Why We Left the Message - Episode 172 Branham Research - video Dailymotion

William Branham Historical Research

Support the show: https://www.patreon.com/branham   Available on Spotify, Google, and Apple Podcasts: https://william-branham.org/podcast   John Collins and Charles Paisley discuss their personal experiences and reasons for leaving the Branham movement. They reveal the problematic focus on divine healing, which often overshadowed the core gospel message. The episode highlights how the misplaced emphasis on faith healing led to unnecessary suffering and even death among believers, who were often discouraged from seeking medical help.  Charles recounts how the faith healing beliefs particularly during the COVID-19 pandemic, resulted in widespread illness and fatalities within their church. They discuss the historical roots of these beliefs, tracing them back to figures like John Alexander Dowie and F.F. Bosworth, and emphasize how these doctrines continue to harm people today. The episode calls for a critical examination of these teachings and stresses the importance of understanding the true gospel.  Charles' Book: https://www.amazon.com/Come-Out-Her-People-1930-1965/dp/B0CZRMM8WQ   00:00 Introduction 01:10 Personal Decision to Leave 04:00 Observations of Suffering and Death 06:30 Harmful Effects of Faith Healing Beliefs 08:00 Hobart Freeman and Faith Assembly 11:00 Personal Experience with Diabetes 15:00 Doctrines of Dual Atonement and Positive Confession 18:30 Misinterpretation of Scripture 20:00 Demotion of Jesus and Manifested Sons of God 25:00 The Reality of Positive Confession 28:00 Mental Health Issues in the Cult 32:00 Stories of Harmful Preaching 37:00 The Spread of Harmful Doctrines 45:00 COVID-19 and Its Impact on the Church 52:00 Final Thoughts on Faith Healing and the Importance of Medical Help  ______________________ – Support the channel: https://www.patreon.com/branham – Subscribe to the channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCBSpezVG15TVG-lOYMRXuyQ – Visit the website: https://william-branham.org – Follow on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/WilliamBranhamOrg  – Follow on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@william.m.branham – Follow on Twitter: https://twitter.com/wmbhr – Buy the books: https://william-branham.org/site/books

Transcript

00:00:00You

00:00:30Welcome to another episode of the William Branham historical research podcast. I'm your host John Collins

00:00:38The author and founder of William Branham historical research at William dash Branham org and with me

00:00:45I have my co-host

00:00:46researcher minister and friend Charles Paisley the founder of Christian gospel church org and the author of come out of her my

00:00:54people and

00:00:56Together we're examining the history and the intersections in history between William Branham and other key figures that either

00:01:03Influenced or were influenced by the post-world war two healing revivals

00:01:08Well Charles today. We have an episode that really strikes home for me

00:01:13This is really the heart of why I finally decided to leave the message cult of William Branham

00:01:20There were many things along the way, you know

00:01:23We've talked about across the span of our I don't know. It's a hundred episodes. I guess we've done together of

00:01:29The many various reasons why I left there wasn't just one reason

00:01:33But I will say that in making my final decision to bring my family out of it. This was

00:01:40The key that unlocked the door for our exit

00:01:44because as a divine healing cult I

00:01:48Came to realize after stepping back and just thinking about it that the focus on the gospel

00:01:57became second place to the focus on divine healing and

00:02:01I had not yet made the connection that William Branham and FF Bosworth and many of the others

00:02:07Kind of tied those two together in order to be saved

00:02:11You also had to believe in this healing thing and William Branham himself called it the gospel of divine healing

00:02:17And it said he said it just has the same power to save and I never caught things like that

00:02:24but I came to realize that if this were the case if this were the

00:02:30so-called gospel

00:02:32then there's a huge problem because

00:02:35It does not protect the people from death and that became very critical in my deciding to leave because number one

00:02:44We had focused on a false gospel number two, it was a gospel that was weak and powerless and

00:02:52You know as I'm going as I'm forming all of these thoughts in my head

00:02:55I began to just think back through all of the people that I knew

00:03:01Growing up and even even at the time of my exit

00:03:05there were so many people that just were sickly so many people that had died and

00:03:12The the real crux for me was we had a person in our family who struggled with I

00:03:21Think it was a 5% chance of living from cancer

00:03:24It was one of the most devastating cases of cancer that I have ever even read about even still today. It was awful

00:03:32and

00:03:33trying to go to the group and you know, we're desperate for healing for this person and

00:03:41Watching what the leadership did watching their response

00:03:45was

00:03:46it literally opened the door for me to leave because they

00:03:50Knew that when cancer is this bad

00:03:53The chances are very low and they wouldn't touch it like with a 10-foot pole. They they wanted to run and hide and

00:04:01you know rather than banding together in prayer and

00:04:04Now what having seen other churches

00:04:07Watching the community come together as a community of people to support the person who's really suffering in their family

00:04:14They wanted to just sweep it under the rug so that nobody found out that there was this level of

00:04:23Critical issues with their divine healing gospel, you know, there's so much there John and you were you're exactly right

00:04:30and I I find myself John and really in a lot of the same places that you are with what you're saying and

00:04:37It I think we have a lot in common in this aspect because over the years a lot of things had piled up

00:04:42for me in the last few years issues that I noticed here and there with the message, but I

00:04:47Have to say it was the divine healing beliefs

00:04:52in the message and the way that they those things played out during kovat that

00:05:00Really was the

00:05:02Ultimate thing like maybe you might say the straw that broke the camel's back

00:05:07you know as I watched a

00:05:09significant number of people in the message die as a result of their divine healing beliefs their faith healing beliefs that

00:05:17really also

00:05:19Woke me up and it actually made me leave the church. I left the church before I quit believe in the message. I left

00:05:27You know over all of the deaths

00:05:30And then a few months after that I then decided, you know, there was something wrong with the message itself

00:05:37and

00:05:39It is it is a really difficult challenging thing when you begin to encounter

00:05:46The reality of those beliefs and you know as as it happened in

00:05:51That situation as people were dying that we're not supposed to die that was healed and all those other stuff

00:05:57People were dying

00:05:59You know you and you start to wake up you begin to look back and realize oh my goodness

00:06:05There has been a string of this for four years for decades

00:06:08this has been going on all along and somehow the blinders are on that that you and you just can't see it while you're

00:06:14While you're in there and it's so deep

00:06:17But especially once you become, you know in leadership, maybe like me you're behind the scenes, you know everything going on

00:06:23You realize that you know that this is just not right. You know, something is not right here and

00:06:29You know, I think as we've expressed in other episodes, I mean we we definitely still believe God's a healer, you know

00:06:36there it's not denial of miracles or denial of these sort of things to

00:06:41talk this way, but

00:06:44There is something wrong with the beliefs of the message because it harms more people their faith healing beliefs

00:06:52Harm more people than they help

00:06:55I mean that that is just the reality of the situation more people are harmed by these beliefs than are helped and you know

00:07:02There's times I've been in there John

00:07:04I'm sure you could say the same that we have seen things that hey that maybe looks like that was a genuine miracle or that

00:07:10Looks like something that hey something, you know special happened here. I think we could both maybe have seen that from time to time

00:07:17But that's not the typical outcome that is the rare outcome and far more often than not

00:07:25People can end up dying as a result of these beliefs and you know, I think we'll talk about that a little bit today

00:07:33and I

00:07:35think I

00:07:37Think that those videos that you've done with Chino Ross over the past few few months

00:07:42I have really appreciated you doing those John Chino Ross talking about Herbert Freeman from Faith Assembly

00:07:48Those have been terrific videos, and I I hope you do a few more

00:07:53And maybe we can talk about that a little bit today as part of this episode

00:07:57Yeah, the the episodes I'm doing with Chino or eye

00:08:01Opening even for me as I'm talking to him

00:08:04I look at what happened with Hobart Freeman's cult and you know

00:08:09Anybody who has seen the outcome of that realized that it was a total disaster

00:08:14and it again it was built right on top of this William Branham divine healing message called and

00:08:21It it's one of the fruits of the message if you really want to look at it like that

00:08:26It's eye-opening because as we're talking

00:08:29I'm putting together all the pieces together of

00:08:32The all of the things that happened and I that I saw and witnessed in our cult

00:08:37That never really clicked as being

00:08:41you know critical information to that should wake up any person and make them leave and

00:08:47The focus is just so wrong. It warps the individual's mind and

00:08:52You know, there is a difference

00:08:55Hobart Freeman was far more extremist in his views

00:08:58They were not allowed any medication and if you talk to any person in the main sect of the message

00:09:04They'll say well he went off into error because we are allowed medication, but what they don't realize is

00:09:11The way in which the gospel this so-called gospel of divine healing is framed

00:09:17it makes you prefer the

00:09:19the divine healing gospel over the medication in other words

00:09:23You put your faith in faith and that faith takes priority over

00:09:29Medication and in some cases people try to go out on leaps of faith so they will deny themselves the medication

00:09:36And it's even still today. It's really hard for me. If I get a headache, I almost refuse to take Tylenol

00:09:42that's how it's so embedded in my head man, and

00:09:47Another this is somewhat embarrassing, but I'm gonna say it and set the record straight in our very last episode

00:09:54Charles that you and I did together where we're driving around the vehicle. I

00:09:59actually, I thought I had beat diabetes and I I did this very strict diet and

00:10:05According to I've got one of these little blood meters according to the blood meter every time that I checked it morning noon night

00:10:12Any time of the day I was well into the normal range

00:10:16but apparently my body was

00:10:18Dumping loads of sugar from my liver as I slept and so I had no idea

00:10:23That the level of sugar that was in my blood that it wasn't showing up on the meter

00:10:28so I thought I had beat it and

00:10:31Not long not long after we recorded that I went back to the doctor and see this is the difference. I

00:10:38Did not go on a leap of faith and put my faith in faith and healing

00:10:43Claiming that my faith in that faith would

00:10:46Make this secure. I kept going to the doctor and the blood tests were very clear

00:10:51I had I eventually did develop diabetes and

00:10:57Now I just take a little medication and it you know, it's all fine

00:11:01but I have watched people and I'm not going to mention any names as we go in this because I

00:11:07Have respect for the people that are suffering. They were blinded just like I was

00:11:13But there are prominent people in the cult that are related to me and everybody will know who I'm talking about

00:11:21Who have claimed healing ever since I can remember words and

00:11:27They are called upon to give their testimonies. Now. They're I

00:11:32Think the person even regards himself as a preacher now because he has this powerful testimony

00:11:38He grew up with the Branham family. He knows the Branham's and so therefore

00:11:43Anybody who knew the original Branham family they get almost prophet or Apostle status in this cult

00:11:49and

00:11:51Yet this person has suffered. I have watched them suffer so badly that they were in a coma

00:11:58I have watched time and time again where

00:12:03healing was claimed and

00:12:05There was a slight improvement. It may have been mental but then a

00:12:10Catastrophic, I mean

00:12:12devastating failure of healing

00:12:15Would knock the person on

00:12:17Knock them on their butt for weeks sometimes months and

00:12:22Yet they're giving their testimony about this thing in this divine healing cult about this divine healing gospel

00:12:28And it's the cycle that keeps continuing. The person is going to get sick. They're going to fall down

00:12:34they're going to be near death and then rise back up and go give a testimony of how wonderful that it is to be in

00:12:42this message of divine healing and

00:12:45All of the people that they live somewhat isolated now, so all of the people who hear this they think wow

00:12:51This is wonderful that you can ask God for healing and if you put faith in your faith

00:12:58You can be healed because here's a living example

00:13:02But this person is one of the most sickly

00:13:05near death individuals that I I can't even describe how long it's been like this and

00:13:11That's what this gospel is producing

00:13:14You know the the message continues to

00:13:17doctrines that

00:13:19originate in the late

00:13:221800s one is called the doctrine of dual atonement and the others called the doctrine of positive confession now in the message

00:13:31I think people have lost track of what these doctrines are called a really long time ago John as in the message

00:13:36You don't hear people say positive confession or dual atonement, right?

00:13:39But but that's that is what they believe

00:13:41I mean that is widely what they believe and I'll just describe them for you that way

00:13:46Yeah, you know that way the people who don't familiar with those terms know what they mean. Well, well dual atonement is the belief that

00:13:54The death of Christ atoned both for our sins and for our healing

00:13:59And it's rooted in a reading of a verse in the book of Isaiah where Isaiah writes

00:14:07that

00:14:08He was bruised for our iniquity, right?

00:14:10You know that verse and it goes on to say by his stripes were healed and so they take that by his stripes were healed

00:14:18to say that

00:14:20You know the whipping that Jesus endured before he went to the cross was to purchase

00:14:27bodily healing

00:14:29for people in addition to his death on the cross atoned for our sins and

00:14:34so they take that to

00:14:37More or less say that bodily healing is available

00:14:41from Christ, you know through faith and

00:14:46That by itself's maybe not so bad

00:14:48But when you combine it with positive confession

00:14:51That's where it really it really starts to get off the rails and and what I what I would suggest to our listeners to John

00:14:58I mean if you go into the book of Peter Peter actually takes that exact same verse that Isaiah wrote by his stripes were healed

00:15:04And the Apostle Peter actually explains what that verse means from Isaiah and it does not mean bodily healing

00:15:11It's actually spiritual healing. It's forgiveness from sins is what the Apostle Peter explains that verse to mean

00:15:16So I would suggest that people who believe in dual atonement are actually contradicting what the Apostle Peter said about Isaiah's verse

00:15:23But at any rate that's that's a dual atonement, but when you combine it with positive confession, that's where this thing gets

00:15:32It gets ugly it gets dangerous and positive confession is a belief that evolved like I think we've walked through this before it evolved out

00:15:40Of Quimby ism out of new science. It got picked up by the British Israelite healers in the late 1800s

00:15:45John Alexander Dowie and so forth, which is where

00:15:49Bosworth lived which is it was nearby Chicago where Kenyon was at and these people pass it on down into the message

00:15:57this is where those beliefs come from and

00:16:00Positive confession is basically the belief that if you will confess

00:16:07Something and believe it with all your heart and all your soul you can have that thing

00:16:12All right, you can have any promise that God promised you could have but you just got to keep saying I have it

00:16:18I believe it. I have it. I believe it. God gave it to me. It's mine

00:16:22You've got a positively confess with your lips with your mouth that you have and are getting this thing that God promised and

00:16:29then you'll get it and

00:16:32When you take that and you combine it with dual atonement will dual atonement promises you can have healing right?

00:16:37so now I'm positively confessing that I can have healing and

00:16:42So long as I positively confess it I can have it

00:16:45And in fact, I do have it and even though outward symptoms may prove I don't have it

00:16:51You know, maybe it looks like I'm sick. Maybe I feel sick. Maybe I have all these conditions still

00:16:56But the truth is I'm really healed and I'm gonna keep saying I'm healed despite all evidence to the contrary

00:17:03Because if I stop confessing that I have this thing, then I'll definitely never get it

00:17:08then I'll definitely never get it and that's the way positive confession works it forces you to say you have something and

00:17:15Believe that you have it despite all evidence

00:17:19To the contrary

00:17:21Despite all evidence the contrary and this is practiced quite widely in the groups and churches

00:17:27That have been influenced by this ideology. So they'll say I'm healed

00:17:33But they're not really I'm glad you brought up the passage from Isaiah and Peter's

00:17:38Explanation of that. I'm no minister. So I try to avoid the theological positions

00:17:43This one is important and it is one that I will mention from time to time because in the way in which the

00:17:51British Israel theology later Christian identity theology

00:17:56developed within this group it developed such that as

00:18:01This false notion that we are the Lost Ten Tribes of Israel

00:18:06These ministers in the movement would pick and choose verses ripping them out of context from

00:18:13whatever passage they were originally written in usually to Israel and then combine it with something else out of context from the New Testament and

00:18:22Make this concoction of scripture. That's like a witch's brew

00:18:25If you take this verse here plus this verse here you equal magic potion a or magic potion B

00:18:32That's that's how this gospel formed and this passage from Isaiah

00:18:38one of the problems with the way that they have done it is

00:18:42They

00:18:43they largely overlook the fact that there was an old and new covenant because if you're focusing on these passages such as this verse from

00:18:51Isaiah and you try to blend it with a new one

00:18:55you're you're outside of both covenants Isaiah being under the Old Covenant and Peter being under the New Covenant and so

00:19:03It was very difficult for me to grasp the fact that there were

00:19:07Such a thing as a period of time with an Old Covenant and then Jesus

00:19:12Introduced the New Covenant. That's not something that's really widely taught in this movement

00:19:17But Isaiah's when Isaiah talks about by his stripes were healed. He's exactly talking about what Peter spoke about the

00:19:25you know the

00:19:26remission of sins because under that Old Covenant that Isaiah was writing about

00:19:32Israel was suffering because of the consequences of the Old Covenant the breaking of the law

00:19:39That concept was very hard for me to grasp

00:19:43Looking forward after I came out of this once I started to understand that

00:19:47They were trying to blur the lines between the Old and New Covenant

00:19:52this

00:19:53even further became a

00:19:56Solidification of my decision to leave because as a false gospel

00:20:00teaching a false set of covenants said it teaching a false set of

00:20:05Doctrines on healing they also had to introduce doctrines of rules

00:20:11because if you're still bound by the covenant of law, you must have rules for which the law was developed and

00:20:19Therefore taking the entire body of modern Christians and

00:20:23Forcing them under a new law that was neither Old Covenant nor New Covenant

00:20:28And I started going back and you can go to my website and just type in rules

00:20:32I started kind of going back and documenting all of the various rules that we had and then

00:20:39carrying it forward to all of the rules that the splinter groups had that were based off of statements that William Branham said and

00:20:47It it was just ridiculous

00:20:49I mean everything from wearing blue suede shoes was a sin to having washing machines was a sin

00:20:56If you take it back to what William Branham said about it

00:20:59And so I began to realize that it was a false gospel where the weight of salvation

00:21:06Was not only in belief in this divine healing gospel

00:21:11But it was also weights that were placed on our shoulders of these rules that had no purpose other than to be

00:21:20under the control of leadership

00:21:21That's really all it boiled down to and I began to realize if we are placing our salvation on

00:21:28Man-made rules instead of the gospel of Jesus Christ, then we have no salvation

00:21:34What happens, you know in so many of these cases John I've known it personally, right? I mean I as a minister

00:21:40Counseled and with people with this problem when you put

00:21:46Faith in healing and faith in salvation on the same plane

00:21:51Right like dual atonement does if you if you just have faith you're saved if you just have faith you're healed

00:21:58Okay, and this is this is how it's set up in people's minds. I just need faith. I can be saved

00:22:03I just need the same faith. I can be healed

00:22:06what happens is

00:22:08When they

00:22:10Use their faith to be healed and the healing never comes, right?

00:22:15They know the healing never comes then their mind starts to go. I'll oh, I don't have faith

00:22:20I don't have faith and if I didn't have faith to be healed. Well dual atonement

00:22:25It's the same faith that healed me is the same faith to save me. Oh, I must not also be saved

00:22:30and so then it sets up this really

00:22:34terrible thing that happens in these people where

00:22:37When they fail to be healed it triggers this chain reaction where they begin to think oh, oh

00:22:43I'm also not saved and now you take somebody who's experiencing a a

00:22:50condition where they are

00:22:53Suffering in with this terrible

00:22:56condition maybe that's going to take their life and

00:22:59This doctrine has set them up to now believe that because they're not being healed

00:23:04They're also not being saved right and and here they're going to their grave

00:23:10Thinking they're going to hell because they're not being healed, right? And it is

00:23:16What this does is it it puts these people who are in an end-of-life condition?

00:23:25Into this terrible position of internal turmoil where they're wrestling with the fear of going to hell because God's not healing them

00:23:33And this then the reaction the way you react to this in this belief system is you've got to continue to confess

00:23:40The healing I mean to the moment that you die, right?

00:23:43You cannot let your faith go because if you let your faith go

00:23:47It's almost like letting your salvation go and you'll see them to their deathbeds saying I'm healed. I'm healed

00:23:55I'm healed. I'm healed. I'm healed

00:23:59But they're not they're not they're not and they die and then even at the funerals how many of their funerals I've been on

00:24:05I think we even showed some of tombstones in our recent episodes

00:24:09Where they'll still put on their tombstone that they were healed

00:24:11They didn't die or that at the funeral we would even say at the funerals

00:24:16Our brother is healed today. Our sister is healed

00:24:19they're their bodies in the casket and we're saying they're healed at their funerals even and

00:24:25It it's so sad and it's so unfortunate and and what what that actually is, you know, where's that happens

00:24:32you just

00:24:34You know step back and look at it with

00:24:39Reasonable logical thinking here. Okay. Here's somebody who is not healed, but they're saying they are healed

00:24:48What is that? That's dishonesty. That's really what it is, right? You're breaking. This is not positive confession

00:24:54This is false confession, right? It's it's false witness. You're breaking one of the Ten Commandments, right?

00:24:59You're saying I'm healed, but you're not really healed

00:25:01And so so what happens is this really just turns people into liars and it's so sad. That's how hard to say that

00:25:09I mean, I'm sorry out there. I mean if you haven't looked at it that way, I apologize for hurting your feelings

00:25:13But it it what did you're doing is you're lying, right? And if you have a faith healing cult

00:25:20So the message is a doomsday cult

00:25:21It's also a faith healing cult James and I mean the rather a William Branham was a faith healer, right?

00:25:27This turned the people into his accomplices, right? How do you know?

00:25:30How do you know in the message when someone comes to you and says I'm healed

00:25:33How do you know whether that's positive confession or a genuine healing?

00:25:37You don't right?

00:25:39How do we know that all of these?

00:25:41Stories in voice of healing and all these stories that we hear on tape with William Branham

00:25:46How do we know that whether it's positive confession or genuine healing?

00:25:49The truth is we don't right you you can't really tell the difference between a genuine healing and positive confession

00:25:58Just based on the words of people alone

00:26:00And that is how William Branham got so many healing

00:26:04Testimonies and why there are so many healing testimonies in the message today. A lot of it is simply positive confession

00:26:10It's not actually authentic healings. I I would even go so far to say John that maybe

00:26:1690 plus percent of the healing testimonies in the message are actually positive confession and not authentic healings

00:26:23Yeah, I would agree

00:26:24it's it's widespread and people who are in it do not realize it's so widespread because

00:26:31Often when they hear the person who claims I'm healed

00:26:35They only see the claim

00:26:37they don't see what happens behind the scenes and that's

00:26:40Exactly what is going on with the the members of my family who are

00:26:45Proclaiming healed and they have been sick

00:26:48I mean deathly deathly sick for ages long as I can remember as even as a child

00:26:55one of the problems

00:26:57you know, and this is another part of it's a complex reason why I decided to leave but

00:27:02One of the problems with this gospel of divine healing because it was based on Christian identity and British

00:27:10Israelism

00:27:11there was a concept in British Israel ism that developed into what you and I have

00:27:16explored and

00:27:18Documented called the manifested sons of God and this was a very heretical very dangerous

00:27:25awful group of

00:27:27People subscribed to a doctrine that they they could become like gods

00:27:31And when you talk to them the main body of the message movement

00:27:36Many of them will deny this they will say that we do not believe that that's heretical those people are dangerous

00:27:43They're weird. And I mean Mike Bickle his group believed the manifested sons of God. They learned it through Paul Cain

00:27:49Paul Cain learned it through Branham Branham learned it through the British Israel doctrine and

00:27:55To believe this doctrine to is to its full extent

00:27:58You have to demote the power of Jesus so that you can elevate the power of humans

00:28:04And that was a concept that was very hard for me to grasp and it took you know

00:28:08Even long after I left I didn't fully understand that. I just knew something was wrong

00:28:14because they would often go to

00:28:17they would go to verses that were just completely ripped out of context such as

00:28:23Thy faith has made thee whole you'll hear them. You'll hear that phrase over and over and over in these sermons and it's

00:28:30Advocating for the notion that faith and faith can heal you and

00:28:34That's this only works with the manifested sons of God framework because if you go back to that example and read it in context

00:28:43It's not the faith and the faith that has healed the person

00:28:46It's their faith in Jesus and his connection to God that has healed them

00:28:51Well in the manifested sons of God framework, you don't have to have God because we're all gods

00:28:58Well, we all have this greater or lesser

00:29:02fulfillment of the being of the embodiment of Christ and

00:29:06literally

00:29:07The phrase that is often used also from the Bible is is it not said that you're gods though?

00:29:13They'll combine those two together and you have to demote

00:29:18Jesus to promote these apostles and prophets and

00:29:22widespread

00:29:24Advocation for this manifested sons of God framework and I just Charles I just came to the place where I could not

00:29:32justify

00:29:33Demoting Jesus so that I could be more like God. I realized that that's wrong

00:29:40what they're doing in this in this movement is wrong and

00:29:44Carry it forward to my research today

00:29:47look at the sheer number of

00:29:49Different groups that we've identified. I mean we just mentioned Mike Bickle, but it's more widespread than Mike Bickles group

00:29:56Look at the widespread

00:29:58heresy that was introduced by this because all of these

00:30:02So-called apostles and prophets and all of their quote-unquote Joel's army that they developed

00:30:08all of these people are falling under that same air and

00:30:12I realized that

00:30:14For me for my family we could not live like this

00:30:18Have you ever wondered how the Pentecostal movement started or how the progression of modern Pentecostal ism

00:30:25transition through the latter reign

00:30:27Charismatic and other fringe movements into the new apostolic Reformation

00:30:31You can learn this and more on William Branham historical researches website

00:30:36William dash Branham org on the books page of the website

00:30:40You can find the compiled research of John Collins Charles Paisley

00:30:45Stephen Montgomery John MacKinnon and others with links to the paper audio and digital versions of each book

00:30:53You can also find resources and documentation on various people and topics related to those movements

00:30:59If you want to contribute to the cause you can support the podcast by clicking the contribute button at the top

00:31:05and as always

00:31:07Be sure to LIKE and subscribe to the audio or video version that you're listening to or watching

00:31:12On behalf of William Branham historical research, we want to thank you for your support

00:31:18This belief set has spread far and wide. I mean this it's not just the message

00:31:23I mean most every movement that's descended out of either the latter reign or the healing revivals in the 40s and 50s

00:31:30Believe this way, you know in some degree or another some of them go to a greater extreme than others, right?

00:31:36And I think Hobart Freeman's group faith assembly is a is a great example of one that went to a great extreme because they got

00:31:44To the point that they believe

00:31:46Also that you never go to a doctor. God will always heal you and if you die

00:31:50It's because you didn't have faith right there. They get to the point that they even completely

00:31:55drop all medical treatment and

00:31:58That also is somewhat

00:32:00Happens from time to time in certain message groups and with certain individuals in the message that they take those beliefs to the same extent

00:32:06That they also will not take medical treatment and I do think it's worth pointing out

00:32:12I know you did a good job of this in the episode with Chino Ross, but

00:32:17Hobart Freeman and faith assembly his faith assembly are definitely an evolution out of the beliefs of the message and I

00:32:25Don't know John that I have ever said this on the podcast series, but I'll say it right now

00:32:29The sect of the message I come from is called faith assembly

00:32:35and

00:32:36The majority of the churches in my sect of the message are called faith assembly, right?

00:32:41And it's not a coincidence that Hobart Freeman's church was called faith assembly

00:32:45And you know, I think I've shared with you the audio clips

00:32:48We had a brother Hobart in our church in the in the late 60s and early 70s

00:32:52and you know, I don't know that it's the same Hobart that was before my time, but

00:32:56You know Hobart Freeman lived like five to ten miles away from our church in the late 60s

00:33:02Right in the same years that we had a brother Hobart, you know

00:33:05Is it that a coincidence that we had a brother Hobart at our faith?

00:33:09Assembly who a few years later went to Warsaw and established another faith assembly, you know, I don't know

00:33:14But we do know he was around a lot of our people, right?

00:33:17We do know that he was near the brand of tabernacle. We know he came into contact with the message

00:33:21We know he was associated with the full gospel businessman

00:33:23He was definitely in the same circles that our preachers were and you seen what happened there

00:33:28They got to the point that they stopped even believing in

00:33:32going and having medical trip medical treatment of any sort and

00:33:36The death toll was I believe I believe I've heard 125 to 150 was the death toll that ensued in that church

00:33:45but John that is not that that's maybe a

00:33:49Big number, you know an extreme number, but I would say

00:33:53That many or more have died in in the faith assembly churches

00:33:56I come from to write and we have our beliefs were not quite that extreme where we denied all medical treatment

00:34:02but it's very common for our people to

00:34:05refuse or to limit medical treatment and

00:34:09We had I could I could go through I thought of a variety different stories. I could tell you about people who

00:34:17Died as a result of our faith healing beliefs in in our sect of the message and maybe as you go along

00:34:24Maybe I share a couple of those more recent ones with people

00:34:28Just explain how this this belief is is all over the message and it ends up manifesting with people suffering and dying

00:34:36Prematurely it is really the sad reality of it

00:34:39Right. It's it's awful when you think of the number of people who have died

00:34:43I mean not just Hobart Freeman not just William Branham, but look at the history of this thing

00:34:50My research has gone back so far as John Alexander Dowie

00:34:54who is labeled as quote God's general and

00:34:59You know as I'm trying to

00:35:02Understand how this gospel this false gospel came to be. I wanted to know its origin its origin

00:35:09I want to know the source. So I went from Branham that led me into Bosworth

00:35:13I saw Bosworth's doctrine and I want to know where did Bosworth get it and lo and behold

00:35:19He was a leader in the John Alexander Dowie cult of the Christian Catholic Church

00:35:24I think they called themselves out of Zion, Illinois, and I just started going through newspapers and I had a

00:35:32interview on Daniel Long's channel

00:35:35And we were talking about how many of these articles to read I read every single one of them

00:35:40And if you go to newspapers.com, you'll find that there are tens of that maybe hundreds of thousands of articles

00:35:49Alexander Dowie, I read every single one of them across the span of several years and I

00:35:55Came to understand that he was not God's general. This guy was

00:36:00Even worse than a con man. This was like the Christian mafia and he was the Christian mob boss

00:36:05but they were whisking away bodies under the

00:36:09Blanket of night, but they had a had collaborated with the undertaker

00:36:14So the undertaker would drive the hearse into the night

00:36:18Snatch a body out of there who had died in these so-called healing homes and then the public, you know

00:36:24They they didn't see this

00:36:26so they did not see the suffering and death that was happening in this cult and I began to tie that back to

00:36:33The experiences that I have with family close friends people

00:36:38acquaintances

00:36:39These people proclaimed healing and I knew their private lives. I knew how badly they suffered

00:36:47Like you said out outright lying

00:36:50They would say I'm healed and then they would go home and be near death

00:36:54And some of them did die. I mean, that's how bad this was

00:36:57but

00:36:58The people who are in this movement who don't see what's happening day to day in the private lives

00:37:04They think wow, this is wonderful. This person had a deadly disease and now they're healed

00:37:10100% healed they often say

00:37:12But they're not there these people suffer

00:37:15You know, I thought of one story I would share John

00:37:19Just just kind of how this works in the churches I come from and this story is about my grandfather actually so

00:37:25family story

00:37:26My grandfather was on blood thinner for 50 years, right?

00:37:31he was in his 80s when he passed away, but he was on blood thinner for 50 years and

00:37:37He had a he had a risk of stroke and

00:37:40When he got into his in the last few years of his life

00:37:44He started to develop some mild Alzheimer's type dementia and he was he was in a very mild state, you know

00:37:51His judgment just wasn't quite right, but he was still lucid enough. He knew who we were

00:37:56He could talk to us, you know, and and he could do that, you know the things to to live from day to day

00:38:01And so as he's in that condition

00:38:04We have a preacher and he gets up and he preaches

00:38:08how

00:38:10He is never gonna take his blood thinner medicine ever again, this preacher says the doctor told me I need this blood thinner

00:38:16Well, I don't need this blood thinner

00:38:18I'm healed by God praise the Lord and and he and the blood thinner in question was plavix

00:38:23And so he's whole sermon is why God

00:38:27Doesn't need him to take plavix because God's gonna heal him, right and he just rips plavix to pieces all through his sermon plavix

00:38:34We don't need plavix. I don't need plavix. God's healed me if I take that again, why would I do that to demonstrate?

00:38:39I don't have faith. So he goes on this big long spiel

00:38:42Against plavix in his sermon that happened to be the same

00:38:47Blood thinner my grandfather was taken

00:38:50well

00:38:51My grandparents go home. Like I said, my grandfather's got some mild dementia

00:38:56And what do you think he does?

00:38:58He quits taking his plavix because the preacher said we don't need plavix for about, you know about a month later

00:39:05He took a terrible stroke John

00:39:07That that medicine was actually there to prevent

00:39:11He went into a nursing home. He never knew who he was again after that. He never recovered from that stroke and he eventually died

00:39:21The those are the sort of things that happen in the message right now my grandfather was elderly, right?

00:39:26I mean he would have passed away eventually he had he did have you know dementia, right?

00:39:31And you know who's to say maybe some of that wouldn't have happened anyway, but you know in my opinion

00:39:35I mean, I think the preacher who preached against that medicine has some responsibility in that situation, right?

00:39:41And I could share so many stories like that, but that's one of my own stories. It's my own family

00:39:46I feel okay to tell that story, but it's really sad

00:39:51What these beliefs do?

00:39:53To people and and it breaks my heart sometimes just to even talk about it to think about it. It's really hard

00:40:00and you know in this type of

00:40:02cult religion

00:40:04There are a lot of mental health issues and I can't stress enough the importance of focusing on

00:40:10Helping those who have the mental health

00:40:14Issues it's widespread. I've I know many people who friends of mine family of mine

00:40:22Acquaintances and I went from churches from Arizona to South Carolina and everywhere in between

00:40:27I know many many people who suffer with mental health issues

00:40:31Some of them really really severe and

00:40:34in

00:40:36This type of gospel you are taught to deny

00:40:41deny anything that resembles

00:40:44something that

00:40:45Your body is suffering with so you deny the mental health issues and in doing so you have to deny the people who need help

00:40:52from their mental health issues with their mental health issues

00:40:56and they'll often deny the medication for it and

00:40:59This becomes very problematic because if if the mental health issue is so severe

00:41:06That the person cannot remain stable without medication and you're trying to convince them not to take the medication

00:41:13Well, then it goes into the cycle that it repeats forever. I know personally

00:41:19People who my grandfather from behind the pulpit

00:41:23would talk about how how bad they had gotten and then

00:41:28After they got the medication they got quote-unquote healed and everybody in the church was praising God because

00:41:35You know grandpa didn't really mention the fact that the person got their medic got it back on their meds

00:41:40he also didn't mention the time whenever they went off of their meds and

00:41:45So they relapsed and often relapse far worse than they had to begin with but they go through this cycle

00:41:53Now people with mental health issues

00:41:55Often there is a struggle to get them to take their meds

00:41:58But compound that with a cult who is trying to teach you that you don't need the meds

00:42:04So in the back of their mind as they're suffering their suffering becomes

00:42:09exponentially greater because they teach them not to take the meds and

00:42:13it's it's so problematic Charles because

00:42:16These the quality of life that these people could have if they were to be on their meds is

00:42:22Completely robbed of them and then

00:42:26Make it even worse the cult

00:42:30Demonizes anything that resembles mental health issues to the extent that if somebody leaves the message

00:42:36They will actually tell them they'll actually tell all the people that that person has a mental health issue

00:42:41and that's why they left and they they further demonize the the mental health rather than

00:42:47Saying that if the people were to go to the doctor and get what they need to make their body chemistry, right?

00:42:54The person could have a normal life

00:42:57And this is not centralized to just the Branham cult. We actually went to I'm not going to mention the name

00:43:03But we went to a mainstream denomination

00:43:07after leaving the cult and

00:43:09They had somehow got a hold of this

00:43:12Latter rain ideology that Branham had taught and they claimed that

00:43:17If a person had mental health issue, it was because they needed

00:43:21They needed intervention from their pastor because they had

00:43:25Alleged sin in their life and they were actually convincing people who had

00:43:31issues that could be

00:43:33Resolved with medication not to take their medication and this was in a mainstream denomination

00:43:39So it's not limited to the message

00:43:41But all of this developed from this framework that you and I have examined on this, you know on this podcast

00:43:48they have put such faith in faith that they have taken away faith in the gospel and

00:43:54I just can't picture a gospel where it is designed that people should suffer

00:44:01I can't picture that being any of any value whatsoever

00:44:05So our family just decided we no longer value this false gospel the gospel of Jesus Christ is so simple

00:44:13You know once once I finally heard it after leaving the cult. I was like why on earth did they hide this from us?

00:44:19It's so simple and it's I mean you can live a good life

00:44:23You can have a happy life and you're gonna have struggles. That's part of life

00:44:27But why would I want to focus on a false gospel like this? I

00:44:31Know what you mean?

00:44:32I and you know, I look at people like my my grandfather who was in the message since William Branham

00:44:39The message sent my grandfather to an early grave John listening to the message preacher sent

00:44:44My grandfather to an early grave is in my opinion and I've seen that with so many people so many people and you know

00:44:50I thought of another couple other stories. I might share. I'll give you another one

00:44:54This is the story John when I actually exited the church. I was in where I was the associate pastor

00:44:59And

00:45:01The same preacher who had preached against, you know, the blood thinner medicine with my grandfather situation a

00:45:08lot of other things similar to that

00:45:11Unfolded and I started to become aware at when it happened with my grandfather that kind of woke me up like, you know

00:45:17Hey, we got to be careful with what we're saying, you know

00:45:19Cuz there's people here who are gonna act out on it maybe in a bad way

00:45:24And you know, I tried to talk to him about that a few times

00:45:27but you know, he just kept you know doing the same stuff, you know without really caring about the consequences and

00:45:34When we got into kovat John

00:45:39Most message churches, I don't think they even followed any of the kovat protocols, right?

00:45:43But our church we follow the kovat protocols

00:45:46We we basically had half the people come one service half come the other service. We spaced everybody out, right?

00:45:53Social distancing and we went for several months into kovat like that and we never spread kovat through the church, right?

00:46:00Because the guidelines actually worked right you wear a mask you social distance

00:46:07It actually worked, right? So we did that for I would say maybe six months and

00:46:14Then about six months in the same preacher who you know had preached against medicines in those different ways

00:46:20He preaches a sermon from the book of Isaiah and and he goes to the verses in Isaiah that says, you know

00:46:25The plague will never I'm sorry, not Isaiah the book of Psalms. The plague will never come nigh your door and

00:46:31He takes that and he and he says in that this is almost a direct quote the bride of Christ cannot get kovat

00:46:37God will protect us. The plague will never come nigh our door and and he does some very common message things

00:46:44He says the best place for a sick person is at church because church is where you can get healed, right?

00:46:49I've you've probably heard things similar to that and

00:46:53So the next church service well all the sick people start coming right the people who are sick no longer quarantining they're coming to church and

00:47:02One week after that John one week after that

00:47:07168 people came down with kovat in our church

00:47:10168 people we were we are a large church and I I don't know if you know

00:47:13I mean our church was the largest Jeffersonville message church John

00:47:17Sorry for tabernacle we had y'all beat back then but anyways we had

00:47:23It's not anymore. I can tell you that but

00:47:26168 people out of our congregation got got the kovat and you know, that was you know, certainly less than half the people but

00:47:35We had multiple fatalities John multiple fatalities came out of that

00:47:40All kinds of elderly people were had to be hospitalized. It was really really bad

00:47:45It was so bad we had to close the church and

00:47:50With the with the with the hospitalization with the fatalities and stuff

00:47:53I mean it I have say that really got to me because I in my mind realized hey

00:47:57It was this preachers actions two weeks before this that caused all this to happen, right?

00:48:03We were fine up until then and it was definitely his actions and people

00:48:07Believing what he said and and following along with it the cause what happened and then

00:48:13After we opened the church back up about three four weeks later

00:48:17He preaches again the same preacher John and he announces that

00:48:22His parents his elderly parents have had kovat

00:48:26Kovat been in their house. They're sick and that his elderly mother. They're refusing to give her any medical treatment

00:48:33The doctors have said she should be hospitalized etc. They're refusing to hospitalize her. They're not going to give her medical treatment

00:48:39not gonna give her medical treatment and

00:48:42That was the event John which really I'm like, oh my goodness

00:48:46They're killing this woman and she did John she died that lady died when they denied her that medical treatment

00:48:52And that was really kind of the breaking point. I'm like, I can't go along with this anymore

00:48:57I mean for God's sake we're killing people, you know, we're killing people and that's the point at which I

00:49:02Exited the church I was in I didn't quit believing the message. But yeah the message app these beliefs absolutely come out of the message

00:49:09and people will

00:49:12Kill their own parents for God's sake. I mean, it's unbelievable John. It is unbelievable. It is unbelievable and

00:49:20Your church was not isolated in this

00:49:22I know that I've been to churches a variety of

00:49:26different belief sets that are all built on this framework that we're talking about and

00:49:31whenever this happens in one of these churches the rest of the churches is just kind of

00:49:36You know

00:49:37Cut them off. They'll say they went off in the air because it's undeniable the error that happened in the church

00:49:44But before they cut them off, you know, they're they're really no different

00:49:48That's that's really the key thing to understand

00:49:51It's no different and if you take this across not just the Branham religion

00:49:55But go to all of the splinter groups that develop from this. They all have the same foundation

00:50:01there are varying levels of how much they

00:50:03Accept and reject within this false gospel

00:50:07But the key elements of the false gospel are largely adopted among all of the splinter groups

00:50:14And so the danger

00:50:17Remains no matter which one of the splinter groups you look at, you know, they may not be hyper destructive now

00:50:25But they have the same framework. And so what happens is over time all it takes is one person who becomes

00:50:32You know authoritarian in the group to develop it into a very destructive and as you've you know

00:50:39examined very deadly group, so for me, I you know, I

00:50:44wish there were laws that

00:50:47prevented these these types of groups from emerging in the United States under the way that the

00:50:54Constitution and the

00:50:56You know article as a written

00:50:57There's no way that this can happen because there is a church separation of church and state and the state can't get involved

00:51:04But I wish that that was not the case

00:51:07I wish that there was a way to govern this to protect the people if nothing else

00:51:13Because all it takes like I said, it's just one person to get

00:51:17Sort of a authoritarian mind and lead people to their deaths

00:51:21Yeah, all right and it has happened, you know

00:51:24The Faith Assembly Church is plural in the state of Indiana have killed hundreds of people

00:51:29They write in I mean, it's documented the Health Department has intervened at different times in the past

00:51:34It and it's it's really unfortunate

00:51:37I got one more story John. I'm gonna share one more story. Okay, so we're following the we're following the kovat train

00:51:45so

00:51:47This one comes after this one's not all that long ago

00:51:49this is after I have done left the message that this one happens and I had multiple people from the church who are still my

00:51:55Friends that talked to me call and share the story with me here. Not too terribly long ago

00:52:00Well the the pastor, so this is a different preacher

00:52:04gets a prayer shawl a Jewish prayer shawl and

00:52:08he's got it around his shoulders and

00:52:11He invites everyone to come be healed and in this he's impersonating Jesus he goes

00:52:17He reads the scripture about the woman with the issue of the blood have she touched the hem of his garment and was healed

00:52:22And so he's got on a prayer shawl

00:52:23he says this is like what Jesus wore and you can come touch the hem of his garment the hem of the preacher's garment and

00:52:30be healed and so he invites everyone to come touch the hem of his the preacher's garment and be healed and

00:52:37So they they form lines and the entire church more or less comes around touches the you know

00:52:44The hymns of his prayer shawl and as all this is happening. He's saying

00:52:48They're singing only believe right? Obviously, they're singing only believe

00:52:53and

00:52:55Is it and the whole time? He's also saying only believe only believe everyone that touches him only believe only believe

00:53:00So they're practicing only believe ism, right?

00:53:03and so the whole church files past everybody gets

00:53:08everybody gets all of the

00:53:11Only believe ism healing touching the hem of his garments. What do you think happens?

00:53:16They all got kovat again

00:53:20Instead of getting healed John he gave they all got kovat again because they are spreading the kovat on the prayer shawl to everybody

00:53:27And they had to close the church again

00:53:30It's unbelievable the stuff I mean, it's unbelievable John

00:53:34It's unbelievable the things that go on and people just don't wake up from this stuff. It is unbelievable

00:53:40I lost really good friends and family to kovat. It's it's no joke and I have

00:53:47Through the work I'm doing with James

00:53:50Goat as we're going through these weird doctrines one day

00:53:53We decided to just go through and see what people were saying in these movements about kovat and

00:53:59Everything from the brand of mites to the NAR. They're all teaching a very destructive very dangerous doctrine

00:54:06They place emphasis on

00:54:09prophecy dreams

00:54:11Healing even just casual statements by ministers

00:54:14they they place that above the medication and there were entire churches that taught that the medication was

00:54:21They they were teaching the conspiracy theories, which I'm certain you've heard from behind the pulpit of how

00:54:27they you know, the government was injecting the mark of the beast into your bloodstream and all kinds of weird stuff man and

00:54:36It's just so problematic because they have taken the false gospel and they've they're toying with the people's lives and they've brought death

00:54:44this movement is a movement that is a harbinger of death and

00:54:49You know, I can't I can't stress enough this is the this is why we left this is why we left the message

00:54:56But there are people still in it and my heart bleeds

00:55:00For the people who are suffering in it because they could live good lives

00:55:05they could live healthy fulfilled lives if they were not under the false gospel and

00:55:11If you're a researcher and you're listening to this and you want to see the true

00:55:16Depths of how bad that a false gospel can lead you this is it

00:55:22this is how it can lead you to death and I just I can't stress enough how bad this is a

00:55:29Lot of people when they research cults they go to the extremes like they'll look at Jim Jones

00:55:33Who was a part of Branham's message called?

00:55:37The he led all those people to death and it was it was a disaster. Don't get me wrong

00:55:42But they often focus on that type of event because it makes the news and not the day-to-day

00:55:48heresy that's being taught like this that

00:55:51Honestly Charles if you take the number of people that have died due to this false gospel

00:55:56It actually is worse than Jonestown. That's how bad this is

00:56:01so

00:56:02For me, you know, I I couldn't do it. I couldn't stay in this thing. I would agree with you John

00:56:07I mean the number of deaths that have come from the faith healing practices of the message and

00:56:15I'll say people who believe in a combination of dual atonement and positive confession, you know

00:56:21By themselves, you know, they're not too bad

00:56:24But when you put them together, it's it's a cocktail that it does kill people and it's it's killed people from it's been killing people

00:56:31From the 1800s John. I mean with it we can track them through the newspapers these deaths

00:56:35And those are just the ones that made the press, you know, it's it's it's probably a

00:56:41number that would

00:56:43Be unfathomable to us that have died that it just never got noticed by anybody with these things. I mean John I don't I

00:56:52It's a massive massive number of people that that these that these beliefs have killed prematurely

00:56:58And it's so sad and so unfortunate and you know, I think I do want to say again, you know

00:57:04Certainly, I believe God heals God's a healer right and but the problem with these beliefs is it it

00:57:12Well, what one preacher I heard would say is it turns God into a vending machine, right?

00:57:16You go up and you punch the buttons with the right combination and you get what you want

00:57:20But it's don't it don't work that way, right? I mean you can't faith your way into anything

00:57:26You can't faith your way into healing unless God wants you to have healing and it's not always that God wants to heal people

00:57:33right, I mean

00:57:35Correct me if I'm wrong, but every person who has ever lived including Jesus Christ himself

00:57:40With the exception of I guess Elijah and Enoch have died, right? I mean

00:57:44Everybody that has ever been born

00:57:47Except Elijah and Enoch according to the Bible is has died right and that trend is not going to change right?

00:57:54In the current paradigm, right? That's not gonna change. Okay, so

00:57:59It's inevitable. God does not heal everybody. Everybody has died

00:58:03okay, and so

00:58:04You just can't add those things up and make them work out the way that that these belief systems put them put it together

00:58:10And it it's really sad. It's really unfortunate and it leads to the deaths of

00:58:15Premature deaths of many many people and and torturous

00:58:19Lives that these people live I'd have so many times John that you know

00:58:23I would be counseling people as a minister and one of these other ministers who is more into faith healing

00:58:28I guess than I was has convinced them to give up their medication and have faith and they're living

00:58:35With all of these conditions that if they just take the pill, right it would help but they have went

00:58:41You know, I had one lady one time come to me and she said

00:58:45I've had so much faith this past year since I quit taking my medication because this preacher what he said

00:58:51But I haven't got any better and and she's crying and she's weeping

00:58:54You know of the pain that she's suffering the things that she's suffering and just cannot understand why her faith

00:59:00Was not enough to heal her right and it's so hard to just to tell people like that

00:59:06You have been snookered. You've been snookered right? You've been tricked. You've been fooled

00:59:11Go take your medicine, right?

00:59:13Obviously God does not want to heal you right now

00:59:16Go take your medicine right and it's not a lack of faith to take your medicine and it's so sad and you know to say

00:59:21These things by the cult we come from John would be branded as the worst heretics there ever was. Oh my goodness

00:59:26you're unbelievers, you don't believe in divine healing all this stuff, but

00:59:30the sad truth is John these people have been tricked and it is

00:59:35Harming and killing people so sad so sad

00:59:39It is sad and in summary if I were to sum this podcast episode up in six words

00:59:45It is come out of her my people

00:59:48so

00:59:49Get Charles book come out of her my people if you've enjoyed our show and you want more information

00:59:54You can check us out on the web

00:59:56You can find us at William dash Branham org and Christian gospel church org for an overview of the historical research

01:00:04of William Branham in the healing revivals read preacher behind the white hoods a critical examination of William Branham and his message

01:00:12available on Amazon Kindle and audible

01:00:49You

01:01:19You

Why We Left the Message - Episode 172 Branham Research

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