Amy Klobuchar Leads Senate Rules Committee Hearing On Oversight Of The Smithsonian Institution
Sen. Amy Klobuchar (D-MN) leads a Senate Rules Committee hearing on oversight of the Smithsonian Institution.
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NewsTranscript
00:00:00I would like to thank Ranking Member Fischer and our colleagues for being here, as well
00:00:05as Secretary of the Smithsonian Lonnie Bunch.
00:00:08I will note that I was saying to Deb that we actually got bling from you guys.
00:00:14We never get anything here from the Rules Committee, and this is very cool, your pocket
00:00:18guide to the Smithsonian.
00:00:21And we welcome you once again to the committee, Secretary.
00:00:25I know that you planned the announcement of the return of the pandas to coincide with
00:00:29our hearing, so thank you.
00:00:32Today's hearing is an opportunity to discuss the ongoing priorities and what's next for
00:00:37the Smithsonian as it works to maintain and share with the public its vast collection
00:00:43of treasures, including some that you've brought for us today, including from a Minnesota perspective
00:00:49– everyone should go over and see these items when we're done here – a comic book
00:00:56about Minnesota's own Hubert Humphrey.
00:00:59These are just part of the institution's nearly 157 million artifacts, in addition
00:01:04to the 2.25 million volumes in its 21 research libraries.
00:01:10Its collection is just part of what makes the Smithsonian a global leader.
00:01:15In fact, since its founding in 1846, the Smithsonian has grown to become the world's largest
00:01:21museum, education, and research complex, and its researchers are tackling cutting-edge
00:01:28questions at the frontiers of science.
00:01:32Earlier this year, Deputy Secretary of the Smithsonian Park testified in this committee
00:01:38about the impact that AI is having on the institution and the work researchers are doing
00:01:43to harness its potential from astrophysics to conservation efforts while guarding against
00:01:50risk.
00:01:51Importantly, the Smithsonian is reaching people in all 50 states and across the globe.
00:01:56In recent years, it has broadened public access through its online resources, welcoming
00:02:01nearly 170 million visitors to its website last year.
00:02:06This has expanded the Smithsonian's reach, building on the many millions of in-persons
00:02:10visits – 17.7 million last year – that it hosted in its 21 museums and the National
00:02:18Zoo, sites that have remained popular, and in some cases, far more popular than expected
00:02:26over time.
00:02:27To cite one example, the National Air and Space Museum was originally designed for two
00:02:33million visitors annually, but it's so popular that it has welcomed many more visitors, up
00:02:39to seven million a year.
00:02:42We look forward to the completion of the Air and Space Museum's needed renovations and
00:02:47to its fully reopening in the time for the country's 250th anniversary in July 2026,
00:02:54along with other cultural activities that Secretary Bunch is planning to honor 250 years
00:02:59that will be taking place on the National Mall.
00:03:02I also look forward to hearing about the ongoing efforts with the two new museums established
00:03:09with bipartisan support after legislation passed this committee unanimously in 2020,
00:03:15the American Women's History Museum and the National Museum of the American Latino.
00:03:20Work on this is well underway with fundraising for both new museums at over 65 million each.
00:03:25That's 65 million each private money for the two museums.
00:03:30There are two open sites on the National Mall that would look even better with the new museums,
00:03:35as the Smithsonian Board of Regents has determined, and the work to develop these museums is ongoing.
00:03:40Dr. Elizabeth Babcock started work as director of the Women's Museum this month, joining
00:03:47Jorge Zamanillo, founding director of the Latino Museum, and staff are working hard to build these collections.
00:03:55These museums represent a critical opportunity to help families visiting Washington learn
00:04:02about the remarkable contributions of Latino Americans and women to the fabric of our country
00:04:07and our shared American story.
00:04:10At the same time, we know that addressing the backlog of maintenance projects at the
00:04:13institution must remain a priority.
00:04:16I look forward to hearing about the Smithsonian's work to assess its facilities and what else
00:04:22is needed to complete ongoing maintenance and repair projects to protect collections
00:04:28for future generations.
00:04:30The Smithsonian will continue to play a critical role in preserving and telling our country's history.
00:04:36And at the same time, it will write new chapters through its groundbreaking research.
00:04:41I know I forever cherish my photo that's in a little black and white Polaroid from
00:04:468th grade when I made my first visit to Washington and posed in what is now, I know, an antiquated
00:04:52astronaut costume with my face in it that went right in my scrapbook, proudly displayed
00:04:58on the first page.
00:04:59So many kids are having that same experience, maybe a little more modernized.
00:05:04Thank you, Secretary, for being here, and I will now recognize Ranking Member Fisher
00:05:08for her opening statement.
00:05:11Thank you, Chairman Klobuchar, for calling this oversight hearing today, and I want to
00:05:15thank our witness.
00:05:16Welcome, Secretary Bunch.
00:05:18As Secretary, you are steward of 21 museums and research facilities, the National Zoo,
00:05:25and a growing collection of over 155 million objects and specimens.
00:05:31Speaking of the National Zoo, congratulations, Mr. Secretary, to you and your team on the
00:05:37exciting news that the zoo will welcome a new pair of pandas, Bo Lee and Ching Bo.
00:05:45And we are grateful that you are joining us.
00:05:46I didn't know you knew them personally.
00:05:47That's impressive.
00:05:48I get out.
00:05:49I get out.
00:05:52We're going to see them at the end of the year, is my understanding.
00:05:56It is a national treasure, our Smithsonian, and we are grateful that you are joining us
00:06:02today to tell us about the Smithsonian's successes and also the challenges that it faces.
00:06:09Over the past several Congresses, my colleagues and I have regularly heard about the challenges
00:06:13faced by the Smithsonian, including its deferred maintenance backlog.
00:06:18I understand the deferred maintenance backlog has tripled in the last several years, now
00:06:23totaling $3.3 billion.
00:06:27In addition to the deferred maintenance on the public-facing museum, this amount includes
00:06:33deferred maintenance for the 700,000 square feet of space in aging storage facilities
00:06:39that are inadequate to house these important institutions' collections.
00:06:45The nation is so fortunate to have the Smithsonian's collections and the buildings that store and
00:06:51display them are foundational to protecting them for future generations.
00:06:57I'm looking forward to seeing the paperweight that you brought from William Jennings Bryan
00:07:03when he was Secretary of State under Woodrow Wilson.
00:07:08I understand a plowshare, which he had swords turned into plowshares before the First World War.
00:07:18I find that amazing, so I'm looking forward to seeing that.
00:07:24As we look to the needs that the Smithsonian has, it is especially crucial as the museums
00:07:33and the Smithsonian continues to expand.
00:07:37In 2020, Congress authorized two new museums, the National Museum of the American Latino
00:07:43and the Smithsonian American Women's History Museum.
00:07:47I look forward to hearing about efforts to address the deferred maintenance backlog while
00:07:53balancing the addition of these two new museums.
00:07:57Of course, the museum buildings in Washington, D.C. are not the only way that Americans experience
00:08:03the Smithsonian.
00:08:05I've heard wonderful things about the traveling exhibits of the Smithsonian's Museum on Main Street.
00:08:12This partnership between the Smithsonian's Travel Exhibition Service and State Humanities
00:08:17Councils brings the Smithsonian out of Washington.
00:08:21I was pleased to see Nebraska included in this endeavor over the last year.
00:08:27The Voices and Votes Democracy in America exhibit made stops in Howells, Kearney, Belvedere,
00:08:34Oahu, Garing, and Omaha, and I got to see it in Kearney.
00:08:39And the Waterways exhibit at the Kearney Rails and Trails Museum opened on March 2nd.
00:08:45I was delighted to have the Smithsonian come to Nebraska, and I want to congratulate the
00:08:50many Nebraskans who coordinated with the Smithsonian to make this happen.
00:08:55Initiatives like Museums on Main Street connect the Smithsonian to Nebraskans and to all
00:09:01Americans nationwide who are unable to visit here in Washington.
00:09:05I hope to hear more about the ways the Smithsonian is seeking to connect with Americans and increase
00:09:12that access to its collections.
00:09:15Thank you again for being here, Secretary.
00:09:17It is an excellent opportunity for committee members to learn more about the challenges
00:09:21and the opportunities facing the Smithsonian.
00:09:25Thank you, Madam Chairman.
00:09:26Thank you, Ranking Member Fischer.
00:09:29As I noted, our witness today is Lonnie Bunch, who became the 14th Secretary of the Smithsonian
00:09:34Institution in June of 2019.
00:09:39Secretary Bunch previously served as the founding director of the Smithsonian's National Museum
00:09:44of African American History and Culture, which welcomed its 10th millionth visitor in September.
00:09:51Impressive.
00:09:53Secretary Bunch is a published author and has held many teaching positions, and earlier
00:09:58in his career, he worked for the National Museum of American History and the Chicago
00:10:02Historical Society.
00:10:03He received his undergraduate and graduate degrees from American University.
00:10:08I will now swear in our witness.
00:10:12Do you swear that the testimony you give before the committee shall be the truth, the whole
00:10:18truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God?
00:10:21I do.
00:10:22Thank you.
00:10:23You can be seated, and we will now proceed to your testimony and recognize you for five
00:10:28minutes.
00:10:29Thank you.
00:10:30Thank you.
00:10:31Good afternoon, Chairman Klobuchar, Ranking Member Fischer, and members of the committee.
00:10:35I want to thank you for this opportunity to testify before you today, because it's been
00:10:39a couple years since I last met with you, and in that time, the Smithsonian has seen
00:10:43approximately 34 million in-person visits to our museums, education centers, and research
00:10:49facilities.
00:10:50We have become an increasingly digital institution, seeking out partners to implement technology
00:10:56smartly and safely, so we can bring the vast resources of the Smithsonian to people around
00:11:02the country.
00:11:03And with the help of Congress, some of our renowned buildings, like the castle in the
00:11:07National Air and Space Museum, have been undergoing substantially and needed renovations.
00:11:13This enduring institution has meant so much to the American people and the citizens of
00:11:18the world for 178 years.
00:11:21It is nearly impossible to adequately describe all that we do, from protecting cultural heritage
00:11:28in war-torn nations, to helping people explore their genealogy, to examining the surface
00:11:34of Mars.
00:11:35We engage with and educate people on important topics like the essence of the American experience,
00:11:42the diversity of the world's cultures, the sustainability of the planet, and the nature
00:11:46of the universe.
00:11:47In some ways, we are at the center of civic, educational, scientific, and artistic life
00:11:52of the nation, and our international reach to more than 100 countries includes robust
00:11:58research, programs, partnerships, and knowledge exchanges.
00:12:02Finally, we are responsible for the safety and security of more than 6,500 employees,
00:12:09more than 3,800 on-site volunteers, and millions of annual visitors to our museum.
00:12:15My vision for the Smithsonian's future is to be a reservoir of knowledge that anyone
00:12:19can dip into at any time, any place.
00:12:22It's embodied in the way that we've expanded our educational research, with a presence
00:12:26in every state in the Union and dozens of countries worldwide.
00:12:31In the physical year 2023, more than 600,000 educators and students used the resources
00:12:39of our learning lab, and nearly 3 million students used our Smithsonian science in the
00:12:44classroom curriculum.
00:12:46We can see a glimpse of the Smithsonian's future in our two new congressionally authorized
00:12:51museums.
00:12:52These museums will not only help us tell a more robust, expansive, and inclusive version
00:12:57of America, but they will also be built as the first digital first museums.
00:13:02Their programming has already begun reaching audiences well before concrete is poured.
00:13:09Building new museums is something I know, and it requires a massive outlay of money
00:13:13as do other needs inherent in buildings in such a vast institution like the Smithsonian.
00:13:18From addressing deferred maintenance to meeting increased salary requirements, we increase
00:13:24our reach and impact by collaborating with other agencies, organizations, and governments
00:13:29whose goals align with us.
00:13:32We rely heavily on the generosity of donors and the public who value all the work that
00:13:37we do, and we're grateful, candidly, that for the past three years have been the most
00:13:42record-breaking philanthropy the Smithsonian's ever had.
00:13:45And of course, the U.S. Congress remains our most valuable partner.
00:13:49We take our fiscal responsibilities seriously and look to spend taxpayers' dollars conscientiously
00:13:55in a way that maximizes our reach and our impact.
00:13:59Our strategic plan lays out bold goals for the Smithsonian's future.
00:14:03Our actions over the past few years reflect those goals.
00:14:06To be more digital in ways to reach more Americans.
00:14:09To be nimbler and more effective in our operations.
00:14:12To elevate our scientific endeavors.
00:14:15To expand our educational efforts and to really be a more trusted source.
00:14:20This will be foundational to my goal of reaching every home and being in every classroom across
00:14:26the nation.
00:14:27The nation's 250th anniversary in 2026 will be a pivotal moment for us to unveil just
00:14:33how much progress we've made.
00:14:35It will serve as a celebration of what we have been, but also give a glimpse of what
00:14:39we can be.
00:14:41We plan to activate the National Mall with a vibrant cultural festival, and the renovated
00:14:46National Air and Space Museum should be fully open to the public in time for the commemoration.
00:14:51I've asked my colleagues as well to work towards opening, at least temporarily, the castle
00:14:56for the public for that celebration as well.
00:14:59To coincide with those milestones, we have programming that both celebrates and contemplates
00:15:04who we are as a nation and the Smithsonian's place in it.
00:15:08We will invite Americans to explore all corners of our complex histories and find ways to
00:15:13have honest conversations that transcend our differences and connect our shared humanity.
00:15:18It will be an opportunity for us to showcase the myriad ways in which the Smithsonian's
00:15:23become nimbler, more relevant, and more effective.
00:15:27Our institution is undergoing a transformation.
00:15:30Like any moment, it is filled with challenges.
00:15:33But I would argue more than anything, it's a moment of opportunity to truly fulfill the
00:15:37vision of our founder, James Smithson.
00:15:40Decades before it was built, he foresaw this institution as a gift to the American people.
00:15:46Recently, a couple announcements highlighted the Smithsonian's global reach.
00:15:50The first, of course, we were able to secure giant pandas to the National Zoo.
00:15:54I've always felt the key was never to be the secretary that lost the pandas, and I'm so
00:15:59pleased to say that as a result of the hard work, we will have the pandas by the end of the year.
00:16:05But also, a team led by the Smithsonian and the National Oceanographic Atmospheric Administration
00:16:10created the National Ocean Biodiversity Strategy.
00:16:14It's a vital plan for ocean conservation, and it's the first nationwide strategy to
00:16:19improve scientists' ability to serve and to gather knowledge on critical biodiversity.
00:16:25Pandas speak to our ability to work collaboratively, to think creatively, to act decisively, to
00:16:31help find solutions to the world's biggest challenge.
00:16:34I am more confident than ever that the Smithsonian is uniquely positioned to do this.
00:16:39Thank you for this hearing, and most importantly, for your ongoing support and your commitment
00:16:42to work with us.
00:16:43I'm happy to answer any questions you have.
00:16:46Very good.
00:16:47Well, that is exciting.
00:16:48I hadn't focused on the 250th anniversary.
00:16:50We tend to focus on right now, today in this place.
00:16:54And I think that's really exciting, 250 years since the signing of the Declaration of Independence,
00:17:00such an opportunity to reflect on our great nation.
00:17:03So, how long has it been since the castle was opened?
00:17:07The castle just closed about a year ago.
00:17:09Okay.
00:17:10So, then you're going to reopen parts of it?
00:17:11Right.
00:17:12The goal is that the amount of work that has to be done in the castle, the initial plan
00:17:16was for the castle basically to have them all torn up during the 250th.
00:17:20I said, we can't do that.
00:17:22So, what we're going to do is do interior work so that we can have the castle open for
00:17:26the 250th.
00:17:27And then after the 250th, we'll do all the earthquake work that's going to really help
00:17:33make it difficult for people to visit the castle.
00:17:36Okay.
00:17:37And, you know, since the pandemic, I was just seeing that your average visitors up air and
00:17:41space, before you closed down for the work, I assume, 7 million.
00:17:47But, you know, what has it been like?
00:17:50Because a lot of people were worried we wouldn't bounce back.
00:17:53I think the numbers have been really good.
00:17:55We are now at pre-pandemic levels throughout the entire Smithsonian.
00:18:00And then couple that with all the digital work we're doing, we're reaching more people
00:18:04than ever before.
00:18:05Could you talk about that, what you've done to make it more accessible, the museum, virtually
00:18:10for people maybe in a little town in Nebraska, farmers that aren't going to be able to leave
00:18:15and are, you know, because they've got their crop coming in?
00:18:19Talk about how you made this accessible.
00:18:21What I realized is that the Smithsonian needed to have people who really could help us lead
00:18:27the digital transformation.
00:18:28So I created a unit to do just that.
00:18:31And we're really looking at how to really be in every home and in every classroom.
00:18:36So part of what we're doing is making sure that we find the right partners that we can
00:18:40collaborate with.
00:18:41Because I've realized that the Smithsonian, no matter how creative it is, doesn't have
00:18:45broad enough shoulders to do everything.
00:18:47So we're working with a variety of entities to make sure that we can digitally share the
00:18:51information we want to do, but also we're partnering with people like the 4-H clubs
00:18:57and looking at different organizations that have never worked with the Smithsonian to
00:19:00allow us to reach these many communities.
00:19:03And I think what I've really said to everybody is the 250th is our opportunity to demonstrate
00:19:08all of that change.
00:19:10So I'm using that as the marker to say we're going to do everything so that by the 250th
00:19:15you can see a new Smithsonian.
00:19:17Very good.
00:19:19So let's talk about the two new museums.
00:19:22And when you last appeared before the committee, we talked about the ongoing efforts to establish
00:19:27the museum.
00:19:28Since then, as I noted, they both hired founding directors.
00:19:33We've got that over $65 million for each museum, private money.
00:19:37And the efforts are going forward to build the collections.
00:19:42There's a lot of excitement, bipartisan excitement, in both houses for moving forward while it's
00:19:48not at this point a funding issue as much as the location.
00:19:52Could you, and we have been able to establish now with the agreement of both groups, two
00:19:57locations that I had seen, I think they're really a good idea.
00:20:03What can you tell us briefly about that progress?
00:20:06What's being done to talk to the public about this?
00:20:11And we'll answer that first.
00:20:13Well, I think that first of all, things are going very well with these museums.
00:20:18The $65 million that was raised is really important.
00:20:22When I was building the African American Museum, it took me four years to get to $65 million.
00:20:26So there's already a great deal of excitement about these new museums.
00:20:30But also what I've said is that these new museums, even though they don't have a building,
00:20:36they've got to share content.
00:20:38They've got to do things digitally.
00:20:40So we're doing programs, education programs around the country through the lens of each
00:20:44of these museums to build excitement, to let people know about it.
00:20:48And candidly, the hiring of Elizabeth Babcock as the new director, that's a way to sort
00:20:54of get more attention because she's new, there's a lot of articles about her.
00:20:57So basically, the goal here is to begin to do work to say the history of women, the history
00:21:04of Latinos can't wait for a decade.
00:21:06It's got to be done now.
00:21:07So we're looking at different ways to do that.
00:21:10How do we make sure that we're doing programs around the country now to build that support?
00:21:14So I think that from a vantage point of where we are, we're in a good place.
00:21:19The challenge, candidly, is finalizing the sites, because fundraising will pick up even
00:21:24more when you're able to finalize the site.
00:21:27Two, you cannot plan on what the museums will be without those sites.
00:21:32So therefore, it's really hard to sort of keep people excited, as you're saying, eventually,
00:21:37we can tell you what's going to be there.
00:21:38I mean, it's kind of extraordinary, all this funds have been raised without the sites.
00:21:43But before Senator Fischer was the ranking, Senator Blunt and I went out and looked at
00:21:49the sites.
00:21:50And could you talk about those sites and how they fit in with the vision of them?
00:21:56I know the Board of Regents has approved these sites, architects, historians, preservations
00:22:01are consistent with this area of the mall in our nation's capital.
00:22:06Well, I looked at 26 sites around Washington.
00:22:10We looked at sites that were vacant.
00:22:12We looked at sites that were historic buildings.
00:22:15And after looking at all these sites, we realized that what was essential was to have these
00:22:20museums as close to the mall as possible, that the mall is where the world comes to
00:22:25understand what it means to be an American, and to be able to have women's history and
00:22:29Latino history on the mall was crucially important.
00:22:31We looked at these sites, one that we call the South Monument site, which is across from
00:22:35the National Museum of African American History and Culture, which is this really sort of
00:22:39gem like site that's going to be the spot for the Women's History Museum.
00:22:44And then we have another site that's behind the Holocaust Museum, that would be the site
00:22:48of the Latino Museum.
00:22:51What's important is that these sites allow several things.
00:22:54One, there's great excitement in the various communities that they're going to be able
00:22:58to build these museums on the mall.
00:23:01Two, it allows these museums to craft architectural vision, to be able to say we want a building
00:23:08that reflects our culture, much like we did with the National Museum of African American
00:23:12History and Culture.
00:23:13So there's great excitement about the potential of new buildings on new sites.
00:23:18And candidly, while there's always a question of how do you preserve green space, what I
00:23:23love is the building of the African American Museum has enriched the mall.
00:23:27It hasn't hurt the mall at all, and I think these new museums will do the same thing.
00:23:32Okay, very good.
00:23:33Thank you.
00:23:34I'll turn it over to Ranking Member Fischer.
00:23:37Thank you, Chairman Klobuchar.
00:23:40Secretary Bunch, in February, Nebraska's Winnebago Tribal Chairwoman and Council Members visited
00:23:46the National Museum of the American Indians Cultural Resources Center, and they viewed
00:23:51some of their cultural artifacts at that time.
00:23:55They told me that it was a very powerful experience for them, and that your staff there was extremely
00:24:02helpful.
00:24:03So thank you very much.
00:24:04While they have not yet made an official repatriation request for the artifacts, if they do, what
00:24:11does that process look like?
00:24:13What does it entail for them?
00:24:16We have a very robust sense of repatriation.
00:24:19They will put a request in.
00:24:22The Smithsonian Museum of American Indian will look at it, will then sort of assess
00:24:28their basic questions.
00:24:29Is it a federally sponsored tribe, et cetera?
00:24:33And once those questions are answered, then what we do is bring people back to Washington
00:24:37to look at the particular artifacts they're interested in, and then make some final determinations.
00:24:42So it's a process, but it's something that's fair and has worked very well with other tribes.
00:24:49And I assume your answer will be yes.
00:24:51Do you work with the tribes in looking at the facilities that need to be in place where
00:24:59these artifacts are going to be stored to make sure that they're going to be preserved
00:25:07in a manner that has to be adhered to?
00:25:10And then do you help with funding for that?
00:25:14Do they need to handle all that on their own?
00:25:16Where do we go on that?
00:25:17What we do is we want to make sure that both the tribe is satisfied, but that the artifacts
00:25:23are preserved.
00:25:25And so therefore, we look to see what facilities they have, what capability they have.
00:25:30There are times that we will give direction that would be very helpful to do this.
00:25:34We unfortunately don't have the resources to actually help them.
00:25:37But I think the most important thing is to recognize that we want to be able to return
00:25:43what the communities really want.
00:25:45And that's really part of our goal.
00:25:47Right.
00:25:48I know the chairwoman and the council members, of course, they want to make sure that they
00:25:55are looking not just at the needs of their current generation of the tribe, but of the
00:26:03generations that these artifacts belong to.
00:26:07And to make sure that they adhere to their beliefs and principles.
00:26:12And then, of course, meet the conditions that you would put on them as well.
00:26:19Mr. Secretary, I also understand that on March 24th, there was a food truck parked at 12th
00:26:25Street and Constitution Avenue in between the Smithsonian American History and the Natural
00:26:30History Museums.
00:26:32It caught fire.
00:26:33It was fully engulfed in flames when the firefighters arrived.
00:26:37The photos that I've seen from that incident were very alarming.
00:26:42Let's say the least.
00:26:44Are these food trucks a regular safety concern for you?
00:26:49You know, I understand the convenience of the food trucks.
00:26:52I understand how it's important within the city of Washington, D.C. for the business
00:26:56that these food trucks create.
00:26:59But candidly, they really cause a problem for us because there are two levels of food
00:27:03trucks.
00:27:04There are those that have the permits, which really are in the right spots, and then those
00:27:07that just sort of take whatever spot they can.
00:27:10And so it's become a problem on several levels.
00:27:12First of all, there's a problem of it really has an impact on my staff.
00:27:16There are trash issues.
00:27:17They're taking care of the rodents issues.
00:27:19But also the way that these trucks are parked is people then sort of take advantage of the
00:27:26green space, and there's a lot of damage to the property of the Smithsonian.
00:27:31We're working with the city of Washington, D.C., the National Park Service, and others.
00:27:36But I want to be candid.
00:27:37We haven't resolved that yet.
00:27:39Luckily, the truck that burst on fire didn't catch any, didn't affect any other trucks.
00:27:45The person wasn't severely hurt.
00:27:47But to me, it's a warning.
00:27:49And it's a warning that says that we want to be as fair as we can, but we've really
00:27:53got to protect the public and protect the Smithsonian.
00:27:56Well, let us know if we can do anything on that.
00:27:59I think it's a big problem.
00:28:02Your team recently completed 70 percent of the Smithsonian's Facilities Conditions Assessment
00:28:08Program using a new methodology designed to provide a more comprehensive assessment.
00:28:13What have you learned from that so far?
00:28:16And what's the significance of the new data that's been compiled from it, please?
00:28:22Well, it's part of my strategic sense of how we should address the deferred maintenance.
00:28:28Part of the issue for me was that we wanted to no longer look at deferred maintenance
00:28:32and capital as two different things, to really think about strategically how we put together
00:28:37those two entities so that, for example, when we did the National Air and Space Museum,
00:28:42we also took care of a lot of the backlog.
00:28:44So then the question was, do we have realistic numbers?
00:28:47So we put together a new process that said to us, here's ways to look at valuation.
00:28:52Here's ways to understand and calculate inflation.
00:28:55And so the numbers are now high, but it's not the fact that there's new problems.
00:29:01It really is that the numbers allow us to have a more realistic way of doing it.
00:29:05So now what that allows me to do is to figure out where we should put our priorities based
00:29:10on what's the greatest need, and what's the greatest need that allows us to continue to
00:29:14serve the public as effectively as we can.
00:29:17So this has really been part of an overarching strategy that allows us to really focus our
00:29:24resources, make the changes we want, and begin to deal with deferred maintenance.
00:29:28The reality is, for having buildings that have 29 million people that go through them
00:29:34for 364 days a year, deferred maintenance is probably one of the biggest challenges we face.
00:29:40Thank you.
00:29:42Thank you very much, Senator Fischer.
00:29:44We're joined by Senator Warner, who's very eagerly awaiting the return of pandas to the
00:29:50zoo from the great state of Virginia, right nearby.
00:29:54Thank you, Madam Chairman.
00:29:55What you don't know, and Madam Ranking Member-
00:29:58Is that you are responsible for bringing back the pandas?
00:30:01That's classified.
00:30:02I can't share.
00:30:03That's classified.
00:30:05But one of my mentors in the Senate was Chris Dodd, and he said, one of the committees to
00:30:12get on is rules, because not everybody knows that rules committee actually has jurisdiction
00:30:16over the Smithsonian, which is obviously terribly important for the DMV.
00:30:22We're very proud of the fact that we've got a number of Smithsonian institutions kind
00:30:26of back office operations across the Commonwealth of Virginia.
00:30:32I am leaving an extraordinarily classified hearing, which I was chairing, to make sure
00:30:39I could come and do three things.
00:30:42One, I want to commend you, Secretary Bunch, for- I think you're doing a great job.
00:30:47And I'm, you know, your history at the African American Museum, now as overall secretary
00:30:54at the Smithsonian, I have watched how you have, you know, taken on this challenge, worked
00:31:01with the community across the region, as well as across the country, and, you know, we spend
00:31:08a lot of time here, up here, criticizing folks, but I think I wanted to come and say kudos
00:31:16and congratulations for, I think, a job well done, and hopefully one that you'll continue
00:31:21for a long time, even though, since I know most of your board and some of them are very
00:31:26difficult people to deal with, I won't get into names on that, but I have a couple of
00:31:30questions.
00:31:31You know, fastest growing population in Virginia is first generation African Diaspora.
00:31:40I think it may even be the same in Minnesota.
00:31:45And while the African American Museum, you know, is magnificent, it is mostly the story
00:31:52of descendants of slaves.
00:31:54You know, as you think about the Smithsonian's mission, you know, we've got 120-odd thousand,
00:32:02you know, extraordinary entrepreneurial, how do we build the ongoing stories of new diasporas
00:32:11that come, you know, in my particular interest, and this question is, is the African diaspora,
00:32:16and how that is weaved into the Smithsonian story of America?
00:32:20The African diaspora is so important, and it's really being addressed in three different
00:32:24parts of the Smithsonian.
00:32:26The National Museum of African Art has really been taking the lead at working with these
00:32:32communities to sort of, one, bring them into the fold, to be able to sort of look at the
00:32:36cultures of those communities and whether or not that's the kind of culture that gets
00:32:40collected in that museum.
00:32:42The National Museum of African American History and Culture has actually now brought in two
00:32:47curators who just work on that area of the diaspora, and so they're reaching out, doing
00:32:53new kinds of exhibitions, online exhibitions, that begin to build those relations.
00:32:58And then the Museum of American History is really looking at how do we collect the local
00:33:03African diaspora community so those collections are there.
00:33:07As you know, the key to the success of a museum is not necessarily what it's doing today,
00:33:11but what it plans for for tomorrow.
00:33:13So I want to make sure that while we're doing programs with the community today, that we
00:33:17have the kind of collections that allow that story to be told in the future.
00:33:24Did we tip you off on that question?
00:33:25That was a pretty good answer.
00:33:26I thought I was going to come at you and kind of like, kind of semi-stump you.
00:33:30Did you tip him off?
00:33:32No, I did not.
00:33:35Well, I thought I was going to got you there.
00:33:40This is not an Intel hearing.
00:33:42I stand by my earlier statement, you're doing a good job, because that's a pretty darn comprehensive
00:33:50answer.
00:33:51But I do think the constant remaking of the American story, I really hope, you know, make
00:34:01sure you weren't thrown off.
00:34:02What are you doing on the South Asian diaspora?
00:34:07Well, I think that, again, we're seeing some attempt to do a better job of that.
00:34:13I think what I've asked is that through our educational community, to reach out, to begin
00:34:19to bring more involvement with these various communities.
00:34:22And I have to be honest, the National Museum of Asian Art is really spectacular in terms
00:34:27of being able to deal with local communities.
00:34:30They had a recent exhibition that looked at Southeast Asian art, and there was a variety
00:34:35of people coming from different communities.
00:34:37Although I'm chair of the India Caucus, I do think there is a unique contribution from
00:34:42South Asia separately, but I want to get my...
00:34:45So I'm glad you didn't come back and say, I've got four points on that one.
00:34:51And I don't think this issue has been raised, but I would like to get your thoughts.
00:34:55One of the things we're all grappling with is AI, and artificial intelligence has enormous
00:35:05ability to enhance, but we can also embed biases.
00:35:12We also have to, I think, think through, do we actually have the notion of some kind of,
00:35:18in a better sense, walled garden around all of the intellectual property and images and
00:35:25parts of our history that Smithsonian protects?
00:35:27Because just as deep fakes can manipulate our political process, you could see AI tools
00:35:35at scale and speed manipulate our history and cultural in ways that could be frankly
00:35:42devastating.
00:35:43Talk to me about that.
00:35:45There's real challenges with AI.
00:35:46Obviously, we want to make sure that we use it as an effective tool, but the biggest concern
00:35:52we have is the Smithsonian is a trusted source, that people know they can count on the Smithsonian.
00:35:57So trying to really do more than dip our toe, but understand how we can use AI and not lose
00:36:04that trusted source.
00:36:05So part of what we're doing as we move towards the 250th is we're taking some opportunities
00:36:12to test, to see how can we make AI work for us.
00:36:16For example, while we're already doing a lot with it, we're doing a lot in our astrophysical
00:36:21work, we're also using it to help us scrub all of our documents to understand if we're
00:36:28missing the history of women, for example, in a lot of the scientific discoveries.
00:36:32But I think that we are really trying to figure out how not to be at the tip of the spear.
00:36:38We don't want to be at the end.
00:36:39And so we're really trying to figure out how to make this work for us.
00:36:43I think we have to be involved.
00:36:45We've already been approached about, do you want to use Smithsonian content for machine
00:36:50learning and the like?
00:36:51And so we're looking at a variety of opportunities, but the most important thing is I don't ever
00:36:55want to lose the trusted source.
00:36:58And right now, you can't trust everything that happens with AI.
00:37:01Thank you.
00:37:02And while I have great respect for California, Minnesota, Nebraska, remember the 250th in
00:37:09many ways was, and regardless of what those folks in Boston say, it's more Williamsburg,
00:37:15it is across the Commonwealth of Virginia, and extraordinarily important.
00:37:20Have you looked at the artifacts over there, which include Nebraska?
00:37:23I've got to go back to my classified reading.
00:37:25Are you aware of the virtual expansion of the Smithsonian?
00:37:29I think it's wonderful, but if you want to see the real stuff, come to Virginia.
00:37:33Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
00:37:34All right.
00:37:36Very good.
00:37:38Next up, we have several new members of the committee, Senator Britt, who was here earlier,
00:37:43and Senator LaFonza Butler, who is here for 14 months, so she asks her questions really
00:37:48fast.
00:37:49No, not really.
00:37:50Because she has to get a lot done quickly.
00:37:51So with that, I turn it over to Senator Butler of the State of California.
00:37:55Thank you, Chairwoman Klobuchar, Ranking Member Fischer, Secretary, thank you so much for
00:38:03coming.
00:38:04There are so many accolades, I'm sure, that have been lauded onto you deservingly about
00:38:09your work here in Washington, but for an Angeleno, it all starts at CAM.
00:38:18Your contribution to generations of Angelenos, teaching us about the history of our city
00:38:26and the place that we belong, I think was just remarkable.
00:38:34All the platitudes earned, but I want to make sure that even Washington, D.C. knows that
00:38:41California was where this started, and they are continuing to see your leadership from
00:38:50Los Angeles.
00:38:51And so thank you for your work and service and for being here.
00:38:55I do sort of move a little bit rapidly, so I'm going to try to move around a couple of
00:39:00big topics pretty quickly in my time.
00:39:05The Chair has allotted us five minutes for questions, but you have said that there are,
00:39:09in your strategic plan, sort of five focus points.
00:39:13And you noted just in your response to Senator Warner, the asset of the Smithsonian as a
00:39:20trusted source for the American people, and indeed travelers around the world who want
00:39:27to understand the history of our country.
00:39:31And you talk specifically about this trusted source as it relates to complex topics like
00:39:37social justice, like climate.
00:39:40So here are two quick questions.
00:39:43Can you say a little bit about how you're working to ensure that Americans who are unable
00:39:49to visit D.C. can understand the Smithsonian as a trusted source?
00:39:55I think some of what you're talking about relative to virtual exhibits could be responsive
00:40:01to that.
00:40:02But also, how you and your team are telling the tough stories that are the truth around
00:40:10these complex issues in the story of our country.
00:40:14Well, I think, first of all, what's really important for us is to use all the Smithsonian
00:40:19assets to make sure the country reaps the benefit of the Smithsonian.
00:40:24So while a lot of it is virtual, also it's our traveling exhibitions.
00:40:28The other thing we do is we do a lot of programs with students, that we bring students in from
00:40:33wherever they are into Washington.
00:40:35So we basically really have, as in our DNA, the recognition that we are more about outside
00:40:43of Washington than we are inside of Washington.
00:40:45Now the second question is this real issue of the difficult issues.
00:40:49And I've really felt that that's really the Smithsonian's job, that at a time when you
00:40:55need clarity, at a time when there's a debate, you want the Smithsonian to sort of bring
00:41:01its scholarship, bring its perspective to help people grapple with these issues.
00:41:06When I built the African American Museum, the real key was to make sure that I wasn't
00:41:11trying to sort of point fingers or guilt.
00:41:15What I was trying to do was say, here is a way we understand ourselves by looking at
00:41:19this complexity.
00:41:20And I would argue, whether it is climate change, whether it is issues of social justice, that
00:41:26the Smithsonian, because it has art, history, culture, science, can really bring our expertise
00:41:32to bear.
00:41:33But what we also do is want to recognize that we don't want to sort of get into controversy
00:41:39for controversy's sake.
00:41:40But we also recognize that if you're going to tell history or science, controversy's
00:41:45there, so we won't run away from it.
00:41:46So all I ask from my colleagues is, let's think very carefully about what we do.
00:41:51Let's make sure it's always about driven by scholarship.
00:41:55And then let's make sure it's always about the greater good, to make sure that this is
00:41:59about how the Smithsonian is this reservoir of understanding and a reservoir of hope.
00:42:06And if we can continue to do that, we can help the country move forward.
00:42:08I love that reservoir of hope.
00:42:10My last question, just in the spirit of time, I know you've talked a good deal already about
00:42:17the two new museums and the waiver that is necessary from Congress.
00:42:24Talk to us about the consequences of that waiver not being granted.
00:42:30In some ways, if the waiver is granted, but it's two years down the road, what it really
00:42:36means is that you're 15 or 20 years away from an actual museum being built.
00:42:42And so right now, there is attention focused on these museums.
00:42:46There's fundraising.
00:42:48But if people feel that it's stalled, there's going to be less attention and excitement
00:42:53to it.
00:42:54And now, candidly, if the waiver isn't granted, then the question is, I'm not sure.
00:43:02Because we've looked at so many sites, and there are sites that just say, do you knock
00:43:08down a building and move a whole department of X?
00:43:12I don't think you can do that.
00:43:13So right now, I'm committed and focused to working with people like Senator Klobuchar
00:43:20to make sure that we can get a waiver.
00:43:25And one other thing I would add is doing it sooner rather than later means that you're
00:43:29still the secretary for when we get started on this.
00:43:32And we'll require you to stay 15 years.
00:43:36But I think that would be helpful to have a seasoned leader there when we get at least
00:43:40to get this off the ground, as you did with the African American Museum.
00:43:45You went a lot farther with that, as we know, with the 10 millionth visitor, just having
00:43:51a visitor there.
00:43:52That's another appealing thing, which I think you have a lot of support on both sides of
00:43:56the aisle to move this forward in a good way in the trust of the regents.
00:44:02So I was going to, the question I was asked, I want to just air for maybe my constituents
00:44:09next to the pandas.
00:44:10They'd like to know about the Air and Space Museum and what you're doing there.
00:44:14Could you give us some details on that, what's happening with that renovation?
00:44:18Well, you know, as somebody who started at the Air and Space Museum in my career, it's
00:44:23what I really care a lot about.
00:44:25And what I'm pleased is to say, look at how the air and space has changed already.
00:44:31The new exhibitions that we opened in 2022, the public can't get enough of them.
00:44:37And they're really, what is powerful is while they're ripe with stories of aviation, they're
00:44:42also ripe with technology, they're ripe with education.
00:44:45So they're really accessible.
00:44:47And then I think that what is also happening is that Udvar-Hazy out in Dulles is really
00:44:53getting more and more visitors because of the large numbers of airplanes and the work
00:44:58we're doing out there.
00:44:59But I think what excites me in some ways about air and space is that we also have this new
00:45:05Bezos Learning Center that's going to be a part of it.
00:45:08And what that really is, it gives the Smithsonian an opportunity to really do STEM and STEAM.
00:45:13Yes, about aviation, but it's about the Smithsonian writ large.
00:45:17And it allows us to serve more students from around the country to come to Washington.
00:45:23So the Air and Space Museum, where we are is, thanks to your support, the federal transformation
00:45:29is now done.
00:45:31And now over the next two years, we will use private money to build, rebuild and open the
00:45:36new exhibitions.
00:45:38So that as I said, by the time we get to 2026, the whole Air and Space Museum will be open.
00:45:43And Udvar-Hazy will then be the place to see even the larger parts of aviation history.
00:45:51Just one other thing you mentioned, I know previously the Smithsonian's effort to protect
00:45:58collections most vulnerable to deterioration and damage.
00:46:01We've certainly seen other parts of the country when they aren't protected or they're not
00:46:06in a safe place, including preparing staff to rescue collections in an emergency.
00:46:13Could you talk about what's going on with the management of those vulnerable collections?
00:46:18Preserving the collections of the Smithsonian is one of the key priorities of any secretary.
00:46:22Those 155 million artifacts are really not artifacts of nostalgia, but artifacts of scholarship,
00:46:30artifacts of understanding, artifacts of effective use.
00:46:33So what we've done is we've actually had a major look over the last three or four years
00:46:39at how do we sort of improve our collection storage?
00:46:42How do we also make sure that vulnerable collections are protected?
00:46:46So for example, when they built the National Museum of African American History and Culture,
00:46:50the goal was to really build everything in there to handle flooding and climate change issues.
00:46:57Now we're looking to make sure we do that at the American History Museum.
00:47:01So we're looking at where we're most vulnerable, how to make those changes.
00:47:04In our FY25 budget request, we request resources that would allow us to bring slurry walls
00:47:13and dams and pumps to the American History Museum.
00:47:18So basically what we've done is we realize that we have to do this on several levels.
00:47:22One is address climate change and the possibility of the flooding.
00:47:26So we're looking at that.
00:47:27Two, training staff.
00:47:29We have staff who's trained just to handle any kind of emergency.
00:47:33We've already moved the most vulnerable collections away from the lower levels so that in essence
00:47:38we're doing everything we can to make sure that we're prepared when the inevitable happens
00:47:43and that as we can continue then to put the resources into addressing the challenge of climate change,
00:47:50we can protect the institute, the museums we need to.
00:47:53The good thing, for example, about the spaces where we're looking for the new museums,
00:47:58they are not in spaces where there's at risk.
00:48:01So while we may do things to make sure that they can handle the water, it's really the museums
00:48:07that are on the Constitution Avenue side that are really most at risk and that's what we're focusing on.
00:48:13Okay, one last question.
00:48:14My favorite museum to visit is the Portrait Gallery, maybe because it's not all portraits,
00:48:19but my favorite exhibit ever was people who remained cool through time, which included
00:48:23two Minnesotans, Bob Dylan and Prince.
00:48:27And just how is that museum doing?
00:48:30The Portrait Gallery was the first Smithsonian Museum I ever visited when I came here to go to college.
00:48:35It's something that's really important because as you said, it is portraiture, but it's more than that.
00:48:42It's rich history, it's popular culture, they're doing very well.
00:48:47Kim Sayatt, the director, has really redefined notions of portraiture and have really brought
00:48:53in people from around the country to give it the kind of financial resources it needs
00:48:57to do wonderful things.
00:48:58So the Portrait Gallery and its sister institution, the Smithsonian American Art Museum, are doing
00:49:03very well.
00:49:05They've become a destination for many younger Americans who come to Washington because they're
00:49:11one of the few Smithsonian's that's open late.
00:49:14Ah, very interesting.
00:49:17With that, any other questions?
00:49:19Senator Fischer?
00:49:20Yes, thank you, Madam Chairman.
00:49:21Just a couple here.
00:49:22I'm a cattle rancher, and I also sit on the Ag Committee along with the Chairman of Rules,
00:49:29and I was encouraged to see the Smithsonian partner with 4-H last summer as part of the
00:49:36rural initiative.
00:49:37Can you tell us a little bit about the rural initiative, but also then, how's the 4-H partnership
00:49:46gone so far?
00:49:49I really felt that the Smithsonian does a lot of work in urban communities, but that
00:49:55it's rural, smaller communities that need our attention, and I wanted to build on work
00:50:00we've done.
00:50:02model of bringing the Smithsonian to small towns, to shopping malls, to where it's really
00:50:09brilliant, but what I wanted was to be more systematic and strategic.
00:50:14So what I did with the rural initiative is that we've actually had people going around
00:50:18the country to find out what the needs are, and to find out how it's less about the Smithsonian
00:50:24coming to rural America and more about a partnership that allows the Smithsonian to be made better
00:50:29by understanding what are the issues that rural communities need.
00:50:34And so for us, it's the 4-H club has been really powerful, because the 4-H clubs have,
00:50:40as you know, deep relationships around the country, and they've got amazing programs
00:50:45that we're able to leverage.
00:50:47And so the notion of being able to create dialogues around democracy, to use the 4-H
00:50:52clubs to really help young Americans not just look at the history of democracy, but understand
00:50:59their obligation, their responsibility to sort of protect the democracy, has been really
00:51:03very moving.
00:51:05And last summer, we brought 700 students through the 4-H clubs to the Smithsonian.
00:51:11They spent time at each of the museums.
00:51:13They worked with curators.
00:51:15And what I realized is that this is what the Smithsonian does well, to give people a way
00:51:20to sort of find wonder, to find new ways to think about their future and new ways to think
00:51:24about their community.
00:51:25And so with the 4-H clubs, while we're doing, I think, important work, I think we're also
00:51:30changing the Smithsonian.
00:51:33Thank you.
00:51:34One last question.
00:51:35As we look at leadership for the new museums, what's the process for candidate selection,
00:51:43and how does the Smithsonian work with a search firm, for example, to find and select a candidate?
00:51:52Running a cultural institution is hard work.
00:51:54Running a cultural institution at the Smithsonian is unbelievably challenging.
00:51:58So part of what we do is we look at this through several lenses.
00:52:01One, we try to hire important consulting firms that can help tease out candidates, but also
00:52:08we reach out.
00:52:09I reached out very directly around the Women's History Museum to people that I thought were
00:52:14the kind of, either the leaders or the next generation of leaders that would sort of help
00:52:20the Smithsonian move forward.
00:52:22The process then is, once we get a pool, we make sure that they spend time not just
00:52:29with sort of senior leadership, but with other museum directors, so they can understand the
00:52:33challenge of the Smithsonian, because quite candidly, when you run a museum that's not
00:52:38the Smithsonian, you really are the CEO.
00:52:41At the Smithsonian, you run a museum, you're a mid-level manager, right?
00:52:45You've got other people on top of you, and so basically we want people to understand
00:52:49the challenge of being a director at the Smithsonian.
00:52:52But then what we do is, after they go through the process, I get to speak to the final two
00:52:57candidates and really ask them questions to guide my sense that they can embrace the ambiguity
00:53:04of leadership, especially if you're building new museums, if they understand the challenge
00:53:08of bureaucracy, and if they have a vision, because basically to build a new museum, you've
00:53:14got to have a vision that you believe in that can carry you for a decade.
00:53:18I know there was a situation in the past on a director for a new museum, and I hope
00:53:25this new process, or more complete process, can be followed in the future.
00:53:30We wanted to make sure that instead of just counting on a search firm to vet a candidate,
00:53:36we also have our own private way of doing that.
00:53:39So we make sure that even after a search firm may say, this is a strong candidate, we have
00:53:44a process that allows us to sort of vet it even further, and to make sure that there
00:53:49are no surprises, because I hate being surprised.
00:53:51Me too.
00:53:52Thank you, Secretary.
00:53:53Thank you.
00:53:54Do you have any additional questions, Senator Butler?
00:53:57I'm happy to ask if I'm given extra time, Chairwoman, thank you so much, I appreciate
00:54:01it.
00:54:02Secretary, what do you, there's a lot of sort of criticism, conjecture, sort of being laid
00:54:10upon this sort of newer generations of millennials, Gen Zs, call them, give them Gen Y, call them
00:54:21whatever you want.
00:54:23I'm curious about your ability, the institution's ability to analyze data relative to who are
00:54:31the participants across all the platforms of the Smithsonian, in-person, virtual, traveling
00:54:39with partnerships, and what do, if you have the capacity to examine and analyze that data,
00:54:45what are the trends that we are seeing relative to future generations being interested in
00:54:52the story of this country, and what are you doing about those trends?
00:54:58So there's a lot of ifs, but I have some great curiosities as to how do we continue the legacy
00:55:04and tradition of this trusted source?
00:55:07Says the mother of a nine-year-old.
00:55:08Says the mother of a nine-year-old who cannot get her daughter to finish the African American
00:55:11Museum.
00:55:12We've been three times.
00:55:15I think first of all, it's crucial that the Smithsonian has data.
00:55:19We really sort of look at who comes, who participates in programs, who we're looking at virtually,
00:55:26and in some ways, the technology's allowed us to capture something we couldn't capture
00:55:29in the past.
00:55:30So we now have a much stronger idea, but also what we find is that we have shaped programs
00:55:37to different parts of our community, Gen X, Gen Z, to make sure that we're asking the
00:55:43questions they want to ask, and what I find fascinating has been that when we're often
00:55:49building a museum, people say, well, you know, these younger generations, they want the virtual.
00:55:55What they want is to realize that they've never seen the actual, and that we use the
00:56:00virtual to get them into the actual, and that really works.
00:56:03We have many, many more people that are grappling with it.
00:56:06I think the other thing that's so important that the Smithsonian's trying to do with these
00:56:10different generations is really shape the educational community.
00:56:15We're doing a lot of work.
00:56:16I created an undersecretary for education for the first time.
00:56:19We're doing a lot of work in different communities to make sure that younger Americans understand
00:56:26the power of history, the importance of science, the joy of the creativity of art.
00:56:31We see sort of millions of young Americans engaging in the Smithsonian besides that trip
00:56:39in eighth grade.
00:56:40That's super helpful, and that's one of the things really what I was trying to get at,
00:56:45and Senator Klobuchar really noted the point that I view most of, if not everything, through
00:56:52a lens of one, urgency, because of my short time in the Senate, but also through the lens
00:56:58of being a parent.
00:57:01As I offer the story in jest, in terms of my daughter in the African American Museum,
00:57:08but does the data, do the learnings offer you anything relative to the footprint of
00:57:16new museums?
00:57:17One of the things that my nine-year-old, take it for what it's worth, the science that it's
00:57:21worth, she says, it's too big, Mama.
00:57:23I just want to do this little part.
00:57:27Does the data give you any insight or any learnings across the industry and field give
00:57:32you any insight relative to what is the right footprint for as we think about new museums,
00:57:40particularly as we are grappling with the complexity of space and climate and all of
00:57:46those things, as well as the attention of a nine-year-old?
00:57:49I think what we found through the data is that the museum needs to be compartmentalized,
00:57:56that regardless of the footprint, you really want to be able to not have people try to
00:58:01do the entire experience, really trying to do pieces of it.
00:58:05I think that's something that will shape as we're building the new museum.
00:58:09The other thing is that to really, we're actually using a lot of child psychologists and others
00:58:17to help us think about, all right, what's the best level to engage?
00:58:21Because as you know, in a museum, you're engaging a whole array of people.
00:58:26We're looking at, do we use technology even differently?
00:58:30Do we really craft opportunities that this really works for sixth-graders, this technology?
00:58:36We're looking at, what are all the possibilities?
00:58:42Very good.
00:58:43Good questions.
00:58:44Thank you very much, Senator Butler.
00:58:46I was thinking you'll have to come to Minnesota, Secretary Bunch, and see the country's biggest
00:58:51state fair for your own cultural experience.
00:58:53Absolutely.
00:58:54I don't count Texas because they're open 30 days.
00:58:59There's a huge 4-H presence.
00:59:00I was thinking about that since you've worked with them.
00:59:03Then you could see the butter carving and think of it of the Princess K and the Milky
00:59:07Way out of huge butter bus that go in a revolving refrigerator.
00:59:13You could think of that as a future exhibit.
00:59:15You are broadening my cultural horizons.
00:59:17Yeah, exactly.
00:59:19That would be a lot of fun.
00:59:20We have some great museums there, as you well know.
00:59:24I want to thank Senator Fischer and the members of the committee for a productive hearing,
00:59:28as well as you, Secretary, for your testimony on the ongoing work of the Smithsonian, your
00:59:34vision for the future, both for the existing collection and then all the exciting new work
00:59:39going on with the two museums.
00:59:42I meant what I said.
00:59:43This is our moment near the end of the year to allow you to get these things launched.
00:59:48I look forward to continuing my work with my colleagues to support the important work
00:59:54of the Smithsonian.
00:59:56The hearing record will open for a week.
00:59:58Do you want to add anything, Senator Fischer?
01:00:00Okay, good.
01:00:01We are adjourned.
01:00:02We're going to look at those artifacts.
01:00:04Thank you.
01:00:05Thank you.