CINCINNATI -- What are the keys of long-term success with Hunter Greene, Nick Lodolo and Alexis Diaz on the Reds pitching staff? Why is Jonathan India such an important piece of the puzzle and how does Elly De La Cruz keep amazing us all? Sam LeCure of Bally Sports Ohio joins Trags to discuss these topics and his close musical relationship with Bronson Arroyo on the latest Code Reds podcast.
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Welcome to CLNS Media's Cincinnati Sports Studio, your ultimate hub for everything sports in the Queen City! We bring you in-depth analysis, exclusive interviews, and breaking news covering your beloved Cincinnati Bengals and Cincinnati Reds. As passionate fans ourselves, we understand the heartbeat of the Cincy sports community and aim to keep you ahead of the game with accurate and timely information!
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00:00 Hey everybody, it is Trags Mike Petralia back with another episode of the Code Reds podcast on the CLNS Media Network
00:07 My pleasure this week to welcome a new guest the one and only Sam Lecure of
00:12 Valley Sports, Ohio, but most Reds fans, of course remember him from his outstanding work in the Reds bullpen
00:19 in the early
00:22 2010s
00:23 Obviously on those NL Central Division championship teams in 2010 and 2012
00:29 Sam welcome to the podcast. Thank you very much. Good morning. How are you? I'm doing well
00:35 Reds are off to a good start nine and seven and I I'm gonna start with a
00:41 you know a point of view or at least
00:44 An area of focus that is near and dear to your heart and that would be pitching and I want to focus on three guys
00:52 In particular first of all hunter green as we record this he is going to be starting on Tuesday night
00:59 In Seattle, he's coming off what I would call an uneven performance
01:03 Against the Milwaukee Brewers gave up the five runs in the first two innings and settled down to get through six
01:10 He had trouble with his slider
01:12 Sam what is going to be be the key for getting hunter green on track on a consistent basis?
01:20 I'd say a lot of it has to do with with that pitch that you're talking about the slider he
01:28 His career has been uneven. I mean that start is a
01:30 Kind of a glimpse of the bigger picture of everything that he's done since he's gotten to the big leagues, you know
01:36 I mean, it's he'll go out and he'll have these dominant starts
01:39 You know three or four in a row
01:42 And then he's out and he's walking people and he looks very hit a hit a bull for whatever the reason is and then so that
01:49 Was all kind of mixed into that one start with Milwaukee, right? Just the unevenness. So a couple weeks ago. I
01:57 Guess it would have probably been his
01:59 Second or I guess it had to been a second start
02:03 CC Sabathia was in town to watch the game him or he and hunter pretty close from growing up out in, California, right?
02:10 And I was kind of asking him the same question
02:11 I was like look man
02:12 If you guys are like buddies and you're talking a good bit like I mean, what are you telling him?
02:17 Like what's like what you know, what's the deal because I'm trying to figure it out, you know for myself
02:21 Just watching him, you know every few days
02:25 And he and his answer was a consistency of the breaking ball not even you know, you know, people are talking about
02:31 Well, he added a curveball. He added a split finger
02:33 The his fastball and slider are good enough and have been at points to dominate a lineup, you know
02:41 It's just consistently being able to land it
02:43 You know for strikes early and I think strike one I mean is the biggest pitch in baseball for everybody
02:50 But especially a guy like him who can overwhelm you later in the count with his top of the zone fastball and the slider down
02:57 So I think for him being able to get into counts with that
03:01 some of it I also think is
03:04 Had just him getting a feel for pitching, you know
03:10 I mean, I kind of say this and I don't know if it's completely accurate, but it's pretty close
03:14 I threw more innings in the minor leagues to get to the big leagues then and this is not college
03:19 It's not high school more innings in the minor leagues and hunters bright on his life still
03:23 You know, so I had a pretty good feel learn. I learned, you know
03:27 I had experience to go out there and understand that there's a time to let off the gas. I mean obviously that's
03:32 If I threw a hundred maybe I don't know if I would have been able to do it either
03:36 Right, you know, but you know kind of getting into account with for him. It would be
03:42 This would be me blowing my arm out
03:44 But a 94 mile an hour fastball for a hunter is kind of a 90% effort level with location
03:51 Maybe a little bit of movement to maybe get a first pitch ground out
03:55 you know and allow yourself to get a little bit deeper in the game and I think that for a young pitcher and one with
04:01 such little experience, it's
04:03 His mind says I have a hundred I'm not gonna go out there and get beat with 94 if I have a hundred
04:11 You know, but it's it's understanding the time in the place for it
04:14 Who's the guy at the plate reading those scouting reports of this guy's aggressive early in the count?
04:19 Okay, well give him what he wants but give it to him like you want to give it to him
04:24 You know tease him with it that down-and-away fastball, but a little bit off because he wants to go get it
04:29 You know just different little nuance of pitching like that that he's just not you're just not gonna be able to tell him
04:34 He's gonna have to go out there and learn it young pictures with
04:37 strong arms and
04:39 Really relatively good health. I he's had obviously Tommy John, I believe early in his career, but he's come back from that
04:47 He's fully healthy, you know, knock wood
04:49 Sometimes it takes a while for pictures to learn or young pictures to learn how to pitch learn the craft
04:57 Do you still see that from hunter? Absolutely. Yeah, I think I mean
05:01 and in large part, I'm not even sure if he scratched the surface of what he's capable of being at this level because
05:09 Because he just hadn't done it, you know, and I and that excuse needs to go away pretty quick
05:15 But it is true and he's like, you know
05:17 He's learning how to pitch and learning and how to do it in the toughest place to pitch in the world
05:22 All right in the big league
05:23 So, I mean it's it's pretty much double tough and just he's surviving right now because he's so talented
05:29 Well, I see not to interrupt you Sam
05:32 But what I see sometimes from hunter and I know a lot of fans they watch him they watch this guy with
05:38 Extraordinary talent. Yeah, his fastball gets too flat and I don't see him
05:45 Using his height enough to throw with a downward plane
05:49 Chris Welsh mace that makes this point all the time on the broadcast and I know
05:54 Cowboy is you know a fan of not only throwing strike one but changing eye angles
06:00 And I'm sure you are too when you watch these guys you have a different perspective
06:04 you actually played the sport and you know how important it is to change I and you know, the
06:10 the
06:12 Eye-angle. Yeah, I love I love I love thank you. And
06:16 Sometimes I just don't see that enough from hunter. I
06:19 Don't either and I think
06:21 The league in general has gotten obsessed with that top of the zone fastball, which I mean again
06:29 I mean that's changing eye level
06:30 But he's almost for me working a little bit too much up there in that upper quadrant, you know
06:35 You'll see maybe I can use my hand to do it
06:37 that upper corner here or that upper corner here the up and in and when he's missing he's missing a little bit up or a
06:44 little bit off but
06:45 For me the high fastball
06:47 Complimented the overhand curveball
06:49 Not the slider like the slider is a pitch that you want the fastball at the bottom of the zone
06:54 To play the slider off of that. So he's not
06:57 complimenting I
06:59 Mean and hit those 100 miles an hour fastball, but his most important pitch is that slider?
07:03 He's not using the bottom of the zone to compliment, right?
07:08 The slider as far as you know, you hear the tunneling phrases, you know
07:11 You want things to come right off of each other to be the fastball and then the slider they come out of the same
07:15 You know the same area
07:18 So I think that that's been something that he's not done
07:21 Enough for me to just be at the bottom of the zone establish strike one down there
07:26 And then once he's gotten that the slider is just gonna play better
07:30 because of it and then once you get into the kind of little bit and you
07:34 Sequenced it where it's a fastball here and the slider right off of it
07:37 Then you change your eye level
07:39 Right, and then once you're back at the bottom of the zone that hundred zips in there a little bit
07:43 Oh that slider looks a little bit better out of the hand
07:46 You can grab a little bit more plate and take some off of it, you know different little things like that. So again to
07:53 The excuse that I'm using and it's not because it's a fact and hunters aware of it
07:59 He's not gonna use it as a crutch
08:01 But it's just gonna have to go out there and he's gonna have to experience it and succeed with it because he will
08:08 You know once he does it because he's just that talented
08:11 When I was in the press conference room after that
08:16 Start against Milwaukee last week
08:18 The one thing I did notice is he wanted to point out the positive from the outing and that was he got six innings
08:24 He did which is great it which is great. And as we saw on Monday night with
08:30 obviously Frankie Mount Montas
08:33 Struggling to get out of the first inning. He got almost three innings in but
08:37 innings do matter especially early in the season and for
08:42 Hunter to figure out a way to get through six innings and David Bell to allow him to get to six innings
08:48 I thought that was the silver lining. I thought it was huge and and that may be something that
08:53 You know springboards you forward because it's there's been plenty of times where you know
09:00 I started earlier in my career and
09:02 It was if I gave up five in the first and then finished with five scoreless
09:06 That's way different than going five scoreless and finishing with five and the six, you know
09:11 It's just a different taste. It's a it's the same line score, but it's a completely different taste in your mouth
09:16 And so for hunter to go out there
09:18 I mean that is a badge of honor to go out there and be able to eat up some innings quality innings
09:22 You know
09:23 He he settled in there and kind of found his groove and that's when you want to get a starting pitcher
09:28 Anybody's anybody's gonna tell you that that's ever pitch says you want to get them early because once they get into a rhythm
09:32 You know, then they're a little bit tougher to handle
09:34 But I think hunter learned a good bit about himself about what it takes
09:39 You know again a learning experience
09:41 I mean, it's all gonna be such a learning curve for him and he's gonna shorten it because of his talent, but yeah
09:47 I thought that was really important for him just and a sign of maturity that he's kind of growing
09:51 And
09:54 And hopefully can figure this thing out pretty quick
09:56 I just want alls I want from hunter and all these pictures these guys that they're they're
10:01 Progressions been stunted each of them, you know kind of talk about hunter Lodolo
10:06 Ashcraft
10:08 Maybe not so much Abbott, but Abbott still kind of learning it too, which I love him
10:13 You know with injury those guys that none of them have made the full slate of starts and had an opportunity
10:19 You know, it's been in a row
10:21 You know
10:21 Maybe they're getting it and then it's interrupted for several month period because of an injury or then it gets to the offseason
10:26 But I just want 30 starts out of them and saying I want to see
10:30 What it looks like and then I think if they get 30 starts this year. I think they're gonna get much better. I
10:38 Think then I think next year that they would blossom. I think Cincinnati Reds fans were jubilant
10:45 Full of ecstasy when they watched Nick Lodolo on Saturday. They were known
10:51 I
10:53 Know hitting I gotta tell you Sam to come right off the injured list and not have pitched in
11:00 The majors in 11 months and put out that kind of performance. Yes
11:03 It's a it was against the now 2 and 14 White Sox forget the competition
11:08 Lodolo doing what he did on Saturday was about him facing Nick Lodolo dealing with Nick Loda himself
11:15 Yeah, and I just that's what impressed me the most
11:18 It's a matter of him staying healthy staying on the mound to me. That is the number one priority
11:24 Absolutely, and I was kind of set on the the postgame shorts
11:28 I mean, I don't care if it was the 1927 Yankees if he throws the ball like that
11:33 It doesn't matter, you know, I mean it he beats everybody like that
11:37 I mean just to come out and locate the ball like that, you know, the fastball location was
11:42 Outstanding he was able to get it in on those right handers climb the zone with it. We know about the curveball
11:49 He's getting people to swing at it as it hits them in the leg back foot
11:52 The true back foot breaking ball man, and but the thing I love the most honestly was a changeup
11:59 I mean, I love the location of everything. Yeah, that's number one for me, but his changeup I thought was I
12:05 mean out of this world because you're
12:09 Everybody's keyed in on those two pitches now. He's got something to fade away from the from the right handers
12:14 I thought it was I mean he was just across the board. I mean aces man and that guy
12:19 Since they started talking about this big three, you know him and hunter and Graham, right?
12:24 Everybody had hunter at the top of the list. I haven't just because Nick
12:29 Had a little bit more pedigree as far as pitching in a major college
12:33 You know being that kind of having a little bit more aptitude for it and he's just so different, you know
12:39 You've been in in Boston a little bit
12:41 They haven't they had a guy there here recently named Chris sale and there's just nobody else that I can think of
12:46 But him to compare everybody I watch pitch. I'm thinking of a comparable, right?
12:51 and it's Chris sale, he just the length the arm angle the breaking ball the
12:58 Ability to run the fastball up there early in sales career. He was able to stay healthy
13:03 Then yeah, he started to break down a little bit right? Yeah, Nick's got to overcome that there's no doubt about that
13:08 I want to move on to a third picture. There's three pictures. I told you I wanted to focus on this is more up your alley
13:15 It's a reliever. It's the closer Alexis. Okay
13:18 Okay, maybe I'm overreacting here
13:21 but I I don't get the sense right now and
13:26 Granted we are whatever 13 14 games into the season
13:31 He hasn't found his rhythm yet and and he hadn't pictured in about a week
13:36 But I still don't know if Alexis Diaz is a lockdown closer. Do you think he can be? Yes
13:44 And I'll answer that. Well just because because he's done it I've seen it and he's got the demeanor for it
13:52 Somebody did bring this up to me and I guess I didn't realize it because I felt like he was still converting saves
13:58 I mean he had a excellent safe percentage last year. I thought
14:01 that since
14:05 Maybe August 1st or some of last year
14:09 I think they're saying his era down the stretch and he got used a lot and yeah, no question
14:15 there's a fatigue factor to this too, but
14:17 His era was you know, six and a half or something
14:22 right, and then he and then he had that the outing on
14:24 It was a bird it was a first or first game or two and the season and he gave it
14:31 Yeah, it was it was his first blown. It was the Saturday game. Yeah, and I believe yeah hunter greens first start and
14:40 The Reds had a 6-4 lead I believe it was heading into the ninth any yeah, he coughed it up badly
14:47 Yes. Yeah last year. I mean last year that would last year out
14:50 I mean even this year obviously, you know, I believed in him because of based on what he did last year
14:54 But you know, he's running out of the bullpen and I'm starting to get ready for the postgame show, right?
14:58 I mean, I'm like, well, we're not playing though
15:00 We don't have to put the bottom of the bottom of the ninth there and he just didn't look right. It looked flat
15:04 I've noticed a little bit
15:07 With most of these guys I feel like that their velocities have been down a tick or two
15:14 hmm, I
15:17 mean
15:19 Really? It's not matter to a reliever. Why does that matter?
15:22 More and I've
15:27 And I've kind of talked about this last night
15:29 With we're talking about buck farmer. It looks like he's really having to put a lot of effort into it to get it up there
15:35 At 92 93, but it just looks like it's rolling, you know, like it's just like there's not that second half of the pitch that is
15:43 finish snap, you know what I mean and
15:48 So velocity not really unless it's mentally, you know
15:52 If you're kind of in your range a little, you know
15:55 If you're close to it not so much
15:56 but just if you look up at the board and you're used to seeing a 96 up there and you look up and you see a
16:02 92 or 3 it's like oh you kind of think to yourself. I never had to worry about that
16:06 If I saw a 95 if I saw 92 or 93, baby, I was wound up that day
16:12 But for him it's
16:16 More the just notice the swings, you know
16:19 Just like keep an eye on the swings and how they're reacting to the pitch because he's got all that funk in his delivery
16:26 Which I think is another reason where maybe he hasn't quite found his rhythm yet because hell man
16:31 He's all over the place and that's like there's a lot to the delivery a lot to it. So -
16:38 if something's off
16:40 You got a lot of places to look to find it
16:43 You know cuz it's gonna be real small like you kind of got to work from the ground up you start at the base
16:47 What's my legs doing? Where's my how are my hands starting?
16:51 Are they breaking into all this and he's got all that to kind of sift through to figure out where the little you know
16:57 Which screws loose?
16:59 So it'll take him longer than most guys then a Graham Ashcraft is just out of the stretch real simple up down and go
17:06 There's not a lot to that. So it's gonna be harder for him to find but I still think that
17:12 When the fastballs in the zone, it's got that
17:15 late light the
17:18 Invisibility to it or something, you know the spin or whatever from the arm angle. I never thought I
17:24 Still not sure I think his sliders good but it seems to play really well
17:30 And he but and he's going to it a lot more this year than I felt like he did last year
17:33 But do I that the long answer to short answer your question is do I think he can be a lockdown closer?
17:39 I absolutely do because
17:41 You make your all-star an all-star team in your first year
17:44 That's pretty good. So I you know full disclosure here. I think I'm making a mountain out of a molehill. I mean
17:51 I see him come into a game because there is so much to his delivery. I've talked to Rob devil about this and
18:03 He's like it's funny, you know, and because Rob had a lot going on with his his delivery as well
18:11 When you when you feel like you're all together
18:14 You feel different you feel confident
18:17 But when you feel like one little thing is out of place you adjust for it
18:21 And sometimes I think I see that a little bit with Alexis, but I think he has a great support system
18:27 I'm a Derek Johnson fan. I think he is
18:30 He works very well with the pitching staff and you know, it's a long season. So I think you'll get it figured out
18:36 I want to move on to the position players and I know Spencer steers off to a great start
18:42 but I think you can make the case for Jonathan India as
18:45 An MVP early on in this season. The reason I feel that way is
18:50 He's provided a lot of stability at the top of the lineup. He's a he's a leader
18:55 I actually think if he stays around he has
18:59 Captain type qualities and I think sometimes a captain does matter
19:04 There are so many intangibles that Jonathan India brings to this ballclub and I think he's shown that early in this season
19:11 he has and I
19:13 It's funny how the game works out, right? I mean a
19:16 Weekend the spring training. It's like man, where are all these guys gonna play?
19:20 You know Jonathan's gonna be a super utility this guy's this place
19:24 And now Matt McLean's out and Noel be Marta's out and TJ free goes out and it's kind of settled into
19:30 You've got Candelario playing third base every day, which is what he's done in his you know
19:35 in the past has been an everyday third baseman Jonathan's been everyday second base and they've been there every game and
19:40 Jonathan I think just the fact that he didn't flinch
19:43 And I'm sure internally he did and at home he did but not I bet you not in the clubhouse not in the media at
19:51 all like
19:52 He feels like he's an above-average everyday major league second baseman
19:56 but he didn't flinch at the fact that he would move around and find a way to
20:00 Force his way into the lineup every single day. No matter where he was playing. I
20:04 Think that that
20:07 That's a leadership quality that you know, yeah, you can't you can't overstate it or understate it whichever way
20:14 Yeah, but I just think for the fact for him to come in there
20:17 I mean last year when they were calling an America's team
20:19 They were calling him captain Jack, you know, cuz he's got the he's got the Pirates of the Caribbean thing going on
20:25 And yes, so just that little moniker itself and the way that they talk about him
20:30 When asked about him that the other guys, you know, I'm not gonna hear this from Jonathan. You shouldn't hear from Jonathan
20:36 But the way that they talk about him like he's our leader
20:39 We get energy from him the way he plays out there, you know going hard at it every day
20:44 It's hot it's just hard to kind of
20:50 Quantify it without being in the clubhouse, you know, it's not it's nothing that you you know
20:56 You and I go into the clubhouse for a medium hour or whatever. It is like it's not something that we're just gonna see
21:03 In there, you know, it's not like he's got you know, some kind of shrine around his locker and it's captain
21:09 You know all this stuff but office of the captain. Yeah. Yeah locker stall everybody who needs help come here
21:16 No, that's not
21:18 Not how it works, but I but I did cuz I didn't buy it. I wasn't buying it, but he after when he missed time
21:25 Last year
21:29 And then came back I know I mean I know notice a difference in the quality of play when he's on the field
21:36 Yes, and that to me, you know
21:40 It speaks louder than anything just his his his presence there means something
21:46 You know whether he's hitting 300 or not
21:49 It's a big deal
21:51 So I think that certainly since he's so recently gone through things
21:55 With success when rookie of the year as a lot of these young players are like they saw him when rookie of the year
22:02 Like they know who Jonathan Indian is because they held some of them might even play to close to played against him
22:07 Right in college because their age but but he's been around longer than anybody on this team other than now can't alario
22:13 So I think they look to him because he can relate to it. He succeeded at it
22:17 He's had some struggles a lot. So he's been through a lot in a short amount of time. So with that experience
22:21 You know comes comes wisdom and I think he's been patting any place hard, you know, I mean, he's all about it
22:28 Ellie Dela Cruz made another play Sam on Monday night. That was like nobody else can
22:34 That sliding catch
22:37 Pretty much back to the infield that he made
22:41 Sixth inning, you know the Reds were you know well behind but he made the cat and made that catch and you just stopped and said
22:48 Yeah, like you just said Sam. Nobody else is gonna make that catch the way he made it
22:52 And I will tell you when he popped up. I'm like, oh god. Oh you saw it, too
22:56 I'm like he didn't just pull at his hammy. Did he?
23:01 Yeah, you know because you you hold your breath every time Ellie makes a play like that
23:05 You do hold your breath like just don't get hurt. It's not holding your breath. It's him taking your breath away
23:11 There you go, well played Sam you have you have you ever seen a player like him
23:18 That you can comp right off the top of your head because I haven't I haven't really the only other guy just because of the size
23:26 and the all the things is that kid from Pittsburgh the O'Neill Cruz correct, but he's but he's
23:32 But still not there's something
23:38 There's Ellie's yeah, he's something different and because I think once you start to I mean we can see the tools
23:45 We see all that right? It's pretty hard to miss
23:48 that kids I
23:50 Think he's a good baseball player like instinctually. I think he said I
23:55 Think he's ahead of everybody else as far as reading what's happening on the field
24:00 And you know, I mean kind of go back to and everybody should remember
24:04 This is when he stole all the bases against Milwaukee in the one inning three bases on two pitches on two pitches
24:10 Different stuff like him changing the mitten, you know, you wear them oven mittens out there changing it mid
24:20 Run around the bases because of how he's gonna slide into the base and which hand he's gonna grab it with
24:29 Like he's already that far. He's already a baseball. Yes. He's already a base ahead and then watching
24:35 Never turning it off
24:38 Watching the pitchers. He's kind of walking. Well, he's kind of creeping down the line of the pitchers over there thinking
24:44 What the hell's going on?
24:45 and then he goes as you know the pitcher kind of
24:48 Takes his hat off or takes his hand out of his to rub the ball down or something like that. I mean
24:53 the instincts
24:56 Added with the tools I mean
24:59 He's got a chance to be the best player in baseball
25:02 I mean aside show him tiny kind of his own deal, but he's aside from
25:06 and Ellie could probably throw 97 off a mountain too, but
25:10 well, you know what I want to stop you right there because
25:14 John Sadak and cowboy on the air during the broadcast on Monday night now made
25:20 Made that point about him eventually playing in the outfield and I think cowboy
25:25 Pointed out and I agree with
25:27 1000% you want him to
25:29 Get his hitting down to the point where he's not worried about another position and still not
25:36 totally in his groove at the plate and I think
25:39 that matters to the Reds and I think he can still be a what I think is an a
25:46 quality shortstop
25:48 But he could be an a-plus outfielder
25:53 I thought I know I don't I don't doubt it. I don't doubt that he could I
25:57 you know the fact that I
26:00 Guess it just puts a bitter taste in my mouth to talk about it already
26:05 Because I think he's still because I think he's hasn't had the opportunity to prove himself to be a really good shortstop
26:11 You know and everybody thinks oh you put him in the outfield. That's easy because he's athletic. I mean
26:18 There are some truth to that, you know, I mean like Billy Hamilton because they compared him to Billy
26:23 I mean Billy was came up as a shortstop and was an amazing
26:27 there was nobody I'd rather watch play centerfield and Billy Hamilton right ever maybe Jim Edmonds, but
26:32 Billy Hamilton to watch run it down to the gap. I mean was was the funnest
26:37 Yeah, Ellie could absolutely do that
26:39 but I
26:42 Guess I hadn't considered that only because
26:45 He's still kind of learning to play shortstop and he had like a couple little scuffles, but I can see him there be changed
26:51 I think the roster construction plays into a lot of that. I mean, okay, so Ellie's you're gonna put Ellie in centerfield
26:58 Where's TJ Prita gonna play? Okay. Well TJ gonna play left or Spencer gonna play. All right. Well Spencer can play, right?
27:04 Well, where's Jake Fraley? Well Benson gonna I mean you've got the pieces now that
27:08 It's not a consideration to me
27:14 And I know that but
27:16 You know first things first for me, you know, it's great and and that's just the baseball mentality is one day of a time
27:22 You got to take care of number one and number ones today
27:25 Why why get in a theoretical, you know conversation about something what we do
27:31 Look I mean being in the media now for a few years
27:36 I would definitely have learned that about the media's with the speculation and I
27:42 And I totally get that and and it's part of it because it's fun fodder and you know
27:47 Talking points around the water cooler and and I get that too
27:49 But I don't want you know
27:52 Say Ellie turns the thing on and obviously he's not gonna watch the broadcast during the game while he was in
27:57 Sure at shortstop, but he watches like well
28:00 Why don't they think I can play shortstop?
28:02 like what have I done so egregiously to you know, it starts to plant a negative seed in the players head and
28:08 if he catches wind of it because
28:10 You know somebody that he knows or know somebody he knows is gonna watch this, you know and say well
28:16 Why why is this such a talking point?
28:18 Like I've played a pretty good shortstop so far this year and he has played a pretty good shortstop this year
28:22 Make some of those spectacular plays. I mean, she's I
28:25 Mean some of them just are John. I mean Monday night was a
28:29 all-timer in terms of athletic ability
28:33 The jump one and I need the relay throws. I mean you and I remember Barry Larkin
28:40 Yeah, pokey Reese. We remember, you know a lot of the the Reds have been blessed with a lot of great athletic infielders
28:47 No question about Davey Concepcion
28:49 obviously
28:51 Joe Morgan, but
28:53 Ellie makes plays
28:55 Athletically that nobody else can the way he makes them. No, I and I think that is we're gonna leave it right there
29:03 I want to move on to something else Sam away from the baseball diamond, but still related
29:08 That's why but that's why you leave him at shortstop
29:11 Very good. I'm getting in the last word because he can do things there that nobody can do
29:16 There you go. And I agree with that. I I think that's accurate
29:21 It's just he's got to work on his fielding and once he gets that down
29:24 He will be an all-star caliber shortstop. No doubt in my mind
29:28 Bronson Arroyo, I covered the man back in the days the glory days of the Red Sox
29:34 This is the 20th anniversary of their 2004 World Championship team
29:39 Of course a lot of Red Sox fans remember Bronson for that notorious Alex Rodriguez play at first base
29:46 in game six of the
29:49 2004 ALCS, of course the Red Sox went on to win the ALCS beat the Cardinals in four games and
29:56 You're you were a teammate of course of Bronson Arroyo's for several years those division winning teams in
30:04 2010
30:05 2012
30:07 What makes Bronson Arroyo such a special individual?
30:10 Athlete and and off the field as well
30:14 well a
30:16 Lot how much time you got as much as you can afford on the
30:24 On the pitching side of the I mean the guys work ethic
30:29 I mean you look at him and you think oh, I mean this guy's 6-4, but he's you know
30:35 170 pounds soaking wet like I mean this guy spent as much time as the gym. He was as
30:41 Meticulous
30:43 With what he did as anybody I'd ever seen to that point as far as when he's gonna eat when he's gonna sleep
30:51 What he's gonna eat what the workout is what the you know cardio or whatever that type of stuff
30:57 And not only what when?
30:59 he would go to the ballpark and
31:02 Throw at
31:05 What would appear to be completely random times?
31:08 based on what time of the day his start was gonna be because he wanted to start to
31:14 Acclimate his body to peaking at a certain moment. He's like, oh, well, I'm throwing in a day game
31:19 Well, I'm gonna throw my bullpen
31:22 I'm gonna get to the ballpark at one o'clock on right, you know
31:25 Whatever day it is to throw my bullpen then so my body's used to doing it
31:29 Little things like that with time change if we're hit we're flying to the West Coast and he had a start there
31:36 He would alter his throwing program to match up with the West, you know
31:41 So little nuance stuff like that that I mean, I wouldn't even have thought about you know
31:44 I just get to the ballpark and go through my thing and do it. So the the work ethic
31:50 I mean he did work really hard the attention to detail the uniqueness of how he went about it of how he pitched
31:56 With you know, I talked about letting off the gas a little bit. I mean
32:00 Bronson went here. I mean, I guess he'd run it up to he'd still run up 93 94
32:06 But he wasn't scared to get into the count of an 82 mile an hour fastball and then throw an 83 mile an hour change
32:12 up, you know just like
32:13 kind of wild stuff obviously the arm angle and he dropped down a little bit had the curveball the
32:20 The only person who's ever actually thrown a sweeper. I don't know what that who that what the hell they're calling it now, but
32:26 Yes, okay everything else is a slider now, but so that that
32:33 Stuck out stuck out and because of all that
32:37 It did 200 innings every year, you know for 10 years in a row
32:41 Except one that was in New York and he threw a complete game in the last last start of the year to finish on 199
32:48 Yes
32:49 But he told me that actually when I saw him over over the winner
32:53 He regretted that that one inning that he missed I forget what year it was. But yeah
32:59 Yeah does big-time
33:04 Now he may and we went into extra innings that game
33:07 It was tied and I and I bet you any money dust
33:10 He would have sent him back out for the tent had his spot in the order not come up
33:14 To let him get to take it and Bronson would have gone out there and he would have got it. No question
33:19 You played with Bronson, right? Yeah many times. Oh, yeah
33:22 What why do you think you both share a passion for music?
33:27 And so I think that this would lend itself to kind of the why do I think Bronson is one of the most interesting?
33:33 Men in the world because I do like he's very attentive. He the way his mind works
33:39 As far as getting interested in different things. I mean he so he came over the other day
33:44 I've been taking guitar lessons for about a year
33:47 Bronson has been playing forever and has always been you know a passion of his so just been nice for me to
33:55 For us to have an excuse to spend a little bit more time together because we always have a great time and he's so
34:01 You know
34:03 Thoughtful about everything, you know people you are having a conversation with him
34:08 He may not know you from Adam, but I mean he is right there. Yep
34:13 And cares, you know and and has a thought about it, but he does go so he came over on Sunday
34:19 He calls me said hey, man
34:21 I'm gonna run down to this kid. I'm gonna run out of the casino real quick
34:24 I'm gonna check on this craps theory
34:27 Like, you know, it's just like he's interested in so much different stuff
34:31 But he wanted to go out and try this little method out and he's like I might take me a while to grind to profit
34:35 You know, so he's talking to craps as in the card game
34:42 Yeah, of course
34:43 But that but he gets he just gets fixated on these little things and he wants to go try it out and see if he can
34:48 kind of
34:49 win
34:50 And whatever and it's not winning. It's the application of a method
34:56 Mind works. It's the way his mind works and I and that is why he just gets
35:03 He's so he's fascinating dude. I mean if you obviously, you know, you've talked to him plenty and been around him enough
35:09 I mean he's fascinating
35:11 Just the nicest guy still takes good care of himself takes great care of the people around him
35:16 You know never
35:19 Would deny requests?
35:21 So yeah, but I mean fortunate to have been able to watch him play and and win some ballgames with him
35:27 but definitely happy that you know, that's been one of my
35:30 Main things I've been happy about instead being in Cincinnati's still get the chance to spend some time with them
35:36 There's a couple of the guys that'll kind of in and out of here a little bit. But yeah, he's definitely
35:41 I would never say that I had a favorite teammate. I mean
35:45 Right. I'd have a long list of tied for first, but he's certainly
35:51 Right there with it, you know
35:54 I'm I really appreciate your time Sam, but I would be remiss if I didn't ask you a
36:00 Couple words about or to share a couple words about Dusty Baker. Oh, okay
36:07 Playing for a hot who is going clearly gonna be a Hall of Fame manager. It was you know
36:13 You get to the big leagues and you know, you're kind of trying to survive a little bit
36:17 Dusty's kind of there, you know, I mean dusty just has immediate respect because of everything he's done at the game, right?
36:26 I mean from the player to the bandage and you know, the the Darren Baker moment that everybody remembers, you know
36:33 JT snow getting him at home plate to the toothpick
36:36 You know the Bartman game. I mean all the all the stuff that he was involved in that's just you know, Barry Bonn
36:41 Crazy, right, you know
36:43 I'll tell you what I remember him the most for and and this is just me as a child of the 70s
36:49 Hank Aaron's teammate. Oh, yeah, 1974. That's what will
36:53 or I mean on the Dodger teams and his relationship with Hank Aaron I should say and
36:59 That's what I'm I I remember dusty for the way he grew up and came up in the game
37:05 And he always written will always reference
37:07 Hank Aaron, you know, yes, it always referencing like it was his you know
37:12 Godfather almost and I remember getting to meet Hank Aaron when we're in Atlanta. That's another thing. That's a good
37:19 representative of dusty is the
37:22 Who's who of red carpet people that would come through the clubhouses to see dusty?
37:26 Oh, you know like me buzz Aldrin and Neil Armstrong coming in like I mean to sit to see dusty
37:34 Whoever whoever coming in to see dusty and saw Mountain a few years ago. I was living out in Manhattan Beach
37:41 which is just South LA or a little bit and
37:44 What the hell is he doing he must not have maybe it was
37:50 maybe he was in between the Nationals and
37:54 Astros Astros, yeah, I would think that timeline would be yeah
37:59 I think so and it was I don't remember if it was Kovat or you somewhere right around there. Yeah, and I
38:06 Don't know he's like he's he's amazing and just kind of reaching out to people. I think I bet you he has a
38:12 Calendar and on every day of every of the year. He's got five people's names written in it
38:21 And he reaches out and it might just be one time a year
38:23 Yep, but he but he reaches out to me once or twice a year
38:28 That's amazing to me. It's a and he does it with everybody. I guarantee I guarantee it
38:32 He had to have had 10,000 text messages after he won the World Series and I bet you he answered everyone one of them
38:39 so I'm out Manhattan Beach and
38:42 He had I called him or something I was like, hey, what are you doing?
38:47 I knew he wasn't working but I knew he's in San Francisco and sure
38:50 Like I'm living out man had me just like Oh Sammy you got out to California
38:54 Like I don't see that out of you, you know, whatever which I didn't see it out of either
38:57 But he's like I'm gonna be down there. He's like I'm be down there. I'm working on the oh, he has got his vineyard
39:02 you know, so he was doing Baker wines and
39:04 He's like I'm gonna be down there. So I'm like, oh cool, man
39:08 my buddy you're gonna come and meet you because you know the lobby this hotel or whatever was and
39:12 And we get over there and I mean
39:15 I'm trying to think of somebody else Michael Jordan might it could have been in there. Yeah
39:23 a
39:24 Crowd of people around dusty just sitting that like sitting at the bar like drinking his wine holding court, you know
39:31 I mean wherever this guy goes he's got this energy that is
39:35 Tangible that I mean it just draws you to him because I mean he and Bronson are in the same like I mean very chill
39:43 Very attentive thoughtful they think of you they take care of you, you know, they reach out to you
39:49 But that was cool. And I'm like what the hell's that like who knows the people?
39:52 What do people in Manhattan Beach know about Dusty Baker?
39:55 I was like, they know the Dodgers and the fact that you know from the 19 that you know early 80s or whatever was late 70s
40:01 80s, you know, they're still coming around and they
40:03 recognize when Dusty Baker comes through town like I mean this is this dude is a dude like he's got
40:10 Like he's never treated somebody wrong I've never met anybody who doesn't just
40:17 Sam whether it's in baseball or not the way somebody treats other people is the way I
40:23 Judge her. Yes, and that's measure of a man the Dusty Baker is my
40:30 That note, I would think I'm gonna let you go Sam
40:34 I can I want to be sure to let people know they can catch Sam like you're on
40:39 Valley Sports, Ohio on the Reds pre and postgame shows with Brian Keeson slaw and
40:46 Annie Sabo as well when and we're doing a little bit of back and forth right now Brian was yesterday
40:52 He's got his last hockey game tonight
40:54 so I got Annie and then it'll be pretty much the the Gheez and Sam show for a little while and
41:00 Brian will be on this very podcast Sam. You'll be happy to know next week. No, so there you go
41:07 Don't ask too many questions about me. I don't want to I don't want you to make it a lie in public
41:11 No
41:13 I'm sure he was very highly
41:16 About me. Like I say about dusty and Bronson. I know I'm at least heading in the right direction. Yes, indeed
41:22 Well, Sam, thanks so much for taking time out. You got a mic. I appreciate one. All right, he is Sam Lecure
41:28 I'm Mike Petralia trags. Thanks for downloading this episode of code Reds of the code Reds podcast on the CLNS
41:36 media network
41:41 Sam that was that was great. Cool. I
41:44 enjoy your
41:47 Your pot I was going to shout out the music salon, but I didn't do that
41:51 So we'll see what we got we've been having some pretty good sessions
41:59 so and Bronson will come over and as well my guitar teacher and I
42:02 Don't remember. So when I was getting into town and I guess this was
42:08 Before last season I said hey, man, do you know anybody around there?
42:11 I can take some guitar lessons from he like looked around and and found the guy that I he
42:16 Recommended this guy to me who I didn't realize it at the time, but I had actually met I was at an FC game
42:23 one of my buddies is part owner of it and
42:25 Sean was in there. I
42:29 Didn't I hadn't realized at the time and he gives that guy lesson
42:32 So the guitar world around Cincinnati is pretty small. So everybody kind of knows each other but
42:37 Sean's great and he likes to you know, come out and hang
42:40 So we've got some something we're trying to do a Sunday sessions at Sammy's so just so
42:45 If you see Bronson, just tell him Mike Petralia says hi
42:49 I'm sure he'll remember the name, but I'm the guy who that did stand-up comedy in Boston. He'll definitely remember
42:56 So, all right
42:59 We're getting out and enjoying another passionate golf you're gonna be at the ballpark on Friday I
43:05 Shall okay. I will stop by and say hi cuz I will be working up in the press box. Okay, that sounds good Mike Sam
43:13 Thanks so much. You got a bud. Take care