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00:00:00For the love of the horse, for generations to come.
00:00:28Welcome to another edition of the TDN Writer's Room.
00:00:31My name is Bill Finley.
00:00:32I'm a correspondent for the Thoroughbred Daily News, also the co-host of the Down the
00:00:36Stretch radio show on Sirius XM Radio.
00:00:39How y'all doing?
00:00:40I'm Randy Moss with NBC Sports here in my home in Minnesota where, what is it now, 11
00:00:49below.
00:00:50Not too bad.
00:00:51Yikes.
00:00:52It's warming up.
00:00:53Wow.
00:00:54Zoe Cameron here with First TV and Santa Anita.
00:00:58It's probably about 60 degrees.
00:01:01I'm getting ready to head up to the slopes and go skiing where I hope it's a little colder
00:01:06than 50 degrees up there.
00:01:08Randy, I have an important question for you.
00:01:10Does Portable get to go outside this time of year?
00:01:14Lucy?
00:01:15Yeah.
00:01:16She does go outside.
00:01:17Obviously, she has to go outside.
00:01:18We keep a very clean house.
00:01:22But she doesn't stay outside for long.
00:01:25I have a jacket, like a coat, I put on her and she runs out and she does her thing.
00:01:30And that's it.
00:01:31All right.
00:01:32Well, it's always good to see you, Lucy.
00:01:33I hope you're doing well.
00:01:35This episode of the Thoroughbred Daily News Writers' Room podcast, they threw us a major
00:01:40curveball this morning.
00:01:41We're all set to talk about the Rebel stakes, which we still will.
00:01:45I'm not sorry, the Rebel, the risen star stakes at the fairgrounds, which we still will.
00:01:50But the story was this out-of-nowhere, magnificent performance by the Steve Asmussen-trained
00:01:58Judy Magnitude, who won it 43 to 1.
00:02:02In fact, the horse that ran second chunk of gold was also 43 to 1.
00:02:06Hope you had this exacted, Zoe.
00:02:08$2 exacted paid $2,629.40.
00:02:13Other story is East Avenue at 4 to 5, the favorite didn't run a step.
00:02:17So geez, what do we say?
00:02:19Judy Magnitude is out of the Triple Crown.
00:02:22I presume he just has a bone chip.
00:02:24That's no big deal.
00:02:25I presume we'll be seeing him in the Travers and those sort of things.
00:02:28But I guess it's a little bit of a moot point, but Randy and Zoe, first of all, how good
00:02:33was this horse?
00:02:34I mean, he got the highest buyer figure.
00:02:36He blew away a good field and he ran like it was a one-horse race.
00:02:42There were a couple of points that people within the industry, horseplayers and horse
00:02:47men alike and women were debating in the aftermath of Magnitude.
00:02:54First of all, where did that race come from?
00:02:56But what did it mean in terms of his performance?
00:03:00Because even Asmussen acknowledged after the race that the reason why Ben Curtis jacked
00:03:07that horse so aggressively to the lead is because Steve and Ben had seen as the card
00:03:12progressed that, in their opinion, speed and rail was dominant at the fairgrounds
00:03:18on Saturday.
00:03:19Now, even with that in mind, even knowing that, he still ran considerably faster than
00:03:26other good horses that had the speed and rail in races prior to that.
00:03:31So there was a debate, you know, what do you make of that?
00:03:35How much did the way the racetrack was playing help Magnitude?
00:03:39Can you really believe that 108 buyer?
00:03:42And then the other debate that we heard quite regularly and which unfortunately now has
00:03:47reared its ugly head, is a horse running that fast in February, a three-year-old, is that
00:03:57counterproductive to the horse's best interests?
00:04:01We've seen, you know, will the horse, quote, blow up after running such a fast speed figure?
00:04:07Because we've seen it time and time again.
00:04:10And that was a concern that Asmussen also had after the race.
00:04:14Was it too fast, too early for Magnitude?
00:04:18And I think what we've seen now, Zoe, is that it turns out that might have been prescient.
00:04:23Might have been the case indeed, but boy, was he impressive.
00:04:28That was amazing to watch because once he sent him so hard, he just clicked off at 12
00:04:34and change, 12 and change, 12 and change, and just kept going.
00:04:37That's the longest stretch in North America.
00:04:40And at the quarter pole, I was like, why is he really going to keep going?
00:04:43He's probably going to falter.
00:04:44Looks like he's going to win.
00:04:46And he just kept going and he kept going.
00:04:48He was like a rocket ship.
00:04:50He was amazing.
00:04:51And how about Winchell Thoroughbreds?
00:04:54You know, not both the epicenter and Magnitude by not this time, both owned by Winchell
00:05:01Thoroughbreds.
00:05:02What's with the earthquake references?
00:05:04I mean, they're pretty cool names, Magnitude and epicenter.
00:05:07You don't get much better than that.
00:05:09So it's a shame.
00:05:11Hopefully we'll see him come back and be as good as he once was.
00:05:16But let us not forget that we saw him run in the Le Comte.
00:05:21I mean, nobody was talking about him.
00:05:23That's why he was 43 to 1.
00:05:25Was it a fluke?
00:05:26Was it the racetrack?
00:05:27I don't know.
00:05:28That was an amazing performance by both horse and rider.
00:05:32So I'd like to get your thoughts on this.
00:05:34I thought it was pretty interesting analysis the day after by Richie Migliore, who pointed
00:05:40out that horses that have a high cruising speed and have stamina, a lot of times run
00:05:47better if you just let them roll, as opposed to trying to excessively rate them and sort
00:05:55of take some of that speed away from them.
00:05:57A lot of them run better if you just give them their head and let them stretch the race
00:06:02out.
00:06:03You know, Randy, I think the post position probably played into that because he had the
00:06:06outside post.
00:06:08And not only did he get this easy lead, there was a lot of other speed that drew inside
00:06:12of him.
00:06:13And I imagine they looked at the race and said, the only way we can win this is just
00:06:17sort of be the speed of the speed and try to outrun these horses and make sure that
00:06:22nobody caught them.
00:06:23And it worked out perfectly.
00:06:24I mean, there were some horses in there that had speed.
00:06:27For instance, we were talking podcast last week about American Promise from the one post.
00:06:32He didn't show any speed at all.
00:06:34I want to get back to East Avenue in a few minutes.
00:06:37But he also we're thinking he's going to go right to the lead.
00:06:40He was close up to the pace, but he didn't give this horse any fight.
00:06:43I wonder if the other jockeys just said, yeah, this horse is 43 to one.
00:06:47We'll ride our own race and we'll go by him whenever we feel like it, which jockeys will
00:06:51do that sometimes.
00:06:52Well, as far as what Richie was saying is, I agree with him.
00:06:57If you've got a horse that's got a little bit of speed and has some stamina and can
00:07:03grind out 12 and change 12 and change.
00:07:05If you sit on that horse and hold him to like a 49 50 half, he's got no finish.
00:07:11There's no punch.
00:07:12Just let them keep on going and they'll keep going.
00:07:15And that's exactly what he did.
00:07:17And I firmly believe if he was sitting behind the pace, he's just going to keep going at
00:07:21whatever pace you go up.
00:07:24So I know we have a lot of horse players watching this.
00:07:27I'll give you a woe is me horse player's story, 48 hours before the Risen Star, I'm doing
00:07:34a little extra homework on the race.
00:07:37And I come across Chunk of Gold's race in the Leonata Stakes at Turfway Park.
00:07:44Absolutely finished like a wild horse.
00:07:47And I loved the way he finished in that race.
00:07:50And so I tweeted out, you know, I almost never tweet, but I tweeted out, you know,
00:07:55this is a really a good long shot to watch.
00:07:58And I was convinced, I didn't think he could beat East Avenue.
00:08:02I thought he would beat every other horse in the race except East Avenue.
00:08:05Wow.
00:08:06And he was 43 to 1.
00:08:08So I bet $400 in all sorts of win, exactus, trifectas, superfectus, and left out magnitude.
00:08:20And you didn't bet him to place either, right?
00:08:22No, no.
00:08:23I didn't bet him across the board.
00:08:24No, no, no, no.
00:08:25I bet him to win.
00:08:26And then I hooked him up in all these exotics.
00:08:28But I'm thinking like you, Bill, the track is playing for speed and rail.
00:08:31He's got the far outside post.
00:08:34You've got speed on the rail with Lucas in American Promise.
00:08:37You know, how the heck can you expect magnitude to go to the lead?
00:08:41They even try to go to the lead.
00:08:43Did he have that much speed?
00:08:44You couldn't tell.
00:08:45So anyway.
00:08:46Certainly didn't look like in his past performances.
00:08:48You mentioned East Avenue.
00:08:49He was the 4 to 5 favorite.
00:08:51He finished in a dead heat for 10th.
00:08:55And what a disappointing effort, at least in the Breeders' Cup Juvenile.
00:09:00We have that excuse of him stumbling at the start.
00:09:04To prepare for the podcast, and just so we can bring you the latest news, I text Brendan
00:09:08Walsh this morning.
00:09:09How's the horse doing?
00:09:11And I fully expected you'd get something.
00:09:13He did something or other, you know, he'll be sidelined for something or other.
00:09:17His quote is, he came out of the race fine.
00:09:20I don't know what we're going to do with him next.
00:09:22I, you know, I mean, I that that Zoe, you know, kind of boggled the imagination, boggled
00:09:30my mind.
00:09:31A horse that good ran that badly and there was no excuse.
00:09:34I guess it happens.
00:09:36But something is amiss with this horse right now.
00:09:38There's no doubt about it.
00:09:40I mean, the question I need to ask is, is he that good?
00:09:44He sure looked like it last year before the Breeders' Cup.
00:09:48Yeah, well, we've yet to see anything.
00:09:50I couldn't find any excuse for him either.
00:09:52I watched him again and again.
00:09:55And I don't know.
00:09:57Brendan doesn't know.
00:09:58He's probably pulling out what little hair he's got left.
00:10:01There's only one logical excuse.
00:10:03And as horse players, we've seen it time and time and time again.
00:10:08Some horses run significantly better with an unchallenged early lead, which is how he
00:10:14made his reputation by winning the Keeneland race, the Breeders' Futurity, on an unchallenged
00:10:19early lead and ran a tremendous race.
00:10:22And we said in the podcast last week, you know, the real question he's got to answer
00:10:26is that I thought it was going to be American Promise.
00:10:29If they go to the lead with American Promise and now East Avenue has to stalk instead of
00:10:33setting the pace, will he be as good as he was at Keeneland?
00:10:37And I think we got the answer to that, at least now at this stage of his career.
00:10:42I can't see how anybody after that effort can still have East Avenue in their top 10
00:10:49of Kentucky Derby horses.
00:10:50And I had him near the top going into the Risen Star.
00:10:54What about Big Ball's Thornton?
00:10:56Does he have him in his top 10?
00:10:59That's a good question.
00:11:00We'll find out because it's coming out this week.
00:11:03And we'll talk about Big Ball's number one horse that's not in anybody else's top 20
00:11:10runs this Saturday in the Bataglia at Turface.
00:11:12We'll talk about that.
00:11:13All right.
00:11:14Rachel Alexandros was supposed to be a super prep for the Fairgrounds Oaks and the Kentucky
00:11:19Oaks.
00:11:20The race completely fell apart.
00:11:22You had two very major scratches.
00:11:25You had Simply Joking coming out and also Ballerina DiOro, which left a field of four
00:11:31in that race.
00:11:33Simply Joking, Whit Beckman says that the horse had a bad blood count.
00:11:37The white blood cell count was off and they were going to just live to fight another day.
00:11:43I have no idea what happened to the other horse, Ballerina DiOro.
00:11:45But you know what's interesting about that race?
00:11:47Four horse field.
00:11:48The other three jockeys, they certainly rode like to beat the good cheer instead of just
00:11:56going about their own business.
00:11:58And down along the inside, Saez was in a little bit of a pickle there.
00:12:01He found a way out and galloped through the stretch and won.
00:12:06You know, visually impressive.
00:12:08But how much do you learn, Zoe, from a four horse race?
00:12:12She's undefeated.
00:12:14That's all you got to say.
00:12:15Nobody has beaten her yet.
00:12:18You can't beat who's not in there.
00:12:20She was good.
00:12:21Very good indeed.
00:12:22I mean, no, she didn't have much to beat after the scratches, but she did it the right way.
00:12:27She was very visually impressive.
00:12:30In my opinion, at least, I think she's got to be at the top of the list of Kentucky Oaks
00:12:35hopefuls at this point right now.
00:12:40Other action over the last week, Baeza.
00:12:43You know him because he is the next in line of the Pucas.
00:12:47Puca, of course, is the dam of Mage and then, of course, of the Dornach.
00:12:53This is a three-year-old trained by John Sheriffs.
00:12:55Career didn't get off to a great start.
00:12:57Matter of fact, he was making his third career start on Friday at Santa Anita, but he looked
00:13:02awfully good.
00:13:03He won by four and three-quarter lengths.
00:13:06Won by a mile.
00:13:07A couple of questions.
00:13:08Is he developing?
00:13:09Is he getting better?
00:13:10Or did he just wind up in kind of a weak race?
00:13:12Because remember, the start before that, he was absolutely clobbered by Rodriguez, one
00:13:17of those Bob Baffert horses who is not even in the top two in the Baffert barn.
00:13:22But it would be a lot of fun to see this horse make it into the Kentucky Derby or into the
00:13:26Kentucky Derby picture.
00:13:27And John Sheriffs, the trainer, who's a pretty conservative guy, has said, yeah, we're going
00:13:31to look at such things.
00:13:33So Randy, is Baeza in your top 20, 15, whatever?
00:13:38Tell you what, let's give Zoe a chance to tease first things first.
00:13:42Ooh, OK.
00:13:44Wasn't he good?
00:13:48All right.
00:13:50Baeza is a good horse.
00:13:54I firmly believe he's a good horse.
00:13:56Now they paid $1.2 million for him.
00:13:59They bought him off of Runnymede Farm.
00:14:00I can remember looking at him as a yearling.
00:14:02He's perfectly balanced.
00:14:03He's beautiful.
00:14:04If you saw him in the paddock on Saturday or Friday or whatever day it was, you only
00:14:11looked at that horse.
00:14:12Now Bob had a couple in there.
00:14:13Vani was pulled up going into the first turn.
00:14:16It looked like he propped at something, shied from the dirt, did something.
00:14:21And he looked like he went funky behind.
00:14:23It was just Juan Hernandez pulling him up because he thought something went awry and
00:14:28he was actually OK.
00:14:30But Baeza sat a beautiful trip under Hector Berrios, who'd worked him the week before.
00:14:35They put the blinkers on him when he broke his maiden.
00:14:38And he like woke up like this.
00:14:40He's a good horse, guys, a really beautiful, good horse.
00:14:45And we're going to hear a lot more from him down the road.
00:14:48What I liked about him.
00:14:49Go ahead.
00:14:50Go ahead.
00:14:51No, no.
00:14:53I'm good.
00:14:54OK.
00:14:55All right.
00:14:56Well, I was going to say what I liked about him.
00:14:57Other than the pedigree.
00:14:58Obviously, you have to like the pedigree.
00:15:01Ninety three buyer speed figure.
00:15:02So he ran fast and he was green coming down the stretch a little bit.
00:15:07So you think there's room for improvement there with a little a little extra mental
00:15:12maturity.
00:15:13Maybe he was just messing around because he'd already put away the competition.
00:15:16He doesn't like the whip.
00:15:18He smacks him once and he swished his tail and ducked in.
00:15:21And he's like, no, thank you very much.
00:15:24So he's smart.
00:15:25Very smart.
00:15:26Randy, you put down on the notes that we all follow our format that you want to talk about
00:15:31the Sunland Derby.
00:15:33Why?
00:15:34It's a it's a it's a Kentucky Derby points race.
00:15:38And, you know, now.
00:15:40So I think we have to at least mention if we think it's going to have any impact on
00:15:45the Kentucky Derby, because I mean, get away car one.
00:15:48He showed a lot of gameness.
00:15:51He wasn't the best horse in that race.
00:15:53The runner up, Caldera, the my racehorse horse trained by Wayne Lucas, didn't get away well
00:15:59from the starting gate, was caught four wide around the first turn, was also outside with
00:16:05a nice move around the second turn.
00:16:08Looked like he put a head in front of getaway car turning for home and maybe even had a
00:16:12head in front of him in mid stretch and then getaway car battles back along the inside
00:16:16to win in the narrowest of photo finishes.
00:16:19To me, Zoe, getaway car, even though he's out of a Kirtland mare.
00:16:24Has always struck me as being the kind of horse that was ultimately going to be a better
00:16:28one turn horse than a two turn horse.
00:16:32So I wouldn't be surprised to see getaway car in a race like the Pat Day Mile on Kentucky
00:16:37Derby Day instead of the Derby.
00:16:40Because another point, after all, getaway car is is a front runner.
00:16:45That seems to be his best go.
00:16:48Baffert, SF Racing, the Avengers already have that spot kind of taken with Citizen Bowl.
00:16:55Couldn't agree with you more.
00:16:56And I don't know how big Caldera is for D. Wayne Lucas, but watching the pair of them
00:17:01come down the lane, he looks like an absolute monster galloping alongside a tiny little
00:17:08gazelle in gaming.
00:17:10Got this giant, big white elephant.
00:17:13And then you've got gaming down on the inside.
00:17:17Getaway car.
00:17:18Getaway car.
00:17:19Yeah.
00:17:20Yeah.
00:17:21Gaming getaway.
00:17:22He was game anyway.
00:17:23Getaway car down on the inside.
00:17:25Who was his game as a pebble?
00:17:27Like you cannot question his gameness, his moxie.
00:17:31None of that.
00:17:32But Caldera ran a winning race and just got nudged out, mugged on the wire by getaway
00:17:38car.
00:17:39How cool is it to see Bob and Wayne still going at it, hammer and tongs every step of
00:17:44the way?
00:17:45That was cool.
00:17:47And, you know, Wayne's probably already got Arkansas Derby penciled in on his calendar
00:17:50now for for Caldera.
00:17:52And rightfully so.
00:17:53I mean, he ran a good race.
00:17:56He's not missing a beat.
00:17:57And that leads us full circle to journalism, who has kind of fallen off everyone's radar.
00:18:03And we're going to remind him with first TV's work of the week.
00:18:07Journalism just beat getaway car in their last at the Los Alfaturity.
00:18:12He may be that one of the number one horses coming out of Southern California.
00:18:16Let's sleep on journalism.
00:18:18The TDN Writers Room is brought to you by Keeneland.
00:18:21Ticket sales are now open for the 2025 Spring Meet to be held April the 4th through the
00:18:2625th.
00:18:27A variety of ticket options for dining, a grandstand, reserved seating and general admission
00:18:33are available.
00:18:34All tickets must be purchased in advance by a Keeneland's official online ticket office
00:18:40at tickets.keeneland.com slash racing.
00:18:44The 15 day Spring Meet features racing Wednesdays through Sundays with a daily first post of
00:18:511 p.m.
00:18:52Keeneland has increased the value of 16 stakes and will award a record $9.4 million in purses
00:19:01across 19 stakes this spring, highlighted by the Grade 1 Ashland on opening day and
00:19:07the Grade 1 Bluegrass on opening Saturday.
00:19:09We'll be right back after this message from Keeneland.
00:19:14Still catching, Leslie's Rose, Sierra, Leon, my $5 million, thank you, Carl Spackler, a
00:19:31Mercy, she feels pretty, hut!
00:19:45This week's Fastest Horse of the Week brought to you by Cogburn, yet another of those fast
00:19:51sires from Windstar Farm and boy was he fast.
00:19:55At one point, of course, Cogburn was our Fastest Horse of the Week last summer at Saratoga
00:20:00when he won the Jiper Stakes.
00:20:02Coming out of that race, it not only turns out he was the Fastest Horse of the Week,
00:20:06he was the Fastest Horse of the Year with a 114 buyer speed figure and really one of
00:20:11the fastest horses ever if you look at five and a half furlongs on turf, 59.80 is time
00:20:20in that race.
00:20:22Cogburn is now booked full in 2025, his initial season standing at stud at Windstar Farm and
00:20:29Cogburn has something in common with this week's Fastest Horse of the Week.
00:20:34Cogburn is a son of the sensational stallion Not This Time, as is Magnitude, our Fastest
00:20:42Horse of the Week from his 108 buyer speed figure romp in the Risen Star, which we discussed
00:20:48in detail a little bit earlier.
00:20:55Welcome in now the Gainesway Guest of the Week, it's none other than Mark Cassie, he's
00:20:58going to have a busy weekend at Oak Lawn Park where his top derby contender Sandman will
00:21:03be going in the Rebel Stakes, the 11th race on Saturday.
00:21:06Welcome Mark.
00:21:07And if you go back to Sandman's last race in the Southwest at Oak Lawn, that race in
00:21:11defeat turned him into having so many more fans because it was such a difficult trip.
00:21:18Is there any doubt in your mind if he gets a clean trip?
00:21:20He not only wins that race, but wins it easily.
00:21:25I'll leave that to you guys.
00:21:26I mean, I would think so, but take nothing away from the winner.
00:21:32I know going in, I had said, Bill, that we were going to find out whether he was a man
00:21:37or a boy.
00:21:38I think he proved he was a man.
00:21:42You know, we all know over the years, we've seen a lot of horses not be able, good horses,
00:21:49not to be able to overcome what he was able to overcome.
00:21:53So I don't know about everybody else, but I came away from the race extremely impressed.
00:22:01Well, here's what I find interesting, Mark, and I kind of try to put myself in your shoes.
00:22:06A lot of trainers, every trainer, when a horse has issues behind the gate, in the gate, leaving
00:22:12the gate, he'll take them to the gate, school them in the mornings, any, you know, all sorts
00:22:17of different ways.
00:22:19Sandman's problem last time in the Southwest, to me, happened after he left the gate.
00:22:25Like the first stride out of the gate, he broke okay, and then all of a sudden, for
00:22:28whatever reason, it's like he almost tried to prop or wheel or lurch to his left.
00:22:34How does a trainer try to rectify something like that, or is there any way to do it?
00:22:40I don't really think so, Randy.
00:22:41You know, we took, he is so smart.
00:22:44He does everything right.
00:22:46I just think it was a fluke, and I'm not going to try to reinvent the wheel with him.
00:22:55He's done everything perfect.
00:22:58I'm just going to say it was a fluke, and we're going to go from there.
00:23:04Obviously, we take him back in standing, but he's not even, he, for a tappet, he's amazing.
00:23:13Knock on, you know.
00:23:16Well, Mark, he is one cool dude.
00:23:19I can attest to that.
00:23:20Take me back to the beginning when you bought him, because he came out of the Lothenback
00:23:24dispersal.
00:23:25We all looked at the same horse at OBS last year.
00:23:28He was kind of like this fat, baby-looking, beautiful, well-balanced tappet who just galloped
00:23:34on the track.
00:23:36How did you manage to persuade your owners to plonk down 1.2 million on a horse just
00:23:41on a basic, easy gallop?
00:23:43I mean, I'm not going to say you're wrong by any means, because he was gorgeous.
00:23:47Oh, that's easy.
00:23:49No, I'm just kidding.
00:23:52You know what?
00:23:53He was a fortunate, John Green, you know, they came to me, they said, what do you think
00:24:00of him?
00:24:01I said, I love him.
00:24:02Terry Finley came to me and said, what do you think?
00:24:05I said, I love him.
00:24:07And I have no idea.
00:24:10The way I normally do it is I go around and make my choices, tell them, and I stay out
00:24:18of it.
00:24:19When he brought 1.2 million, I said, well, I guess we didn't get him.
00:24:26And I walked back there, and luckily, we did.
00:24:32I have to tell you, from the beginning, he has just been, he came to our farm, which
00:24:36is five minutes from OBS, to our training center, and boom, boom, boom, he would just
00:24:43do things with ease.
00:24:44I found over the years, the better the horse, the less it takes to get them ready.
00:24:51And he was like, just boom, boom, boom, just did everything right.
00:24:58In fact, he did so much right that we were getting ready to send him out, and we have
00:25:05a professional gate guy who works at our gate three days a week and okay horses for all
00:25:10over the country.
00:25:11We can run right off.
00:25:13I said, I'm going to breeze this horse with these two older horses.
00:25:17And he goes, you're going to breeze?
00:25:19You can't do that.
00:25:20I said, oh, yes, I can.
00:25:23And I did it.
00:25:24And amazing.
00:25:25I worked him with two older stakehorses, and he blew them away.
00:25:29So you mentioned his mind, he's smart, right?
00:25:34Yeah, he's never done anything.
00:25:38He's just boom, just done everything right, and just never misses a beat.
00:25:46In all honesty, his first couple races, I was pretty disappointed.
00:25:54I was expecting big things out of this horse.
00:25:57And even his race, he broke his maiden in Saratoga and beat a pretty good horse of Wayne's,
00:26:02and I was happy with that.
00:26:05But I kind of came away every race thinking that there was more there, and I was disappointed
00:26:12in him.
00:26:13The allowance race at Oak Lawn, I thought was a really good race.
00:26:17I thought he settled nice.
00:26:20I think he wants to kind of run into the bit.
00:26:24All along in those sprint races, you're asking, asking, asking.
00:26:29He doesn't want that.
00:26:30He wants you to grab him, and he wants to get into this beautiful rhythm.
00:26:34You've seen him.
00:26:35He has an extremely nice stride.
00:26:39I thought Christian did a great job.
00:26:41One, how he stayed on, I don't know.
00:26:46And then he didn't panic.
00:26:48He just let him kind of get his act together, and for him to run as well as he did was impressive.
00:26:54We got a pretty good post.
00:26:59He's been through a few wars, which going forward is going to be extremely important,
00:27:04as we know.
00:27:06So we'll see.
00:27:09My hope is that we get a good racetrack.
00:27:12Drives me crazy.
00:27:13As a trainer, when you go into big races, you're trying to find out answers, and when
00:27:20you get a bad racetrack, you never know.
00:27:25So I just hope we get a good racetrack.
00:27:28Do you think you'll run?
00:27:29I mean, it's supposed to be pretty bad this weekend.
00:27:32Rumors tell me that we may get pushed back to Sunday, but I have not heard any confirmation.
00:27:39That was yesterday.
00:27:40I haven't heard a lot more about it.
00:27:43I think I was told that the California jockeys were allowed to take mounts on Saturday in
00:27:50California, so I don't know if that's true or not.
00:27:54Only read it.
00:27:55As I said, I got home at 1 o'clock this morning.
00:28:01I was in Tallahassee last night.
00:28:06Mark, does all the missed training time at Oaklawn concern you?
00:28:11Because now you get to go up against horses, like from California, that haven't missed
00:28:15any training time, and horses that have been down at the fairgrounds.
00:28:18What are your thoughts on that?
00:28:20You know, Randy, we missed a lot more training going into the Southwest.
00:28:25My thought was there, yeah, we missed a lot of training.
00:28:28The good news is, and it's something that I've done with my derby prospects in the past,
00:28:35I usually don't give them a lot of time off.
00:28:37I kept him going because I feel sometimes we, you know, you run some big race, the next
00:28:44thing you do, you give them some time off, and you're playing catch-up.
00:28:48I've never felt like he was playing catch-up.
00:28:50I thought he was ahead of the game, so missing a little time was not a big deal.
00:28:55The other thing is, look, we're all at disadvantages.
00:28:58Yes, we didn't get as much training, but we're not shipping in.
00:29:02We're playing in our house.
00:29:04These other horses have to come from big, different environments.
00:29:09You come from South Florida, and it's 90 degrees, and you go into the cold,
00:29:14and you go into California, a lot of things can happen during those ships.
00:29:18So, I kind of felt like we were on the same, kind of in the same page, same link.
00:29:24And we haven't hardly missed any training going into this race.
00:29:29We did move his work up a little.
00:29:31I had planned on breezing him on maybe Wednesday, so give him 10 days out from the race,
00:29:38and we ended up going on Sunday because we looked at the weather and said,
00:29:41look, let's do that.
00:29:43But trained great this morning, trained great yesterday.
00:29:46May not get to train tomorrow, but he's ready.
00:29:51Mark, you've got a three-year-old filly that's kind of sneaking up on people,
00:29:55La'Kara, who won the Suncoast Stakes at Tampa Bay Downs on Saturday.
00:30:00That normally isn't a major race on the road to the Kentucky Oaks,
00:30:04but she looked awful good.
00:30:05And what's next for her, and what do you think of her performance?
00:30:08Well, I think, didn't Bill, what was Eclipse's filly, Todd's filly,
00:30:14came out of there, ended up being a good...
00:30:17That race is kind of sneaky good.
00:30:20I think the Suncoast, and the reason why you'll see horses go there is golf string
00:30:27doesn't give us a two-turn race.
00:30:30And if you're trying to get a two-turn race and you want to stay in Florida,
00:30:33you got to go to the Suncoast, and that's why I did it.
00:30:38You know, we went to California with, I think, seven Breeders' Cup horses.
00:30:45We didn't win any, but most of our horses showed up and ran well.
00:30:49She did not.
00:30:51And I don't know why, because she trained great into the race.
00:30:55But again, not every horse can take shipping and going.
00:30:59And so she was very disappointing to me.
00:31:03Brought her home to our training center in Ocala.
00:31:05Gave her a very short time off.
00:31:08Sent her to Palm Meadows and to Nick Tomlinson, one of my main...
00:31:13Nick's been around a lot of our good horses, does a great job.
00:31:18And she trained like a good horse.
00:31:22Dylan worked her a few times.
00:31:24And, you know, in the paddock at Tampa, I said, just be tied on.
00:31:30He goes, I know.
00:31:33So, but she still, she impressed me.
00:31:37I thought the race, obviously, we got lucky because the favorite or the horse
00:31:42that got away bad, but she ran fast and did it easy.
00:31:50Well, Mark, and as we saw today, and as we've all been talking about, I mean,
00:31:55not every horse can take winning a Kentucky Derby prep race by eight lengths
00:32:00and running a 108 buyer speed figure, because now magnitude has been knocked
00:32:05off the Kentucky Derby trail with an ankle chip.
00:32:08What kind of...
00:32:10Yes, he's now out.
00:32:11So, I mean, what kind of personality does a trainer have to have?
00:32:16I didn't know that.
00:32:19Yeah.
00:32:20Well, when trainers...
00:32:21I'm starting to hear that for Steve.
00:32:24I'm sorry?
00:32:25I'm starting to hear that for Steve, yes.
00:32:28Yeah, and that's my question.
00:32:29I mean, trainers have to deal with this on a daily basis, knowing that every time
00:32:34they walk into the barn in the morning and check on some of their top horses,
00:32:39or every time they go out for a routine gallop or breeze and come back,
00:32:43you got to be holding your breath.
00:32:45I mean, what kind of personality does a trainer have to have to deal with that,
00:32:50you know, that looming disappointment that always seems to be right there
00:32:54lurking in the background?
00:32:56What's amazing is I'm 64, just turned 64.
00:33:01My family has a history of high blood pressure.
00:33:04I'm the only guy that doesn't have high blood pressure in my family,
00:33:08and I take no medication.
00:33:09So how do I deal with it?
00:33:15I just...
00:33:16It is what it is.
00:33:18I can't change anything, so I try not to worry about something I have no control over.
00:33:26I just...
00:33:28When you're faced with adversity, you handle it the best way you can.
00:33:33And I would say my number one thought is this.
00:33:37And I tell owners this.
00:33:41If you're playing in this game, you're already in the top one percentile in the world.
00:33:49You are lucky, and that's the way I look at it.
00:33:52Look, you have to have a positive attitude.
00:33:58You know, so many people said, oh, you must have been so disappointed with Sandman,
00:34:06you know, that he didn't win.
00:34:07And I said, no, I wasn't disappointed.
00:34:10I mean, I was disappointed he didn't win, but I learned so much,
00:34:13and there were so many more positives to take out of it.
00:34:17The same way, I don't know if you remember,
00:34:19but when Laura Will almost went down in the Kentucky Derby,
00:34:23everybody's like, you have to be dead.
00:34:25How could you do it?
00:34:26And I said, my horse is alive.
00:34:30Nobody got killed.
00:34:33He's going to get to do this another day.
00:34:35I'm just going to look forward to the next one.
00:34:37So that's how I handle it, and if something goes wrong, it wasn't meant to be.
00:34:45Maybe it could mean that, you know, one of my family members may have been going,
00:34:51driving somewhere to go to this, or I may have been, and something could have happened.
00:34:56You look at the plane yesterday in Toronto that flipped over, the Delta Airlines.
00:35:02Do you know how many times I have flown into Toronto on Delta, that same plane?
00:35:08And so that's the way I look at things.
00:35:12I sleep.
00:35:13I don't go to bed worried about it.
00:35:15I wake up, and I deal with whatever's thrown at me that day,
00:35:18and I have a lot of things thrown at me.
00:35:22Well, that seems to be the only attitude to have.
00:35:24Mark, this is completely off topic, but you're an animal lover,
00:35:28and having known you over the years, you're usually surrounding yourself by a goose,
00:35:34a duck, a pet squirrel, or something.
00:35:37Do you have anything unusual in your menagerie right now?
00:35:41Well, we have some.
00:35:44We have an amazing deal.
00:35:46We have a couple geese that come every year, have their babies.
00:35:53They leave.
00:35:54They bring their babies back, and about a month later, as they're there for a month,
00:35:58they start making them.
00:35:59You can see where they make them leave, and then they have more,
00:36:03and so we're excited about that.
00:36:04We have two beautiful ducks.
00:36:07I don't know where they came from, but from Africa that showed up.
00:36:13And, you know, over the years, my favorite pet of all was a...
00:36:19I had a raccoon, George Cooney.
00:36:21We loved him.
00:36:22We had him from his eyes.
00:36:23George Cooney.
00:36:24Oh, I love it.
00:36:29We had an otter show up one day, and we have a big pond, and I would go out and feed him,
00:36:38and his name was Oakley, and he would come, and I would feed him,
00:36:43and we had a big tornado hit, and a tree fell into the pond.
00:36:47I haven't seen Oakley since, and my wife will tell you, I was so disappointed.
00:36:52So you're right.
00:36:53We have two miniature donkeys.
00:36:55We have two goats.
00:36:57We have 75 ducks in our front.
00:37:03We had an amazing thing happen about a month ago.
00:37:07Forty white pelicans flew in.
00:37:12I don't know if I have any more fish because they were in the pond.
00:37:18They're wiping it.
00:37:18So, yes, you're correct.
00:37:21I live in paradise.
00:37:24Again, that's how I handle it.
00:37:26I have a beautiful wife, a beautiful home.
00:37:30I just am a very lucky guy.
00:37:35Mark, switching subjects again, and I know there's not a whole lot you can say about this
00:37:40because a lot of things are going on behind the scenes,
00:37:42but what at this point can you tell us about the decoupling effort in Florida with Gulfstream Park?
00:37:48What's the latest, and what are the horsemen now trying to get accomplished
00:37:52so that this doesn't happen?
00:37:55Well, I think the number one thing we have to do, Bill, and you're going to hear about it here
00:38:02in the next 24 hours, was we brought a group together to bring all horsemen together
00:38:10to go in one direction.
00:38:12So we're working on that.
00:38:14I think we were a little stunned by the news, but we shouldn't have been.
00:38:20You know, we cannot allow one person anymore to control our destiny.
00:38:33So we're working diligently to see what we can do.
00:38:38We have some very big people, and we'll end up succeeding.
00:38:47But it's a battle, and it's not easy, and it may be the last thing I do,
00:38:56but something's going to get done.
00:39:00So you say you'll end up succeeding, and so are you saying that you...
00:39:06I always go in thinking I'm going to...
00:39:09I'm not a loser, so I will succeed.
00:39:14Am I saying that I know something that somebody else...
00:39:16No, I don't.
00:39:17I just know that we have a great group of people, and not just people,
00:39:24but organizations that understand how important Florida racing is to our entire racing world.
00:39:34This goes much farther than Florida.
00:39:37This is Kentucky.
00:39:39This is New York.
00:39:40This is California.
00:39:42We cannot afford to lose this battle.
00:39:44If we lose this battle, we lose everything, and that's just not an option.
00:39:50So translation, you're very optimistic that ultimately the Florida legislature will not
00:39:57allow the decoupling.
00:39:58Oh, I didn't say that.
00:40:00No.
00:40:01Oh, you didn't?
00:40:02No, it's still a battle.
00:40:03No, it's a battle, Ren.
00:40:05It's a battle.
00:40:06I can't promise you that.
00:40:08I can tell you that we are fighting at it very hard, and I can't make you that promise.
00:40:16I wish I could, but I can't, but we're not going to stop.
00:40:20So that's all I can tell you.
00:40:23Okay.
00:40:24Very good.
00:40:25Well, Mark, thank you so much.
00:40:27It's not a...
00:40:28This is not a foregone conclusion.
00:40:30So everybody that's listening, if you can help, help, because it's going to take all
00:40:36of us.
00:40:37All right.
00:40:38Well, Mark, keep up the good fight as far as that goes with the decoupling.
00:40:43Best of luck with Sandman and the Rebel.
00:40:45Hopefully, you'll get a much better trip this time, and we'll see you in the Winner's Circle
00:40:48on Saturday.
00:40:49Mark Cassie, thanks so much for joining us.
00:40:51Thanks for having me.
00:40:53And our guest of the week, Mark Cassie, brought to you by Gainesway, like his namesake, Jake
00:40:58LaMotta in the film, Raging Bull.
00:41:00The stallion Raging Bull is as tough as they come.
00:41:04He earned $1.7 million.
00:41:06He started in 15 grade one stakes races.
00:41:08He hit the board in nine of those 15.
00:41:11He won three grade ones at three, at five, and six, plus a grade two and a grade three
00:41:17at Saratoga to boot.
00:41:20Raging Bull consistently competitive at the highest levels over multiple racing seasons.
00:41:24Seven races in which he earned a 100 plus buyer speed figure.
00:41:28He is also a son of Dark Angel, a perennial leading European sire of both sprinters and
00:41:34milers.
00:41:35Raging Bull's first yearlings sold last year for $420,000, $410,000, et cetera.
00:41:43His first two-year-olds hit the track this spring.
00:41:46Gainesway, power, passion, performance.
00:41:50Introducing a stallion as top class as they come.
00:41:54In 22 career starts, he won or placed in 12 graded stakes, competing in 15 grade ones,
00:42:02earning over $1.7 million.
00:42:06His undisputed speed is evidenced by seven 100 plus buyer speed figures, a three-time
00:42:15grade one winner, Raging Bull.
00:42:21In this week's edition of First Things First, now, Randy gave you just a little inkling
00:42:26of what's going on here.
00:42:27I caught up with trainer John Sheriffs to discuss the very impressive maiden winner
00:42:33Baeza, and also John May have taken a little bit of umbrage with me calling him a patient
00:42:40trainer.
00:42:46All right, John, we're 12 hours in.
00:42:49Let me see.
00:42:50Do you have a bit of a fever?
00:42:51Is there some derby fever going on here yet?
00:42:54It's raging.
00:42:55It's absolutely raging.
00:42:58Tell us about your horse.
00:42:59He looks fabulous.
00:43:00I just stopped by and saw him.
00:43:01Yeah, I know.
00:43:02He looked really good yesterday, and he came out of the race very well.
00:43:06He's one of those horses that, you know, always looks good, right?
00:43:10He always has a nice coat, which you love in a racehorse.
00:43:14And the race?
00:43:15And the race?
00:43:16Oh, the race was superb.
00:43:18Hector was extremely happy after the race.
00:43:21I thought the horse ran really well.
00:43:23I loved the determination and how he stuck to the job.
00:43:26He's been, at times, unfocused and a little immature, but, you know, he's getting there.
00:43:31You're a very patient trainer, and you've...
00:43:34No, why do you say that, Zoe?
00:43:36Why do you say that?
00:43:37I'm not patient at all.
00:43:40I want everything to run as soon as possible.
00:43:44Okay, well, you started him on the grass, was my question.
00:43:47Okay.
00:43:48And the reasoning?
00:43:50The reasoning was I did not want to leave Del Mar without getting a race into him.
00:43:56In his training in the morning, he didn't show a lot of speed.
00:43:59So, certainly with his pedigree and his sibling, I didn't want to embarrass him.
00:44:04So, I thought, well, I'll put him on the dirt, on the turf, rather.
00:44:07And I'll go long with him, where it'd be more difficult on the dirt to go long for a timeout.
00:44:13So, I thought, you know, I'll edge it as much as I possibly can.
00:44:16And hopefully get a nice performance.
00:44:19Where are we going next, John?
00:44:21Well, that's a good question.
00:44:22I'll discuss that with Mr. Searing, and then make a decision.
00:44:27You know, our time is a little short to get a point.
00:44:32So, in reality, you know, plays will determine where we go.
00:44:36Would he likely stay home?
00:44:38Oh, yeah.
00:44:39How can you beat California weather?
00:44:40Why would you go anyplace else?
00:44:42What's the matter with these people, right?
00:44:44California is where it's at.
00:44:46Love that.
00:44:52And yes, why would anybody possibly not want to be in California?
00:44:57Racing does continue along with the sunshine in Southern California.
00:45:01Friday through Sunday, we'll have lots of good racing on hand.
00:45:06And we're just gearing up to the 1st of March for the first racing tour.
00:45:10Do want to remind you to get your tickets now.
00:45:12We have lots of great racing, including the Grade 1 Big Cap,
00:45:15the Grade 1 Kilro Mile,
00:45:17and an important prep towards the Kentucky Derby.
00:45:20That all coming on March the 1st.
00:45:22So, guys, what did you think about John Sheriff's taking umbrage
00:45:26to me calling him a patient trainer?
00:45:32Is there any more patient?
00:45:34No, he wants to run them as soon as he can.
00:45:37All right, there you go.
00:45:39He's a good horse.
00:45:40Mark my words.
00:45:41We're going to see a lot from Baeza.
00:45:43Yeah, well, that will certainly be exciting, of course,
00:45:45with his pedigree and the remarkable story of the Mayor Puca.
00:45:49Things that happened off the track last week,
00:45:51I thought the biggest story was the Betamethasone.
00:45:55You remember that from the Bob Baffert saga.
00:45:57Well, it is back in the news, and this time it's Todd Pletcher
00:46:02who got a positive for Betamethasone.
00:46:05The horse, let me see, let me find it.
00:46:08With the horse by the name of Vassimo, who actually ran Saturday
00:46:11in the Risen Star stakes, and he tested positive for Betamethasone
00:46:17in his first career start on December 14th at Gulfstream, which he won.
00:46:21He then came back in January at Tampa, was apparently clean in that race,
00:46:26and didn't run very well in the Risen Star.
00:46:28A lot to talk about here, but I got you some numbers and some statistics.
00:46:34How many Betamethasone positives have there been since HIWU took over?
00:46:39If you remember with Baffert, it was before the HIWU-HISA era.
00:46:43All this stuff was done by the Kentucky Racing Commission.
00:46:47This was the eighth person, he's the eighth person,
00:46:50to get a Betamethasone positive since HIWU took over.
00:46:54And in each case, the penalties were exactly the same for all the trainers.
00:47:01They have a disqualification of a covered horse's race results,
00:47:04including forfeiture of all purses and other decompensation,
00:47:07prizes, trophies, points, and rankings, and repayment or surrender
00:47:10of $500 measly dollars.
00:47:14Wait, wait, wait, you mean they didn't get two years?
00:47:17That's the point.
00:47:19I mean, it's not exactly apples to apples,
00:47:22because the Baffert thing had some other storylines to it.
00:47:25But my goodness, how do you look at this and say,
00:47:28presumably Todd Pletcher, for the same offense, is going to get $500,
00:47:33and Bob Baffert got three years when it all came down to it?
00:47:37And I think as time has gone on, people, even myself included,
00:47:42have become more and more of the attitude that Baffert was treated very unfairly.
00:47:48And boy, if this doesn't point that out, nothing does.
00:47:53Todd Pletcher, be careful, don't be getting these positives,
00:47:55but he certainly didn't give this drug to this horse as a performance enhancer.
00:48:00And nonetheless, I think Todd can certainly afford the $500 fine
00:48:05that's coming his way.
00:48:06Zoe, why'd you make up all this?
00:48:08So he gets a better methadone.
00:48:11He's allowed to run at the fairgrounds owned by Churchill Downs.
00:48:15Imagine if Bob had a horse running in the Risen Star and got a better methadone.
00:48:19Would he be allowed to run at the fairgrounds owned by Churchill Downs?
00:48:22Good question.
00:48:23I don't think so.
00:48:26I don't know.
00:48:27We're moving goalposts, aren't we?
00:48:29Yeah, it's likely to be more than $500.
00:48:32Based on the reports I read, because Pletcher had a positive
00:48:37for another therapeutic medication, an overage, I think it was last year,
00:48:42according to the regulations now for HIWU,
00:48:45he faces either a one-week or a two-week suspension.
00:48:50Two weeks if he challenges unsuccessfully.
00:48:52One week if he acknowledges that he was at fault with the positive.
00:48:58But I know a lot of people out there on social media are saying,
00:49:01hey, Baffert got two years.
00:49:03Let's see what Pletcher gets.
00:49:05Let's see if there's any fairness here.
00:49:06Well, keep in mind, it was Churchill Downs that gave Baffert the two-year suspension,
00:49:12not the Kentucky Horse Racing Commission.
00:49:14It was a unilateral decision by Churchill Downs,
00:49:17because Baffert had a previous issue in the Kentucky Oaks,
00:49:20and now this happened with Medina Spirit in the Kentucky Derby.
00:49:24And Churchill felt compelled to, in their words,
00:49:27to sort of protect their property there.
00:49:31But, yeah, it's interesting.
00:49:34It just goes to show you that when you play at the level of a guy like Todd Pletcher
00:49:41with so many different horses that he has to train,
00:49:45it's inevitable that any trainer that has that many horses
00:49:48is going to have the occasional medication overage,
00:49:51something that either falls through the cracks administratively,
00:49:55or maybe something stays in a horse's system a little longer than expected
00:50:00because of metabolism or maybe contamination or whatever.
00:50:06So who's excited about the Saudi Cup?
00:50:09Anybody? Raise your hand.
00:50:10Me!
00:50:11I'm so excited about it.
00:50:13Another defection this week.
00:50:15I've never seen a race fall apart like this.
00:50:18Laurel River, who won the Dubai World Cup last year, he's now out as well.
00:50:23Sixth or seventh major horse to come out of the Saudi World Cup.
00:50:29The rattle and roll for Kenny McPeak.
00:50:31Don't be surprised if he comes in and wins this.
00:50:34Knowing Kenny, this is something that he would absolutely pull off.
00:50:37And we have Straight No Chaser, the Breeders' Cup Sprint winner,
00:50:41running in the $2 million Riyadh Dirt Sprint.
00:50:44But I think we talked about this last week,
00:50:46and, Randy, you were of the opinion that it's just a bad year,
00:50:50bad luck these things happen, and there's nothing more to read into it.
00:50:54But am I excited about it? No, I'm not.
00:50:58Well, you're burying the lead.
00:51:00Yes.
00:51:01Romantic Warrior has won more money than any horse in the history of horse racing.
00:51:06And now he is going to switch to dirt for the very first time in his career
00:51:11to try to win the Saudi Cup, which is a huge story across the world.
00:51:16And he's got to beat Forever Young.
00:51:18It's China versus Japan, basically,
00:51:21because Romantic Warrior is a horse that's been based in Hong Kong throughout his career.
00:51:25We know how good Forever Young is.
00:51:27His trainer, that charismatic Yoshito Yahagi, won the Saudi Cup a couple years ago,
00:51:33so he's got experience winning in Saudi.
00:51:35And then Thowin Rattle and Roll, who won that famous prep,
00:51:39the custodian of the Two Holy Mosques Cup in Saudi Arabia.
00:51:44So, yeah, I think it's a fascinating race to see if Romantic Warrior can transfer his form to dirt.
00:51:52And if so, is he good enough to beat a horse that we know is really good in Forever Young?
00:51:58Yeah, just because the U.S. don't have any major horses in there
00:52:01doesn't make it a bad horse race whatsoever.
00:52:04I'm really looking forward to it.
00:52:06And there's a lot of good racing across the card.
00:52:08We'll get to see the Breeders' Cup Eclipse winner, the champion sprinter, Straight No Chaser.
00:52:15He actually had to work over the strip over there in 48 and changed down black.
00:52:19I'm very happy with the way Straight No Chaser is coming in.
00:52:22So good luck to those connections.
00:52:24Jose D'Angelo will have Howard Wolowitz over there, just to name a few.
00:52:28What about Chad Summers trying to go and win the Saudi Derby with Cyclone State,
00:52:33taking his 19-year-old rider over there, Luis Rivera, I believe.
00:52:37Is that his name, Luis Rivera? He rides him?
00:52:40I'm pretty sure that's right.
00:52:42So he's going to try and win the Saudi Derby.
00:52:44Do we think maybe he bounces off that and comes back over here?
00:52:48There's some good races.
00:52:50And another little interesting subplot, one more little thing.
00:52:54Last year, before Señor Buscador was shipped to run in the Saudi Cup,
00:53:00a Saudi resident, Sharaf Mohammed Al-Hariri, leased a minority percentage of Señor Buscador
00:53:09from the Peacock family, Joey Peacock.
00:53:12And, of course, we know how well that ended.
00:53:15And now he's done the same thing with Rattle & Roll,
00:53:19which is why Rattle & Roll went to Saudi Arabia to prep,
00:53:23and he stayed in Saudi Arabia, which is smart,
00:53:25instead of bringing him back to the U.S. and bringing him back to Saudi.
00:53:28After winning the prep race evilly, he stayed over there.
00:53:32So Sharaf Mohammed has a chance to have another big score here.
00:53:37The TD and Rider's Room brought to you by the Pennsylvania Horse Breeders Association, the PHBA.
00:53:43The breeding sheds opened on Saturday, and as we told you last week,
00:53:46there are 10 new stallions who are now plying their trade in the state of Pennsylvania.
00:53:51And one of those, we're going to introduce you to right now, by the name of Tyson.
00:53:56Tyson won a couple of big stakes at Woodbine in 2023.
00:54:00He was Canada's champion older horse.
00:54:02He won the Seagram's Cup and the Dominion Day Stakes.
00:54:05But he didn't just succeed and run well at Woodbine.
00:54:08He was also third in the Jockey Club Gold Cup at Saratoga.
00:54:11He's the son of Tappet.
00:54:12He hails from the female family of grade one winners streaming,
00:54:16and he stands for $3,500 in the great state of PA at Stone Jug Ranch.
00:54:22So you can breed to a Pennsylvania stallion, foal in Pennsylvania,
00:54:26and earn a 40% Breeders Award paid to first through third in every Pennsylvania race,
00:54:31along with the eligibility to run in those PA-bred or PA-sired stallion series that we tell you about periodically.
00:54:39And who is the poster child for those PA-bred awards?
00:54:43Uptown Charlie Brown, PA's leading stallion.
00:54:47His progeny have amassed $2 million in bonuses for their owners just over the last two years alone.
00:54:55That's $73,000 in average earnings per starter,
00:55:00all for a fee to breed to Uptown Charlie Brown of just $3,000 at Mountain Springs Farm.
00:55:08To earn more, you can call the PHBA.
00:55:10There's your number, 610-444-1050.
00:55:14I think I have that number memorized by now.
00:55:20PA-bred, I think we've built a brand at this point.
00:55:24It's excitement at every step.
00:55:27Roses for Deborah just set a new track record.
00:55:31On average, for the past decade, Pennsylvania paid over $28 million a year in Breeders Awards,
00:55:37restricted races, and owner bonuses.
00:55:39Plus, PA-breds shine on the world's biggest stage.
00:55:42Just three states have bred more Breeders' Cup winners.
00:55:45Learn more at pabred.com.
00:55:50Be a smarter better with First TV.
00:55:52The best horses.
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00:56:02All at your fingertips and delivered right into your inbox.
00:56:08Everything you need to be informed.
00:56:10Be smart. Bet smart.
00:56:13With First TV.
00:56:18The TDN Writer's Room is brought to you by First TV,
00:56:21which used to be XP TV.
00:56:23It's now First TV.
00:56:25Take a look at grade two winning three-year-old journalism.
00:56:29Now, he was among 229 horses to record time workouts on Sunday at Santa Anita.
00:56:37Journalism is trained by Michael McCarthy.
00:56:39He last took down the grade two loss alfaturity in December.
00:56:43Here he is working five furlongs in a minute and four-fifths,
00:56:47sitting just to the outside of stablemate Evco.
00:56:50I'm not sure he could possibly be going any easier, to be perfectly honest.
00:56:55The Curling Coal is expected to make his seasonal debut in the grade two San Felipe
00:57:01on March 1st, going a mile and 16 at Santa Anita.
00:57:05Boy, oh boy, does he look good here.
00:57:08Well, we've had a lot of fun with TD Thornton's top 10,
00:57:11excuse me, his top 12 on the road to the Kentucky Derby.
00:57:14He sort of thinks outside the box, maybe even a little way outside the box,
00:57:19but we're going to find out if he's a genius or not as soon as this Saturday night
00:57:24as his number one horse on his top 12 first resort will make his three-year-old debut,
00:57:31not in the Louisiana Derby or the Arkansas Derby or the Florida Derby or the Risen Star,
00:57:36but in the John Battaglia Memorial, the seventh race at the fairgrounds,
00:57:42excuse me, of course not at the fairgrounds, at Turfway Park coming up this Saturday.
00:57:47Zoe, this is by no means an easy spot.
00:57:52He should win, he should be the favorite.
00:57:54Got a horse in there by the name of Baby Max, who's won, last time out, won a stakes race.
00:57:58Coming in hot, has won a couple of sprint stakes races.
00:58:01I guess the biggest question I've had for first resort is, how will he handle the synthetic surface?
00:58:07I don't think he'll have a problem whatsoever.
00:58:09Being by Uncle Mo, they handle just about any surface.
00:58:13I mean, listen, he's a good horse.
00:58:15He took down Jonathan's Way, who unfortunately was scratched out last weekend.
00:58:20We're not quite sure how good he's going to be as a three-year-old,
00:58:24but he beat him in the grade two jockey club at Churchill Downs.
00:58:28Like you said, he makes his synthetic debut.
00:58:30Owen Hart, he got horses at Turfway.
00:58:33He's worked very well over the strip.
00:58:35You can see by his work tab, six furlongs in 114.
00:58:39He threw down a bullet work in 59 and two.
00:58:42It's lovely to see Luis Saez going to Turfway to ride him.
00:58:46Big Bull's Thornton is on the right horse here for Owen Hart.
00:58:50First resort is without question the horse to beat in here.
00:58:53You mentioned Baby Max.
00:58:55I'm going to throw another horse at you.
00:58:57California Burrito for Tom Drury.
00:59:00He just took down a nice allowance race by seven over there with a pretty good number, 83 by a speed figure.
00:59:07I think he may be the nearest competition for first resort.
00:59:13It will be interesting to follow what first resort win or lose will do after this race because of synthetic surface.
00:59:19This is a prep for the Jeff Ruby Stakes,
00:59:24which is also on synthetic surfaces with a purse of 777,000.
00:59:31Very clever that they changed that to that.
00:59:33Would Owen Hardy dare go into the Kentucky Derby off two prep races on synthetic surfaces,
00:59:40or will he leave town from Turfway and go in a more traditional prep like the Bluegrass?
00:59:45I can offer a guess on that.
00:59:47I don't have any inside information.
00:59:48I haven't texted or talked to Owen about this,
00:59:50but my guess is that he will go to a dirt surface for first resort's final prep, and here's why.
00:59:57The Bataglia wasn't his first choice.
01:00:00Owen was going to ship out of town for first resort's initial race as a three-year-old,
01:00:06but because of weather, his horse is based at Turfway.
01:00:09He got a couple of weeks behind in the horse's training,
01:00:13and so therefore he wouldn't have the horse ready to ship out of town earlier,
01:00:18so he penciled in the Bataglia as a substitute for a start as a three-year-old.
01:00:24That explains that.
01:00:26Now, we just have learned a second ago, I think Jay Pribben put out a tweet,
01:00:31so we give him credit for breaking the news today on Tuesday as we're recording this,
01:00:38but the big card at Oak Lawn has been moved from Saturday to Sunday,
01:00:43the Rebel Steaks, the Honey Bee, et cetera, with a lot of precipitation, a lot of bad weather expected,
01:00:49so hopefully by Sunday they'll have everything worked out.
01:00:53I don't get to talk much about my Kentucky Oaks top ten
01:00:57because I'm so overshadowed by T.D. Thornton and all the fun that we have with him,
01:01:02and I'm the opposite of him.
01:01:04I got little you-know-what.
01:01:08I put the horses to me that figure the most.
01:01:11I don't go outside the box.
01:01:14My number one is Muhima, though good cheer, the stablemate.
01:01:19They're both from the Bradcox barn.
01:01:20They could be 1 and 1A.
01:01:22He will be drew the rail post position in the Honey Bee Steaks,
01:01:26which will be the ninth race now on the Sunday card.
01:01:29This race came up really good, as you'd imagine, with a $500,000 purse.
01:01:33Take charge, Milady, for Kenny McPeak is in there.
01:01:36Look forward, Zoe, you should be very familiar with that horse,
01:01:39a California horse trained by Michael McCarthy who is trying to win around two turns for the first time.
01:01:45Quiet side always shows up, doesn't win that often,
01:01:48but they got a really good 13-horse field.
01:01:51Even on the outside, George Weaver, 5G,
01:01:54a horse that won the Cash Run Steaks last time out by nine lengths.
01:01:58Zoe, who do you like?
01:02:00I like 5G.
01:02:02I mean, Muhima is the horse to beat here.
01:02:065G, I've an inkling with all the storms rolling through Oak Lawn Park
01:02:11that we're probably going to see not a fast track,
01:02:14and it's usually the case, especially on Saturdays and Sunday at Oak Lawn,
01:02:18much like the fairgrounds, that they will have a sloppy track.
01:02:21The daughter of Vekoma, does she want to go two turns?
01:02:25I don't see why not.
01:02:26She's out of a quality road mare,
01:02:28and her run in the Cash Run was pretty sensational to watch visually.
01:02:33She's going to have speed from the outside.
01:02:35She gets a rattle tease aboard her.
01:02:37I really like her in there, even from post position 13.
01:02:41That's the main issue with me and 5G,
01:02:45and you can say the same about Quiet Side out in post 12.
01:02:48I mean, the average American one-mile racetrack has a 990-foot stretch run
01:02:55from the top of the stretch to the finish.
01:02:57Oak Lawn's is about 1,100 feet.
01:03:00What that means is that the finish line is further down the stretch,
01:03:04which means that a mile and a 16 races start closer to the first turn at Oak Lawn
01:03:11than they do at most one-mile tracks.
01:03:13It's even worse at Churchill Downs,
01:03:15but there's very little time for riders to get position at Oak Lawn,
01:03:20leaving the starting gate at a mile and a 16th before they hit that first turn.
01:03:24But you got the Ortiz brothers on those two horses.
01:03:27Jose is on Quiet Side.
01:03:29Irad is on 5G.
01:03:30I think Muhim is obviously the horse to beat,
01:03:33but I also think she's probably going to be even money or 6 to 5,
01:03:37and I don't think she's worth that short of a price.
01:03:42So it's going to be a fascinating race to see exactly what happens.
01:03:45The prep for the boys is the Rebel.
01:03:47Once again, it will be run on Sunday.
01:03:49We spent a lot of time earlier in the show talking to Mark Cassie about Sandman.
01:03:54Four to one in the morning line.
01:03:56Boy, I'd grab that all day long.
01:03:58That last race was so impressive.
01:04:01I mean, the horse did everything wrong and only got beat a length
01:04:05and probably in another five, six jumps.
01:04:07It might have even got up.
01:04:09This horse lived up to its potential in defeat.
01:04:121.2 million, unless something goes wrong with the trip again.
01:04:16I think that maybe Mr. Thornton might have this one as his number one
01:04:21in his next top 12 poll, because I know he's got him number two.
01:04:25And if he goes out and runs a hole in the wind in the Rebel,
01:04:29we've got a serious horse on our hands here.
01:04:31He's set up here to run a hell of a race.
01:04:34Really.
01:04:35I mean, we talked to Mark.
01:04:36The horse is doing exceptionally well.
01:04:38He's a horse that sits a little off the pace if everything goes well,
01:04:41not as far back as he was in the Southwest.
01:04:43And there is a ton of early speed in this race.
01:04:47This is going to be a really aggressively paced race, which also helps Sandman.
01:04:53So I'm expecting, Zoe, I'm expecting Sandman to run huge.
01:04:57Me too.
01:04:58I really am.
01:04:59And, you know, it's funny.
01:05:00I went into Baffert's office the other day and he was trying to figure out,
01:05:04you know, if he was going to send a horse, who he was going to send.
01:05:07And I'd spoken to Pat Pope about the weather.
01:05:10And, you know, there's a storm rolling in there if we ship in.
01:05:13You know, the chances are you're not going to be able to train anyway.
01:05:16So all of these were going through his mind.
01:05:19So he wound up just sending one in Mattercat Road,
01:05:22who would be probably one of his lesser three-year-old candidates in there.
01:05:27I mean, honestly, if you take Sandman out of the equation,
01:05:30this race is wide open.
01:05:33I mean, you want to talk about, you know, an upset or an exactor.
01:05:37I don't know where you, I mean, look at Hypnos.
01:05:39Just one start in the slop at the fairgrounds.
01:05:42He ran a good number that day.
01:05:43The Intermischief Colt out of Dreamtree for Brookdale Racing and Kenmette Peak.
01:05:48Mattercat Road's in there with some good numbers,
01:05:50having run just so-so in the Bob Lewis last time out.
01:05:55Innovators always there with a squeak for D. Wayne Lucas.
01:05:59It's a good betting race.
01:06:02And if you're going to get 4-1 on Sandman,
01:06:04you're going to make some money in some vertical wages for sure.
01:06:08Which you won't.
01:06:10You won't get 4-1 on Sandman.
01:06:12He's 4-1, but he's the favorite in the morning line.
01:06:16That's how evenly matched the odds maker at least thinks.
01:06:19I'm expecting 2-1, maybe even 9-5 on Sandman by the time they actually run.
01:06:25Tiztastic's in there as well for Steve Asmussen.
01:06:28But again, Jose Ortiz has got his work cut out for him.
01:06:31Jose has the 12-hole in the Honeybee.
01:06:34Now he's got the 13-hole with Tiztastic in a 14-horse field in the Rebel.
01:06:40No one mentioned the pride of Delta Downs.
01:06:42Cole Battle, who won two straight and beat a bunch of these in the Smarty Jones last time out,
01:06:47for trainer Lonnie Briley.
01:06:49Why not, guys?
01:06:51Why not? Wide open.
01:06:53Why not? He'll be part of the piece, that's for sure.
01:06:56The question is if he's fast enough, really.
01:07:00He won the Smarty Jones with just an 84 buyer speed figure,
01:07:03and that was boosted because of the slow pace of the race.
01:07:07I think he's going to be stalking maybe two, three lengths back sitting on the inside
01:07:11because you've just got so much early speed in here.
01:07:15You've got Innovator, who you know has got to go for Wayne Lucas.
01:07:19You've got Smokin' Wicked, who's been sprinting in some pretty fast fractions
01:07:23occasionally down at the fairgrounds.
01:07:25You've got Speed King, who won the Southwest, who's been on the lead in all three of his lifetime starts.
01:07:30Some of those horses from the outside post might be sent on, like Tiztastic maybe.
01:07:35A hot gunner from post 14 if he runs.
01:07:38So the pace is going to be really hot, and Cole Battle I think is going to be off the pace this time.
01:07:43But is he fast enough? That's the question.
01:07:46The Kentucky Horse Racing and Gaming Corporation has announced that a record $20 million in awards
01:07:53is on the way to the breeders participating in the Kentucky Thoroughbred Breeders Incentive Fund Program.
01:08:00First implemented in 2005, the KTBIF has provided more than a quarter of a billion dollars
01:08:08to breeders of Kentucky breds winning eligible races worldwide.
01:08:13Last year, Kentucky breds won 72% of graded races in the U.S.,
01:08:19all three legs of the Triple Crown and 10 Eclipse Awards.
01:08:23Bloody hell.
01:08:24Our history is proud and our future remains bright, said Governor Andy Beshear.
01:08:31With some of the fullest fields in the country and quality racing year round,
01:08:36there's never been a better time to reap the rewards of breeding and racing in Kentucky.
01:08:43Purse money in Kentucky is at an all-time high.
01:08:46As is average purse per race, outpacing California, Florida, and New York.
01:08:52Kentucky breds. Breed them. Raise them. Race them.
01:08:57We all win.
01:09:02All the thrills.
01:09:06Fraction of the bills.
01:09:11Experience the power of the partnership.
01:09:17Change your life. Make new friends.
01:09:19And compete at the highest level of thoroughbred racing.
01:09:24West Point Thoroughbreds. The gold standard in racing partnerships.
01:09:28Visit westpointtb.com.
01:09:32And the TD and Riders Room is brought to you last but certainly not least
01:09:36by our good friends at West Point Thoroughbreds.
01:09:38We've talked a lot already about Sandman,
01:09:41who we think is going to be a relatively solid favorite in the Rebel stakes at Oaklawn Park.
01:09:46Now on Sunday, well guess who's the part owner of Sandman?
01:09:50That would be West Point Thoroughbreds.
01:09:52But it's not just Sandman that they have in the Rebel.
01:09:55They are also, West Point, part of the partnership that owns Bullard,
01:09:59who's been shipped in from Southern California by trainer Michael McCarthy,
01:10:03also running in the Rebel, stretching out for the first time in the Rebel.
01:10:08West Point also had a nice weekend last weekend,
01:10:11where at the fairgrounds on the Risen Star Undercard,
01:10:14a nice two-turn maiden win by Jenser and jockey Keith Asmussen
01:10:19for Hall of Fame trainer Steve Asmussen.
01:10:25That's a wrap on this week's show. I hope you enjoyed it.
01:10:28I want to thank my partners in crime, Randy Moss and Zoe Cabman,
01:10:32as well as our producers and editors who work so hard behind the scenes.
01:10:36That's Katie Petruniak, Sue Finley, Anthony LaRocca and Aaliyah LaRocca.
01:10:40And a special thanks to our Gainesway Guest of the Week, Mr. Mark Cassidy.
01:10:45Hope to see you next week. Hope you enjoyed the show. See you then.