Hani—yes, that Hani! The ultimate K-pop fan (read: EXO) and a familiar face online for years.
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00:00Do not overshare. Not everyone has the right intention.
00:09It's A Hard Knock Life. I'm your host today, Su Lim. And I want to talk about today,
00:16okay, friends online. And today I have with me Hani. Hi. Hello. Hi. How are you? I'm good.
00:23The reason I brought Hani is because, you know, I know that she's had quite a long career online.
00:30I want to talk about that first. Let's, for those who know and don't know Hani,
00:35let, you know, whether, regardless, I just don't want to hear it again. Okay.
00:39Just about me? Yeah, it's just fun to know. So I started going online before my career started,
00:46of course, in high school. No, not high school, actually, primary school.
00:52Oh, wow. I started with Friendster. Friendster. For those who, yeah, I mean,
00:57for those who don't know what Friendster is, do you guys know what Friendster is?
01:01It was like way before, you know, what, Facebook. Yes, way, way, way before. That wasn't when I was
01:07in high school. In primary school, it was the same time as MSN Messenger and Friendster. So I used
01:14that a lot with my friends in primary school. And then when it came to high school, I started using
01:19MySpace. And then it was Facebook. And then until now, like Facebook is still in, not in, but you
01:26use it to connect with old friends, like school friends. Our mom and dads use it. Yes. So I add
01:33my mom there. Okay. And then on Instagram, I had it since I started working in the media industry,
01:43actually. I started right after SPM. So that was in 2009, 2010, when Instagram just got introduced.
01:52Wow, that sounds so ancient. Right? Like, I still remember the first time Instagram came up and I
01:58was like, what? Just pictures? We just post pictures? Yeah. And it wasn't even real at that
02:02time. Everyone was busy using all the filters because I was like, oh my god, they have a filter.
02:08Snapchat came in between that. Yes, of course. I had Snapchat too. And then we have Twitter,
02:13which is now X. And then lastly, TikTok, of course. What was your favourite one, though?
02:19My favourite one? I think Instagram is still relevant, no matter how people say,
02:26oh, TikTok is in, it's gonna kill Instagram. No, Instagram has actually fought its way to be
02:31relevant to this day. Because when Snapchat came about also, we thought like, I use more Snapchat,
02:38so nobody's gonna go there. But still, they came back with stories. So yeah, I think Instagram.
02:43So Instagram's the bomb. Or are we just saying that because we're biased?
02:47Maybe. Maybe because of our age.
02:51Yeah. I mean, being, I guess, KOLs, influencers, you know, out there, I have to say, I'll be honest,
02:58there are some people that will message us, you. Some friendly, some a bit not so friendly,
03:08some interesting characters. I want to know who you met online.
03:14Who I met online? Okay, so of course, the juiciest one.
03:19I was like, tell me your juicy stories. I've actually told this before to a lot of
03:24people every time I talk about this. It actually even went on as a headline in a newspaper before.
03:31That has to be a big story.
03:33I got death threats online before. So that is something that, I mean, if you're talking about
03:38something online, right, something that I can't forget. Of course, it's some girls suddenly
03:44calling me out and giving me death threats just because I'm into, okay, so I'm a K-pop fan.
03:52And what I enjoy doing sometimes is I edit photos of me with K-pop idols.
04:01And it's, honestly, to me, it's very harmless because I'm just a fan, even though I work in
04:07the industry and I meet some of them in real life. But to me, it's just as me being a fan
04:15and just being the Lulu like any other K-pop fans, you know. But some of them got
04:21too extremely jealous. Jealous? Jealous of the edited photos and they're like, oh,
04:28if she dares to even, you know, edit a photo of her and my bias, I'm gonna, like, kill her.
04:37I'm gonna kill her. Oh, and another girl comes and say, yeah, I want to hit her head and, you know,
04:43shove her. This is on Instagram. So, what happened was that they had a group. I don't know whether
04:51it's Telegram or WhatsApp. I don't know because it's like a fandom group. And then some of the
04:55fans in that group screenshot it and send it to me via DM in Instagram. So, that's how I got to
05:01know about it. And I was shocked because I was like, I mean, it was not me hugging the real
05:07person or whatnot. I mean, I would understand if it was like that. So, that's the thing.
05:13Do you think they knew it was edited? Yes, because they were talking about the editing.
05:18Oh, okay. Yeah. So, I find that so strange because I just feel like, obviously, it's not real,
05:26right? But I guess to them, they're such fans that they've become, I guess, lost in the world
05:34and just kind of like, yeah. Were you actually scared though? I mean, were you just like,
05:40okay, it's a death threat or were you like, seriously? I was not scared but I was a bit
05:46like taken aback because to me, it's like, how can people say such things, you know? Because
05:54sometimes we do have people, like when we look at their social media, we're like, oh,
05:58I can't stand them. You know, we are human after all. Sometimes, we just can't stand people.
06:01We have our, you know, favorites. But what bothers me a lot even to this day is that how
06:08people can actually say so harsh things to people they don't even know. Yeah. And sometimes,
06:14they even create like fake accounts to do this. I know. They go out of their way, right? Yeah. So,
06:19other than that, I do get, you know, fake accounts like commenting or sending me
06:25things like saying, oh, you don't deserve to do this, to do that, da-da-da-da-da. So,
06:31they hide behind their social media but they're so brave to say so many bad things and I don't
06:39know like, why is your life so sad? Yeah. I mean, did you take it? Here's the thing though. Sometimes,
06:46words will hurt you. Words, you know, they don't know it. Maybe they know it. They're
06:50purposely trying to hurt you. How have you learned to block that or not block it? Yeah. So,
06:56when that happened, things like that happened, my family and friends would say, oh, just ignore,
07:01you know, they just pay attention, da-da-da-da. But that's the thing. We can't keep ignoring
07:06these people. We have to call them out because if we keep ignoring, they'll do it to someone else
07:11and maybe I can take it but some people, maybe they're struggling mentally, struggling with
07:15themselves. They might just, you know, do something really bad to themselves. So, I kind
07:21of try to scare them a bit and I say, you know, I have all these screenshots and your phone numbers
07:27because it was in a group. So, I can do something about it, you know. Right. But like, just kept
07:33quiet. Kind of just say, hey, leave me alone. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But most of the time, what I do
07:41is I don't interact. So, they say it, I'll just delete it or block it or I just, just leave it
07:47because if there's a mean comment or something like that, I'll, I usually don't block until,
07:55unless it's too much. I'll just leave it there because some of them will be like, if I block,
07:59they'll be like, oh my god, you're such a coward. Why do you block me? And then they'll tag me and
08:04get their friends to. It's like a never-ending. Yes. But if I reply, then they're gonna say,
08:10you're still wrong. No matter how you say, because sometimes words can get out of context,
08:16right? And then they'll be like, you see this and you see that. So, that's why I just ignore.
08:22Don't reply. And I think for most of us, we, you know, we don't reply. I think that's the best
08:27thing. Whether it's online or not online, the best way to reply to any negative feedback is just
08:33don't reply to it at all, right? So, you have some enemies online. Have you ever made friends
08:41online? We'll talk about the opposite. We'll talk about better things now. Of course, we have.
08:45Actually, I've met some people, I don't know, from the time that I had Myspace or be it Myspace,
08:52another one, I think, Instagram. Instagram especially is a place that you follow the
08:56person and the person follows you back and we can react to each other and some people,
09:01we don't even, we haven't even met in real life, but we just know that person as your Instagram
09:07friend. And then when you meet in real life, sometimes at events or something like, oh,
09:11I know you. So, yeah, I do have friends online that actually at first I haven't met, but,
09:19and then, you know. Do you ever find yourself like you really good friends with these people
09:24and then when you meet them, you're like, what, catfished? Yeah, but in a friend way, like,
09:31oh, you're not, you know. So far, not to that extreme, I think. Okay, cool. Not that I remember.
09:36You know, nowadays, we are, everything's online. Everything's online, meaning friends are online,
09:43meaning, you know, partners online. Now, having kids and having, you know, like, I, you have a son
09:54and I have kids and we know, let's not keep a one, you know, blind eye. We all know that they're
10:01making friends online, correct or not? I don't know. How old is your son? My son is four, but
10:05he's always on YouTube, which also scares me. Even though you put on YouTube kids, you still don't
10:11know what goes on in there and it's so scary because this is the age where they absorb everything.
10:16So, what I do is, I monitor what they watch, but I know the day will come and I know how
10:24some other parents will be like, oh no, you can't do this, you can't do that. I want to try to be
10:29that parent that allows my son to just explore because at the end of the day, sometimes our
10:36parents will be like, oh, you know, during our time, it's not like this because during your time,
10:42there's no social media. So, it's so different. Like, oh, we wouldn't let, you know, our kids
10:48watch such a thing, but we were watching TV. So, actually, it's just evolved. Yeah, everything is
10:53evolving and I can't stop him from going through social media and whatnot because that is the
10:59future. So, in the future, there'll be more and this is the norm of it. Like, during our time,
11:04maybe the norm is just TV, books, comics and doing other things. But if I don't let him explore,
11:12I mean, he's gonna be far behind from his peers. Yeah. But do you think that you feel like
11:19you have to have somewhat of a control? Yes. How do you do that? To guide him, not like to
11:24control him because I always believe strict parents create sneaky children.
11:32Yes, this is a thousand percent true. I had very strict parents and the more strict the parents
11:38are, the more rebellious we wanted to be, right? So, I want them to be able to tell me like, hey,
11:44you know, there's some random person messaging me and talk to me about it. So, I guess I'll be
11:52more hands-on in terms of that, like explaining maybe my experience and maybe when he's using it
11:58and he understands more and when he's gonna be playing, I don't know, like what Minecraft or
12:02whatever. My kids met a lot of people on roadblocks and I don't know if you guys heard
12:08some of these crazy stories where people will get, you know, spoken. You know, people act as if they
12:15are kids their age. That's actually my biggest fear. Yeah. How do you think, I mean, you can
12:22never stop that from happening though. Like, we never know, right? Like from your experience,
12:30like making friends online and stuff, how would you tell your child growing up the warning signs
12:37of a good friend versus a bad friend? Yeah, I feel that communication is important so they will
12:43have to, I know sometimes kids, they wouldn't want to share with it. Of course. And they know
12:50for a fact that sometimes the thing that they're doing, we might not be okay. So, they just
12:55avoid talking. Yeah. So, that's the thing. I want to try and since he's young, he's already using
13:02social media. So, whenever I can, I want to, you know, slowly tell him, okay, so this is what
13:06happens, you know, what you have to look out for. Create a trust. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because I can't
13:11just say, no, you can't play. The more I say that, they will keep on playing, you know, and then
13:15they're like, oh, no. My second is a girl. She was around 13, 14, 15. She's now almost going on 16.
13:24And I remember one of the first signs I got when I was like, okay, hold on. She is, you know,
13:31she was constantly online, on the phone, on the iPad, and she wouldn't let it go. And, you know,
13:39the minute she finished it, she ran back to her room to use it. And that was like one of my first
13:44signs where I was like, okay, there's something wrong. She's got either a really good...
13:49She's had a friend, but I had more suspicion to like it being more than a friend. And I didn't
13:55know how to go about it. I mean, again, this is something that's not told. Like, online, you know,
14:01nobody tells us this. Our parents don't tell us how to, you know, handle this. I didn't know how
14:06to handle it. But the way I did it was, you know, seeing if everything was okay. Even though I knew
14:12she had an online relationship, I still pretended I didn't know. And it went on for, I don't know,
14:23I would say a year before I had to, you know, did I say things? I said, yeah. And I told her,
14:29hey, be careful. And, you know, her reaction would always be like, yeah, yeah, yeah, I know,
14:33I know, I know, I know. And what do you do? What do you do when they like, yeah, I know,
14:39I know better than you. Of course, mom. And you're like, okay. Yeah, I mean, if the lucky ones are
14:45lucky to not be harmed or like be cheated on, like, or catfished. That's what we're afraid of,
14:52right? So, sometimes I feel like we can only do so much. Yeah, you know, I had to pretend I didn't
14:57know anything. And I had to be like, you know, I would literally make up these stories. And I'd be
15:03like, you know, one of my friends, daughters, sons, and whatever, you know, they met somebody
15:09online and this happened, like giving her my own horror stories that I would actually see online.
15:14And that was the how I handled it. Later on in the future, she kind of learned her lesson. But
15:19it was actually a teamwork thing. Because my son was telling me little things behind, you know,
15:22my older son, my first child. Yeah, but he was he was a snitch. But I think at the same time,
15:28he was a bit concerned, too. So, as a team, we kind of just tried to do it. But it's tough,
15:34man. Like, I mean, through your experiences, like, do you ever have a friend? Do you have any other
15:41stories where you had? So, like, what my parents did to me was when I was in high school,
15:50I think, how do I tell this story? Tell it as it is. So, of course, because I was still young. I
15:58mean, I was only 17. I was doing my, I had my SPM that year, you know. Of course, my parents were
16:06concerned. And I was in an all girls school. And then suddenly I started talking to a boy
16:12who is now my husband. Okay, so chill. I was like a safe. But during that time, of course,
16:19my parents were like, I think they didn't know what to do as well, because I had an elder sister,
16:23but she never went through this with that. Right. So, the first person or the first one in the
16:28family to have a boyfriend was me. So, how they reacted was they took away my phone. Okay. So,
16:34by taking away my phone, it made me go like, I have to find other ways, you know. So, the urge
16:40is that because at the end of the day, you're still a teenager, you have a crush, you know,
16:44you have a boyfriend, you just want to talk to that person. And lucky enough for me, it was a
16:49person that I knew. I mean, it was my best friend's brother at that time. It's just that my parents,
16:56of course, was very, you know, how do you say it? Protective of me. So, I know they meant well.
17:04But as a teenager, when your parents do that, you're like, why? This is so unfair. Life is
17:11unfair. As a teenager, life is so unfair. Yeah. Everyone's out to get you apparently.
17:16So, I think those kind of feelings like growing up and all, it's something that you can't really,
17:22you know, restrict or say no to because we have to have our ways. And different generations have
17:31different problems, different things to worry about. So again, like for my son, I think when
17:36he grows up, I'm just going to keep reminding him that, hey, you know what? You're going to
17:43meet a lot of people, but whatever it is, you're growing, you're going to meet a lot of people,
17:48but always know that I'm here. You know, don't build a trust. Yeah. Build a friendship with
17:53your child, right? I feel like that's a very important thing. You are now at a certain age,
17:59right? This is what I always kind of tell parents, like when they hit their puberty years,
18:03there's a certain age where they hit where they're no longer wanting you to be their mom or dad.
18:08They actually need a friend, if anything. Yeah. I remember being like when my daughter was going
18:13through that, I was like, I just need to be her friend. I need to pretend things happen.
18:17And I just need to talk to her about whatever a friend talks to her about. Yeah. And looking back,
18:24when your parents took your phone away from you, do you think you would, I mean, we'll have it
18:30recorded now. Do you think you'd ever do such a thing as take the phone away? Do you think that
18:36was the right thing to do? Again, there's no right and wrong. Yeah. But it's just like learning from
18:41experience. I want to try to not pass on the trauma. But I'll try to avoid it, of course. But
18:51if let's say he's suddenly friends with someone that's like a gangster or something, of course,
18:56I have to do something about it. How would you know? That's the thing. We don't know. But a
19:02mother's instinct. This is a thousand percent. Yeah. You always feel something. Yeah. Taking
19:09the phone and all, no. But I will start early by, you know, instead of like restricting, you know,
19:16you can't do this, you can't do that. I will monitor. So not restrict, but monitor and be
19:21there when he uses it. I check what he uses and try to say, okay, you know what? For this age,
19:28you can only use this app for now. So you grow with it. I know they'll be like, I know, but
19:34everyone is using this. That card comes out. But my friend is doing it. And you know, so and so's,
19:41you know, mom allows her or him. How do you even battle that? Yeah. I think that my parents were
19:50very strict in terms of like, I can't go out freely and whatnot. I have had a curfew. But
19:55even though they're like that, they were the ones that brought me all over and showed me the world.
20:02So I think that you need to have that connection and that bond. So I think I was not culture shock
20:09even when I was studying abroad alone. Even when my parents were strict, I think it was because of
20:14that. Because my parents showed me the world. Yeah. And you know, they brought me everywhere.
20:20So they were not strict. Like, oh, can't do this. And then you just stay at home. Oh, you have to
20:24study, study, study. No. They're like, hey, let's go here. Let's go on holiday. Let's go see a
20:29concert. Let's go. Yeah. Bring your friends. Yeah. Again, your parents were being your friend. Yeah.
20:35They weren't being parents. They were partially being your friend going, hey, let's go on a holiday
20:41together. I mean, technically, I mean, families go on holidays all the time together. But do they
20:46really go together? Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, maybe they're physically there. But mentally,
20:52if you show them the world and you know, kids who are entertained by the outside world,
20:58get don't get as much, you know, the satisfaction of being online is different. But when they see
21:05the world, when they see what's happening outside, when they have like actual conversations without
21:11the phone, it's different. And I feel like showing them that part, you know, back in the day before
21:17we had internet, like, you know, showing them that is a very magical thing. Yeah. Yeah. Like
21:24you said, showing, you know, your parents showing you even though they were strict, they weren't
21:30they didn't, you know, yeah, they didn't confine me. So, I mean, of course,
21:37not everyone is lucky like that. Not everyone has a family like that. Not everyone has that
21:41privilege. Sure. So, what I can do is, you know, to have those conversations with my child and to
21:50be there for them. To talk to them. Yeah. To show them that, hey, your life is more than just
21:56in the screen. Because it's not just them. Even us, now when we wake up. I was about to say this.
22:01And you know, you want to check the time, you check your phone. I mean, yeah, we tell our kids to put
22:05the phone down all the time. But the iPhone all the time. We're doing it ourselves at the dinner
22:09table. We tell them, well, you're always on your phone. But then the parents will be like, yeah,
22:13but I'm on my phone because I'm working. But the kids don't understand this. Exactly. So, it is
22:19true and we don't realize it that we're always on our phone and they just copy whatever we are doing.
22:24So, they are mini us. It's not all on them. Because nowadays people say, oh no, kids nowadays are
22:30always on the phone with them. Yeah, but we are too. So, we can't keep blaming them. Stop and think about it.
22:35Are we always on the phone? You know, kind of like we're half there listening to whatever they say
22:39and then replying to messages. This again plays an important part too. So, sometimes
22:46interacting with the, you know, they'll understand that having a conversation face-to-face is actually
22:52fun, you know, instead of online. So, anyways, but anything else that you wanted to share? Any fun
23:00little stories? Okay, yeah. Actually, this is very important also. Never, never, never, never, never
23:05post everything that you're doing. I mean, some people forget this. Getting likes, getting
23:13views can be addicting. Yeah. Because you're like, oh my god, they like it. Oh, wow, this one got like
23:1910,000 views. Oh, this one. It's something that some people feed off. Yeah, do not overshare.
23:24Because I do know some people who wants to post every single thing. It's fine.
23:33I know it's your own page but not everyone has the right intention, you know. But how do you,
23:40okay, how do you know what oversharing is? What oversharing is like telling you where you are and
23:46like posting on the spot? That is something you should avoid. I used to post on time. I used to
23:50post everything. I used to do all of that but then I see a lot of things happening around me. I see
23:57people taking advantage of other people, you know, using that against people. Not everyone has a nice
24:04intention. Some are jealous. Okay, some may be your friends and they get envious and then, oh, I don't
24:09like this person. Because I do believe in the evil eye. Me too. So, I feel like if you post
24:16strong on that too many things, then people can get, it becomes a hate from that envy.
24:23Which is also not healthy. Some people like, you know, posting their kids badges. Yes, this is
24:30something, yes, definitely I would advise people to be careful on. Regardless whether you have a
24:36million followers versus having like, you know, 500 followers. It doesn't actually matter but you
24:42just have to be careful out there because especially if your account is public. Yes, true. And be
24:46mindful also of other people. Whenever I'm with my friends who has kids, I'm gonna ask this. Is it
24:52okay if they're in the frame? Right. Are you okay with it? You know, because you have to be mindful
24:57because some people are not comfortable. And I have friends who are like, oh, thank you so much
25:01for asking this. Honestly, I'm not comfortable with people, you know, freely posting my son's
25:06face everywhere because there are pedophiles who would take advantage and edit photos and
25:10things like that. We might be careful but other people will, who has bad intentions, will always
25:16find ways to use it. Yeah. In like, ways that we cannot imagine. Okay, I want to thank you Hattie
25:23for having, for coming and sharing your side of the world with me. My pleasure.
25:31Well, because I actually enjoy that because sometimes we get lost in this social media,
25:38you know, world and we forget what it's like. We forget what it's like that, you know, there's
25:44actually people out there to talk to rather than online. And it's a good reminder for ourselves and
25:49it's a good reminder that our kids are actually going to go through this. Again, whether you like
25:53it or not, they, this generation will go through this and we have to accept this and just find a
26:01way. Yeah. Right. Yes. Yeah. Thanks again. It's a hard knock life, but someone's got to do it.
26:06And I'll see you in the next episode.