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Transcript
00:00Howard joins us now on the River Islands guest line. What's going on my man? How are you?
00:05Gentlemen doing well. How are you? We're fantastic. You know, I was just looking at this story where the Sixers have announced
00:12That Paul George is out for the year and he's going to have surgery
00:17And things are just not going well with the knee and it made me think boy
00:21What could have been with this great golden state warrior story that we're looking at now
00:27If they had been able to acquire Paul George in the offseason like they were trying so hard to do
00:35They were I mean, I think there was a limit that they had my understanding is like
00:40It obviously the Warriors did pursue him. I don't know how far they were willing to go
00:45I mean, I think one way of looking at the the failed pursuit is that
00:50They had a line that they weren't gonna cross, you know, and then you know, obviously Paul George had something to say about it, too
00:56But
00:58however that
00:59unfolded
01:00You know, they the Warriors came into the season with options and and it was interesting when they started the season with all the depth
01:08And all these players, you know, you know running 12 13 deep and and it was you know
01:13So, you know the strength in numbers revival kind of thing
01:15but you always knew like if they could if they could consolidate some of this stuff and
01:20Get another impact player that was going to be the real path forward because yeah
01:24You can only put so much on Steph's shoulders, especially at this age
01:28So like I think they played this right like it was right to pursue Paul George on some level
01:33And it was right to pursue Lowry marketing on some level
01:36It was right to have certain lines that you wouldn't cross to get them because they both
01:40You know had some limitations and it was right to kind of go into the season still having a lot of options
01:45even though
01:47Yeah in another in another
01:49Timeline, maybe this doesn't go this way and maybe Jimmy Butler ends up somewhere else or what if he doesn't force his way out?
01:55You know, there's always a gazillion of these sliding doors moments in the NBA
01:58but I think
02:00You know Mike Dunleavy and his staff have done a really good job of doing this smartly where they didn't rashly pull the trigger
02:06Anything left themselves options and then you you just hope to be in a position to make the right deal when it comes
02:12Becomes available and that's that's what happened with getting Jimmy Butler
02:17And it seemed like they were all in on trying to get Kevin Durant until Kevin Durant had some cold feet about the deal
02:23And then Jimmy Butler ostensibly fell in their lap
02:26It is serendipitous in many ways that they got Jimmy Butler
02:30But could you have imagined that it would have worked out this well this fast?
02:36Yeah, I mean it sounds ridiculous for me to say yes, but I kind of I
02:42There was some but I don't remember when I did this with and I don't remember if it was in in print as one of
02:47Like our roundups of our staff or if it was on the podcast
02:49I was advocating for Jimmy to the Warriors at least a year ago. I swear. This is true
02:54um, you know because I always thought that the heat and Jimmy had run their course and
02:59I took some flack from heat fans and from other people in Jimmy's orbit of a couple different junctures because I kept saying I
03:06Just think that this thing is over and it makes more sense for him to be somewhere else
03:10Partially also too because like Jimmy there's a lot that Jimmy Butler can do for a team
03:16But he's best as a complimentary star and not the leading star and that's not a knock on him
03:20That's in fact praise because he's so malleable as a player
03:24He's got the talent to do a lot of things including lead you on a given night
03:27But night in night out, he's not the guy who wants to be, you know, carrying a 30 35 percentage uses rate
03:34He's he's best. I mean he got them to two finals, which is incredible
03:38It is a real testament to him and to the heat but
03:42Jimmy as as co-star to Steph and Draymond and once upon a time clay when he was still there
03:47Like that always made a lot of sense to me
03:49And so no, I'm not shocked by all of this like what I've expected, you know
03:54We don't winning 12 out of 13 or whatever and and how great they've been like I don't know that I would predict that but
04:00I'm not surprised that he fit in so well. He's a super smart player and
04:05So are the two stars that he just joined and it's just lifted their their team IQ and
04:11Jimmy is one of those rare stars where he doesn't need the ball every possession. He's not demanding touches and shots
04:17He's going to make the right play every time and he's a low turnover guy
04:23Added to a team that is a often a high turnover team
04:26But he's just helped fix a lot of things and he's just such an easy fit
04:30Howard we're in such a honeymoon period with it right now that I I think warrior fans are struggling to understand why it
04:38Has ended in a bumpy way in all of his previous stops
04:43Is is that just because it's the honeymoon period or or do you think that this one?
04:48Is that kind of a fit where where maybe it will work out nicely. I
04:53Think Jimmy is to an extent a victim of his own
04:56Actions in terms of perception because I think his history is not quite as messy as people believe it to be
05:03He he's a 30th overall pick in Chicago
05:07Nothing expected of him grows into stardom or budding stardom in Chicago
05:12But they they're you know, there's a lot that comes with that
05:15So they traded him like Jimmy Butler enforces. We had a Chicago. They traded him to Minnesota, Minnesota
05:20Obviously with the clash with their young stars somewhat understandable
05:24Wiggins in towns, you know needed somebody to kind of mold them a little bit
05:29But they didn't want to be molded and Jimmy also wanted a big contract extension that the Timberwolves weren't willing to give
05:36So it went south there because of that Philly was fine, but Philly chose Tobias Harris over Jimmy Butler
05:43For many number of reasons. So again, like he didn't it didn't end messy messily in Philly
05:48and then in Miami like, Minnesota, he wanted an extension that the team wasn't willing to give and
05:55This is not to excuse anything that that Butler has done in a couple of these stops
05:59But it's not been a complete disaster or or you know bridges burned on every exit
06:06It's it's really just two. It's, Minnesota and Miami
06:09So and the Warriors the first thing they did in trading for him was give him the extension that Miami wouldn't
06:15So what there's nothing for him to complain about
06:18He can be headstrong, yes, he is a big personality. Yes, but he's joining a team that's got four championships and
06:24two Hall of Famers like yeah, I
06:27Not I didn't have a lot of the concerns that a lot of other people might have about his fit there
06:33Yeah, and the fit has been unbelievable mark talked about the honeymoon period and I can't help but think about what happens after the honeymoon
06:40Where you get into April and maybe even of the playoffs if things continue in this direction
06:45Do you see the Warriors now as a viable dangerous team in the Western Conference?
06:50Yeah, absolutely
06:53We have at the ringer tomorrow a day staff survey of
06:57basically like who should cause the Thunder concern in the West and it's a really interesting and difficult question because
07:04You know the Thunder are so far away the best team in the West by record by net rating by whatever metric you want to
07:10Apply and it's been a the kind of thing in the West where the West is really deep
07:14There's a lot of good teams
07:15But there's really not been one clear number two team if the Thunder are number one in the West and they are
07:22Like is it it who's next best? Is it Denver?
07:25You know one point you would have said well Dallas get the benefit of the doubt of the defending Western Conference champs
07:30Well Dallas took them out of took themselves out of that discussion
07:34The Timberwolves looked, you know dead for a long time. They've kind of revived themselves recently. Could they be a threat?
07:41The no one takes the Rockets serious seriously because they're young and they don't really have a go-to guy
07:47People still aren't quite sure what to make of the Grizzlies
07:49And so I look at the Warriors and the Lakers, you know
07:53Who coincidentally the two teams that have the two faces of the last, you know?
07:5815 years of the league and LeBron and Steph two teams that both added stars at the deadline Luka and Jimmy Butler and
08:05Those are the two teams that I look at and think if I'm the Thunder
08:07I'm not sure the Thunder fear anybody, but if I'm worried about anybody as I'm looking down the bracket
08:12It's the team that has you know
08:16LeBron and Luka or the team that has Steph Jimmy and Draymond because those are the teams that have all the playoff experience in
08:23the world and championship
08:25experience and
08:27You know are just really solid
08:28So I'm the Lakers and Warriors both despite, you know, and then Warriors case in particular a pretty jagged season early on
08:36But um, you know if LeBron's healthy the Lakers are in this discussion and as long as the Warriors are healthy they're in this discussion
08:43Okay, so Howard back the ringer with us here on Willard and Dibbs
08:46What about if we asked a similar question kind of a different way from the perspective of?
08:52The Warriors which is is there a team that they don't want to see for matchup reasons?
09:01LeBron and Luka. Yeah, I agree with you Howard
09:06Yeah, I mean which listen I love that that can be the answer because
09:11You know, we don't know how many more years we're getting of these guys, right?
09:14like we got to appreciate them while we still have them and LeBron and Steph are both still playing at a really high level and
09:19What have we been talking about the last couple of years with these guys if they could just get some help if they could?
09:24Just you know
09:25Be able to be put in a position where they can make another run, but they can't do it on their own
09:29Especially at this late stage of their careers
09:31So I'm happy that we can have a conversation where I'm saying hey
09:34Maybe the biggest threat to the Warriors the Lakers to Steph and LeBron is each other
09:39I hope they don't meet too soon in the playoffs, but we'll see how it all shapes up
09:43Yeah, hopefully it's deep in the playoffs
09:46I was looking earlier and Steph is 17 and 11 against the LeBron James teams in the playoffs
09:52And I know a lot of that was when KD was here and they were handling Cleveland
09:56But when you look elsewhere in the Western Conference and you think about Houston in Memphis, are they viable in your eyes?
10:03Howard or are they still a year of experience away from being dangerous?
10:09All the credit in the world
10:10let's talk about the Rockets first like all the credit in the world to you knew doca for shaping that team and
10:15To their young players for you know really forging an incredible defensive identity
10:22and they're good enough offensively, but you know Jalen Green has not really established himself as a go-to star yet and
10:29When Fred Van Vliet's not playing that that team's offense just gets stuck in the mud
10:33And so they need Fred Van Vliet who's you know, they always been this like just unspectacular or like not flashy
10:39But just really workmanlike
10:42incredibly
10:43effective leader and
10:45An orchestrator out there, but they don't have the go-to guy. They have a bunch of guys who are pretty good
10:51But in the playoffs in crunch time, you know last couple minutes of a good a tight game
10:56You need a Steph Curry or a Kevin Durant or LeBron James or Luka and
11:02I just don't think the Rockets, you know, especially the really young team that again like their their playoff experience
11:07It's all it's all new for most these guys
11:09I I just don't think anyone takes them seriously and I and I agree with that stance
11:14The Grizzlies are a little different in that they've they've had some playoff experience and some battles, of course with the Warriors
11:20And then the Grizzlies kind of you know
11:22got lost in the desert for a while and have now found their way back and
11:27You know, they still have some
11:30vulnerabilities in the half-court offensively and
11:34You know, I like I think I would take them more seriously than the Rockets
11:38I think the Grizzlies would present bigger concerns
11:41but I
11:44Still think that when people talk about the West in this league
11:48After the Thunder I think the teams that they're that are they're paying the most attention to are the Lakers and Warriors and and of course
11:54the Nuggets Howard
11:55What about if we we dive a little bit deeper on on the way the Warriors are playing right now in other words?
12:02Are they gonna have to evolve a little bit into?
12:05their their
12:07more focus on their stars
12:09These guys Moses Moody and Quinton post and these contributions that they're getting from young players
12:16How confident are you that that can continue in the postseason?
12:22You know, it's sliding scale
12:24I think more so with Moody than post because Moody's got at least some postseason
12:28Experience and has been around for a couple years and post. This is all new to him
12:32I do think that that's where it becomes a concern right as you get into the playoffs and you know
12:38You're gonna lean on your veterans quite a bit
12:41But Steph and Draymond and Jimmy Butler need to have confidence move that when they kick the ball out to Moody or post or pajam ski
12:49That those guys are going to be competent enough to make shots
12:52But they're not going to hesitate or that if they're not open
12:54they're gonna move the ball quickly and keep you know as Steve Kerr always preaches and you want to make quick decisions with with the
12:59ball and
13:01Our guys going to you know be able to handle that playoff pressure when some of them have little or no experience
13:08I don't know. I mean, we'll see when they get there, but it's that you know
13:14That's why it's all that much more important that you have a guy like Butler around where there's one more guy
13:18You know is always going to be you know
13:20Steady in the moment and making the right play. Is it fair to expect Jonathan Kaminga to be able to step up into a real?
13:26Prominent role. I know having Jimmy Butler makes it so he doesn't have to be the second score
13:31But is he in a spot Howard that you think he can be a big-time contributor in high leverage playoff games?
13:37I mean he almost has to be because the thing is like
13:41you're you know the scoring you need the scoring to come from multiple places and
13:46You know, he's he's one of their you know, few vertical threats. I mean, he's obviously the best vertical threat
13:52And you know, he could do a few things with the ball in his hands as well
13:55And he's just he's just an incredible athlete
13:58So like you're gonna need coming to be to playing a major role like do you need him go out and score 25 a night?
14:04no, I don't think that's what's expected of him, but
14:07You know, he's another really important release valve
14:11This play in tournament fascinates me right now Howard
14:15I mean, I like there is so much optimism right now with the Warriors
14:19But I'm looking at what the Wolves are doing and and and through all this the Warriors may end up in this play in tournament
14:26Anyway, how do you how would you sort of predict?
14:29This thing is going to to play out who ends up in that seven slot. I
14:35Mean I haven't looked at strength of schedule to see like how this is gonna pan out
14:38I mean right as of right now, of course, the Warriors are you know, potentially six so they avoid the play in
14:45as the standing sit right now if it's Minnesota Clippers Kings Mavs, I mean the Mavs I
14:53Would think we're gonna lose hold on on that 10th spot and the Suns probably replace them
14:57But the Suns have been so disastrous that it's hard to place any faith in them either
15:02I'm gonna say the Suns end up in the 10th spot. I'm gonna say the Suns end up I
15:08Think they beat the Kings like Kevin Durant just just throws a haymaker and and then they emerge
15:16Between the Clippers and Wolves like that's a tough one. I think I kind of lean Timberwolves
15:22So do we eventually get like
15:24Timberwolves versus Suns wait, no, excuse me
15:27Timberwolves end up with the seventh and then Clippers have to play the Suns for the eighth spot
15:34Yeah, I don't know
15:37Like I have so little faith
15:39I see and that's the thing like the Suns like I could see them like knocking out the Kings in a playing game and then
15:44Just getting smoked by the Clippers the next game somehow, right?
15:47And then so I think we're where I think I just talked myself into Minnesota 7th and Clippers 8th
15:52Which is how the standings look right now. Anyway, so that was creative. Yeah
15:57I think as long as you don't have the Warriors in it, our listeners are probably happy with it
16:01But the Wolves have a very very soft schedule at least for another week or so
16:08They got a lot of New Orleans a lot of Indiana without their stars kind of things going on for the next week or so
16:15So we'll see meantime the Warriors have a back-to-back against Yoke it's and Giannis
16:21Yeah, sometimes the schedule gods are a little cruel but as well as the Warriors are playing
16:26I think they'll get through it. I mean look, let's say that the generals knock them out or they you know
16:32Overtake them the Warriors are in the plan
16:34The plans I see right like, you know in any at least if you're that that
16:39Seven eight game. You've got a little bit more wiggle room
16:43But I you know, I think the Warriors are but like I I said this for weeks starting from the moment
16:49They got Jimmy Butler
16:49I said the Warriors are making the playoffs and whether that's through the play-in or whether they get it outright at the six seed
16:55I'd I have very little doubt that they're in and then it's just a matter of matchups and how they do from there Howard
17:00Love having you man. Thank you so much for the time today
17:03Always a pleasure fellas. Thank you. There is Howard Beck on the ringer