Garden Report  Celtics Post-Game Show by CLNS Media Sports Network - Dailymotion

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Transcript

00:00:00 Hey, Bobby Manning here. Welcome to a Friday edition of the Garn Report. Dart Adams is here.

00:00:07 Red everywhere. Dart, it's been a year. It's been an off season. Always enjoy talking Celtics with

00:00:15 you. And I want to get your vibe on this team. How you're feeling about it. How you felt about

00:00:24 the off season. How things look going forward. But we do have a little bit of news this afternoon.

00:00:31 We'll kick around first. Jalen Brown's back in Boston. Attended a court refurbishing in

00:00:38 Dorchester. You know, did a short speech. Made an appearance out there. He was in New York on ABC

00:00:44 News last night. Been busy out in Spain, obviously. Which is what initially held up extension talks.

00:00:52 Now it sounds like they're going to get going again next week. But this is obviously the big

00:00:56 story in Celtics land right now is Brown. And the extension talks. And it's a little strange. There's

00:01:05 been a lot of reporting that said this is normal. This isn't any return here. But we're now almost

00:01:13 all the way through July. Three weeks since he's been eligible to extend. And not a ton of momentum

00:01:20 here. So how have you felt about this whole saga, if we want to call it that?

00:01:24 I've just been seeing Celtics fans panic. And I'm sick of hearing them panic about everything.

00:01:33 Whine and cry about everything. Jalen Brown's about to sign what may be the richest NBA contract

00:01:41 ever for this small time frame. Before everybody else becomes eligible and does it. There's going

00:01:47 to be a lot of stuff that needs to be hashed out before this contract gets signed. We're dealing

00:01:54 with this new deal that happened, the CBA and all this other stuff that happened before. Incentives,

00:02:00 all these other things. How are we going to sign this deal? How much money is it going to be? Is

00:02:06 it going to leave wiggle room to do other things for the Celtics? There's a lot involved in this

00:02:12 contract. And I feel as though Celtics fans wanted this to be over soon so it could be signed,

00:02:20 so they could be comfortable. And Celtics fans always want to be comfortable. They bring their

00:02:27 hands a lot. They're always nervous about the other stuff dropping. And it's annoying to me.

00:02:35 I'm about to turn 48 in August. When I read how long this new deal was with the salary cap and

00:02:44 everything else and everything involved in taxes, and then on top of that, you're dealing with the

00:02:51 new system of now you're signing for the Max. He was all NBA. There's so much going on. And then

00:03:00 the thing is that we're going to have to deal with somebody else coming up. When I look at the pieces,

00:03:06 they signed Porzingis the way they did for a reason. They traded Grant when they did,

00:03:12 and did the signing trade for Grant for a reason. All of these things are made so you can shift

00:03:18 stuff around so we can handle jailing. It's going to take the time it takes. I'm not concerned about

00:03:23 it. I'm not worried about it. I'm more thinking about how is this team forming into shape,

00:03:29 coming into the offseason? Because we're not done. And I think a lot of people are mistaken

00:03:34 about this Celtics team and what it's going to look like when the season finally starts.

00:03:38 We're not done. There's still a lot of things we have to move around. The jailing situation is the

00:03:43 next thing to handle, and then we can get back into business. - Yeah. And I started thinking

00:03:48 about that a couple of days ago, what this whole offseason means for jailing. I also think the deal

00:03:55 is going to get done. It just makes too much sense on both sides for Brown to get the money,

00:04:00 the Celtics to get that control long-term, whether they're committed to them or not. That's a bonus

00:04:05 on both ends for them. So I guess it's probably tax. I guess it's probably some level of protection

00:04:12 on both ends holding this up. I think the latest thing being kicked around is the player option,

00:04:17 which makes a lot of sense to me, as well as the trade kicker and things that just sort of

00:04:22 make it a varying level of difficulty to move him going into the future. You can't get a no

00:04:28 trade clause, of course. I don't think after this Bradley Peel saga that anyone would get one anyway,

00:04:32 even if he was eligible for one. But it definitely just seems to be some tinkering here,

00:04:38 and it's going on a little long in my mind, but I think it will get done. - There's so much involved.

00:04:46 - There is. - There's so many-

00:04:48 - The past specifically. - Yeah. There's so much that has to be

00:04:53 hashed out with this deal, and taking their time with it is the smart thing to do. It's the common

00:05:01 sense thing to do. Is it taking longer than fans would like? Of course. But that's life. Just like

00:05:06 when Celtics fans should understand what's happened over the last two years, things don't go the way

00:05:10 you think they will. - Yeah. And I guess the thing is,

00:05:14 for most guys in this position, it is sort of just boom, done. It's a supermax. There's no incentives.

00:05:22 There's no if this or that. That's the player option. Most guys get the player option. So

00:05:27 the hand-wringing does say a little something about his situation here. I just wonder how

00:05:35 both sides view each other at this point, because we know through the interviews, there was some

00:05:40 resentment on Brown's end from last summer and how that went down with the Durant saga.

00:05:44 I'm sure there's probably some legitimate worry, given the comments and everything else on the

00:05:52 Celtics end about how committed he is to Boston long-term. And we know in this new dynamic,

00:05:57 pretty much anyone can get out of their situation no matter how many years are left on their term,

00:06:02 no matter how good the situation looks. So I think that's probably a small part of it too,

00:06:09 is just the slightest distrust on both sides that exists here. And again, Brown's talked about this

00:06:16 and I wish it wasn't there. I think it'd make it easier to progress into the future. And I'd have

00:06:21 to think that's part of why Porzingis is here too. Obviously he's a guy who really solidifies

00:06:26 this core and we'll get to him in a minute, but he's also another all-star caliber guy who's

00:06:32 signed long-term now, who's able to play alongside Tatum, who solidifies this core no matter what

00:06:40 happens going forward with Brown here. I think you want all three, but it's also going to be,

00:06:44 as you said, very expensive to keep all these guys under the new CBA. So there's a lot that

00:06:48 goes into this really. And it's tough. I think we all think the deal is going to get done,

00:06:54 but it's tough to, I think, say definitively whether Brown's going to be here for a long time.

00:06:58 I mean, we never know that ever. This is a new era for the league. I mean, I was talking to

00:07:08 somebody about this. When I was growing up, players had their numbers retired with the team.

00:07:13 They were with the team for a long time. Players move around so much now and they have power they

00:07:19 didn't have before, which I don't have a problem with. They can advocate for themselves. They can

00:07:25 have leverage. God forbid these players have any type of agency or autonomy. No, we don't want to

00:07:33 see that. What? So Jalen Brown being apprehensive is the intelligent thing to be. Jalen Brown

00:07:42 holding the team accountable for not handling things the way they should have is the smart

00:07:48 way to be. We've had discussions about there was the stretch of time when it looked like they were

00:07:55 going to trade people for AD and when Danny Ainge said publicly that he was angling to sign AD

00:08:02 when he still had two more years under his contract in New Orleans.

00:08:07 Yeah. And Jalen was part of that whole era too.

00:08:10 Exactly. And everybody was there. So everybody's sitting in that locker room like,

00:08:15 "Wait a minute. So you mean to tell me that if they ask for me, I'm out the door, but you're

00:08:25 saying that I'm the future of this franchise?" So you start there where the talk of players being

00:08:31 assets and not players, not a part of the team going forward, not the future of this franchise,

00:08:38 assets. Because at the end of the day, basketball, the NBA is a business. And Jalen is very aware of

00:08:46 that, as is Jason. And when you see how Jason and Jalen are weighed against each other,

00:08:55 I look at them as the duo that we never got because we had Len Bias pass away

00:09:05 before he became a Celtic. And unfortunately, we're approaching the, wow, the 30th anniversary

00:09:14 of losing Reggie Lewis. We never got that duo. We never got to see those players develop as

00:09:25 young players and go through all the different stages, right? We're getting that with the Jays.

00:09:31 And I just feel like the Celtics fans, they're so blinded by almost winning the championship in 2022

00:09:39 and feeling like they should have done more, forgetting the field and who was actually

00:09:44 winning championships and who was ahead of them this whole time. And they're ages, 26 and 27.

00:09:50 They're missing the forest for the trees. Jalen will be under contract. Jason will be under

00:10:00 contract. And we'll talk about Przingis later. But there's so much involved with Jalen Brown

00:10:10 making the Boston Celtics kind of suffer during this agonizing, grueling negotiation.

00:10:21 He should do it. He should hold their feet to the fire. I would do it. Now, as a Celtics fan,

00:10:27 people are being apprehensive and scared. Oh, what happens if he leaves? What happens if he

00:10:31 leaves? That's always a question. We just lost Marcus Smart. He was here for nine years. That's

00:10:37 always the issue. Watch the damn team. Try to enjoy Boston Celtics basketball for a change.

00:10:43 Just try, please. - Well, it's interesting

00:10:48 'cause Karel is still out there, the question of the biggest recent what if. And yours was game

00:10:54 seven against Miami. I think a lot of people's was, it's in recent memory. Tatum turns his ankle

00:11:00 on the first play. Brown has probably the toughest night of his career, which I think set the tone

00:11:07 for a lot of the discussion about him this summer. But I go back to Rob, March, 2022. And that was

00:11:15 the team that I really look at and say was head and shoulders above the league that year. They're

00:11:21 rolling through 22 and three stretch into the spring. Best defense maybe ever. And he goes down

00:11:31 and everything changed after that. And when he came back, they were still effective in his minutes,

00:11:35 but he wasn't quite the same guy and they weren't quite the same defense with him out there. And

00:11:39 then the whole thing gets thrown into a loop next September when he may get suspended and eventually

00:11:45 fired. So that's still my big what if, 'cause that really seemed like the moment. They're there in

00:11:49 the championship. They got that two one lead over the Warriors. That was the year where the whole

00:11:54 conversation could have changed. And everything could have changed. I don't know, depending on

00:11:59 how the finals go last year, maybe smart still here. I don't know about Grant. He's probably

00:12:03 gone either way after the way last year went, whether they go to the finals or not. But that

00:12:08 does become a seminal moment now, not only for smart and the team, but also Brown, because I

00:12:14 think it just sort of changed the conversation around him. One summer ago when we were debating

00:12:19 KD, I don't think a lot of Celtics fans want to move Brown. They were very defensive overall,

00:12:25 just taking the temperature of the fan base. I think people love Brown, want to keep them,

00:12:30 even though Durant was that enticing top end, top five, 10 level player. People saw the upside

00:12:36 with Brown. Then he comes out this year, all NBA him and Tatum keep making that push on the

00:12:41 all time list of guys with 30, 30 games, teammates, Michael Jordan, Scotty Pippen, Shaq, Kobe.

00:12:47 But then the playoffs come, things get tumultuous. They fall short again. And there's this real

00:12:55 appetite for change. And I felt it a little bit too. I started thinking and imagining some

00:12:59 scenarios where they could shake this up a little bit. I didn't think the smart route would be the

00:13:02 way they'd go, but they keep in Brown. It looks like trade smart. That's their way of shaking

00:13:08 this up. And they're still going to trust that Tatum and Brown continue to grow. And I think

00:13:12 that more than anything is going to decide where they're going is how much these two Brown

00:13:17 specifically can keep growing into a new deal here because he's going to have to keep growing.

00:13:21 Yeah. I mean, when we look at this last season, I think one of the things we have to keep in mind

00:13:27 is that of course he may is out. Like when he may got suspended last year, we had the discussion.

00:13:32 I was like, no, he means gone. He's not coming back. I knew that you can't do that as a Boston

00:13:37 Celtic and expect to return. Not with this franchise, not with this history, not with the,

00:13:43 with the status that this franchise has in the league and in the city town,

00:13:48 metro area, New England, what have you? No. So I knew the coach Missoula was going to be the coach

00:13:54 going forward. I care that there was an interim on his name. If you follow me on Twitter, I was

00:13:59 just like, just call him the coach. He's the coach. Um, now it's a 21 and five. Yes. So the issue

00:14:05 coach Missoula, 34 year old rookie head coach, uh, a staff that's not there for him. Half the staff

00:14:13 is resentful that they got jumped over because they probably had tenure. And on top of that,

00:14:18 uh, more, uh, you know, um, experience than he did and he ends up being coach.

00:14:25 Um, so half that coach's staff was resentful and other half was like, we were here for email.

00:14:29 He was, he's supposed to be working with us. Um, so you're dealing with that, right?

00:14:34 Half those guys ended up going to email in the end, which said a lot.

00:14:36 And one of them ended up leaving for another coaching job before the season was up. So that

00:14:43 lets you know exactly Damon Stoudemire lets you know exactly what the situation was. When I think

00:14:48 about the situation coach Missoula stepped into and won 57 games as an inexperienced 34 year old

00:14:56 rookie head coach. I think of it like being, you step into the beef and it's not your kitchen.

00:15:03 It's not your staff. It's not your menu. You know, it's not even the type of food that you,

00:15:08 you know, have prepared yourself for your entire career to cook, but you make your way through.

00:15:16 And then after that first year is over, you remodel that entire damn, uh, restaurant. You

00:15:23 redo that whole kitchen. You change that. You change that staff. You get the white staff you

00:15:28 want, and now it's going to become the bear. And that's exactly what coach Missoula is going

00:15:33 through right now. He has a new coaching staff who are there for him and this team. You know,

00:15:39 he is forming a team. He and Albrad are forming a team that's going to work the way he wants to

00:15:47 play. Right. Look at the players that have been added. O'Shea Brissett, six foot seven swingman

00:15:53 tweener wing Syracuse guy, Syracuse guy. Who's very, very, very athletic. Can hit shots can

00:16:02 finish is a dump. I'm really excited about him and transition right. Can defend multiple positions.

00:16:09 Dallino, but Ben, I don't know exactly what he's going to do because he's, they say he's a point

00:16:14 guard. I don't know how much of a point guard he is to me. I see him as a swing man, a tweener and

00:16:19 a wing who can defend multiple positions. He can steal the ball. He can block shots. He can jump

00:16:25 the passing lanes. He's athletic. He can run. He can finish. Okay. Six, seven Jordan Walsh swing

00:16:35 man, tweener wing, mainly a defensive guy, but he can disrupt things on defense and that initiates

00:16:44 offense. He can finish, he can run and he's improved his three point shooting and it's going

00:16:50 to get better, especially with the Boston Celtics staff. And then you have Jay scrub was a six,

00:16:56 five guard, small forward wing who finished what I just said. It's a mad lips here. Same thing.

00:17:04 So that is the kind of team. And these are the kinds of players that coach Missoula is looking

00:17:11 to have. Right. And then you add Chris Porzingis who a lot of people are down on because they say

00:17:16 he doesn't play a lot. He's never, he's always injured, but also Chris Porzingis before now,

00:17:22 Riston really had a lot to play for. He hasn't. We don't know how he plays in the clutch when

00:17:29 it really matters. He hasn't had the opportunity yet. He hasn't. And the other part of Chris

00:17:36 that's Porzingis, right? Seven foot three. He's not a center. You know, is he a power forward?

00:17:43 Is he a small forward? He'll do what he, what he does, but he is a matchup nightmare. He is

00:17:49 the offensive threat. He can do so many things with the ball. He can handle the ball. He has,

00:17:55 he has, he had teammates like the Jays before. Has he been in a franchise? That was the one

00:18:03 situation probably compared to, but a little different. Has he been in a franchise that

00:18:07 stables the Boston Celtics that win no matter how many times they have to pivot?

00:18:12 He might've actually been on the three most unstable organizations in the league.

00:18:16 Exactly. The Boston Celtics have a competent front office. They have a more than competent

00:18:23 coaching staff, more than competent people in the, in, in basketball operations. And it's with

00:18:29 a stable franchise, with a team that has a core and guys in the locker room who are leaders. Okay.

00:18:37 Now we had nine years of Marcus Smart. If you think that the time that Jason Tatum and Jalen

00:18:43 Brown were there with Marcus Smart in that locker room, that they haven't absorbed enough

00:18:47 to, it's their team now and they should be leading it now, then I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell

00:18:53 you. It's time for them to step up. They already know it. We don't need to tell them. We don't

00:18:58 need to write articles about it. Just watch it happen. Right? So when I look at this team

00:19:03 right now, are they better? They're going to be the team that Joe Mazzulla probably

00:19:11 wants out there to execute the game the way he wants to. Because again, he was going into the

00:19:16 kitchen cooking with somebody else's ingredients, with somebody else's menu, trying to make things

00:19:22 happen. And their game plan. And Grant talked a little bit about that. We'll get to Grant in just

00:19:26 a second. But he did deserve the chance, I think, to show with a full summer with his staff, with

00:19:36 belief in the game plan. And that's what they need to have, I think, was a belief in this

00:19:41 philosophy. And yeah, a lot gets talked about the offense. And I'm glad you brought up some

00:19:46 of the length and all the different things they added this summer, because I do think he has a

00:19:50 ideology on defense that I don't necessarily agree with, but did end the year number two on

00:19:57 that end. And it's because of playing the percentages. They played a ton of drop, take

00:20:03 away the rim. They really tried to take away the three point shot from opponents. Length will help

00:20:08 you do that. You know, they switched a lot last year because it's what they did the year before.

00:20:12 I don't think they'll switch as much this year. I think they'll lock into positions a lot more. I

00:20:17 think they'll try to keep guys on matchups. And that goes back to Jalen, who I think has had a

00:20:21 couple of rough years defensively here. I think he was one of the guys that the switching defense

00:20:26 didn't come as naturally to. And he's talked about it too, like he likes to lock in on a matchup when

00:20:31 he's been able to do that. He's played great defense in his career, and he is a great, long,

00:20:37 versatile body when it comes to NBA defense. You'd think that this guy would be one of the

00:20:42 better defenders in the league. Last couple of years, it's slept up a little bit. So I'm

00:20:45 interested in seeing the kind of defense they play this year. A lot of it, I think, is going

00:20:50 to be filling up space on the floor. Now they're going to play a ton of zone. We saw it in summer

00:20:55 league. I found it interesting that they were trying that out with the summer league crew.

00:20:58 Maybe they'll try a little bit with this team this year just because of the personnel they have.

00:21:02 But I think a lot of this bodes well for Jalen on that end, because I think it's going to be

00:21:07 a style that suits him a little bit more. And if we're being real, the offense suited him pretty

00:21:12 well last year. He didn't shoot well from three, but he was the beneficiary of a lot of the

00:21:16 pressure that came to the three-point line. And he was able to cut and roll and do whatever to

00:21:21 get shots close to the basket. And they let him shoot that mid-range too that was so deadly last

00:21:26 year. So I like where this is going for him. I think he's going to be a good fitness offense.

00:21:30 He might have to get back to the corner a little bit just to make room for Porzingis in the middle

00:21:34 of the floor. But this is going to be a good year for Porzingis, for Brown, I think. And

00:21:40 the question is, is the money going forward? But on the floor, I think this is a guy who's

00:21:45 going to continue to get better. This is a guy I like for a number of different reasons.

00:21:49 And I think it's probably going to use that game seven as a little bit of fire into the future

00:21:55 here. And again, we're always going to talk about the mix. We're always going to talk about Tatum

00:22:00 and Brown's ability to play together. But the one thing I've always believed in is Brown's desire

00:22:09 to not only improve and win, but also his ability to make it work. And he did play a role that was

00:22:16 a little different for him the last couple of years to help this team win. And so I do think

00:22:21 he deserves credit for that. Now the contract, we'll see how that shakes out. His desires on and

00:22:26 off the court, where he wants to be, that's a different game. But on the floor, there's just

00:22:32 absolutely a relentless drive to get better. Now, there are weak spots in his game he needs to

00:22:37 improve on the dribbling, the passing, all the rest and the defense, as I mentioned.

00:22:41 But he's really become a machine offensively. - I mean, in terms of like Jaylen Brown having

00:22:49 places in his game to improve. Yeah. I mean, when you're 26, 27 in the NBA, yeah, that's the thing.

00:23:00 You do have holes in your game and you have things you can improve on. Great. But when you can

00:23:06 improve on things and get even better and you scored 27 points a game the previous season,

00:23:12 it's time to celebrate. You should be cracking a cold one on your stoop over there.

00:23:19 And I think that people don't understand how crazy they are when they talk about Jaylen Brown

00:23:26 didn't do X, Y, and Z. Jaylen Brown couldn't do this. Jaylen Brown didn't do that. The man has

00:23:31 played 105 playoff games since he entered the NBA. 105. And it would have been more if it

00:23:39 weren't for the fact that he was injured and missed an entire playoffs, I think in 2021.

00:23:45 So people need to understand that. That guy has a... He has more playoff experience than a man

00:23:54 who was a 15-year veteran who just won a championship in Jeff Green. And he's not even

00:24:00 near 30. He needs to improve his handles. I've seen that man do some amazing things with his

00:24:07 handles on the basketball court. Now, when we're talking about the playoffs, when people are

00:24:11 centered on you and it's the best defenders in the league and they don't want you to kill them,

00:24:16 yeah. If you're holding the ball in a situation when everybody's going to be swiping at the ball

00:24:25 in crunch time, yeah. Jaylen Brown has done X, Y, and Z. Jaylen Brown's been in that situation

00:24:32 multiple times in the last how many years. And everybody who's critiquing him was doing what?

00:24:38 Watching him from home on TV. Players who were critiquing him were in Cancun watching him play

00:24:46 deep into the postseason again. So when you have that level and you can improve on that,

00:24:54 yeah. Let's go. Now, the issue is that a lot of people think that this is as good as Jaylen can

00:25:00 get. I do not agree with that. Do you think that that's as good as Jason Tatum can get?

00:25:06 I don't think so. Jason Tatum scored 30 points and it annoys me that people say Jason Tatum was

00:25:16 the first Celtic to score 30 points a game. Larry Bird scored 29.9 and it was a matter of eight

00:25:22 points over the entire season. He scored 30 a game. All right. That's just the end of the season.

00:25:26 I was there. I was alive. I was outside. But the thing is that if you think that Jason Tatum,

00:25:32 the most he can score a game is 30 or you think the most Jaylen Brown could score a game is 26.6.

00:25:38 But now the question is, will they adjust their game to allow for Porzingis to come in and be a

00:25:48 big scorer too? Is Porzingis going to be a guy scoring between 20 and 22 or is he going to drop

00:25:53 down to 18 and 19 and then the Jays score more? Or is it going to be more balanced in the offense?

00:26:01 Now, one of the things was those two guys were the focus of the offense and then you hoped that

00:26:07 you got scoring by committee from other people and it was spread out. But Porzingis is going to be a

00:26:15 guy who allows for the Jays to do so much more. He's seven foot three. He can handle the rock.

00:26:22 He can shoot. He can drive. He can finish at the rim. He can catch alley-oops.

00:26:28 And then on top of that, you're going to have a healthy Rob Williams. You're going to have

00:26:36 the ageless wonder Al Horford. Now, after that, I'd like to see Sam Hauser have another season

00:26:45 where he's doing amazing things and shooting and scoring. But I want to see Sam Hauser be

00:26:49 effective in the postseason. Sam Hauser was not able to be effective in the postseason.

00:26:52 No, he didn't show up. No.

00:26:54 No.

00:26:55 And your rotation's always going to get a little tighter, but if there's an injury or whatever it

00:27:00 might be, you do need guys like that to step up in that case.

00:27:02 Sam Hauser is 6'8" and he's a surprisingly good defender. He doesn't get killed when they have

00:27:09 him on the court. So I was disappointed that Hauser wasn't able to be out there and contribute more.

00:27:19 And Grant Williams, he pretty much was out of the lineup for a lot of times until we absolutely

00:27:24 needed him. And then Coach Mazzullo was like, "This is your opportunity to step up and play."

00:27:30 I do want to get to Grant in just a second here.

00:27:33 Yeah.

00:27:34 Making his rounds. Real quick, just to wrap this Jalen thing, he did appear at

00:27:40 this park in Dorchester today, refurbishing it, gave a short speech. As I said, he's been all over

00:27:46 the place putting in work with the NBPA this summer, as well as in New York on ABC News,

00:27:54 talking about the Juice Foundation, the clothing line he's using to fund some of his social efforts,

00:28:00 education efforts. He's been pretty active in Boston from the time he's been here. And people

00:28:06 are going to debate what this means for his future. I know he had a few vague comments in here that I

00:28:10 don't think really have much sway in either direction. But one thing that's been talked

00:28:18 about when it comes to his future is his desire to be involved in stuff off the court, make an

00:28:23 impact off the court. And he has been able to do that pretty effectively here, obviously,

00:28:28 through the local colleges and then just being in the community as a whole here.

00:28:34 And I think that's a good sign in the sense that he has been able to find ways to

00:28:41 build his business here and make an impact here. Now, he's expressed frustration on that sense,

00:28:48 too. And I don't think we've kicked around those comments he made to the, I think it was to the

00:28:53 New York Times, though, specifically about how he's felt kind of blockage in the city,

00:29:00 like a pushback against what he's doing or an inability to do it at the level he wants to.

00:29:06 And so those are some of the factors people talk about when it comes to his future here is his

00:29:11 connection with the city, his ability to accomplish what he wants to accomplish off the court here,

00:29:16 and those type of things. - I mean, being a black Bostonian,

00:29:20 I deal with those same things. I deal with those same things, the pushback from trying to get

00:29:27 things to happen in the community, trying to get signage on buildings that should be historical

00:29:31 landmarks in my neighborhood. Due to gentrification, people walk past them every day and don't realize

00:29:36 that these have a massive significance to the black and Latino population of the city,

00:29:41 or acknowledging the black and Latino population of the city. So I totally understand where Jayden's

00:29:45 coming from. Now, I think that there are a lot of people that get up in arms and get kind of

00:29:50 trepidatious when he says these things. He's not saying anything that isn't true to anybody who

00:29:57 hasn't lived here their entire lives doesn't already know about and has experienced these

00:30:01 same things. So for him to vocalize it isn't a knock. I've lived here my entire life. I fight

00:30:09 every day to change these things. These are the same things that Bill Russell talked about,

00:30:13 same thing that anybody with any level of intelligence would discuss openly about what

00:30:19 needs to change in the city. Because things don't change in the city until you say these things need

00:30:23 to change in the city. Otherwise the status quo continues status quoing. And that's not what we

00:30:28 want. We want progress. We want actual forward progress. And the way that happens is to fight

00:30:37 for it, to vocalize it, to make it known it needs to happen. And that's what Jayden's doing. And

00:30:44 again, when it comes to the fans, anything they perceive as being negative, oh, God, oh,

00:30:50 does he want to stay? Does he want to stay? Do I want to stay? I've been here 48 years. I'm a guy

00:30:54 here. You know? So of course he's going to talk about the issues that he faces. He wants to do

00:31:01 more. He wants to do more. He wants to provide more for the community. I want to see him do it.

00:31:06 I'd like to help him do it. If he stays here long enough, it's going to happen. You think that

00:31:13 anybody with a foundation, whether we're talking about when Antoine Walker had a foundation,

00:31:18 the Real Deal Foundation, whether we're talking about the things that Paul Pierce wanted to do,

00:31:24 Eric Williams, anything, they had to deal with the same type of situation, you know, about getting,

00:31:32 you know, help and wanting more and to do this and have a bigger grant and all these other things

00:31:37 and reach out. Like when I think about the things that he's been able to do,

00:31:41 you know, already, it's amazing. And again, he's nowhere near 30, well, if you round up, yeah.

00:31:48 Think about what this man will accomplish by the time he's 30 and up, 30 and 32 in the city.

00:31:56 And you know why it will happen? Because he verbalized that he wanted to do more.

00:32:01 I'd much rather have somebody talk about they want to do more and they were blocked from doing more

00:32:05 as opposed to completely retracting and being withdrawn and just waiting for their time to be

00:32:11 up so they can bounce. This is a positive thing. - So there you have it. Let's go to Grant because

00:32:21 he did a couple of interviews over the week here, JJ Redick, I think Theo Pinson, who used to play

00:32:29 for the Maine Celtics, I think he's in Dallas now. So he's been talking about his exit from Boston.

00:32:34 He's talked quite a bit already. He got interviewed by the Athletic. I ran into him in Vegas,

00:32:39 wasn't able to get him, bummer, but he said a lot. And I think he said a lot throughout this

00:32:45 year. I think he had a frustrating year and it ultimately made sense for both sides. Here's

00:32:49 the Globe reported that they separated. Grant wanted to play more. Dallas gave him a fully

00:32:54 guaranteed contract. The Celtics were looking to have incentives involved in it. And he talked a

00:33:00 little bit about Joe Mazzola, what went down last year, the spat with Jimmy Butler and all the rest

00:33:05 here in these podcasts. But first I want to tell people quickly about our sponsor, great sponsor

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00:34:11 go to gambling helpline, ma.org or 800-327-5050 for 24/7 support. If you sense you have an issue

00:34:20 with gambling. All right, Dart, let's talk Grant. So Grant's a guy I liked for a long time here,

00:34:27 even through some of his struggles, didn't have the most consistent first two years here,

00:34:32 a great third year. Last year was weird, fell out of the rotation late, didn't really get back into

00:34:37 it in the playoffs until Malcolm Brodden got hurt. And I thought played well when he got his spot

00:34:42 opportunities here. I think he was a favorite of Emei, not as much with Joe. And that leads to his

00:34:50 departure. I mean, if he wasn't going to play here, the Celtics weren't going to pay him and

00:34:55 he wasn't going to stay. And they ended up with a sign and trade here. They got them three seconds.

00:35:00 I don't know how much you heard. He talked about a ton in these podcasts,

00:35:04 as well as Joe's coaching style. He's always pretty, I think, political in his comments,

00:35:12 deliberate in his comments. I was trying to rock the boat too much, but you always do sense a

00:35:16 little bit of frustration on how things went down here, understandably losing his role and

00:35:22 not able to be part of this team going forward. So would you make a grant the grant trade?

00:35:26 I think Grant Williams is a consummate professional. He's been very diplomatic

00:35:34 in what he said about what happened last season. And I think the same could be said for Marcus

00:35:41 Smart. The thing is that Marcus Smart and Grant Williams were perfect for Celtics under what Emei

00:35:50 Udoka was trying to do with the team and his philosophy. They didn't exactly fit under what

00:35:58 coach Joe Mazzullo wanted to do. That's why neither one of them are still on the team.

00:36:04 Marcus Smart is not missing any words, the heart and soul of the Boston Celtics as we know them.

00:36:18 Grant Williams was probably right under them. When the Celtics were getting, as he quoted,

00:36:25 pumped by the Miami Heat in the playoffs, he stood up and he went toe to toe with Jimmy Butler.

00:36:34 Jimmy Butler scored eight points in the final stretch. He talked about this in a recent podcast.

00:36:40 He scored 10. He was the one scoring. Yeah, Grant was hitting threes.

00:36:45 Yeah, he was doing scoring. He's the one joining with Jimmy Butler. But the thing is that they

00:36:49 got contributions from two other guys that we didn't expect them to and the Celtics ended up

00:36:55 losing. Grant Williams had his role. He filled his role. He wasn't consistent enough at it.

00:37:04 And he's no longer a Boston Celtic. When you look at Grant Williams and you look at how he's built

00:37:09 and look at his game and look at how he plays, the tenacity, the ferocity, the stick-to-itiveness,

00:37:18 guarding multiple positions at undersized, a 6'6", not very long, not super athletic,

00:37:26 but athletic enough. But it's will and determination. And also, he's very cerebral,

00:37:33 really smart guy. And he understands basketball, but he just wasn't the guy he needed to be.

00:37:39 And again, when I ran down who the Celtics have gotten, 6'7", long, athletic, wing people,

00:37:47 that can run, guard multiple positions and finish at the rim. Their body types are the polar opposite

00:37:56 of Grant Williams. Grant Williams is often put in as a 6'6" guy being pretty much another center.

00:38:03 We're not going to see that happen again. And Marcus Smart is 6'3", 6'4"-ish,

00:38:09 doing things. You look at Delano Benton, who is not the player Marcus Smart is,

00:38:15 isn't as clutch as Marcus Smart is, isn't the defender Marcus Smart is,

00:38:18 but can be disruptive much in the same way. If you have Brissett, you have Benton, you have Walsh

00:38:24 and Scrubb just doing little things in the rotation, you hope that by committee,

00:38:32 they can do what one Marcus Smart can do, but not as the leader. But we already have the two guys

00:38:38 who are supposed to be leading this team. They're supposed to be taking over this franchise.

00:38:42 No, it's going to be thinner building around three stars. And hopefully those guys can break

00:38:48 through. You're hoping that, because you do have to go with minimum signings and such,

00:38:51 now that you're right up against the new apron here. You can't get a mid-level guy, so you end

00:38:57 up with a Benton and Brissett and all the rest here. But it's going to be on white. It's going

00:39:00 to be on poor Zingas to replace those guys. And they want to consolidate around more consistent

00:39:07 guys. And white was very consistent last year. Smart had an up and down year around injury and

00:39:12 all the rest. And I think people started to feel that white was the better option overall there.

00:39:16 And they felt that way too, obviously. And poor Zingas, there's no question there, he's better

00:39:21 than Grant, if healthy. But I still look at Grant as a depth guy. And I'm sure they'll deal with

00:39:28 some injuries during the year. There's a leadership component here too. But I still go back to,

00:39:33 like, yes, Brissett, I like, could have a solid year. Could be a diamond in the rough along with

00:39:39 Benton, who's going to have to compete for his spot, it looks like, on a partially guaranteed

00:39:43 deal here. But Grant came out two years ago and he's shot close to 40% from three for a couple

00:39:51 years now, which isn't easy to do. And he came out in a game seven, hit seven, eight threes,

00:39:59 won that game. That's not something I don't think we've seen any Celtics role guy ever do.

00:40:04 I mean, that's one of a kind performance there. That's not easy to do. And I think that is

00:40:09 something they missed during the playoffs when he wasn't playing. And I think it is something

00:40:13 they'll miss going forward is just the upside of his role contributions. Because he did a few

00:40:18 things well, switch, shoot threes. He wasn't the most consistent player. But when it came to those

00:40:24 things, those few things he did really well, I think you could almost always bank on him doing

00:40:29 those things. And a lot of people have criticized the defense last year. I don't think he played

00:40:33 consistently enough to really get a good sense for it. And as we talked about, they played a

00:40:37 different kind of system last year. So I don't know. I feel like they're losing something with

00:40:42 him. I don't think it's going to hit as hard as some of the intangible smart that they're losing

00:40:47 and smart rather. This guy is obviously more replaceable, but losing them both together.

00:40:53 I think like you're going to walk into that locker room next year and there's just, you know,

00:40:57 if Blake's not there, whoever, you know, some of these other more vocal guys, it's going to be a

00:41:02 little quieter in there. You're going to notice how quiet it is because these guys are just talking

00:41:07 nonstop. I also think it has a lot to do with like more of the fans and their feeling and their

00:41:13 perception. Marcus Smart was the, he was the consummate Boston Celtic. He was the Celtic,

00:41:21 you know, he was the guy that the entire community and the fandom embraced,

00:41:26 a warts and all. If you talk to different sports writers and talk to people to cover the NBA,

00:41:32 you know, and that is just something that, you know, we lost nine years.

00:41:40 When the Celtics had Marcus Smart, they were winning again because before that things were

00:41:44 pretty dark, right? So, but then when you look at it from this perspective, this team is going to be

00:41:52 more the squad that Joe Mazzullo wanted to coach and wanted to implement the things that he wanted

00:41:58 to do. And we're not finished because again, man, we haven't figured out where Peyton Pritchard's

00:42:03 going. We have these, this weird guard situation with JD Davison, Yamadar, Yuan Begarin, you know,

00:42:11 that's going to pop up at some point that we're going to have to address, you know.

00:42:15 - Yeah, in the future. I think Pritchard's a plan going forward, but we'll see.

00:42:19 - And then there's the big situation, right? You got Cornett and Cabanguele. Cabanguele,

00:42:26 I thought was, I prayed was going to be more of a contributor because I thought he would have been

00:42:31 like Rob Williams Jr. When I saw the things that he did in summer league, that previous summer

00:42:36 league. - He was a little short,

00:42:38 that killed it. Cause he had a motor. He could hit the three a little bit, he's a physical guy,

00:42:43 but I think he was only like six, eight, six, seven, six, eight. So that's what killed him.

00:42:47 His guys could really shoot over him. He actually played for the Hawks in the summer league. So I

00:42:50 think he's gone at this point. - Yeah. Yeah. When I looked at what

00:42:53 he did in the two summer leagues ago, and then I saw what he did in the G league.

00:42:57 And, but when he came down to the Celtics and they put them on the court, he looked like

00:43:00 lost. Like he looked like he ran out of turbo. And I was just like,

00:43:05 I was very disappointed. I was like, he's not the guy.

00:43:09 - Yeah, no, that's the other thing, right? Cause Horford's aging and they kind of need that big

00:43:14 of the future. And maybe that's Porzingis now and Rob's still relatively young, but you know,

00:43:19 that versatile modern five and you know, they didn't use Grant at the five a ton, but he could

00:43:24 guard fives and he could draw fives out of the paint if they were guarding him. So you don't

00:43:29 really have that younger protege of Horford. I think Grant called himself a mini Al at times.

00:43:35 - Yeah. Like he could guard fives cause he had to. That's the way to say it, right? And again,

00:43:42 Grant Williams, once we switched over from Emei Udoka to Coach Mizzoula, it was his time,

00:43:52 his days were numbered, you know, many, many tickle of Harsin, you know, was written on the

00:43:56 wall for that man. And unfortunately under that, I feel like under that scrutiny, knowing that,

00:44:01 you know, Grant just didn't have a solid second half of the season because he kind of didn't know,

00:44:08 I think he, not he didn't know, scratch that. He knew he was on the outside looking in. He knew he

00:44:14 wasn't one of Coach Mizzoula's favorite guys. And I think that that kind of played in, that he kind

00:44:21 of tried harder and he pushed himself. And I think he kind of played himself out of his own,

00:44:28 out of his rotation spot, you know? - Right. And I, you know, I read an article,

00:44:32 I think one of the Dallas papers where he talked about, I want to be a playmaker. I want to be a

00:44:37 guy who can set some other players up on this team. And that's really not what the Celtics

00:44:41 wanted him to do. Even Emei, I remember would say like, we want you to do a narrow role and we want

00:44:46 you to do it well. And I think Grant always had that desire and he talked about in these podcasts

00:44:50 too to do a little bit more, but he talked a lot about Joe and, you know, he praised him,

00:44:55 said he was different, you know, understands he has that eye for offense and that's really what

00:45:00 he emphasizes and that different coaches emphasize different things. And so I actually saw Grant

00:45:07 talking to Emei, you know, down at Summer League. I think they had a pretty good relationship. I

00:45:11 think a lot of these players had good relationships with Emei and really came to trust what he did

00:45:14 because of course they went to the finals on his game plan. So that's still a dynamic going forward

00:45:21 that I find interesting. I think smart was a big Emei guy. You know, Tatum keeps in touch with him,

00:45:28 but he's, you know, I think one of Joe's biggest proponents and, you know, Jalen, I don't know, but

00:45:32 that's changed from the defensive identity to the offensive identity was pretty drastic last year.

00:45:42 And I think it, you know, shook this team up at times, like how different their focus was this

00:45:47 year and the offense, you know, made big progress. The defense played a little bit more inconsistently

00:45:53 here and, you know, you're going to try to work these things out here, but when it comes to Joe,

00:45:57 they really believe in him and, you know, he's, he's unproven. He's a guy who came off the back

00:46:02 of the bench. He's a guy who doesn't have great NBA experience so far and didn't play in the NBA,

00:46:09 of course, either, but they really believe in him to the point where, as you've said,

00:46:13 players who don't fit under his system are now gone. You know, they gave him the extension

00:46:18 and as Brian Windhorst said on his podcast, they're doubling down on his ideology of offense.

00:46:26 They kind of should 50 demand. Okay. I need to just stress this.

00:46:34 A 34 year old, I've said this before, rookie head coach who was using a staff that didn't,

00:46:40 half of them didn't want to be there and resented him being there with players in a team that were

00:46:46 not to his, you know, specific, you know, what he wanted to do. You know, he didn't pick these

00:46:53 players. These are not his ingredients. This is not his menu. This is not the kitchen to

00:46:58 design to his specifications. That man won 68 games as a head coach and he should have won more,

00:47:07 but he didn't due to inexperience. All right. He won 68 games. Do you know the only other coach to

00:47:14 win more games than him? The man who won the NBA championship and the way that he, and he won 69,

00:47:22 he had to win 16 to win the championship. Okay. So, and then again, the Boston Celtics were down

00:47:28 three to oh, three oh in the ECF, in the, in the finals, they had a seventh game at home.

00:47:36 They were running on fumes in that game seven, but they didn't lay down and die. All right.

00:47:43 When you want, when you don't want to play for a coach, when you want your season to end,

00:47:48 when you just want to pack it up, you stop playing. The Lakers died in game four. The Celtics

00:47:55 fought to the bitter end. It was ugly, but they fought to the bitter end. And you don't do that

00:48:03 for a coach that you don't trust and you don't believe in it. And in terms of like how Jalen

00:48:07 feels, if you let that man win, put them in position, put them in a position to play well

00:48:14 and their stability. And you seem to be a standup guy. Like you stand up for what you believe in.

00:48:24 You don't like cower, you know? And I think that Jalen respects Joe Mazzulla, regardless of his

00:48:33 age, because that man was put into a situation that was not ideal. And look what he did his

00:48:41 first, we're talking about something. When in the history of the NBA have you seen a 34 year old

00:48:46 first time head coach do what this guy did? Like, what did his fandom do? Complain because

00:48:53 they should have won 60 plus games. - Right. Expectations are high though, rightfully.

00:48:59 - Expectations are high, but then there's reality. You know, then there's common sense.

00:49:08 And this fandom doesn't seem to be able to toe the line and be able to do both. They want

00:49:14 everything. They want every game to be won by 25. You know, they want the Celtics to sweep

00:49:20 every team on a West Coast road trip. They want everybody to stay healthy all the time. It's not

00:49:26 going to happen. Anytime there's any type of adversity, Celtics fans all seem to just like

00:49:35 fall apart. Adversity is what this 82 game season is built on. Life is built on adversity. It's

00:49:42 about how you recover from the adversity, you know? And again, sometimes the regular season

00:49:48 doesn't go the way you want it to. And then the post season goes another way. It happened to the

00:49:52 Miami Heat. Miami Heat were trashed this season. The Lakers were trashed this season, but then they

00:49:59 had some tweets. They did some things, they figured some stuff out and they did it in the playoffs.

00:50:04 When it mattered the most. Yeah, and he's going to get better. I find it interesting though,

00:50:09 and they talk a lot about this. You know, he's learning, he's growing. There's obviously

00:50:14 potential they see in him. And you know, the comparison some people make is Spolstra, who

00:50:18 started very young, who had these kinds of doubts, who came up in a situation under Pat Riley there,

00:50:25 where everyone was saying like, "Oh, the old guy was so much better," and this and that.

00:50:29 Remember Spol's first postseason? Remember how that ended? That's what I'm going to say. And

00:50:35 who did he lose to his first postseason? Spolstra.

00:50:39 So this is, yeah, so this is what I ask is, is there something here? Is there an ideology? Is

00:50:45 there philosophy? Is there something they see in him that they really want to see through,

00:50:49 that they think could benefit them long-term? Because you know, in the short term, they have

00:50:53 a lot of stakes right now, right? They got these two young stars, they got big expectations,

00:50:58 and coming out of year one to hear, "Yeah, he's growing, he's learning, he's making mistakes,

00:51:02 and he's learning from them." I don't think people want to hear that because they're in

00:51:06 such a high stakes position. But if he can grow into something special, especially in a, you know,

00:51:14 reasonable amount of time here, I think that's when people are going to look back on and say,

00:51:18 "Oh, like, you know." And again, you know, Utah wanted to hire this guy. Danny Ainge wanted to

00:51:22 hire this guy. And he actually made some comments, I think to the Globe last year,

00:51:27 that he thinks Joe is better than he may, personally. And you know, they may...

00:51:31 - Something to think about. Brad Stevens was a young coach that people were very high on. They

00:51:41 saw what he did. They saw he had this vision, right? If Brad Stevens believes in this guy,

00:51:47 and Danny Ainge, the guy who's managed to fleece the entire NBA multiple times over,

00:51:54 and rebuild and retool different franchises over and over again, you see what he's done in Utah.

00:51:59 If they believe in this guy, then what the hell is wrong with the fandom? What are they not seeing?

00:52:05 - Well, at this point, he's tied himself to Joe, because they've picked Joe over multiple guys.

00:52:10 You know, they have some assistance here that potentially if things go sideways,

00:52:15 these are some really good assistance that they could turn to if things don't go well going

00:52:18 forward. But they've committed pretty heavily to Joe. So Joe's going to have to improve next year.

00:52:26 He's going to have to take those steps, and he's going to have to show, I think, that this system

00:52:29 works. Because again, last year, lots of wins, as you mentioned. You get to the East Finals,

00:52:34 they almost come back. But you know, the fans, they want to see a step forward. And I think last

00:52:40 year, it was a small step back. I think it was, you know. And again, there were reasons for that.

00:52:48 I think a lot of the excuses were valid. But now, there's the full summer, there's the assistance,

00:52:54 there's the team, as you mentioned, that befits him. A couple of the things Grant said,

00:52:59 you know, did a good job taking things on his head, trying to take the blame. As players,

00:53:06 we could have helped. E-May was a little bit more player empowering with trust guys. And when they

00:53:11 saw something, he'd ask, and you know, he'd roll with that. Joe had more of dictating the matchups

00:53:16 and doing things his way. So there's got to be a mix of both. Players have the communication

00:53:20 ability to be like, "Hey, we don't think this is working." Then you got to figure it out on that

00:53:24 side of the ball. And you know, he thought that was why there was less connectivity last year.

00:53:28 It was just a change in philosophy. And now, you know, there'll be adjustment to that. There'll

00:53:33 be the personnel for that. But I don't know. It's going to be interesting. I think it's fair. I

00:53:37 think it was fair to bring him back. I think it's fair to give him this extra chance. But I also

00:53:41 think the criticism was valid last year. It was valid because it was his first year, you know.

00:53:45 Learning on the job. He was thrust into the fire. It was a baptism by fire. He was just thrust into

00:53:54 the position. And he took it on running, you know. Like, that says a lot for him. And on top of that,

00:54:03 right, we have a full summer to implement all the things you want to do, you know,

00:54:13 to put that philosophy in place. And also, when we talk about trusting the players,

00:54:18 Joe Mazzulla did something, in my opinion, that was all about trusting the players.

00:54:22 He knew who we had on the court. He knew these players knew each other. He knew they knew the

00:54:28 game. And he didn't call unnecessary timeouts. He's like, "You guys can figure it out. You guys

00:54:35 can write the shit. This is a team that comes back. You guys can communicate with each other.

00:54:41 When you have guys like Al Horford, Marcus Smart, Jason Tatum, and Jalen Brown on the court,

00:54:52 who have played so many games together, you know, have been in the fire together,

00:54:59 have been in the postseason together, have had so many incredible comebacks,

00:55:06 have had to deal with teammates in situations, and they made it through, you know, and still

00:55:15 were resilient enough to still win at the end of the day when it was all said and done.

00:55:20 Okay, if you guys can make it through that, I'm pretty sure you can figure out this 8-0 run

00:55:25 that this team's going on. Or you can figure out this defense that they're doing. I don't need to

00:55:31 call a timeout and tell you guys what to do. So when I think about that, Joe Mazzulla absolutely

00:55:36 trusted this team. Now, did he dictate matchups, do a whole bunch of other stuff that they weren't

00:55:41 familiar with? Sure. Is he going to do that going forward? I don't think so. I think he's going to

00:55:47 switch and do what works. If it doesn't work, I'm more than sure that Joe Mazzulla is going to stop

00:55:57 doing what doesn't work. Because people that try to do the same thing and it fails, that is the

00:56:03 definition of what? Insanity. And I believe that that guy is pretty smart. And I think that he'll

00:56:11 listen when somebody brings something to his attention that isn't working. And I think he'll

00:56:15 actually listen to the players, because the players ain't that much, the age difference

00:56:21 isn't that much for him. And I think that the staff that he has in place are going to help aid

00:56:26 with that. And if there's any issues that the players have with him, I'm pretty sure they can

00:56:30 hash it out with that man. I'm more than sure. I think Ime was a different person. Ime is a

00:56:37 different guy. Ime is a different person, different coach, everything. He's not Ime Udoka. He's Joe

00:56:43 Mazzulla. Let him be Joe Mazzulla. Let this team grow with him. Let them figure out what they need

00:56:48 to figure out. And let's just watch this next season and see how it goes. This team isn't done.

00:56:54 It's not done. It can't be. They don't have a lot of wiggle room. They don't have a lot of

00:57:01 maneuverability. But this team, this roster isn't done. And then I'm going to wait to see

00:57:09 how this thing plays out in the regular season. Because if you're going to go into this regular

00:57:15 season expecting 55 wins, 60 wins, what have you, throw that out. We'll figure out what it is

00:57:24 sometime in the first quarter of the season. We'll figure out what this team is and how they play.

00:57:29 And then the more important thing is how do they match up with teams in the postseason?

00:57:34 And then there's going to be a whole lot of new wrinkles thrown into this new season

00:57:37 with these mini tournaments. We're playing tournament, yeah.

00:57:41 Yeah. So you bring up two things I want to hit on quick. And we got to get to Porzingis before

00:57:45 we get out of here. First, factor meals. Just got my big box in the mail. And it really is perfect

00:57:53 for this time of year, summertime. You run around. You're in and out of the house. You don't have a

00:57:57 ton of time to cook. And it's too hot to cook. So factor meals going to send you up to over 34

00:58:04 chef-prepared, dietician-approved weekly options featuring premium ingredients such as broccolini,

00:58:10 truffle butter, asparagus, and more. A ton of add-ons, snacks, breakfast options, egg bites,

00:58:17 potato, bacon, egg, breakfast skillet. So many different options here. And I love the shakes.

00:58:23 The shakes are my favorite part by far. They sent me a bunch of those. Some of my favorite I've ever

00:58:27 had. And I'm definitely going to be ordering some more of these because they're done in two minutes.

00:58:31 Throw them in the microwave, two minutes, boom, it's out. You're eating and then you're on the

00:58:35 go again. I'm actually about to throw one in right after I get off of here. So factormeals.com/garden50

00:58:42 is going to get you 50% off your first box when you head over there. That's called garden50

00:58:46 at factormeals.com, America's number one ready to eat meal kit. That's factormeals, F-A-C-T-O-R,

00:58:56 M-E-A-L-S/garden50 and get 50% off your first box when you head over there. A ton of options.

00:59:04 Check out the shakes. You won't regret it. And let's get to Porzingis. So, Dart, watch Porzingis

00:59:12 over the years, as you said, coming from three teams that haven't been the steadiest organizations

00:59:18 over his career. So what intrigues me, the shooting is the real deal. You watch this guy

00:59:25 hits insane shots. And one thing I do hear from people around the NBA about the Celtics, maybe the

00:59:30 biggest point of praise for them and that they're only going to get better with this move, is they're

00:59:35 a tough shot hitting team. You'll come out of a game feeling like you played great defense and

00:59:39 their players just hit ridiculous shots and that won them the game. And Porzingis is going to do

00:59:44 that. I mean, this guy's pulling up from half court a lot of the time and draining it. Post

00:59:48 up presence, something they were missing last year. Now, is that something Joe's going to embrace?

00:59:52 Not really something they did at all last year. Not really a modern piece of basketball, but

00:59:57 something he did well a year ago. I'm interested to see that. And the real deal is the defense.

01:00:03 Perfect drop center, maybe the best drop center you could get for the system that they're playing,

01:00:08 just standing back, protecting the rim, blocking shots and rotating around them.

01:00:12 So those things make a lot of sense. Younger center with some upsides that his best basketball

01:00:19 still in front of him. Guy who's grown and gotten better coming off a career year and a third star

01:00:25 pair with the other two. So you're able to form a rare big three. I think there's only really two

01:00:29 in basketball right now at this level. So I get why they did it. If this hits, it's going to hit

01:00:37 tremendously and they're going to have a staggering talent advantage over the opposing teams.

01:00:42 But there's injury concerns. There's fit concerns. And, you know, I think also him being a guy who's

01:00:50 been a star in a lot of the teams is going to be adjustment given that he's going to have to play

01:00:53 under Tatum and maybe even Brown here. Those two are going to have to balance things out here. So

01:00:58 how do you look at him? How do you see him fitting? And does he make the Celtics better

01:01:03 than they were a year ago? I don't know if he makes us all this better than they were a year

01:01:07 ago. He's going to make them different than they were a year ago. He's a matchup nightmare.

01:01:13 He can do so many things offensively. He can make life so much easier for Brown and Tatum,

01:01:23 potentially. When you have a guy that big that can do that many things with the ball,

01:01:30 score the ball, shoot, ridiculous range, handle the run, is a willing passer.

01:01:38 And this is another thing. People never got to see what he played like with different kinds

01:01:47 of teammates, with a different kind of setting, with a team with a different defensive profile,

01:01:56 with different coaching, and again, in a stable environment. He hasn't played a significant

01:02:02 amount of games in a season yet. Why? What did he have to do on the court?

01:02:09 How much energy did he have to exert? How much was he asked to do in those seasons that pretty much

01:02:18 could have lent to him not being on the court more than 64 games in a year? I feel like if you're

01:02:25 playing on a team with Tatum Brown and some of these other cats and the way they play, the style

01:02:32 they play, he might spend more time playing. He might have to, and if the Celtics play well,

01:02:41 he's not going to have to spend the entire game on the court. There are a whole lot of different

01:02:46 factors that people aren't really considering. This is a unique situation for Chris Saps Porzingis.

01:02:55 So when you think about what he did previously, throw it out.

01:02:59 I understand people thinking, "Okay, this is what he's done in the past,

01:03:05 so we're going to project that to the future." Throw it out.

01:03:08 This team is going to have such a different look. It's going to be dangerous in a different way on

01:03:16 offense. It's going to allow for people to do more things, but you're calling him a center.

01:03:23 In my brain, I can't process him being a center. Just because of the shooting?

01:03:26 Well, because of his play style. When I think of a center, I still think of Al Horford or Rob

01:03:33 Moore as a center than him. To me, I don't care that he's 7'3". When I see him, he's a small

01:03:40 power forward, but he can't be a small power forward if you're going to have Jalen playing

01:03:45 there. See what I'm saying? It's going to be interesting, right? Because I think their plan

01:03:50 is to start Rob and Porzingis together. Rob's the guy who's going to play closer to the rim,

01:03:55 who's going to roll. Porzingis, I don't want to say he's going to be shooting exclusively threes,

01:04:01 but he's going to be shooting a lot of threes to make this work.

01:04:04 I think he's going to be spending a lot of time in the paint, and he's going to be shooting threes.

01:04:09 I think he's going to be able to get shots because of the players on the court, and I think that the

01:04:15 players on the court are going to be able to get shots because of Porzingis. I think it's going to

01:04:19 open up a lot of things for Rob to do and Al to do and any of these wings that I've listed.

01:04:25 I think that they might be able to create some level of chaos on the defense that gets them out

01:04:32 in the transition. I love his fit defensively, I do.

01:04:35 Because I fully believe that one of the things that Joe Mazzullo wants to do is make this team

01:04:42 somebody that just grinds you into the dirt and then just tires you out to the point where they're

01:04:49 just scoring on you in a myriad of ways. I think that the way the Boston Celtics were constructed

01:04:56 before, they had a different defensive philosophy. I think there's going to be offense first,

01:05:01 then the defense on top of the offense. You want grit, you want toughness. I feel like Joe Mazzullo

01:05:08 is like, "We're going to have a different kind of toughness. It's not going to present the way

01:05:14 it did before." I think the fans are going to have to be open and receptive to it. I'm just afraid

01:05:21 that looking at the past few seasons, that this Celtics fandom is looking for things in a different

01:05:29 manner that they're going to appear, and they're not going to appreciate it immediately. I'm able

01:05:34 to throw out all my preconceived notions and all my expectations and just watch what the Celtics do.

01:05:40 I feel like it's going to be successful. How successful? I don't know. The Celtics fans

01:05:47 won a championship. Only one team wins a title out of the 30 every year. The Denver Nuggets won it

01:05:54 last year. Did anybody pick them before the season started? No. Just watch the season and just be

01:06:00 Celtics fans. Please. Let's do that. Let's try that. That's the one thing I'm going to sit back,

01:06:07 watch and see this whole thing play out with Boyce Angus because there's a world where this

01:06:12 is just a grand slam and this is that final piece they needed to turn this into a championship team.

01:06:20 It wasn't quite KG for a bunch of reasons, but sitting at that press conference, they got it

01:06:28 down on the court. Probably their biggest acquisition since, depending on how you look at Kyrie.

01:06:33 It was a big deal. The 7'3" guy comes walking in off this great year. Looks like he's going to be

01:06:42 a big three-piece along with the other two wings. They were missing a lot of offense

01:06:47 at that center spot last year. I'll call him a center again. They didn't have a pressure on the

01:06:55 rim and they didn't have a big guy on defense like a 7'3" guy. Those are two areas of weakness

01:07:02 on last year's team because teams would shoot over Horford in that drop. Teams would be able

01:07:08 to easily take the rim away from Tatum and Brown because they didn't have that rim pressure.

01:07:11 He could really solve those two things, not to mention being the three-point threat he is,

01:07:17 which is really going to hurt Giannis and Bede, those guys who want to camp out in the paint

01:07:22 rather than go out and guard this guy. All he needs to do is give us between 18 and 20 a game.

01:07:27 You could get 30 or 32 from Jason and you could get 25 to 28 from Jalen. If they get 25, 28,

01:07:43 and you get 20 or more from Chris Stapps-Porzingis, that's insane. Now you have to start thinking

01:07:50 about what's Derek White going to do. When we get Brogdon back, how's that going to work?

01:07:55 Then we have all these versatile wings that can finish and defend, guard, possibly cut to the

01:08:05 basket, score, get offensive rebounds, get second shot opportunities, be disruptive on the defensive

01:08:14 end. This can go well or it can be a huge disappointment. I'm going to reserve judgment,

01:08:24 but I think the fans, they just want to see a championship. They don't care about anything

01:08:30 else. I think there's a whole lot of middle ground there. There's a whole lot of middle ground there.

01:08:35 He's Darren Adams, as always, one of the more prolific

01:08:40 tweeters about the Celtics and also a brilliant journalist, historian, and all the rest.

01:08:45 I've got a new piece in NPR about Boston as a hip hop hub. Anything else cooking? Anything

01:08:51 else to look forward to coming along? I recently collaborated with this French magazine

01:08:58 to do a whole piece about Boston and Boston basketball. I collaborated with a journalist

01:09:04 from France who was for Le Monde newspaper. We did an article about Boston Celtics basketball

01:09:10 and basketball culture. I'm working on there's going to be some high level Boston Celtics

01:09:22 content that's going to come to you in 2024. I'm working on that with some great people.

01:09:30 Yeah, I'm just doing a bunch of writing. We're about to approach the 30th anniversary of the

01:09:38 passing of Reggie Lewis and me and my boys, Boston Legends. We're going to be re-releasing

01:09:43 a bunch of Boston uniforms, jerseys, shorts very, very soon. Everything's happening right now.

01:09:52 Yeah, the 90s were 30 years ago now, unbelievably.

01:09:58 Yeah, I'm glad you bring up the France thing. I don't think people realize just the fever

01:10:02 of Celtics fans overseas. I saw it in Spain, France. Our guy Timmy there does the highlights

01:10:11 from Poland. I mean, all over the world, there's just Celtics fever. I think the most intense

01:10:17 Celtics fans, there's a lot of them in Boston, but there are much more overseas who grew up on

01:10:23 Bird and seen them play in Madrid or whatever it might be. It's intense over there. They are

01:10:31 passionate. That's one thing I want to kick around with O'Shea. I knew him from college.

01:10:37 I don't think people understand really coming to Boston and playing for the Celtics is

01:10:41 not only the internet thing, the fan base online is just wacky, weird and intense.

01:10:50 Yes, there's that for sure. But then there's also just like internationally, you're just going to

01:10:56 become so renowned because of the amount of people that root for this team from abroad and do it at

01:11:01 such a level where they're rooting for the eighth guy, the 10th guy, even the 15th guy on the roster.

01:11:05 And I think that's always going to shock guys who join this team for the first time because it's

01:11:09 different with other teams. It really is. When you see the support Luke Cornett gets,

01:11:14 you're like, wait a minute. All right. He's Dart Adams. Good as always talking to you, Dart.

01:11:20 We'll continue to follow along. Follow him on Twitter @Dart_Adams. See what he has coming out

01:11:25 on the Reggie Lewis front and all the rest. And we'll talk to you again here soon, hopefully,

01:11:29 Dart. See you when the season comes around, which will be sooner rather than later.

01:11:32 Can't wait to quote Mark Scott.

01:11:34 All right. And a word from one more sponsor before we get out of here. Stay tuned. You are not going

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01:12:36 All right. That's our show. We'll be back again live with the whole crew next week. Maybe we'll

01:12:45 have a Jalen extension to kick around. Maybe we will not. If not, I'm sure there's still going to

01:12:49 be some loose ends to tie up with the Celtics off season. I want to dive into some of the new players

01:12:56 of people who watch them. Of course, we had a recent episode with Kaitlin Cooper where we kicked

01:13:00 around O'Shea Breset's impact. I want to do the same with folks on the Dallas side, folks on the

01:13:05 Washington side with Porzingis and see what he's going to bring at a deeper level from guys who

01:13:11 watch them closely in recent years. Of course, maybe Delano Baird down the line as well, though.

01:13:17 Again, he's on a non-guaranteed deal now. I don't think it's as certain that he's going to

01:13:22 make the team. I think he'll make the team, but also play a big role in it going forward.

01:13:27 Also looking forward to seeing Payton Pritchard out with Team USA, going to be part of their

01:13:32 preparation process for FIBA next month. Speaking of Porzingis, he will be playing

01:13:37 for his country next month, Latvia, in the World Cup. I know people get nervous about that after

01:13:48 how things went last year, but a really big deal for him, a big deal for a lot of the players

01:13:53 from overseas. We'll be able to see what kind of shape he's in, what he's looking like, get a few

01:14:01 games from him to talk about into August. Once August is, there's really not going to be a lot

01:14:07 of fresh topics to kick around. I know one thing Jimmy wanted to throw out there as a fresh topic,

01:14:12 my performance in my opener, second game of the season this summer. Finally got back into

01:14:19 my rec league this summer. A little rusty off Vegas, as you can see. A little.

01:14:31 I think after probably close to a year since my first organized basketball here,

01:14:36 a little winded, but played aggressive, as I told Jimmy. I was happy with that.

01:14:44 One of our viewers emphasized people are ignoring the eight rebounds, three blocks,

01:14:51 and overall grittiness of this effort, three fouls as well. I didn't like two of the calls,

01:14:58 but I'm not a big complainer. I will mention, just because I want to clarify two things.

01:15:04 The other team had six guys. It was six on six. I don't know what happened with the box score down

01:15:12 there, but this was not a five on four game. Number two, I don't think I shot 26 shots,

01:15:20 but if I did because of putback tries or whatever it might have been,

01:15:26 I definitely was out there close to 40 minutes. I was in check in 26 shots in 22 minutes.

01:15:32 Want to clarify that. I'll keep you guys up to date through the summer if you really want to

01:15:36 know how my performance is going. But again, first game back in a while, I was really happy

01:15:41 with how aggressive I was. And we won. We obviously had a massive lead, as you saw,

01:15:44 17 and a half. Got outscored by 13 in the second half and had to steal it off for three throws.

01:15:52 Long pass down the court, kicked it to a teammate and we got a layup that kind of iced the game.

01:15:56 So that was that. We're two and O. That's all I care about. All right. That's our show. We'll

01:16:04 see you next week. Enjoy the weekend. Enjoy the rest of your summer. And once again, I'm Bobby

01:16:09 Mann. This has been the Garden Report. Thanks to Dart Adams. Thanks to drinkag1.com/garden.

01:16:14 Thanks to factormeals.com/garden50. Go check them out. I'm actually about to have some of that right

01:16:19 now. And of course, our official sports wagering partner, FanDuel. That's fanduel.com/boston.

Garden Report: Are the Celtics BETTER than Last Year?

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Garden Report Celtics Post-Game Show

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