Faith Assembly: A 1984 Dystopian Christian Faith - Episode 205 Branham Research Podcast - video Dailymotion

William Branham Historical Research

Available on Spotify, Google, and Apple Podcasts: https://william-branham.org/podcast  Support the show: https://www.patreon.com/branham   Chino's YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/@chinodross  The podcast episode provides an in-depth discussion of Hobart Freeman and his Faith Assembly movement, focusing on its decline in 1984. The conversation draws parallels between the dystopian novel *1984* and Freeman’s control over his congregation, likening his methods to totalitarian thought control. Freeman's teachings, which resulted in numerous deaths due to rejection of medical care, were discussed alongside his increasing isolation and bitterness toward the media. Freeman's rigid views and unyielding leadership alienated followers, leading to schisms within the Faith Assembly. The dialogue emphasizes Freeman's focus on control, both in religious doctrine and personal lives, as well as his public shaming of dissenters.  The discussion further explores the aftermath of Freeman’s leadership, with personal stories from survivors and the long-lasting effects of his teachings. Freeman’s rules, often arbitrary and contradictory, extended to all areas of life, from the rejection of medical care to marital and lifestyle restrictions. Former followers recall the oppressive atmosphere, where criticism was met with excommunication, and compliance was demanded under the guise of spiritual superiority. The episode concludes by noting the ongoing impact of Freeman's teachings on his followers, many of whom continue to suffer physically and emotionally from his doctrine.  00:00 Introduction   02:07 The Decline of Faith Assembly in 1984   05:05 Media Coverage and Deaths at Faith Assembly   07:58 Comparisons with John Alexander Dowie   10:58 Hobart Freeman’s Control and Thought Manipulation   14:34 Ongoing Impact of Freeman’s Teachings After His Death   18:03 Parallels Between *1984* and Religious Cults   21:01 Bruce Keny's Departure from Faith Assembly   26:01 Cult Control Tactics and Public Shaming   30:53 The "No Hunting" Rule and Other Arbitrary Restrictions   36:43 The Burden of Legalism in Cult Churches   42:04 Further Contradictions in Freeman’s Teachings   47:06 Hobart Freeman’s Mockery of Departing Members   52:20 The Contrast Between Cult Churches and Traditional Churches   56:01 Hobart Freeman’s Final Days and the Decline of His Ministry   1:00:08 The Effects of Freeman's Teachings on Marriages and Families   1:03:58 Closing Remarks ______________________ – Support the channel: https://www.patreon.com/branham – Subscribe to the channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCBSpezVG15TVG-lOYMRXuyQ – Visit the website: https://william-branham.org – Follow on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/WilliamBranhamOrg  – Follow on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@william.m.branham – Follow on Twitter: https://twitter.com/wmbhr – Buy the books: https://william-branham.org/site/books

Transcript

00:00:00You

00:00:31Hello and welcome to another episode of the William Branham historical research

00:00:35podcast. I'm your host John Collins the author and founder of William Branham

00:00:40historical research at william-branham.org and with me I have my co-host

00:00:45minister and friend Cheno Ross pastor and the voice of the understanding

00:00:51scripture and truth by Cheno D Ross YouTube channel. In Cheno today we're

00:00:56getting into the year 1984 and my frame of reference for 1984 is the book 1984

00:01:04which yeah read or not but yeah in the book you've got this dystopian world

00:01:09where everything's just kind of falling apart and then in the world of Hobart

00:01:14Freeman and the cult that he created it's kind of falling apart so the two

00:01:20parallel each other a good bit. I love the analogy yes John in the in the fall

00:01:27of 1984 I would say there were dark clouds on the horizon for Faith

00:01:32Assembly and for Hobart Freeman totally unbeknownst to them what was just around

00:01:37the corner and these dark clouds weren't due to pressure from the community

00:01:44around them it wasn't due from the state legislature which we have seen in some

00:01:50past interviews they had specifically targeted Faith Assembly because of the

00:01:56lack of ability for law enforcement in the court system to help protect these

00:02:01child neglect and death cases and so they had passed laws and that was

00:02:07presenting problems because now the legal system was involved now the local

00:02:14law enforcement the courts the judges were involved people were going to

00:02:19prison for the death of their children but the the problems at Faith Assembly

00:02:26unlike what Hobart always said were not caused by the news media everything fell

00:02:32squarely on Hobart's shoulders the problems were caused by the needless

00:02:37senseless deaths of so many people and Dr. Freeman just loved one of his

00:02:43favorite topics was maligning the news media just like they were maligning him

00:02:49and he would talk about that constantly and we would throw our hands up in the

00:02:55air I mean he would say don't you realize that the media he gave this

00:02:59famous story and it was it was very cute and very humorous but the media is like

00:03:04a couple of blind men in a dark basement looking for a black cat and they found

00:03:11him said that's what the media is like well we already know what the media is

00:03:16like we know that the media that they are controlled by you know left of

00:03:22center organizations and I would think my goodness when we come to church our

00:03:27purpose in coming here is to learn the Bible and learn about our Lord please

00:03:32don't preach against the media again but he just did it all the time it's like a

00:03:37criticize your critics instead of hey let's identify why is it why is it we

00:03:45are such a target of opposition they called it persecution but it wasn't

00:03:52persecution persecution is what we see in the book of Acts persecution is when

00:03:57you are really suffering for the cause of Christ for preaching his name

00:04:02actually for divine healing and not for divine death that's what they were

00:04:08experiencing there nobody in the New Testament was suffering persecution

00:04:13because people died they suffered persecution because they heal people and

00:04:18raise people from the dead so I just always thought that they were looking to

00:04:25the wrong area and wondering what was going on around us rather than looking

00:04:31within the only reason that the media even bothered with Faith Assembly is

00:04:37because there was a story there I mean I don't have the media camping out on my

00:04:42front lawn because there's no story here in Central Kentucky it's pretty boring

00:04:47here their job is to find a story and the story happened to be these

00:04:53completely senseless needless deaths at Faith Assembly there was a book I

00:05:01recent one actually or fairly recent John published by no less than Oxford

00:05:07University Press it was published in 2008 and listen to the title of this

00:05:13book by this prestigious press University Oxford University Press when

00:05:20prayer fails faith healing children and the law and what they had done in this

00:05:29study was they were comparing they were they were really looking at Christian

00:05:35science that whole religious cult you know which is headquartered in Boston

00:05:41and that's that's a that's a religious pseudo-christian group with hundreds of

00:05:47thousands of members they did a comparison of the what they called the

00:05:55number of neglect related fatalities so it's children and adults but neglect

00:06:01related fatalities they did a study over a certain period of time they had a

00:06:07starting point they had a stopping point and they were going to compare Christian

00:06:12science which is a worldwide cult with guess who Faith Assembly and over that

00:06:19little period of time that they decided this is going to be our test sample in

00:06:24Christian science there were 28 neglect related fatalities in Faith Assembly

00:06:34there were 64 we're talking about one little tiny group and they almost

00:06:43tripled what a worldwide cult was producing and what they called neglect

00:06:49related fatalities so why was the news media after them they were after them

00:06:55because so many people were dying I never will forget whenever I began

00:06:59researching John Alexander Dowie who in many ways Hobart Freeman resembled Dowie

00:07:06had the same trouble with the newspapers newspapers report news if there's not

00:07:12news not going to report it and if you are doing something that is unfavorable

00:07:19they're going to paint you unfavorable if you're doing something heroic they

00:07:23paint you as heroic and Dowie was killing people in the you know in the

00:07:29hundreds man they had Dowie actually had a deal with the Undertaker and at night

00:07:35the Undertaker would come and whisk the bodies away from his so-called healing

00:07:40homes that didn't get healed so that when people came in the daylight and

00:07:44they saw people they they never saw the dead you know and Dowie did the same

00:07:49thing there's newspapers out to get me there they're working with the

00:07:53Antichrist all of that kind of thing and I thought when I first discovered I

00:07:58thought you know how could somebody who is in the Dowie cult not notice that all

00:08:04of this is going on because any reasonable person can realize when

00:08:09somebody starts bashing the news that is reporting news that there's probably

00:08:15a problem here that we need to dig further now you know CNN is heavy

00:08:19heavily liberal and you know Fox is heavily Republican I get all that but

00:08:24there comes a point whenever news that's being reported is accurate and people

00:08:30who are trapped in the mindset can understand that yeah the news is

00:08:33actually reporting this bad thing that happened but then it started to hit me

00:08:38once you're under the the mental control and the group think you start to

00:08:45ignore the logic that other people might understand and so it all kind of makes

00:08:50sense to me now but I was a little bit shocked when I first discovered it yeah

00:08:55so but you got to also remember which you and I have said that they are in

00:09:00control of the input in your life and they've already said you can't read

00:09:04outside sources so I mean they just have you coming and going that's what is so

00:09:11dangerous about these groups I remember seeing John not long ago a documentary

00:09:17on Adolf Hitler and it was about the last years of Hitler's life really

00:09:23probably the last months and we know the account of the Second World War that one

00:09:28of Hitler's biggest problems maybe his biggest strategic problem from a

00:09:33military point of view is he's trying to fight a battle on two fronts he's

00:09:37trying to bomb England to the West but he had sent his troops so far into the

00:09:41Soviet Union to the east and it was the dead of winter and you know his own

00:09:46troops were dying of starvation the supply lines had been cut off and when

00:09:51you study what was going on actually in Germany at the time so much of the

00:09:58effort was a war effort production everything was going toward war effort

00:10:04to the point that even the people in Germany were beginning to starve to

00:10:11death even Hitler's own citizens and so some of the people closest to Adolf

00:10:18Hitler went to him and and tried to reason with him we've got to dial back

00:10:27this war effort or we're not even going to exist to the end of the war now he

00:10:34wasn't out there fighting on the front lines he was in his chateau in the

00:10:38mountains or he was in his bunker with Eva that's where he spent all of his

00:10:43time he wasn't having to experience what was going on and people were literally

00:10:48dying German citizens that those were his own people they were dying by the

00:10:54tens of thousands and when I saw that documentary it just reminded me of the

00:11:02lack of empathy the lack of involvement in Hobart Freeman's life with what was

00:11:08going on with his church and he was just absolutely not in touch with reality a

00:11:14normal minister or pastor would have been heartbroken over all of these

00:11:20people trying to the best of their ability to follow me and follow my

00:11:25teaching Hobart at that time was still alive he hadn't suffered any permanent

00:11:31ill effects of his own teaching but my goodness the other people had people

00:11:36have gone to prison people have died and you know John just since the year our

00:11:41last interview went online I guess it was last week I mean I can't tell you

00:11:48how many different people knew these are all new people I'm not talking to

00:11:52the same people it's new people and they're not even from the same state

00:11:55they're from multiple states and what they're to what they're telling me my

00:11:59point is that people are still dying people are still dying and people have

00:12:05recently died one woman whose mother died it's been quite a while ago when

00:12:10she was 26 but this was long after Hobart had died these people are

00:12:14continuing to hold on to his doctrine as soon as she brought up that account

00:12:20because I asked well are your your parents still alive as soon as she

00:12:24mentioned her mother I mean she broke down over the phone in tears that's how

00:12:28raw that was to her that's what this man did in people's lives and I'm sorry but

00:12:38that's not Christian I'm sorry but you can know the Bible from cover to cover

00:12:43and that's not what any of the New Testament ministers did they don't have

00:12:47that on their track record they don't have they don't have that on their

00:12:51resume Paul or Peter or any of them they don't have to look back and say oh it

00:12:57wasn't hundreds it might have been thousands of people have died remember

00:13:02the Jonestown Jonestown happened in what 1978 we're in the fall of 84 it's just

00:13:09six years after Jonestown that is still fresh in the in the mind's eye of the

00:13:16American public and I don't remember the number you probably remember John but it

00:13:20was probably just shy of a thousand people drank the Kool-Aid or were

00:13:24forced down there and what wasn't Jim Jones a friend a fellow minister of

00:13:29William Branham I mean aren't we talking about all the same thing and people yeah

00:13:35and there was more recently in Kenya there was a minister who convinced I

00:13:41don't know how many hundreds of people that they could hasten their departure

00:13:46from this earth into heaven by starving themselves to death and he's on trial

00:13:49right now in Kenya and they found series of Branham books in his cult compound as

00:13:56well so this this repeats itself again and again and again well people have

00:14:01said the newspaper articles about Faith Assembly say only you know a hundred or

00:14:05hundred and twenty died that's just what they could document most of those were

00:14:10actually at Faith Assembly or at least within northern Indiana a few of them

00:14:15were in surrounding states like Illinois and Michigan Ohio and there were a

00:14:20couple several of the people I even know down in Kentucky they were a part of Tom

00:14:24Hamilton's Church in Shelbyville Kentucky but that didn't deal with the

00:14:29people in Canada in Germany and Switzerland Australia the satellite

00:14:34groups in Tennessee and Casper Wyoming and Massachusetts and Virginia and

00:14:40Alabama and Florida and that doesn't can that doesn't count all the people that

00:14:46have died since those articles were written in the fall of 1983 that's when

00:14:51they came out there are hundreds and hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of

00:14:55people there are people according to what I'm being told by ex-Faith Assembly

00:15:00people now that are still believing for some healing there have been people who

00:15:06haven't had their glasses on in 30 or 40 years waiting for their healing of their

00:15:11eyes to be manifested and you know as you age it only gets worse it doesn't

00:15:15get better and so they have foregone this whole period of time where they

00:15:20actually could see something clearly by following this man's beliefs so yeah

00:15:27maybe Hobart would not have brought a pitcher of Kool-Aid into the church

00:15:31although someone did tell me that in the Rockford Illinois meeting that was a big

00:15:37satellite group where one of the tier one ministers traveled and spoke weekly

00:15:42he joked and said he wasn't gonna bring any Kool-Aid into the meeting and that

00:15:48is a completely that is a completely out-of-order joke you don't ever bring a

00:15:57statement like that into the church you just don't the one the church up in

00:16:02Grand Rapids which was another big Grand Rapids Michigan another big satellite

00:16:07group someone told me here recently that he would joke all the time by saying you

00:16:14know we're accused of brainwashing you you people and that's exactly right we

00:16:20brainwash you with the water of the word ha ha ha those are inappropriate comments

00:16:26those are unprofessional inappropriate comments that that don't have any place

00:16:31in a pulpit but yeah I like your comment to begin with 1984 George Orwell's book

00:16:38this Orwellian society yeah what a great thing John I'm glad you you brought

00:16:44that up because if I remember George Orwell's book 1984 probably the only

00:16:49thing he didn't include was a chapter on Hobart Freeman in faith assembly I mean

00:16:55that was the book that was the book if I remember correctly that gave us the the

00:17:02the Big Brother concept and I think even the word Big Brother and the thought

00:17:07police that's the and that was written when back in the 1930s or 1940s I would

00:17:13say and the only thing he didn't cover were modern-day cults you know it's kind

00:17:18of funny I I had to look it up while you're talking and the the book 1984 was

00:17:23written in 1949 which is exactly after the the Assemblies of God had denounced

00:17:31latter rain as being very cultish you know they had a series of more

00:17:36professional words than that but it was spawning off all of these cult leaders

00:17:40and it was creating a dystopian society and religion and Orwell came up with a

00:17:46concept for his book in 1948 so at the height of the latter rain it's coming up

00:17:51with the concept and you can't say that it was directly related I'm certain that

00:17:56it's not but the the latter rain movement and many of the things that

00:18:00were spinning up around that same time frame were a result of the world events

00:18:05that were happening and it was very dystopian they they were really looking

00:18:10towards a imminent World War three and they thought everybody thought it was

00:18:15coming from religious extremists to probably even George Orwell but

00:18:20similarities are like you said they're unbelievable whenever you really

00:18:25followed them out to their conclusions and I think the Orwellian society was

00:18:29one that was going to be dominated you know by government control and Big

00:18:34Brother and the Thought Police and yes so I think it's so similar to the

00:18:39mindset of a religious cult where you do have Big Brother or this is Big Pastor

00:18:44Big Brother Freeman and you do have the Thought Police they control the input to

00:18:50all your information now I know it's not on a governmental level but maybe it's

00:18:57even worse when it's on a personal and religious level because people follow a

00:19:04religious leader probably way more diligently than they would a political

00:19:11leader I mean they follow David Koresh to his death they follow Jim Jones to

00:19:17his death to their death they many of them followed Hobart Freeman to their

00:19:22death so I think George Orwell was on to something he just neglected a chapter on

00:19:30religious cults and then a postscript on Hobart Freeman so I've got an article

00:19:38here that I did not mention last time John that I will just quickly show the

00:19:44Warsaw Times Union on November the 11th 1984 actually did a pretty big article

00:19:53covering the information they that their reporter had just received and that was

00:19:58on Bruce Kinsey's exit from Faith Assembly and I have said in our earlier

00:20:03discussions about Bruce the thing that I always thought that made Bruce a little

00:20:09different and maybe put him in a position to do what he did is that he

00:20:14was a little older than some of the other young ministers he had been a

00:20:20sergeant in the Marine Corps did a tour of duty in Vietnam back in the late 1960

00:20:25so he had some street sense to him he had some independence he had a backbone

00:20:30the other ministers just worshipped at Freeman's altar and Bruce was cut from a

00:20:36little bit of a different cloth and I think that's because of his background

00:20:41but in any in any event you know things began to add up in Bruce's mind and he

00:20:46decided I don't think I can continue to follow this and so he did exit the

00:20:52church we talked about that before there was a screaming match between he

00:20:55and Hobart and and people have asked well was he kicked out or was he put out

00:21:00well it was probably 50-50 I mean let's be honest Bruce is not going to continue

00:21:05to sit there and listen to stuff he doesn't agree with and he's not going to

00:21:09sit there and have his father-in-law give another prophecy to him like we

00:21:14heard last time and prophesy to him from the pulpit and basically point him out

00:21:19and try to publicly shame him so Bruce is gonna leave but at the same time

00:21:24Hobart doesn't just want Bruce to leave and not be under some form of church

00:21:31discipline because Bruce may go out with some believability and then be able to

00:21:37take some people with him so he was excommunicated so you know you have both

00:21:43things going on he has put out but he leaves of his own accord you know it

00:21:49follows the pattern whenever when my family left my grandfather was the

00:21:54pastor and I did tell him that I was going to leave the church and go to

00:21:58another church we we went to a local Baptist Church as one of the first ones

00:22:03that first churches that we experienced afterwards and I'm not recommending

00:22:07anybody go to the Baptist Church unless you want to but anyway I informed

00:22:12grandpa is going to another church and in most churches that aren't a cult

00:22:16church they would be well that that sounds great thank you I hope you I hope

00:22:21you and you have a you know closer walk with the Lord or whatever your pastor

00:22:27might say to you but for me it was I'm going to come down very hard against you

00:22:33and your family John I need to send we're gonna send a few of the brethren

00:22:39to your house and we're gonna talk to you and no I'm not gonna let him do this

00:22:45to me yeah I knew at that point this this was a cult and they're trying to

00:22:50strong-arm me and so my response was well you can come if you want but you're

00:22:55not going to be invited in the house and you know it was not an easy conversation

00:23:01I'll admit that but they placed the equivalent of a South African hex on me

00:23:08and me and my family and condemned us to death and it really bothered my wife and

00:23:14I told her you know they can chant curses all they want and it it would

00:23:21have less effect on us than if they were to come and spray our windows with a

00:23:24water hose from the outside yeah I'd rather they not do it but it's it's not

00:23:29going to affect us and that's the way these cults are they they cannot let you

00:23:34go without having everybody know that you have fallen from grace because

00:23:41otherwise other people might wake up and say hey if they can leave I can too

00:23:44and it's part of the mental barriers that keep you in a cult there are no in

00:23:50many of these cults there are no physical walls but the walls are in your

00:23:54head and that's how they do it yeah and have you ever heard of any other church

00:23:58that operates like this John except a cult church I mean if you want to leave

00:24:03that Baptist Church the one that you started to attend I take it you don't

00:24:08attend there anymore did anybody bother you when you decided to leave you know

00:24:12we were because of that our first cult experience we were so terrified when we

00:24:19decided to leave the Baptist Church and we I thought they're gonna bring down

00:24:23the wrath of curses on us on our heads I thought that's the way churches behave

00:24:28right and they didn't and it was surprising they were loving kind and

00:24:33yeah no good go try out a few and you're always welcome back if you want to come

00:24:38back John it was that kind of thing you know and many of the people who we in

00:24:43fact I think my wife just met with one of the ladies maybe two nights ago many

00:24:48of the people that we the friends that we made in that church we're still

00:24:51friends with and I still meet with from time to time where whereas in the cult

00:24:56they will not meet you for nothing man they cut you off all of the people that

00:25:02I grew up and I called my best friends not a single one of them has ever

00:25:06reached out yeah you're exactly right that is the mode of operation the young

00:25:12ministers at Faith Assembly years ago and to this day you know I would reach

00:25:17out to them because I would want to continue to have a conversation

00:25:21conversation slash debate slash argument slash defense whatever you want to call

00:25:26it I'm not afraid to be involved in that I've always said either I'll be proven

00:25:31right or proven wrong and in both cases I'm a winner if I'm proven right that

00:25:35means I'm right if I'm proven wrong that means now I know what's right and I

00:25:39get to change so in either way you know I'm proven to be a winner in that but

00:25:44boy if you ever do you ever come against the leader I mean you are taboo your

00:25:49your name glow goes literally on the blacklist I think there was a TV program

00:25:54a while ago called the blacklist your name definitely goes on the blacklist

00:25:58and these people are they're such weasels they are such cowards they don't

00:26:09even have the decency to even respond to you it's like you people must have been

00:26:14raised in a barn by a pack of wolves that your parents taught you no more

00:26:20manners than when someone communicates you reach out and say look thank you for

00:26:25the communication but I choose not to respond they just go into this giant

00:26:31black hole where you can't find them but the thing is if you would ever say

00:26:36something positive oh they just rush back into your presence again if I would

00:26:41ever call Hobart or write him a letter and say anything positive oh I'd get an

00:26:48immediate response if I had any question any question at all minor major in

00:26:55between and definitely if I had anything of a critical nature to say oh no

00:27:00response no response and that just shows me there's basic cowardice involved here

00:27:05yeah you know the blacklist it's one of my favorite shows of all time I love

00:27:09that show and it's it's kind of odd because it's like if if you're a

00:27:15Superman fan it's like watching a show about Lex Luthor and he's the you know

00:27:20the main character in the show but even in the blacklist these are hardened

00:27:25criminals the worst criminals of the world right the world's top hundred

00:27:29worst criminals but even among them they have this code of morals where there is

00:27:33a level of respect between criminal and criminal and even somewhat between

00:27:38criminal and the law there is a there's a level of respect there in the cults

00:27:43there is none it's it's hard to say it because I mean these are not good people

00:27:48in the blacklist but they have more morals about them in many ways than the

00:27:53cult members and that was Megan Megan Boone and who was the other star I'm

00:27:59trying to think as you're talking about the blacklist who was the male it was

00:28:03James Spader oh James Spader yeah he's one of my favorite actors too there was

00:28:08a show called Stargate back in it might have also been in 80 80s or maybe early

00:28:1390s but he was in Stargate and when I saw him on blacklist he he's the only

00:28:19reason I watched the show and I ended up really liking it well to your point

00:28:23about those hardened criminals in the blacklist that I think all of us on any

00:28:28side of a theological or biblical or just plain intellectual issue should be

00:28:35able to converse over it you know if you can't if you've got this spooky spooky

00:28:41mentality which is definitely what they had you know you can't do anything you

00:28:45might pick up a demon well look that's not how demons get in people you don't

00:28:49pick them up accidentally you know by having a conversation with someone you

00:28:53know can't pick up a spirit that was a favorite phrase of theirs don't talk to

00:28:58him or don't go there don't read that you know don't eat that you might pick

00:29:02up a demon oh come on you know that that is you know dark age theology that

00:29:08doesn't have anything to do with the Bible yeah we were branded also with the

00:29:13demon that you can accidentally pick up and it suddenly struck me after having

00:29:18escaped for a few years man the god of the cult was so incredibly weak that he

00:29:23couldn't protect you from a demon from talking to somebody and you know it's

00:29:28just a different God it's not the God of the Bible yeah for sure so whenever

00:29:33Bruce decided to make this leave it's really interesting that Bruce and I were

00:29:39actually in communication with each other he had heard the no hunting thing

00:29:44we looked at that before where on comfort for troubled times taught on

00:29:50October the 17th 1984 Hobart said I believe and I'm gonna state my belief

00:29:57but we don't have laws or rules that overcomers will get to the place where

00:30:02they won't want to kill anything overcomers was just his terminology for

00:30:07their little special group he said because you don't need to I'm not

00:30:13talking about going fishing for 50 you see you'll have to put it all together

00:30:19but I don't believe overcomers are gonna have anything to do with weapons of

00:30:23death whether guns or bows or errors or whatever times too short for you to try

00:30:28to debate that that's a direct quote from that message and that is a and if

00:30:33people wonder people have asked me how do you have these quotes I mean there it

00:30:36is typed up on a piece of paper from 40 years ago I didn't do any of this

00:30:41recently when I heard these messages coming out back then I was so shocked

00:30:47and stunned by it because I can remember 10 years previous to that you know

00:30:53Hobart's teachings did not go down these paths he had enough of his issues

00:30:58for sure he was in error on multiple things but there was um I mean we've all

00:31:03been in error in our life and there was a happiness to the air they were in it

00:31:07was not life and death and you better obey me or else and that's where we

00:31:11ended up in in 1984 but John in this very statement I'm gonna state my

00:31:16belief but we don't have laws or rules I've said so many times as soon as a

00:31:21cult leader states his belief that becomes the law and the rule and they

00:31:25did have their laws and rules they had a sheet of ten requirements for fellowship

00:31:31at Faith Assembly and some of those things in the ten requirements where you

00:31:35had to hear certain tapes and read certain books of Hobart Freeman how about

00:31:40just let's let's congregate around the truth of Scripture and and how is it

00:31:45that this was a group who was so opposed to denominationalism and creeds

00:31:51and anything that was outside of the Bible but I find this little group

00:31:56became its own denomination they had their own creed they had their own Pope

00:32:01they had their own Cardinals they had their own bylaws they had their own

00:32:06unspoken rules but they actually had ten things on their list of requirements to

00:32:13be in fellowship with Faith Assembly and I just can't imagine any of the

00:32:18churches in the first century having their own list of what you must do

00:32:22before you can be a member here what the early Christians did is they just wanted

00:32:27to gather around their mutual love of God and love of Scripture and progress

00:32:35forward and do the best that they can but he said oh we don't have any laws or

00:32:38rules but I'm gonna state my belief that if you're gonna be an overcomer you're

00:32:43not gonna want to kill anything but as he's saying that you know and we can all

00:32:49think and you got to put yourself in the this was brand this was news this was

00:32:54hot off the press to people sitting in those hard metal chairs at Faith

00:32:59Assembly that day he had not said this before and they're hearing this and I

00:33:04mean it's only a paragraph long and then he goes on but it did become the

00:33:08law of the church you know if you say it's not a law or not a rule what do you

00:33:14think would have happened a month later had a group of ministers got together

00:33:18and so let's go on a hunting trip and had that gotten back to Hobart Freeman

00:33:22you know what do you think would have happened so don't tell me this wasn't a

00:33:27law or rule and that's exactly what cult members they well Hobart never said that

00:33:33he most definitely did say this and he knew what he meant when he said it and

00:33:39he knew the outcome of it that it was going to be a dividing line between

00:33:44people who were going to continue to follow him and people that he was going

00:33:49to consider as the chaff of the wind that he would be able to drive away and

00:33:54he knew Bruce was a hunter he knew Bruce was a big-time hunter Bruce loved to

00:33:59hunt and fish so this was gonna be one of those other things that would stick

00:34:04in the crawl of Bruce Kinsey that Bruce would you know just not be able to deal

00:34:10with but as Hobart is saying no hunting you know I mean I thought of this 40

00:34:17years ago and his mind is flashing through his mind okay what happened

00:34:22after Noah's Flood God gave dominion over the earth to mankind where they

00:34:28were now allowed to you know kill and eat and how many times were animals

00:34:33killed killed hundreds of thousands sacrificed in the temple and and kill

00:34:39for food so that's going through his mind as he's saying this I just know him

00:34:45and so he's trying to think well in the New Testament can I think of any

00:34:50Christian killing an animal no but I can think of a group of fishermen so I

00:34:55better make an exception here where he then goes on to say I'm not talking

00:35:01about going fishing for fish to eat well is that killing an animal is there

00:35:07anything more cruel than pulling a fish out of the water who has to breathe

00:35:12underwater and throwing me in in a cooler on your boat and having him

00:35:17suffocate you know is I mean come on but I know the the thought pattern of a cult

00:35:24leader they try so hard to cover all their bases so no one can trip him up on

00:35:31anything and he knew that post post-resurrection Jesus in John 21 met

00:35:39the disciples on this shore of the Sea of Galilee after they had fished all

00:35:43night and didn't catch a thing and what did he say just throw your net on the

00:35:47other side of the boat and they brought back so many fish it about broke the net

00:35:52have you ever wondered how the Pentecostal movement started or how the

00:35:56progression of modern Pentecostal ism transition through the latter rain

00:36:00charismatic and other fringe movements into the New Apostolic Reformation you

00:36:06can learn this and more on William Branham historical researches website

00:36:10William dash Branham org on the books page of the website you can find the

00:36:16compiled research of John Collins Charles Paisley Stephen Montgomery John

00:36:21McKinnon and others with links to the paper audio and digital versions of each

00:36:26book you can also find resources and documentation on various people and

00:36:31topics related to those movements if you want to contribute to the cause you can

00:36:36support the podcast by clicking the contribute button at the top and as

00:36:40always be sure to LIKE and subscribe to the audio or video version that you're

00:36:45listening to or watching on behalf of William Branham historical research we

00:36:49want to thank you for your support you know there are many things that we

00:36:53learned in the Baptist Church even though it's not a church that we still

00:36:58attend and we've tried other churches after that that we have chosen not to

00:37:04attend we're actually going to a different one altogether but even you

00:37:08can learn something at all of them and when we were in the cult we were so

00:37:12legalistic that we literally had a religion where we thought we could save

00:37:18ourselves by the things that we do and if you understand the concepts of the

00:37:22New Testament it's exactly backwards it's not about what you do to save

00:37:27yourself it's about what Jesus did one of the things I learned in the Baptist

00:37:32Church that wasn't taught in the cults were was the concept of the covenants

00:37:38which sounds odd to any Christian who's listening who's never been in this kind

00:37:42of thing but there wasn't really a clear ending of the Old Covenant and in

00:37:47entering into the New Covenant it was this blend this weird mixture of both

00:37:51where yes Jesus died to save us and we must do all of these rules some of which

00:37:58were in under the Old Covenant and others we ignore that we're in the Old

00:38:02Covenant and if we didn't follow those rules then Jesus the the salvation that

00:38:07he gave us when he died on the cross is ineffective because we broke the rules

00:38:11that's really in its essence that's the way the cult operates and so I was

00:38:18discussing one day all of the rules that we had with the ministers and they were

00:38:22just they were laughing at me man some of the things were just really really

00:38:25stupid and I got to thinking about I run all these support groups and I was

00:38:32asking other people if they had encountered ministers or friends who

00:38:39came in contact with some of the rules that they had and did they laugh and

00:38:44suddenly I got this response everybody's talking about rules that I didn't know

00:38:48were rules and I thought well what is this and come to find out because it is

00:38:54a religion where you save yourself by the works that you do well if you're not

00:38:59saving yourself you add new works to it and it grows and it grows and it grows

00:39:05and so the way that these churches and the cult were the way that they were

00:39:11operating was if they couldn't get themselves to a higher spiritual plane

00:39:16by the same rules that the main sect did the splinter group sects would go

00:39:20through all of the recordings and transcripts of Branham and pick out

00:39:25additional rules that they found and like you said with Hobart they weren't

00:39:29really rules they were opinions I don't like this or this thing I won't let my

00:39:35family do this it was all all of opinions and so one day I compiled this

00:39:40list and if you go to my website and you type in rules you'll get a good kick out

00:39:44of it because some of the things are very similar like no watching television

00:39:48no newspapers that kind of thing movies but it gets into things like no blue

00:39:55suede shoot no suede shoes in general no suede shoes for the men because Elvis

00:39:59had blue suede shoes and there he's gonna condemn from suede shoes to

00:40:04booster bras to things that you just would never there's there are also

00:40:09comments in here that he would condemn the women for their washing machines

00:40:13because you know back in my day the women didn't need these fancy washing

00:40:17machines but now they got to save time so that they can go out and get a job

00:40:21and enter the workplace he's just ranting you know and granted my family

00:40:28had a washing machine and I assume I don't know but I assume many of the

00:40:32women in the main sect wore the booster bras but there were sects of the message

00:40:37that that did not and things I mean all the way down to you can't play

00:40:42basketball or you can't swim this kind of thing the rules are just ridiculous

00:40:46and in the end I go back to my previous comment if the God is so powerless that

00:40:52he can't save you if your women are wearing a booster bra you're probably in

00:40:58the wrong religion man John I know you haven't even listened to dr. Freeman's

00:41:03tapes and weren't a follower of his but if Hobart Freeman's followers would just

00:41:07take all of what you just just said and just run it through the Freeman filter

00:41:13they come up with the identical same stuff on one of Hobart's later messages

00:41:18he outlawed competitive sports he said all competitive sports are wrong he on

00:41:24another message he outlawed using abbreviations like you couldn't say Ag

00:41:29Department he said that is the hippie culture and he called it the hip culture

00:41:35which actually is itself an abbreviation of the hippie culture he kept saying

00:41:39that that's too hip and I'd say well that's an abbreviation but you couldn't

00:41:43say you know you couldn't say the Fed you couldn't say a promo I this is a

00:41:51promo you couldn't say a condo you you couldn't say I went and bought me a

00:41:55condo you had to say a condominium now did he actually teach you couldn't say

00:42:00those yes he actually did if you listen to the message and I can dig it out from

00:42:04these files but I won't take the time to now he said that Christians will not do

00:42:12that and I can fill in the rest of the sentence so if you do them what are you

00:42:17not you're not a Christian yes those exact same things in the washing machine

00:42:22he did not want box-mix cakes he did not want anything instant he wanted the

00:42:28women he felt that the wimp the reason that women have smaller feet than men is

00:42:33so they could stand up at the kitchen counter all day and he wanted the women

00:42:38in the kitchen slaving away and making they know he didn't want them out of the

00:42:43home working I mean he didn't really want anybody let's face it John to have

00:42:47any education because as soon as you have any education you might get smart

00:42:51enough to challenge him so going back to this quote on honey I take things like

00:42:56this and I just dissect them sentence by sentence and it's not reading between

00:43:02the lines it's taking exactly what he said I'm not talking about fishing for

00:43:07fish to eat well you just said you can't kill anything and now you're gonna allow

00:43:12a type of killing of an animal that has some kind of feeling and you're gonna

00:43:17suffocate that animal and that's worse than you know putting a high-powered

00:43:22bullet through a deer's double lung then he says you see you'll have to put it

00:43:29all together you'll have to put it all it's so confusing he doesn't want to be

00:43:36liable for his statement he doesn't want to be responsible what someone should

00:43:41ask him is would you please now that you said no hunting and then you said

00:43:46I'm not talking about fishing would you please explain the difference we need

00:43:50all of that analyzed we need all of that explained you can hunt but you can't go

00:43:55fishing see you'll have to put it all together he's putting all the burden of

00:44:00his confusion upon the people you know he's putting the burden of his

00:44:07contradictory statements upon the people rather than saying hey I just

00:44:11made a pretty dumb couple of sentences in this paragraph and I need to try to

00:44:17dig myself out of the hole then he goes on to say I don't believe overcomers

00:44:21are gonna have anything to do with weapons of death whether guns or bows

00:44:24or errors or whatever times too short for you to try to debate that that's a

00:44:32standard cult statement there it's the shortness of the hour time is too short

00:44:38you don't even have enough time well we're 40 years later Hobart we've had

00:44:4540 years to debate we have plenty of time what they mean is they don't want

00:44:50you to come up there and question them because they don't have any answers

00:44:52people are gonna say give me chapter and verse Hobart was always about chapter

00:44:56and verse give me a proof text for that well he doesn't have any and he knows he

00:45:01doesn't have any so he shields himself because he's a coward he's an

00:45:05intellectual coward he shields himself he protects himself from anybody being

00:45:11able to come up and challenge him over that yeah and Branham ism it was the

00:45:16message of the hour and I'm told that in the International House of Prayer it was

00:45:21the urgency of the hour it's always something of the hour it's always got to

00:45:25be we're at the last minute one of the favorite favorite quotes that I've heard

00:45:31from many of these guys is the Bible says no man knows the day nor the hour

00:45:35but it doesn't say anything about the minute they'll try to twist things like

00:45:42that but in the end what it is it's a it's a message of fear the message of

00:45:47the hour is a message of fear and we want to put you in a fear that the

00:45:51world's about to end and we want to tell you that you are unprepared for it

00:45:56because you're the God is too weak to save you you have to go through me your

00:46:01spiritual leader to bring you closer to God so that you can make it otherwise

00:46:06you're doomed to hell and that's really in its essence that's what these cults

00:46:10are doing yeah you're right John this article on Bruce leaving just gave a

00:46:16list even the reporter was able to get to the bottom of why Bruce was leaving

00:46:21and he just gave a list and this is fairly accurate he said Kenzie left

00:46:26because he did not believe that doctors are always the bad guy that they're a

00:46:30part of a cult he left because he disagreed with Hobart's teaching on

00:46:35demonic deliverance they were going back years in their life trying to find

00:46:39what's causing the problems in our lives and the problems in our church they had

00:46:45not been able to solve why they were experiencing as many problems rather

00:46:51than look in common sense areas they look behind every bush and under every

00:46:55rock to try to find the demon and Bruce didn't think that was valid neither did

00:46:59I women were not allowed to wear makeup or worldly quote-unquote clothes and of

00:47:06course what's worldly and what's not is all dependent on Hobart Freeman's

00:47:11definition of that women were not allowed to wear strapless dresses or

00:47:16bathing suits or pants they were not allowed to wear a certain brand of

00:47:23tennis shoes in the marital relationship there were no foreplay was allowed no

00:47:30birth control was allowed Hobart taught that the purpose of the act of marriage

00:47:37was procreation and that was it and we're talking about an old guy who's way

00:47:42past his prime and I can't imagine the damage seriously John that was done in

00:47:48the marriages of the young people in their 20s and 30s in this church I just

00:47:54can't imagine the arguments in families the questions the husband retreating to

00:48:01one room and the wife to another room because this old fart who's way past

00:48:07his prime who is just a killjoy you know he's a religious Scrooge is what he

00:48:12really was he wasn't having any fun in life and he wanted to make sure nobody

00:48:16else was you know how they've always people have defined the Puritans that

00:48:20whole Puritan movement they said the the Puritan movement what a Puritan was with

00:48:25someone who was afraid someone might be having some fun somewhere in their life

00:48:32that's what Puritanism was and I see a lot of this in Hobart Freeman I mean

00:48:39they so many things were outlawed John you just you just really had to spend

00:48:44your time listening and re-listening to his cassette messages praying fasting

00:48:52and there's so much more you should leaving the tapes out of his you should

00:48:58pray you should fast you should go to church you should worship I mean those

00:49:02are all biblical things to do but there is so much in addition to that that not

00:49:08only should we do but we're allowed by God to do look at the Prophet Daniel who

00:49:14was one of the most holy most righteous most consecrated men in the Old

00:49:19Testament and he was also second in control of the government of Babylon

00:49:24under King Nebuchadnezzar he had all kinds of responsibilities that were

00:49:30required of him and and those responsibilities and the rest of his

00:49:35life we've got 24 hours all of us each day the rest of his life the rest of his

00:49:41day that he got to live beyond what his government responsibilities were then he

00:49:49spent it in prayer and worship and when he wasn't in prayer and worship he was

00:49:55living the rest of his life so I'm saying that to say so many people were

00:49:59just robbed of a particular educational path that they wanted to take and

00:50:06there was nothing sinful in it it could have been medicine it could have been

00:50:10physics it could have been astronomy who knows it could have been electronic

00:50:14theory and they were robbed of that because somehow that's secular or that's

00:50:21not pleasing to God or Jesus is coming back any day why do you need an

00:50:26education like that and some of the people that I talked to just in the last

00:50:30few days one of them particular bemoaned the fact said we had we had no savings

00:50:36we weren't preparing for the future this man told me we did not actually get to

00:50:41the point in our marital life and journey to start being able to put money

00:50:48away so that we can retire until he was 55 years old he's he's older now and he

00:50:55said thank God by God's grace and mercy my wife and I are both retired so even

00:51:00though we started late we had enough time but they had they operated a more

00:51:05normal existence they'd be multi-millionaires now I'm getting to go

00:51:10to Israel and see the Holy Land every other year or twice every year that's

00:51:16what these cults have done to people and it's just it's why I continue to have

00:51:22this burden to talk against it and I and I hope John that you'll continue to have

00:51:28this burden although I worry about you because you go at it non-stop I'm afraid

00:51:34you're gonna burn out brother before it's all said and done people been

00:51:39telling me that for almost 10 years now you're gonna burn oh well that's good

00:51:42news you know so many things you mentioned you're basically mentioning

00:51:48Branham ism 2.0 and there's so many stories I especially around the marital

00:51:53stuff I'll never forget this this one rather gruff man stood up after church

00:52:00and he he was talking all the other guys and he says I don't care what he says

00:52:06that preacher can stay out of my bedroom he was not gonna let not gonna

00:52:11let all of that ruin but they impacted every aspect of our lives and I've got

00:52:17funny stories that you know all of these things it's funny you can look back and

00:52:23you can laugh at it now but it's really sad when you sum all of the stories

00:52:28because like you said they're people that don't prepare they're people that

00:52:32miss out on just life in general they the cult has robbed them of life and I

00:52:38know a lot of people myself included were way behind the eight ball in trying

00:52:44to prepare for the future because especially with the the economy the way

00:52:50it is it's really hard to put back right now and when you haven't put back for I

00:52:54was 30 what was a 39 40 years old before I even began to have a dollar put back

00:53:01for retirement so that's that's the mentality of somebody who's in these

00:53:06doomsday cults you don't prepare for the future because there's not supposed it's

00:53:10a 1984 future there's not supposed to be a future and it's when you when you look

00:53:16at it from the outside looking in all you see among all of these ministers

00:53:22that are doing this really is a bunch of thieves I agree John and I pray God

00:53:27blesses you and that you live long enough that you will have plenty and

00:53:32good health live long enough that you'll have plenty of money put away but you're

00:53:37right I've heard people say it really took away their whole life their normal

00:53:43existence of life and they have been fighting and struggling to get it back

00:53:49and and so this fall of 1984 was a dark time it was scary it was oppressive the

00:53:57for the people who really were at the mother church in Wilmot the walls were

00:54:03closing in they were nervous they were suspicious I even talked to Jeff Barnett

00:54:08one of the big-time ministers down there last year Jeff Barnett and I had a

00:54:12conversation on the phone I can't get Jeff to respond to me anymore

00:54:16maybe it's because of these podcasts but we were talking about the closing days

00:54:22of Freeman's life and he said that they had lost a lot of people he said you

00:54:28know we were down to about 1,500 people in the big building and the big building

00:54:31I mean I don't know what the what the high was of attendance in the low 2000s

00:54:372,200 2,300 on a good Sunday maybe I don't know but they were down to 1,500

00:54:44people and Hobart himself he was angry you can hear it on the later tapes he

00:54:50was bitter he had a sour attitude to some of it as Jerry Irvin said may have

00:54:54been due to the fact he simply wasn't feeling well he was sick Bruce leaving

00:55:00didn't help any I think he was frustrated over the number of people

00:55:05leaving some of the people saw the handwriting on the wall some of the

00:55:09people just realized I if I stay on what Hobart called the discipleship he had

00:55:16this famous tape abandon ship or discipleship and I think they realized

00:55:22if I stay on this stupid analogy that Hobart was talking about stay on the

00:55:28discipleship I'm going down with the ship and you know the ship went down

00:55:32Hobart went down and the ship went down that whole message was talking about how

00:55:37we're on the discipleship and you better not jump off you better not abandon ship

00:55:42because if you jump off you'll just drown but if you stay on the discipleship

00:55:48we're gonna make it into port together that didn't happen that ship sank with

00:55:54its captain on board and people were deciding to jump off of the discipleship

00:56:00and so when people decided to leave and I'm sure you can attest to this John in

00:56:06your experience with your background then what happens from the pulpit is the

00:56:10people that are leaving are mocked they the Hobart would mock the people he

00:56:15would use phrases like they're biting the hand that fed them that was a

00:56:20favorite one they are criticizing what they once praised well yes they are

00:56:27because one of two things either you've changed your message you definitely did

00:56:31that I've given examples or the people woke up so do you have right a right to

00:56:38criticize once you once praise of course you do it's just saying you've

00:56:42come to your senses now or it's saying that the leader is now preaching

00:56:47something that he didn't preach before so but rather than deal with that Hobart

00:56:52just criticized his critics he never dealt with the issues he did a series in

00:56:57Galatians called I think it was called gleaning in Galatians Hobart got real

00:57:02cute at the end of his life rather than just give us a study of the Bible it had

00:57:06to be this alliteration preaching from the prophets the judgments of Jude

00:57:12gleanings from Galatians exhortations from Exodus those were thought-out

00:57:18well-prepared copious notes where Hobart had all of this stuff his jokes are

00:57:24written out the statistics are written out there is no quote anointing unquote

00:57:30on any of that stuff it was stuff well thought out he was trying to be cute he

00:57:35had run out of things to say and in his gleanings on Galatians people remember

00:57:41this he said if you leave Faith Assembly you can't be saved and is that any

00:57:48difference in Roman Catholicism I mean you can't let you can't be saved if you

00:57:52leave the Catholic Church you but can you be saved if you leave a normal

00:57:57church and go to another church of will of course you can be being in that

00:58:02a church any church isn't what saves you it's your relationship with the Lord

00:58:08Jesus Christ but that was his way to keep people in fear and it's just abuse

00:58:13of power this insidious abuse of power you know if the people want to go just

00:58:21let them go and let them go with freedom and let them go with love and send them

00:58:27off with a blessing there's no way a cult leader is going to do that they're

00:58:31going to track down any kind of rumor that someone might have said something

00:58:36against the pastor someone might be and considering leaving they're gonna track

00:58:41those rumors down and grill those people you know it's it's okay to differ in

00:58:47theory but it's never okay to actually differ in practice and then what he

00:58:52would do if he someone had come to him and said brother Freeman we think we're

00:58:57gonna leave you know he would be rude to them number one most wouldn't even go

00:59:01to and they would just leave and he would hear about it secondhand and then

00:59:06he'd use a public the pulpit as public shame and he would shame he did it with

00:59:12Bruce you know he prophesied to Bruce to shame him out of the church a lady the

00:59:18other day told me the story of she said one time she said I'll never forget this

00:59:23here we are sitting in church Hobart's preaching and all of a sudden he looks

00:59:27over to his right and he points to this woman and he calls her a lesbian he said

00:59:36the Lord has shown me that you're a lesbian and I want you out of this

00:59:41building and that lady had to get up and leave well the interesting story about

00:59:46that lady is she was a a fur coat dealer she dealt with fur coats and many of the

00:59:53minister's wives had bought owned a fur coat from this lady so you know what

01:00:01they had to do with their fur coats yeah you had to burn it you had to burn them

01:00:06that's that's you know that's opening the door for demonic oppression or

01:00:11possession so it's back to this bully pulpit thing and I just can't imagine a

01:00:17minister standing up at a pulpit telling a woman that she's a lesbian and kicking

01:00:22her out and then the repercussions of that because the other women had bought

01:00:27fur coats from her then they had to go home and couldn't sell them get some

01:00:32good money out of them they had to go home and burn their fur coats let me

01:00:37make one other comment that just is so glaring to my in my mind John over that

01:00:42whole thing when I go back because we always want to trace things back to what

01:00:48did the New Testament teach what did the Apostles teach here's what Paul taught

01:00:52on things like that Paul the Christian the Apostle who himself had been bound

01:00:59up in prior conversion days in all of the technicalities of the pharisaic

01:01:06religion he was well aware of all of the do's and don'ts and Jesus had talked

01:01:10about it he said the Pharisees are willing to tithe of the ten seeds of

01:01:15this little spice or plant they'll bring one seed out you'll tithe mint and anise

01:01:22and cumin but you will omit the weightier matters of the law judgment

01:01:27mercy and faith that's the way Jesus approached that Paul was a free man so

01:01:33when they would bring a piece of meat to Paul's plate Paul didn't care where that

01:01:40came from and there were other people that would say don't you know that that

01:01:45came from an animal that was sacrificed to the goddess Aphrodite or or Diana

01:01:52Paul couldn't have cared less if Aphrodite doesn't want it I want it I'm

01:01:57hungry now Paul knew there's no way to pick up a demon and listen to what we're

01:02:04saying John this was meat Paul said in 1st Corinthians that was actually had

01:02:09been sacrificed to a a pagan idol but Paul said an idol is nothing our God

01:02:16made he created the heavens and the earth an idol is just a stone statue a

01:02:20piece of wood means nothing to me if the idol or the God or God is behind it's

01:02:25not hungry enough to eat the food I am I'll take it you know if any if there's

01:02:30any way that you could pick up a demon quote-unquote I would say that would be

01:02:35the way you would pick up a demon wearing a fur coat that you bought from

01:02:39a woman who was or was not a lesbian I don't know wearing a wearing a fur coat

01:02:45that you got from her I mean those ladies just lost a probably a really

01:02:50nice coat but that's the way you that's the way they roll in a religious cult it

01:02:56really comes down to this if you go to a real church a non cult church they lift

01:03:02you up and they prepare you and if you go to a cult church they pull you down

01:03:06and add all of these weights to your shoulders and anything they can do to

01:03:10keep you burdened they want to keep you burdened and I went to when we went to

01:03:15our first new church it was the Baptist Church I remember walking out and they

01:03:19were the people were saying things like wow I feel so refreshed today and I was

01:03:25shocked like I looked around this is just really odd because in the cult

01:03:28churches I actually remember a scene where we walked out of the church

01:03:33building this was down in the south and this man walked out and all the men kind

01:03:37of gathered over here and the women over there which was kind of odd but the one

01:03:41of the man walked out and he said man we sure got a beating in there today

01:03:45didn't we brethren and that's the that's the difference between these things man

01:03:51and once you experience the the burdens being lifted you'll never go back that's

01:03:57just the way it is but well this is incredibly fun we um we've covered a

01:04:02lot of things that are still we were enter into these things that are so

01:04:06similar between the two religions and you know you can tell that it was a

01:04:11splinter of the same trunk that kept splintering over and over and continues

01:04:16even still today to splinter but thank you for doing this I enjoyed it as

01:04:21always it's a lot of fun well if you've enjoyed our show and you want more

01:04:25information you can check us out on the web you can find us at William dash

01:04:28Branham org for more about the dark side of the n-a-r read weaponized religion

01:04:34from Christian identity to the n-a-r available on Amazon Kindle and soon

01:04:39audible

01:05:25you

Faith Assembly: A 1984 Dystopian Christian Faith - Episode 205 Branham Research Podcast

Category

Transcript

Recommended