On this episode of the Big 3 NBA Podcast, A. Sherrod Blakely, Gary Washburn and Kwani Lunis preview the Celtics' upcoming matchup with the undefeated Cleveland Cavaliers. Could this NBA Cup matchup also be a preview of the Eastern Conference Finals? That, and much more!
0:00 - Intro
1:01 - Welcome back
4:49 - Eastern Conference tone
6:49 - Importance of Cleveland game
9:17 - Donovan Mitchell's impact
10:51 - Cleveland's team dynamics
12:37 - Cavaliers' efficiency
15:10 - Evan Mobley's impact
17:42 - Mobley's consistency
20:28 - Kenny Atkinson's influence
22:34 - Cleveland's offensive growth
24:39 - Unlocking Darius Garland
26:28 - Celtics' psychological obstacles
29:12 - Jayson Tatum legacy discussion
31:10 - Celtics vs. Cavaliers rivalry
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0:00 - Intro
1:01 - Welcome back
4:49 - Eastern Conference tone
6:49 - Importance of Cleveland game
9:17 - Donovan Mitchell's impact
10:51 - Cleveland's team dynamics
12:37 - Cavaliers' efficiency
15:10 - Evan Mobley's impact
17:42 - Mobley's consistency
20:28 - Kenny Atkinson's influence
22:34 - Cleveland's offensive growth
24:39 - Unlocking Darius Garland
26:28 - Celtics' psychological obstacles
29:12 - Jayson Tatum legacy discussion
31:10 - Celtics vs. Cavaliers rivalry
CLNS Media is Powered by:
💰 Prize Picks - https://prizepicks.onelink.me/LME0/CLNS
Download the app today and use Code CLNS when you sign up & Get $50 instantly when you play $5!
🎫 Gametime - https://gametime.co
Take the guesswork out of buying NBA tickets with Gametime. Download the Gametime app, create an account, and use code CLNS for $20 off your first purchase. Download Gametime today. Terms apply. What time is it? Gametime!
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SportsTranscript
00:00The Big 3 NBA Podcast is powered by PrizePix, the exclusive daily fantasy partner of the
00:23CLNS Media Network.
00:24Hello, everyone.
00:25Welcome back into the Big 3 NBA Podcast.
00:29I say back because I have been away for a while, but Sherrod and Gary have been holding
00:33it down.
00:34I appreciate y'all.
00:35If we do anything for our star, our franchise center, you know, hopefully we'll be better
00:42than the Sixers when they didn't have Joel Embiid.
00:44So I don't understand how did Kwanee Embiid, Kwanee Leonard.
00:51I'll take Leonard because we have similar spellings of our names.
00:54That's all I got.
00:55Welcome back, Kwanee.
00:56Welcome back.
00:58I appreciate it.
00:59Kwanee good for like at least another two and a half podcast straight, then she might
01:05need a break.
01:06Then I'm going to need to take another.
01:07Low management.
01:08Then we got to kick in low management.
01:09Two and a half.
01:10I'm good for two and a half, but then I don't know about number three.
01:19I do not want that reputation.
01:20So I will be, I need to be back here consistently for the team.
01:25Let's get into the NBA cup.
01:27The Celtics playing the Cavaliers against Donovan Mitchell, MVP candidate.
01:33Right into it.
01:34What are you two looking forward to from that game on Tuesday?
01:37It's two more.
01:38Gosh, this week's fine.
01:39Bye.
01:40Great game.
01:41It should be a great, great game.
01:42I mean, Cleveland is playing the best basketball.
01:44Let's just call it what it is.
01:45Best basketball franchise history right now.
01:48The Celtics have been good, but I don't think, I don't think anyone feels the Celtics have
01:51been great.
01:52They've been good.
01:53It'll be interesting to see how the Celtics rise to the occasion because they're going
01:56to have to play one of the better games to win this game against Cleveland because Cleveland
02:01is a good team.
02:02They're getting a lot.
02:03They're undefeated at this point, by the way, I've buried the lead, undefeated 15-0.
02:07Yeah, undefeated.
02:09And the one thing that, again, I'm curious to see is how will the Celtics rise to the
02:13occasion because they're going to have to step their game up if they're going to be
02:16in that streak.
02:18Yeah.
02:19The Cavaliers are playing, like you said, great ball, teamwork.
02:26They're getting career years out of guys, and they have the confidence they can score
02:30on anybody.
02:31I mean, their defense hasn't been great lately, but they can put up 135 points on anybody.
02:36So the Celtics are going to have to, their defense has been, I would say average at best
02:42this year.
02:43They're going to have to step up defensively.
02:46They're going to have to have guys, no lapses, no slow starts, none of this that they've
02:54had the last week or two weeks.
02:56They played pretty, on a scale of one to 10, six basketball over the last couple of weeks.
03:05They've been able to win.
03:06They're 11-3, so you can't complain about that.
03:08But Toronto was the worst team in the league and took an overtime.
03:11Brooklyn is not a very good team, took an overtime.
03:16They lost that game to Atlanta, which was, to me, a pretty embarrassing loss because
03:20they got punked in that game.
03:22So they're going to have to reach back and get all of what they got for this game.
03:28And I think they seem like they're looking forward to it, they're fired up for it, but
03:32it should be one of the better regular season games we've seen at the Garden in a long time.
03:38Yeah, and to me, that's what makes this one so special because, you know, you can talk
03:42about important games in November, but there are very few games that, going into it, actually
03:48matter that much.
03:49But when you look at where Cleveland, what they're looking to do this year, and you look
03:52at what the Celtics are looking to do, this game means a lot to both of these teams.
03:56Not only because of the whole Emirates-NBA Cup deal, but just the simple fact that this
04:03Cleveland team is on an unprecedented pace right now, and the Celtics are the champs.
04:09This is clearly the team that is going to present the greatest threat to you repeating
04:16as champions.
04:17And here you got a chance to play them on your home floor, packed house, early November,
04:24and you get to play them when they're going to be at relative full strength and you are
04:28Porzingis absent, obviously, you're going to pretty much have your core group intact
04:33as well.
04:34So I'm looking forward to this game.
04:35I think this is going to be one of those games that we're not just going to be able to brush
04:41this one aside easily and just think, oh, that's just another game back in November.
04:45This is one of those games that I think is going to set the tone for how the Eastern
04:48Conference is going to be played out, because if Cleveland wins this game, now you start
04:53having some serious questions, Mark, about whether the Celtics are built to repeat.
04:58And if the Celtics go out there and smash Cleveland, then it becomes a matter of, okay,
05:02can Cleveland bounce back?
05:04They've been able to knock kids out easily, but can they get off the mat now that they've
05:07been knocked out?
05:08So lots of storylines and subplots to this one.
05:12Wait, another storyline that is definitely derailing the conversation, but should the
05:17Celtics want to win the NBA Cup, especially considering the inaugural winner were the
05:22Lakers?
05:23So now they'll have a new tier of competition with LA?
05:26Go ahead, Gary.
05:27Since you're talking about the Lakers.
05:28Oh my goodness.
05:29I mean, I think they should want to win every game.
05:32I think it does mean something to them.
05:34I think they were a little bit upset last year when they lost the quarterfinals at Indiana.
05:39And then they kind of blew it against Atlanta.
05:42So now they've got to literally win out the last three games, Cleveland, Washington, and
05:47Chicago, and then hope some things happen, because Atlanta's now 2-0.
05:52You got to give Cleveland a loss.
05:53You got to hope Chicago loses or whatever.
05:56You got to, basically, you got to hope that some good things happen so they can get one
06:02of maybe, either win the group, if Atlanta finishes the same record, Atlanta's got the
06:08tiebreaker, or get one of those two wild card spots.
06:12In other words, 18 out of 30 go to the quarterfinals.
06:15So they got their work cut out for them moving to Atlanta again.
06:18That was a bad loss.
06:19But I do think that they want to win it.
06:20They want to get there.
06:21They want to get to the quarterfinals.
06:22These are the semifinals.
06:25They got to play their best basketball.
06:27This is their hardest game, obviously.
06:30They should be able to beat Washington on Friday, and then they should be able to beat
06:33Chicago next weekend, which will be their last game of the cup.
06:38But this is something they should want.
06:41You don't want to be at home or playing some regular season games while other teams are
06:46in Vegas.
06:47But the way it looks now, Atlanta's 2-0.
06:50The Knicks are 2-0.
06:52It could be a pretty mediocre team that reaches the semifinals, and just like the Lakers were
06:58last year, end up winning it.
06:59So it doesn't mean that they're not going to win the championship if they don't win
07:02this cup, but it's something they should want to do.
07:07I think for them, it's like, yeah, it'd be nice to win it, but we ain't going to sweat
07:10if we don't.
07:11I think that's kind of the attitude that they're taking with this thing.
07:14Because as you pointed out, Gary, the team that won the inaugural cup was the Lakers.
07:18And last I checked, they were doing the same thing that most teams were doing come late
07:24playoff time, watching.
07:26And the Celtics ain't built for that.
07:28They understand that at the end of the day, the only goal that they truly, truly, truly
07:34absolutely thirst over is winning another championship.
07:36And anything that they can win along that journey, that's just icing on the cake.
07:41But again, to your point, I'm curious to see this Cleveland game.
07:46Because this one, it goes beyond the cup.
07:49It goes beyond any of the usually early season, sending a message type games that we hear
07:55and talk about.
07:56This is a game that there's no way you can get around the importance of this game.
08:02This team is beating everyone, literally beating everyone they step on the floor against.
08:07And you are the defending champs.
08:09You better take this game personal.
08:11You better take this game as not just another regular season game, because it's not.
08:18I don't know if we've ever had a circumstance where a defending champion, at this point
08:23in the season, faced another team that was undefeated.
08:27That just doesn't happen every day.
08:29And are the Celtics going to embrace the moment and rise to the occasion?
08:33Or are they going to treat it just like it's another game in November?
08:36And I'd be very disappointed in them if they treated this as if it was just another game
08:40in November.
08:41Because even if, to me, something that Joe Mazula has talked about, this team, the effort
08:46has been pretty consistent throughout, but the execution, at times, hasn't been quite
08:50where it needs to be.
08:51It damn so better be where it needs to be if they plan to beat Cleveland.
08:54Because if they come out here lollygagging and just kind of easy breezing their way into
08:58the game, they are going to get their asses kicked.
09:01And we're going to talk a little bit more about just some of the different players,
09:04not named Donovan Mitchell, who are major factors in this Cleveland team being the best
09:10team in the NBA at this point in the season.
09:12Yeah, thanks for teaming me up.
09:13Let's get back into the matchup itself.
09:16Before we do get into the other players, Donovan Mitchell, we mentioned him being an MVP candidate,
09:19but what has he been doing differently this season that has made his game stand out so
09:23much more?
09:24I think a couple things he's done that stand out when I watch him play.
09:28He's a better defender.
09:29I think he understands how to defend and not be a problem for them.
09:35Because remember, with him and Garland in the backcourt, you've got two relatively smallish
09:39guards and they have been able to play, Donovan specifically, has been able to play where
09:43that hasn't been a major factor.
09:45But to me, the biggest thing that he's doing is he doesn't seem to play with the same pressure
09:50that he has been playing with previously, where he felt he had to score.
09:55Remember, you look at this Cleveland team, and Gary touched on it earlier, they are the
09:59highest scoring team in the NBA this year.
10:02And offense was a problem for them last year.
10:04They relied too much on Donovan to carry the load, where now you've got Evan Mobley, you've
10:08got Allen, you've got a multitude of guys on this roster, Garland, who are able to score
10:15They're all scoring at a career high level, which means they don't need Donovan to be
10:20as ball dominant as he's been in the past.
10:23I think they're doing a really good job of keeping him on and off the ball so that teams
10:27aren't able to really lock in on how best to defend them.
10:31And Donovan, I give him a lot of credit.
10:33He's being a lot more, I think, trusting of his teammates, and that trust is being rewarded
10:38with guys having career years.
10:40So to me, basically, less has been more in terms of what he's bringing to the table,
10:45and as far as him having the ball in his hands.
10:48And again, they're just a better team.
10:51And that's exactly what Cleveland is doing.
10:52They're playing much better team ball, as opposed to Donovan Mitchell and a bunch of
10:57dudes who ran up and down a court ball.
11:00Yeah, Mitchell, it's interesting.
11:05His scoring from two years ago, when he was an All-Star, his scoring is down from two
11:13years ago by four points.
11:16His minutes are down by four, almost five minutes.
11:19He's only playing 31 minutes a game.
11:22He's averaging almost 25, but he's shooting 42% for three.
11:26His three-pointer, he's always been a streaky three-point shooter.
11:29He's been a pretty good three-point shooter, but 42%, obviously, is in the upper echelon.
11:34And like you said, Sherrod, they're not depending on him as much because they have guys like
11:39Ty Jerome, a surprise, a shocker.
11:41Former Celtic draft pick.
11:43Yeah, like someone who probably will compete with Peyton, maybe in the most improved or
11:49even sixth man of the year of what he's doing.
11:53Darius Garland, the big boys up front in Jared Allen, Evan Mobley, Karis Levert, always a
11:59Celtic killer.
12:00They're getting fantastic contributions from all their guys.
12:04They're playing a faster pace than they did.
12:07They were always a good defensive team under Jamie Bickerstaff.
12:10But this time, they're playing more team ball.
12:13They're playing more faster-paced ball, team ball.
12:17I'm looking at their average, like six guys averaging in double figures.
12:21I mean, and that's outstanding.
12:24And guys, Karis Levert shooting 46% from three.
12:27Ty Jerome shooting 54% from three.
12:30Sometimes limited opportunities.
12:33But I mean, Mitchell, 42.1.
12:37Garland, 46% from three almost.
12:40These guys are shooting lights.
12:41They're shooting 42% from three as a team, right?
12:44So they are out-Celtic-ing the Celtics pretty much.
12:48I mean, they're not shooting up 50 a game, but they are making 42%.
12:53When you're making that amount, you're extremely hard to beat.
12:58They're taking only 37 a game compared to over 50 for the Celtics, but
13:03they're making 42% of them.
13:05So the Celtics are just gonna have to play their best defensive game.
13:09They're gonna have to rely, hope someone, they're gonna have to put the onus on
13:15someone to beat them that usually doesn't beat them.
13:17You can't let Mitchell go for 50.
13:19You can't let Garland go for 35.
13:21So it's gonna have to be maybe an Evan Motley, a Ty Jerome, a George.
13:26You're gonna have to put it on someone.
13:28You can't stop everybody, but you're gonna have to stop somebody.
13:32And so I think that the Cavaliers are a juggernaut at this point.
13:38And the Celtics are gonna have to play their best defensive game.
13:40But I think when you look at Donovan Mitchell,
13:43he's not doing as much cuz he does not need to do as much.
13:46But he's been more efficient in lower minutes and lower shot attempts.
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15:09You mentioned Evan Mobley.
15:10What has his impact been for the Cavs?
15:13What you got, Gary?
15:14Mobley is someone who is, you've waited for the light to come on.
15:20He's always been, he came out of USC, one and done.
15:23A guy who was always been a plus defender, right?
15:27The problem is, with him was, he doesn't, he's not comfortable at the rim scoring.
15:33That's not the case.
15:34You're averaging 18 points a game, 8.8 rebounds, 1.5 blocks.
15:39So this guy even almost three assists.
15:43So this guy's doing it all.
15:44And that's the, he's taking that step forward.
15:47This is what the Cavaliers needed from him to make him and Jared Allen just almost
15:51impossible to stop in the paint because they both can protect the rim.
15:55Both averaging combined near three block shots a game and about 20 rebounds.
16:01So there's something like, you can't let this team kill you on the offensive boards.
16:06I think Mobley is just taking that step forward.
16:10He's a guy, he doesn't do any commercials.
16:14You don't see, I don't know if anyone's ever heard him talk.
16:18He has just put his head down and decided he's gonna gradually improve his game.
16:24And his game is, he's shooting about 57% from the field.
16:29And I said, he's even taken a couple of threes this year.
16:32But just taking that step forward at age 23, 24, and that's what they wanted.
16:38They were looking for that.
16:39And I think we saw a little semblance, a little slice of that in the Celtics series
16:44when he was like basically their only offensive option when Donovan Mitchell was hurt.
16:48And he was taking the ball to the rack and he was going, he was getting at him.
16:51Now, the Celtics wanted that because they wanted to trade two for threes.
16:55But you saw, when you saw Evan Mobley in that series, you're like, yeah,
17:00like if he does more of this, he's gonna be an all star.
17:04And so he's putting up, he's having that type of season.
17:08And he's a guy who just does his role too.
17:11He knows he's not gonna take as many shots as Garland or Mitchell.
17:15But he's gonna get his, but he's also gonna do a little dirty work in the paint,
17:18get those rebounds and also defend.
17:20Yeah, the big thing I noticed with him is that they're just running more action through him now
17:25than they used to.
17:26They're forcing defenses to actually respect what he can do as an offensive player.
17:29And that's something that we just didn't see much of last season.
17:33I don't know whether it was just a matter of JB just didn't want to go there,
17:37or whether Mobley wasn't quite ready to assume the load that he is clearly capable of now.
17:42But the big thing for him is that he's showing a level of consistency
17:46with his game that we just did not see last year.
17:49And in the playoffs, we saw glimpses of how good a player he can be and
17:52live up to the hype that so many had when he came into the league.
17:56But what he's doing now, I mean, he's an All-NBA player.
17:59I go a step further, I think he has moved past the All-Star caliber talent thus far.
18:05And it's really, I think it's very much in that conversation for
18:09All-NBA based upon the way he's played up to this point.
18:12Now, obviously, there's a lot of basketball left to be played.
18:14And certainly, that'll bear itself out over time.
18:18But he's doing so many of the little things, rebounding,
18:22giving them offensive punches beyond just putbacks and cleaning up,
18:26doing a lot of the dirty work.
18:27He's actually becoming a viable threat for them.
18:30And Gary, I think you kind of alluded to it earlier when you talked about how
18:34he came into the league after one year.
18:36This is, I think this is year three, year four for him.
18:38And so his body is starting to fill out to where he's not so
18:42easily moved back and forth the way he used to be.
18:45And he also has the benefit of wisdom.
18:47I mean, he knows the game at this level way better than he did two, three years ago.
18:54And that experience, that wisdom is really starting to pay off.
18:59And it's helping him play with Allen.
19:02Because remember, last year, they just didn't look like they could work
19:06coherently together.
19:08And when the playoffs, his best basketball came when Jared Allen was not playing.
19:12So to see what he's doing now with Allen on the floor at the same time,
19:17that's part of what happens when you're in a program for three,
19:20four years and you're learning, you're getting better.
19:23And everything is coming together.
19:24And certainly, one of the low key factors in his success is the coaching change.
19:30I mean, let's just call it what it is.
19:32I know a lot of us, myself included, really were kind of hating on the Cavs
19:36when they got rid of JB.
19:37Because JB, you just didn't think could be held.
19:42That Cleveland team was battered and banged up and injured in the playoffs.
19:46And so for them to get bounced the way they did by the Celtics,
19:50it just didn't feel that you fire a coach over that.
19:53But I give the Cavs credit.
19:55I mean, they went out and they got a guy in Kenny Atkins,
19:58and we'll talk a little more about him.
20:01They're definitely a better team now, not just the record wise,
20:03but just their style of play than they were a year ago.
20:05Well, you keep seeing me up perfectly.
20:09I don't really need to do anything today.
20:10But Kenny Atkinson, like you mentioned-
20:12Okay, Joelle.
20:13Stop.
20:18Dang, the load management coming soon.
20:20I can feel that elbow.
20:24Kenny Atkinson, as you mentioned, his first season with the Cavs, 15 and 0 so far.
20:29And well, we can get into Joe Mizzoula and the coaching matchup overall.
20:32But what do you think he has done for this team?
20:35And then we can get into how does he match up with Joe Mizzoula as a coach for this game?
20:40I think people forget that he used to coach the Brooklyn Nets.
20:44And when he did coach the Brooklyn Nets,
20:46the one thing that he made a very clear and undeniable part of their identity
20:50was they were going to work hard.
20:52You may beat them, but they came to compete every single night,
20:55regardless of how talent challenged they were.
20:58And that's one of those things that Kenny Atkinson
21:00and the teams that he's been associated with, that's kind of what they do.
21:03That's how they are.
21:04And so now he has a Cleveland team that he's instilling some of those same
21:09foundational principles, but there's one difference.
21:12These guys can play.
21:14He actually has a team that can not only play hard, which is what he wants,
21:19but they're talented guys who are playing hard.
21:21They're guys who have a legitimate chip on their shoulder.
21:24People, himself included, did not think Cleveland would be very good this year
21:28because I wasn't sure whether Mobley would make that transition
21:32to being a top flight player,
21:33whether Donovan Mitchell would become comfortable doing less with more
21:37and being more of an impact player by doing less.
21:40There are lots of unknowns about this team, and to their credit,
21:43they have answered the call time and time again this year,
21:46and Kenny Atkinson deserves a lot of credit for that.
21:49The way that he goes about doing his job,
21:51the way he prepares his team to battle.
21:55We also forget before he was head coach in Brooklyn,
21:59he was an assistant coach with the Atlanta Hawks many years ago.
22:01He was the one that developed Al Horford into a three-point shooter.
22:05He was the one that convinced Al that this was a part of your game you need to add
22:09so that you can have longevity in this league.
22:12And so when you look at Al Horford,
22:13who now he's on pace to become a 40% or better three-point shooter
22:17for the third year in a row,
22:19Kenny Atkinson has a lot to do with that.
22:21And when you look at the way Cleveland is shooting as a team,
22:25it's not a surprise when you think about who their head coach is
22:29that they have become a very difficult team to contain offensively
22:33because that's just kind of who he is and what he does.
22:37Atkinson, I thought, he left Brooklyn and he got pushed out of Brooklyn
22:44because KD and Kyrie didn't know him very well
22:48and they wanted Steve Nash to be their coach.
22:50And we see how that worked out.
22:52That worked out.
22:54He goes to Golden State.
22:54Steve Nash, he got paid.
22:56Yeah, it helps win a championship.
22:58And remember, he was gonna take the Charlotte job about a year ago,
23:02a couple of years ago before Steve Clifford came back
23:05and he turned it down.
23:06He accepted it, then turned it down and waited for the right job.
23:09And obviously, this was the right opportunity,
23:11a team that was ready to win,
23:12a team that probably just needed a little bit more of a boost offensively.
23:15And they're playing faster ball, taking more threes
23:18and taking advantage of their offensive players.
23:23And the thing is that they didn't really make any off-season acquisitions.
23:27Like Cleveland didn't have anybody.
23:29They just re-signed everybody.
23:31The key has been Ty Jerome.
23:33And there's a guy who was out injuries most of last year.
23:37He played two games last year.
23:38So he was a complete non-factor.
23:40So for him to come back and be a guy who can turn around
23:44and average like 15, 16 points off the bench in 16 minutes is insane.
23:51I'm sorry, he's averaging 11 points in 17.5 minutes a game.
23:56So he's not playing a whole lot of minutes.
23:59And he's shooting, as I noted, he's shooting 54% from three.
24:03So that is the biggest surprise,
24:06is that they're basically playing the same guys as they did last year.
24:10They're just getting more contributions from guys like Sam Merrill,
24:14Isaac Acoros, come back, Dean Wade has had his moments.
24:18So if you're a deep, deep team, guys, they have, we see here,
24:2410 guys playing at least 17 minutes.
24:27So he goes deep into his roster.
24:29They're playing faster.
24:31They're playing some of their key guys less minutes to save them in games.
24:34And then Garland, to me, he's the guy who's been unlocked
24:39because he is so crafty.
24:40And he's a small guy, but he can get to the rim at will.
24:43He can hit the floater game, hit it off the glass.
24:45And he just gets to the point where he's so quick and speedy and crafty and nifty.
24:51He can get anywhere he wants.
24:52And he just gets, you get tired of guarding him because he just doesn't stop.
24:56So the key to Cleveland, to me, was unlocking Garland in terms of playing with Mitchell,
25:02as Sharada mentioned earlier.
25:04And it seems like he has been unlocked.
25:06So they've got a dynamic duo in the backcourt, two high-quality centers.
25:11And then you get by with LaVert or George's Ning or Acoro as your other guy,
25:17your defender, or Dean Wade.
25:19And you've got quite a combination.
25:21Now, are they ready to win the championship?
25:23We'll see.
25:24Obviously, there's been teams that have won, not necessarily start 15 and 0,
25:28but have won, had these long winning streaks, and not even made the final.
25:32I remember, if you remember Sharada's quantity,
25:34I remember Houston several years ago won like 22 in a row during the season.
25:39They didn't make the finals.
25:41So this is not, oh, Cleveland, could Cleveland win it?
25:44Yes, at the way they're playing now.
25:46We'll see how they do over an 8-2 game season.
25:49But for now, they're the best team in the East.
25:51And the Celtics are going to have to respond because the Celtics
25:53were playing like the best team in the East for a while.
25:56Then that loss to Indiana kind of curtailed them a little bit.
25:59And since then, they've been a little bit erratic.
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27:25Joe Mazula has already proven in some ways that years of experience isn't everything,
27:30but when we do look at that matchup against a coach that's been coaching for 20 years at this point,
27:37how do you two think that they match up against each other?
27:41Go ahead, Gary.
27:42Talk about your boy, Joe.
27:44I think Joe will have a game plan.
27:46I think he'll be completely prepared for Cleveland.
27:48I think he's had a couple of days to prepare.
27:50They played Saturday.
27:52They rested Drew.
27:54I think that was important to get him a day off because I think he's not a young man anymore.
27:58They got him that day off.
28:00He'll be ready for Cleveland.
28:01He had to play that overtime game.
28:03Yeah, he's not playing those extra minutes.
28:05So now you got to rest Drew coming on.
28:07So I think they'll have a game plan now whether they can execute it,
28:11whether their thing is, well, let Cleveland take as many twos as they want
28:15as long as they're not taking threes.
28:16That might be the best plan since Cleveland's leading the league in three-point percentage.
28:21But they've got it.
28:22I think their biggest obstacle, Shirai, is just psychologically.
28:26Not starting off slow.
28:28Not getting in the lapses.
28:29Not blowing a big lead.
28:31And just punching first.
28:32Being it's a national TV, TNT game with Shaq and Charles and those guys gonna be talking about it.
28:38So this is one of the bigger regular season games in recent memory.
28:41And they got to be ready.
28:42I mean, just be ready.
28:44Joe, sometimes the coach can't do everything that's prepared you.
28:48He can't make you be motivated.
28:50But maybe he comes up with something to get them motivated.
28:56And I think the fact that Cleveland's coming in undefeated and they know
29:00that if they lose this game, people are going to be like,
29:02oh, all the talk and first takes and all that, the perks.
29:05And our friends are going to be like, well, are they for real?
29:12Can Jason do it again?
29:15What does it say about his legacy?
29:17In a simple case of just eating porzingis or are they-
29:21And Jalen and Jason play together.
29:24Right.
29:26At the time, they didn't like each other.
29:29So to me, it's an important game for them.
29:31It's an important game for Cleveland.
29:33Cleveland eventually is going to lose.
29:35We all know that.
29:35They could have lost to Chicago on Friday.
29:39I watched that game and they just, Chicago couldn't stop them.
29:43But they didn't play good defense.
29:45A lot of threes and the same with Charlotte.
29:47Charlotte took them into the fourth quarter coming off a back to back.
29:51So it wasn't like Charlotte was well rested and
29:53what Cleveland just outscored them in the end.
29:55So it could be that Cleveland is due for just a game.
29:59I mean, the Celtics didn't play a great game against Atlanta.
30:03They've lost three close games or whatever, but they haven't played well.
30:07And eventually Cleveland's going to slow down.
30:08But to me, I think Missoula will have a capable game plan.
30:14But it's going to be up to the players.
30:17Yeah, I mean, that's ultimately what it comes down to is the players.
30:21But I think Joe is going to, I think, put them in position to be successful.
30:25I mean, these are the kind of games that, just like players get up for big games,
30:29so do coaches, I believe.
30:30And Joe Missoula is a very emotional coach.
30:33You better believe this is a game that he wants bad.
30:36Not just because it's the next game on the schedule.
30:38Not just because they're a good team.
30:41But this is a team that, in theory, is your biggest challenger for your title.
30:48This is the team that believes they are better than you.
30:51They believe, because think about it, Gary,
30:53the point that you made about them bringing the band back together.
30:56The Celtics brought the band back together
30:57because they thought that that group could repeat.
31:00Cleveland brought the band back together
31:02because they think this group can unseat them.
31:05If we are all healthy enough late in the season and go to the playoffs,
31:08we can beat Boston.
31:09That's their thinking.
31:10That's why they didn't make any dramatic or radical changes.
31:14And so you've got two teams, two organizations,
31:16with two ideas that are similar that are going to collide for the first time.
31:22Cleveland has shown a level of mental toughness to handle adversity thus far this year.
31:27They've won 15 in a row.
31:29The Celtics, can they meet or exceed that?
31:32That's really what this is going to come down to.
31:33And I do think Joe Missoula is going to do his part
31:36to get them in the right headspace for this game.
31:39But ultimately, as you pointed out, Gary, it's on the players.
31:42I mean, you either shut up or show up.
31:44I mean, something's got to give.
31:46And this is the time where they have to show up
31:48if they plan to win and send a clear message,
31:51not only to Cleveland, but to the rest of the NBA that,
31:53look, it may be a new season, but we ain't new to this.
31:56This is what we do.
31:58And this is that first real opportunity to show that.
32:01Well said.
32:03Well, Tuesday night, we'll see how it all goes down.
32:05Any final thoughts on that matchup before we wrap it up?
32:10Kwanye, I just want to say I appreciate you.
32:13I appreciate you rocking that hat,
32:14although I really would have preferred you
32:17a Boston College hat, because Boston College,
32:19they beat my alma mater when Kwanye was going.
32:22And so I wanted to give her her props and her respect.
32:25Which is actually, I had it here.
32:27Is this a little obnoxious?
32:28This is like a vintage BC hat that a-
32:30So these are Kwanye and Kwanye.
32:31The victors, it's the crown of victors.
32:34That's what we do.
32:35Only winners wear caps.
32:37So that's why I got mine on.
32:39That's why you got yours on.
32:40And hey, Gary, how you doing?
32:42Well, I was going to wait to bring up the hats
32:44after what I'm about to bring up,
32:46but we don't talk about our personal lives here a lot.
32:49I do want to say I appreciate the two of you
32:52for the support over the last two weeks.
32:54The reason why I was on load management
32:56was because my grandmother passed away,
32:58as you two already know.
32:59But I just want to say thank you for the support,
33:01sending the flowers to the funeral home for my family.
33:04But last night, I was going through photos and videos of her
33:08and I found a picture of her watching a Celtics game
33:12that I wanted to share with you guys.
33:14Look at that.
33:15She had no idea what was going on,
33:16but every time I was in that house,
33:18I would put on some kind of Celtics game,
33:20but just wanted to send some love to her as well.
33:23But also, again, thank you guys
33:25because you guys have really become my family,
33:27whether you like it or not.
33:28And I appreciate you both.
33:30We clown you all the time
33:32because that's what we do.
33:33That's what family do.
33:33And you should.
33:35And it's just, look,
33:37I mean, our hearts were hurt
33:39when we found out about your grandma
33:41and we wanted to absolutely make it clear as day
33:43that we're here and we love you.
33:46But we will clown you.
33:48Of course.
33:50I'm just, I'm amazed that Gary has not mentioned
33:52Chaka Khan once in this episode.
33:55You know, I'm surprised neither of y'all said anything.
33:58Well, it was there.
33:59It was there.
34:00I was just waiting for the moment.
34:03But I feel for you.
34:07We need a bingo card of this podcast,
34:12Michael B. Jordan, Chaka Khan, and others.
34:15Because y'all are annoying.
34:18One of my bucket list items
34:20is to meet Michael B. Jordan one day
34:22and just find a way to get him on the show
34:25for three minutes.
34:26I just need three minutes.
34:28It's going to happen.
34:29It's going to happen.
34:30It is.
34:31But until then, we're A$AP Rocky.
34:33I can't believe you stated that dude like that.
34:37See, I had to wrap this up before this derailed again.
34:40For A$AP Blakely and Gary Washburn,
34:42I'm Kwani Lutus.
34:44Tune in Tuesday.
34:45We'll be back next week to recap that game.
34:47I don't care if you're Michael B. Jordan or D. Jordan.
34:51You ain't Michael B. Jordan.
34:54You're Michael B., not D. Jordan.
34:56You ain't the real Michael Jordan.
34:58All right, we out.
34:59We appreciate y'all.
35:01No, you ain't the real Michael Jordan.