Patriots Brandon Aiyuk intel, Pats-Panthers and Hunter Henry Interview | Pats Interference
Before an exclusive interview with Patriots tight end Hunter Henry, Andrew shares what he knows about the team's failed pursuit of Brandon Aiyuk and welcomes NBC Sports Boston's Tom E. Curran to the show. Together, they break down what went wrong with the Pats' pursuit, what it says about the state of the team and what they want to see from Drake Maye in Thursday's preseason opener versus Carolina.
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SportsTranscript
00:00Alright, it is Wednesday morning, and I don't know where you are watching or listening to
00:18this.
00:19I don't know who you are.
00:20I don't know when it is.
00:21Okay, it is Wednesday morning, and I don't know who you are, how you're listening or
00:28watching to this, or when you're listening or watching to this.
00:31But I bet you're a little bummed out right now, because we were all taken for a nice
00:35little ride over the last 36 hours.
00:37The Patriots could get Brandon Aiyuk.
00:39The Patriots have an agreed upon trade, a framework to get Brandon Aiyuk.
00:43The Patriots are ready to give a bag to Brandon Aiyuk, and Brandon Aiyuk goes, eh, no thanks.
00:51And here we are, Wednesday morning, the Patriots pulling out, quote unquote, 12 hours ago in
00:55a way that, look, I've been there.
00:57You go out often enough as a single person, you've been there too.
00:59You approach someone, things don't go well, I didn't really want to talk to them anyway.
01:03That's what the Patriots are, the good friend, love interest, and the rom-com who gets overlooked
01:08the entire movie, and that the girl looks to at the end and realizes you've been here
01:12all along, and then still chooses the bad boy.
01:15Who is that bad boy?
01:16I don't know, it could be the Steelers, it could be the Browns, he could go back to the
01:19Niners.
01:20But the bottom line is this, the Patriots whiffed on Brandon Aiyuk, and frankly, I don't
01:24think it's their fault.
01:25I think they did everything right getting the Niners to agree to a framework, which
01:29I will tell you here with some intel before we get to a conversation with Tommy Curran
01:32of NBC Sports Boston about Aiyuk, Drake May, training camp in the preseason opener.
01:37We have a football game Thursday, by the way, and then an exclusive interview with Hunter
01:42Henry.
01:43I'm going to explain that a little bit more in a second.
01:45But for Aiyuk, this is what I've heard after making some calls and doing the best that
01:49I can to dig into this.
01:50Yes, the Patriots did have an agreed upon trade.
01:53First report about Matt Mayuka, NBC Sports Bay Area, then Mark Daniels and Matt Slive
01:57confirmed it.
01:58I confirmed the detail that Kendrick Bourne was in this trade package that the Niners
02:03agreed to.
02:04Okay, check.
02:05Patriots, as I heard scuttlebutt from other folks around the league, not hard reporting,
02:09but since confirmed by Mike Reese of ESPN, Patriots were willing to go north of $30 million
02:16per year.
02:17Now, average annual value is not everything when you're pitching a contract, guarantees
02:20are a big part of this conversation.
02:22But I would bet that they were not outside of the top 10 when it came to guarantees.
02:26So they were willing to give him a bag, seemingly a big check for Aiyuk too, given that the
02:31issue with the Niners, not this month, not last month, not even just four or five months,
02:36but going on close to a year has been, he wants more money and hasn't gotten it from
02:41them yet.
02:42So the Patriots say, we'll give you the money.
02:44And it's just not good enough.
02:45And the reason is, unlike most NFL trades, where all the power and all the leverage lies
02:51with the front office, right?
02:52The guys at the top, management, Aiyuk has a much bigger say in this trade than most
02:58players tend to, and especially non-quarterbacks, because he has one year left on his deal,
03:04right?
03:05And any team trading for him, giving up something similar with the Patriots would have done.
03:09Kendrick Bourne, likely around a second round pick, maybe a little bit more, but a ton of
03:12draft capital.
03:13And whatever else the Steelers or Browns might do, it's going to be a big haul.
03:17You're not doing that for one year.
03:18You want this guy locked in long-term.
03:21So that's why you have to make him a contract offer.
03:22And if he doesn't like it, Brandon Aiyuk, just like Kevin Durant, God knows how many
03:27times, just like James Harden, God knows how many times, all these disgruntled NBA stars
03:31who have the power in that league, if he doesn't want to go, he doesn't have to.
03:37And that's what happened here.
03:38Brandon Aiyuk cooled on the Patriots, as reported, again, NBC Sports, Bay Area, Matt Maioco,
03:4330-year reporter for the Niners, a trusted source, unlike some folks on Twitter who would
03:48love just more of your attention and likes so they can get more money.
03:52That's a whole separate conversation, but Aiyuk didn't want to come here.
03:56Patriots are not a destination.
03:57And Kern and I get into this a little bit later, but as far as the Patriots go, when
04:02it comes to satisfying the 49ers, making a competitive offer, if not the largest to Aiyuk,
04:07they did everything they could.
04:08They're just so far behind right now that as much as they know they need a receiver,
04:13as much as they continue pursuing them, we all remember the Calvin Ridley experience,
04:16they just can't get it done.
04:17And so they've got to move on.
04:19And I understand why everyone's going to be bummed.
04:21I would say it made the trade.
04:23It's a ton of draft capital.
04:24It's a monstrous contract.
04:25There was real risk in there going, OK, he walks in, knows he's valued more than everyone
04:29else on the roster.
04:30He gets to call his shots.
04:32He's only a 25-year-old guy, which is good and bad for your contract.
04:36And even take him to age 30 and would also be the length of Drake May's rookie contract.
04:41But it just didn't happen.
04:42And so the Patriots did everything they could.
04:44They've got to move on.
04:45We would love to hear from Elliott Wolfe soon about this, something he'll get into with
04:48Kern a little bit later.
04:50But that's where we are with the Aiyuk stuff.
04:52And they have been after him for months.
04:53So this was not new.
04:54It just came to the surface a little bit more when the Niners are going, OK, Aiyuk's got
04:59us not against the wall, but agitated, certainly.
05:02We're also dealing with Trent Williams.
05:03Oh, and by the way, Christian McCaffrey's hampered a little bit.
05:06We've got to do something here.
05:08And what their thing was to try to open up the market and let it be known, hey, these
05:11two places you seemingly don't want to go, and one in New England you don't, meaning
05:14Aiyuk, Cleveland and the Patriots, we've got deals with them.
05:18It's up to you.
05:19And now we know how Aiyuk felt.
05:20He didn't want to come here.
05:22And they've all got to move on.
05:23So in addition to a little bit of Aiyuk conversation, Tommy, Kern, and I get into Drake May, what
05:29we want to see from him Thursday against the Panthers, which is just going to be a
05:32preseason poop fest, if we're being honest.
05:35But if I'm also being completely honest, which we like to do here on the show, I'm very excited
05:40for you to see Drake May, because this way we can open up the conversation, we can level
05:44the playing field.
05:45It's not me relaying all my camp notes, which I love to do.
05:48Training camp is one of my favorite times of the year, but the discourse has gotten
05:51a little stale.
05:52And there's a lot of cherry picking from folks on radio and TV who aren't there every single
05:56day.
05:57So understandably, when you hear me say, I think Drake May's been a C or a C plus, you're
06:01like, well, I don't want to hear that.
06:03It stinks.
06:04No one likes a C or a C plus.
06:05Even a D would be more exciting.
06:07It would be depressing, but at least get you going a little bit more.
06:10What we see on Thursday is going to mean more than any single practice we've seen so far.
06:15Operationally, seeing schemes, a different talent level and roster in the Panthers, it's
06:20going to be important.
06:22But it's not going to be more important than the second preseason game and third preseason
06:24game.
06:26But not bigger than the ones that are still coming up.
06:28More Drake May.
06:29And then we're going to end, as I teased, an exclusive interview with Hunter Henry.
06:33Brand new segment.
06:34OK, right?
06:35A couple of weeks ago, I'm telling you, new guests, new segments, we're going to spice
06:38things up.
06:39This is the start of it.
06:40It's called the four minute drill, and this is how it's going to go every single week
06:43with the Patriots player.
06:45I start the clock standing with them.
06:47I alternate football and non-football questions, and they just can't run out the clock like
06:52you would in a four minute drill.
06:53And Hunter was awesome.
06:55And this is a goal of mine to get you to see them a little bit looser, shoulders dropped
07:00down, just who they are as dudes, as much as they are football players that you root
07:04for on Sundays.
07:05And the same goes for me.
07:06Like, I think we keep it pretty casual here on the podcast.
07:09You can tell, though sometimes my voice gets a little professional broadcastery.
07:13I don't want to do that.
07:14I want you to feel like you know me from listening to the show and doing these interviews.
07:19You also get to know how I speak with these players in the locker room every day, because
07:24the job of being a journalist and reporter is as much having the relationships to have
07:27a call at 1130 at night and get to know some intel like the Bourne stuff or the Patriots
07:32offer of being over $30 million per year for IUC.
07:35It's also just being able to hang and having chit chat and BS about whatever.
07:41So Hunter Henry's a guy I've done that with for years.
07:44I think you're really going to enjoy this segment.
07:46It was a good time with him, and that comes up at the end of the show, last thing before
07:48we get to Tommy Curran.
07:51It's been a while, guys.
07:53We need a new review, and I would just say if you like IUC intel, if you like conversations
07:59about Drake Mag, if you like exclusive interviews with Patriots players, I would love to hear
08:03from you, because the last one I think was brought by the Pony Express on Apple, Spotify.
08:08Help us grow.
08:10Support us so we can continue to support you and tell you more about the Patriots and bring
08:14you inside and do all these different things.
08:16Those really mean a lot.
08:17So if you have a second, and I know you do, this is always my pitch.
08:20You're listening.
08:21If you want to listen for a lot longer, leave a quick review on Apple, Spotify, drop a comment
08:26in the YouTube channel, and subscribe to my YouTube channel, at underscore Andrew Callahan.
08:31It is a huge, tangible help to us here on the show.
08:34Breaking news.
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09:54Okay, that's enough for me.
09:56Here comes Tommy Curran.
09:57Here comes Hunter Henry.
09:58We will be back at the end of the week, solo episode from me, breaking down all the film
10:03notes.
10:04Same old schedule, coming back up again, every single game broken down, and you will have
10:07it here on YouTube and everywhere else you get your podcasts.
10:10Without further ado, our guy, your friend, Tommy Curran from NBC Sports Boston.
10:14Hey, Tommy.
10:16Tommy, you there?
10:17Hold on.
10:18I got a call coming in.
10:19Yeah.
10:20No, it's the internet.
10:21Yeah.
10:22Everybody's using it.
10:23Yeah.
10:24You'll catch on.
10:25Yeah.
10:26I know.
10:27Gotta go.
10:28Drew!
10:29What's up, buddy?
10:30The old rotary phone to fire you up on a Wednesday morning.
10:33How we doing, pal?
10:34I'm doing all right.
10:35Look at this thing.
10:36I can't find a place for it.
10:37I don't know why I bought it at the antique store in the first place, but it doesn't go
10:42anywhere.
10:43It's sitting here as a big six-pound handle cradle telephone.
10:49It's a weapon.
10:50This is what it is.
10:51Okay.
10:52Let's get after it.
10:53For the audio folks, that not only is a rotary phone, but it has a block, a base that could
11:00count as if you added something to the game of Clue of weapons that they used in the parlor,
11:05you could hit someone over the head with that and do some damage.
11:10It looks like kind of a modernized rotary phone from the 40s or 50s when it was starting
11:15to move forward.
11:17It's not your wall rotary phone.
11:18It's not your desk rotary phone.
11:20It looks like it was probably pretty novel and ahead of its time in about 1950.
11:24Oh, good.
11:25Well, speaking of things that look like they would have been ahead of their time in 1950,
11:29the Patriots offense swung and missed on Brandon Iuk.
11:32It's funny, pal, because you and I did TV Monday night.
11:34I wasn't particularly thrilled with my appearance, but you were not there for the last segment.
11:38It's just me, Phil and Giles.
11:40News breaks that at the time felt big.
11:43Brandon Iuk, more likely to be traded than not.
11:46That was Monday night.
11:47Here we are Wednesday morning.
11:48We've had agreed upon trades that weren't done.
11:51We've had offers sent to Brandon Iuk.
11:54We've had his agent allowed to talk to all 31 teams and say, you can go get more offers
11:57if you want.
11:58Oh, except for, by the way, last night, Tuesday, the Patriots are out.
12:02They don't want to be used anymore.
12:04Your chief takeaway from the last 36 hours has been what?
12:10That the Patriots are a hard sell.
12:12The Patriots are a hard sell for any player who wants to pursue success immediately.
12:19And for a position like wide receiver that is so interdependent on so many things, whether
12:25it be coaching, play calling, quarterback, offensive line, the rest of the wide receivers,
12:32there's a big dice roll in coming to New England.
12:35And there's also uncertainty as to what this team's all about right now.
12:39And the Patriots have to answer those questions this year.
12:42Second receiver that has rebuffed them in this off season.
12:48And it shouldn't be surprising when you look at it from 30,000 feet, but when you look
12:53at it granularly, when you look at it up close, we ain't used to it.
13:01It was a destination.
13:04Now it's a stay away place.
13:07So that to me is my biggest takeaway.
13:09Just reemphasizes that no get rich quick schemes are going to help this team get better.
13:16They have to actually get better.
13:18Right.
13:19And are you made happier by this?
13:21Because you were against it.
13:22Phil and I got on you pretty good in that early edition on Monday.
13:25You're obviously good with it, but are you relieved?
13:27Yeah, I'm good with it.
13:29I mean, relieved.
13:30That's interesting.
13:31Mike Kavlik asked me yesterday about something relative to IUK when the Patriots were still
13:38in and he said, you know, you must be, you must be bummed out.
13:41Like, why?
13:42You know, they're getting closer with IUK.
13:45I'm like, Mike, get them, don't get them.
13:48It's like not going to impact me one way or the other.
13:50And honestly, I think that what ends up happening is when you're covering something, you have
13:56your initial inclinations as a analyst, even with fan hat on and how you think a team should
14:05be built.
14:06But once reality starts to sink in that this might happen, you're not going to sit there
14:11and go, oh, it shouldn't happen.
14:13You just start to move your mind forward.
14:16And as yesterday dawned, I was talking to Phil, Mike, you know, they have $40 million
14:21of cap space.
14:22They have $78 million of cap space next year.
14:25They haven't had a first-round pick work out at least since 2018.
14:30You never had to sign a second contract for Sony Michel, for Isaiah Wynn, for Nikhil Harry,
14:36for Mac Jones, certainly probably not for Cole Strange.
14:40So if you have to go buy a player, you've already ducked having to do it with all these
14:45other players.
14:47So suck it up and go ahead and do it.
14:51That was the way my thought process morphed to getting accustomed to the idea of brand
14:57and IU.
14:58Now, I don't think that it's conducive for the team to do it with a player like that
15:05before they know Drake May is actually good.
15:09Because you're courting disaster if you're bringing in a player, giving him $30 million,
15:13telling him he's the best player in the organization, most important player in the organization
15:17by paycheck, and then not giving him an opportunity to succeed.
15:22Right.
15:23And that was my kind of unknown in this whole conversation, right?
15:26Is you can bring someone in and give him a lot of money and he plays football, but what
15:30are the dynamics like around that?
15:32How does he act as a big dog in a new market that's probably going to struggle?
15:35Which they didn't have any answers for, but you need to sift out how much of the last
15:39six months of brand and IU on social media, doing interviews, courting other teams, is
15:43like him putting on in the name of business.
15:46Or is this just a rankled guy that will still be rankled once you lose a couple of games
15:51here and he might not be getting any targets?
15:53Last dismount for me on this is here.
15:56The destination point is the big one, because I think the Patriots did everything they could.
16:01Give Brandon and IU over $30 million per year, give the Niners something that was reportedly
16:05sufficient for them and a trade work deal that I confirmed included Kendrick Bourne.
16:09So it's not their fault this didn't happen, but it is their fault that they've gotten
16:13to this destination part where it's not just coaches and executives you and I are seeing
16:17at the owners meetings.
16:18Last time we spoke on this podcast going, hey, what the hell are the Patriots doing?
16:22It's players like IU, who have never played it down in the NFL with the Tom Brady Patriots.
16:27So what he's known has been Cam Newton, that wildcard team that got crushed in Buffalo,
16:31Matt Patricia, 4-13, and these are the Patriots.
16:34So they have an optics issue at all levels of the league that they're going to just take
16:39time to dig out.
16:42Yeah, that's all you can do is look in the mirror and say, okay, I'm pretty ugly right
16:45now.
16:46What am I going to do?
16:47What am I going to do to improve myself?
16:48And they can say to themselves, well, we didn't put ourselves, we're not the ones who ate
16:52all that pasta, pizza, drank all that beer and got ourselves this sloppy looking.
16:57It was the last guy, which quite honestly it was.
17:01Now Bill might have had a plan to dig out that would have been enacted over the last
17:05few months.
17:06And maybe his presence gets an IU here.
17:09But to me, it is what it is for Elliott Wolfe, for Gerard Mayo, for the Crafts, and you have
17:16to dig out.
17:17And I think that we're going to head into this pretty shortly, but I think that the
17:22way they're going about it is fairly interesting.
17:25Yeah.
17:26And one note here, because I don't want it to sound like I'm just dumping on Bill, the
17:29guy who's gone.
17:30Patriots could have signed Jonah Williams, Tyron Smith, some other guys who are veterans
17:34of free agency, giving them some more money and then looked a little bit more competent.
17:38Then we're going, we're doing the Vidarian low thing and practice again.
17:41Okay.
17:42Okay.
17:43Not that Brandon Iuk was keeping up with my practice reports or yours certainly from afar,
17:46but that's it.
17:47All right.
17:48Thursday, preseason opener against Carolina at seven o'clock to let stadium.
17:51Our guy, Phil Perry on the radio call.
17:53I love that for him, by the way, it's going to be a lot of fun, him and Bob.
17:56He's also not doing any like game simulation prep.
17:59He's just going to wing it.
18:00And I think he's going to nail it anyway.
18:01Yeah, I do too.
18:02I mean, he's got encyclopedic knowledge of the roster.
18:06He's an entertaining person to talk to.
18:08He doesn't think in just, you know, straight line stuff.
18:12And I always think that more is less.
18:14It certainly will be a difference from the emotional, passionate intensity of Scott Zoek.
18:24And so see, might get to finish a touchdown call.
18:27Yeah, maybe.
18:28And if it's a Drake May touchdown call, we're going to have a lot to talk about because
18:32I have been eager for everyone else to watch Drake May so I can stop talking about what
18:35Drake May looks like and have to inform you and then either make you feel bad or want
18:39to debate me when I go.
18:40Well, if you're there, you know, and if you're not, you don't.
18:43What do you want to see from Drake May on Thursday and how long do you want to see him?
18:47I want to see him for a good long time.
18:49And I would say it's probably more drives than plays.
18:53I want to see him in two minutes.
18:57I want to see him for probably about two full quarters.
19:03He needs probably six to eight drives now, depending upon the game.
19:06But it's probably gonna be a punt fest because it's Carolina, New England, first preseason
19:10game between two of the worst teams in the NFL.
19:12So he might get eight drives.
19:17I want to see composure.
19:18I want to see in and out of the huddle.
19:19I want to see diagnosing what he sees defensively.
19:23I know he can throw it hard.
19:24I know he can throw it far.
19:26If he throws it too high, if he throws it too low, if he throws it behind somebody.
19:32Fans need to understand the same way they needed to understand when they watched his
19:36pro day, that those are going to friggin happen.
19:41They happen to Brady.
19:43They happen to Rogers.
19:44They happen to everybody.
19:46And the why of the misthrow, they can fix.
19:50It's how quickly does he process?
19:52What's his poise like in the pocket and what's his comfort level?
19:55Does it look like a rookie who is a wild stallion running around or does it look composed
20:04and applies the right tool for the job in each play?
20:12That's what I want to see.
20:14That's a lot.
20:15I think it's fair because I even tweeted after I thought it was a bad practice Saturday,
20:20where he finished with the last two minute drill we saw it again on Tuesday.
20:23I think he'll play better.
20:24The schemes are simpler.
20:25The talent is going to be worse than the Patriots starting or even second team defense.
20:29And you just can't look more lost than he has for spurts, for pockets.
20:32It's not like the guy is back there and his head is spinning like you just put your hand
20:36on a globe and let it go.
20:37It's just there are times where he's not in rhythm and a little out of control.
20:43And he's a rookie.
20:44So what I want to see is him in rhythm, comfy.
20:47And I want to see him, as you said, processing on time, which is a scary way to put this
20:52best illustrated by saying, I want to see rookie preseason Mac Jones.
20:56That's what I want.
20:57Like, he's not going to have the candid arm in the downfield.
21:00Oh, yeah.
21:01Oh, there's some maturity here.
21:02Like this could work.
21:03He's kind of he's just at the controls.
21:05And that's it.
21:06Because I think he will get to his natural game that hasn't gone anywhere.
21:09He's not throwing the ball downfield in practice.
21:11I don't need to see it against Carolina.
21:13Just be okay with the operational stuff, the rhythm, the timing.
21:16And I'm going to look a ton at his feet just to see that'll tell me how harried he is,
21:21or how comfortable he is running this offense, facing full team defense, that he doesn't
21:26know what's coming.
21:27And if he does, the ball is going to be out quickly.
21:30And he's going to be he's going to have some ugly plays.
21:34But the feet is going to be the tell, as will the hands.
21:37You know, we've seen a lot of aborted throws.
21:42We've seen a lot of pumps.
21:44We've seen a lot of padding of the football and seeking off platform throws from him.
21:51Can he drop back, set his feet, bounce, bounce, process throw?
21:57He might not be able to do that one friggin' time.
22:01Doesn't mean he's a bust.
22:03But it'll show you, okay, this is what he was as a rookie, and this is how far he has
22:09to go, which everyone should understand, as Jaden Daniels and Caleb Williams, and you
22:13hear reports on the Vikings and J.J. McCarthy, as all that unfolds, people have to understand
22:18that this is not a surprise with Drake May.
22:22This is what you bought.
22:24And we said it at the time.
22:26Like this, there was a certain fella that you work with, I was doing TV with last night,
22:30who was like, I don't remember hearing this leading up to the draft.
22:33It was Drake May, so great, and he'll be ready right away.
22:35And I said, the guy who is screaming loudest that this is not the right move, because he's
22:39not ready and you're not ready for him, is a teammate.
22:42His name is Tom Curran.
22:43He is raw.
22:45He's 21.
22:46He's played two football seasons in the last four years, because 2020, high school got
22:50canceled for COVID.
22:5121, he was a backup.
22:53This is the catch-up we're playing.
22:54And I don't want to spend any more time on my podcast talking about Mike Felger.
22:57But to answer the second part of my own question, I'm good with just four or five drives, because
23:01I think Jacoby will get one or two to start, four or five and take him to halftime, get
23:06to the two-minute drill that you're talking about, which I really, really want to see.
23:09Ove, two picks, and two juju drops the last couple of practices in that scenario.
23:14And then I think it's going to be the Bazooka Joe show in the second half.
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24:50Pick more.
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24:53When we look to another player or position, though, where you go, okay, Thursday's the
24:56preseason opener.
24:57There's going to be like, you know, Jermichael Hasty has a touchdown.
25:00We all write about it.
25:01We all know what Jermichael Hasty is.
25:02If someone stands out, a player or position, and you go, okay, I actually trust this.
25:07This is meaningful to me.
25:08Who's it going to be?
25:09Offensive line.
25:12Okay.
25:13Because it's been so bad in practice that we have to keep asking ourselves, well, is
25:19it the Patriots front?
25:20Is it their front seven?
25:21Is it the fact that they're so experienced and the offense is putting in an entirely
25:25new system?
25:27Can the offensive line look competent, open holes, help the running game average close
25:33to four yards per carry?
25:37Show seams.
25:39It's looking like everybody crowding onto a subway with closing doors on too many running
25:45plays.
25:46So what will it look like?
25:47And if it looks much better, I will buy that.
25:53The excuses that I just mentioned, that it's the defense and not the Patriots ineptitude
25:58that are creating the mess that we're seeing at training camp in the running game.
26:04Right.
26:05Which has been the bigger issue.
26:06Like I've had multiple practices going through my notes going 30, 40, 45% of runs just got
26:12stuffed to the line of scrimmage.
26:15Not going to work.
26:16Yeah.
26:17Stuffed at or behind.
26:18A quick game because this just occurred to me and you make a good point.
26:21Carolina's defensive front actually has some talent starting with Derrick Brown, first
26:24round pick who they're like moving around.
26:26It's more of a three, four now.
26:27I'm going to give you three names.
26:29They're familiar either as ex-Patriots or stars in the league.
26:31And I want you to tell me if they're on Carolina or not.
26:34Are you ready?
26:36Yeah.
26:37Jadavion Clowney.
26:42He was wrecking something someplace.
26:44I think.
26:45I'm going to say not there.
26:47No, he's there.
26:48He's going to start.
26:49Of course he is.
26:50You're not going to bring up Jadavion Clowney if he's not there.
26:53All right.
26:54Number two.
26:55You remember undrafted rookie?
26:56We have.
26:57We did the game.
26:58Who's Bill going to pick?
26:59Who's going to be the guy?
27:00Well, it's going to be someone from Alabama.
27:01LeBron Ray.
27:02Defensive lineman.
27:03Sound familiar?
27:04Is he in Carolina?
27:05Yeah.
27:06LeBron Ray is there.
27:07Yeah.
27:08Okay.
27:09Good.
27:10Yeah.
27:11Because you're not going to say LeBron Ray if he's not there.
27:12It's not a guy you're going to bring up.
27:13This is another deep cut.
27:14Meaningless.
27:15But things you pick up looking at Carolina's depth chart,
27:17as they did right before we got on.
27:19Nick Thurman.
27:20De-tackled a couple years in the practice squad.
27:22Are we going to see him tomorrow?
27:26No.
27:27Nick's not there.
27:28Of course he's there.
27:29He's there.
27:30He's there.
27:31How could you do that to me?
27:35You know what's crazy?
27:36But it's the third quarter.
27:37You know what's crazy for folks for tomorrow night?
27:39Is you might look in the mirror and see a pretty big Patriots fan.
27:43You're going to watch this preseason game and go,
27:45who are these people?
27:47Yeah.
27:48Who are these people?
27:50And that's going to be tough to realize that not only do you not know who
27:55they are,
27:56but they have to capture your attention to make you want to learn who they
28:00are.
28:01Yeah.
28:02And I look,
28:03I don't know if silver bullet's still around.
28:05Big ball,
28:06dude,
28:07silver spray up and down the top.
28:08If we have a new age,
28:09silver bullet,
28:10if you retire,
28:11whatever happened,
28:12that guy does not know to your point.
28:13And guys like I'm looking at a training camp,
28:15but who's 27 again?
28:16We're a week and a half into this because he had an interception.
28:18It's Marcella style who had the last tip drill pick from Drake May,
28:22who I bring up because a,
28:23I think he's going to play a lot.
28:24B,
28:25my answer to this question about players or positions that go,
28:28okay,
28:29they stand up good or bad.
28:30I trust this.
28:31Are the young corners because Jonathan Jones has banged up a little bit.
28:33It's not going to keep Matt long.
28:34He's not going to play Christian Gonzalez could probably have a,
28:37my tie at halftime.
28:38And then the other ones are Alex Austin,
28:40Marco Wilson,
28:41Marcella style,
28:42Isaiah Bolden.
28:43I think they look great in practice.
28:45I don't know about you,
28:46but I also,
28:47I think that'd be great.
28:48It's the guy I keep coming back to is Marco Wilson.
28:50Yes.
28:51Marco Wilson looks really good in coverage,
28:55making plays,
28:56breaking up plays in one-on-ones.
28:58He's a skinny guy.
28:59He came late to the team.
29:00He came late to the team from Arizona and you'll be interested because
29:04they need,
29:05I love Jonathan Jones.
29:06Everyone likes Jonathan Jones as a person,
29:08as a player,
29:09what he's produced in big games against players who are physically
29:13taller than him because of his speed,
29:15but he's not tall enough.
29:18There are times he's going to get tree topped.
29:21So they need a taller guy.
29:23Marco Wilson's not,
29:24you know,
29:25built like a NBA three,
29:27but he's taller.
29:29Right.
29:30And he's had four picks,
29:32three picks back with Arizona,
29:33documented him as my training camp sleeper.
29:35My larger point is I think the receivers here are good enough.
29:38We'll know against Deontay Johnson,
29:40Adam Thielen,
29:41crafty vet,
29:42and Xavier Leguette,
29:43who's the first round pick,
29:44because everyone painfully remembers from April,
29:46who he had big fans in new England.
29:48That's better competition than they've seen in practice.
29:50So we'll know,
29:51has it been the Patriots receivers making them look good or is this actually
29:54good young court corners that they could roll with if Jonathan Jones is out
29:58or getting tree topped or maybe playing safety,
30:00which he's been doing a little bit more of as of late.
30:03Last question.
30:04Yeah.
30:05Yeah.
30:06I got time.
30:07Okay.
30:08Well,
30:09I love this question and I haven't asked it of anyone on the Hill yet,
30:12but like we might've done this last,
30:14last episode.
30:15What's a storyline.
30:17The two weeks of camp,
30:1811 practices,
30:19about half of them padded.
30:20That's just been overlooked.
30:21It's all Drake May.
30:22It's all the receivers is all the corners and we're all taking notes,
30:26but this thing is standing out to you in a way you're not hearing about a
30:28whole lot.
30:32It has less to do with what's going on on the field and what's going on in
30:35the building.
30:36And that is,
30:37I think that Elliot Wolf is doing a great disservice for the position.
30:42The Patriots gave him to be as invisible as he's been.
30:47He should be out front.
30:48He should be responsible for the contractual conversation.
30:52He should be more visible.
30:54He should be articulating what the vision is for the team.
30:57He should be propping up the head coach instead of having him out there
31:01jumping on grenades for Matthew Judon.
31:03He should be selling.
31:06That's part of the position.
31:08And Elliot Wolf has been in this league for a long time around the league
31:13for a long time.
31:14He's got a lot of media people,
31:15I think nationally,
31:16and perhaps he's building them locally,
31:19but it's not all about trying to win behind the scenes so that you get
31:24written about favorably.
31:30It's about representing the interests of the roster,
31:35of the cap,
31:36of the team in general,
31:38because Mayo,
31:39as he said,
31:40I want to coach.
31:41Coaching does not mean having to talk about Devon Godshaw's contract does
31:47not mean talking about Matthew Judon's contract slash holdout.
31:50So I think that's been an under reported,
31:55or maybe I'm the only one who's noticing it and gives a crap.
31:57I also will piggyback that with as much time as Robert craft and has
32:04publicly and privately spent saying, Hey,
32:07I'm not involved in the decision-making.
32:10I'm not involved in the football stuff.
32:13I look at the brand and IU pursuit.
32:15I look at the Calvin Ridley pursuit.
32:17I look at the Drake may drafting.
32:19I look at the contracts that have been handed out,
32:21but especially the IU pursuit and say.
32:29They want to be involved in a pod.
32:32They're give their green lighting things enough so that even if they're
32:36not walking down to Elliot Wolf and saying,
32:38can we talk about Devon Godshaw's contract?
32:40Even if they're not walking down to Elliot Wolf and saying,
32:43can we go after IU?
32:44He's pissed.
32:45If Elliot Wolf comes to them, they're saying, please.
32:48Yes.
32:49Great.
32:50I love it.
32:51And I think that that's an interesting thing to see on one hand.
32:54They're being much more spend thrifty.
32:57Spend thrift.
32:59They're being,
33:00they're spending much more freely than they have been accused of.
33:05And on the other,
33:06they're probably a little bit more involved than people are.
33:09Then they're,
33:13then they're allowing people to believe.
33:15Yeah, man.
33:16No, no, no.
33:17You got there.
33:18You got across.
33:20I will say this.
33:21Two good points.
33:22So yeah, I want to.
33:23For the crafts.
33:24And it's so embedded in this.
33:28Be in the media and the fans belief.
33:34It's such a fallacy to think that they didn't spend money on players.
33:38Bill was the one who stopped them from doing.
33:41So I covered this team before bill got here.
33:4497, 98, 99, who didn't get a contract?
33:47Max lane, Todd Ruchi, a hundred million dollars to bled.
33:50So Willie McGinnis, Ted Johnson, Ty law, everybody got contracts.
33:56Everyone.
33:58And when bill came in,
34:00part of the reason they want to bill here was because of his economic
34:03foresight and his ability to manage the cap,
34:06which he did for 25 years.
34:08Bill's gone.
34:10What's happening with the money.
34:11Yeah.
34:15I don't think that's bad.
34:16You're still 40 million under the cap with 78 hanging around,
34:18but it's,
34:20it's interesting to see the spending right now.
34:22It is interesting.
34:23And I would say anyone who wants to push back on that,
34:25just look at the cash spending for 2024,
34:28where the Patriots rank,
34:29because here's the thing,
34:30even if Kyle Duggar and triple peppers and Hunter Henry and divine God,
34:33chow,
34:34and all these players who resigned for you,
34:36don't excite you.
34:37They're still getting combined hundreds of millions of dollars in the
34:40Patriots are in the top 10,
34:42if not top 12 of the leaking cash spending right now,
34:45I last checked about a week ago.
34:46So that's happening in a way that they have not been for the last three
34:49or four years.
34:50And so,
34:51yes,
34:52I think there's a different approach here.
34:53Not to mention heavy.
34:54I used to rate happen.
34:55I shoot up to like top five and then the signing bonus for Brandon and I,
34:58you would have been enough to square away a family of 10 for about a
35:02hundred years.
35:03Now,
35:04aside from that,
35:05going back to the Elliot Wolf point,
35:06that is the best answer I could hope for there because I've not heard
35:09anyone else say that.
35:10Gerard has said multiple times.
35:12That's an Elliot question.
35:13We've had multiple contract issues now trade talks and macro.
35:17Much of the line macro was out in front of the media during his two
35:22year plus,
35:23whatever of being in this role earlier in training camp than we are right
35:27now.
35:28And Elliot Wolf has waited probably to wait out Matt Judon who's
35:31increasingly erratic,
35:32especially on social media,
35:33but the time is approaching.
35:35If not already passed for him to talk because we've got a lot to get to.
35:39Yeah.
35:41Nascent team in terms of who they are,
35:43what they're all about,
35:45what they're going to be.
35:46I guess my takeaway too,
35:49as we wrap this up and I want to ask you too,
35:51I guess my takeaway from the IU thing is I got my brain around how fun it
35:56would have been to see him.
35:57And it pisses me off to no end.
35:59Here's the reason I didn't want IU as I was just offended as a football
36:04watching person by the fact that we're talking about Brandon IU.
36:10We're Calvin Ridley and we're still trotting out Calvin Anderson,
36:15bless him and Vidarian low.
36:17And you have no answer at left tackle or right tackle.
36:19And the only reason you had to draft a quarterback this past March,
36:22April was because you did the same thing.
36:25Mack Jones would still be the quarterback here.
36:27If you had fixed the tackle positions,
36:30Cole strange and Mike and one who started the season.
36:34That's why Mack Jones isn't here because it was a jailbreak for the first
36:38three or four games.
36:39Then he started to do stupid things,
36:41lost his confidence and was unusable.
36:43If they gave him protection early in the year,
36:46team would have won some games and he wouldn't have peed down his leg to the
36:49point that he did.
36:50Yeah.
36:51I'm glad Mack Jones has gone.
36:53Cause I just think there was a heart.
36:54I am too.
36:55To your point,
36:57they don't put weapons around Drake man.
36:59So, you know,
37:00you have,
37:01when I asked people during 2022 in the off season,
37:04Patriots really don't do anything.
37:0523 again.
37:06Why aren't they surrounding back Jones?
37:08Who's rookie contract is this great benefit financially to be able to spend
37:12on other players.
37:13And the answer I got from other folks guessing granted,
37:15but they're in the league was bill.
37:16Doesn't believe in him.
37:17Cause if you did,
37:18as they do with Josh Allen and Buffalo,
37:20as they do in Joe burrow in Cincinnati,
37:22even to it in Miami,
37:23you go get the weapons.
37:24So I'm glad Mack.
37:25They don't have a frigging line.
37:27I don't give a shit about the weapons.
37:28Fix the line first.
37:30It's such an embarrassment.
37:31So yes,
37:32you get the weapons,
37:33but we're ignoring the fact that the same issue that we're dealing with
37:38Yes,
37:39you get the weapons,
37:40but we're ignoring the fact that the same issue is going to arise.
37:43I'm going to talk about it.
37:44We've talked about it all through camp.
37:46It's an embarrassment to put all these things out there and give them
37:49absolutely no foundational ability to run the place.
37:52Or run the football,
37:53which is what they want to do.
37:55According to Gerard Mayo.
37:56And you don't need receivers necessarily to do that.
37:58You need big guys up front clearing holes.
38:02And you have one injury in Chuck's core for who now everyone's just
38:06decided is worthy starter.
38:07And I think could be,
38:08but we don't know.
38:09And it's a house of cards all over again.
38:11Not to get you riled up.
38:13I appreciate you coming on here,
38:14but I'm excited for Thursday in a way.
38:16I've not been excited for many preseason openers coming up.
38:18Drake May is going to play.
38:20Jacoby Percet will start.
38:21And you're not going to be hanging out with us.
38:23You're going to be doing TV.
38:24Studio,
38:25studio,
38:26studio,
38:27studio,
38:28studio.
38:29All right.
38:30We'll miss you.
38:31See you Tom.
38:32All right,
38:33buddy.
38:34Thank you for having me.
38:35You know,
38:36in practice,
38:37he is the first guest on a new segment,
38:38four minute drill,
38:39where typically you're trying to run out the clock on a four minute
38:41drill,
38:42but that is the only thing you can't do.
38:43You can answer these questions,
38:44alternating football with non-football,
38:45however you like.
38:46You've already committed to running out the clock on the first
38:48question,
38:49which is,
38:50I think was like false starting and your part,
38:51but we'll see how this goes.
38:52You ready?
38:53Yeah,
38:54I probably won't do that,
38:55but whatever.
38:56We'll see what happens.
38:57Very good.
38:58All right.
38:59Clock has started.
39:00We saw you getting a little scrap there.
39:01He to training camp,
39:02Bamford,
39:03he Jennings.
39:04What happened in camp?
39:05And it really wasn't that big of a deal.
39:06There's a,
39:07I don't know if there's a one liner there,
39:08but,
39:09uh,
39:10like you said,
39:11it is hot and we're in the middle of camp and,
39:13you know,
39:14it was just me and my other tight end out there,
39:15you know,
39:16just gritting and grinding.
39:17Uh,
39:18so it was just a little bit of scrap.
39:19It's just kind of what comes with the territory a little bit.
39:21Cool.
39:22All right.
39:23That was like a six out of 10 on the cliche scale.
39:24I think you did.
39:25You did.
39:26Okay.
39:27Perfect.
39:28Um,
39:29we were chatting last year cause you had a couple of best man
39:30speeches to give recently.
39:31I want you to tell us the best line from one of those speeches
39:32and how it landed.
39:33Oh man.
39:34Gosh.
39:35Okay.
39:36Uh,
39:37honestly,
39:38probably my first brother.
39:39Uh,
39:40I was pretty nervous for that one.
39:41And,
39:42uh,
39:43he's four years younger than me.
39:44So there's a big age gap,
39:45but my dad always just,
39:47when he was younger,
39:48we started playing football and we just played Oklahoma drill in the,
39:50in the front yard.
39:51So I just,
39:52I hit on that a few times.
39:53Just literally my,
39:54me and my brother just in the front yard,
39:55he's six,
39:56I'm 10 and we were just clashing each other in the front yard.
39:59Pretty good times.
40:00Uh,
40:01but I think that's something that we could,
40:02uh,
40:03relive for sure is good.
40:04So good family times in the Henry household means maximum violence,
40:06right?
40:07In public on the front yard.
40:08Yeah.
40:09It paid off.
40:10It paid off.
40:11Uh,
40:12look at it,
40:13look at us now.
40:14So it's all right.
40:15Yeah.
40:16Good stuff.
40:17All right.
40:18Back to football.
40:19Um,
40:20one,
40:21one myth or misconception,
40:22either in the media or fans think about the game that if you could just
40:23clear up forever,
40:24Hey,
40:25this is not the case.
40:26This is really the truth about my position or the game itself.
40:27Um,
40:28I don't know if people realize how tough a position maybe tied in is.
40:30Um,
40:31and just how complex it is.
40:32I think I would love to have someone just sit in those,
40:35in that seat and just like mentally and physically,
40:37like everything that we have to do.
40:39Obviously I think it's mentally,
40:40we're the second behind the quarterback on offense,
40:42but,
40:43um,
40:44we are asked to do a lot.
40:45It's tough.
40:46I'd agree.
40:47I think the tough part is you followed Kronk,
40:48who we all assume could,
40:49you know,
40:50could maybe not handle it necessarily,
40:51but that's more as public persona than actually the football IQ,
40:53uh,
40:54back to non-football.
40:55So again,
40:56you gave those speeches.
40:57What was one line that did not land particularly?
40:58Well,
40:59I don't know if that was a joke you had teed up.
41:00You felt good about it.
41:01Maybe you're actually didn't like there wasn't anything too crazy.
41:03There was a,
41:04there was a,
41:05a story I wanted to tell.
41:06And my dad went first and he told it.
41:08So I had to like completely scrap that out of my,
41:10uh,
41:11out of my speech.
41:13So that was kind of a last minute adjustment to my speech that I didn't
41:15really want to do.
41:16Did it go well though for your dad?
41:17It went well for my dad.
41:18Yeah,
41:19it went well for my dad.
41:20So,
41:21you know,
41:22good for my dad.
41:23He,
41:24he still looked at me though.
41:25All right.
41:26We're closing in an under two minutes left.
41:27Um,
41:29um,
41:30man,
41:31probably my first touchdown,
41:32uh,
41:33was up there for sure.
41:34Um,
41:35we,
41:36we lost that game.
41:37That was the Tampa game,
41:38but that was a,
41:39that was a fun,
41:40fun game in a way and a fun moment just to kind of,
41:42I felt like relaxed me in a way,
41:43just being here.
41:44And,
41:45uh,
41:46you know,
41:47I hit the ground running a little bit after that.
41:48Yeah.
41:49Primetime in the rain,
41:50you guys were building that second half comeback.
41:51I think the game ended with just about two minutes left.
41:52So yeah,
41:53all went well.
41:54Um,
41:55give us the Olympic sport you would love to jump into tomorrow.
41:56If you just got to go to Paris.
41:57I was actually just talking about this with my wife.
41:58Uh,
41:59I think I could play handball.
42:00Yeah.
42:01I was watching that.
42:02I was watching that the other day on TV.
42:03And I was like,
42:04I,
42:05I think I could play that.
42:06Yeah.
42:07Out of all the sports.
42:08I think,
42:09I think I could pick that up pretty fast.
42:10I love it.
42:11No,
42:12no offense to the handballers,
42:13but I don't know.
42:14I'm an elite athlete.
42:15So I think I could pick it up.
42:16Yeah.
42:17Uh,
42:18probably less thinking and tight end too.
42:19So you just get to react and play.
42:20All right.
42:21Under a minute left here.
42:22Can you,
42:23from any system you've played in a lot,
42:24a lot of offensive coordinators just rattle off.
42:25I'll play.
42:26Call you like,
42:27uh,
42:2812 duo.
42:29Oh,
42:30come on.
42:31Even I know what duo is.
42:32I'm trying.
42:33I'm looking for something that sounds Turkish to the rest of us,
42:34but it's like football East.
42:35Oh man.
42:36Let's go like F slingshot to Buffalo,
42:37right?
42:38And counter,
42:39uh,
42:40two jets.
42:41Uh,
42:42why chase X come back?
42:43I love that.
42:44You see this.
42:45Ooh,
42:46right on it.
42:47One last one.
42:48Your least favorite question in a press conference.
42:49Uh,
42:50I think it's,
42:51I think it's,
42:52I think it's,
42:53I think it's,
42:54I think it's,
42:55I think it's the question I ask in a press conference.
42:56Uh,
42:57you all just trying to ask about what,
42:58like what the quarterback's going on probably right now.
43:00And that's probably my least favorite right now.
43:01Like,
43:02I mean,
43:03we're,
43:04we're a weekend.
43:05So,
43:06all right,
43:07very good next time.
43:08We'll be talking to Hunter Henry about the quarterbacks.
43:09You're going to hear for the past interference podcast.
43:10I appreciate you buddy.
43:11I appreciate you.
43:12Be good.
43:13🎵