In today's digital age, where personal branding and public perception play a vital role in success, strategic PR efforts have become more important than ever. In a recent podcast interview with entrepreneur Ulyses Osuna, hosted by Jeff Fenster, the power of PR in shaping personal brands and controlling the narrative took center stage. Ulyses, the founder of Influencer Press, shared valuable insights on the significance of PR, the evolving landscape, and the keys to achieving business growth while maintaining a fulfilling personal life.
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00:00First things first is you have to control the narrative for your brand PR is just organized truth
00:04People are no longer competing just off of the name to go speak. It's like, okay
00:07Now you have something to bring to the table. You wrote for Huffington Post you wrote for success you were for entrepreneur
00:13It was scary because I got banned and there was a lot of people doing reporting on me
00:20So anybody that's ever done anything in their life and in their business if you just
00:25Organize it the correct way you can get it
00:27You can get in a lot of these doors for me at that point in time. It was my age
00:31So they let me write one of them and the content was good. They accepted it after that
00:36I used that article that I published on entrepreneur.com. I went to the Huffington Post and I said, hey, I write for entrepreneur
00:41I love to write here and then I'd go to the Huffington Post and I'd say hey
00:44I'd go to success comm next and it's just once you start doing it for one big level person
00:49They'll make an introduction as long as you do a good job to another person and another person another person
00:53It just becomes kind of like this snowball effect
00:57I
01:14Welcome to the show Ulysses. Thank you, dude. So awesome. I mean it's been uh, I think we met back in what 2020
01:21It was a while back. Yeah. Yeah, my old business partner Neil Patel connected me
01:25I saw I saw his face on your website. Yeah, and I was looking for some press
01:29I was looking to build more a little bit more of the personal brand
01:32It's googling some stuff and I've came across you and I was like, hey, I know that guy
01:37So I reached out to Neil and he was like, oh, yeah
01:39I'll connect you and I think he connected us for the first time and we had a
01:42Conversation you said something to me and I think it's your personal quote
01:45If you can control what someone sees about you, you can control what they think about you. Yeah, did I get that right?
01:51That's a hundred percent, right? Yeah
01:52Yeah, and it was good cuz like Neil was one of those guys that like got me into everything
01:56So, you know whenever he makes an introduction like it's a it's just a game-changer, you know
02:01Cuz like who would have thought so I when I knew him I was like back in my high school year. So
02:06Now being an entrepreneur and like anytime I get an introduction from Neil
02:09It's like it's just a it's just a huge thing for me, you know
02:12I don't know if you know this but I actually sold him. I'm kind of a big deal calm. Did you do that?
02:17Yeah, so but so he had that LLC for a while, right?
02:20He didn't have the website he didn't need the website, but he was like, hey, you know
02:24You should go ahead and like try to get it for me because if I try to do it
02:28They're gonna charge him a lot cuz it's Neil right, but I mean I was in high school
02:31They're not gonna charge me that much
02:32So he bought it for me for like five thousand and I bought it for like I don't know five hundred bucks a thousand dollars
02:37So I used to write checks to I'm kind of a big deal LLC when we were partners
02:41Yeah, that's who I would pay his cut of our deal and I used to always joke and I'd say when are we gonna get?
02:47Airplane where it says I'm kind of a big deal on the bottom of the airplane. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, hopefully soon, right?
02:53Yeah, absolutely
02:53Well, thank you for coming on
02:55It's so awesome to have you in studio as I think we talked about off-air
02:59the whole premise of the show is success formula that you know, I believe success is formulaic and
03:04Successful people have a formula that they use again and again
03:07And I've gotten to the privilege of getting to know you and watching you use your own formula for success
03:11Yeah to really disrupt a very competitive landscape. I mean your company influencer press
03:17I mean not only have you built your own personal brand, but you build others all over the place, right?
03:21Right get media you help everyone get that message really into the marketplace
03:27You've launched your own podcast. You're now a father
03:30Yeah
03:30so I
03:31Want to open with you actually telling me what are your if you spent time thinking about and if you have what are your success?
03:38Principles, so I definitely believe that there's a sequence of things of how they should be done
03:43But this is more tactical and like just the PR side if I was to talk about just very generalistic stuff
03:48It's like not general
03:50but like in my day-to-day of what I actually have to do number one like I was telling them outside is like my Fridays are
03:56For me to kind of just eat a nice steak
03:58Smoke a nice cigar get a massage like do things that I love
04:02You know that that if I can get done then it'll help me kind of wind down during the day
04:06if I don't do that, then I'll notice I'm always like
04:09My mind is just constantly business business business and I'm all constantly in that mode
04:14But that hurts, you know my relationship if I'm if I'm constantly there so I do that to wind down and then after that
04:19I'm with my partner. I'm with my daughter and it's just you know, the being thought being a new father is this phenomenal, you know
04:25Yeah, I just it's just a love that you
04:28You really can't explain until you become one and then you see them smile all of a sudden, right?
04:32They just love you for being who you are. You did nothing and it's just the best feeling in the world
04:38So that makes sense on the personal level, but at the professional level, I mean when you launched influencer press
04:44Yeah, that was your first foray in entrepreneurship. Yeah, and you didn't say I'm gonna start
04:49I mean you basically built a PR firm and your goal was to get influential people a lot of press, right?
04:55And I mean when you go to your website influencerpress.com
04:58The list of clients that you've had and have is extremely impressive. Thank you. So you don't just walk in
05:04I mean, it's not like you just show up one day and that just happens, right? Right?
05:07yeah, so the way that I first started out is I was very blessed because when back in the day before I started influence press
05:13I was semi interning for like Neil Patel a mutual friend and I would just do random shit, you know
05:19But I was like so happy to do it because he was like my he's my idol basically, right?
05:24and because I was doing that I
05:26It was easier for me to get an in to these publications and back in the day
05:30There were very few people that were actually writing for these publications like they're now like now
05:34There's so many people doing it but back in the day. That was kind of uncommon
05:38So they gave somebody like me a chance
05:39They invited me to go right and I first wrote for entrepreneur then success.com then Hummington Post things like that
05:45And someone told me he's like you can make easier money introducing people being a connector then you can be doing website design
05:53So I didn't believe him at first. I gave it a shot with my first client
05:58I said, you know, hey pay me $2,000 and I'll make an introduction to an editor at entrepreneur and he paid me
06:04That was the easiest $2,000 I've ever made. Who's your first client?
06:07His name's Patrick and I don't know his last name. Okay, Patrick Clark Kelly one of those
06:12and
06:14It was like five minutes of work, you know, he paid me that he paid the invoice right away
06:18$2,000 I've never made $2,000 before a couple hundred bucks
06:21I would have made you know doing website design and I literally just introduced him to an editor the editor wrote about him and I
06:26Didn't do any work except for making the connection and having the relationship with the editor, right?
06:31That's the we did a lot of the early work. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, but other than that like I
06:37Realized that look this is a big kind of industry for people that have a lot of money and also that are really big
06:43So at first when I was doing it is because of the money for sure
06:46But then I started getting into like, you know high-level
06:50Connections and places and you know people like yourself and and like for example active client right now is like Brandon Dawson
06:56So, you know Cardone ventures like these guys
06:59Believe it or not don't have press like, you know, some of these guys are just so so successful
07:04He sold the company for 151 million
07:07No press whatsoever, right like and my let when we work with him
07:11He had very little press and I you know
07:13when when when my sales guys closed him we didn't know how big and my let was when we took him on as a
07:18Client and then all of a sudden you start doing these interviews and you're like, you know, you've done what it's like insane
07:25you know and
07:27Once you start doing it for one big level person
07:29They'll make an introduction as long as you do a good job to another person and another person another person
07:34It just becomes kind of like this snowball effect, you know, it's really the power of relationships
07:38Which you do a tremendous job of yep. Well, I believe it's my superpower
07:42It's what I focus my effort on but I also think it's extremely important in success. I mean to your point
07:48You can go and do a ton of work and build a website and website design or you can make an introduction to someone who?
07:54Knows you trust you and is willing to move on something that you have said and make $2,000 in five minutes
07:59Yep
08:00you've earned the right to do that and you've done that because you've demonstrated accountability credibility and
08:05Validation and everything you've done with that editor beforehand like you say it took five minutes, but it's really not right
08:10How long had you known that editor?
08:12For like four or five months and and what did you've done for that editor, right?
08:17Yeah, what did you demonstrated you wrote good content?
08:19Yeah, you brought them serious people and they trusted the fact that if you make the introduction
08:23It's somebody credible. That's true. That's true. Yep. So I would just say, you know for you it is more than five minutes
08:28Yeah, yeah, it's just looking back at it, you know, like things happen so fast, but it's true
08:32Like, you know, I have to because they don't have to accept any introduction I make, you know
08:37They're doing it as a favor to me
08:39So I also have to make sure that I'm not abusing that that that power right like for example
08:43If even for this if I'm like Jeff, you know
08:46I think this guy's amazing would love to frame to be on the show if I'm constantly doing that and doing nothing else
08:50You say it best it's like it's draining, you know, you're not gonna answer my next call my next text, you know
08:55So you have to really you can't abuse your relationships
08:59So, how do you view press a lot of people want it?
09:03Yeah, and a lot of people say there's no such thing as bad press right right there definitely is bad press. That's for sure
09:09But the way that I view it is like the same way that press can be very bad and we can take a look at
09:14You know people like Donald Trump where it's swayed really into one side Andrew Tate or people like that
09:20Alex Jones, right the media portray these people as one thing and one thing only
09:24And if if it can do that, right for for them then for somebody else that maybe isn't as big and maybe not as hated
09:32What can it do for their brand?
09:34So if you do it correctly
09:35You can really kind of sway the public opinion opinion about you and that's kind of where my quote comes into play
09:40And then everything else becomes a lot easier you you experience like this red carpet effect
09:44You know when movie stars go to red carpets and they get a ton of pictures and people hand them water
09:49And you know, they're just people are so nice to you, right?
09:52So I want my clients and I want myself to live a life that has the red carpet effect
09:57So you used to do I think when I first met you you were renting houses
10:03High-end houses. Oh, yeah. Yeah, but I didn't rent them. So I got him for free. Okay, even better. Yeah
10:08Yeah, explain to me explain to me what that was. So, you know back in the pre kovat. I did a lot of masterminds and
10:14You normally you have to pay, you know thousands to rent like multi-million dollar homes
10:19But with the press stuff we would essentially do barters with these locations and we do this now at a higher level with like speaking
10:24on stage but
10:25You know, I lived in a 10 million dollar mansion for free for 30 days and they were gonna extend it to 60
10:31I was able to live like in multiple locations without really paying
10:34And that's because I would offer them press, you know in a 10 million dollar house
10:38If we got press for a 10 million dollar house, it's only gonna track their types of buyers
10:42So it's a very much beneficial mutual relationship there that I was kind of getting with these, you know locations
10:48I would throw mastermind I charged three to five thousand, you know, 15 people would come and we didn't have to pay for the chef
10:53We didn't have to pay for the exotic cars there
10:55We didn't have to pay for the house there
10:56Everything was essentially free and profit except for obviously the time and labor for you know, things like that
11:01But yeah, it was a it was a good time free kovat. Sure
11:04I remember I think when we when I first met you you were just moved into your new 10 million dollar house
11:09Yeah out of your previous 10 million dollar house. Yeah, you were in Beverly Hills at the time
11:13Yeah, and you're like, yeah, I just moving into this new house and you show me pictures. I'm like, wow. Yeah
11:19You're like, yeah, I pay nothing for it. Yep. I'm like, well, that's a that's a pretty good model
11:23Yeah, it was it was working for a bit
11:25We haven't done it in a while because now now that we have a kid like we want to stay where families at
11:30But yeah now we do it with stages. So, you know stages they want more eyeballs. They want to sell more seats
11:35So we'll tell them like hey if you get a client, you know to speak at your events
11:39We'll get pressed for all of the event for for all the event or all the speakers or the event organizer
11:44So they can choose essentially
11:46And then they'll say yes or no and most of the time they'll say yes if it's a big enough client and they get you know
11:52recognition for it
11:54Because people are no longer competing just off of the name to go speak
11:57It's like okay now you have something to bring to the table
12:00Well, and you you brushed over earlier that you're you wrote for Huffington Post you wrote for success you wrote for entrepreneur
12:06Which enabled you to have the platform to get this press? Yeah
12:10That's not so easy to just be able to be a contributor for these major publications
12:14I mean you had to break into this world somehow, right? Right. How did you do it?
12:19And what was the process because I'm assuming you didn't just call and say yeah. Hey, I'm a leases
12:23I want to write for you entrepreneur and they're like, oh sure. Yeah, just send us an article, right? Right, so
12:28Because I was like interning with Neal at the time
12:30He had a lot of these connections and what I did was I would use Neal's name to my advantage to my advantage
12:37So I'd say like, you know, for example back back in that time. I did the website for like Forrest Gump calm
12:42So which is you know, if anybody's seen the movie the movie is phenomenal, right? Yeah, great
12:47So I would use that as like my ammo anything that I would that I was doing like it like for with Neil Patel
12:52I think I was like 17 18 when I was like interning
12:55So I'd say like hey, I'm working with Neal Patel I'm interning I'm doing xx and x I love to write about the topic or
13:01I you know, I did the website for Forrest Gump calm at this age
13:05I'd love to write about the topic
13:06and I just kind of came with like some strong ammo and a unique angle if that didn't work what really worked at the time was
13:14Interviewing high-level people so I would interview for example. I know this kid back in the day. He was like 17
13:19He interviewed Mark Cuban, right no publication is really gonna say no to an interview with Mark Cuban because
13:27Even for them. It's kind of hard to get so
13:29Whenever you come to these publications, you have to have something that's newsworthy
13:33That's unique and then also has like that spin on it for me at that point in time. It was my age
13:38So they let me write one of them and the content was good. They accepted it after that
13:43I used that article that I published on entrepreneur comm I went to the Huffington Post and I said hey I write for entrepreneur
13:49I'd love to write here and then I'd go to the Huffington Post and I'd say hey I'd go to you know
13:52Success.com next and it's just you know, just zigzagging each and leveraging each thing
13:57But the thing that got me there first was definitely Neal using Neal's name
14:01So what Ulysses is actually talking about it's something I wrote in my book and it's something I talked about in my LinkedIn course
14:07It's called the bug light concept and it is a phenomenal way to utilize
14:11Relationship capital to accelerate yourself because to your point if I do an interview or I'm working with Mark Cuban
14:17Everyone wants Mark Cuban. They may not know Jeff Fenster yet
14:20They may not have any idea what I do or why I'm doing it
14:23but when I bring Mark Cuban I can use the power of Mark Cuban to give myself that opportunity if done effectively you don't burn
14:30Any relationships and you really can promote yourself and that's what you did with Neil Patel, right?
14:35I did the same thing with Neil Patel when we were partnering with our digital marketing agency
14:39I'm phenomenal at sales and I knew nothing about digital marketing
14:42So I was able to use Neil Patel's name to get us into any company
14:46I wanted to yeah, because I would simply say hey, this is Jeff. I'm Neil Patel's partner. We do digital marketing
14:50We're gonna come in and do a free audit for you and let you know how you can make more money online
14:53How does that sound?
14:54Sounds great. Sign me up, right?
14:55They let us walk in then I got to do what I'm great at sales
14:58Neil got to do what he was great at marketing and together
15:01We closed tons of accounts and made tons of money and helped tons of businesses all through the bug light concept
15:07So I'm so glad you mentioned that because if you're sitting on the sideline right now and you're like, hey, you know
15:11I just I don't know how to do it
15:12You may know somebody influential and if you don't you can intern for someone influential and use that same concept
15:18I think that is such a great success principle that we can all use to elevate ourselves and take the
15:23Elevator instead of the stairs as we're trying to break in. Yeah, you say it's so well. Yeah. Well, I wrote about it
15:29Yeah, but yeah, that's true. But no, I think it's so critical. I mean I've used it again and again
15:33I actually learned that the tactic from David Meltzer
15:36David Meltzer did it with Warren Moon when they had sports one marketing and so he spun up sports one marketing off of Warren Moon
15:42And he taught me the bug light concept. Yeah, and then he eventually built his own brand, which is now David Meltzer brand
15:48But that's how he used to get into all these different in opportunities around the Super Bowl and around marketing
15:53You know, they took products and services and marketed them with sporting events and your point was like hey Warren Moon Warren Moon
16:00Well, yeah, they want to work with Warren Moon and all you need in life. Is that door to open?
16:04Yeah
16:04Once we get the door open then you get to shine and show your skills
16:07Exactly and in without that it just becomes a little bit harder because people don't give you the time of day
16:12You know and I had that in the beginning where I knew I could perform but they don't know you they don't care about you
16:18They don't think you can so it doesn't matter right and it's just life just becomes a little bit harder
16:23You know more harder than it needs to be
16:26being that
16:27Influencer press someone reaches out to you. You take them on as a client. They're probably gonna get a little more famous
16:32They're gonna get a little more attention
16:34How important is it that the client let's say?
16:38You know, mr.
16:40Or mrs.
16:40Smith who calls you up how important is it that they are crystal clear on their mission on their values on what they want the press
16:47To be because I think what we've seen in a lot of people who've had that 15 minutes of fame
16:51Yeah, they don't always it doesn't always end the way they wanted it to right, right?
16:55They yeah, they have to that's probably like core number one because you can do a lot of press and you can you know
17:02Come on shows and things like that. But if you really don't know what your end goal is
17:06Then you just have a lot of press and that's it
17:09And what what happens is it just becomes like this placeholder like this trophy and and just an ego booster like oh, yeah
17:15I've been on this show. I've been on Forbes. I've been on ink and that's it
17:18You know, and then everybody will just remember it as that and it just kind of dies
17:23So if you know your core mission or what you're trying to accomplish and it's a lot easier to kind of attack that
17:29You know from all different angles, but without it, it's just you know, you're you're on a ship that's going nowhere
17:35So how has press changed post kovat and now that everyone is coming it used to be
17:41First time I got interviewed for entrepreneur. I was like, oh my god
17:44Yeah, now it's like an entrepreneur. No offense entrepreneur
17:47But it became that it did and it did because a lot of these places
17:51So like before they started allowing people to pay to write there
17:55There was a lot of pay-to-play that was happening and that's actually how I got banned from a lot of those publications like a long
18:00Time ago. Maybe how did you get banned? So I got banned because I was doing things incorrectly
18:06And incorrectly basically means this you can't pay writers. You can't bribe them and you can't bring them gifts
18:12So if you were a journalist and I came here with a gift for you
18:15Automatically, I'd be a band which is kind of stupid
18:18But hey the rules are the rules right sure and I was naive at the time and to me
18:23I'm like dude, it's a win-win situation client pays me five grand. I pay the writer two grand. I keep three grand
18:29He gets his article. We all win, you know, where's that? Where's the issue? Yeah, you arbitrage make sense
18:33Yeah, the issue is it's biased, you know, you just got paid three grand
18:37You're gonna make him look really good, right and that's not journalism. So I mean I agree, you know, but
18:43How old were you when you got banned? I was like
18:4617 18 probably okay. So I mean you were young you didn't know better
18:49I got a slap on the wrist, which is you know
18:51Thank God, but it was scary because I got banned and there was a lot of people doing reporting on me
18:56so and I don't know how true this part is, but one of the reporters said that the
19:02FTC or se one of those was like looking into me at the time
19:05I'm like, what the hell like I'm just a kid that just came out of college
19:09Like I'm just trying to you know do well
19:11but yeah, so I had to I did lose a lot of my connections at that time and I had to rebuild everything back up and
19:16Obviously clients didn't want to work with me for the rep that I had
19:19So it took me about six months of doing everything correctly to kind of get a client again and do everything the correct way
19:25Now obviously here we are but um, yeah
19:28I was very lucky that nothing else happened because because they they definitely gave me a slap on the wrist
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20:01So, I'm sorry and I pivoted on you so how the the PR world though it has definitely changed
20:07Yeah, yeah from I mean back when I first met you to today. I mean everyone has a podcast now. There's a ton of yeah
20:13The the opportunities for media are it's more available, but they're less meaningful. They're less impactful
20:19There's obviously, you know, you go in the Joe Rogan show. It's a major win, right? Right? Yeah
20:23So I think now it's all about sequence and how you use it. So
20:27There's a lot of things that you know, people do everybody
20:30It's it's almost as if everybody has the tangibles already
20:32People have the podcast people have spoken on a couple of stages people have gotten the articles
20:37But that's it. Like that's that's the only thing that's which is which is which is what I'm grateful for because
20:42It's become so saturated that you really have to have a skill now to
20:46To
20:48Kind of stand out right to make it meaningful
20:50So like now we use it as a marketing channel very rarely is PR seen as a marketing channel
20:55It's seen as like a branding thing not an ROI thing
20:57But now if you do it correctly if you do it in sequence if you actually have systems in place
21:02You can generate revenue from from you know stuff doing stuff like this from getting an article placement
21:07but it has become saturated because I feel like
21:11So many people are selling placements, you know people get so many DMS about that and then what else oh
21:18And then the publications are also charging so you can go to Forbes Council's you can go to entrepreneur leadership network
21:23You can go to like Rolling Stone Culture Council fast company execs all of these places
21:28They're basically licenses with these with these publications and you can pay to write there. So like Forbes Council's
21:34I think it's like 3,000 some I know entrepreneur leadership network is 3,000 a year
21:38So so what you're saying is I could pay them $3,000 and then I get to write for entrepreneur
21:43Yep, you can I get to say I write for entrepreneur exact so I'm paying to have that title
21:48Yep, which kind of lowers the credibility now, right same thing that's happening with meta, right?
21:53Back in the day Instagram verification and all that was like super powerful
21:56Everybody wanted it and then now it's 12 bucks a month, you know
22:01So it's like you have to really which is which I like because you now actually have to have a skill
22:07You actually now have to be credible
22:09To you can't just play on the same field as everybody else by buying your way in to that, right?
22:14Well, you can for 12 bucks, right?
22:15Yes
22:16You can buy into that but now because everybody can now the new level is something else. Yes, you know
22:21Yes, so which is good the cream will rise. Yeah. Yeah. Well, so in that same vanity you mentioned sequence
22:27Yeah, what is the right sequence? Great question?
22:31So I'm gonna get a little bit like
22:33Nerdy, please. Okay. I'm sure a lot of our listeners are sitting here going
22:37I'm trying to get press for my brand
22:39I'm trying to get press some people want it for them their personal brand some people want it for their company, right?
22:43You know, I remember when when I started my very first first company I checks I couldn't figure out for them
22:50This was before Instagram and Facebook was I mean, I don't even think Facebook was even 2007. So was Facebook small then?
22:56I don't even remember
22:56Yeah
22:57I couldn't figure out for the life of me to get anyone to write an article and I mean it was local like with the
23:02Union Tribune of San Diego, please write an article in my payroll business. Yeah. Well dude now you have a ton of
23:07Press in San Diego. It's it's grown. Yeah, it's grown but a lot but for for for those listening like what would be that sequence?
23:14Like how would they do it? What is the right approach? How do we do it properly in 2023?
23:18Yeah, first things first is you have to control the narrative for your brand
23:21So the easiest way to do that is to start off with either, you know small blogs or small publications
23:27because you know when you do that you can control the headline the body of the image the body of the article the
23:33Image everything and when you do that
23:35You want to basically control like any objections that you would normally get or how you want to be perceived or things like that
23:42If you can get anywhere from five to ten of those in the beginning
23:46that's gonna make your life a lot easier because we learned this back in the day when we
23:50Unfortunately did press for a fraud
23:53And I can tell a little bit about the story. We thought this kid had sold a company for a hundred million dollars
23:58He was 21 years old
23:59The reason why we didn't vet him correctly is because he showed me a check that he was gonna give my business three million dollars
24:04So I'm like, okay say less. I will help you, you know
24:08Influencer press two s's at the end. Yeah, exactly
24:12And you know, we didn't vet him correctly and when we tried to get impressing initially they said where's your proof?
24:19Right, where's your proof? So we had to come up with a different way to
24:23Manufacture proof so we did is we got a lot of these small blogs
24:27Stating exactly that that he sold the company for a hundred million dollars. So
24:31Now when we went back
24:33Everywhere, they looked because if you know if you can rank for your name with that
24:37it's only gonna reinforce the same idea that a
24:40Company is coming out to you with a story that a kid sold this company for a hundred million dollars everywhere
24:46You look it says the same thing
24:48There's no reason to like vet it, right? So
24:51Once you do that, so and that's unethically
24:54But once you do it correctly for your business, then you can go to like bigger podcasts
24:58You can say hey, you know, I did this for my business. I did this PR just organized truth
25:02so anybody that's ever done anything in their life and in their business if you just
25:07Organize it the correct way you can get it. You can get in a lot of these doors PR is organized truth
25:12I've never heard it said like that. Yeah, because you know most of the time you're trying to amplify things
25:16But you have to do it correctly. Yeah
25:19This yeah, because not everything is newsworthy sure most things are yeah, most things are not newsworthy, right?
25:25But yeah
25:26Once you do that you have you have that initial ammo and what I call like the pillar pieces
25:30Then you can go to these big level shows because they're gonna ask for you know again references or anything like that
25:34Well, you have that, you know, you can go to these big publications and you have these references
25:38But the the key here is you created those references, right?
25:42You articulated exactly what you wanted that person to see about you
25:47Which then can only mean one thing, right?
25:50If they have a bullshit meter, which they are
25:52Well, you have nine other pieces that say the exact same thing all that bullshit meters gonna go down
25:57Right, so you just kind of have to yeah
25:59You have to do certain things in a sequence and you know zigzag your way up
26:02So that first sequence getting those small publications. Yeah, someone's listening. They have their company. They're trying to get some press for it
26:09What's the one or two things that you would recommend that they do right now so they can start getting them?
26:14It's hard to go from it's chicken and egg
26:16It takes it takes a few to get a few but you need to get those first few right, right?
26:20So I'll say one thing really quickly before I'll tell you exactly where
26:25One of the things that you should look at in this in these peeler articles is what are common objections that you normally get?
26:31So, you know the best salespeople know their objections by heart, you know, they know exactly what's gonna come up on the call
26:37you know exactly how to
26:39Talk the way through it or whatever and even more I'll say the
26:42This is what I made a fortune doing this is I would address the objection before you do right and I'm sure you're gonna think
26:49This this this and this and then I would answer it and you've taken the steam out of the objection long before you ever got
26:54It exactly hundred percent and that's what you're doing with these with these articles. You're saying hey, I know I'm gonna get these objections
27:00So if I can eliminate them not by saying them but by having a third-party credit, you know
27:05Credible site say them then I already I'm already one step ahead, right?
27:09right, so think about things that usually give you a door that you know, that's just kind of hard to open and
27:15Once you kind of identified those then then you should go after some of these places and I'll tell you some of these places
27:20That you can go on
27:22Thrive global is one of them super area and I have ariana huffington was is the founder of that
27:28There's other places like disrupt. There's other places like medium
27:31There's there's plenty of sites that are free to use that you can start there
27:35Right free to use meaning I can go write a feature on every ball if I want to exactly and I have to pay a dime
27:41And they'll post it. Yep. So now at least I have some media
27:45Exactly. Yep, you can do that on medium and I'm and I'm pretty sure you can do that on thrive global. It's just free
27:51And if you want I can I can come up with a list and then you know
27:54How I would love it we can share it because I think a lot of our audiences is college-age
27:58And we also have a lot of aspiring entrepreneurs and business leaders that are
28:02Struggling because they're great at what they do, but the media the press side. That's where that's a hard roadblock. Yeah. Yeah
28:08I struggle with it for years
28:10So I can only imagine yes, if we can provide that resource, I think it'd be great for the community. We'll do that
28:15We'll do that. Yeah, so now we have some and I mean
28:19Influencer press you guys are obviously you're not for everybody, right? There's a certain level of
28:25Business or entrepreneur? Yeah, what is that level?
28:28So minimum seven figures just in terms of revenue just because of the like our pricing
28:34And that because it's a Ferrari pricing or because to get the press that you guys are gonna provide
28:40Requires that kind of level of success already. Yes both
28:44One it's easier for business the more like many people think like if you charge a premium you can deliver premium services
28:51if you if you have low margins
28:54It's very difficult to to kind of provide like a premium service because you don't have stuff to play with
29:00You know, so I yeah
29:02So both we want to make sure that number one they have success and usually if you're a seven-figure business you have success
29:08And then number two
29:09We want to make sure that we can charge enough to be able to give you enough because if I'm only charging you
29:16You know, maybe like 500 bucks or so
29:18I can only get you the free stuff in order to make a margin, right?
29:21Because I still have to have client fulfillment. I still have to have the sales that I have to give, you know portion two
29:25I still have to do finances taxes, right?
29:27So if you don't price things correctly, which at first we were struggling a lot with business model then
29:34Then you're kind of kind of screwed. Sure. Yeah, sure
29:37So you and then in addition to influencer press and helping others, I mean you've done this remarkably well for yourself
29:41I mean you speak on stages and I've seen you individually your personal brand
29:46Explode thank you. Thank you. You're actually doing the same steps for yourself, right?
29:50And in turn you're using that for top of funnel for influencer press. Yeah, I'm saying that right? Yeah, you are
29:55Yeah, I just came back like we were in Vegas. I had no idea you were gonna be at that show
30:00But so a couple days ago
30:01I was being interviewed on a show and I'm about to go in and who walks in to be interviewed right after me
30:07Ulysses so we got to say what's up in Vegas a couple days ago. Yep. Yep
30:11But yeah, like what we show our clients I do myself like I was there for a podcast tour
30:15I did Sean Kelly's I did a few more I did TV while I was there like in San Diego like right before this I
30:21Did TV so it's important to again do stuff in sequence and then also do it for yourself because if I'm not doing it for
30:27Myself, then why would uh, you know, why would clients want to do it for themselves?
30:30Some people don't think it's powerful, but it really is and how would you say?
30:37your brand
30:39Ulysses and
30:40Influencer press have grown
30:42Have they grown together or has it been one of them kind of taking the lead and then the other one following and catching up
30:49It was definitely me fall me leading and then the business
30:53Next because what I noticed was whenever you start working with high-level people they refer you
30:58but because they referred you you are now the person that they look to for
31:03For updates or for things like that, right?
31:05But in order to grow a business you can't have that like I can't be the client fulfillment person right for for everybody
31:12So I had to like, you know
31:14Kind of pick that back up and systemize things and make sure that I have a team and you know
31:18Thank God we have like 16 people now
31:20So yeah, we have client filming people and all that good stuff, which is great
31:23But I always had to like bring it with me because people want to work with just me
31:27And there's it's great phenomenal, but there's a downside to that. I'm capped number one and number two
31:32I just can't like I don't have enough time in the day to do it
31:35You know
31:36So I have to systemize the thing in a way to get results for everybody even the high-level guys
31:40And how do you value actual paid press releases that are launched on the wire?
31:44Do you recommend companies write their own press release and pay to put them on the wire only if you're buying a company you're exiting
31:50A company or if you have an announcement anything else, I wouldn't I wouldn't do that, but I do recommend paying for
31:55You can pay for slots on TV and you can pay for things like Nasdaq. You can pay for things like that
32:00I do recommend that like Nasdaq is in like being interviewed on Nasdaq or getting the
32:06Board yep, yep things like that, but you don't recommend for example
32:09Ever Bowl opens a new store in Tucson should I do a press release? Yes, because that's a that's an opening. That's an announcement
32:16Okay, what about ever Bowl hires new president 100%? Yes, so what would be an example of a press release?
32:21I shouldn't do this guy like for example like
32:24Ever Bowl is so great at what they do like something like that like our bowls taste great exactly
32:29I do the minted in four out of five customers agree ever bowls the best acai bowl if see
32:34But you do it in a way you understand media, so you understand like that's an announcement, right?
32:38It's like if you have an opening or if you say
32:41This isn't this is an announcement where these people are rating ever Bowl as four out of five, right?
32:46That's very much still an announcement, but what people will do is try to say like oh, yeah
32:52You know buy my X course or whatever because so many people are getting great results. That's not something you should put out
32:58That's more of an advertisement. Yeah, exactly and people can tell through that so really only exits announcements like you hire a new president
33:05Or whatever that's an announcement go ahead put it put it there
33:09Anything else other than that I wouldn't say you know I'm too much
33:13I'm not a fan so as a client say we come to higher influencer press. Yeah
33:19Do you make the world know that we're a client or do some of your clients say hey
33:24We want you to be hidden in the background. We don't want to know we don't anyone to know you did all this amazing
33:28Work for us. Yeah, unfortunately, you know some some clients
33:32Like we would love to put out case studies
33:34But they they want everything to show like it's organic
33:39You know and then other people don't care and other people like that were their agencies
33:41So they want people to know but isn't it organic the work you're doing anyway
33:44It's just it's like paying. It's like having our own media team. Yeah, it's just influencer press exactly
33:50But you know other when people see that they see it as like well
33:53You're still paying to get the result you know and to me
33:56I'm okay with that like you pay Facebook. You know when you do Facebook ads you pay to get the customer like
34:00What's the difference you know?
34:02So yeah, but some people just they just want to make it seem like they did it all themselves
34:07Which I'm okay with you know does it actually change anyone's perspective not mine
34:11No, but I mean from have you seen from the customer side um yeah, it does it does if it's a product yeah
34:17Yeah, so if I if ever Bowl hired influencer press we wouldn't want the world to know influencer press was driving it for us
34:23Unless what's a little bit different because you're you're a public figure right you're a lot of the people that are my clients are probably
34:30Friends, so it's like yeah, it would work well in that situation so I'd be like hey
34:34I have Jeff you know can we get him on your show or whatever but for somebody that probably isn't in that space
34:38But has a product they don't care about that this this side of it, so yeah
34:43They'd be like no like we just want you know yeah, we just want the company
34:46So what was the impetus for you launching your own podcast because you recently launched blacklist?
34:50I was a fortunately enough to be a guest yours is good. Oh, thank you
34:54It was fun being on there, and you you actually produce out of blue wire studio in the wind which was the inspiration for our own
35:00Studio it's a badass studio in the lobby of the wind and it's a it's a cool network
35:07Yeah, what was the impetus for you to launch that show?
35:09Well, I was doing so I was interviewing a couple of people from like Netflix
35:13So I'm not you sure if you watch selling sunset, but they're basically like a real estate show and I like the investors of every ball
35:19Oh, yeah, yeah, Tariq is and his wife Tariq is our main investor, but his wife is is involved as well nice nice
35:26Well, I interviewed Jason so I interviewed Jason, and I was like you know I'd love to start working with people from Netflix
35:33Celebrities or you know what can I do to get into that like those circles?
35:36and
35:37Well, I saw blue wire
35:39I saw Casey Adams was you know recording there and at the time he was only one of five business podcasts that you know are
35:44Hosted on blue wire blue wire is basically like a sports thing so they do boxing they do all the all sports
35:50and
35:52usually
35:53People need to have a support system like they need to have an audience and they need to have a podcast to get in
35:59But because of my relationship capital I was able to get in without a without a podcast ever you know made so
36:06Take a note of that. That's exactly the power of relationship capital most people need this, but because of the relationship
36:12Fast-track don't need it. Yep, and then now that I have it like it's so much easier to get like Neil Patel
36:17You know he's in Vegas. I just quick text like hey
36:20Can I have you on the show I think he came in right after we didn't I didn't know he was filming right after
36:25Yeah, yeah
36:27Leaving I'm leaving the episode and in the green room. There's Neil. Yeah, yep, so yeah like relationships are so important
36:34You know because if not, I would have never gotten in sure never and that's a beautiful studio
36:41As an entrepreneur I know how meaningful it is to invest in the people and causes that are close to me and on go fund
36:47Me it's easy safe and powerful to do just that whether you're supporting a family member friend
36:54Local business or charity and whenever you make a donation you're protected by the go fund me giving guarantee
37:01Visit gofundme.com today to help make a positive difference in your community
37:11So okay, so you're launching the blacklist yeah, so the impetus was to get into Netflix you we derailed
37:17You were going to Netflix you want to get the celebrities
37:19Yeah, and and that's one of the ways to you know kind of do it like the celebrity is not gonna come to like
37:24C-list show you know they want to go to the big stuff
37:28So that's a that like for people that don't know the win invested six million dollars into that studio
37:33So it's like it's it's phenomenal. So when I'm speaking to these people and I kind of like
37:39Initially wanted to do that completely forgot and now I just you know interview a ton of entrepreneurs
37:43But when they see the studio I get I get contacted to go to to be interviewed, right?
37:48Yeah, or to for them to want to be interviewed so it just makes my job easier
37:52I can connect with higher level people which then in turn they know about me
37:55They might want to hire us if they don't that's okay, but I started getting into these higher level
38:01Networks and it and for anybody that's ever realized this people in your space like they usually hang around in the same circle
38:08Dan hangs around same people you hang around with same people and it's usually a lot of people at the top
38:14In order to kind of get there you you can't you have to be kind of invited you know or you have to be
38:20Someone else like that public figure status
38:22So getting something like that will just kind of propel me a little bit more that way, right?
38:27I mean it is it's true
38:28It might be subconscious, but I get asked to be on a lot of shows for me to travel to go
38:33Yeah, if I've never heard of the show and I don't know the person
38:36I'm more likely to not want to do it and I'm struggling with that now that I have my own
38:39Show and I'm requiring everyone to come here. Yeah, I'm not gonna do a zoom
38:43Yeah, and so I'm feeling it like as I'm trying to get like I'm trying to get Shaq to come on on the show
38:48Yeah, will he do a zoom? Yes. Can I come to him? Sure, but to get him to come here
38:54Yeah, you need to have something exactly and that's kind of why when I left your studio
38:58I brought Eric from our COO and I said, hey, we need our studio to be like this
39:03Yeah, and it's it's you did it. He said he did it in three weeks. Yeah, we you guys move fast
39:08Well, we have we built so we build builds everything. So yeah, we built the studio
39:12I mean the longest the thing that took us the longest was the soundproof door and the soundproof windows. Yeah
39:17We'll do it. This is this is the shit dude. Well, it's uh, you know, thank you blue wire for the inspiration
39:23I mean the goal the beauty of everything. It's like
39:26Doing something better than everyone else is not hard when you use everyone else
39:30I mean we all if we're not learning from each other and
39:32Trying to one-up each other and force each other to grow and improve
39:36I mean Bradley's studio and blue wire was okay. That's the floor. We need to meet or beat those two studios
39:43Yeah, and funny enough. I was just in Vegas at Brad's studio and Brad says I want to redo my studio
39:50And so we're gonna he's coming out here in a couple weeks and we will it's gonna hopefully redo his studio because it's it's a little
39:55Older, yeah, he's got up his game. Yeah, Brad. We're challenging you now do better than this one. He's had it for years
40:01I know, you know, it was so cool. The first time I went on his show
40:04There was like no other studio in town like it like it not even at the win. His was the place
40:09Yes, yeah, and he didn't open it to everybody nope just his lightspeed clients, yeah, which was a great
40:15I mean, it's just a great top of funnel thing to do
40:18Oh, yeah, when I went if anybody that's ever gone to Bradley's show when you go he tries to sell you on lightspeed
40:25Oh, yeah, I bought lightspeed. Yeah, exactly
40:27fun fact I bought lightspeed in
40:312019 I think 20 I think it was there in 2019. Yeah, we're just implementing it now
40:35I've been paying for it and I haven't used it yet. He closed us, but all good salespeople get sold by good salespeople
40:42Yeah, oh, he's great. He's great. Yeah, he's great. He closed. I mean
40:46It's such a good product. Yeah, the problem for us was we then had to implement the product
40:51We just got so busy right he's kept paying for it and paying for it and paying for it and paying for it
40:54I just saw me he's like are you gonna finally do it? I'm like, yeah now we're gonna find
40:58Yeah, he's great. Yeah, so who was the best person you've ever interviewed man?
41:03And by best I don't mean like yeah, like no answer for sure
41:08Who's your let's go not best who was somebody that you were you pinched yourself like you're like
41:13I can't believe I got to interview this person
41:15I was so the only person I was ever nervous when he went to the studio was Neil. Yeah
41:21Yeah, it's cuz it's just that full circle moment, you know, like you get to see someone
41:25He saw me at my lowest and I had no money nothing and he was such a nice dude
41:30You know
41:31he didn't have to do half the things that he did for me and I showed him like
41:34I created books out of his pot out of his blogs because he wrote blogs like every you know
41:39Every freaking day still does quick sprout. Yeah, and and so I didn't have time to read them all
41:44So what I did is like I would copy and paste each and every single blog
41:47I put it into a book so I would just read books and I have books from 2019 to 2017
41:51you know all that stuff and I showed him and
41:54I was so nervous on that call cuz I'm like
41:57Sometimes it's hard to connect with people that are just at such a higher level than you but it was it was a really good
42:03Show, well, he's he's genuinely one of the best human beings
42:06Yeah, I mean I met him cold through a friend Pat Flynn introduced us and he became my partner
42:12You know, he let me build a business around his brand and use him as a bug light
42:17He didn't have to he was already so successful. He didn't need me, but I obviously showed some value
42:23Yeah, just such a great human. I mean
42:26Fortunately, he introduced me to you years ago. I mean look at what has happened as a result
42:30So if you don't follow Neil, you definitely need to yeah
42:33He's also co-founded some of the most disruptive incredible technology SAS products out there Neil Patel digital if you need digital marketing
42:40Highly recommend he speaks on stages. He's not cheap. But if but if you reach out, I'm sure maybe he'll do it
42:48So Neil was the one huh? Yeah, I actually try to get him to speak at my event last year
42:52We had him or we had that real estate guy
42:56There's only one Josh Altman or something like that. Okay
43:01But yeah, anyways, it didn't happen. But yeah
43:05Neil's Neil's such a good dude. Yeah, he really is
43:07So what's next for you now that you have influencer press growing blacklist is killing it. Yeah, what's the what's the next venture for Ulysses?
43:14I want to exit
43:16Not now, but do you know Chris and Jen Kristen? Yeah, Jen Gottlieb. Yep. Yeah, so in Chris Moonfield. Yep
43:22Yep, good people too. They're great people. Actually, I'll give you something fun. So they're friends of mine. They're in New York
43:28They sold their company. Yeah, and I'm talking with Jen. I
43:32Don't know six months ago. We're having just having a phone call. They they were just in it was no
43:36It was not six months ago
43:37It was four months ago because they were in Mexico just before New Year's and I was down in Mexico and we were gonna actually
43:42hang out and
43:43I was saying to her like I think I said something like yeah, you know, we're really launching we build now
43:47I need to get some press for and she's oh I got introduced you to the best person in the world
43:51I'm like, who's that? She's like you got to talk to Ulysses. Oh soon. I was like, I know you Lisa's. Yeah
43:56Yeah, so she referred she was trying to refer me to talk to you and I was just asking her to give me some tips
44:02For we bill. Yep. Yep. No, I know they're phenomenal people. They are
44:06I look up to Chris a lot because he has connections that I wish I had, you know, and one day I'll get there
44:12But like I want to get to that point where they sold cuz they sold for I mean, I don't know the exact amount
44:17But they sold for eight figures, you know
44:19so I want to get to that in that point where I'm just like, you know a
44:23New York City type firm and just you know exits and has a big exit and who knows I don't know what they're referring you
44:31Now because they're out of the business. They can't do it. They're referring you. Yeah, they said no a lot of clients
44:37Yeah, yeah, it was awesome. Yeah, so that's cool. So you're gonna so the plan is to exit win
44:42I'm hoping in like three to five years. Yeah
44:44So what do you so with your success formula and the things that you've used to be successful?
44:48What are you doing today to set that and make that a reality?
44:52changing the changing
44:53Well, a lot of it is like right now. We're doing a lot of thinking time. So I know that sounds a cliche but
45:01When when you dedicate like 45 minutes to two hours to just think
45:07it
45:08dramatically propels you forward and
45:11Most of the time a lot of business owners are just stuck in the weeds and they're delegating they're doing this
45:15But they're constantly on the go and when you're doing that there really isn't time to look at your business from a 30,000 foot view
45:20So you don't know what you don't know
45:22You don't know what you have to like, you know test out and do so
45:25We're trying to do thinking time every single week for 45 minutes to two hours
45:29That way we can plan things sometimes a bit the business model sucks, right?
45:34Like I remember before the lifetime value of our client was like $10,000 now
45:38It's $100,000 some clients stay with us from three for three to five years, you know
45:42So it's just thinking of little tweaks that you can make or new hires that you need to make
45:48New people that you need to put so they can delegate or whatever
45:51But without really giving you yourself time to think it's very hard to kind of move up
45:56But so thinking giving myself time to think so thinking I mean that's very broad. Yeah
46:00Are you how are you narrowing that down?
46:02We have a list of questions that we that we try to tackle
46:05Like one or two questions only
46:07So I have a list of questions. It'll say like, okay if you had an extra $300,000 in the business
46:13Where would you spend it so you can grow?
46:15Another thing is like, okay, if you had a 10x your revenue in the next six to whatever months, what would you do now?
46:21So it's very much questions that like it's questions that you probably can't get the answer to right away
46:26Like it takes me about 45 minutes
46:28That's why I'd leave the minimum at 45 because shit doesn't really pop up in your head until like I don't know
46:34Okay, it doesn't really pop up in your head until like 45 minutes after you know, so
46:39That's where the good stuff kind of comes into play
46:41So yeah
46:42Thinking is definitely broad but like you want to give yourself obviously a GPS of like where you want to go and what you want
46:48to hit
46:50And obviously it becomes easier, right? So what do you do once you have that?
46:53So I spend two hours or an hour and a half. We we have our questions. We do some thinking and I have a few ahas
46:58Yeah, hopefully. Yep. Some days. I'm sure you don't right, but let's say I have an aha
47:03What's next then you execute it as quickly as possible and you figure out if it works or not taking immediate decisive action immediate action
47:09Yeah, and you'll know, you know, you'll know if it works or not, or if you have to make some tweaks, you know
47:13For example, like right now we're trying to scale Google Ads. So we'll hire different companies
47:19You know, we just we just spent three months with one company that we didn't get really results for okay
47:23I've got to cut it off. I didn't get you know spent three months didn't didn't work hire somebody else
47:28So I want to I want to hone in on that because to me that's so important in the path to success
47:34So many companies try something. Yeah, it didn't work three months all that money down the drain. So guess what Google Ads isn't for my business
47:42What if it's not true?
47:43Yeah, what if it's no that company just didn't understand the value proposition and how to articulate your message on Google Ads
47:49But this other company can and that's exactly what it is because it's not that that thing doesn't work
47:55It's that either that company couldn't do it or you did something incorrectly or you know
48:00Or maybe you need to go with somebody else that's a better track record in your specific niche
48:04But it's definitely not that that thing doesn't work because obviously it works for so many people, right?
48:08So it's about guys ending it getting 1% better every day and working towards the results you want. I like that
48:15yeah, yes, so
48:17Last thing if you don't mind sharing with the audience, so they learned a lot and this was great
48:22There's a lot of tactics that they can take from this. Yeah
48:25They're unsure
48:26Maybe on exactly how they're gonna break in but they have some some smaller publications that they can you know
48:32Go and write for get get that initial bit going. Yeah
48:36And I think you said and I don't want to butcher it because it was so brilliant, but you said press is organized truth. Yes
48:44Do you have a worksheet or something that you do with when you onboard a client to help organize their truth for them?
48:50So they can rattle it off. Yeah, there's a few things and do I look at the camera?
48:54Sure. All right
48:55So there's a few things that you can do
48:56Number one you have to take a look at if you were gonna make your life easier and out of everything that you've ever done
49:01What will what will give you an in because sometimes?
49:04People want to lead with something but it's not what's gonna get them the end. So you have to think about that for yourself
49:10Number two, how can you control the narrative?
49:12So once you know exactly what that thing is
49:14It's gonna make your life easier and get you into all these doors
49:17number two is how can I position it in a way where it's a no-brainer for everybody else and the number three is
49:23Basically now figuring out the outlets and stuff like that that you kind of want to go go for it
49:27But the first two the most important again press is all about making your life easier
49:32so that way you can experience the red carpet effect and
49:35Do stuff like this. How many tattoos do you have too many?
49:39Yeah to the point where like my parents are like you can't get anymore. Do you draw them yourself? No. No, I wish
49:45Yeah, okay
49:46Well release this man. Thank you so much for coming on as always. It's always fun to hang out with you
49:51It's great to see you. I learned a lot from you. I'm watching you
49:54I'm implementing things on the side. If you don't have a firm, I recommend you reach out to Ulysses and influencer press
50:01I can vet I can validate everything they do is on the up-and-up. He works with some of my friends
50:07He's great. I work with him. I would continue to work with him. I recommend you do as well and dude. Thank you
50:12Thank you coming on. I appreciate it
50:14Hey everyone first
50:16I want to thank all of you for tuning in and if you guys haven't heard about my new book
50:20Relationship bank account click the link in the show notes or search the title on Amazon
50:24This book is packed with all my secrets to success in both relationships and life
50:29Make sure to pick up a copy and if the book helps you on your journey, let us know by leaving a review
50:34I appreciate all of you and can't wait to see you on the next one
50:50You