Rodrigo Gomes, Pedro Lima, Alvin Ayman, Wes Okoduwa and Max Kilman all discussed
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00:00Hello, I'm Nathan Jude. I'm delighted to be joined from holiday, fresh-faced and bushy
00:14tail, Mr Liam Keane. Liam, how's it going, Bebba?
00:18Pretty good. It's good to be back in the saddle, if you will, after a short break, going and
00:23watching some Euros football.
00:25Well, Euros football. Appreciate the curtains, tartan army tonight.
00:29Yeah, I'm surprised that you've gone for that look. It doesn't really suit you, and you're
00:35not Scottish, but best of luck to them. They're going to need it.
00:39They are going to need it. They're going to be absolutely smashed. I'm at the rent's house,
00:42to be fair, so that's why. But yeah, they were awful, weren't they? But yeah, good little
00:45Euros for you. Enjoyed some queuing?
00:48Yeah, some queuing, unfortunately.
00:50Some more queuing?
00:52Brilliant game, brilliant stadium. Yeah, can't complain, mate. Good. But it's been impressively
01:00busy while I've been away, as it happens to always be.
01:04You know when to take your time away, Mr Keane, Wolverhampton Wanderers reporter. So yes,
01:09we're just doing a quick video to summarise, I guess, exactly what's happened in the last
01:13couple of weeks when you left me stranded and sawing all this stuff out. But I've enjoyed
01:18it. I've enjoyed it. It's been a pleasure. And thankfully, off the field and on the field,
01:22things are looking pretty good early on in the case of Wolverhampton Wanderers for next
01:26season.
01:27So let's go to the top. Let's go. Seems a long time ago now, by the way, Liam. Rodrigo
01:31Gomez signs. A lot of people will not know too much about him. However, I think that
01:39as you're going to tell us in a little bit as well, and from his pedigree, from his track
01:43record, from what he's going to bring to this club, this is a cracking way to start off
01:48the summer.
01:49Oh, absolutely. I know there'll be some supporters that think number nine, which of course is
01:54on the shopping list, is really important. There'll be other positions that fans will
01:58bring up and think may be more important. But we've both been saying actually for quite
02:02some time that Wingers is going to be massive for this summer because Pedro Neto's future
02:08obviously is up in the air. And he really is the only out and out winger, someone who
02:12will get to the byline direct, attacking, quick, exciting, fast feats. And this is exactly
02:18what Rodrigo Gomez is.
02:21We've known that Wolves were interested in him for quite a while. There were reports
02:25obviously in January and before that, I did a story in March to say that Wolves were planning
02:30a summer bid for him. But I don't think anyone expected it to be this soon. And it's one
02:36hell of a deal. 12.7 million from Braga, obviously he was on loan at Estrela last season, nine
02:42goals, eight assists over the course of the season and all competitions there. And played
02:46a lot as a wing back on the right as well as a winger, can play both flanks. So I think
02:52we'll see him more as an attacking option considering the fullback and wing back options
02:55they do have.
02:56But to have a versatile player at 20 years of age in the Portugal under 21 squad and
03:03adding the kind of attributes in a position that they needed to add, I think is a perfect
03:08way to start the summer. And the fact that they were interested in him for so long, scouted
03:12him for so long. And then there was a little flicker of danger that they might lose him.
03:18Atletico Madrid interested and Wolves act quickly. Now that has to be applauded in my
03:23opinion, because there's been times when Wolves have taken their time and have hesitated.
03:28And on this occasion, they didn't. They moved quickly to get the player they wanted, the
03:32player they've looked at for some time. And it's going to add, I think, a lot of dynamism
03:37to this Wolves side.
03:39Yeah. And look, we've talked a lot about self-sufficiency and self-sustaining model that Wolves are
03:45going to be taking on going forward. But there are going to be people who are going to be
03:51leaving the club. But at the same, at the start of this, for the first signing of the
03:54season, that's not chump change, Liam.
03:56No, absolutely. We spoke about, and this is over the last sort of 18 months or so since
04:01Matt Hobbs has come into the sporting director role and Wolves have begun to move towards
04:05a new strategy. But it's been about bringing players in that want to be at Wolves, first
04:09of all. Now that is young, up-and-coming players to some extent, but also you've seen players
04:14like Mario Lamina and Craig Dawson, who've got a point to prove in Mario Lamina's case
04:19back to the Premier League, or in Dawson's case, moving to play regular football in the
04:22Premier League, have a point to prove at a slightly older age.
04:26Now either ends of the spectrum there, whichever age of a player they go for, they want a player
04:30that wants to be at Wolves and that they will not overspend mega money, 40 odd million
04:36on individual players. We were looking at the eight to 15 million mark, Rodrigo Gomez
04:40falls into that and he fits perfectly the kind of profile of a footballer that Wolves
04:47want to bring into the club. But you are right to say that they've also quickly jumped the
04:52gun to bring a player in at a decent, very decent fee, considering they haven't sold
04:58anyone yet. And again, that probably plays into the facts or what we believe that Wolves
05:04will sell one or two players moving forward. But I just think it's such a good sign, particularly
05:09in comparison to previous windows, when the Wolves have missed out on players or acted
05:13slowly to see them acting so quickly here for a player that they really wanted.
05:18And we know they could do a little bit of movement in the window without selling players,
05:23but they want to add sort of five, six, seven players, if that is as many as they will look
05:27to add, then they will have to let a player or two go. But it's yeah, one hell of a good
05:31start to the summer.
05:33Just like buses, when one comes, the second one is pretty close by and it has arrived.
05:38Pedro Lima, 17 years old, soon to be 18. Look, we've all done the searches. We've all looked
05:47at YouTube. We've all seen what he's done so far. Not too much, but of course, such
05:52a young talent playing senior football at such a young age, Brazilian, Youth International
05:58and with an eye for goal, strong tackling. Chelsea very much interested in him. This
06:04is a bit of a coup, isn't it? And someone who is not going to get loaned out, who is
06:08not, we believe, going to go into the under 21s. This is a youngster. I mean, 18 year
06:12old, he's an adult, but someone who's going to really compete straight away in this first
06:19team.
06:20Yeah, look, you don't spend roughly £8.4 million on a player to throw them into the
06:26under 21s. A loan would have been, considering his age, possible, I suppose. But the position
06:32Wolves are in, it's not something they're going to be looking at. Wolves are not signing
06:3617 year old footballers for that kind of money to send them on loan. This is a player that
06:40will come in and challenge for the first team. Now, I think, as I say, he's 17, turns 18
06:45on July 1st, which is when the deal will officially go through. He'll be playing regularly
06:50for Brazilian second tier side sport, CFE. So for him to come to the Premier League is
06:55a massive jump. I think that's a really important thing to mention, first of all. I don't think
06:59anyone should expect the world from him straight away. I think he's going to need time to bed
07:03in. You made a point on the newsletter and in previous pieces recently to say that, look,
07:11Mateus Kunia took a bit of time to get up to speed. It's going to take someone of this
07:15age, you know, perhaps even more time to get to speed with the rigorous demands of the
07:20Premier League. But he's a player that, as you rightly say, was wanted by a lot of clubs.
07:24Man City have been mentioned today, as well as clubs that have been really keen to bring
07:28him in. But the attraction of Wolves is that they will give young players an opportunity.
07:33And rather than going on loan to Strasbourg, which was reported, if he was going to be
07:36joining Chelsea, he is joining Wolves to play and be around a Premier League squad.
07:42And that is a massive attraction to any player, particularly these talented young South American
07:47players that come over to England. So, yeah, it's a really exciting one. It's one that
07:51will again, will be a slow burn, I would imagine. But, you know, players have surprised us before.
07:57You know, if he comes in and he gets an opportunity quickly, you never know. So he'll be around
08:02the first team. It's, again, a proper coup for Wolves to bring in a player of what we're
08:09expecting to be very, very high calibre. But it's going to be one that we get to know over
08:13pre-season. And similar to Rodrigo Gomez, to have him in early, have him in before pre-season,
08:19have him an opportunity to really bed in. It can only be a good thing for the player
08:22and the club and for Gary O'Neill and his staff. So for both deals that they've done
08:27early, it's only a positive, I think, moving forward.
08:30Absolutely. That's key, what you say there, Liam, is that you're going to have them in
08:33from the very start of pre-season and also getting used to their teammates. I mean, you
08:37saw him saying goodbye to his teammates. There's a video on social media today. He's in tears,
08:42but he's excited for the challenge. And I guess, obviously, very different clubs and
08:45circumstances, but same nationality. In Jao Gomez, there was other talks of teams interested
08:52and yet he chose Wolves. And with Chelsea there, he's chosen Wolves again. So, you know,
08:57you think that with some national teammates there with the likes of Jao Gomez, with the
09:00likes of Mateus Cunha, who's obviously, you know, been key in getting him, that from a
09:05bedding in point of view, yes, he is young. Yes, he is going to be raw. Yes, he is going
09:09to take time to settle in, that at least you've got those kind of compatriots to learn from
09:15and to look up to.
09:16Oh, it definitely helps. I mean, at the moment, I'm not too sure on what his English is like.
09:21Rodrigo Gomez, as we've seen...
09:23We'll be asking, though. We'll be asking.
09:24We definitely will be. Rodrigo Gomez, from what we've seen from bits of Wolves that have
09:28obviously speaking to people at the club, his English is pretty decent. Obviously, it
09:32will improve as well. Pedro Lima, obviously a bit younger. Unsure at the moment what it
09:37will be like. So let's assume for a second that it isn't perfect and he comes in and
09:42needs to learn the language. Having these people around him, like Jao Gomez, who hardly
09:46knew a word of English when he arrived, is certainly improving. Yos Mosquero, I know
09:50he's been out on loan, but again, another one who's really improved his English as well
09:53over the last couple of years. That will only help having the players around him, compatriots,
09:58not only to communicate in general, because if you can't speak English, you need to speak
10:01to someone, but to help him learn the language, learn the culture, settle into the Premier
10:06League and then also know what Gary O'Neill wants.
10:09I mean, Mateus Cunha is a player that will be speaking to Pedro Lima to explain to him
10:13what the manager expects and what the demands are on a Premier League footballer. And he's
10:17got all of these things to learn because as much as a lot of brilliant players are coming
10:22out of Brazil and have them for a long time, the second tier of Brazilian football is a
10:27far cry from the top flight of English football. So there's a long way to go and I think he
10:32needs to be given a bit of patience and a bit of time. But for Worms to be picking up
10:36a player that we all expect will be a star in the next few years is only exciting really
10:42for the supporters who pay that hard-earned money to watch the club.
10:45Absolutely. And when you've got two Brazil full internationals as well with you in the
10:48same squad and training day to day, that can only be a good thing.
10:51Right, let's move on to two youngsters in Alvin Aymann and Wes Okuduwa. Seems like one
10:57is close to leaving. Liam, which one is that?
11:01Yeah, you remember, again, I think it was April time, possibly May, put a story out
11:06to outline that both these players were being coveted by a lot of big clubs. That's not
11:11really been a secret for some time. We know that they're both very highly thought of.
11:16Wes Okuduwa obviously been on the bench quite a few times for Worms and not played. Alvin
11:20Aymann travelled with the team to Man City and wasn't in the squad that day. But it was
11:26to give them both an opportunity to see what a Premier League matchday is like. And of
11:31course, Worms want to keep them both.
11:34The reality, unfortunately, is that Alvin Aymann is on the cusp of leaving for Liverpool.
11:38Liverpool have got a great track record of giving young players an opportunity. They
11:42did sign a 14-year-old lad. Unfortunately, his name is escaping me at the moment. So
11:47I do apologise to him. But about 800 grand from Worms a year ago, 18 months ago. So these
11:53deals have happened in the past. There are reports suggesting that this fee will be above
11:59a million. We're still waiting to hear on the final figures involved. But it's going
12:05to be substantial.
12:06Harvey Owen, I think.
12:07Harvey Owen, that's the one. That's the guy. It's going to be substantial for Alvin Aymann
12:10to leave. But that is not done just yet. But it is getting closer and is expected to go
12:14through. So he will be moving on. Midfielder, can play in defence. Came from Bradford previously.
12:20With Wes Okuduwa, obviously, as I say, been probably more well-known to supporters because
12:24he was on the bench several times last season without playing. Right back, played for the
12:2921s. Both players are 16. So, you know, really young age and both doing really well. And
12:34Chelsea, ironically, Worms taking Pedro Lima from the Chelsea's nose. And now Chelsea reportedly
12:39interested in Wes Okuduwa. But as far as we're aware, there is nothing close. There
12:44is no direct conversations with that happening. But we do know there's a lot of interest in
12:48him. So it's one that I think is important to keep an eye on because he's a player that
12:53has attracted interest from a lot of the big six clubs.
12:57So in terms of them not signing senior contracts, are we talking about compensation here?
13:03Yeah, unless obviously the clubs can come together to arrange some sort of fee. Unless
13:10a contract runs out, it will go to a tribunal and there'll be compensation. But with Eamon,
13:14they are looking at a fee and that should go through fairly comfortably. Wes Okuduwa,
13:20I think they're looking at, as reported previously in my story, they are looking at getting some
13:25sort of scholarship contract together based on his age. He turned 16 fairly recently in
13:31May. So you would like to think they could keep hold of him, but obviously signing Pedro
13:36Lima, same position, will that impact Wes Okuduwa's future as well? Yeah, want to keep
13:41an eye on because clubs are interested and there's only so much Wolves can do to keep
13:45hold of these kind of players once clubs like Chelsea and other big clubs start coming in
13:49for them.
13:50Right, let's move on then, Liam, to Leon Ciaomi, who has signed a new deal, new contract. We
13:57both liked him last season from what we saw. I thought he was very, very good, putting
14:02a couple of mature performances in difficult circumstances when Wolves are really struggling,
14:07weren't they, for strikers and up front. But I thought he held his own and perhaps outshone
14:12Nathan Fraser in the end when it comes to looking back at this season. By the way, there
14:17will be some positional reviews coming out next week. But good news, new contract. I
14:22know Gary Neal likes him and I think that he will be involved more in that first-team
14:27squad potentially next season.
14:29Yes, obviously he did that serious ankle injury which ended his season in mid-April. But at
14:35the time of that happening, I asked Gary about that and spoke to Gary about Leon's development
14:40and he was pretty positive with moving forward into next season. So there was already indications
14:45there of the news that we've got now that Ciaomi has signed a new deal or agreed a new
14:51deal until 2028. We'll have a year option on top of that as well. He's expected to be
14:55fine for pre-season, having recovered from this ankle injury. So I think it was roughly
14:59ten weeks or so was the lay-off. And he's expected to have an opportunity in and around
15:05the first team. Now that is with, we would like to think, and we know Wolves are targeting
15:10to sign a senior striker, so he won't be the only striker in the squad for next season.
15:15But he's expected to be in and around it and have opportunities every now and then, which
15:19I think is the right 18 years on. It's more what he needs. He needs to be thrown in every
15:24now and then at the right time, dip his toe in, get...
15:27Still 21s, make the bench, maybe a Carabao Cup appearance, etc.
15:32Exactly. And that only makes sense. He got thrown at the deep end in the starting away
15:36Villa and it was tough. But from what we saw and from what Gary saw, there was a player
15:43there that has got really good athletic ability, quick, good in behind, had the ball up quite
15:49well and has now signed or agreed a new deal. And of course, it is yet to be announced.
15:55But yeah, really good news for him. And then obviously it impacts Nathan Fraser, doesn't
15:58it? Because he's a player who we both really liked and then he had a couple of injury issues,
16:03didn't perform in a couple of games, obviously the Coventry one being one that was standing
16:07out unfortunately for him. There's a lot of interest from League One and Championship
16:11that has been since last season as well. And he's expected to go out and play now, which
16:15I think he needs. He needs to go out, have a season. If he can go and play 25, 30 games
16:20or even more at a League One or Championship club, that will only do him the world of good
16:26to build a career, whether that's at Wolves or elsewhere. So hopefully that will go through
16:31for him this summer and Wolves can get him a move.
16:33Yeah, do you think in terms of Nathan Fraser that it's sink or swim really when he goes
16:38out on loan, he's got to really perform? And if he's a class above or levels above, then
16:42that's someone who Wolves want to carry on and maybe look at offering a new contract
16:46too and having him as part of this Wolves squad going forward? Or is it, let's see how
16:51you do and then if not, then potentially there could be a sale maybe further down the line?
16:55He is 19 now and I would say never say never because players come back and achieve Premier
17:02League status. But if he's going to be a Premier League player for Wolves, he probably has
17:08to have a big season, I think. I think he has to go out, have a big season, really
17:12impress.
17:13Could you see him being sold though? Could you see him being sold and not going out on
17:15loan and maybe they do sell him this summer?
17:18It's definitely not impossible, but I think a loan would be far more...
17:23Scores 15, 20 goals on loan and then all of a sudden his transfer fee goes up to a big
17:27time.
17:28Yeah, I mean that would be an unbelievable return, especially because he's not gone out
17:31and played. He's only been at Wolves, he's only had the limited opportunities that he's
17:35had here and he has had good moments. He was scoring against Blackpool, scoring against
17:38Brentford, both in the Cup. So yeah, I think a loan is definitely more likely and if he
17:44can go out and have a really big loan, a really big season, there's every chance he can come
17:48back and play Premier League football for Wolves. Maybe not straight away, but within
17:52the next few years. If it's a bit of a difficult loan, doesn't quite work out for him, maybe
17:59that chance might have gone because he didn't have a great end to the season and obviously
18:03he was then overlooked for Torino to come in. So yeah, it will be a really big season
18:09I think for Nathan Fraser and I would like to think he gets a good loan that will suit
18:13the way he plays, which of course is always what Wolves aim for. A team that will suit
18:17the way that the player and the style they have and hopefully get the best out of them.
18:22Right, let's finish with the club captain, Maximilian Kielman. Of course, you look at
18:29his season, you think that... I think he had a good season. I think it was a solid season.
18:33I don't think it was spectacular. There were definitely mistakes in there, but he also
18:36had some very strong games and was the subject, of course, of a £30 million bid at the start
18:43of last season, last summer. Now, it's no secret that West Ham are interested in him.
18:48As of yesterday, there was no official bid, but I think Wolves are bracing themselves
18:51for an inquiry or official inquiry from West Ham United. Of course, we all know who that
18:55new gaffer is there and the relationship that they had, Lopetegui, with Kielman himself.
19:02If and when that bid does come in, Liam, what do you think Wolves' stance will be? I mean,
19:07I'm pretty sure that any bid these days gets rejected straight away anyway. But in terms
19:12of their make-up, in terms of Wolves' centre-backs, of course, Craig Dawson missing a lot of last
19:16season or at the end of last season. You've got Totti Gomez. You've got a couple of others.
19:21You've got Jose Mosquera, who may or may not be staying. Santi Bueno as well. Can they afford
19:28to lose their centre-back and club captain? Of course, there'll be a replacement there.
19:31And if so, what kind of feed do you think Wolves will agree to part ways with their,
19:37like I say, not just a key centre-back for them, but their club captain?
19:40Yes. So, as you say, last summer rejected a £30m bid from Napoli, wanted roughly £35m
19:47and that bid never came in from Napoli. They never pushed any further. Wolves kept hold
19:51of Kielman, offered him a new contract, signed it. Happy days. And as you say, had a good
19:56season. Going into this summer, Wolves want to keep him, absolutely. I think Wolves would
20:02certainly not entertain any bids that were far below their market value of Max Kielman
20:09and they want to keep him moving forward as their skipper and into next season. That is
20:14absolutely the case as it stands. What will test their resolve massively is any bid in
20:19the region of £40m to £45m, I think is really going to test Wolves' resolve. And in my
20:26opinion, as much as I like Max Kielman, I think he's at a really good age in his prime
20:30now, had a really good season. Any money in £40m to £45m range I think is really difficult
20:36to turn down. Wolves, as you say, have got Mosquero coming back, albeit untested in the
20:41Premier League, had a really good season, or half a season, in Spain. I would like to
20:48think they will bring in another centre-half as well, another experienced head. I think
20:53allowing Kielman to go for that kind of money is only going to benefit the squad in terms
20:59of bringing other players in, and potentially could mean you don't have to sell a Pedronetto,
21:05or an Ait Nouri, or Giao Gomez. You can keep the rest of the players together. I think
21:12the ideal scenario is Wolves don't sell Max Kielman. I think he's a good player that should
21:17be in Wolves' starting XI next season. But if you get that kind of money, and it means you keep
21:21other players as a result, I think it's a deal Wolves have to do. But are West Ham or any other
21:28club prepared to go as high as that? Because that is a rather hefty transfer fee for a player who I
21:34think has done very, very well, and is a very good footballer. But I'm not quite sure that he's
21:42worth that kind of fee. I think that's where Wolves will be looking at to let him go, because
21:47they don't want to let him go. I just wonder, when you look at Max Kielman, you look at where he is,
21:51you look at his career. I'm talking about the player now, I'm not just talking about the transfer
21:54fee. But there is obviously an incredible talent there, and I think at his very best, he's probably
22:01in the discussions, as he has been with Gareth Southgate, watching him, in terms of potentially
22:05being called up to an England squad for the first time. However, it hasn't quite happened for him.
22:12And I think there is that player there. But in terms of his progression as a footballer,
22:16I wonder whether a move might suit him. I wonder whether he's getting to that stage
22:20of his career. And like I say, I'm not talking about Wolves hoping to keep the best players,
22:23I get that. I'm not talking about transfers, I'm talking about Max Kielman as an individual here.
22:28And you look at his career progression, and you look at the way, how long he's been at Wolves,
22:31and that he's now played quite a few seasons, he's been starting, he's been club captain,
22:35he's done very well. And you look at career progression, and maybe you have two to three
22:39big moves in you and your career. I just wonder whether you're getting that to that cycle now,
22:44where if you're Max Kielman, do you want to really, in his mind, I mean, we think that you
22:48can do it at Wolves, but in his mind, kick on and maybe have a different challenge? Maybe it
22:52might suit all parties? Yeah, I think that's a really good point, actually, because he is from
22:57London as well. So that's an important point, I think. Going back to potentially closer to family,
23:02I would imagine, and going back to the capital, that I think would suit him. But for the talent
23:08he's got, and the player I think he could be, having that kind of move at a club like West
23:15Ham that is, I mean, Wolves and West Ham are both big clubs, but maybe there's slightly more
23:19pressure there, maybe slightly more expectation there, especially with the new stadium they've
23:23moved into fairly recently, and winning the European Cup recently. With all that
23:30rowing into the mix, and it isn't a big six club as well, where the expectation is
23:35off the charts, I think there's a chance he really could thrive as well, which I'm sure will go into
23:40Wolves' thoughts when it comes to transfer fees as well, won't it? Wolves would be aware of where
23:45he could go as to where he is now. I think it could be a good move for him personally, I really
23:50do. As much as he openly loves Wolves and loves being at the club and loves being captain, he says
23:56that regularly, I think it would be a good move for him personally. And if Wolves can get that
24:00kind of money for them, I think it's a good move for Wolves. If it's anything below that,
24:05I wouldn't blame Wolves for turning it down. I can understand Wolves wanting to keep that
24:09player and wanting to keep their captain and not really upset the apple cart, so to speak,
24:15but if it's anything near the £40-45 million range, I think it's difficult to turn down.