War Thunder Proposed Japanese Tank Tech Tree - Light Tanks! - video Dailymotion

Toreno

In this new part of the future tank tech series, I take a look at a possible Japanese tank tech tree, starting off with the light tanks.  Intro: 00:00 Type 92: 05:48 Type 97 Te-Ke: 07:26 Type 95 Ha-Go (Added in Update 1.65 "Way of the Samurai"): 10:50 Type 98 Ke-Ni (Added in Update 1.65 "Way of the Samurai"): 14:41 Type 2 Ke-To: 16:41 Type 4 Ke-Nu: 18:39 Type 5 Ke-Ho: 21:23  Proposed Japanese Tank Tech Tree⬇️ Japanese Light Tanks➡️https://youtu.be/a4La6cIj3U8 Japanese Medium Tanks (Part 1)➡️ https://youtu.be/6ZT_JiN0lFY Japanese Medium Tanks (Part 2)➡️ https://youtu.be/EQn_A3aWh8I Japanese Heavy Tanks➡️ https://youtu.be/QhMx05tIZC4 Japanese Amphibious Tanks➡️ https://youtu.be/4_paUh-5U30 Japanese Tank Destroyers & Assault Guns➡️ https://youtu.be/w0Xxw9F-xyk Japanese SPAA➡️ https://youtu.be/Oo0tpdRt9_k Japanese Premium Tanks➡️ https://youtu.be/OxPzgNZo1wI   Information/picture sources⬇️ WWII: The Directory of Weapons Weapons of World War II Armoured fighting vehicles of the 20th Century New Vanguard. Japanese tanks: 1939-45 http://www3.plala.or.jp/takihome/  Rickard, J (21 August 2008), Type 92 Jyu-Sokosha/ Kei Sensha Cavalry Tank (Japan),   http://www.historyofwar.org/articles/weapons_type_92_cavalry_tank.html  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_92_Heavy_Armoured_Car  http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_95_Ha-Go  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_95_Ha-Go  http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File%3AType_95_(AWM_097336).jpg By photographer not identified [Public domain], via Wikimedia Commons This image is of Australian origin and is now in the public domain because its term of copyright has expired.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_97_Te-Ke  http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File%3AType_97_Te-Ke_in_the_Kubinka_Museum.jpg By Mike1979 Russia (Own work) [CC BY-SA 3.0 (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0)], via Wikimedia Commons  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_98_Ke-Ni  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_2_Ke-To  http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:%E4%BA%8C%E5%BC%8F%E8%BB%BD%E6%88%A6%E8%BB%8A.jpg This photographic image was published before December 31st 1956, or photographed before 1946, under jurisdiction of the Government of Japan. Thus this photographic image is considered to be public domain according to article 23 of old copyright law of Japan (English translation) and article 2 of supplemental provision of copyright law of Japan.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_4_Ke-Nu  http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Ke-Nu2.JPG This photographic image was published before December 31st 1956, or photographed before 1946, under jurisdiction of the Government of Japan. Thus this photographic image is considered to be public domain according to article 23 of old copyright law of Japan (English translation) and article 2 of supplemental provision of copyright law of Japan.  http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File%3AKe-Nu2.JPG This photographic image was published before December 31st 1956, or photographed before 1946, under the jurisdiction o

Transcript

00:00Hello everybody and welcome back to the future proposed tank tech tree series, it's been

00:05gone for a little while, last time I left it I'd just finished the Italian tech tree

00:10and was preparing to go into the Japanese tank tech tree which we're looking at in the

00:13next few episodes but I couldn't find much information so I've had to order one or two

00:18books in, they finally arrived so hopefully I can do a more accurate tank tech tree.

00:24Now I'm going to give a little run down on the Japanese tanks as I've seen them so far,

00:29I'll leave a little annotation to skip to the tech tree itself but for those of you

00:35who don't want to, you know, who want to hear a bit of a run down on the Japanese tanks

00:38feel free to stay.

00:40Japan actually had the 5th largest tank army in 1940 after Russia, Soviet Union, France,

00:46Britain and Germany.

00:48Japanese tanks also have somewhat unfairly got a bit of a bad reputation because they

00:53weren't seen to be successful against American tanks such as the M4 Sherman, which is true

00:58but it's also a bit unfair because the most numerous Japanese tank for example, the Type

01:0495, wasn't built until 1935 or wasn't put into service until 1935, so it's obvious that

01:11an almost 10 year old tank wasn't going to do particularly great against M4 Shermans

01:15while armed with a 37mm gun, not to mention most Japanese tanks were only supposed to

01:21be armoured against small arms fire from rifles and provide infantry support.

01:27Even in the Chinese invasion they did this very well, you know, they were decently protected

01:32and they were able to support the infantry.

01:34I don't think Japan expected them to have to fight against other enemy tanks, but when

01:39they did they were generally successful, until World War 2 when they came up against M4 Shermans

01:44which were more powerful and more numerous.

01:47However, despite, you know, fighting with pretty old tanks, the Japanese were pretty

01:53innovative.

01:54I think they actually produced the first mass-produced diesel tank in the world, the Type 89, and

02:00you know, they did come about with some pretty good designs as the war went on.

02:05They actually made some very good improved designs such as the Type 3 Chinoo or Type

02:094 Chitou, but these were kept on the Japanese home islands because they were expected to

02:15be invaded so there was no point sending off tanks to all these different Pacific islands,

02:20not that they could by this point because of the American air and naval supremacy.

02:25So they were kept on the home islands to defend against the American tanks and, you know,

02:30the invasion never happened, so they were scrapped after the war and most people forgot

02:34about them.

02:35Now, stepping away for a second from how the Japanese tanks were in real life, how would

02:40they be in War Thunder?

02:41As you can see here we've got a decent tech tree, maybe it could be fleshed out more,

02:46but some of the tanks I didn't have much information on so I didn't include.

02:51We've got about 51 tanks and other vehicles here as it is, so, you know, I think this

02:55is what the basic tech tree could look like, and you know, other additions added later

02:59on.

03:00Now, some of you can see I've underlined and put a U next to.

03:05These are the tanks, I'm not sure if they should be on the tech tree or not sure where

03:08they should be.

03:09For example, the Type 5 Horu was a very late war Japanese tank that was about the same,

03:15you know, it looked a bit like the Hetsa, but it only had a 47mm cannon, which would

03:19suggest it should be put very low in the tiers, even though it was a 1945 design.

03:27You've also got the Type 2 Ho-I, which was a bit like the Panzer IV, and I don't know

03:31whether that should go in Assault Guns, Tank Destroyer, or with the BDM tanks, so you know,

03:36I am still changing this as it goes on a little bit, but the light tank side of it does seem

03:41to be finished for the moment, which is where we're going to be starting off with.

03:45But how they will actually perform in War Thunder, Japanese tanks, how can I put it,

03:51are very lightly armoured.

03:54The M2 machine gun in War Thunder can penetrate something like 26mm of armour at 100m.

04:00That will probably be enough to penetrate most tier 1 Japanese tanks, most of the tier

04:062, and you know, it's not until tier 3 where they get seriously armoured.

04:10I think pretty much every tier 1, or pretty much every light tank Japan fielded will be

04:16vulnerable to M2 machine gun fire, so you're going to have to rely on your guns and not

04:22getting hit a lot of the time, especially when you take into account most of these tanks

04:26only have 2 or 3 crew members.

04:29Under the War Thunder kill system, if the gunner's seat or the driver's seat can't be

04:33filled, your tank is counted as dead.

04:35So if you have just your commander and your driver, and your commander doubles as the

04:40gunner and the loader and he takes a shot to the head, your tank is killed.

04:45No ifs, no buts.

04:47If your tank has 3 crewmen and then you lose your gunner, the machine gunner takes over

04:52the gunner's seat and then he's killed, again you're counted as killed.

04:55So you'll have to be very very careful when taking fire in these tanks, and you know,

05:00have to learn to use them more tactically.

05:03However, getting away from the armour, they are quite fast, especially the light tanks.

05:09And they do have some okay guns, some are quite good but some aren't particularly great,

05:15some are not so good.

05:17But overall Japan should be able to hold its own during War Thunder matches, but you will

05:24have to be very tactical with them, you know, you can't just go into battle and expect to

05:29take shot after shot, because you'll be slaughtered, you'll have to sort of flank your enemies

05:34from prepared, or you know, shoot from prepared positions, that sort of stuff.

05:39Now I've spent like 5 minutes talking about the Japanese tank history, so let's get straight

05:44onto the tech tree.

05:46Now the first vehicle we're looking at is the Type 92 Cavalry tank, although from what

05:50I understand it was actually more of a tankette, or armoured car.

05:56Now it wasn't particularly well armoured, apparently the thickest its armour got to

06:00was about 6mm, although I've seen other sources that suggest it could have gone up to 12mm.

06:07But it was only armed with a 13mm machine gun, but sometimes they could be armed with

06:13a 20mm cannon.

06:15Now I tried looking up the penetration values for the 13mm machine gun, and there were some

06:19wildly different results.

06:23Apparently when the French tested it they got some like 20mm at 200m, or 15 at 400,

06:30whereas when the Germans tested it, at 300m they could barely manage 10mm, and at 100m

06:35barely 12mm.

06:36So if we're talking 25mm, that's enough to penetrate most low level tanks in the sides

06:43or rear, and possibly at the front, especially for the really unarmoured early tanks, so

06:48we're talking 12mm, there's no point.

06:50I also tried looking for the 20mm cannon, but just couldn't find any penetration value

06:56for it.

06:57On the bright side it could apparently do 25mph, so I suppose that's one good point

07:02out of it.

07:03So it could possibly be a good or okay-ish reserve tier tank, but really it depends if

07:09Gaijin can find any figures for those 13mm or 20mm cannons, or accurate ones.

07:15Like I said, they're rather different results depending on who's tested the 13mm one, and

07:21none for the 20mm one.

07:24Now the next tank is the Type 97 T-Key Tankette, which I believe can be a reserve tier tank

07:31instead of the Type 92 if the Type 92 doesn't make the cut.

07:35Now this is actually out of chronological order, because this is after the Type 95,

07:42but it's a tankette.

07:43It would be a bit silly if we had the tank, and then a tankette, and then a tank.

07:47It just wouldn't make any sense, so I've put that before the Type 95.

07:53Now this is actually a bit more upgunned, because it has a 37mm cannon.

07:59Now again I tried looking at penetration values for the Type 94 37mm cannon, and I got again

08:07wildly different penetration values.

08:10One saying it only could manage 25mm at 300m, another one which gave it 32mm at maximum

08:18at 500m, or 24mm at minimum at 500m, or 24mm at 1000m, and another one that gave it a penetration

08:27figure of about 45mm at 300m.

08:32So anywhere between 25mm and 45mm at about 300m to 500m, I've no idea which one really

08:41is right.

08:43The one that said 25mm came from a forum, so it's possible that one is wrong.

08:48Another one came from a website, worldwar2vehicles.com, which sourced some of it from various books,

08:55and some have just come from the website itself.

08:59The last one, the 45mm penetration, came from a website, I'm not sure of the person's name,

09:06Taki.

09:07I think they've been involved in books or magazines or something, from what I understand

09:10looking online they're seen as a bit of an expert when it comes to World War 2 tanks.

09:17So I'm hoping that 45mm one is the correct value, because this would actually make it

09:22a little bit better than the Americans reserve tier tank at the moment, but slightly worse

09:27than the Stuarts, which I think would be a fair matchmaking, or make it fair for the

09:32Japanese in matchmaking.

09:34It also goes to show how difficult it can be to research Japanese tanks, and I don't

09:39particularly remember having these problems with the British or Italian future tank tech

09:42trees when researching them.

09:44Now the armour is 6-16mm according to the book I'm reading, which is actually, unless

09:51I'm mistaken, a bit better than the Type 95's, but I believe the Type 95 gets a better

09:56gun, and again the Type 97 Tiki is actually a tank head, so again it would make sense

10:03to have it come before the Type 95, which is why I've got it before the Type 95.

10:09It also has a decent speed again, about 26mph.

10:13Now like I said before, I think this could be a reserve tier tank if the Type 92 isn't

10:18suitable.

10:19If the Type 92 is suitable, this should still be a very low battle rate, no more than 1.3

10:24which is where the Stuarts are at the moment.

10:27The Stuarts actually have a better gun, better armour, they're basically superior in all

10:30aspects.

10:31You know, I don't want this tank to be too high otherwise it will be unplayable, as its

10:37gun wouldn't be able to penetrate anything, and practically everything from 7.62mm machine

10:42guns would be able to completely destroy it, but I think it would be a very good early

10:46tier tank for the Japanese.

10:48Now the next tank on our list is the Type 95 Hargo light tank, so we're finally starting

10:52to get into the, you know, away from tank heads and armoured cars and into light tanks.

10:57Now this was the most numerous of all the Japanese tanks, you know, most produced during

11:02the war and before the war, and I believe it was also involved in the first tank on

11:06the tank battle of the Pacific War.

11:08I believe the Type 95's v M3 Stuarts and the Type 95's won, because they got the first

11:14shots off.

11:15I think they only disabled one Stuart tank, but, you know, they forced the rest to retreat

11:19so they won the battle.

11:21Now there's actually a few different variants of this, there's an early variant, a late

11:24variant, and a variant called the Hokomon, I can't pronounce it properly.

11:31I'll talk about these separately, because I think they should all be implemented separately.

11:38Now the early version had the same gun as the Type 97 Tiki, so potentially anywhere

11:43between 20 and 45mm penetration at a few hundred metres, about 300 metres.

11:50Like I said, I hope it's going to be 45mm.

11:53The armour, it was actually really hard to find any armour stats on this thing, but luckily

11:58one of my books did list it as about, if I can find it, between 6 and 13mm.

12:04Now that's again going to be quite bad, because practically anything is going to be able to

12:08penetrate it, and the gun may not be, you know, particularly the best in the world.

12:13Thankfully, it does have a fairly decent speed, about 28mph, so faster than the tankette.

12:21But after, well, some of these tanks were sent off to Manchuria, or Manchukuo, and apparently

12:27they had a lot of problems to do with crossing certain fields.

12:35So they had to introduce modifications.

12:48Basically a modified suspension was developed, with a small wheel suspended at the centre

12:53of each bogie.

12:55A portion of the Type 95 production run was manufactured with this Manchurian suspension.

13:01Now I don't know if this had the early gun, or the late gun, from the later version, which

13:05I'll talk about in a sec, but it won't be that different from the normal Type 95s.

13:11But again, Japan could really have all the different tanks and variants it can get, which

13:15is why I've put it in the Tank Tech Tree.

13:18Now as with most tanks, the Type 95 was improved as time went on, and it was given a new gun,

13:23the Type 98 37mm tank gun.

13:27Now again I looked up the penetration figures for the gun, and apparently it could do about

13:3125mm at 500m, remember the Type 94 did 45mm at 300m.

13:37The muzzle velocity was nearly 100m higher than with the Type 94, so it should hopefully

13:43be a better performing tank gun, and hopefully it'll be a bit of an improvement over the

13:50previous Type 95s, which is why I've put it a little bit higher.

13:54That said, it probably should still be fairly low down on the Tech Tree, it's still got

13:59a muzzle velocity like 100m slower than most other tanks, 100m at the best, slower than

14:05the other tanks.

14:06So it's still going to have a lot of trouble penetrating other enemy tanks, and that armour

14:11again is going to be penetrated by absolutely everything.

14:14And while it does have a decent speed, it's not particularly a massive great plus point

14:18unless you're trying to get to the cap circle before the enemy team can.

14:22Overall, if it's put low enough down in the tiers it should make a fairly good tank, I

14:28mean it's the most numerous tank so it has to be added in anyway otherwise it just wouldn't

14:33make sense, but it's still going to be quite vulnerable to most other enemy tanks if it's

14:38put too high.

14:39Now the next tank on the list is the Type 98 Keeney, which is supposed to be a replacement

14:44for the Type 95 Hargo, which is quite obsolete by this point, now that Grantz and Matilda

14:512s were being introduced to fight the Japanese, and the Hargo basically couldn't deal with

14:57them.

14:58Now the Type 98 had a better gun, it had the Type 100 37mm gun, unfortunately I can't find

15:08any penetration values for this, I mean literally nothing.

15:11I found one website that suggested 25mm at 500m, but it also said the same about practically

15:18every 37mm gun, so I'm probably not going to trust it.

15:23Even trying to find values for the muzzle velocity was pretty hard, I found on the Wikipedia

15:29page it mentioned 760 metres a second, on the other website I've been using for the

15:34gun penetrations by Taki, I'll leave a link in the annotations, it suggested a muzzle

15:40velocity of 700 metres a second, but it's such a wide gulf between 700 and 760, you

15:48know, is it a 15 metres per second improvement on the last gun, or nearly a 80 metres per

15:54second improvement, you know, it's just hard to find any information on these tanks.

15:59Fortunately armour was improved ever so slightly, to 16mm to 6mm, which is only 2 or 3mm better

16:08than the Type 95, still pretty useless, it could do 31mph though, so I suppose quite

16:17fast.

16:18Now like I said this was actually meant to replace the Type 95, but this was actually

16:22only a few hundred, about 100 of these were built and then they stopped building this

16:26instead and just carried on with the Type 95, I don't know why, apparently this wasn't

16:31much of an improvement, you know, it's not hard to see their point of view.

16:35I'm not actually sure if any of these ever saw combat, with so few being produced, but

16:40obviously the Japanese thought this was a bit lacklustre, this tank, so they produced

16:45a new tank, which is also the next tank on our list, and the first tier 2 light tank

16:49on our list, the Type 2 Kito.

16:52Now again the armour on this was pretty bad, about 16mm to 6mm, considering this wasn't

16:57put into production till 1944, that is ridiculously thin armour, it also did about the same speed,

17:0331mph.

17:04The only real improvement seems to have come about in the 37mm gun, the Wikipedia page

17:10mentions an 810mph muzzle velocity, one of the websites, or the main website I've been

17:18using, which again I'll link in the description below, mentions a muzzle velocity of 785mph

17:26and a penetration of about 25mm at 1000m.

17:30Now unfortunately I can't find the penetration value for lower distances, but based on the

17:35that puts it roughly on par with the M3 Stuarts and M5A1 already in game, I think the M22

17:42also uses the same gun as those tanks, so this finally puts the Japanese somewhat on

17:48the same playing field as some of the American light tanks, the only problem really being

17:54that again it's got ridiculously thin armour.

17:58Now the reason I've put this on tier 2 is because we've already got some Ignite 1-2-3-4-5-6

18:04about 6 tanks on tier 1 already, it wouldn't have been particularly good to have 7 or 8

18:11on the tier 1, but I think this should be a very low battle rating, it should be the

18:16same battle rating as the M3 Stuarts and M5A1, about 1.3 to 2.3, any higher than that, I'd

18:26suggest the 1.6 or something, any higher than 2.3 though and it's just going to get slaughtered

18:32because it would be penetrated by everything and couldn't defeat any of the vehicles it

18:36would go against.

18:39Now the next tank is actually more of a modification and a purpose built tank, it's the Type 4

18:44Kinu, now basically this is a Type 95 Hargo with a turret from the Type 97 Chihar, the

18:51Chihars were basically originally fitted with 57mm guns which were low velocity, which weren't

18:58particularly good against armour, so they were retrofitted with 47mm guns and basically

19:03this left a whole lot of turrets not doing anything, so the decision was taken to put

19:09it onto the Type 95 Hargo.

19:12Now presumably the whole armour was the same, but the turret armour, I think it was 33mm

19:18thick at the gun mantlet which took up most of the front of the turret, or about 26mm

19:24at the turret sides, the rest of it would presumably be the same between 6mm and 16mm

19:30depending on where you're looking at.

19:33The 57mm gun isn't all that great from what I understand, well we're using it with just

19:38armour piercing it with 20mm at 500m which is pretty bad, but apparently there was high

19:44explosive anti-tank or HEAT and this had a penetration of 55mm which is quite a bit less

19:51than most other HEAT rounds in the game, but it should give it a somewhat good advantage

19:57for the 37mm tank guns of the American tech tree such as the M22 and M5A1.

20:04It should also be able to better penetrate some of the other tanks it could possibly

20:08face such as the T-50, early Panzer 3s and Panzer 4s, even the M4 Sherman at the sides,

20:14so a significant firepower upgrade for the Japanese light tanks.

20:21However even with the firepower upgrade it's going to be a lot slower because it added

20:26something like a tonne of weight, the new turret, which slowed it down to about 24mph

20:31and it's still got ridiculously bad armour, the turret's got slightly better armour because

20:36it'll probably be a little bit higher in battle rate and that's going to be negated completely

20:42by the additional firepower of better tanks that it's likely to face.

20:47Honestly I don't think it should be a higher battle rating than say 2.3, 2.3 is probably

20:53the highest I would have it honestly, maybe 2 would be a good battle rating but any higher

20:58than 2.3 it just gets slaughtered.

21:01Now again this tank was actually produced in very little numbers, only about 100 and

21:05from what I understand not many of them actually ended up in combat, I think a few were captured

21:09in Manchuria when the Soviets invaded because I think there's one in the Kubinka museum

21:14in Moscow so obviously some were used but yeah not very many produced and didn't particularly

21:20help the Japanese that much.

21:22Now the next tank I wasn't sure whether to add, the Type 5 Kiho which was apparently

21:26built as a single prototype but Japan already has a lot of problems with getting suitable

21:33combat vehicles so I am including a few prototypes here and there if they're sufficient in

21:39information about them.

21:41Apparently one was built so there must be some sort of information about it that Gaijin

21:46could use.

21:47Now from what I understand it had 8-20mm of armour which is still very bad but you know

21:52it's the best they've got at the moment and the main armament was the 47mm tank gun.

21:59Now this was the same gun used on the Type 97 Shinotos when they got rid of their 57mm

22:05guns so even though it's smaller it's got much better muzzle velocity.

22:10Penetration values I've heard something like between 40mm at 500 and if I can get it up

22:17about 55mm at 500m so it's a massive improvement on the previous guns so you know it will finally

22:25give Japan a fairly hard hitting light tank.

22:29It's also fairly fast being able to do 31mph so it should be able to get to the cap points

22:34fairly quickly and do a decent amount of damage or you know get into good flanking

22:38shots and do a good decent amount of damage.

22:41Now if we take the penetration to be about 55mm it should be able to easily penetrate

22:47any light tanks it goes against including most German, including the Panzer 3s and Panzer

22:544s the Germans have.

22:55It should also be able to penetrate the sides of the T-34 and the Sherman as well as the

23:00rear of the Sherman the Russian tank is a bit more sloped at the rear so it would have

23:04a bit of trouble penetrating there so I think the Sherman's the first one's about battle

23:10rating 3 3.3 sorry the first Sherman I think the I think the Type 5 Kiho should be a battle

23:18rating of 3 any higher than that and I think it's a bit over tiered or too high a battle

23:24rating but I think it would have you know a decent it should be able to do decently

23:29well against any tanks it should meet it would probably still meet Shermans occasionally

23:34and it should be able to deal with them but if you put it any higher it's going to be

23:37facing the you know later era Shermans which you won't be able to deal with very effectively.

23:43The only problem with this like with pretty much all of the Japanese light tanks is it's

23:47armour it's 20mm thick at the you know thickest point so it's just going to be destroyed by

23:54absolutely anything that fires back with it as will all of the Japanese light tanks pretty

23:59much. The other major problem is of course only one of these were built now I assume

24:04there must be some information on it but it's possible guides you might be able to find

24:08all the information it requires which may make it a bit hard to implement but you know I thought

24:13I should put it here just so you know this could potentially be in a Japanese future tank tech tree.

War Thunder Proposed Japanese Tank Tech Tree - Light Tanks!

Category

Transcript

Recommended