#OffTheRecord #ImranKhan #PTI #ReservedSeats #KashifAbbasi #ElectionCommission #SupremeCourt #QaziFeazIsa #JusticeAtharMinallah
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NewsTranscript
00:00Now, the most interesting issue in the Supreme Court's case is this,
00:04which is presented in the proceedings of today's court,
00:07that on what basis should a decision be made?
00:10A set of judges think that a decision should not be made only on whether
00:15the Sunni Unity Council is a political party and whether it should get seats or not.
00:19This is a fundamental question on which the Chief Justice of Pakistan wants to go.
00:23When he says, the letter and spirit of the constitution.
00:26Not spirit, just letter.
00:29But other judges have come up with various ideas today,
00:33that whether to limit it to justice,
00:37or to proceed according to Article 117, which talks about complete justice.
00:43This is the fundamental division in the Supreme Court at the moment.
00:46I will start with the various views of the judges.
00:51Justice Mansoor Ali Shah said today,
00:54we are looking at the case, we have caught one part,
00:57whether the Sunni Unity Council is a political party or not.
00:59Listen to what he said.
01:27So this was Justice Mansoor's view.
01:55In other words, you are asking this apex court,
02:02vested this jurisdiction extraordinary as well that one looks at 185,
02:09what would be the effect?
02:11He was saying, do we have to look at it in a very small way,
02:14or do we have to take a big view?
02:16Listen to what he said.
02:18In other words, you are asking this apex court,
02:21vested with jurisdiction, extraordinary jurisdictions as well,
02:25that only look at 185, and thus, what would be the effect?
02:30The effect would be during these proceedings,
02:33one thing has become absolutely obvious,
02:36that there has been a grave constitutional violation
02:40by excluding a political party on the basis of misinterpretation of the provisions
02:46and a judgment of this court.
02:48So now, indirectly, this apex court would be validating a grave constitutional violation
02:54and thus invoking the doctrine of necessity again.
02:57Now, this is not an ordinary 185 litigation.
03:01It relates to the rights of the people, particularly those who by now...
03:07Justice Athar Minilla, he said, he is saying,
03:11now his question is, is PTI a political party or not?
03:15We will come to this later.
03:17If it was, then the election commission made a grave mistake
03:21by misinterpreting the decision of this supreme court.
03:25On the basis of which, this whole issue has arisen.
03:27If the basis is wrong, then the basis also has to be rectified.
03:30Justice Munib also has a similar view.
03:34To me, that begs the question,
03:36where did that very large number of independents come from?
03:39Were they independents returned by the people?
03:42Were they independents, with all due respect,
03:45to the election commission, created by the election commission,
03:48on its faulty understanding of the constitution,
03:52and in particular, the judgment of the supreme court,
03:54which upheld their order.
03:56They said it meant this.
03:57It didn't say this, it didn't mean this or that at all.
03:59So you see, when we are in this realm,
04:02if this is the correct position,
04:04that this whole problem or issue,
04:07is arising out of errors made by the election commission,
04:10then surely it is the, or is it not,
04:13the duty of the court, the supreme court,
04:16to the extent that it is able to do that,
04:18to correct that error, to rectify the problem.
04:21If the election commission of Pakistan has made mistakes,
04:24then is it the job of the supreme court to rectify them?
04:28Justice Munib.
04:29Qazi Faisal saab,
04:30is probably closer to the letter of the constitution.
04:34There is a lot of debate going on.
04:37The division in this court is visible.
04:39What is his view on this?
04:41When judges, some of them may have great wisdom.
04:44I am not one of those.
04:45Say, forget what the constitution says.
04:47There is this one word, justice.
04:49And I am going to elect, erect an edifice,
04:52on the basis of this one word.
04:54Then we might as well go away with the constitution.
04:56Because we are now imposing our vision on the nation.
05:00We are imposing what the constitution says.
05:02Hang on.
05:03Constitution makers, you didn't quite get it right.
05:05We know what justice is.
05:07We are imposing our will on parliament.
05:09When we go into these vague concepts,
05:11we get into all sorts of troubles,
05:12which I can't anymore.
05:13Since mention was made on the doctrine of necessity,
05:15it was on...
05:16This is the division of the bench.
05:17Qazi saab has made his view very clear.
05:20Today's Don Akhbar,
05:21yesterday's proceedings,
05:23the headline today's Don Akhbar has put on it,
05:26that CJP comes to ECP's rescue.
05:29If we can run this on the TV screen.
05:33Let me show it from here.
05:35CJP comes to ECP's rescue on reserve seats.
05:38That is, to save the election commission of Pakistan,
05:41the Chief Justice of Pakistan has come.
05:43This is a view on reserve seats.
05:46An English newspaper has led by this.
05:49What is their view on yesterday's proceedings?
05:52Hasnaat is present with us.
05:53Hasnaat Malik, thank you very much.
05:55Atif Khan saab, Khan saab,
05:56Tehreek-e-Hind saab, Syedat Kazmi saab,
05:57and Muneeb Farooq saab is present with us.
05:59He is not dependent on any stars.
06:00But let's first see what is happening in the Supreme Court.
06:04Is it right that this is the division at the moment?
06:07What to do?
06:09The majority judges who are speaking,
06:12they are saying that
06:14only the party of the Sunni Unity Council,
06:17whether it is a party or not,
06:18this should not be seen.
06:19Why did it become a party?
06:21Why did the free people go into it?
06:23Why could they not go into PTI?
06:25This is also important to see.
06:27And Qazi saab says, no,
06:28it should be limited to the constitution.
06:30But in one thing,
06:31the judges of the Supreme Court are unanimous,
06:33and that is that the decision of January 13,
06:35the election commission did not interpret it correctly.
06:38In this, all the judges,
06:39The Chief Justice of Pakistan is also there.
06:41All, all.
06:42But the Chief Justice does not want to correct it.
06:43The rest of the judges will have to correct it.
06:44They say that no,
06:45whatever has happened, has happened.
06:46I have to look at the text.
06:47And in the text, it is that
06:49proportional representation,
06:50which political parties have to get,
06:53reserve seats,
06:54and all those people,
06:56the PTI back,
06:57the return candidate,
06:58they were independent.
06:59So because of this,
07:00Now,
07:01Why were they independent?
07:02The reason is that
07:03The election commission made them independent?
07:05The election commission and
07:06Justice Qazi's judgment.
07:07Because of the judgment?
07:08Exactly because of that.
07:09And the election commission,
07:10they are saying the same thing again and again,
07:12everyone is unanimously saying that
07:13the interpretation of the election commission is not correct.
07:15So it is clear in this matter.
07:17Now the rest,
07:18Justice Qazi is saying that
07:19I have to look at the text.
07:20Although in the past,
07:21we have seen,
07:22even if a presidential reference was filed against them.
07:24Muneeb Sahib is in front.
07:25Article 211 was very clear.
07:27The Supreme Judicial Council's proceedings
07:29cannot be carried out in any court of law.
07:31Justice Qazi Faisal broke the door of the Supreme Court.
07:34Although Article 211 was very clear.
07:36He is the only Justice Qazi Faisal in Pakistan,
07:39among 5-6 judges,
07:40who have striked down the Constitution Amendment.
07:42Article 249 is very clear that
07:44you cannot strike down the Constitution Amendment
07:46on the ground.
07:48In 2016-15,
07:50he struck down the Constitution Amendment.
07:52On what principles?
07:53The text was very clear.
07:55Article 211 was very clear.
07:57You brought a judgment made law.
07:58Ramzi Sahib's judgment made law.
07:59So where...
08:00So where...
08:01So in the Supreme Court,
08:02where it seems convenient,
08:03the text becomes ambiguous.
08:04Where it seems convenient,
08:05the spirit becomes very ambiguous.
08:07But one thing that is unanimous
08:09is that the interpretation of my decision is not correct.
08:12When did I say that
08:14these candidates are not from PTI?
08:17If they had joined PTI,
08:19they would have got the result sheet.