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(Current Affairs)
Host:
- Ashfaq ishaq Satti
Guests:
- Shaukat Yousafzai PTI
- Senator Afnan Ullah PMLN
- Dr Khaqan Hassan Najeeb (Economist Analyst)
Govt going to import wheat worth 1bn Dollars | Afnanullah's response to Shaukat Yousafzai's claims
"Bilawal Bhutto PTI ko Meeting Main Lasakte Hain Tou..." Afnan Ullah's Statement
Follow the ARY News channel on WhatsApp: https://bit.ly/46e5HzY
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ARY News is a leading Pakistani news channel that promises to bring you factual and timely international stories and stories about Pakistan, sports, entertainment, and business, amid others.
(Current Affairs)
Host:
- Ashfaq ishaq Satti
Guests:
- Shaukat Yousafzai PTI
- Senator Afnan Ullah PMLN
- Dr Khaqan Hassan Najeeb (Economist Analyst)
Govt going to import wheat worth 1bn Dollars | Afnanullah's response to Shaukat Yousafzai's claims
"Bilawal Bhutto PTI ko Meeting Main Lasakte Hain Tou..." Afnan Ullah's Statement
Follow the ARY News channel on WhatsApp: https://bit.ly/46e5HzY
Subscribe to our channel and press the bell icon for latest news updates: http://bit.ly/3e0SwKP
ARY News is a leading Pakistani news channel that promises to bring you factual and timely international stories and stories about Pakistan, sports, entertainment, and business, amid others.
Category
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NewsTranscript
00:00As-Salaam-Alaikum, dear viewers, I am Ashfaq Ishaq Satti, I hope you are all doing well.
00:17The last ten days of Ramadhan are almost coming to an end.
00:20If we talk about the market, people are busy shopping for Eid.
00:23Thank God, we are managing ourselves well.
00:28We did not know about the month of Ramadhan.
00:32This is also a part of the month of Ramadhan.
00:34But all the blessings and blessings you can accumulate, you should accumulate.
00:39I saw a news this morning.
00:42Obviously, it was anticipated that this would happen.
00:45But in the field of cricket, the goddess of fortune or the system of nature was not kind to us.
00:51So, we have lost the series.
00:54In one match, our team showed that we can play.
00:59After that, our performance was zero.
01:01So, what is there to discuss?
01:03It was not something that surprised us or shocked us.
01:06It had to look like this.
01:08But in terms of economy, a good news that has come is that there is a staff level agreement with the IMF.
01:14And it is important on this basis.
01:16If there is any matter of taking a loan, I do not appreciate it.
01:19Obviously, no one should appreciate it.
01:21But for our economy, it is a compulsion that you have to continue your program with the IMF.
01:26Because you have to pay the loan that you have taken.
01:29And the good news is that there was a program in recent history from 2013 to 2016.
01:35Pakistan had completed it with the IMF.
01:37In 2022, our affairs were very bad.
01:42And in the end of PTI's government and in the beginning of PDM's government,
01:46you saw how difficult the time of 15 months was.
01:50But now it is that without a mini-budget, it was being said that the government will have to bring a mini-budget.
01:56The government will have to make some more strict decisions on the public.
02:00Because we see that the public usually suffer from strict decisions.
02:03But this time it did not happen.
02:04And the Prime Minister also appreciated it.
02:06Now it is that he has agreed to give the next installment of the IMF program.
02:10And then the IMF has said that in the last 18 months, Pakistan's activities have been better in terms of economy.
02:15And it has also raised international confidence.
02:17So the Prime Minister was very happy about it.
02:19And what did the Prime Minister say? Let me show you first.
02:24Alhamdulillah, the IMF's staff level agreement with Pakistan, which has been passed overnight.
02:29Do you remember how the opponents beat the drum on this?
02:34That what has come now? Mini-budget.
02:36And without a mini-budget, the IMF will not move forward.
02:39Alhamdulillah, it did not come in the mini-budget.
02:41And God accepted your hard work.
02:44And with his great kindness, this staff level agreement was made possible last night.
02:49Agricultural tax was a make or break.
02:51Without it, the IMF would not have moved forward.
02:53The parties have fully participated in it.
02:56Okay, the Prime Minister said about agricultural tax.
03:00Then the target of tax collection.
03:02That was the most important thing.
03:04They praised the salaried class.
03:06Of course, at source and times.
03:08And then a lot of claims were made.
03:11And you will remember for a long time.
03:13After the 90s, Mr. Ishaq Dar said that the tax net needs to be broadened.
03:20It needs to be expanded.
03:22It is not that when you come to Shikanje, you have collected as much as you wanted.
03:26And the rest of the retail sector or the rest of your agricultural sector.
03:30You do not collect from there.
03:32But this time, the targets of tax were achieved.
03:35And what did the Prime Minister say about other matters?
03:38Let's listen to you first.
03:40The target set by the IMF for tax collection was 10.2.
03:45You achieved 10.6.
03:47Do not forget the contribution of the salaried class.
03:50And this is the highest tax ratio achievement in the last four years.
03:54They set a target for tax collection of 12.9 trillion rupees.
03:59The IMF said in its review that we reduce this target.
04:02I said no.
04:03They told us to bring it from 12.9 to 12.1.
04:06We negotiated and increased it again to 12.33.
04:09So whose success is this?
04:11Yours? This nation's?
04:12An institution like the IMF was surprised and worried.
04:14Is it happening in Pakistan?
04:16And somewhere else?
04:17In comparison to last year, there is a 26% increase in tax collection.
04:22So the IMF is surprised that is it happening in Pakistan?
04:25And we appreciate the measures taken by the government.
04:27But there are some questions here.
04:30One is the lack of inflation.
04:33And third, I would like to talk about the fact that things are getting cheaper.
04:38This matters to the people of Pakistan.
04:40Because they are not able to understand the other two terms.
04:43The second thing is that everyone else got relief.
04:46But when will the salaried class get relief?
04:49And when they will get relief and there will be an equal distribution of taxes.
04:53Then we will also say that is it happening in Pakistan?
04:56Along with that, there is a lack of electricity bills.
04:59It was said that it will be announced on 23rd March.
05:02But on what basis was it not announced?
05:04We will try to talk about that too.
05:06And what relief can come in the future budget?
05:09What are the possibilities?
05:11What things will be better?
05:12We will discuss this.
05:13We will talk about the economy.
05:15In the next part of the program, we will also talk about the political environment.
05:18The guest who is with us, let's welcome him.
05:20Senator Dr. Afnanullah has joined us in the studio.
05:23Thank you so much for your time.
05:25Along with that, Mr. Shaukat Yusufzai is joining us on the video link.
05:28Thank you very much, Mr. Shaukat, for your time.
05:30And Dr. Khakan Najeeb is joining us.
05:33He is an economist.
05:35We will talk to him.
05:36So starting from you, Dr. Khakan Najeeb.
05:39At this time, things are being appreciated a lot.
05:44And the Prime Minister is happy that this agreement has been signed.
05:48This happened without a mini-budget.
05:51So did you think that this would be possible?
05:54Or were there some difficulties that were sorted?
05:58In the name of Allah, the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful.
06:00Look, Pakistan's engagement with the IMF is behaving very well.
06:07And that's good.
06:08This means that if you apply economic policy-making on Pakistan,
06:13which is theoretically correct,
06:15then the economy behaves the same way as research tells us.
06:20What does this mean?
06:21Look, this means that for macro-stabilization,
06:25which means to reduce the risk of rising prices,
06:29to handle external losses,
06:32and to build up our reserves,
06:34whatever policies were implemented,
06:36in which fiscal tightening, i.e. expenditure and revenue decreased,
06:40we left a little bit of money on market forces.
06:44And even today, when I am talking to you,
06:47we have not eased the policy rate.
06:50We have certainly reduced it by 10%.
06:52But we are still going through a phase of monetary tightening.
06:56By applying all these things,
06:58we have achieved a stabilization.
07:01This is how the economy has behaved.
07:05But people of Pakistan have paid a price for this.
07:08Indeed, they have.
07:09What is that price?
07:11That price is that you saw a bout of taxation,
07:14which was implemented on your salary,
07:16on my salary,
07:17on non-salary people,
07:18and on manufacturing as well.
07:20And why did this happen?
07:21Because in our current tax net,
07:24we cannot tax agriculture, real estate, and retail in the way
07:28we can easily tax them.
07:31And then we imposed some withholding taxes.
07:34So by doing this,
07:35we certainly showed a 26% growth in a slowing economy.
07:39What was the consequent effect of all this?
07:41So this was a burden on people's pockets.
07:44Then the authorities themselves told us
07:46that there was an 8% change in the price of gas,
07:48a change in the price of electricity.
07:50The price pass-throughs that we should have done in the same way,
07:53we had to do them.
07:54And we had to take PDL up to 70 rupees.
07:57So that is the price that the nation paid.
08:00But it has brought a stability.
08:02And things are to a great extent
08:05that we are comfortably sailing through.
08:09And we have got a time and space.
08:11This is the most important sentence.
08:13What is forward-looking?
08:14We have got a time and space
08:16to do the work in which the burden of adjustments,
08:20that is, the burden of increasing the tax,
08:22can be lifted from you.
08:24And it can be imposed on retail, agriculture, income tax,
08:28and real estate.
08:30We have got that time and space
08:32to take cost-effective measures
08:34so that the price of electricity
08:36can be reduced on a cost-effective basis.
08:38Mr. Sati,
08:39this short-term,
08:40that we invest 10 rupees on PDL
08:42and give it to electricity,
08:44I want to see further
08:46that we create efficiencies,
08:48we go into privatization.
08:50And there are long-term measures,
08:52instead of taking short-term measures
08:54and fire-fighting measures.
08:56Doctor,
08:57please say that it is good,
08:59that it is okay.
09:00Although I said in the beginning
09:02that we should not appreciate or glorify the loan.
09:04But the thing is that
09:05to run the economy of Pakistan,
09:07it is a good aspect that
09:09we are gaining confidence.
09:11Are you satisfied with whatever is happening right now?
09:14In the name of God,
09:15the macroeconomic indicators are better.
09:19There is no doubt about it.
09:20Anyone who understands the economy
09:22can say that foreign exchange reserves are increasing,
09:24inflation has bottomed out,
09:27interest rate has come down significantly.
09:29So all these things are good news for the economy.
09:33I think the challenges are that
09:35while moving forward,
09:37we should keep in mind that
09:39imports should be manageable
09:41and the current account should not be out of control.
09:43And exports should be better.
09:45Exports should be better,
09:46remittances should be better.
09:47Yes, exports should be better,
09:48remittances should be better,
09:49your services should be better.
09:50So we should focus on this.
09:52Because if you look at the history of the economy of Pakistan,
09:55then we have a boom-to-bust cycle.
09:57We have a booming economy,
09:59we open imports,
10:00a lot of things come out of it,
10:02and eventually the current account comes out.
10:04This is what has happened in 2022.
10:07If you look at it,
10:08you have reduced the petrol prices,
10:10your imports have increased,
10:12your foreign exchange reserves have depleted,
10:14your imports have gone up to 81 billion dollars.
10:1781 billion.
10:18The record has never gone that far.
10:20And exports were at 35-34 billion.
10:23So when such a big deficit comes,
10:25it damages the economy for the next 3-4 years.
10:28So I think our main issue is that
10:30the government is very vigilant about this.
10:33And we will have to go towards a sustainable growth model
10:37which we can sustain for the long term.
10:39Let's hope.
10:40Mr. Shaukat,
10:41you are listening to all these discussions
10:43and we also heard what the Prime Minister said.
10:45In 2022,
10:48there were discussions between you and us,
10:50from then to now.
10:51Do you think there has been some improvement in the economy
10:53as shown by the government?
10:55And not only the government,
10:56but also from the IMF,
10:58the re-establishment of the staff level agreement.
11:02Do you see that as a good sign?
11:07Thank you very much.
11:09If the economy would have been better
11:11by increasing the debt,
11:12then I would have also said that it is absolutely right.
11:14See, countries take loans,
11:16but they manage themselves.
11:18By taking loans,
11:20they go towards correctness.
11:22They make such policies
11:23so that your economy can improve.
11:25What is happening here?
11:27The prices have increased here,
11:29but if there is a shortage of money,
11:31then where will you stand?
11:33Your exports are falling day by day.
11:35When there is no export,
11:37your 187 textile mills are closed in Punjab.
11:41The production of cotton this year
11:45has seen a lot of decline.
11:49You have only one source,
11:51the biggest textile you can export,
11:53which is very less this time.
11:56You took a loan of Rs 27,000 billion in two years.
11:59Even after taking a loan of Rs 27,000 billion,
12:02you are happy that the staff level has been adjusted
12:05and we are getting more loans.
12:07If the economy would have been better
12:09by taking foreign loans,
12:10then we would have been happy too.
12:12And there is a shortage of money.
12:14Then you say that the people of Bijli
12:16have not been able to benefit from one rupee
12:18in three and a half years.
12:19There is a continuous government.
12:20Before Nigran, there was Shahbaz Sharif.
12:21Then there was Nigran,
12:22and then there was Nigran.
12:23They are still crying and crying
12:25that Imran Khan has ruined everything.
12:27Now get out of this.
12:29For God's sake,
12:30give something for the people too.
12:32How long will you put people
12:34behind the wheel of a truck?
12:36Now that we have got a loan,
12:37our reserves have increased.
12:39Give benefit to the people.
12:40Then we will agree that yes.
12:42Now China is not in your control.
12:44Earlier you used to say,
12:45China mafia.
12:46Now where is the Chinese mafia sitting?
12:49What did they do cheaply?
12:51They say that the inflation rate has fallen.
12:53I know.
12:54I myself am going to buy everything.
12:57For the house.
12:58I have not seen anything
13:00that there has been a decrease in oil prices.
13:02Rice, lentils.
13:03Which thing has decreased?
13:04Mr. Shaukat, there is one thing.
13:05We have a very sensitive debate.
13:07And we also try to know this.
13:09And when you go to buy groceries,
13:11you do not see a decrease in anything.
13:12And this is what our benefactors,
13:14Dr. Khakhan,
13:15and other economic analysts
13:17try to know.
13:18Two terms are used.
13:20One says that there is a decrease in inflation.
13:22Let's say that there is a decrease in the rate of inflation.
13:26But even that does not mean
13:28that things have become cheaper.
13:30So I think this is a clear term.
13:32No one should have taken it out.
13:34See, this is the business of numbers.
13:39Earlier when the budget was presented,
13:41the Minister of Treasury used to prepare everything.
13:43Even I was in the company for 17-18 years.
13:46When he used to explain everything,
13:48no one could understand
13:50whether the budget was a surplus or a loss.
13:53He used to give such figures back and forth.
13:56So my point is that
13:58until you can't benefit the public,
14:00you should never say that we have got loans.
14:02We used to get loans earlier too.
14:04Which government will not get loans?
14:06In the meantime, the situation was such
14:08that I would like Dr. Shaukat
14:10to shed some light on this.
14:12Dr. Khakhan,
14:14wasn't the situation such
14:16that at that time,
14:18it was difficult for the IMF
14:20to run a sustainable program?
14:22I would like you to shed some light
14:24on those 15 months.
14:26Was it so easy to get loans
14:28that we are getting now?
14:30Satish sir, go back.
14:32When inflation was at 38% in May 2023
14:34and our engagement was breaking
14:36with the IMF,
14:38and Pakistan's reserves
14:40had gone to a dangerously difficult level,
14:42and we were at $3.5 billion.
14:44We did not have an import cover
14:46for the IMF at that time.
14:48We were standing there,
14:50and I remember very well,
14:52I had written this in all
14:54the magazines of Pakistan
14:56that at that time,
14:58without a fund,
15:00because the fund works
15:02in architecture international
15:04that when there is such
15:06a challenging situation,
15:08it is the lender of the last resort.
15:10You were not ready to give any loan.
15:12It's not just that.
15:14You take loans from multilaterals.
15:16You take loans from the Paris Club.
15:18Your friends,
15:20I say this to you very respectfully,
15:22in the World Economic Forum,
15:24the Saudi people
15:26who had to
15:28re-profile the loan
15:30to Pakistan,
15:32the Chinese,
15:34they were all saying
15:36that you should engage with the IMF.
15:38Satish sir, you said
15:40that we will get $1 or $2 billion.
15:42You approved it.
15:44Because of this,
15:46friends offered $12 to $14 billion.
15:48Your access to commercial loans
15:50was opened.
15:52And for that,
15:54as I said,
15:56the people of the country
15:58have paid a heavy price
16:00through an adjustment.
16:02But now they have to say
16:04to the authorities.
16:06But the problem is that
16:08the people have paid the price,
16:10and the tax at source is being cut.
16:12There are many people
16:14who are in grey areas.
16:18They are out of the tax net.
16:20What should be done about that?
16:22Sir, in 77 years,
16:24all four provinces,
16:26and we all live in those provinces,
16:28we have not been able
16:30to keep the agricultural income tax
16:32that you have classified as salary.
16:34And we did this
16:36at the behest of the IMF.
16:38You tell me,
16:40if these decisions are for us,
16:42if we are a horizontal equity
16:44at the behest of someone,
16:46equity means that
16:48I, you, Senators,
16:50give the same tax
16:52that comes from our salary,
16:54manufacturing, and agri.
16:56But we have not been able
16:58to run such a system
17:00of tax in the country.
17:02And then there is an informal economy
17:04in which retail and wholesale
17:06have been disincentivized.
17:08In manufacturing,
17:10we ask where the money comes from,
17:12know your customer,
17:14everything, and then
17:16up to 60% tax,
17:18then super tax,
17:20then tax on dividends.
17:22And when we go to take this work
17:24in real estate,
17:26we don't even ask
17:28the know your customer.
17:30So we have incentivized
17:32in this way.
17:34We have to do privatization
17:36We have to make business
17:38easier in the country.
17:40We have to bring down
17:42the cost of doing business,
17:44especially in terms of
17:46the energy sector.
17:48We have to make policies
17:50so that we can say
17:52that we have used time and space
17:54prudently.
17:56There was a 3 to 31 rupee
17:58liter of petrol in September
18:002023, and now it is 255.
18:02It has to do
18:04with the international market
18:06as well.
18:32food security
18:34food security
18:36retail sector
18:38numbers speak for themselves
18:40numbers speak for themselves
18:42numbers speak for themselves
18:44numbers speak for themselves
18:46numbers speak for themselves
18:48numbers speak for themselves
18:50numbers speak for themselves
18:52numbers speak for themselves
18:54numbers speak for themselves
18:56numbers speak for themselves
18:58numbers speak for themselves
19:00numbers speak for themselves
19:02numbers speak for themselves
19:04numbers speak for themselves
19:06numbers speak for themselves
19:08numbers speak for themselves
19:10numbers speak for themselves
19:12numbers speak for themselves
19:14numbers speak for themselves
19:16numbers speak for themselves
19:18numbers speak for themselves
19:20numbers speak for themselves
19:22numbers speak for themselves
19:24numbers speak for themselves
19:26numbers speak for themselves
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27:24I don't have that information.
27:26But we hope that such a thing will not happen.
27:29And keep in mind that Mangla and Tarbela are dead levels because winters are coming to an end.
27:34When summer comes, it will start to fill up.
27:36But from 24th September...
27:38Okay, I know.
27:40And in three mornings, there has been an alert about drought.
27:43And they are saying that our crops can be greatly affected by this.
27:45No, it is a lifeline. There is no doubt about it.
27:49But three years ago, it was being said that the country is defaulting.
27:55I wasn't saying this. Bani PTI themselves used to say on TV that the country is defaulting.
28:00We don't need 22 billion dollars. The country will default.
28:03The whole campaign was run on this.
28:05In the whole world, the IMF wrote a letter to default the country.
28:09So if those people come and give us a lecture on the economy,
28:12this is the glory of Allah.
28:14Tell me that the budget of Khyber Pakhtunkhwa is 1754 billion rupees.
28:18They are asking us what we are doing.
28:20I can count 4000 things. What have we done?
28:22You tell me, what have you done?
28:24I will give you an example.
28:26There is a hospital in Tamil Nadu.
28:28Medical gloves worth 14 crores were supplied there.
28:3014 crores?
28:32Yes, 14 crores.
28:34And they came out in an audit of 60 lakh rupees.
28:3613 crores and 40 lakhs were consumed.
28:38This is the performance of the government of Khyber Pakhtunkhwa.
28:40Earlier, we used to hear that Mr. 5%, 10%, 15%.
28:42Mr. 95% is there.
28:44That eat everything.
28:46They say, leave it.
28:48After that, when the people shouted,
28:50they said that Wifaq has eaten it.
28:52I can tell you that if you install an electricity factory,
28:54you will not get an IPP contract.
28:56If you don't do any work,
28:58you keep sitting all day and
29:00badmouthing others,
29:02this is an even easier job.
29:04The net metering proposal has also been rejected today.
29:06The net metering has been updated.
29:08The ECC has updated the price of rupees 10.
29:10But they are doing the new one.
29:12The old ones are not for new consumers.
29:14The corruption has increased.
29:16I challenge them on your TV channel
29:18to come and sit with me.
29:20Tell us your performance.
29:22Tell us about your TV project.
29:24I am ready to challenge you.
29:26You are not focusing on this.
29:28They do not focus on the line order.
29:30They do not know what is happening.
29:32They do not know what is happening.
29:34They do not know what is happening.
29:36They do not know what is happening.
29:38They do not know what is happening.
29:40They do not know what is happening.
29:42They do not know what is happening.
29:44They do not know what is happening.
29:46The line order is not a problem in the morning
29:48if we look at it.
29:50The line order is not a problem in the morning
29:52if we look at it.
29:54I am not referring to the line order.
29:56I am talking about the line order
29:58which is at the verge of a catastrophe.
30:00Who will come for you under this condition?
30:02Why are you running out like this?
30:04If your condition was so good
30:06and if you could see a future
30:08So why are these young people running out? Why is your investor going out?
30:12People are taking out all the money and going. Why are they going?
30:15They are going because you didn't give them hope.
30:17And you can't give them any hope because you don't have anything yourself.
30:22What can you give this country except taking loans?
30:25Tell me one thing.
30:26It is very easy to say that it is safe from default.
30:29It is safe from default.
30:30My brother, you tell me what did the public give you?
30:33I would like to take an answer from Dr.
30:37Khagan.
30:38I would like to take an answer from Dr.
30:40Khagan.
30:41He used to say that we have sent so many people out.
30:43In our view, he is saying that people are going out.
30:45Dr.
30:46Khagan, the term used by Shaukat Yusuf Zahid that so many people have gone out of the
30:49country.
30:50Now in January and February, we have seen that our remittances have been recorded.
30:54That is, remittances are sent by the same people who go out of the country.
30:57So does this have a negative impact, as Shaukat Yusuf Zahid is saying, or does it have a positive
31:01impact, that people go out of the country?
31:03No, it has no negative impact.
31:34Okay.
31:35Okay.
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