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00:00:00They say, the harder the work, the greater the reward.
00:00:21This is our life's work.
00:00:26The TDN Writer's Room is brought to you by Keeneland.
00:00:28When the thoroughbred world descends upon Lexington this November, there's one place
00:00:31you need to be.
00:00:32And that, of course, is at Keeneland.
00:00:33It's home to the 2022 Breeders' Cup, followed directly by the November breeding stock sale
00:00:38at Keeneland.
00:00:39View the catalog online now at november.keeneland.com.
00:00:44Good afternoon.
00:00:45It's 1255 in the East Coast on October 4th.
00:00:47This is the TDN Writer's Room, brought to you by Keeneland.
00:00:49I'm your host, Bill Finley, with a new cast of characters.
00:00:52Welcome in, Randy Moss and Zoe Gadman.
00:00:54Thanks, Bill.
00:00:55Glad to be here.
00:00:56Delighted to be here.
00:00:58Well, guys, the big story this week, and there were many big stories, but the big kerfuffle
00:01:03coming out of the Lucas Classic.
00:01:05And there's really two stories here.
00:01:07A great horse race for Hot Rod Charlie, kind of been an unlucky loser throughout his career,
00:01:13came back with this great surge in the end, beat Rich Strike on the wire, Rich Strike
00:01:17running what I thought was maybe the best race of his career.
00:01:20But all anybody wants to talk about is Sonny Leon.
00:01:23What was going on in the stretch?
00:01:25Did it look like he was trying to elbow Tyler Gaffney on?
00:01:28Was it rough riding?
00:01:29Randy Moss, your take on Sonny Leongate Saturday at Churchill Downs on Lucas Classic.
00:01:34This was a race that we actually covered on NBC as part of our telecast on Saturday.
00:01:41And it was really a tale of two replays because we didn't have access at NBC Saturday to the
00:01:48Stewart's Head-On replay.
00:01:49First, you see the pan angle, the normal angle, and you see a fantastic horse race with Rich
00:01:55Strike taking the lead at the 16th pole, looking like he's going to go on to yet another
00:01:59victory at Churchill Downs.
00:02:01And then Hot Rod Charlie came battling back along the inside.
00:02:04You couldn't really see a whole lot else going on on the pan shot.
00:02:09Then afterward was sort of the video scene around the world.
00:02:12The Stewart's Head-On angle, where you could see, Bill, exactly what you described, Leon
00:02:18bringing Rich Strike over toward Hot Rod Charlie, I think probably in a moment of panic, leaning
00:02:25over and appearing to try to elbow Tyler Gafleon in the final strides of the race.
00:02:30And of course, Hot Rod Charlie managing to get up to win anyway.
00:02:34And as they galloped out, you could see Gafleon sort of look over at Sonny Leon, almost with
00:02:40an amused look on his face.
00:02:42I have a feeling it wouldn't have been an amused look if Rich Strike had managed to
00:02:46win the photo.
00:02:47But look, he was given a 15-day suspension by Churchill Downs stewards.
00:02:54Kudos to the stewards for not falling for what, in my opinion, was a completely bogus
00:02:59excuse that Leon came with about the saddle slipping.
00:03:05First of all, if the saddle had indeed slipped, okay, it's ironic that it would have slipped
00:03:13only in the final strides of the race when Hot Rod Charlie is coming back along the inside.
00:03:19Then you see the gallop out afterward and you see Rich Strike coming back to be unsettled.
00:03:23No evidence there of any kind of saddle slip.
00:03:27If indeed the saddle did slip in the last stages of the race, I think it was the result
00:03:32of Sonny Leon leaning over and trying to elbow Gafleon and not the other way around.
00:03:38Look, he deserved the suspension.
00:03:41If it was me and I was a Churchill Downs steward, he'd be on vacation for the rest of the year.
00:03:47I would have given him at minimum two months and maybe even three months.
00:03:52I think it's inexcusable.
00:03:54He's got a history of rough riding.
00:03:56Remember after he won the Kentucky Derby, he immediately started a suspension.
00:04:00It was his fourth since September then.
00:04:03I just think there's no place for anything like this at all.
00:04:06We're fortunate that it ended the way it did and we didn't see Gafleon lose his balance
00:04:12on Hot Rod Charlie.
00:04:13Zoe, what do you think?
00:04:15I think a lot of the takeaway has been we're forgetting what a great race that Hot Rod
00:04:20Charlie actually had.
00:04:21I think maybe over the years, especially the last few races, maybe he's just been unlucky.
00:04:26Maybe he does try every single time because he really wanted to prove that he was the
00:04:31best horse on the day.
00:04:32Now, had Rich Strike stayed straight, he may well have gone by.
00:04:36I have no doubt in my mind that Sonny Leon did steer this horse down into Rich Strike.
00:04:41I also do believe that the saddle did slip, but the only reason it slipped is because
00:04:46Sonny was doing this and elbowing.
00:04:50When your weight is all the way over on one side, of course the saddle's going to slip.
00:04:54Then I think he righted it.
00:04:55There are definitely some pictures when you can see that he is completely off balance
00:05:01and over the wrong side of the horse.
00:05:03I think that split second instant is where the saddle did slip, but it was cause specifically
00:05:10because he was leaning over and trying to basically ride Hot Rod Charlie as well.
00:05:16It's a bit of both, but I think ultimately the stewards made the right decision and 30
00:05:21days.
00:05:22Yes.
00:05:23Think back to Modonagal, last year's Remsen.
00:05:25I actually just watched that this morning and that was really bad and Irad got his 30
00:05:31days.
00:05:32I mean, it's about the same infraction there because Irad steered Modonagal all the way
00:05:37down and-
00:05:38Zoe, let me interrupt for a second because you just said it's the same infraction, but
00:05:42they gave Irad 30 days.
00:05:44They only gave Sonny 15.
00:05:45Different jurisdictions.
00:05:46As an ex-jockey-
00:05:47Yeah, I know.
00:05:48I know.
00:05:49You're going to have a great opinion on this, but to me, it goes beyond whether or not he
00:05:53costs Rich Strike the race.
00:05:56Isn't he putting Tyler Gafleon in jeopardy?
00:05:59Gafleon could have been seriously injured here and we could have had a catastrophe.
00:06:04I'm with Randy.
00:06:05I would have given him at least six months.
00:06:06I think the stewards went too easy on him.
00:06:08Your thoughts?
00:06:09Well, I think the problem has been over the course of the last couple of years that these
00:06:13jocks are getting away with it.
00:06:15When Irad got 30 days, he probably should have got 60.
00:06:18I mean, what he did on Modonagal the day before, he dropped the jock and that's what gave him
00:06:23the penalty.
00:06:24He dropped the bug boy.
00:06:26I think the stewards in all jurisdictions need to start coming down a lot harder, a lot heavier
00:06:32on these guys.
00:06:33Don't let these guys run, ride in designated races.
00:06:37Oh yeah, you get 30 days.
00:06:38You can ride in a grade one race.
00:06:40Well done.
00:06:41Here's your reward.
00:06:42You get 30 days.
00:06:43You should be able to, you should have to take them.
00:06:45You shouldn't be allowed to ride in graded stakes if you are on a suspension.
00:06:50Right.
00:06:51Now we had a similar incident with Christophe Simon in France, which we're going to talk
00:06:54about later.
00:06:55Randy?
00:06:56We've seen Irad do things like this.
00:06:58We've seen Paco Lopez on numerous occasions put what his fellow riders thought was putting
00:07:03them into jeopardy during the running of a race.
00:07:06I agree with Zoe.
00:07:08I think something's got to be done about this.
00:07:09I would have given, again, I would have given, I would have given him the Churchill Downs
00:07:15Bob Baffert treatment, right?
00:07:17Maybe not that draconian, maybe not two years, but yeah, kudos to them for giving them more
00:07:24than like the one week standard suspension, a three week suspension.
00:07:28But I think they could have, and I would have gone a lot more heavy duty on that.
00:07:33So Randy, let's get back to the race itself and Zoe touched on it.
00:07:36If this didn't happen, and like you said, if we were only looking at the pan shot, then
00:07:40we're looking at a terrific horse race.
00:07:42And I thought the story was Rick's strike, even a little bit more so Zoe than Hot Rod
00:07:47Charlie, because to me, this horse still had to prove himself.
00:07:51I know he ran well in the Travers, but he was fourth.
00:07:54And to me, he was still the 80 to one shot that won the Kentucky Derby with a Sonny Leon,
00:08:00great ride, perfect trip, pace meltdown.
00:08:02I thought this was the best race of his career.
00:08:04I thought it was even better than his Kentucky Derby considering a couple of things.
00:08:08First of all, he was running against older horses for the first time in a pretty salty
00:08:12field.
00:08:13You know, it wasn't a big race of field-wise, size-wise, there's some really nice horses
00:08:16in there like Hot Rod Charlie, like Happy Saver, et cetera.
00:08:19And he really showed up, probably would have won the race if this incident didn't happen.
00:08:24The other thing, Randy, I liked about him, what happened to the rich strike that comes
00:08:27from 20 lengths behind?
00:08:28He was fourth early, two and a half lengths off the pace, I believe in the half mile call.
00:08:34That's going to serve him well.
00:08:35I hate horses that come from 20 lengths behind because they're always pace dependent.
00:08:39He ran like a different horse in the course of the race.
00:08:42I thought it was the best race of his career.
00:08:45And I think Eric Reid has every reason to be very happy about it.
00:08:48And looking forward, he's already talked about how good this horse is going to be as a four-year-old.
00:08:51I think he's right.
00:08:52You know, Eric kept telling us after the Kentucky Derby, he kept insisting, this horse actually
00:08:57has speed.
00:08:58And we just kind of laughed as far back as he was in Kentucky.
00:09:01But obviously, the horse does have a few more chops during the first part of a race
00:09:05than he showed at Churchill Downs.
00:09:07Look, I really liked his race in the Traverse.
00:09:10He wasn't going to beat Epicenter, but I thought he was the second best horse in that race
00:09:14because Sonny Leung actually started the engine at about the four and a half pole and was
00:09:19in a full on ride at the half mile pole with rich strike moving that early.
00:09:25And yet the horse was still digging, digging, digging for the final quarter of a mile and
00:09:28ran pretty well.
00:09:30So I expected him to give a really good showing of himself on Saturday.
00:09:34Did I expect him to run as well as he did?
00:09:37Maybe not.
00:09:38But I agree.
00:09:39He definitely did prove that he's for real.
00:09:41He really did.
00:09:42I mean, then there's no question that he loves Churchill Downs.
00:09:45He's almost, almost undefeated at Churchill Downs.
00:09:49But I pose the question, does Sonny Leung stay on?
00:09:52Do we get a new rider?
00:09:54Well, so far, there hasn't been a change.
00:09:56We haven't heard anything from the connection.
00:09:57So we'll wait and see if they do make a change.
00:09:59Eric Reid has seemed pretty loyal to him all along.
00:10:01So we'll find out about that.
00:10:03All right.
00:10:04We thought the big story of the week was going to be life is good.
00:10:05Turned out nobody's even talking about him winning the Woodward.
00:10:09And I got to admit, look, at one hand, you look at this horse, he's won three grade ones
00:10:12this year.
00:10:13If Flightline didn't exist, he'd be the leading contender for the horse of the year.
00:10:17But you know what?
00:10:18At one to 20, not even one to 10, one to 20, going against three rivals, I certainly expect
00:10:24a lot more than a, what was it, a length and a half win, where at one point in the
00:10:29race, it looked like he might actually be in jeopardy of winning.
00:10:32And Randy, your team with the buyers gave him a 97 buyer figure.
00:10:35He's going to have to run a lot faster than that, not only to win the Breeders' Cup Classic,
00:10:40but to be competitive in the Breeders' Cup Classic.
00:10:43Now, you could make one argument that it was just a paid public workout.
00:10:46I get it.
00:10:47But you know what?
00:10:48I was expecting more from him, to be honest, Randy.
00:10:52I don't think a matchup with Flightline at a mile and a quarter at Keeneland in the Breeders'
00:10:58Cup Classic is going to end well for Life is Good.
00:11:02Having said that, I do think that his Woodward was a little better than the 97 buyer speed
00:11:10figure would indicate.
00:11:12And here's why.
00:11:14The horse had shown a tendency in his two-turn races, going back to the Pegasus World Cup,
00:11:21to the Dubai World Cup, or was it Saudi Arabia?
00:11:26Anyway, one of the two.
00:11:28And then the most recently in the Whitney, of running off down the backstretch with Ira
00:11:35Ortiz, really aggressively at about the three-quarter pole, taking off down the backstretch and
00:11:41using up a lot of valuable energy at that point in the race.
00:11:46And it showed in the closing stages of his race in the Pegasus.
00:11:50He ran the final quarter in 26.38.
00:11:53In the Whitney, he ran the final quarter in 25.57.
00:11:57Pletcher made it a point during the lead-up to the Woodward to try to get the horse to
00:12:03settle a little bit and to tell Ira, going into the Woodward, the same thing, you know,
00:12:09try not to let him run off down the backstretch.
00:12:12If anything, I think it worked too well.
00:12:14I think the horse was too relaxed during the early part of the race.
00:12:18If you look at the internal fractions, it was a lot slower than he had been running
00:12:23early on in those races.
00:12:25And as a result, when Law Professor ran up to him and gave him that scare at the quarter
00:12:28pole, right, Leichtesgut was able to finish in 24.01 for the final quarter mile.
00:12:34By far the fastest finish that he had had in any of those mile-and-an-eighth races that
00:12:39he had run in the past.
00:12:41So I do think the race was better than the visuals would indicate, and maybe better than
00:12:48the speed figure would indicate.
00:12:49But having said that, does that mean that, you know, he's going to stack up really well
00:12:54when Flightline grabs him by the throat, if that happens at the half-mile pole or so in
00:12:58the Breeders' Cup?
00:12:59I don't think it will.
00:13:00I mean, I'm with you with everything you said, Randy, for sure.
00:13:05And the internal fractions were good for Flightline.
00:13:08He did finish.
00:13:09Visually, it was workmanlike, but that's not...
00:13:12This was just a stepping stone to the Breeders' Cup Classic.
00:13:16The old adage, never be afraid of one horse.
00:13:19Anything can happen the morning of the race.
00:13:21God forbid.
00:13:22I mean, I don't want anything to happen.
00:13:23I want it to be a terrific horse race.
00:13:26But unless you're entered, I know a lot of people are going to be saying, why doesn't
00:13:29he run in the dirt mile?
00:13:31What happens if Flightline's sick the morning of the race, and you're in the dirt mile,
00:13:36and it's up for grabs?
00:13:37I mean, you've got to be in it to win it.
00:13:40So I applaud them for still going for the Classic, because at the end of the day, it's
00:13:45a horse race, and it's going to be a good one.
00:13:48Yeah, I talked to Todd before the Woodward.
00:13:52We had a phone conversation with him, and I asked him, I said, look, you've had a lot
00:13:57of good horses.
00:13:58You've been in this position a lot of times.
00:14:01And I know you still have the Woodward left to go, but in the back of your mind, you kind
00:14:04of envision the Breeders' Cup Classic at Keeneland, where you're in front, Flightline is sitting
00:14:10right behind you in second, and what might happen?
00:14:12And he said, absolutely.
00:14:13He said, it's human nature.
00:14:15You can't help but think about that.
00:14:18And he said, our best hope, given how good Flightline is, is that perhaps we can possibly
00:14:26see the same thing in the Breeders' Cup Classic as we saw when Olympiad was chasing Life is
00:14:32Good in the Whitney, right?
00:14:35Olympiad had been dominant, chasing horses that were inferior to him, and looking like
00:14:43a world beater in the process.
00:14:45And then in the Whitney, when he had to try to chase Life is Good at the half-mile pole,
00:14:49and he tried and he couldn't really make any headway, he was like, oh, wait a second.
00:14:54And he just basically gave up, I think, and Todd Kletcher thinks as well.
00:15:00The hope, at least, from the Life is Good camp is that when Flightline makes his run
00:15:05at Life is Good, and suddenly, you know, he's not making his run at some of those horses
00:15:09that he's been having to run down in the past, and he has to work a little bit harder
00:15:14to get there, that it might discourage him a little bit, and we might see a surprising
00:15:19outcome.
00:15:20I think the problem with that logic is that Flightline is just a better horse than Olympiad.
00:15:25It's nice for them to try.
00:15:26Okay, the other race of the weekend that we knew was going to produce horses for the Breeders'
00:15:30Cup Classic was the Awesome Again out at Santa Anita.
00:15:34My take on that is you have, of the older male dirt horses in California, you have a
00:15:39superstar and a bunch of really ordinary horses.
00:15:41Defonded, boy, he was coming off a sixth-place finish in a sprint race, kind of stole the
00:15:46race.
00:15:47I thought Country Grammar would run a lot better than he did, and I kind of wanted him
00:15:51to see him run better because I wanted him to, because I'm such a Flightline loon, if
00:15:55Flightline beats him by 19 and a quarter lengths and he comes back and wins the Awesome Again
00:15:59by five or six, what does that say about Flightline?
00:16:02Well, again, I'm still a Flightline loon, but I think what we learned is Pacific Classic,
00:16:06he beat fairly ordinary horses, Randy.
00:16:09Yeah, I mean, the top older horses in California have been taking turns beating each other
00:16:14all year. Your Country Grammar's Express Trains, your Royal Ships, you know, there goes
00:16:19Harvard, wins one of them.
00:16:21And they're all pretty good races, and some of them are even better than pretty good.
00:16:24But, you know, I mean, in the end, in the Awesome Again, those horses were
00:16:30disappointing. I thought Country Grammar, I agree, I thought he would run better than
00:16:35he did. And Baffert is now talking about not even trying to run against Flightline in
00:16:41the Breeders' Cup Classic. Of course, he has Teba, the three-year-old, pointing for that
00:16:45race as well. And maybe he thinks that Country Grammar's not as good as Teba.
00:16:49He thinks he's kind of going in the wrong direction.
00:16:51Express Train, when he came out of the Californian, he had to have some extra time
00:16:56because he was body sore and he didn't run in the San Diego because John Sheriffs didn't
00:17:00like the way he was training.
00:17:02He obviously is not the same horse.
00:17:03Royal Ship went in the wrong direction.
00:17:05Defunded's just not good enough, right?
00:17:07I mean, I think he's better than the betters gave him credit for at five to one because
00:17:13he ran really well in the Hollywood Gold Cup at a mile and a quarter to finish second.
00:17:17Then he ran in the San Diego and caught a very deep rail that gave him absolutely no
00:17:21chance. And then he was thrown into a sprint race for the first time since early in his
00:17:24career. He just didn't do very good chasing in the sprint fractions when he's able to
00:17:28control the pace like he did on Saturday.
00:17:30He's good enough to beat those kind of horses if things go his way.
00:17:34But I think the main story here is that none of those horses look like they're likely to
00:17:39go on and ship out to Keeneland for the right to run against Fightline and Life is Good.
00:17:45Yeah, and Defunded, quite frankly, is just really good at Santa Anita.
00:17:48He's a very good workhorse.
00:17:50He works superbly at Santa Anita and he likes the track.
00:17:53So, you know, it'll be up to Bob to see if he wants to send him there or not.
00:17:58You know, another cool storyline is about that race, I think.
00:18:03The three amigos, right?
00:18:05The owners, Mike Pegram, Carl Watson, Paul Whiteman.
00:18:09Of course, you know, they've been around for a long time.
00:18:11They had Midnight Loot and, of course, Mike Pegram well before that with Real Quiet.
00:18:15They've kind of taken a back seat in the Baffert barn over the last 10 years or so, you
00:18:20know, with American Pharoah and with Justify and the Avengers group spending these millions
00:18:25and millions and millions of dollars for these high priced two year olds and yearlings.
00:18:30But this year, it's been a renaissance for the three amigos.
00:18:34They're not only defunded, but they've got a whole barn full of really good two year
00:18:39olds, including the favorite for the American Pharoah coming up on Saturday.
00:18:43So it's kind of cool to see those guys back in the limelight.
00:18:46It's really cool to see them back in, because I think they had three stakes winners, the
00:18:50last three stakes winners that they had.
00:18:52Neither one cost more than two hundred and sixty thousand.
00:18:55So Donato Lani, who buys a lot of Bob's horses, he also buys for the Avengers, is
00:19:01finding these horses for the three amigos.
00:19:04And, you know, Bob is right in there with them.
00:19:06And it's it's going back to their roots, basically, because these are the guys who Bob
00:19:11started with right from the very, very beginning.
00:19:13I mean, it is love or hate Bob Baffert.
00:19:16This is a cool story that he's going back to his roots and his roots have been there
00:19:20all along. Just a reminder, it's full stars, all star weekend.
00:19:25This Keeneland 11 stakes worth more than five point five million dollars.
00:19:30Nine of those races are Breeders' Cup win and you're in contest.
00:19:33We're also just a month away from the Keeneland sale that starts on November the
00:19:37seventh, right after the Breeders' Cup.
00:19:40And I know a lot of those really fantastic racemers will be headed to the Keeneland
00:19:44sale, including multiple grade one winner Juju's map.
00:19:49When the thoroughbred world descends upon Lexington this November, there is one place
00:19:54you need to be the place where history comes alive with every championship victory.
00:20:01The place where the future is built with the fall of a gap, the place that exists to be
00:20:08the heart of this industry.
00:20:10The center of it all.
00:20:12Home to the November breeding stock sale and 2022 Breeders' Cup, Keeneland.
00:20:18Maximum Security proves he's the real deal with a gate to wire win in the Florida
00:20:23Derby. Champion three year old Maximum Security has won the TBG.com Haskell
00:20:30Invitational. Eleven triple digit buyers.
00:20:33Maximum Security, he smoked them in the cigar mile.
00:20:38Grade one winning four year old Maximum Security takes them all the way in the TBG
00:20:43Pacific Classic. Secure your mare's future.
00:20:46Maximum Security.
00:20:49The TDN Writer's Room is brought to you by Coolmore.
00:20:52Ashford Sire Practical Joke got two new grade one winners over the weekend.
00:20:57And Randy, I know you are a big fan of chocolate gelato, both the horse and the pudding.
00:21:03How good was she over the weekend in the grade one frisette?
00:21:07I think I like the horse a little more than I like the pudding.
00:21:09Eight and a half week maiden win.
00:21:11And she followed that up with that win in the frisette at Belmont at Aqueduct on Sunday
00:21:16on a sloppy racetrack.
00:21:17I think that stamps her as one of the leading contenders right now going into Keeneland
00:21:22for the Breeders' Cup Juvenile Phillies.
00:21:24And hey, if it rains at Keeneland, she's proven she can handle it, Bill.
00:21:28Now, I want to know, is calling gelato pudding like an English thing?
00:21:32Zoe, I've never heard that before.
00:21:34Yeah, it's pudding.
00:21:35It's pudding.
00:21:35Of course, it's pudding.
00:21:36No, it's gelato.
00:21:37I mean, it could be dessert as well.
00:21:38Well, you just watched Bill Cosby used to eat on those old ads before he went up in jail.
00:21:43I'm not sure where you're asking his name anymore.
00:21:46Right.
00:21:50See, now I learned something.
00:21:51You always learn something on the Thoroughbred Daily News Writer's Room.
00:21:53Now I know what pudding means to people in England.
00:21:56Now, the big story in Europe this weekend was not pudding.
00:21:59It was, of course, the Arc de Triomphe.
00:22:01And Zoe, you talked about Alpinista before the race, your affinity for Sir Mark
00:22:05Prescott, who you worked for before.
00:22:07I don't follow European racing all that closely, but I gather people were very
00:22:11happy to see this mayor win for one of the reasons why Prescott is very well
00:22:15liked and they were hoping that he would get his first arc win.
00:22:17Zoe, tell us more about the story of Alpinista.
00:22:20I mean, it's just a massive story.
00:22:23Kirsten Reusing has had five generations of family.
00:22:26She brought the first one back in 1985.
00:22:29Sir Mark has trained them all, Alborado, Alpinista, Albedora.
00:22:33They all begin with Al and there's been five generations.
00:22:36And the fact that this mayor in Sir Mark's 53rd year of training, he is the longest
00:22:43serving trainer in Newmarket, wins the arc.
00:22:46I don't think there's a single person other than perhaps the poor suds that work
00:22:50for him back at Heath House that basically work night and day because I've been one
00:22:55of them, that wasn't happy for Sir Mark and the team and Kirsten Reusing.
00:23:00It really was a phenomenal performance on boggy, boggy ground.
00:23:06I mean, the second place finisher was good.
00:23:08We saw Torquato Tasso run third.
00:23:10So he basically, it wasn't a fluke last year when he won, but it really was a
00:23:15fantastic day of racing.
00:23:18And there is not one person that wasn't happy for Sir Mark, perhaps his long, long
00:23:22serving, suffering assistant, William, because Sir Mark's been threatening to
00:23:27retire for years and he just says he's just never going to retire now.
00:23:34Randy, your take on the arc?
00:23:36Oh, it looks like we're not going to get any of the the top finishers coming over
00:23:40from the arc to the Breeders' Cup.
00:23:42Maybe we'll get some of the also-rans, it remains to be seen.
00:23:44A lot of that doesn't get decided until, you know, right before the planes leave
00:23:48Europe to come over here for the Breeders' Cup.
00:23:51We might get a couple of fillies coming out of the Prix de l'Opera to run in the
00:23:56filly and mare turf as one of the historic undercard races for Longchamp.
00:24:01But going into the arc, OK, one of the one of the big storylines was the fact that
00:24:08Christophe Soumion was going to be actually allowed to ride.
00:24:13He winds up riding in the arc on a horse called Vadini and is a is a very strong
00:24:19second, getting beat just to half length.
00:24:22But Bill, what we saw from Soumion in France was very similar to what we saw from
00:24:28Sonny Leon Saturday at Belmont at Aqueduct, except it ended much more dramatically.
00:24:35Yeah, so let's go back to the story.
00:24:36It was Friday at Saint-Clude and Soumion was riding a horse in a grade three stakes
00:24:40race, group three stakes race, a jockey by the name of Rosso Ryan, who I've never
00:24:44heard of. Zoe might be more familiar than was outside of him.
00:24:47And Soumion, yeah, he went above and beyond what even our friend Sonny Leon did.
00:24:51He elbowed the jockey and knocked him off the horse.
00:24:54And the suspension was not only was it just 60 days.
00:24:58And just as I said that Sonny Leon deserved a more serious suspension or longer
00:25:03suspension, he was able to ride in the arc.
00:25:06They didn't let the suspension.
00:25:08But those were the rules that were in place at that point that they wouldn't start till
00:25:13after the weekend, I guess maybe because entries were already taken for the race.
00:25:17That sort of thing. But again, you know, talk about, Zoe, what he what could have
00:25:22happened. The horse was OK and the jockey he knocked out of the saddle was OK.
00:25:26But this, again, could have been a catastrophe.
00:25:28And I don't know, Kristoff Soumion, all I know the first thing about him.
00:25:32But this was a really egregious offense.
00:25:35And I would have given him at least again, at least a year.
00:25:38The French stewards seem to be doing the same thing that they're doing in the United
00:25:41States. They're not sending enough of a message that safety comes first.
00:25:45And you cannot pull stunts like this.
00:25:47And if you do, you're going to be set down for a long, long time.
00:25:51Absolutely. And he did a move that has worked for him in the past.
00:25:54But any time you're racing horses at 30 miles an hour, you've got your toes in the
00:25:58stirrups. Any slight elbow or jostle can knock you off balance.
00:26:02And that's exactly what happened to Ross Ryan.
00:26:05He apologized frantically afterwards.
00:26:09I'm not sure what Ross had to say for it, but thank goodness that he was OK.
00:26:14Soumion has lost his job with the Aga Khan over this.
00:26:18He did get to ride Vardini in the arc.
00:26:21Thank goodness he didn't win.
00:26:22He was second. And it looks like Vardini will stay in training and try for next
00:26:26year's arc. Whether Soumion rides him or not, I don't really know.
00:26:30But, you know, they made an example of him.
00:26:32They gave him the two months and basically closed the book on him for the rest of
00:26:38the year. And quite rightly so.
00:26:40It happens a lot.
00:26:42There was an article, I think, this morning in the Racing Post, another jockey saying
00:26:47that this is a move. He just did it wrong.
00:26:49You know, so these are moves that jocks make in races.
00:26:54And we've seen it time and time again.
00:26:56People got enough horse, they'll barge their way through there.
00:26:58And that's exactly what he did.
00:27:00Well, Zoe, let me ask you, as a rider, I don't know if anybody's ever literally
00:27:05elbowed you off the horse.
00:27:06But how often do these sort of things, maybe not quite as egregious, but how often do
00:27:11they happen where jocks are, you know, jostling one another, pushing one another, maybe a
00:27:14little elbow here and there?
00:27:16Does it happen more than the public might know?
00:27:18Oh, every day, every single day.
00:27:20If you're stuck on the rail and you've got horse, you're going to get through.
00:27:24I mean, different jurisdictions take different lights on it, but it happens every
00:27:30day. And for people not to see it, I think the stewards need to start coming down hard
00:27:36on these jocks. I mean, I've jumped heels before on horses.
00:27:40I mean, you can jump heels to get out of situations, but yes, it happens.
00:27:45And especially in Europe, where they ride a whole lot tighter.
00:27:48You can hear horses clipping heels.
00:27:50If you stand on the rail at Longchamp, you'll hear clickety, clickety, clickety, clack.
00:27:54And these jocks know exactly how close they can get and not go down.
00:27:59Like, it's amazing that more don't go down, but that's just how close and compact.
00:28:04Half the jocks over here, if they rode in a 30 horse field at Longchamp, would be
00:28:07absolutely terrified because they just ride very, very close.
00:28:14So in America, what we typically see would be in turf racing where they're bunched up
00:28:19and you get a rider, let's say, who's on a four to five or a three to five shot at the
00:28:23top of the stretch and he's boxed in behind horses and he's got to get out and he just
00:28:27broadsides a horse next to him and bulls out and makes room for himself.
00:28:32When you see the head-on replay of the Soumian incident, both those horses are at the
00:28:38back of the pack and it looked as if Soumian was trying to force his way out to get some
00:28:42room. Except in this case, he didn't just broadside the horse.
00:28:45He reaches over and he elbows Ross Orion at the same time and apparently caught Ryan a
00:28:50little bit off balance. The scary part, when you look at the still photos, Ross Orion
00:28:57actually hits the ground face first and his body is contorted up in the air behind him.
00:29:03He's very lucky when you see that photo of the way he landed that he's not looking at
00:29:08spending the rest of his life in a wheelchair because we've seen much less severe looking
00:29:13incidents than this cause some pretty catastrophic outcomes.
00:29:18So the one thing that did amaze me is usually
00:29:27if something like that happens, the egregious jock will know it's happened.
00:29:32The fact that Soumian didn't even look over like he elbowed him so he knew he created
00:29:37contact and you can hear like if someone falls off, there's going to be a squeak.
00:29:42There's going to be some kind of noise like you are going to know like riding races.
00:29:46You know when something's happened behind you, you can hear it and jocks make noise
00:29:51that people don't realize the amount that you can hear out there.
00:29:54So he will have heard it and didn't look over and there is no way he didn't know that
00:30:00something maybe he didn't know the guy fell off, but something usually you will take a
00:30:04look over and be like, oh, oh, oh, dear.
00:30:07Something like that.
00:30:08That is what boggles my mind.
00:30:11Right.
00:30:12Going back to the card on the Arc de Carte, I think that we should mention there was something
00:30:17we don't ever see and probably never will see in U.S. racing.
00:30:21A two-year-old won the Prix Le Bay.
00:30:23The name escapes me at the point.
00:30:24Zoe, I hope that you're up on that.
00:30:26But tell us a situation where a two-year-old can beat older horses in a group one race.
00:30:33It's fantastic.
00:30:34I don't think it's happened since maybe the 1970s or something.
00:30:39Holly Doyle rode the filly.
00:30:41The name is escaping me as we speak.
00:30:45And she basically won the win in your end.
00:30:47Now, the win in your end is for the Turf Sprint, but she, of course, will be the win
00:30:51in your end in the Juvenile Turf Sprint.
00:30:53And for a two-year-old filly now, she was getting a huge break in weight, which does
00:30:58help these, but usually they're not even entered.
00:31:01For her to beat Elder like she did in the style she did it and the fact the ground was
00:31:06so testing was simply amazing.
00:31:08And Holly Doyle just rode her terrifically.
00:31:11Okay, I have to look this up.
00:31:14The name of the horse is the Platinum Queen, the one that Prix de la Bay.
00:31:17Now, somebody pointed out something that's interesting.
00:31:20Usually, the Prix de la Bay winner would go in the Breeders' Cup Turf Sprint.
00:31:24She's not eligible because the conditions of the race don't allow a two-year-old.
00:31:29It's for three-year-olds and up.
00:31:30Now, they do have that other race on the card.
00:31:32And I don't know what their plans are coming for the Breeders' Cup or not.
00:31:34They do have that Breeders' Cup Juvenile Turf Sprint.
00:31:37But of course, it perhaps might even be one of the would be one of the favorites in the
00:31:40Breeders' Cup Turf Sprint is not eligible to run in it because of her age.
00:31:45Like I said, two-year-olds beating older horses just does not happen in this country.
00:31:48The conditions for the Abbey are two-year-olds and up.
00:31:54And there's a colossal weight break for two-year-olds when they run against the older
00:31:58horses in the Abbey.
00:31:59But still, you just never see a two-year-old win that race.
00:32:02So fascinating.
00:32:04And if they come over, Midland Park Racing, those guys went absolutely nuts.
00:32:10And quite rightly so.
00:32:12They're a great group of guys.
00:32:13And they basically got this filly for peanuts.
00:32:16And good luck to them.
00:32:17I hope they do come.
00:32:18And that seemingly is the plan.
00:32:21The TD and Riders Room is brought to you by the Pennsylvania Horse Breeders Association.
00:32:26The PHBA recently concluded a successful inaugural edition of the Pennsylvania Stallion
00:32:32Series.
00:32:33Lupe Preciado won the training title.
00:32:35The top three trainers receive bonuses of $25,000, $15,000, and $10,000.
00:32:41Also, nominations for the 2023 Pennsylvania Sired, Pennsylvania Bred two-year-old Stallion
00:32:48Series are now open.
00:32:50Next year's series is being expanded to run in three legs.
00:32:53Each leg has a race for two-year-olds and two-year-old fillies.
00:32:56Also, a $50,000 trainer bonus for the top three point-earning horses.
00:33:02We'll be right back after this message from the PHBA.
00:33:06Here in Pennsylvania, we're proud of our breeding program, the best in North America.
00:33:11But we're also proud to be leaders in this industry.
00:33:14The PA Horse Breeders Association is funding cutting-edge research at PenVet to detect gene
00:33:19doping in thoroughbreds.
00:33:20And we endorsed the SAFE Act to help protect the most vulnerable horses.
00:33:25Plus, we're pleased to support the aftercare programs set up by our horseman's groups.
00:33:30Just a few of the reasons why you should join us in Pennsylvania, the premier place to breed
00:33:35and race.
00:33:55The TDN Writer's Room is brought to you by XPTV.
00:34:10The XPTV Work of the Week is Blightline.
00:34:14He is a perfect five-for-five, and you can see him working here.
00:34:17Five furlongs in a minute flat, under one laver.
00:34:20This is a horse who is just absolutely terrific, not only in the morning, but also the afternoon.
00:34:27I had a chance to catch up with trainer John Sadler to discuss the work.
00:34:35Just a nice, easy work for Blightline today.
00:34:39He's got a series of works leading up to the Breeders' Cup today.
00:34:42We didn't want to do too much.
00:34:43We just wanted to cruise around there, and he did that.
00:34:46So I'm very happy and look good doing it.
00:34:49Looked like you were leading a cavalry charge.
00:34:51There were a lot of horses out there, John.
00:34:53Yeah, well, the pattern is a lot of horses work on the weekends,
00:34:56because we race Friday, Saturday, Sunday.
00:34:58So you see more works on the weekend.
00:35:02And the weather's conditions were great today, nice and cool, a little bit overcast.
00:35:06So it was a good day to work.
00:35:07Is it a concern for you, watching that many horses on the track at the same time as your champ?
00:35:13Yeah, but I mean, we're blessed to have Juan Leyva,
00:35:16you know, who knows how to stay away from trouble.
00:35:20So we're always trying to get the first bunch of them before anybody falls off.
00:35:25All right, John, thanks for your time.
00:35:26You're welcome.
00:35:28And now the Green Group Guest of the Week, sponsored by the Green Group,
00:35:32an accounting and tax consulting advisory firm specializing in the thoroughbred industry.
00:35:36With over 500 clients in the horse business, they have proven strategies to save you taxes.
00:35:42Learn how they can help you at www.greenco.com.
00:35:47Well, our special guest this week is Tim Martin, the trainer of Tyler's Tribe,
00:35:51an exceptional horse running on the Iowa Circuit 5 for 5 Lifetime.
00:35:55Tim, thanks for joining us.
00:35:56And let's go back to the beginning.
00:35:58You and your owner, Tom Lepick, found this horse for $34,000 at an Iowa sale.
00:36:04And the horse was by a first-time freshman crop sire in Sharp Azteca.
00:36:08Not a lot to go on.
00:36:09Not exactly the kind of horse you think might be one of the favorites in a Breeders' Cup race.
00:36:13What did you see in this guy to make you go in for the $34,000?
00:36:16And what were you expecting?
00:36:18Well, we bought him on his looks.
00:36:21I was looking for an Iowa bred with Tom Lepick.
00:36:26We've been partners before, and we were looking for an Iowa bred.
00:36:30And he sent me a picture of this horse, Tyler's Tribe.
00:36:33When he sent me the picture, I'm like, wow.
00:36:36I said, this horse looks like a horse coming from Kentucky.
00:36:39He don't look like no Iowa bred.
00:36:40And so, his yearling picture was like something I hadn't seen in Iowa bred.
00:36:45So, I told him, I said, let's go look at this horse.
00:36:47This is, yeah, he's something to look at.
00:36:50So, that's where it started is the picture that, I don't know where he got the picture,
00:36:54the video of him, but it was outstanding when I saw it.
00:36:57I'm like, wow, what a horse.
00:37:00So, there's where it was.
00:37:02So, Tim, so, okay, you buy the horse for $34,000.
00:37:05Now, you're going to get his career started, right?
00:37:08You're at Prairie Meadows for that four and a half furlong maiden race against Iowa breds.
00:37:15He's the favorite.
00:37:16He's five to two, but he's not a heavy, heavy favorite.
00:37:18What did you think you had at that point?
00:37:22I told Tom, what happened is that boy, Tyler, is a grandson of Tom Lepick, and we named
00:37:28the horse after that grandson, Tyler.
00:37:32You probably know the story.
00:37:34So, in the paddock, Tom Lepick told me, he said, hey, I talked to the stewards and asked
00:37:39him, said, Tyler's here, and if we don't win the race, can we get the picture?
00:37:44We're in the paddock.
00:37:45The horse already left.
00:37:46He said, can we get the picture with the Tyler, my grandson?
00:37:50And the stewards said, in the winner's circle said, yes, if you don't win, y'all can come
00:37:54get the picture with the grandson.
00:37:56So, I said, did you tell the jockey?
00:37:58He said, no.
00:37:59I said, well, let me tell you something, Tom.
00:38:02I hate to say, but I really believe when this race is over, we're going to be getting phone
00:38:07calls on this horse because, you know, you don't want to brag him up, but this horse
00:38:11could run.
00:38:11I knew he could run a bunch.
00:38:13And I just told him, I said, I think we're getting phone calls on him.
00:38:15So, that's kind of where it started.
00:38:17So, when you watched him win by 16 and three quarters lengths in a four and a half furlong
00:38:23race, what did you think at that point?
00:38:24Well, I was shocked because I didn't want to run the horse short four and a half.
00:38:30I waited and I told Tom and I talked to the jockey.
00:38:34I said, I don't know about four and a half.
00:38:35It's a big horse.
00:38:37And she's like, oh, no, he can run short or long.
00:38:40And I said, you think he's got enough speed?
00:38:42Oh, yeah.
00:38:42She said, he's got speed.
00:38:43I said, well, I'm running four and a half.
00:38:45But when he went like that, I was, I knew he's a nice horse.
00:38:48I knew he could run a lot because when we was breezing him, she kept saying, these horses
00:38:53are, they're running.
00:38:55He's just galloping.
00:38:56She said, it's like he's not even trying.
00:38:58He just got such a long stride.
00:39:00So, I knew that he was a nice horse, but I didn't know, you know, when he went by 16
00:39:06three quarters going four and a half.
00:39:08Yeah, it was, I was a little shocked.
00:39:11And fast, too.
00:39:12He went 52 and one.
00:39:14So, he wasn't, he was running.
00:39:16Well, Tim, definitely want to get back to more talk about his career, but let's segue
00:39:19to the story of the young man named Tyler, Tom Lepick's grandson.
00:39:24He has leukemia and that's one of the many reasons why your co-owner named the horse
00:39:29after him.
00:39:29Give us an update.
00:39:30How is he doing these days and how much has this helped him in his recovery to have this
00:39:34wonderful horse named after him?
00:39:36Well, it's helped him a lot.
00:39:38And he's, he's actually, he's, he's free of cancer now, or however you want to say it.
00:39:44They took the port out of him a week or two ago and he's, he's really doing good.
00:39:49And so, uh, they announced that the other day.
00:39:52So, they took the port out.
00:39:54And so, he's, he's cancer free right now.
00:39:56So, that's a good thing.
00:39:57And, and he's excited.
00:39:58He's there every time, all five races.
00:40:01He's been there, been the winner's circle and, and, uh, it's been, it's been good.
00:40:06So, now spinning it forward, Tim, uh, you've got a horse who's five for five.
00:40:11His average winning margin is 12 lengths.
00:40:15I mean, you look at his past performances on paper and it's just like almost hard to
00:40:19believe that a horse can be this dominant in every race.
00:40:22And now you're looking ahead to the Breeders' Cup.
00:40:26So, how do you decide, first of all, which race to go into in the Breeders' Cup?
00:40:33Well, I'm, I'm, I'm undecided, but I'm kind of leaning more, uh, towards the, the short
00:40:39race, just because the horses, I didn't get to run him nowhere.
00:40:43I had to stay in Iowa.
00:40:44I had some opportunities, but I had to stay in Iowa because of the, uh, Tyler and the
00:40:50classic night and, you know, the fans there, we kind of planned that.
00:40:54So, I got some offers to go somewhere else.
00:40:57I wanted to run him long before, if I'm gonna go, you know, if I'm going to experiment with
00:41:01him, I'd like to do it before a big race.
00:41:05And I know he's fast and I know he's super fast.
00:41:08And so, I'm thinking more of taking the chance of the turf.
00:41:11And I think he'll like the turf because the family has got some pedigree, the dad, the
00:41:16mom, he's got some siblings that's running really good on the turf.
00:41:20So, I know that he's fast and I know he can run short, long, I don't know.
00:41:25I'm not, I'm not.
00:41:26So, it's just hard to stretch him out right now.
00:41:29Tim, when you have a horse like this, who's never been tested, do even, you know, how
00:41:33good he is?
00:41:34How good is he?
00:41:36We don't know how good he is.
00:41:38Every time the rider rides him, she just pulls up and she's like, I got more horse.
00:41:42I used to not even run it.
00:41:43So, that part, we don't know.
00:41:45We don't know.
00:41:46Cause she, every, every time she says, I have horses, she said, he's got more left.
00:41:50He's got more.
00:41:51And so, so I don't know.
00:41:53I mean, she's hitting the last time the race before the, the, uh, the classic night.
00:41:58The classic Iowa cradle.
00:42:00He went by 15 and a half lengths and Chris Shar brought a two-year-old in.
00:42:04He said, he told the agent and said, I know that my horse can run.
00:42:07I don't know about Martin's, but I don't know if he can beat him, but he can run.
00:42:10Well, he beat him 15 and a half lengths and, and he was just, she hit him one time at the
00:42:16wire and then people jumped like, why'd she hit that horse?
00:42:19I said, well, maybe she wants to teach him what a whip is.
00:42:21Cause he, but he's just, he just takes off.
00:42:24He runs with him.
00:42:25And then when he gets to the lane, he just takes off.
00:42:27He just starts running.
00:42:28So, uh, the other night we had planned to run, to stretch him out, like go the mile.
00:42:33I talked to surge and, but she stood up on him at the wire.
00:42:38So I never did get a line on him.
00:42:40What, what, you know, what to do or what to go long or, or what to do with him on that.
00:42:44Cause she just kind of stood up on him and I know she understood me or not, but anyway,
00:42:49that's kind of what happened on that part.
00:42:52So Tim, you mentioned that you had offers to run him elsewhere.
00:42:55What about other types of offers?
00:42:57Now this is a, obviously it's a horse with a fairly modest pedigree.
00:43:01Although sharp as tech is off to a really fast start as a stallion.
00:43:06But you know, Iowa bred, how much has the phone been ringing?
00:43:11As this horse continues to win with big margins from people wanting to buy the horse from you.
00:43:17Yeah, we've had a lot of offers.
00:43:18I've had some good offers for him.
00:43:22But I've never had in my career, a horse like this.
00:43:25Even close to this.
00:43:26And he's named after Tyler and, and I, we just kind of plan not to sell him.
00:43:32So really, it don't really matter.
00:43:34They offer what, what they want to give.
00:43:36I've had some good offers on it, but I just, we just plan not to sell him.
00:43:40We didn't, me and Tom talked about it and I said, Tom, I don't have to sell him either.
00:43:44And we don't have to sell him.
00:43:46Let's just run him.
00:43:46So I gilled him.
00:43:48Now everybody's saying you gilled the horse.
00:43:49I said, I've had a lot of these horses.
00:43:51They, none of them ever been like this.
00:43:53So what am I going to do?
00:43:55He's a gilded.
00:43:55I said, I mean, just race him.
00:43:58Now you say good offers.
00:43:59Now, not, don't name names or anything.
00:44:01And I know you wouldn't, but give us a ballpark.
00:44:03When you say good offer, what are you, what are you talking about?
00:44:07So I've had a couple of fives, 500.
00:44:09So, I mean, you know, half a million.
00:44:12So I went day, but I mean, I just, I didn't, I'm not, I'm not wanting to sell him.
00:44:16You offer a million dollars.
00:44:18We're not even interested, me or Tom, let's not want to sell him.
00:44:21Wow.
00:44:22So we're having fun.
00:44:23And I've always said, I've heard you can't put a price on fun.
00:44:27So.
00:44:28Very good.
00:44:29Tim, another part of this story is your jockey, Kylie Jordan.
00:44:33She's not familiar to too many people, perhaps outside of Prairie Meadows.
00:44:36She was the leading rider at the meet, but she was up till about a month or a month and
00:44:40a half ago.
00:44:41She was an apprentice.
00:44:42A lot of trainers in your position at some point would have made a change.
00:44:46You would have dialed up Erad Ortiz Jr's jockey agent, John Velasquez's agent, something
00:44:50like that.
00:44:51You've been very loyal to this young lady.
00:44:53Tell her, give us your take on Kylie.
00:44:55And was there ever any temptation to change jockeys?
00:44:58No, I'm not yet.
00:45:00And I may never, but she's fit this horse good.
00:45:04And we started this thing together.
00:45:05And I think I'm pretty loyal to people if they're good.
00:45:09And I've always been that way with riders until, and she's done good.
00:45:12She ain't done nothing wrong.
00:45:15I don't, I want to give her a chance to, she's a really, a really good rider.
00:45:19She fits this horse well.
00:45:21She's quiet on horses.
00:45:22You can put her on babies that people have trouble with.
00:45:25And she just laid back and she gets along with them.
00:45:29And so I've had a lot of success with her already.
00:45:33And I just, I think she fits this horse good.
00:45:35And I've had calls, different people want to ride him, but I'm like, no, I'm sticking
00:45:39with her.
00:45:40We started this together and I'd like to see her do good too.
00:45:44Because I've known her a long time.
00:45:46Uh, she's friends with my daughter and I used to, her and her sister, we'd go to lake, I'd
00:45:51pull them on the tubes and all that.
00:45:52So I've known her a long time, her family at Prairie Meadows.
00:45:55I've been going to assist for 20 years.
00:45:57So I knew her when she was little.
00:46:00So Tim, horse players in Arkansas, horse players in Iowa know you.
00:46:05You've been around, you've been around for quite a while, mostly claiming allowance
00:46:09sources, the occasional stake source.
00:46:11Now you go to the breeder's cup.
00:46:13Okay.
00:46:14You're going to get to square off against a horse trained by Bob Baffert, probably in
00:46:19the juvenile turf sprint.
00:46:20Some horses from Europe, maybe Wesley Ward, Aiden O'Brien.
00:46:24What's it going to be like for you?
00:46:28Well, it's going to be different.
00:46:30That's for sure.
00:46:31I've never had a horse of this level and I know it's a different level, but I'm only
00:46:37thought of this early because of the horse.
00:46:40And I, you know, I don't want to just go to the breeder's cup.
00:46:42I want to have a shot of that.
00:46:44I think so legit the horse and, and I feel that he is a really nice horse.
00:46:50And so I wanted to, I've never been to breeder's cup personally.
00:46:53I've never been to the, I've been to Keeneland, never been to Churchill, the Derby, but if
00:46:57I get a horse, I'll go.
00:46:58But, and that's why this horse, I think that he's a really, really nice horse.
00:47:03And I think we got a shot with, cause I don't know what Nate challenged him.
00:47:07I don't know.
00:47:08He's fast.
00:47:08I mean, he'll, he just gouged when they're running.
00:47:11So we're going to the breeder's cup and I know there's some good horses.
00:47:14I've been hearing about them.
00:47:16And I'm like, well, we don't know what we got yet because he's not been, nobody's challenged
00:47:20this horse and not even be able to even stay with him hardly a quarter mile that he don't
00:47:25beat him a long ways, you know?
00:47:26So, and I know we're at Iowa, but we've had some decent horses come in.
00:47:30I know top recruit and some of them come in and he beat him pretty easy at Iowa.
00:47:36So yeah, I'm thinking we got a good shot in there.
00:47:40I like our chances.
00:47:41Well, we thank Tim, particularly putting up with us, trying to get him to talk on his
00:47:45iPhone in his car.
00:47:47It wasn't exactly the technological genius on our part, but we want to thank Tim very
00:47:51much for putting up with us.
00:47:53And it's a fun story, Tim.
00:47:55Can't wait to see how he fares.
00:47:56And this horse, as I said, in my riding thoroughbred daily news, he's no underdog.
00:48:00He's too fast to be an underdog.
00:48:02This is a legit horse.
00:48:03We can't wait to see what he does in the breeder's cup.
00:48:05Tim Martin, thanks so much for joining us.
00:48:07Thank you very much.
00:48:08Sorry, I couldn't hardly hear.
00:48:09But anyway, thank you all very much.
00:48:10OK, thank you, Tim.
00:48:13The Green Group guest of the week is sponsored by the Green Group, an accounting and tax
00:48:16consulting advisory firm specializing in the thoroughbred industry.
00:48:20As this week's guest of the week, Tim Martin will receive a free one hour tax consultation.
00:48:25Learn more at www.greenco.com.
00:48:29We'll be right back after this message from the Green Group.
00:48:33Why do the most successful owners, breeders and horsemen select the Green Group as their
00:48:36tax advisor?
00:48:37We simply save them money and know how to make them more successful.
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00:48:44in the history of the sport.
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00:48:50has produced positive results for his clientele and has made the Green Group the top rated
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00:49:03at www.greenco.com.
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00:49:06Proven strategies to save you taxes.
00:49:35And now it's time for the TDN Writers Room Weekend Preview brought to you by 3 Chimneys.
00:49:54I got an idea, guys.
00:49:54Let's take a deep dive into all the stakes races that are being run this weekend.
00:49:59And let's extend the podcast.
00:50:01What would that take?
00:50:01About six hours, something like that.
00:50:04This is a weekend to get so excited about because look at these numbers.
00:50:08There are 24 graded stakes races being run this weekend.
00:50:1113 win-in-your-in races and nine grade ones.
00:50:15This, of course, is the last big shebang before the Breeders' Cup comes Sunday morning.
00:50:20Actually, I would say come Monday, Sunday afternoon after all the big races are run.
00:50:23We'll have a pretty good idea, at least from the American horses, who's going where and
00:50:27what races.
00:50:28But you know what?
00:50:28I'm more interested, perhaps, well, I'm interested in all these races.
00:50:32But the ones I'm really looking forward to are the Joe Hirsch Turf Classic out at Aqueduct
00:50:36and the Beldame.
00:50:38And the news broke this weekend that Warlike Goddess is going to go in the Joe Hirsch.
00:50:42And it looked like kind of a, you know, just a ho-hum race.
00:50:46Gouffo's in there.
00:50:47Obviously, he's a very solid horse in this division.
00:50:49But I think Warlike Goddess will really spruce things, spice things up.
00:50:53And Bill Mott, the way he's been campaigning this mare, it's very interesting.
00:50:57This shows why he's a Hall of Famer.
00:50:59He thinks the Breeders' Cup filly in mare turf is too short for her at a mile 316.
00:51:03Wants to run her in a mile and a half against the boys in the Breeders' Cup turf.
00:51:07So why not take on the boys beforehand in the Joe Hirsch Turf Classic?
00:51:11Now, we record this before the entries are out, before the PPs are out, before we have
00:51:15the morning line.
00:51:16But Randy, I think she's as good, if not better, than any of the boys in this marathon turf
00:51:21division, at least in the US.
00:51:22I don't know what the boys are going to bring over from Europe.
00:51:24But right now, I give her a chance, a big chance, in both Saturday's race at Aqueduct,
00:51:29Belmont, at the Big A, as well as the Breeders' Cup.
00:51:32I think Mott is playing his hand very sharply here.
00:51:35Oh, I think she is the best mile and a half turf course in America of either sex.
00:51:42And I think she's going to be a leading contender for the Breeders' Cup turf.
00:51:45Of course, the Europeans typically dominate that race.
00:51:48So we'll see what they bring over.
00:51:49But her loss in the Flower Bowl in her last start at Saratoga, I think she lost nothing
00:51:56at all in the way of stature for that defeat, because she had the most god-awful trip.
00:52:01A horribly, horribly slow pace.
00:52:04And then she was in traffic and couldn't get extricated until it was too late.
00:52:08Despite the fact the pace was so slow, she came charging up late and just failed to get
00:52:14up.
00:52:14So she lost nothing in defeat there.
00:52:16Now, Gufo's a nice horse.
00:52:18They both have similar running styles.
00:52:20They come from well back in the pack.
00:52:22So it'll be a nice test for Warlight Goddess.
00:52:25And also, both horses are maybe not as much as it would be if the race were run on dirt,
00:52:31but they are somewhat pace dependent.
00:52:33And looking at the list of probables for this race, there aren't a lot of confirmed speed
00:52:38horses in here.
00:52:40I mean, Chad Brown, of course, is always going to be tough to beat.
00:52:43He's got a couple on the probable possible list.
00:52:45Ed Hamo and Rock Emperor.
00:52:48But, you know, Warlight Goddess, even with very little early speed in here, I think is
00:52:53going to be the worst to beat.
00:52:55Absolutely.
00:52:56I mean, I would have loved to have been a fly on the wall to hear the conversation between
00:53:01Joel and Bill Mott after the last race.
00:53:04And I mean, Bill's not going to tell Joel what to do.
00:53:07He's not that kind of guy.
00:53:08But, you know, you're right in the one to five favorite.
00:53:12There are many different ways to win a horse race.
00:53:15And only I mean, many different ways to lose and only one way to win.
00:53:18So it'll be interesting.
00:53:19But I think we'll see perhaps a little bit more of a productive ride from Joel this time.
00:53:26And the other race I'm looking forward to it back.
00:53:28B.A.Q.
00:53:29The racing form abbreviation for this meet, of course, is the Bell Dame.
00:53:33Because, you know, Nest has been a little bit overshadowed this year because she is
00:53:36a filly, of course.
00:53:37And, you know, all the hype has been for Flightline and justifiably so in the NEPA
00:53:41center in the male division.
00:53:42Let's not forget how good she is.
00:53:44And Todd Pletcher is dividing up his two big guns for the Breeders' Cup Dystaph with
00:53:49Malathat going Sunday in the Spinster Stakes at Keeneland.
00:53:52And Randy, I mean, Nest is turned into obviously the best three year old filly in her division.
00:53:57I think it's possible she's already I wouldn't say it's possible.
00:54:00I say it's quite likely that she's already wrapped up the three year old filly Eclipse
00:54:03Award.
00:54:04And I also give Pletcher credit.
00:54:05He's one of the trainers that isn't ducking all these, you know, training up to the Breeders'
00:54:10Cup.
00:54:10We're not going to run after Saratoga.
00:54:12He ran Life is Good.
00:54:14In the Woodward, he's running Malathat in the Spinster.
00:54:16He's running Nest in the Veldane.
00:54:18Those are his three big biggest guns among many for the Breeders' Cup when it comes to
00:54:23Keeneland later on in November, the first week in November.
00:54:25So, you know, she's always, you know, again, right now it looks like a small field.
00:54:30I don't know if she'll be 1-20 like Life is Good, but she'll be a huge favorite in that
00:54:34race.
00:54:34And she's excited anytime she shows up.
00:54:37Oh, to me, Bill, right now, if you were to make a line for the Breeders' Cup Dystaph
00:54:41and it looks like a pretty solid race.
00:54:44I think Nest would have to be the favorite.
00:54:45She has been absolutely dominating in her last few races.
00:54:50She started off the season good as a three-year-old filly, obviously, and she's just gotten better
00:54:55and better and better as the years progressed.
00:54:57She's got tactical speed, so she can maybe avoid some trouble early in a race.
00:55:02You know, she's got that sort of ability to be wherever her rider wants her to be and
00:55:08to take advantage of a slow pace or sit back a little further in case the pace is fast.
00:55:14And looking at the building, she definitely looks like a heavy, heavy favorite.
00:55:20Yeah, I basically predict maybe a four-horse field for those facing Nest, and she'll be
00:55:271-9, and she'll probably park.
00:55:29She's actually a really cool filly to be around.
00:55:31She's not an overly big filly.
00:55:33Like, sometimes you think these fillies, especially that run in the Belmont, are massive, and
00:55:38she's not.
00:55:38She's very feminine.
00:55:39She's got a dainty way of going.
00:55:41She's just a pure racehorse.
00:55:43She's an absolute racehorse.
00:55:45If you look it up in the book, you'll find a picture of her.
00:55:47She's amazing.
00:55:49It'll be interesting, too.
00:55:50They ran in the Belmont, and they, for just a minute, gave some thought to running in
00:55:55the Traverse.
00:55:56I assume she's coming back at four.
00:55:57Most good fillies and mayors in this day and age do come back as four-year-olds.
00:56:01I wonder if they'll try the boys next year.
00:56:03If they pick the right spot, I would love to see that Polar Rachel Alexandra.
00:56:07Well, she's obviously good enough.
00:56:09Especially if she continues on this path of improvement, right?
00:56:15I mean, typically, you see three-year-olds improve toward the end of the year, but not
00:56:19always.
00:56:20Sometimes they're so precocious, and she was good early in the year, that they basically
00:56:24stay on the same plane throughout the three-year-old year, and they don't improve.
00:56:28Nest is one of those horses that started good, and now she's gotten better and better.
00:56:33And I think if they do choose to run her against the boys, I think she'd be very competitive.
00:56:37This TDN Writer's Room and the Weekend Preview is brought to you by Three Chimneys.
00:56:42We heard from Tim Martin talk about his sensational two-year-old, Tyler's Tribe, who's an
00:56:47unbeaten five-for-five right now.
00:56:49Well, Tyler's Tribe is a son of Three Chimney stallion Sharp Azteca, who currently leads
00:56:55this class of first crop sires in North America with 27 winners already this year.
00:57:00Furthermore, in the upcoming Claiborne Breeders Futurity at Keeneland, Sharp Azteca has a
00:57:06potential starter there in Honed, who was second last out in the grade three Iroquois
00:57:11stake.
00:57:12And another Three Chimney sire, Funtastic, might be represented in the Breeders Futurity
00:57:17by Funtastic again.
00:57:20We'll be right back for part two of the Weekend Preview after this message from Three Chimneys.
00:57:27Here comes Tabor.
00:57:29Tabor in the center of the track with good looking stride.
00:57:32Squares off with Cyberknife.
00:57:33Cyberknife takes the lead.
00:57:35Tabor going with him.
00:57:36These two in a thriller.
00:57:37Cyberknife just in front.
00:57:39And Cyberknife has won the TBG.com Haskell over Tabor.
00:57:44Jack Christopher finished third.
00:57:46The running time, one minute, 46.24 seconds.
00:57:52Come dream with us at Three Chimneys.
00:57:57Well, welcome back.
00:57:58This is the Weekend Preview brought to you by Three Chimneys.
00:58:01Zoe, a lot going on out at Saturday at Santa Anita.
00:58:04Two-year-old races in the lineup with the American Pharaoh and the Chandelier.
00:58:07Surprise, surprise.
00:58:08Bob Baffert will be front and center.
00:58:09What do you know about, first of all, the American Pharaoh?
00:58:11Yeah, well, Bob Baffert going to be having at least three in there.
00:58:14We mentioned the three amigos earlier.
00:58:17His trio, or maybe he's got four in there, will be led by Cave Rock, a son of Arrogate,
00:58:22who is undefeated.
00:58:24He's won his last two by multiple lengths.
00:58:26And it's not often that we talk about a son of Arrogate that actually looks like Arrogate.
00:58:30He moves like Arrogate.
00:58:32He just had a really good work.
00:58:34You can catch that on xbtv.com.
00:58:36And he definitely does appear a horse with a very bright future.
00:58:40We'll have the Grade 1 Chandelier as well.
00:58:42A win and you're in for the Juvenile Phillies.
00:58:44Looks like Bob Baffert may lead the roster with home cooking in there for him.
00:58:49And, of course, the Zuma Beach.
00:58:51And let's just not forget the turf races.
00:58:54We have the Grade 1 Rodeo Drive as well.
00:58:56A win and you're in for the Philly and Mare Turf.
00:58:59So a bunch of really good races this weekend at Santa Anita.
00:59:04Randy, how good are these Baffert horses?
00:59:05They're fast, aren't they?
00:59:07Which, again, goes without saying.
00:59:09I mean, Kay Rock especially.
00:59:10I mean, his first two races were just off the charts.
00:59:14Buyer speed figures of 101 and then a 98 in the Del Mar Futurity, right?
00:59:18I mean, he can run fast early and keep going.
00:59:21And Baffert is also very high on National Treasure, right?
00:59:25He wanted to run National Treasure at Keeneland in the Breeders Futurity.
00:59:29That was his early plan.
00:59:30And he thought he could win both races this weekend.
00:59:33But because the purse money at Santa Anita is not as good as the purse money
00:59:37at Churchill Downs and Kentucky Downs and Saratoga, he was afraid.
00:59:41He was told by the Keeneland Racing Office there was a pretty good chance National Treasure
00:59:45wouldn't be able to get in in case the race is oversubscribed and it comes down to career
00:59:50earnings at Keeneland.
00:59:51So he called an audible, opted to keep National Treasure there in California for the American
00:59:56Pharaoh.
00:59:57But he thinks he's in with a big shot as well.
00:59:59Zoe, an interesting horse in there that says Josie.
01:00:01He's a maiden, but he's got a big buyer figure, cost $3.5 million at the sales.
01:00:06He's got to have a shot too, doesn't he?
01:00:08I mean, this horse wouldn't, a maiden winning a grade one race in this case would not be
01:00:11a surprise.
01:00:12I mean, basically, we're talking distance, distance, distance.
01:00:15He's a son of Bernardini.
01:00:17He's going to get better as he goes longer.
01:00:19Gary Young bought him for Zidane.
01:00:21Everyone got carried away that day at the sale and paid an awful lot of money for him.
01:00:26But anytime Baffett runs a maiden in a graded stakes race, you really have to pay attention.
01:00:31Didn't American Pharaoh break his maiden in a grade one race?
01:00:34I don't know.
01:00:35You threw me a curveball there.
01:00:36I'm not really sure.
01:00:38All right.
01:00:38So let's head out to Keeneland now.
01:00:40And last but certainly not least, what a big weekend of racing the opening week of the
01:00:44fall meet at Keeneland and so many big races.
01:00:47We're not going to have a chance to talk about all of them.
01:00:48Got the Breeders Futurity, got the First Lady.
01:00:51You've got the Coolmore Turf Miles.
01:00:52Sunday, you've got the Spinster Stakes.
01:00:54We talked about that earlier.
01:00:55The race I'm looking for, and this is always a really good race, both from a betting standpoint
01:01:00because it gets a big field and fairly wide open, and also from just a quality standpoint
01:01:05is the Coolmore Turf Mile.
01:01:06You've got Ivor, who ran second last time out behind Modern Games in the Woodbine Mile,
01:01:11the Rico Woodbine Mile.
01:01:12Some hop, like at Hot Brown, coming off a win in the stakes race at Kentucky Downs.
01:01:15Castle Creek coming off a win in the four-star date.
01:01:18Santon, the Arlington Millionaire winner coming into there.
01:01:21Randy, that race is going to be loaded.
01:01:22Your thoughts on what's going on at Keeneland this weekend?
01:01:24Those horses and a smooth like straight makes the trip east for trainer Mike McCarthy.
01:01:30I mean, he's a seriously legitimate grade one miler as well, who has good form in past
01:01:35races in Kentucky.
01:01:37So with those horses, yeah.
01:01:38Ivor, I mean, I know Castle Creek is running really, really well.
01:01:42He's on a two-race win streak at a mile in graded stakes races for Belmont.
01:01:46Ivor's last race, running second to Modern Games at Woodbine in the Woodbine Mile, I
01:01:53thought was sensational.
01:01:55He got off to an even slower start than usual.
01:01:58He was four wide around the turn following Modern Games in that race.
01:02:01He fanned even wider at the top of the stretch.
01:02:03He was pushed out at about the three-six seats pole when William Buick came out for room
01:02:08on Modern Games.
01:02:09He didn't elbow anybody, did he?
01:02:11He didn't elbow anybody, but he didn't make his way out.
01:02:13He didn't bull his way out.
01:02:15But yeah, he was blown away by Modern Games, of course.
01:02:17Modern Games is going to be, right now, I think it looks like he's going to be a pretty
01:02:21solid favorite for the Breeders' Cup Mile.
01:02:24To still run second in a good number for Ivor in that race, given the way his trip went,
01:02:31I think he's set up to run well in here.
01:02:32And he won this race two years ago, back in 2020.
01:02:38Yeah, Paul Alobo really knows how to lead those good horses over for the stakes races
01:02:43at Keeneland.
01:02:44He's stabled down there.
01:02:45He was in Southern California for an awfully long time, and now he's stabled on Rice Road.
01:02:49And he's really had a very productive meet, each and every meet.
01:02:54He seems to win at greatest stakes.
01:02:55Am I crazy?
01:02:56But does Paul Alobo not win at greatest stakes every Keeneland meet?
01:03:01Yeah, the two-year-old races are also going to be front and center, guys.
01:03:04You got the Alcibiades on Friday and the Calabrian Breeders' Futurity on Saturday.
01:03:08The Breeders' Futurity, I mentioned National Treasure is not making the trip.
01:03:12Baffert called an audible and is putting Newgate on the plane, along with Carmel Road,
01:03:17to come to Keeneland and face hopeful winner Forte, who was flattered, of course,
01:03:21by the win and the hopeful by Chad Brown's horse on Saturday.
01:03:27So you've also got a horse in there by the name of Lost Ark from the Todd Pletcher Barn,
01:03:31who is a half-brother to Nest, and who is also in very good form right now.
01:03:36Alcibiades, fun and feisty.
01:03:38Looked really, really good winning the Pocahontas.
01:03:41Figure wasn't all that good, but visually, nice move on the second turn.
01:03:45Very impressive.
01:03:46So those races are interesting to me as well.
01:03:48Yeah, once again, it's a spectacular weekend.
01:03:50Once again, here are the numbers.
01:03:5124 graded stakes races, 13 win in your inns, and nine grade ones.
01:03:56All major preps for the Breeders' Cup.
01:03:58So it should be a fascinating and very exciting and very meaningful
01:04:02weekend on the American racing scene this weekend.
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01:05:00We know it's a huge responsibility.
01:05:01We're always with your horse every step of the way when it comes to racing.
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01:05:21I want to see as many people enjoy this sport as they possibly can
01:05:23because we do have the most beautiful sport in the world.
01:05:28The TDN Writer's Room is brought to you by Legacy Bloodstock.
01:05:32If you think 50 years of combined experience in the horse business could benefit your program,
01:05:36give Tommy or Wendy a call.
01:05:38They personally advise you on each horse as if they were their own.
01:05:43Meanwhile, the Fasig-Tipton Kentucky October Yearling sale is three weeks away
01:05:47and Legacy has almost 50 yearlings catalogued for the auction
01:05:52by first crop sires, preservationists, enticed, metolike, audible,
01:05:56as well as young sires with runners excelling on the track
01:05:59like Mendelssohn, Practical Joke, and Good Samaritan.
01:06:02Well, that's a wrap.
01:06:03Randy, before we go, we'll be seeing you on the airwaves this weekend.
01:06:06We've got a couple of shows on NBC Saturday and Sunday from the studio,
01:06:10but dealing with the Keeneland races on Saturday,
01:06:14we'll have the Claiborne Breeders Futurity and the Coolmore Turf Mile.
01:06:17Sunday, we'll have the Bourbon and the Spinster,
01:06:19where Malafat goes up against Latruska.
01:06:225 to 6 p.m. Eastern, both days, Saturday and Sunday.
01:06:26All right, team.
01:06:27For our first race over the track, I think we did pretty well.
01:06:30I want to thank both Randy Moss and Zoe Cabman.
01:06:32Of course, I want to thank our producer, Patty Wolf,
01:06:35our assistant and associate producer, Katie Petruniak,
01:06:37our editors, Nathan Wilkinson and Aliyah and Anthony LaRocca,
01:06:41Bill Finley for the TDN Writers Room.
01:06:43Thanks for joining us.
01:06:44Talk to you again soon.