Sam "Jam" Packard and Brian Robb analyze the Celtics up-and-down play of late and whether the uneven stretch is anything to worry about over the long term. The guys also react to the latest in the Jimmy Butler trade rumor saga after Pat Riley denied the Heat would deal the veteran.
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00:00Steve Harvill, Steve Harvill, Boston Tech, Steve Harvill, Steve Harvill, oh yeah!
00:12Steve Harvill, Steve Harvill, Boston Tech, Steve Harvill, Steve Harvill, and a Nike!
00:21He brought Jim Peck a JK, Steve Harvill, Steve Harvill, to seize around the court to get another ring,
00:27Steve Harvill, Steve Harvill, everybody in the chat now sing,
00:31Steve Harvill, Steve Harvill, Steve Harvill, Steve Harvill, Boston Tech, Steve Harvill, Steve Harvill, oh yeah!
00:42Welcome back to Still Potable, the best Boston Celtics podcast here on Al Gore's internet.
01:00I am Sam Jampakker, joined the day after Christmas by Brian B. Rob Rob,
01:07And this is the free episode of Still Potable.
01:09That means we are coming to you
01:11on the CLNS YouTube channel.
01:14And that means we are also brought to you
01:16by the fine folks at Prize Picks and the Game Time app.
01:20Now, B-Rob, Jay and I broke down a little bit
01:24about the Celtics loss,
01:26the Christmas Day loss to the 76ers yesterday
01:30on yesterday's pod.
01:30If you wanna hear all the Still Potable pods,
01:34Monday through Friday, go to patreon.com slash stillpotable.
01:37We'll have a podcast for you every day of the week,
01:39if you so choose.
01:41But B-Rob, not the result the Celtics were hoping for
01:45on Christmas.
01:47And I think a lot of that was their defense,
01:50especially to start the fourth quarter was to bleed.
01:53Yeah, it's just kind of been a jarring stretch, Packard,
01:58from a standpoint of one night it's like the defense,
02:02one night it's the offense.
02:02And I say a stretch, it's like,
02:03it's been six or seven games
02:05when things just haven't looked right, quote unquote here.
02:09But usually you can kind of pinpoint under Jomezulu
02:14like what's going on or where the team needs,
02:18you know, just to like ratchet in and figure it out.
02:20But the, it's only gonna be inconsistent,
02:23but it's only gonna be inconsistent
02:25on both sides of the ball,
02:26which has been the case when they're lost,
02:28like they lost to the Sixers in that fourth quarter,
02:31they couldn't get stops.
02:32And then they lost to the Magic on Monday night
02:35because they couldn't score.
02:36And then you go back to the Bulls the week before
02:39and it's cause they couldn't get stops.
02:41And so it's kind of been just like
02:42little seesaw situation here.
02:45And normally you'd say no big deal,
02:49but I just feel like it feels like
02:50they just didn't have stretches like this at all last year.
02:53And it's a bit jarring to see it happen now
02:56because this is a spot in the schedule
02:59where they should be piling up wins
03:02as opposed to, you know,
03:04having to struggle for 40 minutes to beat mediocre teams.
03:08Yeah, and I think that makes it more difficult
03:12in terms of making an adjustment
03:13because if there was like one thing consistently,
03:16then it's like, oh, the Celtics can focus on this
03:19and just sure that up.
03:19And then it's like, oh, it's our perimeter defense.
03:21Oh, we're closing out too hard on certain guys.
03:24But it feels like it's been a different thing
03:27over the course of what's been a,
03:28not a great month for them.
03:30I just went back and looked at the stats.
03:33They're six and five this month.
03:36Cause the first month of the first game of the month
03:38was the loss against the Cavs.
03:41And so that's just not what you expect to see
03:43from the Celtics.
03:44And I think part of the inconsistency
03:48and the reasons why it's coming from different places
03:50and Jay and I touched on this a little bit,
03:53but they're just not,
03:55they haven't had the same guys really
03:58over that 11 game stretch.
04:00If you look at the kind of the lineup data,
04:03just look at five man lineups.
04:05There's one lineups that has played four games.
04:08And so that's just like,
04:12they haven't really had a time to really build cohesion.
04:16And you'd think a championship team
04:17would have that sort of cohesion
04:20and be able to get it together
04:23and they wouldn't necessarily need that.
04:24But I think it's just,
04:25it's been one thing working Chris Stapps
04:27back into the lineup.
04:29Then you have the role players getting less time,
04:31less consistent time.
04:32And then, so when you do play a guy like Cornette,
04:34it's a random spurt of minutes.
04:36But I was just surprised in 11,
04:40they played 11 games across that stretch
04:43and only one lineup,
04:45only one five man lineup has played four games.
04:48And so I think that's maybe just be the issue here
04:50where it's, you know,
04:51they're just haven't really gelled in a way
04:54where last year it felt like
04:56they were just blowing teams out by 20
04:58and they had really pretty good injury luck
05:01until Chris Stapps got hurt late in the season
05:04where they had the,
05:05one of the best eight man rotations
05:07running out there every single night.
05:10Yeah, it's a little bit been more,
05:14not jarring, but like, yeah,
05:15there's been more of a cycle right now from that.
05:18And I do think like the motivation from a game to game,
05:21it's like, this is a different season.
05:22It's a different entity for a bunch of reasons.
05:25Like there's been other stuff going on,
05:27like some guys have even been playing,
05:30you know, Jalen had the thing with his mom last week,
05:32the break-in, like that may or may not be affecting him
05:36to this point on the court.
05:38Other random stuff like that can, you know,
05:41that we don't necessarily know about
05:43can have an impact beyond just the players
05:44being on and off the floor.
05:46But you understand it from Brad's team's standpoint of like,
05:50okay, you bring everyone back this year,
05:52the continuity is there, you get to work,
05:54but every year is a new entity.
05:57And so I'm curious, like, as we get
06:00into the upcoming weeks here,
06:03and now the Celtics are closer to the third seed
06:06than the one seed right now,
06:07like the Knicks are suddenly two games back of them
06:10for the two seed,
06:11which kind of, I feel like came out of nowhere.
06:14And they're healthy, they're kind of rolling right now.
06:17And the schedule is about to get harder.
06:20So it is going to be fascinating to see
06:23with the volume of games coming up
06:26and Porzingis being in and out.
06:27And we can kind of go through guys here
06:29throughout the board.
06:30I'm curious, like with Porzingis at this point,
06:34Packard, like this is three games now
06:37where he's gotten hurt, couldn't finish the game
06:41within I think like two or three weeks.
06:45Do you, is this just him at this point?
06:48And you just like, you just have to prepare for this
06:50and understand this is Porzingis at this point in his career
06:55or is this more of a fluky type situation in your mind?
06:59Can it be both?
07:00Like the man has the longest legs I've ever seen.
07:04And so it just feels like there's more leg to injure.
07:07What I don't know is like, are these injuries connected?
07:13That's the scary part.
07:14Is it like, oh, if he continues to play on them,
07:17he's going to continue to come up like lame
07:19and then limping around.
07:20Like I, it seemed like he could have like,
07:23if this was the playoffs,
07:24he probably would have played the second half
07:25against the 76ers.
07:27Cause he was like still running around out there,
07:29still knocked down some shots.
07:30But is it like, that was an ankle injury
07:34and it seemed like he just kind of tweaked it.
07:35But then the one before was like a calf strain
07:39on the same leg that he had previously had an injury on.
07:43But that was a different injury
07:44than the off season surgery.
07:46That was a different leg.
07:47And so I don't know at this point
07:49what you can really do about it
07:51because you want him to play.
07:54These are not like injuries
07:55that are going to keep them out for a while.
07:57But I feel like they're taking the right approach
07:59and like, let's just play things safe here.
08:03But I think it's, he just completely changes the way
08:07that they play both in terms of,
08:10I think on both ends of the court.
08:11And so not knowing whether or not
08:14he's going to be in the game,
08:15I do think is a big adjustment.
08:19The thing that is problematic to me
08:22is that there are certain, like some night,
08:25like the game against Orlando, they couldn't score.
08:28But that was like, oh, Jason Tatum was missing in that game.
08:31And so maybe that's kind of be expected.
08:34Tatum has missed three games
08:35over this December stretch that we talked about.
08:37They actually won the first two of them.
08:40But it feels like there's moments
08:41and especially against lesser opponents.
08:44And the Bulls, you know, give them credit.
08:46They play with a lot of pace
08:47and they're a pretty good offense.
08:50The 76ers actually have a lot of talent
08:52and should be better.
08:54But it just feels like there's,
08:56to watch the Celtics flip a switch,
08:58as I feel like they've done a number of times this season,
09:01and which was really evident
09:02in the fourth quarter of that Sixers game,
09:03where it's like, oh, we're going to play super intense
09:06ball pressuring defense to try and get back in this game.
09:10I was like, where was that for the first half of the game
09:13where you didn't cause a steal or a turnover?
09:16And so it feels like there's been games
09:17when they first played the Cavs,
09:18when the Cavs are undefeated,
09:19where they're like, we're going to bring it tonight.
09:20Like we're here playing defense.
09:23And it's just, I don't know if it's,
09:25they don't have like the same lineups.
09:27And so it's harder to kind of like lock in.
09:29I don't know how much of it's a scheme thing
09:31or how much of it just feels like
09:33we won a championship last year.
09:34It's human nature to not be as hungry
09:37and not be as like, I guess, dominant as they were
09:42last season.
09:43Last season, they're blowing teams out
09:44by like 20 and 30 every single game.
09:46And I felt like they got there because of their defense.
09:48Yes, I feel like the three-point shooting
09:50has been probably like just as good as it was last year,
09:53but they haven't had these dominant defensive performances.
09:56And is it because they're playing down to lesser opponents?
10:01Is the West Coast just the best thing for them?
10:03Because they know they're going to have to like
10:04play these elite teams
10:06and they're going to bring it every night.
10:08Tune in to SteelPod for Friday.
10:10Monday through Friday, you'll think.
10:13Yeah, it is.
10:14Those are, and those are all the questions
10:15I think they're going to be banning about the front office
10:18for the next month plus here
10:19as like trade season starts to ramp up
10:21and formalized tweaks of being like,
10:24is this like, are they able to still turn on
10:28or are some guys just not the same this year?
10:32And you can even, I mean,
10:33the obvious guys is like the older guys,
10:36but like that game on against on Christmas background,
10:37like they, I think their three-point shooting was masking
10:41just how they weren't like locked in
10:43at the beginning of that game.
10:44Like they were staying in the game
10:45because Horford and Porzingis were hitting threes,
10:47but like the rest of their offense
10:49and the defense just like was not like up to par.
10:53And you're like, this is the, like,
10:55it was covering up some maybe underlying issues
10:57in that point.
10:58So there's, it's one thing is that the game here and there,
10:59but now we're getting into, okay,
11:00this is like a week to two weeks and you can,
11:04there are reasonable excuses for it,
11:06but I think it might go a little bit deeper than that.
11:08One thing I'm looking at,
11:09like if you go down the roster right now,
11:11like Hauser, he took like,
11:14he's taken like three shots in the last two games.
11:16Totally.
11:17He's also been hurt.
11:18He's been in Atlanta.
11:19Exactly, that's like this back situation
11:20has been up and down all year long.
11:23That's like, oh, what's different from last year this year?
11:24Like if Sam Hauser is not healthy,
11:26like that's a pretty big deal for this team.
11:28And he's, he's crying and grind through it.
11:31But as anyone who's ever had back issues before,
11:35like that stuff goes on forever.
11:38Oh, I'm normally back issues are just solved
11:40pretty easily, right?
11:40You just need to take it.
11:41Yeah, you know, you just go to the chiropractor,
11:43just snap it back into place and you'll be good in a week.
11:46So that's, that's a scary thing of like, you know,
11:48he holds up defensively well when he's healthy,
11:51but then you have Maxi, as Jay pointed out,
11:55telling us all the time, like he can, yeah,
11:56he can stay in front of anyone, anyone in that game.
11:58And if he's not hitting threes, not being aggressive,
12:02then that's like a big deal.
12:03Cause we all know Joe, like behind them on the wing
12:07right now, there's been no real reliable options.
12:10And so if he's not there,
12:11if he's not able to soak up minutes than that,
12:13the weight falls harder on Brown and Tatum
12:16or, or Derek White even,
12:18and that stuff can start to add up
12:19over the grind of the year.
12:20So you look at that Drew holiday,
12:25his numbers have been, I think,
12:27relatively down offensively.
12:29Like he's not playing as much
12:31like cause he had small knocks.
12:33And so it's like, I think it's a combination of
12:36not everyone's been available,
12:37but then when they have been available,
12:39they haven't been necessarily at the level
12:41they were last year and holiday and Hauser, I think.
12:44And I think Jalen at this point, it just his shooting.
12:47I know it's, we've talked about it in prior podcasts.
12:49It's not, maybe not a huge concern
12:51cause you imagine he's going to return to it,
12:52but he's not having the best shooting season of his career.
12:56Some would say he's having the worst
12:57or like since his like rookie or sophomore season,
13:01just in terms of percentages.
13:02So I think it's definitely a combination
13:06of not getting your best performances
13:08from some of these players.
13:10And then these players just not being necessarily available.
13:13I talked about that.
13:14The one lineup that has played four games together,
13:19they have a negative 9.6 net rating.
13:23That's holiday, poor Zingas, Jalen, Jason and Derek White.
13:25So like what you think your starting lineup is,
13:29they have a negative net rating of 118 defensive rating.
13:32So they're just like-
13:33That's the month of December?
13:34Yeah, that's in the month of December.
13:37That lineup is giving up a opponent
13:40three point percentage of 48%.
13:43And so that's supposed to be your go-to championship lineup.
13:47It is admittedly small sample size.
13:49Like I said, that was kind of my point.
13:50It's only been four games,
13:52but to be giving up that high percentage from three
13:56when you're supposed to be the team
13:58that's out in Athens teams
13:59and have your star lineup be that porous defensively,
14:04it's no wonder that you're gonna be in close games
14:08against the Bulls.
14:09Or I mean, maybe sometimes it's a fluke
14:12and Caleb Martin hits seven of nine threes,
14:14but you gotta do better on...
14:17Even if your game plan is to let Caleb Martin
14:19shoot those shots,
14:21you have to still contest him a little bit.
14:23And there was, of those seven, I think four were wide open
14:27and it just wasn't like effective defense.
14:30Even if that's like who you want shooting,
14:32he's still an NBA player.
14:34He still shoots 45% from three against the Celtics.
14:37You gotta do something to make him
14:38a little bit less comfortable out there.
14:40Yeah, and you brought this up in yesterday's pop package,
14:42I think was a good point,
14:43with like going back and looking at those.
14:46That wasn't a strategic thing to avoid.
14:47That was like a Celtics defense that was scrambling
14:50and rotating and someone making a mistake
14:53and then all hell breaking loose,
14:55leading to wide open looks for Martin
14:58and other guys on the team.
14:59There was a couple where it was just poor Zingas was like,
15:00I'm on you, I'm not gonna contest.
15:03And that was like the first couple of ones.
15:04But then the ones that really, the back breakers were,
15:07we messed up on a switch, we fell down.
15:11And so, yeah, it just wasn't good
15:13defensive execution whatsoever.
15:14Right, like we rotate off.
15:15There's one where Tatum was going to help at the basket,
15:19but like was too far away to actually make any impact
15:22in that he was straight enough away from Martin
15:24to give him just a wide open three.
15:25So it's like stuff like that,
15:27where Al Horford talked to us after the game on Christmas
15:30saying like, yeah, we just need to like,
15:33everyone needs to lock in a little more.
15:35Like, and I think, and we were,
15:36and Jay actually followed up being asked like,
15:38what does that mean?
15:39And he's just like, no, it's just like,
15:41he didn't like wanna call anyone else typically,
15:43but I think it's clear like the focus
15:46on both ends of the floor has not been there at times
15:49in the string of the stretch.
15:50And now you have a Pacers team coming to town,
15:54back where that is, you know,
15:56historically given this team a good run for its money.
15:59And they've been very bad to begin the year,
16:00but they've been kind of putting it together
16:02in the last couple of weeks.
16:03They've had some good wins here.
16:05They're healthy.
16:06And so they're gonna be coming in here, we're gonna go.
16:10And so you got that and then a Raptors game
16:13and then a brutal Western Conference stretch
16:16coming up after that.
16:17So this is, there's not much time
16:19to kind of figure it out here.
16:21You're at home, but you're actually been worse at home
16:24than on the road this year.
16:25And they already actually have more home losses
16:27this year Packers than they had all of last year,
16:29which is kind of wild to me.
16:31Well, last year they had the crazy kind of home
16:33winning streak to start the year.
16:35But yeah, I do think this stretch of games
16:36before the West Coast trip is pretty important.
16:40And if you wanna see Andrew Nembhard
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17:50Now, that being said,
17:54we've got a little negative here
17:58because the Celtics have struggled
17:59and you don't expect them to be six and five
18:02over any really stretch of the season.
18:04It's not something that we experienced at all last year.
18:09Jason Tatum has been pretty good, at least numerically,
18:13especially putting up double digit rebound games.
18:19I have a feeling that if this team
18:21gets their top eight guys all healthy
18:24and all playing multiple games in a row,
18:30I have no real concern about what this team can do.
18:33I just don't think we've seen
18:36basically a fully stocked roster for Joe Mazzuola to use.
18:41And it seems like Tatum has responded.
18:44He did not have the best game against the Sixers.
18:46Jay and I talked about a little of this.
18:47Well, it's like a little sloppy there,
18:48but he's still finished with 30 points and 16 boards.
18:53But I feel like he's been doing a pretty solid job
18:56and had that huge performance
18:58after the famous Bon Temp's drop hole came out
19:00and had him in a distance fourth place in the MVP.
19:04But I don't think we can put blame
19:07on the one on top right now,
19:10which is normally where the blame goes in a situation.
19:12You normally blame the star player.
19:15But I think Tatum's been pretty superb,
19:18especially in December.
19:19Yeah, I mean, 29, nine, and five are his averages right now.
19:27And yeah, there are certain guys on the roster
19:31that have helped cover up any sort of major deficiencies,
19:35which there may or may not be with this team.
19:37But Tatum is the last guy you're worried about right now
19:41once he's got, hopefully his fluid intake
19:43is back to where he needs it to be
19:45after the Monday situation.
19:47But yeah, Tatum's been great.
19:50Pritchard was bad on Christmas,
19:51but he obviously has been
19:54the third, fourth best player in this team period.
19:57I think Horford has been as rock solid as you could hope
20:02on a nightly basis.
20:03Like, yeah, like maybe people talked about like,
20:06you know, some pay protection issues with him.
20:07Maybe at the beginning of the year,
20:08those have kind of faded in most games late,
20:11but offensively he's giving you all you could hope for
20:13and more shooting 40% from three.
20:17And Derek White, I guess is like dipped a bit lately,
20:21but that's more of like,
20:23he was playing at such a high level Packard.
20:25I think it's like, yeah, this is gonna happen.
20:27Like he's not gonna be shooting 45% from three
20:30for a whole season here.
20:30Like these are some progression to the mean
20:33for guys like that.
20:34So like, those are, if you're looking at the whole roster,
20:36like those are the guys I think you feel best about.
20:40And then it's like Jalen with the three-point shooting,
20:45Drew with three-point shooting
20:47and just his overall health,
20:49Porzingis we hit on a lot there and then Hauser.
20:53And then beyond that right now, again,
20:55it's like you had a little bit too Packard.
20:58Like when Porzingis comes back,
20:59it's like, it's kind of been a revolving door
21:01of like, who's gonna play Cornette, Kata,
21:04like even Jaden Springer.
21:06Jordan Walsh will play, Jaden Springer will play.
21:09So I mean, from, how do you think Joe's handled
21:12the last month from that standpoint of like
21:14the mixing and matching of those guys?
21:16Has it been up to where you would want to be at this point?
21:21I feel like I'm on of two minds on this one.
21:23Cause there's the stay ready approach where it's like,
21:28these guys need to be prepared for at any point,
21:31Joe can look down the bench and be there
21:34and be like, it's your turn to be in this game.
21:37But if I know anything about NBA players
21:39is that they love routine and knowing
21:41when they're going to come into the game.
21:42And that's like, so much of it is a mental
21:46just battle of like being consistent.
21:49And I guess Joe prides and the staff prides
21:52like being a part of that stay ready group.
21:54But I think it's gotta be pretty frustrating for like,
22:00I don't know, we thought we,
22:01there was like what, three games of Peterson.
22:03Then we got a random Jaden Springer game.
22:05Then we got a random Jordan Walsh game.
22:08I don't think Nemi was probably supposed to play yesterday
22:10until Chris Tapps got hurt,
22:13but there was a Nemi stretch of time there.
22:16And so I do think that's gotta be harder
22:18for those bench guys just to like
22:21figure out what their role is
22:22and how to come in and check into a game.
22:24And so, I don't know, I think it'd be interesting
22:26to get Joe's perspective on like what he is thinking
22:30when it's like, if it's purely matchup dependent
22:33or it's just like, we're in December
22:35and we're going to try some shit
22:36and throw things against the wall.
22:38Because I think that is something
22:39that Brad Stevens was pretty good at.
22:41I think he feel like separated the season into quarters
22:45where it's like the first quarter
22:46we're just trying to figure out what we had.
22:47Then he kind of tried some stuff in the second quarter.
22:50Then he tried to like really solidify that
22:52and nail it down third quarter.
22:53And then like fourth quarter
22:54you're just building for the playoffs.
22:55And so maybe Joe's just in his kind of like,
22:58I don't know, maybe Jayden Springer
22:59will give us something in this moment.
23:00He didn't, but I'm curious.
23:05Like, I don't know if that necessarily
23:07is like the thing that's like swinging these games.
23:09I feel like it's much more of like defensive effort
23:12from the top six, top seven guys.
23:15Yeah, no question.
23:16This is a situation where there should never be a point
23:21where those decisions are swinging these games
23:23unless you're down a couple of bodies.
23:26But yeah, I think you're, I'm with you.
23:28And I'm honestly like, I'm curious where like,
23:31I thought Drew Peterson actually was like
23:33playing fairly well for them.
23:35And then he just kind of fell off the map.
23:36I know he played in the G League showcase in Orlando.
23:39And so he was down there for a while with Shireman.
23:43But if Hauser's not himself or just not, you know,
23:48just not healthy, then that's the guy would be like,
23:51all right, like, I'd want to see him more
23:54out of all the options he's kind of rolled through
23:56in the last couple of weeks.
23:56And then I do think there've been times in the game
23:59it's like Cornette against a small ball sixers lineup
24:03did not work.
24:05K to two, obviously like those guys are valuable guys
24:08and they give this a lot,
24:09but there are certain lineups where you're like,
24:11this is like, this is trouble.
24:13Like this is not-
24:14But who do they go to in that moment
24:15when you need to match Horford with Embiid's moments?
24:19And then-
24:20You go to him at the five.
24:21Like, is that a situation where you just screw it?
24:24Like-
24:25But then Tatum has played basically the entire second half.
24:29And so it's like, you want to tax him
24:30at playing him at the five
24:31for this random game in December.
24:33You bring up James Springer.
24:35I've seen some people tweeting on the interwebs.
24:38Like he's the only person that could like
24:40possibly get traded, right?
24:42Like he is as a contract that could possibly get moved.
24:46I've seen that.
24:47I don't think they're going to be able to trade
24:49James Springer and picks for anyone who's like
24:52better than Sam Houser at this point.
24:54But if Sam Houser is so inconsistent with his back,
24:58it's like, I don't know.
25:00You know these things, B-Rob.
25:01You tell me what's possible out there.
25:03Yeah, it's a situation.
25:07And then I'll go through this as you will hear
25:10from about our sponsor price picks in a second here.
25:12But if you're talking about your pick
25:14of where you want to add to the roster right now,
25:17I do think that the Wink situation
25:20is where I'd look to because of the Houser.
25:22Like you have someone known there.
25:24You have some unreliable guys behind them.
25:27And Springer is, you know, $4 million in the books.
25:32So you're not going to be able to,
25:33you're only gonna be able to add someone on the cheap there
25:35or just open straight up, open up that roster spot
25:37and sign someone on the free agent market.
25:39But yeah, there's, without a doubt,
25:41like Springer is, whether it's for tax concerns,
25:45whether it's just because you want to upgrade that spot,
25:47like he is the most likely candidate to go.
25:49And the question is, if you're Brad Stevens now,
25:51it's like, how soon do you wait to see
25:54where the market develops?
25:55Or do you want to get more help in here now
25:57because you need, you want to take the onus
25:59off of minutes for Houser
26:00and the rest of the Winks in this roster,
26:02you know, sooner rather than later,
26:04if you know you're going to go in that direction anyway.
26:06Yeah.
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27:28Now B-Rod, we just got the injury report
27:29for the game against the Indiana Pacers.
27:33Drew Holliday questionable
27:34and Chris Stapps Porzingis questionable.
27:38That's good news.
27:39I think that's good news.
27:41I think every Chris Stapps injury,
27:42they're just extremely precautious
27:44because they want him to be available
27:46and they don't want anything to turn into a long-term injury.
27:49But I was like, I think like you,
27:50the last time he got hurt, I was like,
27:52oh, he's going to be out a couple of games.
27:53And then he just came back and played normally.
27:55I feel like we're likely to see him against the Pacers.
28:00Maybe, when's the last time we saw the top eight
28:04like fully be healthy?
28:05I think we got it for a game in Chicago
28:08and then Derek White got hurt at the end of that game.
28:10So I don't think we've gotten a full 48 minutes
28:12of the full top eight guys in competition healthy.
28:16It's kind of wild.
28:17And whether, I mean, we'll get there at some point,
28:21maybe might be, we have to wait till January.
28:24But it is that day, like for all the nitpicking
28:28we've kind of gone through here,
28:29like the fact of the matter
28:30is they haven't had everyone together.
28:32And even just having everyone together,
28:34if it's like, if how they're still,
28:35if they're how close are they to a hundred percent
28:37when they are on the floor together is another question.
28:40But the good news is this is December.
28:45Realistically, the one seed, if it does go out of reach,
28:50I don't think that's a huge deal.
28:51Like, I don't think this is a team
28:53that's going to get too flustered going into Cleveland
28:58if it comes down to that.
28:59Now, from a matchup standpoint in the first round,
29:02like the where, how high Philly gets up in the standings
29:05is going to be a fascinating thing.
29:06Cause if that's, if they are lingering
29:08in the playing tournament, then, you know,
29:12if you're a two versus three, like that,
29:15that sort of stuff will could ultimately matter.
29:17But that's way down the line at this point.
29:20And I think forgetting about the standings right now,
29:23I think Joe and his staff is probably just looking at him
29:25like, all right, how can we just get back
29:27to like where we're bringing that consistency back
29:30that we had all of last year,
29:31that we had for most of the first month of the year.
29:35What we've seen so far kind of brings back shades
29:38of a couple of years ago, Packard maybe,
29:40of like where they, you know, shot the lights out
29:44for the first 20 games or so,
29:46and then it started to peter out.
29:48And now we're seeing the three point shooting.
29:50I think they were like down to, you know,
29:53middle of the pack and the whole NBA right now,
29:55which is a surprising place for them to be
29:57given how much talent they have in this roster.
30:00Yeah, it's, who knows?
30:03This is, that's why this is an important stretch
30:05to win these games against the Pacers,
30:07win this game against the Raptors
30:08before you go and test yourself on the West Coast.
30:11Like the East is getting better.
30:14Like the Bucks have seemed to have rebounded.
30:16The Sixers are rebounding a little bit.
30:17And so it's not as much of a, just like a two tiered team.
30:20The Magic are gonna come back
30:22once those guys finally get obliques.
30:25But obviously we saw that without them,
30:28they can still play a very tough game
30:30and they have, they're a type of team
30:31that's bringing intensity.
30:33You mentioned the Knicks.
30:34And so I do think just in terms of creating,
30:38like everyone talked last year about the easy,
30:40easy playoff path that the Celtics had.
30:43And some of that had to do with injuries,
30:45but they were also the one seed.
30:46And so they got to play the Heat in the first round.
30:49And then they got to play the Cavs.
30:52Like the bracket worked out for them.
30:55You put yourself in the two seed or even the three seed,
30:57you just make that path that much harder.
31:00One team that they probably won't be playing
31:02in the playoffs, and I say this now,
31:04and I probably will live to regret it,
31:07is the Miami Heat.
31:09They have not been great this year,
31:11but the vibes are interesting down in Miami.
31:14And this has been a long saga.
31:16Two weeks ago, Shams from ESPN tweets some stuff
31:20about Jimmy Butler wanting specific team.
31:23He wants out and he wants to be traded
31:25to three specific teams.
31:27Then Jimmy Butler wears those team colors in his hair.
31:31It was like yellow for the Warriors,
31:34blue for the Mavericks, and red for the Rockets.
31:39Then Jimmy Butler's agent comes out and says,
31:42how dare you, Shams?
31:43How dare you put your name or my client's name
31:46in your mouth and insult Shams?
31:49It did not, Shams came right back on ESPN
31:51and said, I stand by reporting.
31:53And then on Christmas day, he says,
31:56Jimmy is really making waves.
31:57He wants to out here in Miami.
32:01I've heard some scuttlebutt around the league.
32:02Jimmy's trying to really get out of there
32:04because his contract is up.
32:06And it feels like the Heat are really not wanting
32:08to give him that long, big money extension.
32:12But then today, after Shams ruins Miami Christmas
32:17with this report, Pat Riley comes out
32:20and makes a statement of his own.
32:23Pat, who made quite a statement in the offseason
32:26about Jimmy, I just don't want to get his ass on the floor
32:28and tell him to shut up after he has made comments
32:31in that subject series, comes out and says,
32:33we usually don't comment on rumors,
32:35but all this speculation has become a distraction
32:37to the team and it is not fair to the players
32:39and the coaches.
32:40Therefore, we will make it clear,
32:41we are not trading Jimmy Butler.
32:45End of statement.
32:46Now, first of all,
32:47let's talk about Pat Riley's statements, Packard.
32:48Do you remember Pat Riley's statement
32:50to Danny Ainge back in the day?
32:52Didn't he say, fuck Danny Ainge?
32:53Yeah, exactly.
32:54So this was like, this might be a close two
32:57to Pat Riley's most famous statements.
33:01But I'll start here.
33:04Is Pat Riley a liar?
33:06Yes, absolutely.
33:07So this is like, this is just,
33:09and is this posturing going to work at all
33:12or is trying to posture against Jimmy Butler
33:14just a losing move?
33:16Yeah, I don't know if this is a statement
33:19against other teams who are like,
33:21calling about Jimmy Butler,
33:22or this is a statement to try and shut Jimmy Butler
33:25up himself from a guy who's making a lot of noise
33:28in the locker room about like, demanding a trade.
33:31But when I read that statement,
33:32I read that as sounding like,
33:35that's a team that's going to trade Jimmy Butler.
33:37Like, if you don't come out
33:39and say you're not going to do anything,
33:42if they get a good offer,
33:44it only makes sense for them to trade Jimmy Butler.
33:46If they're also not willing to sign him,
33:48you don't let someone of that talent walk away for nothing.
33:52It's extremely hard, especially in this,
33:55I guess, salary cap.
33:56Like what free agency doesn't really,
33:58is not a thing anymore.
34:01Yeah, like Brooklyn's the only team with real cap room
34:04to sign Jimmy outright this off season.
34:07So Jimmy either needs two things.
34:10He needs A, like more teams to open up that cap space,
34:14which is very hard to do this summer to get him.
34:17Or B, he needs the heat to trade him preemptively.
34:21And so he can sign an extension
34:24where he wants to sign an extension.
34:26And the heat obviously,
34:29the teams that you hear rumored here of like,
34:32oh, like the Mavericks, the Warriors, the Suns.
34:35Like you hear the Suns and like the Mavericks,
34:37you're like, what the hell are they going to give?
34:40Like they have exhausted their assets already.
34:42Like the Suns have like two draft picks left.
34:45Unless they're going to take back Bradley Beal.
34:47Like I don't see how that's going to work out.
34:48Or you can take, right.
34:49You take like another terrible contract,
34:51which the heat, which Pat Riley doesn't want to do.
34:52So I understand from that standpoint of like,
34:56all right, Jimmy, like you want to go somewhere
34:58and you want to pick your landing spot.
35:00You're not helping us with leverage at all.
35:03So we need to tell everyone to like F off right now, I guess.
35:07The Mavericks, they just lost Luka Doncic for a bit.
35:09Do you think they did something crazy?
35:11I don't even think they have the
35:12how to even get to Jimmy's salary with.
35:14That's the thing.
35:15Like they don't I don't know how they get there
35:17with Kyrie and Luke on there.
35:18Like they have to package up a lot of everything else.
35:21And I don't I think those are important pieces
35:23or the rest of their team
35:24to get there, because Jimmy makes a ton of money right now.
35:27He's making forty nine million dollars.
35:30And then he has a player option for fifty two million next year.
35:33So I think like realistic teams
35:35like the Rockets have the stuff to do it
35:38and they have the young players that probably would entice
35:42Miami in the package.
35:44The Warriors, potentially, I guess like you can make the case for,
35:47you know, they could do it.
35:48They have to give up Wiggins and like like coming in like some price,
35:53some other younger guys.
35:54And that's where it's like.
35:55I feel like those are the two realistic spots.
35:58If he's going to go anywhere, it's going to be those.
36:00But if you're Pat Riley and he right now, you can't look at what this team is
36:04and be like, all right, we're this is worth keeping together for one last run.
36:07Like there are five hundred team.
36:10Jimmy's been pretty good.
36:11Bam's been up and down.
36:13Heroes playing great numbers wise, but they're they're still five hundred team.
36:17And so they're going to get smoked at some point in the playoffs.
36:21And then are they just going to hope that Jimmy doesn't have any offers
36:26and then once will eventually opt into his last year of his deal?
36:29Like, I don't know.
36:30Like that, that's a pretty damn risky play given Jim Butler's history.
36:35Yeah, I mean, if anyone would not pick up a 50 million dollar player option,
36:39it might be Jimmy Butler.
36:41He's made a fair amount of money in his career,
36:42and he knows how to ruin a locker room real quick.
36:45So he might he might pick up that option
36:48and then publicly demand a trade like in front of the like right on South Beach.
36:53And so. If I'm the he, I kind of want to avoid that situation,
36:57but also I know Pat Riley and like Alonzo Mourning,
37:01they have some some championship pedigree on their own
37:03and they don't like to be pushed around, especially by someone like Jimmy.
37:08I think they this is where the heat culture kind of all breaks down,
37:11because if you have multiple alphas in the heat culture environment,
37:15it's too much heat culture.
37:17Things are too hot.
37:18And so I'm fascinated to see.
37:20I think to me, the Rockets deal makes the most sense if I'm the heat,
37:24just because they have a bunch of young players.
37:27And so maybe you can get back Jabari Parker.
37:31Jabari Smith.
37:33That's true. Jabari Parker is
37:36was the number like to pick like a decade ago.
37:39He's available. I bet you get him.
37:41I bet they could get him as far as I don't know if you can match salary.
37:43You probably have to throw someone else in there.
37:45Jabari Smith is the young big on the Rockets,
37:49but they have some other guys they drafted just don't really play right now.
37:53I think Kim Whitmore's on that team.
37:55He was. And so if they really do want to blow it up,
37:59but they maintain they're not they are not trading Jimmy Butler,
38:02according to this press release,
38:04I would not be surprised at all if they traded Jimmy Butler.
38:07Yeah. If I was going to be betting on this, I'm a few like this is going to end.
38:12But this is Riley trying to at least get Butler back in line, being like, OK, like
38:18you have to cooperate, at least pretend you're like all in right now
38:21to not screw us and to not screw our,
38:25you know, leverage in the negotiations, because if you with the leaks,
38:29all those questions that came out now, like it's hard to build a market
38:34if you're the heat, if you're realistically, it's only say
38:37I'm going to go to three or four teams and half those teams don't have shit.
38:41Yeah. If I'm the Rockets, I'm just waiting because like, OK, you're going to go.
38:45You're going to build around Andrew Wingans.
38:46Are you really that excited about Kuminga right now?
38:48I'm not going to include this extra draft pick in this deal.
38:51And so the thing that's also interesting is that
38:55Jimmy Butler doesn't like being backed into a corner.
38:58And so what is Jimmy Butler's response going to be?
39:01He openly like walked into Timberwolves practice and ran stuff
39:05with the third team and just talk shit to the GM the entire time.
39:08And so it's going to be very
39:12a very interesting saga down in Miami that I think will
39:16will at least keep our attention through the through the trade.
39:18Celtics feel pretty great right now looking at this for
39:22being 22 and whatever, seven,
39:2522 and eight.
39:28But it's funny, though, because you look at this where the Rat Packer to put like
39:30versus where the Heat are and the what if situations of Willard
39:34a couple of years ago in those trade talks and the fallout of the
39:38the twenty three finals there.
39:40But the Heat have just been on themselves over and over again that
39:46I think that clock has just run out and where they're where Brad Stevens
39:49was practically being like, OK, we have to like push all in now.
39:52We have to go for what else can we add now?
39:54Because we only have a finite window to do that.
39:58They maximized it last year.
40:00They're in position to do it again this year.
40:02And now still 22 and eight with Porzingis being out for 20 games
40:06like they would have taken that in a heartbeat before the season started, I think.
40:09And so this like the smaller stuff right now, it's all fixable in theory
40:14as long as they do get back to their full health.
40:16But big picture wise, they're still in a great spot in the East.
40:19They just have there's just more competition now for them deals.
40:22Yeah. And it's just, you know, they they made so much of like
40:26Banner 18 was the thing that you just heard around the Celtics
40:30basically for the last 10 years before this.
40:34You don't hear a lot of chatter, but you know,
40:36Banner 19 has not become a thing, and maybe they need to lock in more
40:40and refocus on Banner 19.
40:42Change the LLC name like whatever you need to do, because.
40:46Well, they're still the team back or they're still on the team.
40:48So it's hard to invest in that stuff right now with that on the back burner,
40:51which is I mean, we haven't gotten to that, but that is that will drop
40:54at some point probably in the next month or two.
40:56And yeah, I think they starting to get bids.
40:59I think Himmelsbach reported that like is starting in the new year.
41:01They'll start getting actual bids.
41:02So we'll know who that is.
41:03But there needs to be a refocusing in on Banner 19.
41:08Maybe that hasn't been a charm season, Packard.
41:10It hasn't been a charm.
41:10No, it has not been charmed.
41:12As the great Jay King described last year, it's not been charmed.
41:15But maybe they can recapture that charm this weekend
41:18against the Indiana Pacers.
41:19They got two games, a Friday and a Sunday.
41:23We'll be back for you in your feeds Monday morning
41:26or we'll be on the postgame potable potable postgame Sunday night
41:30after that Pacers game.
41:31So if you want to tune into that, go to Patreon dot com slash still potable.
41:36We appreciate everyone who's watching on CLNS YouTube page.
41:39We are a Monday through Friday Boston Celtics podcast.
41:43And again, you can access all of our great content at Patreon dot com
41:47slash still potable.
41:48Have a great weekend and we'll be back Monday morning.
41:52Thanks for listening.