Converging Apostasy: Vladimir Solovyov and the NAR - Episode 156 Branham Podcast
Support the show:
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Available on Spotify, Google, and Apple Podcasts:
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John and Steve discuss the influence of propaganda within religious and political spheres, drawing parallels between the tactics used by the NAR and other esoteric and mystical traditions. They explore how these movements manipulate vague scriptural passages to propagate their agendas, highlighting the dangers of such practices. The conversation also touches on the historical roots and evolution of these ideas, tracing their connections back to figures like Vladimir Soloviev and the impact of his philosophies on current religious and political thought.
The episode emphasizes the convergence of various apostate movements and the role of propaganda in shaping public opinion and religious beliefs. The hosts discuss the manipulative techniques used by leaders within these movements to create a sense of urgency and unity among followers, often leading to divisive and harmful outcomes. They also reflect on their personal experiences and the challenges faced by individuals trying to escape such manipulative environments. The discussion underscores the importance of critical thinking and discernment in navigating the complex landscape of modern religious and political movements.
00:00 Introduction
00:31 Podcast Welcome and Host Introduction
01:09 Discussion on Internet Comments and Public Discourse
02:22 Political and Theological Implications of Current Events
03:56 Personal Political Views and Public Perception
05:19 Guest Struggles and Public Reactions
07:05 Historical and Contemporary Propaganda Tactics
09:45 Vladimir Solovyov's Influence and Russian Ideology
12:26 Modern Propaganda and Its Impact on Public Opinion
14:29 Sophia and Gnostic Influences
17:01 Manipulation of Religious Concepts and Discernment
19:05 Solovyov's Prophetic Claims and Theological Influence
21:16 Russian Cosmism and Its Esoteric Roots
25:47 Union of Religious and Political Ideologies
30:19 Esoteric Knowledge and Religious Propaganda
34:45 Controversial Doctrines and Their Origins
38:22 The Concept of Perfection in Esoteric Teachings
42:18 Unification of Believers in Prophetic Visions
46:39 The Role of Cosmism in Modern Ideologies
50:49 The Marvel Universe Analogy and Religious Networks
54:09 Concluding Thoughts and Reflections on the Converging Apostasy
______________________
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https://www.patreon.com/branham
Available on Spotify, Google, and Apple Podcasts:
https://william-branham.org/podcast
John and Steve discuss the influence of propaganda within religious and political spheres, drawing parallels between the tactics used by the NAR and other esoteric and mystical traditions. They explore how these movements manipulate vague scriptural passages to propagate their agendas, highlighting the dangers of such practices. The conversation also touches on the historical roots and evolution of these ideas, tracing their connections back to figures like Vladimir Soloviev and the impact of his philosophies on current religious and political thought.
The episode emphasizes the convergence of various apostate movements and the role of propaganda in shaping public opinion and religious beliefs. The hosts discuss the manipulative techniques used by leaders within these movements to create a sense of urgency and unity among followers, often leading to divisive and harmful outcomes. They also reflect on their personal experiences and the challenges faced by individuals trying to escape such manipulative environments. The discussion underscores the importance of critical thinking and discernment in navigating the complex landscape of modern religious and political movements.
00:00 Introduction
00:31 Podcast Welcome and Host Introduction
01:09 Discussion on Internet Comments and Public Discourse
02:22 Political and Theological Implications of Current Events
03:56 Personal Political Views and Public Perception
05:19 Guest Struggles and Public Reactions
07:05 Historical and Contemporary Propaganda Tactics
09:45 Vladimir Solovyov's Influence and Russian Ideology
12:26 Modern Propaganda and Its Impact on Public Opinion
14:29 Sophia and Gnostic Influences
17:01 Manipulation of Religious Concepts and Discernment
19:05 Solovyov's Prophetic Claims and Theological Influence
21:16 Russian Cosmism and Its Esoteric Roots
25:47 Union of Religious and Political Ideologies
30:19 Esoteric Knowledge and Religious Propaganda
34:45 Controversial Doctrines and Their Origins
38:22 The Concept of Perfection in Esoteric Teachings
42:18 Unification of Believers in Prophetic Visions
46:39 The Role of Cosmism in Modern Ideologies
50:49 The Marvel Universe Analogy and Religious Networks
54:09 Concluding Thoughts and Reflections on the Converging Apostasy
______________________
– Support the channel: https://www.patreon.com/branham
– Subscribe to the channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCBSpezVG15TVG-lOYMRXuyQ
– Visit the website: https://william-branham.org
– Follow on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/WilliamBranhamOrg
– Follow on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@william.m.branham
– Follow on Twitter: https://twitter.com/wmbhr
– Buy the books: https://william-branham.org/site/books
Transcript
00:00You
00:30Welcome to another episode of the William Branham historical research podcast. I'm your host John Collins
00:38The author and founder of William Branham historical research at William dash Branham org and with me
00:44I have Steve Montgomery the author of the converging apostasy and a quick outline of hands-on
00:51eschatology a matter of timing and agency and
00:54And together we're examining the themes of apostasy in the New Apostolic Reformation and its history
01:01Steve it's good to be back and I'm a little excited for today's episode
01:07We uh, we were just talking before we started recording how it's tying in with some of the comments
01:12We've been getting and I'm just I'm dumbfounded sometimes by the things that people
01:18Say and you know on the internet it kind of hides you makes you distant from the person
01:23some of the time sometimes when people are talking
01:26they're saying things that they would never say if they're in front of a person's face because you get that emotional connection and
01:32You know if people were just to stop and think well
01:35No, that that might hurt that person's feelings and it's not going to do any good in the end
01:40But you know that applies to religion that applies to politic
01:45Politics that applies to pretty much everything we've been talking about. So very glad to get into this with you. Yeah me too
01:52John
01:53The the recent comment that I that I noticed and I thought was interesting
01:58it was a valid comment, but I you know, I I didn't feel like I should probably get into it and answer directly, but
02:06Really? I think the the comment of the viewer was in relation to whether I was on the right side
02:12Politically or on the left and so this to me is an answer to that. I
02:18Located a really good
02:21Excuse me, the allergies are coming up here in Texas. I
02:25Found a really good article that deals with this topic. It's by Joshua Pauling
02:31If if you want to look at that later, I can send you a link to it, but he basically says
02:37The political has ascended to become esthical logical
02:42for the left
02:43This is the only hope to usher in a better world in it for the right
02:48This is the last chance to prevent the world's destruction
02:53so I thought about that and I said that was pretty applicable to the topic and then
02:58Like always when we think in generalities or themes
03:04Somebody that's talking about this is not directly speaking about the NAR but I see similarities because as
03:11In the NAR and their predecessors in the latter-ray movement
03:16This sort of thing is an attempt for man to assume the role of God and redeem himself
03:21That's a direct quote from mr. Pauling
03:24And mr. Pauling also says it attempts to replace the
03:30eschatological final judgment wrought by God
03:33with utopian visions wrought by humanity and
03:37In his assessment, this is a problem to which anyone is susceptible when ultimate importance
03:45subscribed to
03:47politics
03:48yeah, it's so interesting because I've seen the comment that you're referring to and I get those there's a reason why when I
03:56Do a podcast I will say I'm not advocating for the Democrats or the Republicans because you know
04:03Honestly to be open and honest
04:05I really think both parties ought to just be done away with and get some actual people in there
04:11I I have a hard time believing. This is the best that America can do. Are you serious?
04:16but what happens is if you say anything that might challenge the beliefs of one side or the other even if it's factual just
04:25presenting facts what happens is if the facts lay
04:30Lay on the critical side of one side or the other well
04:33The other side is going to come in and say well, you're you're taking the sides and I I'd take neither side
04:38I really think that both sides should be just wiped out and let's get some good people in Washington and
04:44It happens not only with politics but religion
04:48As you and I were discussing right before the show. I
04:51Invite anybody who has escaped a cult to come in and talk on my podcast and you know, it's an open door
04:58I have I have let people of beliefs that you know
05:02I'm not going to say which ones because I don't want to hurt their feelings
05:05but they're so far from what I believe that I
05:09Sometimes I have to think it
05:11They're living a life that is deeper fantasy than the one that they left. I'll just say it like that
05:16so I'm not in alignment with many people who get on the podcast, but
05:22anytime
05:23for example today the
05:26Gentleman was talking about he had a struggle with homosexuality
05:30Which you know
05:31I've never had many people that I know who have escaped these cults have had and
05:36I feel a deep concern for them
05:38You know if they struggle I would like to help them if I could I can't I'm not even I'm not a minister
05:45I'm not anything like this and so my recommendation has always been
05:49Go find a pastor to help you if you're wanting to remain Christian and you struggle with this go find a pastor
05:54And I just leave it at that
05:56But what happens is if I invite a guest on the show who has a struggle like this
06:03Well, then it is so polarized and politicized that you'll get people to attack that and say well
06:09You shouldn't have invited him on your show. You must be sympathetic to the homosexuals. Well, my dad was a was a pastor and
06:17One of the things that he I really remember this phrase from him and he was talking about
06:23Interpreting scripture, but obviously it applies to any kind of logical discourse
06:27he says you can't argue from silence and I think you know what that means John, but
06:34easy way to say that is
06:36If somebody directly says something, okay
06:39Well, then you can discuss that you can think about whether there's a dialogue that can happen
06:44But if somebody has not said something you can't
06:48Inject ideas or alternate facts or whatever you want to call them into that discourse because then you have
06:56Really nothing to stand on and so I think I neglected to bring up
07:03Something that is going to it's going to seem perhaps obscure
07:09To the folks that have seen these these podcasts of ours
07:13But I was thinking of a working title for this would be Vladimir Solovyov and the NAR
07:19So Solovyov, I would expect people will not be aware of them. But hopefully after this broadcast you would see a
07:27podcast rather you'd see
07:29how he kind of ties into things and he fits my
07:32my overall
07:34premise of there's a
07:36Converging apostasy coming from different angles. One of course is a Christian identity
07:42Another is just purely political
07:45And then of course latter rain ideas and even what you'd say like new age kind of ideas from Alice Bailey
07:53so
07:54That said this already might sound like I'm stepping on somebody's toes. But here goes
07:59I
08:00thought of the quest to make Russia great again, and so
08:06There's this there's an interesting place that I found this idea coming up in
08:11And that is in The Light Will Come From Russia by the NAR prophetess Gwynne Shaw
08:19Now Gwynne, if anybody has my book, you'll see that not only was she in good standing with all the NAR
08:27apostolic conferences and prophetic meetings
08:30but she was highly influenced by
08:34By esoteric thought and did some plagiarizing on her part
08:38But Miss Shaw tells us in this book that there will be new prophecies and she makes this all mysterious
08:45Related to the role of Russia in the end times. Okay, that's interesting
08:51You can actually hear that kind of stuff from
08:54people on the alt-right say like Richard Spencer and
08:59Even Steve Bannon to a certain extent
09:03Here's another fact that talks about this
09:06Revitalization of Russia
09:07the blind Russian mystic Baba Vanga says
09:12Nobody can stop Russia and she continues saying for the glory of Russia
09:18Vladimir Putin will become the lord of the world. Okay. Well, that's pretty pretty high position for him considering
09:25Kind of yeah, he seems to be
09:28And so one the Russian mystic Vladimir Solov
09:33He would have been writing in the mid 1800s to around
09:371900 to the Holocaust the nine John lamb lash probably another new name for a lot of your listeners and
09:45three
09:47Alexander Dugan
09:48Here's the esoteric fascist and an advisor to Vladimir Putin all of these people
09:55Talk about ushering a new era in order to make Russia great again
10:01Yeah, and you mentioned the ties to the NAR and I'm certain when people see that title
10:06they're gonna say what in the world is this but
10:09Solovyov was a propagandist and as
10:14Anybody who has seen the recent little short documentaries that have been putting out on the NAR?
10:20some of the things that they are spreading is propaganda and
10:24I know that there's this big world of you know
10:28labeling people conspiracy theories if they talk about Russia influencing elections, especially if I mentioned the guy with the
10:36you know with the
10:38the big hair and the orange face
10:40if I mention that
10:42I'm not gonna mention the name
10:45But if you mention that there is a conspiracy happening there are people who will reject that
10:51But I'm an IT guy, I know how AI works I have seen the AI I get on Facebook
10:57I can see it people tell me that my
11:00sometimes they'll share one of my videos and it'll get brought down because the AI will detect that it has
11:07Elements that might be seen as offensive or whatever and and literally it's because I'm quoting these NAR guys or Branham
11:14Which is really ironic if you think about that, they're saying these things in churches
11:18But it's more than a conspiracy theory it is a proven conspiracy
11:23I can see what's happening there and Facebook's algorithm is to try to combat what's going on with Russia and China
11:31Where they're just dumping propaganda to try to sway
11:34Public opinion. Well while Russia and China are doing this with our heads and Facebook and these other social medias
11:41They're doing the same thing in the churches with social medias
11:45Maybe not in the same way or same strategy, but it is propaganda and
11:50That history has been going on
11:53if you watch the
11:55you know the
11:57Christian identity series that I'm doing with John McKinnon
12:00You can go back in the 30s and you can see the same exact thing happening with Hitler and back then they didn't have Facebook
12:07But it's all coming in the newspapers and there were propagandists that were spreading this thing
12:12So the ties are unbelievable if you like you said the converging apostasy. Well now you're converging
12:19apostasy also with propaganda and
12:22You know that combination to me. That is the essence of the NAR
12:28Yeah, John, that's interesting that you mentioned being taken down
12:32Off of the internet for various things just quoting people back when Twitter was Twitter. That's a long time ago, right?
12:39Yes
12:41Never mind, but when Twitter was still Twitter
12:44I was quoting Bill Hammond the supposed prophet of the NRA
12:51sorry in AR and
12:53So Hammond Hammond was just saying these outlandish things about what I would call the sacred purge and I just quote him and it was
13:01evidently
13:02considered
13:04Hate speech or something else. I say yeah, it is hate speech, but he's the one saying it not me
13:09so, but here's something here's something that gets back to the Russian aspect of things and
13:15very interesting to me
13:18because as in the Bible you see wisdom is something you would ask of God if you if you hate need wisdom ask
13:26And your father would give you your father in heaven would give you this
13:30Because you know if you ask for a loaf of bread, he's not going to give you a snake
13:35so
13:36Things like that that you might hear and of course, I'm paraphrasing different aspects that I've heard in Scripture
13:43But here's something that you don't hear too often is
13:47That Sophia is a personal spiritual being
13:52Jane Lee who so greatly influenced the latter rain prophets some of them
13:58She referred to Sophia as the great goddess and the wonder of wonders and she claimed that she got all of her
14:06revelations from Sophia
14:08Okay, there's a reason for that in the esoteric world. And so let me just run down this as far as personal Sophia
14:15other than
14:17Vladimir Solyov, so he does think of her as a personal actual being
14:22Those who consider Sophia to be a personal spiritual being include
14:26The Gnostic Valentinus, go figure
14:30Jane Leeds mentor the spiritualist John Portage
14:34Jane Leed herself. This is going to be a bit odd sounding, but the Satanic Church of Zazuzel
14:40and
14:42five the
14:44Neo-Gnostic John Lamb Lash. So there's another one John Portage probably listeners are not too familiar with him
14:52And probably especially John Lamb Lash, but talk about converging. He's sort of like Wesley Swift
14:59He's got a little bit of everything
15:01So here's what Mr. Lash says on the rise of Russia and I have to warn again. This is going to get pretty weird
15:10So he is a white supremacist. He's also a Luciferian
15:14And he supports the rebirth of Russia
15:17So he's not going to be going waving, you know, the American flag he's actually talking about Russia being the one
15:25for the end times
15:28He says that these ideas have been revealed to him by Sophia and get this he refers to
15:34Sophia as the true Lucifer
15:38Pretty odd idea there and he says that she promotes Russia and America
15:44Left and right working together for an alliance of white power
15:48And so my question might be this does this sound vaguely similar to anything said by politicians?
15:56Generally speaking in recent years
15:59So what about Sophia and the sacred purge according to Lash?
16:03He states that the planets and its people cannot go against Sophia without an annihilation
16:10In the timeline is what he puts it
16:14So similar to the final solution that we all know came from the Third Reich
16:21Lash calls this a Sophiac correction
16:24So he's kind of euphemizing the term final solution given the Jews all of his anti-semitic stuff
16:33Excuse me, and so what makes this especially dangerous is
16:37That like the hands-on
16:39Eschatology of the NAR which of course inherited from say lead and lettering prophets
16:45Lash says
16:47Lash, excuse me says that this annihilation will require human
16:53Participation so it's not gonna be angels of Jesus or an earthquake is gonna swallow him up
16:58He says no humans are gonna have to carry that out and he says we have met the time of this great purging
17:06That's his words. Yeah, and you can go back through history and you can see
17:11Every single bad regime that has risen up and even before it was political regimes every bad religious
17:18Movement that rose up and they tie it to this esoteric knowledge. We have the knowledge we have the secret you guys don't
17:25We're the ones who have the special power and what it is is a tool of manipulation and in its essence
17:31It is a tool of propaganda much like the gentleman we're discussing
17:36what's really ironic is that
17:39There while they have that type of manipulation for whatever is there, you know premise that they're trying to put their agenda
17:46They're trying to push they also have manipulation on the words and phrases if it's a Christian
17:53pseudo-christian religion
17:54Such that for example, I've thought about this long and hard in the latter rain movement
18:00They had this thing that was called discernment
18:02Now in the Bible discernment means being able to discern in other words
18:08Somebody comes to you and they give you this false
18:11Propaganda like these movements are doing and you discern is it true or is it false? It is discernment
18:16well
18:18They're pushing this false thing in this latter rain, right?
18:20so they began claiming that the word discernment actually meant the ability to
18:26detect people's
18:28Personal information that they had written on their prayer cards when they came through the law it is
18:36It is so absurd and and this you know, this got kind of widespread and
18:41So you you hear this word kind of randomly use even in churches that haven't been a part of that latter rain history
18:48Because it was so widespread. They're using this word discernment and not really clearly understanding what it is
18:54So there's propaganda on top of the propaganda
18:59Yeah, so
19:00You know more directly with this fella. So love your of Vladimir his first name
19:06He has a very long middle name, which I'm leaving out
19:10For purposes of not being able to pronounce it very well
19:14But he he said that like a lot of our narrow folks
19:17He claimed to be a prophet and he said that his prophecies would soon come to pass
19:22So he was an influential 19th century Russian philosopher who studied
19:27Go figure lots of esoteric literature
19:31So this included again the Gnostic Valentinus
19:35Kabbalah which has turned up again and again and again in esoteric world and he actually had access to Jane Leeds
19:43mentors
19:44Writings and that is the spiritualist John Portage
19:49So just as a reminder how this is tied into things
19:53more pertinent for today
19:55Several of the lattering prophets borrowed heavily from Jane Leeds writings and many of their ideas were then passed on
20:03To the Nara and also to what some people call diminutist ideas and so on
20:07Because she talks the same and she was back there in the 17th century writing this stuff and then lettering prophets
20:15Plagiarized it and passed it on to folks that preach that stuff today. And so the question here is so what?
20:23Well, I kind of already answered that but another way to word it would be that Solovyov was in the family tradition of
20:30Esoteric teachings that spawned two main things one that literally
20:35Spawned the New Age movement
20:37Whatever people want to call that I would call it Alice Bailey influenced writings and she used the word New Age constantly
20:45so and to
20:47the Jane Leed inspired doctrines that developed and
20:51Progressed in the lettering movement of 1948
20:54So who does this Solovyov have in his corner who promotes him?
21:00Well, a lot of people do behind the scenes in Russia and elsewhere
21:05But here's one John Pope John Paul the second called Solovyov
21:10quote one of the greatest Russian Christian philosophers of the 19th and 20th centuries and
21:16Bringing it all down to today
21:19Russian president Vladimir Putin quote assigned his regional governors with homework. Well, who might they be?
21:29One of the ones that they gave the most homework about
21:33Putin wanted people to be familiar with the writings of Solovyov
21:38now
21:39There's a lot that I'm not including here, but just a quick way of saying how that might come out
21:46Is that people have quoted Solovyov's works and shown how they support
21:56Russian attacks on
21:59Their satellites and in particular the invasion of
22:03Ukraine and stating things. So we talked earlier John about the dehumanizing
22:09language
22:10They would say that the Ukrainians are not even humans. They're
22:15their beasts that
22:17Have have decided that they can actually rise up and challenge mother Russia. And so their demise is fitting
22:25right and the dehumanizing language really is what happens after you have the propaganda because the
22:32Propaganda is meant to manipulate your head get you into an ideology and then hyper charge that so that you can be
22:40Aggressively against something whereas you might not have been in the first place
22:44And you know back to the example, we gave at the beginning of the show a person who has some sort of struggle
22:50I don't care what it is alcoholism in the case that I mentioned
22:54I think it was you know, it was homosexuality
22:57but there are many different sins in the array of sins that humans can do and
23:02That's that's part of being human you struggle with things
23:06You know and what one person has a struggle with the other person doesn't what happens is when you're in these movements and they use
23:13Propaganda to hyper make you hypersensitive against those things. It's interesting because you can see what is the
23:21Clearly the political agenda of the religion because what is the current politics?
23:27What what is the current sin in politics that they're focusing upon?
23:31That's the one they hyper charge you with and that's the one that they they come at you and what happens is it?
23:38Dehumanizes you to the extent that the person who's struggling
23:41You would rather attack them than to try to lift out a hand and help them back up and
23:48It puts it into the place where your average person who has no inclination whatsoever to be a spiritual
23:56Guider to be a minister or evangelist or counselor or anything?
24:01instead you
24:02You use the propaganda to supercharge their mind to attack and that's literally what it's doing
24:09And so these people they attack the person with whatever is the current popular
24:14politicized sin, right and
24:17it's so aggressive and the problem with this is you can look at all of the villains in history that
24:24You know countries that have started world wars. We took, you know, we're talking about Putin right now, but before him there were several others
24:30They they did the exact same thing and they got the people to back them in their agenda
24:36To attack other people and so the fact that they're doing this in religion to me, it's scary. This is some scary stuff
24:44yeah, yeah, and
24:47The the part about Solovio that I think is interesting and takes him out of the arena being
24:54completely obscure and therefore not
24:57Not really important to deal with is similar to Jane lead. I've had people say well why focus on Jane lead?
25:04And my answer is because
25:06much of what I call hands-on eschatology meaning
25:10we will become perfect or we will become
25:15at least morally superior to others as part of the end time and then
25:22ruling and reigning with Christ
25:24well
25:25we'll do that for Christ before a literal person Christ comes to receive the kingdom and then of course the the
25:32The sacred purge aspect of that
25:35Because all of these things are doing being done on behalf of Christ before he returns
25:41So that's where Solovio actually has touched bases if you want to put it through other people
25:47in history on to the alt-right and some of the white supremacist ideas of today and
25:53So here we go with those two supposedly obscure people, but still significant
25:58I can say this as far as Solovio's Sophia. That's a mouthful for me
26:05I can say this like Jane lead
26:09Solovio claimed to have mystical experience with experiences with a personal Sophia
26:15Not just the idea of I want to be wise full of Sophia. No, he was actually
26:21Having visions he said and this may have been related to something as you said that he was struggling with
26:28Because his soul his whole life was sort of obsessed with Sophia
26:33And I think he either had a romantic interest or a wife of that name
26:39so he said
26:41That Sophia was the in one of these visions. He said that she was the perfect image of feminine beauty
26:49Now somebody a scholar who's written about this
26:52Dr. Oliver Smith in
26:54his the Russian boy
26:57Says that so Solovio had deeply
27:01Eroticized visions of Sophia that is really easy to come by if you saw it been someone like him who studied
27:09Valentinus and Kabbalah because they're full of that kind of stuff and
27:13Interestingly that kind of stuff also gets passed on to Jane lead
27:19One of the only components that I've seen in Jane lead that is not so much present in the latter rain is
27:25The feminine aspect of this this divine Sophia
27:30They pretty much stick to Jesus, but they'll add in all of the other
27:35Hands-on eschatology kind of ideas that Jane Lee did. Okay. So as far as the NAR goes
27:43This stuff is similar to what the NAR prophet Bill Johnson's when heaven invades earth says
27:50According to Solovio's the
27:55reconciliation of Sophia Sophia
27:57He says that she is called the rainbow which is reconciling heaven and earth
28:03Where heaven steeps down to earth in divine reconciliation?
28:07So yeah, if you've read Bill Johnson's book
28:12This will probably click with you and you'll say hmm. Yeah, that sounds familiar. You know, it's kind of funny because
28:18Whenever I first left the religion and I was trying to just get footing
28:23I mean, I wouldn't even say that I was on a path yet
28:26I was just trying to get footing and I was trying to understand what what is this mess?
28:29What is this weird thing because we had the secret knowledge and so you get in Google and you type in secret knowledge
28:36And you're gonna find all kinds of things that you know, yeah me
28:39I didn't know existed and it led me straight to Gnosticism, which is the gnosis the secret knowledge, right?
28:46Well, what is interesting is they're each each brand of this thing whether it's Gnosticism or Kabbalah or
28:54any of the others the Sophia character exists in a certain way a certain form and
29:00I began to compare all of these different esoteric religions with what I had grown up with and I found out
29:06It's almost like a cookie-cutter stamp
29:09religion some of them Christianity some of them not and
29:13I got to the point of
29:15Right before the healing revivals before it became latter rain
29:19There were numerous people that were claiming that they had some kind of secret knowledge and it came to them in
29:25different various forms
29:26Which you could easily take whatever it is that they said and replace it with Sophia and it's the same exact thing and then
29:34you know about
29:361940s ish you had all of these men not just William Branham
29:40But many of them claiming that they had a an angel come down and the angel gave them the secret knowledge and therefore I have the
29:47New revelation and you should be my cult members. That's it was so common. So many people doing it, right? Yeah
29:54well, and then
29:56Branham, I don't know. I don't think he originated it but somebody came up with the idea that angels
30:01Had to not be female and so that began to spread through the movement and they took the female aspect out
30:08Which is exactly what you just said. It wasn't the female Sophia, but it was the same exact thing just without gender
30:17What's really interesting is when you come forward and you get into about the time of the Kansas City Prophets
30:23You've got you know, Paul Cain and Bob Jones and all these guys. Well, they took that same
30:30genderless angel that Branham claimed to have he I don't think he really saw anything and
30:35They said it was a female Emma a female angel named Emma
30:39So then they brought the fullness of Sophia back into the to the NAR
30:45Have you ever wondered how the Pentecostal movement started or how the progression of modern Pentecostalism?
30:52transition through the latter reign
30:54Charismatic and other fringe movements into the New Apostolic Reformation
30:58You can learn this and more on William Branham historical researches website
31:03William dash Branham org on the books page of the website
31:07You can find the compiled research of John Collins Charles Paisley
31:12Stephen Montgomery John McKinnon and others with links to the paper audio and digital versions of each book
31:20You can also find resources and documentation on various people and topics related to those movements
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31:33And as always be sure to LIKE and subscribe to the audio or video version that you're listening to or watching
31:39On behalf of William Branham historical research. We want to thank you for your support
31:44So yeah as far as this
31:46angelic
31:47Sophia
31:49You know, or is it male or female?
31:51Actually in the writings of Jane Leed
31:55She does something that goes all the way back to Valentino's
31:58And kind of has like have your cake and eat it, too
32:02She says that Sophia is genderless, but what she means is
32:09Actually more accurately she says that Sophia can express herself as male or female as she wishes
32:16Well, if you look in Wicca or other places like that, you see that's a very common idea
32:21And it's pretty much the the idea of the androgynous
32:27Original man, you know, you get in the Plato and folks like that and definitely and
32:33in Valentino's these
32:37Male female pairs in the heavenlies
32:41If one of them is cast down like Sophia was her this is pretty disgusting
32:46But her her pair her consort or she was the consort apparently in his ideas of Christ
32:53And so she got kicked out of heaven for wanting to know what it was like to be God
32:57And of course if we read in the book of Genesis, there's a lot of implications behind that
33:03So she gets kicked out. Okay
33:06her new role as far as esoteric world goes is to enlighten people with the gnosis of their
33:14divine heritage and their divine
33:17Realignment or infusion or union with the angel that they had to leave
33:21So and yeah, you know if you get into some of the Apostles of the Latter-day Saints beginning like George Houghton
33:29George Houghton was one who said
33:34He gave the male gender to the body of Christ he didn't say the bride of Christ
33:41He didn't say the bride of Christ he said no we are the sons of God and the new Jerusalem that comes down upon us
33:48That's the feminine part. So it gets real twisted around and it's like this since that like you said the Emma thing
33:55Okay. So what about Solovyev, Sophia and Lucifer? Okay. Here's this war in it again. It's about to get pretty weird
34:03Well, this guy dr. Stefan a holler says that Solovyev's writings
34:10Were often invocations to Sophia and they were dilated he says with Gnostic and Kabbalistic
34:18terminology and metaphors
34:20for example
34:22Solovyev's Song of the Ophites and maybe you know what that means John
34:27It was written in honor of Sophia who he referred to as the serpent of wisdom in the Garden of Eden
34:35Interesting now if you get into the esoteric world, that's the that's the flip side, you know, everything in the Bible gets reversed
34:43the serpent
34:45representing Satan or Lucifer
34:47turns out to be the good guy the guy that gives illumination and
34:52freedom from the
34:54suppressive
34:56Jehovah and the Jews all those guys are no good. So come with us
35:01So Valentinians who were also the ones that influenced Solovyev taught that
35:08Sophia herself was the serpent if you get into Blavatsky and some of the other occultists you can see
35:15Yeah, yeah, that's fits pretty well
35:17Because Blavatsky calls Valentinus a saint
35:22So go figure
35:25Valentinians also said that this Lucifer like Sophia is and this is where it gets very weird
35:31Prunikos, I think that's Latin or Greek, but yeah, it looks like Greek
35:36I've never heard it pronounced but it literally means and if you're talking about somebody
35:41Who in the occult world is you know, like Lucifer slash?
35:46Sophia
35:49Prunikos literally means quote the sacred whore
35:53Okay, and then similar to Jane Leed inspired manifest sons of God teachings
35:59So love your praise to Sophia
36:02Incarnate yourself in us and restore the fullness of the ages that God may be all in all
36:08I'm glad you brought up the Garden of Eden because and the funny thing you and I tend to beat each other to topics
36:15You you beat me to at that time
36:17But you know when when I began doing this and I began explaining to people that a
36:24Lot of what we grew up with was religious propaganda
36:27It was hard to put that into words because people that that term propaganda has just been so overused that people
36:33Associated with things that aren't even propaganda
36:36But the way propaganda works in the religious form is they like to take these
36:43passages from the Bible that are very obscured very
36:47you know
36:48Don't have a lot of details and what happens is they will spread the propaganda to give you the details to fill in the blanks in
36:55Between and that's the esoteric knowledge. That would that is what would come from Sophia, right?
37:01and so what happens is the people get
37:05Assimilated into these belief sets through propaganda so much so that they will take a passage that has no details
37:11But it's very vague very sometimes prophetic sometimes just literally there there are no details
37:17Such as the Garden of Eden and they'll say what's black and white. Can't you see XY and Z?
37:23that isn't even in the text and
37:26The example that I was gonna go to for that was, you know, William Branham serpent seed
37:31We've mentioned at the two seed doctrine of Christian identity
37:35John McKinnon and I talk about it quite a bit. Well, if you talk to somebody who has been
37:41Manipulated with that
37:43racist anti-semitic propaganda
37:46And I've had him tell me this can't you see it's black and white the serpent had sex with Eve
37:51But there is no text that says the serpent had sex with Eve. That's the result of propaganda
37:56You have the propagandists who are giving you the false information and they're saying fill in the blanks
38:02Can't you see and they hyper charge you to the extent that you know, it's kind of funny after you after I escaped this thing
38:09I look back at some of these things that we believed and they're unimportant, you know
38:14Whether the serpent did or didn't actually in the context of just that passage. It's really unimportant
38:20But we were manipulated to think that it was important much like the propagandists
38:26So we're we were we were in essence
38:29Our minds were you know
38:31Just literally hijacked by some of the propaganda and the fruits of that as you know with Christian identity
38:37Turned into some very dangerous things in the 60s. Yeah, and John you sound like you're
38:43Boy, excuse me today. You sound like you're kind of alluding back to this idea that I was saying my dad taught me
38:50About it. It's a bad idea to argue from silence the silence. There would be a
38:57Full exploitation of one of these sort of vague scriptures. It's a real problem when people try to fill in those gaps and
39:04Technically, I think probably the best thing is to leave them alone if you can't come up with a literal
39:12Plain-to-see
39:13Interpretation of it then just leave it alone and don't don't follow what people are saying
39:18So one of the one of the points in relation to that arguing from silence from vague scriptures
39:25comes what with one of the big ones that all these guys were most don't talk about is the
39:30manifestations of the sons of the manifestation of the sons of God
39:34So Solovyov
39:36Actually was another one who was really intrigued with that that statement
39:41From the Bible and he related it just like Jane Leed to becoming quote perfect
39:48So and and you see this kind of thinking in the narrative to a certain extent, especially with the older prophets
39:54they had more access to be an influence from the latter reign, so
39:58So
40:00Solovyov was studying the the eighth chapter of Romans and
40:04that's where this phrase comes from and
40:07He said this helped him to develop his desire for immortality and for the glory of the sons of God
40:14Well, he could easily sound like a latter-in-prophet, you know, even though he's just a Russian mystic
40:20And so again, this dr. Stefan a holier says that all of Solovyov's writings about perfection
40:28are both
40:30Theosophic and theurgic. So I came across that word, you know, we read we learn
40:36Haven't heard it too much. But I think it's
40:40Easily defined as calling down spirits
40:44Even asking them to well calling them down for information
40:49Because they're you know in the heavenlies and they know more about stuff than we do
40:53Or even asking them to channel through your body to get prophecy or
40:59to
41:00Inhabit your body permanently as a matter of perfection. The latter part there would fit Jane Glead and
41:09Valentinus quite well. So so what is this this theurgy?
41:14Well, we can go to one of the horse's mouths here
41:18The Satanist Helena Blavatsky of the Theosophical Society
41:23defined theurgy as quote a
41:26communication with and a means of bringing down to earth
41:31Planetary spirits and angels who are the gods of light. I mean that sounds like it's coming straight out of Jane Leeds
41:38Mouth, especially if you've read
41:40this kind of stuff from my book quoting Jane Leed
41:44But here's where it gets a little bit interesting I mean or more interesting
41:48How does this idea of calling down spirits?
41:52Compare with the NAR prophet Bill Hammond when he calls down angels to quote
41:58appoint themselves
41:59companions with Christians
42:02I just have to leave it at that. I think it compares pretty well
42:07And so here's something else that you can see
42:10Parallels with the the NAR
42:12Solovyev and unity
42:16on the topic of unity he says that
42:21There would be a global unification of the church and a theocracy
42:26Which would be ruled by a Russian czar of course think like in his day. They had Russian czars and
42:33a universal church
42:35With a Pope and the Prophet he's pretty vague about what he means by the Prophet
42:40I don't know folks read your Bible and see how that will compare to things you might hear in the book of Revelation
42:45So speaking of Revelation in
42:491900 Solovyev wrote a short story of Antichrist
42:53And it sounds oddly similar to what the NAR prophetess
42:57Sandy Jacobs says I mean
43:00generally speaking
43:02So for Solovyev, he says that genuine believers, ah whoever heard that lately
43:10from
43:11Catholicism Russian Orthodoxy and Evangelical Protestantism
43:16Will all come together in unity in the 21st century
43:21okay, so
43:23Talking about the the great end time revival of course some people would say no the Bible really doesn't say that the the billion-person
43:32Harvest and all that there's plenty of scriptures that would oppose that and say directly the opposite
43:37We're here have Solovyev agreeing with the NAR prophets and saying that yeah
43:43All these guys are going to get together and it's actually some direct quotes from Sandy Jacobs. It talks about
43:49There must be complete unity among believers. And that's where you see some of the ideas of
43:56Having this big tent kind of philosophy of saying okay
44:00Well, you're Catholic, but are you on with what we're doing? Yeah, you're a non charismatic. Maybe you're
44:07Maybe you're Methodist, but hey, we need to set up the kingdom of God. Are you with us?
44:12And so yeah, it does sound like NAR teaching to me
44:16But in the same story a short story of the Antichrist
44:22Solovyev says
44:24That there will be an imposter. Hmm. Okay, go figure
44:28And but he says that later
44:32People that support him will become pleased with killing and silencing those who oppose this
44:39Diabolical tyrant they will even hold festivities to execute them for God, you know, and it's kind of weird and
44:48almost like a
44:50Fantasy movie to the way the NAR developed over time. I'm sure you're familiar with this, but I'm finding not everybody
44:57Even in the NAR is aware of this history
45:00But when C pit Peter Wagner started putting a name on what was emerging
45:04He started claiming that there were different regions of the earth that were ruled by these elemental spirits
45:11And so we need to establish this network and the network became the NAR
45:16But this network of Christians who may not even believe the same things
45:20But in the network they can provide prayer warriors to go fight the spirits
45:25And this guy named Ted Haggard started claiming that there was this Queen of Heaven that he was trying to
45:31battle it with his spiritual warriors and
45:35What was her name? It was Anna Mendez
45:38I think it was
45:39called a group of several people and they went up into the Himalayas to call down this elemental spirit from heaven and fight it and
45:46You can imagine how silly that would have looked
45:49All these people but what they're trying to you know, and it's all for me
45:53It's all fantasy that none of this is even any real any reality to it
45:58But if it were real what they're essentially trying to do is call down the bad spirits not the good ones
46:04So the whole thing is just so absurd
46:08It does yeah John it reminds me of one
46:11What's a company that has the all the really popular superhero movies?
46:17Marvel's yeah Marvel. It sounds like one of those kind of things doesn't it? Yeah
46:22so
46:23Okay, here's here's something that when I mentioned this
46:27This word people thought no, you really need something else. So so you all so love you of
46:33He had a very big influence on Russian cosmism and people think are you trying to say?
46:40Communism said no
46:42cosmism
46:43speaking of the cosmos
46:45So the first question that comes up is what is cosmism
46:50well from the things that I read about a
46:53Cosmism tried to synthesize Gnostic beliefs with scientific progress
46:59Okay, so so that's a big one of those convergences and from anybody from Jane Lee roll crown quiz
47:08Even Helena Blavatsky they all talk about
47:12These vague kind of ideas that that science and and spirituality will merge and
47:19That this will somehow lead to either the New Age or immortality or heightened psychic abilities
47:26However, they want to phrase it
47:28and so cause
47:30Cosmos and this is kind of a dark and dirty aspect of it
47:35It seeks an alliance between Germany and Russia since both share common roots in
47:42the peoples of
47:44Aryan origin
47:45Okay, so there you go with something that really can tie into the guys and alt-right Christian
47:52identity
47:53and
47:55some of the more so-called
47:58intellectuals of that movement
48:01Like Dugin, Alexander Dugin, they do draw upon these these histories and Dugin being a Russian
48:08he's familiar with
48:10Valentinus and Sophia and
48:13Plato and some of these other ideas about cosmism
48:17and so and it just goes just
48:21It's it's logical just to show the next part here is that
48:26Cosmism shares some of Lede's sources of inspiration and
48:31Remember what she gets gets handed down to the latter rain, at least a lot of it
48:36So for example
48:38Cosmism includes the so-called classic occultist traditions such as Kabbalah
48:45Astrology
48:46Alchemy, etc. Okay, so and like Valentinus and Jane Lede, the Cosmists, here we go
48:54This is a big one, Fyodorovich Fyodorov
48:57I think I got it, said that perfection is possible through union with immortal beings. That probably sounds to you like
49:06Jim Jones and Branham. To me it sounds like also like Jane Lede
49:15And because they're all in the same big happy family even though they alter these words as you say John
49:22The little letters they pull out and the strings they pull for their their propagandist
49:31Presentations of all this stuff
49:33they really cross cross ties and and
49:39Come together in certain respects. I have a theory about that which you probably wouldn't relate to too much John
49:46But it's totally a historical. I know you're very good with the historical research
49:51In my idea
49:53Certain forms of deception are ahistorical and they just essentially follow a line
50:01To denigrate Christ, to pull people away from Christianity
50:06But those ideas exist out there and don't necessarily have to have so-and-so said this to so-and-so and whatever
50:14So I'm sure we can have a nice discussion about that sometime John
50:18Okay, but but here's something that does tie all this Cosmos stuff
50:23back to current-day NAR folks. So similar to the elitism of the NAR and the Third Reich and
50:33The Indian
50:35Nationalists that we discussed last time
50:38Cosmos believed that the transformation of man into Superman will come through
50:46Authoritarianism and physical violence, you know, you mentioned the Marvel comics and it's hard not to
50:53Not to apply that example to this whole thing because you've got the Christian identity in the United States
50:59You've got the Russian thing. You've got the Indian thing and you know, it's it's like the Marvel Universe
51:05But then because of all of these networks
51:07You've got the Marvel Universe and then you've got the DC universe for the DC comics
51:12And I don't know maybe alley-oop from the funny papers
51:15It's all of these different networks and then within the NAR because they're tied to the right wing
51:24pseudo-christian politic thing
51:26Well in within their network, you've got all of the different versions and variations from there
51:31Most of which aren't in full cohesion
51:34so sometimes they'll be completely polar opposite and doctrines but as long as they're part of the network and as long as we're joining to
51:41Fight this imaginary
51:42Queen of Heaven or whatever is the weird thing?
51:44They're fighting at the time as long as you're part of that network
51:47You're okay, and we'll see you as a good people and anybody who opposes us as a villain
51:52We have seeded that propaganda and now I mean think of this
51:57It has reached the level where even Christians in the United States are vilified
52:02because the other Christians who are part of this network they see the
52:07The not the same flavor of Christianity as the villain because of the propaganda
52:13yeah, this is very
52:15unfortunate and
52:17We both see it so much
52:20I'm I'm really thankful for the times. I know you feel this way to John
52:27Other than people who maybe misunderstand what you're doing and you know
52:33Try to try to downgrade whatever your point of view is
52:37You have these folks that are sincere they're hurting they've gone through some form of deception
52:44They're trying to get out of it and they say thank you so much John. Thank you so much Steve for
52:50Bringing these things to light is helping
52:53Me to get out of what I'm doing. It's something unravel some of that stuff
52:57I know John you talked about the years that it took you to
53:00Unravel and kind of get back to the just base of who you are as a person
53:05And what do you think about the Bible about Christ?
53:10For me when I left the the positive confession Word of Faith group that I was in
53:17It took it took a long time
53:19And even when I did go back and read the Bible all that all that loaded language would come back
53:25And I think one of the terms I heard in those in those days was floating
53:30So floating would be like you're kind of back in the mindset of the group and wondering
53:35okay, well the Bible does say that but but what does it really mean and
53:41so
53:42So yeah, I think what do they call that cognitive dissonance? I think that that's a big
53:49problem for people that come out of these groups and I'm just glad that we can
53:53Put in our two cents worth and help folks out. Yeah, I'm glad to and you know
53:59Having gone through it it's easier for me than some of the people who haven't but just to put it into proper perspective
54:06Somebody who has had their identity stolen from them. That's that was me. That's many of the people I work with
54:12well, there comes a point when you have to deconstruct that and
54:16Some of the things that people argue as sin or not sin
54:20Well, there's a point of time in your deconstruction that you really just simply don't care because you have deconstructed all of that
54:26You have nothing you've wiped your complete every every bit of your foundation is gone and you're trying to trying to stack back up
54:34What is my foundation? Who am I? What do I believe?
54:37So my parents were Christian. Why why am I Christian?
54:41Why do I want to be Christian and you have to allow that?
54:44Progression because if you try to push somebody one way or another you may actually push them away from where you're wanting them to head
54:51because you're
54:52You're not doing the right thing
54:54I'll just say it like that
54:54Even the psychologists will tell you don't prophesize people when you want to help them instead show them the way right?
55:02So that's what we try to do here. Everybody's welcome, and I'm glad we can talk through these things and it's just for me
55:09it gets more and more fascinating the further you and I go into the converging apostasy because
55:14Every single aspect of what we talk about on this show
55:17My mind is racing through all of these doctrines and how it applies and I know that all of our listeners are the same way
55:24That's that's why this this is one of the more popular ones that I do
55:27So thank you so much for doing this with me Steve glad to be a part of it, John
55:32Well, if you've enjoyed our show and you want more information, you can check us out on the web
55:36You can find us at William dash Branham org for more information about the dark side of latter rain
55:42You can read weaponized religion from latter rain to colonia dignidad
55:47Available on Amazon Kindle and audible for more about the converging apostasy
55:52You can read the book the converging apostasy and you can also read the book a quick outline of hands-on
55:58eschatology a matter of timing and agency
56:12So
56:42You