Debate - The Bible and The Quran - in the Light of Science Dr Zakir Naik vs. Dr William - Part 2
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00:00:00Now I call upon Dr. William Campbell to present his response to Dr. Zakir Naik.
00:00:31Well, Dr. Naik has brought up some real problems.
00:00:37I don't agree with his answer about the Koran in terms of the alaqa and mudaqa.
00:00:43I still think it's a big problem.
00:00:47But that's his opinion and my opinion.
00:00:50So everybody will have to go home and think about it themselves.
00:00:55He spoke about he hasn't met any person that took the poison test.
00:01:04I can't present the person because he's already gone to be with the Lord.
00:01:08But I have a friend, Harry Radcliffe.
00:01:12And he lived in a town in the south of Morocco.
00:01:16And one of his people, who he thought was a friend, invited him over for a lunch, for a dinner.
00:01:25And he invited the wife and son also.
00:01:30And so when Harry agreed to go, somebody came and knocked on the door and said,
00:01:36the man's going to poison you.
00:01:38So they went.
00:01:41Harry took this very verse that you've read.
00:01:45And he decided that he should go because he had said he would.
00:01:49So he went.
00:01:51He waited, hoping to find a time when the man brought in the couscous.
00:01:55The man would go out and he could turn the couscous around.
00:01:58But there was no such time.
00:02:01So he dug in and he ate.
00:02:04His wife, she wasn't able to eat very much.
00:02:08And they had fed their son before they went.
00:02:12But Harry ate.
00:02:15And that night, Harry got pains in his tummy.
00:02:18And he had some blood.
00:02:20But he lived.
00:02:22And so two days later, he went and knocked on the door.
00:02:25And the man came and opened the door and his face went absolutely white.
00:02:29And Harry thanked him for the meal.
00:02:36So I give you this one example anyway.
00:02:42Now you have said about Jesus was only sent to the Jews.
00:02:47Only go to the Jews and not to the Gentiles.
00:02:52Well, in the Koran itself, it talks about Mary.
00:02:58And then she says, I don't know any man.
00:03:01In Sura 19, 21.
00:03:03And then it says that Jesus is to be a sign unto man and a mercy from us.
00:03:11In Matthew 4, 9, a lady came and anointed Jesus' feet.
00:03:17He said, wherever this gospel is preached in the whole world,
00:03:22what this woman has done will be told.
00:03:25And in Matthew 28, when Jesus is about to ascend into heaven,
00:03:30he says, go into all the world and preach the gospel.
00:03:34Well, this is not a contradiction.
00:03:37He did say to his disciples, go only to the Jews.
00:03:41Because the Jews were given a certain chance.
00:03:45There's a story in the Bible.
00:03:49Shouldn't use the word story, I suppose, but history.
00:03:52Where Jesus came to a fig tree.
00:03:55And the fig tree had brought no fruit for three years.
00:03:59And so he said, shall I tear it down?
00:04:04And then Jesus' answer was, no.
00:04:07Leave it one more year and we'll fertilize it and see if it brings any fruit.
00:04:11This was all a parable about Israel.
00:04:15He had preached to them three years and he would preach another half.
00:04:19But then there are other parables that he told where he said, all right.
00:04:23It will be taken away from you, the blessing and given to the Gentiles.
00:04:35Dr. Naik has talked about the day and the periods.
00:04:41The day in the Bible also can have the time of a long period.
00:04:47Doesn't have to be 24 hours, as Dr. Bukai wanted to insist in his book.
00:04:52And I believe that it was long periods of time.
00:04:56And there are some of these problems that he has said.
00:05:03And I don't deny them.
00:05:05And I don't have good answers for them.
00:05:07But I will tell about.
00:05:09He spoke about the two kinds of salt.
00:05:29The sweet water and the salt water.
00:05:32I don't agree with his explanation.
00:05:37The Koran says that God has let free the two barriers.
00:05:44Two bodies of flowing water meeting together.
00:05:47Between them is a barrier which they do not transgress.
00:05:51Then which of the favors of your Lord will you deny?
00:05:55The word used here for barrier is barzakh.
00:05:58Means interval or gap or break or bar or obstruction or isimus.
00:06:04The same information is given in Al Furqan 2553.
00:06:09It is he who has let free the two bodies of flowing water.
00:06:14One palatable and sweet and the other salty and bitter.
00:06:19And he made between them a barrier and a partition that it is forbidden to pass.
00:06:24The phrase a partition that it is forbidden to pass represents two words from the same root.
00:06:30This is done in Arabic to stress or accent whatever is being discussed.
00:06:35The word hijr means forbidden, interdicted, prohibited.
00:06:39All very strong words.
00:06:41And the second word which is the last participle of the verb has the same,
00:06:45past participle of the verb has the same meanings.
00:06:48Therefore very literally one might translate this as he God made between them a bar and a forbidden forbidding.
00:06:57Dr. Bukai discusses this briefly and then he says though he admits at the end,
00:07:03well it mixes far out to sea.
00:07:06A scientist friend commenting on this said,
00:07:09it is simply that the salt and fresh water are physically separated.
00:07:13The effluent from the river displacing the seawater but there is no barrier.
00:07:18Thermodynamically the mixing is a spontaneous immediate process highly favored by entropy.
00:07:25The only barrier is kinetic.
00:07:28It takes a long time for that much stuff to mix.
00:07:31I myself have had a tiny example of this.
00:07:36I had a friend in Tunisia and he used to hunt for octopi.
00:07:43So I went there once and I jumped out of the boat and was swimming around
00:07:49and it was right at where our small creek came in
00:07:54and the top water was cold and the bottom water was hot.
00:08:01I thought how can this be?
00:08:03The top is cold and the bottom is hot.
00:08:05Then I realized the cold water was coming out of the river and the salt water is heavy.
00:08:13So the salt warm water was on the bottom and the cold light water was at the top.
00:08:19But there is no barrier.
00:08:39Dr. Naik spoke about languages
00:08:44and of course I am not able to answer about the languages in India.
00:08:51Well, I couldn't answer about the Indian languages in America either.
00:08:55So it's no different between India and America.
00:08:58However, the place that he talks about in the Bible,
00:09:01the disciples were given languages as a miracle
00:09:05but they were the languages that the people who were there knew.
00:09:10They weren't languages that were unknown.
00:09:13If somebody came from Spain, an apostle spoke to that person in his language from Spain.
00:09:19If another person came from Turkey,
00:09:21a different apostle spoke to the other person in his language from Turkey.
00:09:26I'm going to go to something that I prepared to give and talk about witnesses.
00:09:41In Deuteronomy, God told Moses the way to know true prophet was did his prophecy come true.
00:09:49Elijah is an example.
00:09:53Elias in the Koran.
00:09:55He went to the king and he told him it's not going to rain until I say so.
00:09:59And so it was six months and no rain.
00:10:03A year and no rain.
00:10:05Once in Tunisia there was a whole year with no rain.
00:10:07Then two years with no rain.
00:10:09And three years.
00:10:10And three and a half years.
00:10:12And then Elijah went to the king and he said,
00:10:16we're going to have a contest.
00:10:18And they went up on Mount Carmel and they had this contest.
00:10:21And the king lost.
00:10:23And in the Koran it says that Elias had a major wonderful victory.
00:10:28But then Elias fell down on his knees, Elijah, and he prayed for rain.
00:10:34And the rain came.
00:10:36Well, Elijah is the first witness.
00:10:39When he said it's not going to rain until I say so, he was the first witness.
00:10:42When God made the rain come, when Elijah fell down on his knees,
00:10:47God himself was the second witness.
00:10:51Another example is Isaiah 750 B.C.
00:10:55The Jews were sent into exile.
00:10:57He prophesied they'd be sent to exile.
00:11:00And then Cyrus would bring them back.
00:11:03Cyrus, who's Cyrus?
00:11:05250 years later, Cyrus, a Persian pagan king,
00:11:08sent the Jews back to Israel, back to Palestine.
00:11:13And there's a Cyrus cylinder in London that talks about it.
00:11:18So we're going to ask the question, did Jesus fulfill prophecies?
00:11:21Did Jesus do miracles?
00:11:23Did Jesus make prophecies?
00:11:39We're going to make a mathematical study of prophecies.
00:11:43It's called the theory of probabilities.
00:11:48Estimate, and we'll estimate the possibility
00:11:51that these prophecies could be fulfilled by chance.
00:11:55An example of this is supposing Dr. Naik has 10 shirts.
00:12:00And I know he has a red shirt.
00:12:03And I say, tomorrow he's going to wear the red shirt.
00:12:06And tomorrow he does.
00:12:08And so then I say, I'm a prophet.
00:12:11Well, my friends are going to say, no, no, that just happened by chance.
00:12:15Well, then, supposing Dr. Samuel Naaman,
00:12:17he has two pairs of shoes and a pair of sandals.
00:12:20So then the next day, I prophesy what shirt Dr. Naik is going to wear.
00:12:26And I prophesy that Dr. Samuel Naaman is going to wear his sandals.
00:12:31And Dr. Zabiel Ahmed, he has five hats.
00:12:34And I say he's going to wear his turban.
00:12:37Well, what are the chances that I could have all of these right by chance?
00:12:42Oh, it's gone away.
00:12:44Anyway, all right.
00:12:46You multiply 1 over 10 by 1 over 5 by 1 over 3.
00:12:52And you get 1 over 150.
00:12:55And that's my chance of getting it by luck.
00:12:58Is it possible to have the slide projector down, please?
00:13:02I mean the screen down.
00:13:12Well, the time is going, and we're going to look at 10 prophecies.
00:13:16And then one which we will not count because it is what we want to prove.
00:13:26The first one is a prophecy in Jeremiah 600 BC
00:13:37that the Messiah must be from the posterity of David.
00:13:41The days are coming, declares the Lord, when I will raise up to David a righteous branch,
00:13:46a king who will reign wisely and do what is just and right in the land.
00:13:51He will be called the Lord Yahweh, our righteousness.
00:13:55And the fulfillment was in the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent from God to Mary.
00:14:00The angel said to her, Do not be afraid, Mary.
00:14:03Behold, you will conceive in your womb and bear a son.
00:14:06He will be called Jesus, he will be great, and will be called the Son of the Most High.
00:14:11And the Lord God will give to him the throne of his father David.
00:14:15And in his kingdom there will be no end.
00:14:18And the angel said to her, The Holy Spirit will come upon you,
00:14:22and the power of the Most High will overshadow you.
00:14:27Therefore, the child to be born will be called holy.
00:14:31Well, when David was first, he was just from a small family.
00:14:35But after he became king and his family was known,
00:14:38then everybody would remember if they were the fifth cousin of the king.
00:14:42So I'm going to assume that 1 in 200 Jewish people belong to the family of David.
00:14:57The second prophecy is an everlasting rulers to be born in Bethlehem.
00:15:03Micah, 750 BC.
00:15:05But you, O Bethlehem Ephratah, who are little to be among the clans of Judah,
00:15:11from you shall come forth for me one who is to be ruler in Israel,
00:15:15whose origin is from of old, from ancient days.
00:15:19In the fulfillment, though Joseph and Mary lived in Nazareth,
00:15:23because of an order from Caesar Augustus,
00:15:25Joseph had to take Mary to Bethlehem, his native town.
00:15:29In the fulfillment, it says,
00:15:31and Joseph also went up from Galilee from the city of Nazareth to Judea,
00:15:36to the city of David, which is called Bethlehem,
00:15:39because he was of the house and lineage of David.
00:15:43And while there, she gave birth to her firstborn son.
00:15:46Well, what's the chance of being born in Bethlehem?
00:15:50There's about 2 billion people were born in the world from Micah until now.
00:15:58And 7,000 live in Bethlehem.
00:16:01So one man out of every 280,000 men was born in Bethlehem.
00:16:12The third prophecy, a messenger will prepare the way for the Messiah.
00:16:16This was done by Malachi in chapter 3, 1 in 400 BC.
00:16:20Behold, I send my message to prepare the way before me.
00:16:25And the Lord whom you seek will suddenly come to his temple.
00:16:29The messenger of the covenant is whom you delight, in whom you delight.
00:16:33Behold, he is coming, says the Lord of hosts.
00:16:36The fulfillment, the next day, John, John the Baptist,
00:16:41even Zechariah, saw Jesus coming toward him,
00:16:44and said, behold, the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world.
00:16:48This is he of whom I said, after me comes a man who ranks before me,
00:16:53for he was before me.
00:16:55And to this the Koran agrees also in the story of the family of Imran,
00:16:593.39.45, when it says that Yahya is to come,
00:17:04witnessing the truth of a word from God,
00:17:06whose name will be Christ Jesus, the son of Mary.
00:17:10Well, how many leaders had a forerunner?
00:17:13Well, that's hard to say.
00:17:15But when I put down one man in a thousand was a leader who had a forerunner.
00:17:24The fourth prophecy, the Messiah will do many signs and miracles.
00:17:30In Isaiah 7.50, we read, say to those with fearful hearts,
00:17:35be strong and do not fear, your God will come and he will save you.
00:17:39Then will the eyes of the blind be opened, and the ears of the deaf be unstopped.
00:17:44Then will the lame leap like a deer, and the tongue of the dumb shout for joy.
00:17:50The fulfillment.
00:17:52The Gospel states, it does the Koran, that Jesus did many miracles.
00:17:56The Bible speaks of only four prophets who did many miracles.
00:18:00Moses, Elijah, Elisha, and Jesus.
00:18:03Jesus is the only one that did all four types of miracles mentioned in the prophecy.
00:18:08And he sometimes healed all who came to him.
00:18:11Well, since many Muslims believe there were 124,000 prophets,
00:18:15we will use that number and say that Jesus was the one man in 124,000.
00:18:21The fifth prophecy.
00:18:23In spite of these signs, his brothers were against him.
00:18:27In the Psalm of David, 1000 B.C., he says,
00:18:30I have become a stranger to my brethren, an alien to my mother's sons.
00:18:35And in John, he gives the fulfillment.
00:18:39So his brothers said to him, leave here and go to Judea.
00:18:43For even his brothers did not believe in him.
00:18:46Our question might be, one ruler and how many would find his family against him?
00:18:51Well, many kings were overthrown by their own relatives.
00:18:54Therefore, we will say one in five.
00:18:57Or two times ten to the first power.
00:19:03And the sixth prophecy.
00:19:06It's given by Zachariah in 520 B.C.
00:19:09Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion.
00:19:11Shout, O daughter of Jerusalem.
00:19:13Behold, your king comes unto you.
00:19:15He is just and having salvation.
00:19:17Lowly and riding upon an ass.
00:19:20The fulfillment.
00:19:21The next day, the great crowd took palm branches
00:19:24and went out to meet him, shouting, Hosanna.
00:19:28Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.
00:19:30Blessed is the king of Israel.
00:19:32And Jesus found a young donkey and sat upon it.
00:19:35Well, obviously, Jesus chose to sit upon the donkey.
00:19:38That's no miracle.
00:19:39It's nothing unusual.
00:19:40But the crowd was there and the crowd came and praised him
00:19:46and said, Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.
00:19:50Well, how many rulers enter Jerusalem on a donkey?
00:19:57Nowadays, he'd come in a Mercedes.
00:20:00But one ruler, I said one ruler in a hundred.
00:20:05The seventh prophecy, Jesus foretells the destruction of the temple.
00:20:09He himself gave the prophecy.
00:20:11So Jesus said this sometime in 30 A.D.
00:20:15And as Jesus was going out of the temple,
00:20:17one of his disciples said to him,
00:20:19Teacher, behold what wonderful stones and what wonderful buildings.
00:20:23And Jesus said to him, Do you see these great buildings?
00:20:26Not one stone shall be left upon another which will not be torn down.
00:20:31In the fulfillment, about 40 years later in 70 A.D.,
00:20:35the Roman general Titus captured Jerusalem after a long siege.
00:20:39Titus had intended to spare the temple, but the Jews set it on fire.
00:20:44Well, for the Jews to revolt and then be crushed would be common.
00:20:49So I said one chance in five.
00:20:52For the eighth prophecy, the Messiah will be crucified.
00:20:57In Psalms, David wrote 1,000 B.C.,
00:21:00A band of evil men has encircled me.
00:21:03They have pierced my hands and my feet.
00:21:06David didn't die this way.
00:21:09He died in his bed.
00:21:11His feet and hands were not pierced.
00:21:14Luke gives us the fulfillment.
00:21:17When they came to the place called the skull,
00:21:20there they crucified Jesus along with the criminals.
00:21:23One on his right, the other on his left.
00:21:26Our question is, one man and how many has been crucified?
00:21:30Well, I said one man and 10,000.
00:21:35The prophecy, nine.
00:21:37They will divide his garments and cast lots for his robe.
00:21:41Again, this is David speaking.
00:21:44They divided my garments among them and cast lots for my clothing.
00:21:48Well, John gives us the fulfillment in chapter 19.
00:21:52When the soldiers crucified Jesus, they took his clothes,
00:21:56dividing them into four shares, one for each of them,
00:21:59with the undergarment remaining.
00:22:01This garment was seamless, woven in one piece from top to bottom.
00:22:06Let's not tear it, they said.
00:22:08Let's decide by lot who will get it.
00:22:10Well, how many criminals would have a seamless garment?
00:22:14Well, you can make your own decision, but I said one in 100.
00:22:22The 10th prophecy.
00:22:24Though innocent, he would be counted with the wicked
00:22:27and with the rich in his death.
00:22:29Isaiah said in 750 B.C. he was assigned a grave with the wicked
00:22:34and with the rich in his death, though he had done no violence,
00:22:37nor was any deceit in his mouth.
00:22:40He was numbered with the transgressors.
00:22:43Matthew gives us the fulfillment in chapter 20.
00:22:46When the soldiers crucified Jesus, they took his garments
00:22:49and with the transgressors.
00:22:51Matthew gives us the fulfillment.
00:22:56They crucified two robbers with him.
00:22:59As evening approached, there came a rich man from Arimathea
00:23:04named Joseph, a disciple of Jesus.
00:23:07Going to Pilate, he asked for Jesus' body.
00:23:10Joseph wrapped it in a clean linen cloth and placed it in his own tomb.
00:23:15Well, how many executed criminals were innocent?
00:23:18Well, I said one man in 10.
00:23:21And how many innocent men or how many criminals were buried with the rich?
00:23:25I said one man in 100.
00:23:27That gives one in 1,000.
00:23:33Finally, the prophecy.
00:23:36After dying, he will rise from the dead.
00:23:40In Isaiah again it says, for he was cut off from the land of the living.
00:23:44He died.
00:23:45And though the Lord makes his life a guilt offering,
00:23:48he will see his offspring and prolong his days.
00:23:52So there is a prophecy that he will come back to life.
00:23:56Luke tells us Jesus himself stood among them and said to them,
00:24:00Peace be with you.
00:24:02And then Paul gives us a summary in 1 Corinthians 15.
00:24:07That Jesus appeared to Peter and then to the 12.
00:24:11After that he appeared to more than 500 of the brothers at the same time,
00:24:15most of whom are still living.
00:24:17Then to James, Jesus' half-brother.
00:24:20Then to all the apostles.
00:24:23Well, that's not something you can give a value to.
00:24:29So now we're going to look at the calculation.
00:24:33One man and how many men?
00:24:35The world over will fulfill all 10 prophecies.
00:24:40This question can be answered by multiplying all of our estimates.
00:24:43I don't have time to read them,
00:24:45but the answer is 1 chance in 2 times 2.78 times 10 to the 28th, 28 zeros.
00:24:52Let us simplify and reduce the number by calling it 1 times 10 to the 28th.
00:24:58The best information available indicates the number of men who ever lived
00:25:01to be about 88 billion.
00:25:03We'll call that 1 times 10 to the 11th.
00:25:07Dividing these two numbers,
00:25:09we find that the chance that any man might have lived down to the present time
00:25:13and fulfilled all 10 prophecies by luck is 1 in 10 to the 17th.
00:25:18That's written out this way with 17 zeros.
00:25:22Well, let's try and imagine this.
00:25:24If you took the state of Texas and you covered it with dollar coins,
00:25:30one meter deep, three feet deep, silver dollars,
00:25:34and then one coin was marked electrically,
00:25:37and then I say, there, go walk out into the state of Texas and pick the right coin.
00:25:42That's your chance of picking the right coin by chance.
00:25:45In other words, it's no chance.
00:25:56I'm having trouble. Just a minute.
00:26:01There are many more prophecies.
00:26:02These all show the prophet David or Isaiah as the first witness.
00:26:07God causing fulfillment is the second witness.
00:26:10And God caused the disciples of Jesus to write it down.
00:26:14These are all proofs that the Bible is true and from Yahweh, Elohim.
00:26:18The gospel says that Jesus came from God and paid the penalty for our sins.
00:26:23This is good news.
00:26:24The Koran has hard news.
00:26:27Surah Nahal 1661 says,
00:26:30If Allah were to punish men for their wrongdoing,
00:26:33he would not leave on earth a single living creature.
00:26:38The problem is that the Koran states very clear that even those who have done their best are given only a maybe.
00:26:45In the surah of their narration, Al-Qassas, it says,
00:26:49But as for him who shall repent and believe and do right,
00:26:52perhaps, Asayan, he may be one of the successful.
00:26:57In the forbidding, At-Tahrim, it says,
00:27:00O you who believe, repent toward Allah with a sincere repentance.
00:27:04It may be that your Lord will repent from you your evil deeds.
00:27:08In the surah of repentance, Tawbah, it says,
00:27:12Those only shall worship in the mosques of Allah who believe in Allah on the last day
00:27:17and observe proper worship and give alms and fear none except the law.
00:27:21And it might be that these are of the rightly guided.
00:27:25In the end, it's very lonely.
00:27:27If a person does not believe, then he's sure to go to hell.
00:27:31But if he does believe on the day of judgment, he stands there all by himself in front of Allah.
00:27:36There is no intercessor or friend,
00:27:39and he can only hope that maybe, perhaps, he might be among the blessed.
00:27:43This is hard news.
00:27:45Where in his dictionary translates Asayan as it might be,
00:27:51it could be that, possibly, maybe, perhaps.
00:27:54In the Oxford dictionary, English Arabic, perhaps it's translated as Asayan.
00:28:01This may be true, but it's hard.
00:28:05On the other hand, the gospel has good news.
00:28:08Jesus said, I did not come to be served, but to serve to give my life a ransom for many.
00:28:13Another verse from Paul the apostle says,
00:28:16If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord
00:28:20and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead,
00:28:23you will be saved.
00:28:25Straight out.
00:28:27This is wonderful good news.
00:28:30You read with me these fulfilled prophecies as proofs.
00:28:34There were 500 people who saw Christ after he rose from the dead.
00:28:38There are many archeological finds confirm the Bible.
00:28:42I urge you, get a copy of the Bible, of the gospel, read it.
00:28:46You will find good news for your soul.
00:28:49May God bless you all. Thank you.
00:28:51Applause
00:28:58I now call upon Dr Zakir Naik to present his response to Dr William Campbell.
00:29:05Applause
00:29:14Praise be to God.
00:29:16Peace and blessings be upon the Messenger of God and all his family and companions.
00:29:20I seek refuge in God from the accursed Satan.
00:29:23In the name of God, the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful.
00:29:25Do not ponder over the Qur'an, even if it is from God.
00:29:29There is no doubt about it.
00:29:31In the name of God, the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful.
00:29:33The Lord is my heart and my life.
00:29:36He is the only one who understands my speech.
00:29:39Respected Dr William Campbell,
00:29:41the other people on the dais,
00:29:43my respected elders, and my dear brothers and sisters,
00:29:46I welcome all of you once again with the Islamic greetings.
00:29:49As-salamu alaykum wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuh.
00:29:53May peace, mercy, and blessings of Almighty God be on all of you.
00:29:59Dr William Campbell only touched on two out of the 22 points I made.
00:30:05Only two.
00:30:06The first point he raised,
00:30:15was he thinks that the days mentioned in the Bible,
00:30:19he refers to as long periods.
00:30:22I already gave the reply in my talk,
00:30:24that if you consider the days to be long periods like the Qur'an,
00:30:28you can only solve two problems.
00:30:32The six day creation problem,
00:30:34and first day light came, and third day earth.
00:30:36But the remaining four problems yet is there.
00:30:39So Dr William Campbell chose to say days are long period,
00:30:42and out of six, he solved two scientific errors.
00:30:46The remaining four of the creation of the universe, he does agree to it.
00:30:49That's good.
00:30:51And he says it's difficult to answer.
00:30:54The second point he touched on,
00:30:56was regarding the scientific test of Mark,
00:30:58chapter number 16, verse number 17 and 18.
00:31:01And he said one of his friend by the name of Harry,
00:31:04whatever the name was,
00:31:06in Morocco,
00:31:09he ate couscous.
00:31:12The Bible says,
00:31:14the King James Version as well as the New International Version,
00:31:17which Dr William Campbell refers to,
00:31:19drink deadly poison, not eat, drink.
00:31:29Yet, yet, I don't mind,
00:31:32even a person eats deadly poison also no problem,
00:31:35but imagine one man in Morocco.
00:31:37I'm told there are two billion Christians in the world.
00:31:39No one can come forward.
00:31:41Not one out of the two billion.
00:31:43And I thought Dr William Campbell was a true Christian believer,
00:31:46and I asked him to pass the test,
00:31:48not his friend who already died.
00:31:51And he said that blood came out of the mouth.
00:31:59Dr William Campbell, and even I know very well,
00:32:01being medical doctors,
00:32:03that having poison, blood comes out,
00:32:05and we cure many people of poison, so it's so great.
00:32:07The test is, they should come forward,
00:32:09and do all these things,
00:32:11and yet, you should be able to speak foreign tongues.
00:32:14And Dr William Campbell said,
00:32:17that at that time, if you read Gospel of Mark, chapter 16,
00:32:22those people there, they spoke the languages people knew.
00:32:26And foreign tongues.
00:32:28Dr William Campbell doesn't know there are Indians out here,
00:32:30surely many know Gujarati, Marathi, even I know.
00:32:34Suppose if I ask you,
00:32:37if I ask in a particular language,
00:32:39Nirgut, Tamil,
00:32:43no reply.
00:32:44Foreign tongues.
00:32:46Nirgut, anyone know Tamil?
00:32:48Or Malayalam? Vellam?
00:32:52Yes, very good.
00:32:54Are you a Christian believer?
00:32:56Are you?
00:32:57I'm asking that person there.
00:32:59You are a Muslim?
00:33:00Anyway, fine, this was supposed to be a test passed by Christian believers.
00:33:03There are many people who know foreign languages out here,
00:33:05only thing you had to do was speak to them,
00:33:07like, what is your name, how are you,
00:33:09for example, kai faalook and Arabic, which you know,
00:33:11new languages, which you didn't know.
00:33:13And you proved my point,
00:33:15and yet I have not come across a single Christian
00:33:18who has passed the test in front of me, not a single.
00:33:20Out of the thousands I've met personally,
00:33:22and now it can be a thousand and one,
00:33:24after meeting Dr William Campbell.
00:33:26Only touched two points.
00:33:29Dr William Campbell did not reply to my 20 points,
00:33:33and he started speaking about prophecy.
00:33:37What does prophecy do with science in the Bible?
00:33:41If prophecy is the test,
00:33:46if prophecy is the test,
00:33:47then Nostradamus' book should be the best book.
00:33:50Nostradamus' book should be the best book to be called the word of God.
00:33:53It is not.
00:33:56He spoke about theory of probability.
00:33:58For the definition of theory of probability,
00:34:00how you can analyze with the Quran, with scientific facts,
00:34:03refer to my video cassette, Is the Quran God's Word?
00:34:07It's available in the foyer.
00:34:09I've proved scientifically, how can you use theory of probability.
00:34:13Dr William Campbell used it on the base of prophecy.
00:34:16If I want, I can try and prove his prophecy wrong.
00:34:19I don't want to do it.
00:34:20I take it for granted for sake of argument,
00:34:22using the Concordia's approach,
00:34:24that whatever prophecy he said was right, for sake of argument.
00:34:27But even if there's one unfulfilled prophecy,
00:34:29the whole Bible is disproved to the word of God.
00:34:32I can give you a list of unfulfilled prophecy.
00:34:35For example, if you read Genesis, chapter number 4, verse number 12,
00:34:38it says God told Cain, you will never be able to settle.
00:34:41You will be a wanderer.
00:34:42Few words later on, Genesis, chapter 4, verse 17 says,
00:34:45Cain built up a city.
00:34:46Unfulfilled prophecy.
00:34:48If you read Jeremiah, chapter number 36, verse number 30,
00:34:51it says that Joachim, the father of Joachim,
00:34:54no one will be able to sit on his throne.
00:34:56The throne of David, no one will be able to sit after Joachim.
00:34:59If you read later on 2 Kings, chapter number 24, verse number 6,
00:35:02it says that Joachim, after he died, later on, Joachim sat on the throne.
00:35:07Unfulfilled prophecy.
00:35:08One is sufficient to prove it's not the word of God.
00:35:11I can give plenty.
00:35:12If you read Ezekiel, chapter number 26,
00:35:14it says that Nebuchadnezzar, he will destroy Tyre.
00:35:17We come to know that Alexander the Great was the person who destroyed Tyre.
00:35:21Unfulfilled prophecy.
00:35:22Isaiah, chapter number 7, verse number 14 says,
00:35:25prophesying of the coming of a person who will be born to a virgin.
00:35:28His name shall be Emmanuel.
00:35:30They say, the Christians, it refers to Jesus Christ, peace be upon him.
00:35:33Born to a virgin.
00:35:34The Hebrew word there is Amla, which means not a virgin, a young lady.
00:35:39The word for virgin in Hebrew is Betulah, which is not there.
00:35:43Even if you agree, we are using concordance.
00:35:45We agree.
00:35:46Virgin? Virgin. No problem.
00:35:48It says he will be called Emmanuel.
00:35:51Nowhere in the Bible is Jesus Christ, peace be upon him, is called as Emmanuel.
00:35:55Unfulfilled prophecy.
00:35:56I can give several, plenty of unfulfilled prophecy.
00:35:59One is sufficient to prove the Bible wrong.
00:36:02I've given a few.
00:36:03According to your theory of probability,
00:36:06Bible is not the word of God.
00:36:14Dr. William Campbell said,
00:36:15that according to the Quran, Elijah won the battle.
00:36:18According to the Bible, Elijah lost the battle.
00:36:20Whatever it is.
00:36:21That doesn't mean that Bible is correct and Quran is wrong.
00:36:24If the statements differ in the Bible and the Quran,
00:36:26you are assuming Bible is the word of God.
00:36:29If both are supposed to be analyzed,
00:36:31it can be possible that Quran is right and Bible is wrong.
00:36:35It can be possible Bible is right and Quran is wrong.
00:36:38It can be possible both are wrong.
00:36:40It can be possible both are right.
00:36:42So what we have to do,
00:36:43if we have to analyze which of the two is wrong,
00:36:45we have to get a third source from outside,
00:36:47which is authentic.
00:36:48Just because Bible says Elijah lost and Quran says Elijah won,
00:36:52therefore Quran is wrong, is illogical.
00:36:56And Dr. William Campbell,
00:36:58besides replying to the scientific errors I mentioned,
00:37:02I'll just touch on the points,
00:37:04which I could not due to lack of time.
00:37:06There are an additional six or seven points,
00:37:09which he mentioned in his talk,
00:37:11which inshallah I'll give the reply briefly.
00:37:15He spoke that the Quran says,
00:37:19according to me and he showed my cassette,
00:37:21according to brother Shabir Ali,
00:37:24that the light of the moon is reflected light
00:37:27and he said it doesn't mean that.
00:37:30I'm quoting again,
00:37:32the Quran mentioned in surah Furqan,
00:37:34chapter 25, verse 61,
00:37:35that blessed is he who was placed in the sky constellation,
00:37:39placed there in lamp, sun and moon,
00:37:43having borrowed light, munir.
00:37:45Arabic word used for moon is kamar.
00:37:48It's always described as munir or nur,
00:37:50meaning reflection of light,
00:37:52reflection of light.
00:37:54Arabic word used for sun is shams.
00:37:57It's always described as wahaj, diya,
00:38:00which means a blazing torch,
00:38:02a shining glory.
00:38:04And I can give references,
00:38:06surah Nur, chapter number 71,
00:38:08verse 15 and 16,
00:38:09surah Yunus, chapter number 10,
00:38:11verse number 5 and so on.
00:38:13And he said,
00:38:14that if it means a reflection of light,
00:38:17and he quoted the Quran,
00:38:19surah Nur, chapter number 24,
00:38:21verse number 35 and 36,
00:38:23that Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala
00:38:25is nur samawati walad,
00:38:27is the light of the heaven and the earth.
00:38:29Read the complete verse
00:38:31and analyze what does it say.
00:38:32It says Allah is the light, nur.
00:38:37It says Allah is the light of the heaven and the earth.
00:38:40It is a similitude like a niche,
00:38:43and within the niche there is lamp,
00:38:45the lamp word is there.
00:38:47So Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala
00:38:48has got light of its own
00:38:50and even reflected light,
00:38:51like you see a halogen lamp,
00:38:53you know, which I have here.
00:38:54The lamp inside is like a siraj,
00:38:57but the reflector is like moon.
00:38:59It is reflecting light.
00:39:01The lamp, the tube,
00:39:03the tube is having a light of its own,
00:39:05but the reflector of the halogen lamp
00:39:07is reflecting light,
00:39:08so both two in one.
00:39:10So Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala,
00:39:11alhamdulillah,
00:39:12besides having light of its own,
00:39:13as the Quranic verse says,
00:39:15in the niche there is a lamp.
00:39:17And that lamp light of Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala
00:39:19is its own light.
00:39:21And Allah reflects his own light.
00:39:23Dr. William Campbell says,
00:39:24that the Quran says,
00:39:25that Quran is Noor.
00:39:28It is reflecting light, of course.
00:39:30The Quran is reflecting the light
00:39:31and the guidance of Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala.
00:39:34Regarding Prophet Muhammad sallallahu alaihi wa sallam
00:39:35being siraj,
00:39:36yes he is.
00:39:37The hadith of the beloved Prophet
00:39:39is giving guidance to us.
00:39:41So Muhammad sallallahu alaihi wa sallam
00:39:42is also Noor,
00:39:43he is also siraj,
00:39:44alhamdulillah.
00:39:46He has his own knowledge also,
00:39:47alhamdulillah.
00:39:48He has the guidance of Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala,
00:39:50alhamdulillah.
00:39:52So if you use this word Noor
00:39:54as reflected light
00:39:55and Munir as reflected light,
00:39:57yet alhamdulillah,
00:39:58you can prove it scientifically
00:40:00that the light of the moon
00:40:02is not its own light,
00:40:03but it is the reflected light.
00:40:06The other points
00:40:07Dr. William Campbell raised
00:40:09was regarding surah Kahf,
00:40:11chapter number 18, verse number 86,
00:40:13that Zulkarnain sees
00:40:15the sun setting in murky water,
00:40:17in turbid water.
00:40:18Imagine,
00:40:19sun setting in murky water,
00:40:21that was unscientific.
00:40:22The Arabic word used here is
00:40:24it is wajada,
00:40:26meaning it appeared to Zulkarnain.
00:40:29And Dr. William Campbell knows Arabic.
00:40:31So wajada means,
00:40:32if you look up in the dictionary also,
00:40:34it means it appeared.
00:40:35So Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala
00:40:37is describing what appeared
00:40:39to Zulkarnain.
00:40:41If I make a statement
00:40:42that the student in the class
00:40:44said 2 plus 2 is equal to 5,
00:40:45and you say,
00:40:46oh Zakir said 2 plus 2 is equal to 5.
00:40:47I didn't say.
00:40:48I'm telling the student in my class
00:40:50that 2 plus 2 is equal to 5.
00:40:51I'm not wrong.
00:40:52The student is wrong.
00:40:53There are various ways
00:40:55to try and analyze this verse.
00:40:57One is this way,
00:40:58according to Muhammad Asad,
00:40:59that wajada means it appeared to,
00:41:01it appeared to Zulkarnain.
00:41:03Point number two.
00:41:05The Arabic word used is maghrib.
00:41:08It can be used for time
00:41:10as well as place.
00:41:11When we say sunset,
00:41:12sunset can be taken for time.
00:41:14If I say the sun sets at 7pm,
00:41:16I'm using it for time.
00:41:17If I say the sun sets in the west,
00:41:19it means I'm taking it for place.
00:41:21So here if you use the word maghrib
00:41:23for time,
00:41:24so Zulkarnain
00:41:25not reached that place of sunset,
00:41:28used it at time.
00:41:30He reached at the time of sunset.
00:41:32The problem is solved.
00:41:34Furthermore, you can solve it
00:41:35in various ways.
00:41:36Even Dr. William Campbell says,
00:41:37no, no,
00:41:38the basic assumption is too much.
00:41:40It does not appear to.
00:41:41It is actually this.
00:41:43Let's analyze it further.
00:41:44The Quranic verse says,
00:41:46The sun set in murky water.
00:41:50Now we know
00:41:51when we use these words
00:41:53like sunrise and sunset,
00:41:55does the sun rise?
00:41:57Scientifically, the sun does not rise.
00:41:59Neither does the sun set.
00:42:01We know scientifically
00:42:02the sun does not set at all.
00:42:04It is the rotation of the earth
00:42:06which gives rise to sunrise and sunset.
00:42:08But yet,
00:42:09you read everyday in the papers
00:42:11mentioning sunrise at 6am,
00:42:14sunset at 7pm.
00:42:16Oh, the newspapers are wrong
00:42:17and scientific.
00:42:23If I use the word disaster,
00:42:24oh, there's a disaster.
00:42:26Disaster means
00:42:27there's some calamity
00:42:28which has taken place.
00:42:29Literally,
00:42:30disaster means
00:42:31an evil star.
00:42:33So when I say there's disaster,
00:42:35everyone knows what I mean
00:42:36is a calamity,
00:42:37not about the evil star.
00:42:38Dr. William Campbell and I know
00:42:40when a person is mad,
00:42:41we call him a lunatic.
00:42:43Yes or no?
00:42:46At least I do.
00:42:47And I believe Dr. William Campbell
00:42:48also will be doing that.
00:42:49We call a person a lunatic.
00:42:50He's mad.
00:42:51What is the meaning of lunatic?
00:42:54It means struck by the moon.
00:42:57But that is how the language
00:42:58has evolved.
00:42:59Similarly,
00:43:00sunrise is actually,
00:43:02it is just a usage of word.
00:43:04And Allah has given the guidance
00:43:06for the human beings also.
00:43:07He uses so that we understand.
00:43:09So it is just sunrise.
00:43:10Not that it is actually setting.
00:43:12Not the sun is actually rising.
00:43:13So this explanation
00:43:14clearly gives us a clear picture
00:43:16that the verse of the Quran
00:43:18of Surah Kahaf,
00:43:19chapter 18, verse number 86,
00:43:20is not in contradiction
00:43:21with established science.
00:43:23That is the way how people speak.
00:43:26He quoted
00:43:27Surah Furqan,
00:43:28chapter 25,
00:43:29verse 45, 46,
00:43:31that the shadow lengthens
00:43:33and prolongates.
00:43:34We can make it stationary.
00:43:35The sun is its guide.
00:43:37And in his book he mentions,
00:43:39does the sun move?
00:43:41Where does this verse say
00:43:42the sun moves?
00:43:44In Surah Furqan,
00:43:45chapter 25, verse 45, 46,
00:43:47doesn't say the sun moves.
00:43:49And he writes in his book,
00:43:51we were taught in elementary school
00:43:53and he said that also
00:43:54in his talk,
00:43:55that it is due to the rotation
00:43:57of the earth
00:43:59that the shadow prolongs
00:44:00and gets small.
00:44:03But what the Quran says,
00:44:05the sun is its guide.
00:44:07Today,
00:44:08even a person who has not
00:44:09gone to school
00:44:10knows that shadow
00:44:11is due to sunlight.
00:44:14Even a layman
00:44:15who has not gone to school
00:44:16knows that shadow
00:44:18is due to sunlight.
00:44:20So Quran is perfectly right.
00:44:21It doesn't say the sun moves
00:44:22and the shadow is caused.
00:44:24He is putting his own words
00:44:25in the Quran.
00:44:27The sun is its guide.
00:44:29It is guiding
00:44:31the shadow.
00:44:32Without sunlight,
00:44:34you cannot have shadow.
00:44:36Yes, you can have shadow
00:44:37without the light.
00:44:38It's a different thing.
00:44:39But here it's referring
00:44:40to the shadow which you see
00:44:41which is moving,
00:44:42prolonging,
00:44:43and becoming short.
00:44:44Sir William Campbell spoke
00:44:45about Solomon's death.
00:44:49Surah Saba,
00:44:50chapter 34,
00:44:51verse number 12 to 14,
00:44:53and said that,
00:44:54imagine a person
00:44:55standing on the stick
00:44:56and he dies
00:44:57and no one comes to know,
00:44:58etc.
00:45:01There are various ways
00:45:02to explain.
00:45:03Point number one,
00:45:04Solomon, peace be upon him,
00:45:05he was a prophet of God,
00:45:09and it can be a miracle.
00:45:12When Bible says
00:45:13that Jesus Christ,
00:45:14peace be upon him,
00:45:16could give life to the dead,
00:45:19Jesus Christ was born
00:45:20of a virgin birth,
00:45:21which is more difficult
00:45:22to imagine?
00:45:23Being born of a virgin birth,
00:45:24giving life to the dead,
00:45:25or standing on a stick
00:45:26for a very long time?
00:45:29Which is more difficult?
00:45:31So when God can do miracles
00:45:32through Jesus Christ,
00:45:33peace be upon him,
00:45:34why can't he do miracles
00:45:35through Solomon, peace be upon him?
00:45:37Solomon, peace be upon him,
00:45:38parted the sea.
00:45:39He threw a stick,
00:45:40stick became snake.
00:45:41Bible says that,
00:45:42Quran says that.
00:45:43So when God can do that,
00:45:44why can't God let a man
00:45:45rest for a long period?
00:45:47Anyway,
00:45:48I'll give him
00:45:49various different answers.
00:45:50Nowhere does the Quran say
00:45:51that Solomon, peace be upon him,
00:45:53rested on the stick
00:45:54for a very long period.
00:45:55Nowhere does it say.
00:45:56It just says
00:45:57that animal,
00:45:58maybe some say ant,
00:45:59maybe other animal
00:46:00of the earth came
00:46:01and bit.
00:46:03Maybe possible,
00:46:04maybe,
00:46:05that Solomon, peace be upon him,
00:46:06was just dead.
00:46:09And any animal
00:46:10may have shook the stick
00:46:11and Solomon, peace be upon him,
00:46:12may have fallen down.
00:46:13But I assume,
00:46:14I use the conflict approach
00:46:16with the Quran.
00:46:18Because irrespective
00:46:19whether you use
00:46:20the conflict approach
00:46:21or the concordance approach,
00:46:22the ayah I quoted
00:46:23in the beginning of my talk,
00:46:24Surah Nisa, chapter 4,
00:46:25verse 82 says,
00:46:27Do they not consider
00:46:28the Quran with care?
00:46:29Had it been for
00:46:30anyone besides Allah,
00:46:31there would have been
00:46:32many contradictions.
00:46:33Irrespective whether
00:46:34you use the conflict approach
00:46:35or the concordance approach,
00:46:36if you are logical,
00:46:37you will not be able
00:46:38to take out
00:46:39a single verse
00:46:40of the Quran
00:46:41which is contradicting,
00:46:42neither a single verse
00:46:43which is against
00:46:44established science.
00:46:45I agree with Dr. William Gamble.
00:46:46Now,
00:46:47I'll give him
00:46:48various different answers.
00:46:49Now,
00:46:50I'll give him
00:46:51various different answers.
00:46:52Now,
00:46:53I'll give him
00:46:54various different answers.
00:46:55Now,
00:46:56I'll give him
00:46:57various different answers.
00:46:58Now,
00:46:59I'll give him
00:47:00various different answers.
00:47:01Now,
00:47:02I'll give him
00:47:03various different answers.
00:47:04Now,
00:47:05I'll give him
00:47:06various different answers.
00:47:07Now,
00:47:08I'll give him
00:47:09various different answers.
00:47:10Now,
00:47:11I'll give him
00:47:12various different answers.
00:47:13Now,
00:47:14I'll give him
00:47:15various different answers.
00:47:16Now,
00:47:17I'll give him
00:47:18various different answers.
00:47:19Now,
00:47:20I'll give him
00:47:21various different answers.
00:47:22Now,
00:47:23I'll give him
00:47:24various different answers.
00:47:25Now,
00:47:26I'll give him
00:47:27various different answers.
00:47:28Now,
00:47:29I'll give him
00:47:30various different answers.
00:47:31Now,
00:47:32I'll give him
00:47:33various different answers.
00:47:34Now,
00:47:35I'll give him
00:47:36various different answers.
00:47:37Now,
00:47:38I'll give him
00:47:39various different answers.
00:47:40Now,
00:47:41I'll give him
00:47:42various different answers.
00:47:43Now,
00:47:44I'll give him
00:47:45various different answers.
00:47:46Now,
00:47:47I'll give him
00:47:48various different answers.
00:47:49Now,
00:47:50I'll give him
00:47:51various different answers.
00:47:52Now,
00:47:53I'll give him
00:47:54various different answers.
00:47:55Now,
00:47:56I'll give him
00:47:57various different answers.
00:47:58Now,
00:47:59I'll give him
00:48:00various different answers.
00:48:01Now,
00:48:02I'll give him
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00:56:53I'll give him
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00:56:56I'll give him
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00:56:59I'll give him
00:57:00various different answers.
00:57:01Now,
00:57:02I'll give him
00:57:03various different answers.
00:57:04There are certain
00:57:05people who try
00:57:06and reconciliate
00:57:07and say
00:57:08that 6 days
00:57:09mentioned in the Bible
00:57:10it actually
00:57:11refers to Epochs
00:57:13like the Quran
00:57:14long period
00:57:15not 624 days.
00:57:16It is illogical.
00:57:17You read the Bible
00:57:18evening,
00:57:19morning
00:57:20it clearly states
00:57:2124th
00:57:22it indicates
00:57:23but even
00:57:24if I use
00:57:25a concordance
00:57:26approach
00:57:27no problem
00:57:28I agree with
00:57:29your illogical
00:57:30argument
00:57:31yet they will
00:57:32only be able
00:57:33solve the first scientific error of six days creation, and second, that first day light
00:57:38and third day earth. The remaining four, yet they cannot solve. Some further say that if
00:57:46it's a 24-period, why can't the vegetables survive for 124 days without sunlight? I say
00:57:53fine. If you say that the vegetables were created before the sun and can survive for
00:57:59124 days, I've got no objection. But you can't say the days mentioned are 24 as well as epochs.
00:58:06You can't have the cake and eat it both. If you say it is a long period, you solve point
00:58:11number one and three. The remaining four are yet there. If you say the days are 24 days,
00:58:16you solve only point number five. The remaining five are yet there. It becomes unscientific.
00:58:21I live with Dr. William Campbell, whether he wants to say it is long period and say
00:58:25that there are only four scientific errors, or say it is 24 days and say there are only
00:58:29five scientific errors in the creation of the universe.
00:58:35Regarding the concept of earth, there are various scientists who have described how
00:58:42will the world end hypothesis. Some may be right, some may be wrong. But either the world
00:58:51will perish or the world will live forever. Both cannot take place simultaneously. It's
00:58:56unscientific. But this is exactly what the Bible says. It's mentioned in the Bible. In
00:59:02the book of Hebrews, chapter number one, verse number 10 and 11, and the book of Psalms,
00:59:06chapter number 102, verse number 25 and 26, that almighty God created the heavens and
00:59:12the earth and they will perish. Exactly opposite is mentioned in the book of Ecclesiastes,
00:59:20chapter number one, verse number four, and the book of Psalms, chapter number 78, verse
00:59:24number 69, that the earth will abide forever. I leave it to Dr. William Campbell to choose
00:59:31which of the two was unscientific, the first pair or the second pair. One has to be unscientific.
00:59:37Both cannot take place. The world cannot abide forever as well as perish. It's unscientific.
00:59:44Regarding the heavens, the Bible says in Job, chapter 26, verse 11, that the pillars of
00:59:49the heaven will tremble. Quran says in Surah Luqman, chapter 31, verse number 10, that
00:59:54the heavens are without any pillars. Don't you see it? Don't you see the heavens are
00:59:59without any pillars? Bible says heaven has got pillars. Not only do the heavens have
01:00:04got pillars, Bible says in the first book of Samuel, chapter number two, verse number
01:00:09eight, as well as the book of Job, chapter number nine, verse number six, and the book
01:00:13of Psalms, chapter number 75, verse number three, that even the earth have got pillars.
01:00:20In the field of diet and nutrition, let's analyze what does the Bible say. The Bible
01:00:26says in the book of Genesis, chapter number one, verse number 29, that God has given you
01:00:34all the herbs bearing seeds, the trees bearing fruits, those that bear seed, as meat for
01:00:42you. New International Version says the seed-bearing plant and the trees bearing fruits, bearing
01:00:49seeds, are food for you, all of them. Today, even a layman knows that there are several
01:00:58poisonous plants, like wild berries, strychnine, datura, plants containing alkaloid, oleander,
01:01:07buckeye poid, that which if you ingest, if you eat, there are high possibilities you
01:01:12may die. How come the creator of the universe and human beings doesn't know that if you
01:01:18have these plants, you will die? I hope Dr. William Campbell doesn't give this vegetarian
01:01:23diet to his patients. The Bible has a scientific test how to identify a true believer. It's
01:01:32mentioned in the Gospel of Mark, chapter number 16, verse number 17 and 18. It says
01:01:39that there will be signs for true believers, and among the signs, in my name, they shall
01:01:48cast out devils, they shall speak foreign tongues, new tongues, they shall take up serpents,
01:01:55and if they drink deadly poison, they shall not be harmed, and when they place their hand
01:02:01over the sick, they shall be cured. This is a scientific test. In scientific terminology,
01:02:06it's known as the confirmatory test for a true Christian believer. In the past ten years
01:02:12of my life, I have personally interacted with thousands of Christians, including missionary.
01:02:17I have not come across a single Christian who has passed this confirmatory test of the
01:02:23Bible. I have not come across a single Christian who took poison. I have not come across any
01:02:33who took poison and who has not died. And in scientific terminology, this is also called
01:02:40as a falsification test. That means if a false person tries and does this test, takes poison,
01:02:47he will die. And a false person will not dare attempt this test. If you are not a true Christian
01:02:53believer, you will not dare attempt this test, because if you try and attempt the falsification
01:02:58test, you will fail. So a person who is not a true Christian believer will never attempt
01:03:05this test. I have read the book, the Quran, the Bible in the light of history and science,
01:03:12written by Dr. William Campbell, and I assume that he is a true Christian believer, and
01:03:21at least I would like him to confirm to me about the falsification test. Please be rest
01:03:35assured. Please be rest assured. I will not ask Dr. William Campbell to have deadly poison,
01:03:42because I don't want to jeopardize the debate. What I'll do, I will only ask him to speak
01:03:49in foreign tongues, in new languages. And as many of you may be aware, that India is
01:03:55a land which has more than 1,000 languages and dialects. Only thing I request him is
01:04:00to say these three words, 100 rupees, in the 17 official languages. There are only 17 official
01:04:09languages in India. And to make it easier for Dr. William Campbell, I've got a 100 rupee
01:04:15note. And this has all the 17 languages mentioned here. Besides English and Hindi, I will help
01:04:26him. I'll give him a beginning. Ek so rupiah in Hindi. The remaining 15 languages are here.
01:04:33I request him to read. I know the test says they will speak foreign languages on their
01:04:40own, without the help of reading. But I want to make the test easier. I want to see someone
01:04:44passing the test. I have not seen anyone. So if he can't say it on his own, or from
01:04:48his memory, at least read it. I don't mind. I'll accept it. And I request the chairperson
01:04:54to give it to Dr. William Campbell. He has his rebuttal. 15 languages. Ek so rupiah,
01:05:01three words only. What does the Bible say regarding hydrology? Bible says in Genesis,
01:05:11chapter number 9, verse number 13 to 17, that after God, at the time of Noah, submerged
01:05:19the world by flood, and after the flood subsides, he said, I put up a rainbow in the sky as
01:05:26a promise to the humankind never to submerge the world again by water. To the unscientific
01:05:33person, it may be quite good. Oh, a rainbow is a sign of Almighty God, never to submerge
01:05:39the world by flood again. But today we know very well that rainbow is due to the refraction
01:05:44of sunlight with rain or mist. Surely there may have been thousands of rainbows before
01:05:49the time of Noah, peace be upon him. To say it was not there before Noah's time, you have
01:05:53to assume that the law of refraction did not exist, which is unscientific. In the field
01:06:02of medicine, the Bible says in the book of Leviticus, chapter number 14, verse number
01:06:0849 to 53, it gives a novel way for disinfecting a house from plague of leprosy. Disinfecting
01:06:18a house from plague of leprosy. It says that take two birds, kill one bird, take wood,
01:06:27scarlet, hyssop, and the other living bird, dip it in water and under running water, later
01:06:33on sprinkle the house seven times with it. Sprinkle the house with blood to disinfect
01:06:39against plague of leprosy? We know blood is a good media of germ, bacteria, as well as
01:06:46toxin. I hope Dr. William Campbell doesn't use this method of disinfecting the OT, the
01:06:51operation theater. It's mentioned in the book of Leviticus, chapter number 12, verse
01:06:57number 1 to 5, and we know medically that after a mother gives birth to a child, the
01:07:05postpartum period, it is unhygienic. To say it's unclean religiously, I've got no objection.
01:07:10But Leviticus, chapter number 12, verse number 1 to 5 says that after a woman gives birth
01:07:16to a male child, she will be unclean for seven days and the period of uncleanness will
01:07:21continue for 33 days more. If she gives birth to a female child, she'll be unclean for
01:07:26two weeks and the period of uncleanness will continue for 60 days. In short, if a woman
01:07:32gives birth to a male child, a son, she's unclean for 40 days. If she gives birth to
01:07:37a female child, a daughter, she's unclean for 80 days. I would like Dr. William Campbell
01:07:42to explain to me scientifically, how come a woman remain unclean for double the period
01:07:48if she gives birth to a female child as compared to a male child?
01:07:54The Bible also has a very good test for adultery. How to come to know a woman has committed
01:08:01adultery? In book of Numbers, chapter number 5, verse number 11 to 31. I'll just say in
01:08:06brief. It says that the priest should take holy water in a vessel, take dust from the
01:08:12floor and put it into the vessel and that's the bitter water. And after cursing it, give
01:08:20it to the woman. And if the woman has committed adultery, after she drinks it, the curse will
01:08:27enter her body, the stomach will swell, the thigh will rot and she shall be cursed by
01:08:33the people. If the woman has not committed adultery, she will remain clean and she will
01:08:38bear the seed. A novel method of identifying whether a woman has committed adultery or
01:08:43not. You know, today in the world, there are thousands of cases pending in different parts
01:08:48of the world, in different courts of law, only on the assumption that someone has alleged
01:08:53that the woman has committed adultery. I had read in the newspapers and I came to know
01:09:00in the media that the president of this great country, Mr. Bill Clinton, he was involved
01:09:06in a sex scandal about two years back. I wonder that why didn't the American court use this
01:09:13bitter water test for adultery? He would have gone scot-free immediately. Why didn't the
01:09:21Christian missionaries of this great country, especially those who are in the medical field,
01:09:31like my respected Dr. William Campbell, use this bitter water test to bail out the president
01:09:37immediately? Mathematics is a branch which is closely associated with science, with which
01:09:45you can solve problems, etc. There are thousands of contradictions in the Bible. Hundreds deal
01:09:52with mathematics. I'll just touch on a few of them. It's mentioned in Ezra, chapter number
01:09:572, verse number 1, and Nehemiah, chapter number 7, verse number 6, the context that when the
01:10:03people returned from exile from Babylon, when King Nebuchadnezzar of Babylon, when he released
01:10:09the men from Israel, they came back from captivity. The list of the people are given.
01:10:14The list is given in Ezra, chapter number 2, verse number 2 to 63, and Nehemiah, chapter
01:10:21number 7, verse number 7 up to 65. The list is given with the names, as well as number
01:10:27of people released. In these 60 verses, there are no less than 18 times. The name is exactly
01:10:34the same, but the number is different. There are no less than 18 contradictions in less
01:10:40than 60 verses of these two chapters. This is the list. I don't have time to run through
01:10:51the list. There are no less than 18 different contradictions in less than 60 verses. Further,
01:10:59it's mentioned in Ezra, chapter number 2, verse number 64, that the total congregation,
01:11:07if you add up, if you add up, it comes to 42,360, and if you read in Nehemiah, chapter
01:11:15number 7, verse number 66, there also the total is the same, 42,360, but if you add
01:11:23up all these verses, which I had to do my homework, this is the list, this is the list
01:11:31of Ezra, this is the list of Nehemiah, Ezra, chapter number 2, Nehemiah, chapter number
01:11:397. If you add up, I had to do my homework, if you add up in Ezra, chapter number 2, it
01:11:47doesn't come to 42,360, it comes to 29,818, and if you add up Nehemiah, chapter number
01:11:567, even there it doesn't come to 42,360, it comes to 31,089. The author of the Bible,
01:12:08presumed to be Almighty God, does not know simple addition. If you give this problem
01:12:13even to a person who's passed elementary school, he'll be able to get the right answer.
01:12:17If you add up all the 60 verses, it's so easy, Almighty God, didn't know adding, if we presume
01:12:27that this is the word of God. Further, if we read in Ezra, chapter number 2, verse number
01:12:3465, it says there were 200 singing men and women. Nehemiah, chapter number 7, verse 67,
01:12:40it says there were 245 singing men and women. Were there 200 or were there 245 singing men
01:12:46and women? Context is the same, a mathematical contradiction. It's mentioned in the 2nd Kings,
01:12:53chapter number 24, verse number 8, that Joachim was 18 years old when he began to reign Jerusalem,
01:13:00and he reigned for 3 months. 2nd Chronicles, chapter number 36, verse number 9 says that
01:13:07Joachim was 8 years old when he began to reign, and he reigned for 3 months, 10 days. Was
01:13:12Joachim 18 years old when he began to reign, or was he 8 years old? Did he reign for 3
01:13:17months, or did he reign for 3 months, 10 days? Further, it's mentioned in the 1st Kings,
01:13:25chapter number 7, verse number 26, that in Solomon's temple in the molten sea, he had
01:13:302,000 baths. In 2nd Chronicles, chapter number 4, verse number 5, he had 3,000 baths. Did
01:13:39he have 2,000 baths, or did he have 3,000 baths? That I leave it upon order of William
01:13:44Campbell to decide which is correct. There is a clear-cut mathematical contradiction.
01:13:50It's mentioned in the 1st Kings, chapter number 15, verse number 33, that Basha, he died in
01:13:58the 26th year of reign of Asa. And 2nd Chronicles, chapter number 16, verse number 1 says that
01:14:07Basha invaded Judah in the 36th year of the reign of Asa. How can Basha invade 10 years
01:14:14after his death? It's unscientific. To make it easier for Dr. William Campbell to answer
01:14:22to the points I have raised, I'll just mention it in brief, the points that I mentioned.
01:14:31The 1st point was the creation of the earth and the heaven. The universe was in 624 days.
01:14:38Light was there before the source of light, point number 2. 3, day came into existence
01:14:45before creation of earth, point number 4. Earth came into existence before sun, point
01:14:51number 5. Vegetation came into existence before sunlight, point number 6. Light of the moon
01:14:57is its own light, point number 7. The earth, will it perish or will it abide forever? Point
01:15:07number 8. The earth has got pillars, point number 9. The heavens have got pillars, point
01:15:14number 10. God said you can have all plants and all vegetation, including the poisonous
01:15:20plants, point number 11. The scientific test, the falsification test of Mark chapter number
01:15:2616, verse number 17 and 18. Point number 12. A woman remains unclean for double the period
01:15:33if she gives birth to a daughter as compared to a son, point number 13. Using blood to
01:15:41disinfect the house against plague or leprosy, point number 14. How do you find out the bitter
01:15:52water test for adultery, point number 15. 18 different contradictions in less than 60
01:15:59verses of Ezra chapter 2 and Nehemiah chapter number 7. I didn't count them as 18 different,
01:16:03I counted them only as 1. Point number 16. The total is different in both the chapters,
01:16:11point number 17. Are there 200 singing men and women or are there 245 singing men and
01:16:15women? Point number 18. Was Joachim 18 years old or was he 8 years old when he began to
01:16:23reign? Point number 19. Did he reign for 3 months or 3 months 10 days? Point number 20.
01:16:32Did Solomon have 3,000 baths or 2,000 baths? Point number 21 is that he did not have a
01:16:41son. Basha, how could he invade Judah 10 years after his death? Point number 22 is Almighty
01:16:48God, he said, I put up a rainbow in the sky as a promise to the humankind never to submerge
01:16:54the world again by water. I have listed only 22 out of the hundreds available unscientific
01:17:03points in the Bible, scientific errors, and I request Dr. William Campbell to answer them
01:17:07and irrespective whether he uses the concordance approach or the conflict approach, as long
01:17:13as he is logical, he will never be able to prove scientifically all these 22 aspects
01:17:18I have told him. We agree in Jesus Christ, peace be upon him, to him was revealed the
01:17:25Injil. This is not the Injil. It may contain part of God, but the other unscientific portion
01:17:31is not the word of God. I would like to end my talk by giving the quotation of the glorious
01:17:34Quran from Surah Baqarah, chapter 2, verse 79, which says,
01:17:47Vote to those who write the book with their own hands, and then say this is from Allah, to traffic with it for a miserable price. Vote to those for what they write, vote to those for what they earn.
01:18:05I would request our audience to bear with us and maintain a due decorum for the continuation of the dialogue.
01:18:16Yes, I'd like to pose this question, or rather this test, to Dr. William Campbell. Why don't you attempt the falsification test of the Bible given in the book of Mark, chapter 16,
01:18:33verses 17 and 18, and prove to the audience here, right now, that you are a true Christian believer.
01:18:43My question is to Dr. Zakir Naik. The Christians explain the concept of Trinity scientifically by giving the example of water, which can be in three states, solid, liquid, and gas, in the form of ice, water, and vapor.
01:18:56Similarly, one God is a triune God, Father, Son, and Holy Ghost. Is this explanation scientifically correct?
01:19:03The word Trinity is not there in the Bible, but it is there in the Quran.
01:19:08Dr. Zakir, you said there isn't any mistake in Quran. I see more than 20 mistakes in Arabic grammar, and I will tell you some of them.
01:19:22He said, in Baqara and Hajj, which is right, Asabi'oon or Asabi'een? Number one. Number two.
01:19:44Brother, one question at a time, please.
01:19:47But the same thing, he said in Surah Taha, verse 63, mistake. Can you explain that?
01:20:02And the book is referring to Abdul Fadi. Abdul Fadi, correct? Is the Quran infallible?
01:20:07I can see some things. Yeah. Alhamdulillah, my sight is good.
01:20:18Dr. Campbell, since you are a medical doctor, could you please explain scientifically the various medical aspects in the Bible regarding, because you didn't answer them in your rebuttal.
01:20:29For example, blood used as a disinfectant, bitter water test for adultery, and most importantly, that the woman is unclean for double the period when she gives birth to a daughter than as compared to a son.
01:20:40Okay, Dr. Campbell, if you cannot answer the contradictions in Genesis regarding the creation, don't you think that that proves that the Bible is unscientific and therefore not from God?
01:20:54I admit that I have some problems with this.
01:20:57The Muslim yashtiq, the Quran, is far superior to your yashtiq, the science. Therefore, you should believe in Quran, which is far superior.
01:21:06Dr. Campbell agreed to Dr. Naik that the errors he showed are not wrong and that he can't answer them.
01:21:13So does this mean that Dr. Campbell agrees that the Bible has errors? So it's not the word of God.
01:21:20There are things in the Bible that I can't explain, that I don't have an answer for now.
01:21:25How can a son be two years older than the father?
01:21:29Believe me, even in Hollywood film, you will not be able to produce it.