" Logon Ko Pata Hona Chahiye Ke Aeen Mein Kya Tabdeeli Ho Rahi Hai. ." Jehangir Jadoon
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00:00Mr. Parshad, the Ayin has become a no-man's-land, let's do it anywhere.
00:05If someone says, follow the Ayin, then today the Ayin is something else, tomorrow it will be something else.
00:09There is a reform. This is the right of the Parliament to do the reform.
00:13Now, to reform, someone should bring a law, and by doing the law, reform and change the number game.
00:19Where should the ECP stand in this vicious circle?
00:23Look, the Ayin is a living document, and the right of the Parliament to reform is in it.
00:34Reform can be done.
00:36Nothing can be kept at one place. It is an evolution process.
00:41With time, changes come.
00:44Now, the question is, can the reforms that are coming, how can they be looked at?
00:53Look, if you look at everything one by one, and we have done some exercise today,
01:02there are some very good things and some very objectionable things.
01:08So, you cannot brush aside the very good things,
01:13and say that this government is doing something wrong, and this person is killing people.
01:19Look, there are some amendment proposals that are based on the demands of the Bar Councils and Bar Associates.
01:27I agree with that. I agree.
01:29I would like, Mr. Pasha, to bring forward the bad and good sides.
01:35When we are going beyond the limits of the Ayin,
01:38can you clarify what you have in front of you?
01:42And what is acceptable to you and what is not?
01:46Look, yesterday, there was an All Pakistan Lawyers' Representative Convention,
01:56in which the Law Minister was in the hot seat.
01:59And for four and a half hours, he faced every question and gave an answer.
02:04He was satisfied with some and not satisfied with others.
02:08But the most beautiful thing in this amendment is Article 185, subclass 4,
02:15which has two provisions.
02:18One of which is that if this amendment is passed,
02:22then immediately after the implementation of this amendment,
02:26whatever criminal appeal is filed,
02:29then the Supreme Court of Pakistan is bound to decide on it within 12 months.
02:34And the second provision is that the criminal appeals that have already been filed in the Supreme Court of Pakistan,
02:43then the Supreme Court of Pakistan is bound to decide on them within 24 months.
02:49This was a very strong demand of our lawyers and the people of Pakistan
02:56that there should not be a fixation of cases.
02:59When life imprisonment cases are filed, the accused comes home after serving his sentence.
03:05This is a positive point.
03:08If he comes home after serving his sentence, then that will also be a boon.
03:13Many people die there.
03:15Look, it becomes infectious.
03:18Death sentence cases are in the death cell.
03:23They cannot be spent there for a day.
03:26And they have been locked up there for decades.
03:29Then one thing that we objected to was the Sunset Clause,
03:37that the Chief Justice's appointment will be made first.
03:43The Speaker will make a committee of eight members of the National Assembly.
03:50And then the Prime Minister will make a proposal to the President of Pakistan.
03:56We objected to this.
03:58We said that this should not happen.
04:00When we are making our own proposal, then we are keeping these things in it.
04:10Look, there should be a deliberation.
04:12There should be a deliberation.
04:13Because there should be a deliberation, I will also talk to Mr. Jadoon on this side.
04:17Let's ask you, Mr. Jadoon.
04:20Whether he is agreeable to this or not.
04:24Because there is a fact everywhere that there has been a polarization.
04:29There are two sides in the government.
04:31Unfortunately, there are two sides in the judiciary as well.
04:34There are two sides in the public as well.
04:35There are two sides in the lawyers as well.
04:36So, whether one segment of the lawyers is agreeable to the other segment of the lawyers or not?
04:42Look, the second group that has convened in Lahore today,
04:46let's look at it now.
04:49If we look at the way they have said it, our first objection was that
04:53the constitution is a social contract between the people of Pakistan and the state.
04:57So, the people should know what changes are happening in the constitution.
05:01And the people who say that in the darkness of the night, this is absolutely right.
05:04If the numbers were fulfilled that night, the amendment would have been passed.
05:08This is a huge injustice.
05:10Why are they doing this debate now?
05:13Is it getting better now?
05:14No.
05:15It should have been better earlier. I agree.
05:17This should have been discussed earlier.
05:18There should have been a consultation with the stakeholders.
05:20First, the amendment is the right of the parliament.
05:22There are no two opinions in this.
05:23Who says it is not the right of the parliament?
05:25But there is a limitation in the amendment.
05:27It is not the absolute right of the parliament.
05:29The parliament should not put this obstacle in the K.P.
05:33Until the K.P. assembly approves it.
05:35Parliament has three basic features or principles.
05:39The interpretation of the constitution,
05:41which has been developed till date,
05:43and the constitution itself says that
05:44first, no law can be passed against the fundamental right.
05:47Second, no law can be passed with respect to the freedom of judiciary.
05:52Third, no law can be passed against Article 227 of the constitution.
05:58The parliament has the right to do so.
06:01But is the amendment of the constitutional court
06:03in any way against the Supreme Court?
06:06The timing of the amendment is irrelevant.
06:10The reason for that is that the C.O.D. was passed in 2006.
06:14And now after 18 years, they are suddenly...
06:16Is it right to pass it?
06:17Yes, it is right to pass it.
06:19You can pass it after two months.
06:21The constitutional court should not be...
06:23Should it not be person-specific?
06:24No, it should not be person-specific.
06:26In the C.O.D. it is written that the constitutional court will be established after 24 years.
06:30The most important article in the C.O.D. is Class 22.
06:34No government wants support from the army in its government formation.
06:39Today, tell me, which government, which party,
06:42wants support from the army?
06:43This is a very long debate.
06:44Tell me one thing.
06:45This is a very long debate.
06:46No, C.O.D. is a very good document.
06:48You have acted on all the points of the C.O.D.
06:50On whom did you act?
06:51On how many percent?
06:52You are doing it on one person.
06:53Don't let them do it on one person.
06:54Do it.
06:55Do it.
06:56But in a special way.
06:57The parliament has the right to make a court.
06:58But if you make one court and undermine the other,
07:01then that court will also be judged by the judiciary.
07:03You are not undermining anyone.
07:04Okay.
07:05You will take the Supreme Court to the district court level.
07:07And you want to establish a court that is the most supreme.
07:11And its judge is 68%...
07:12Let's see what they do.
07:13Now the issue has come to the debate.
07:15It has come forcibly, but it has come.
07:17But Mr. Jaddu, thank you very much for joining me.
07:18If I say that you establish a court and undermine the other court, that is also fine.
07:21Mr. Parshad, thank you very much for joining me in the program.