Off The Record | Kashif Abbasi | ARY News | 3rd August 2023

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۔Aitzaz Ahsan slams PDM govt over passage of a huge number of bills

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Transcript
00:00 Asalikum, you are watching the program with Kashif Abbasi.
00:02 There are many issues that have been discussed for the past 2-3 days, especially regarding the constitution.
00:08 The government itself has stood against the government in the Official Secret Act.
00:12 Many people from the government bench have criticized this.
00:17 Raza Arbani has torn the paper and said that this is the Rajwada or the Senate
00:21 which has brought the law of extreme favourability, which the People's Party has tabled.
00:27 Rana Asnaullah has written a letter on this.
00:30 The People's Party and the senators of the Noon League have also distanced themselves from this.
00:35 The Pakistan Bar Council has also expressed strong reservations on the Official Secret Act
00:41 that it is against the personal freedoms of the people.
00:45 That someone should be given this right to the Intelligence Agency.
00:48 Someone should be allowed to go to someone's house, arrest and confiscate things.
00:53 This issue was also brought to the court when Ittizaad Zahid Singh Sahib went to Boston and said that
00:58 the court should take a suo moto.
01:01 The court has not taken it yet.
01:03 The court has said that the Chief Justice cannot decide this according to the new bench.
01:08 But what will happen?
01:09 The court has said that this bill is still present in the Senate.
01:12 Let's see.
01:13 Ittizaad Zahid Singh Sahib is present with us.
01:15 Many of our court reporters are present.
01:17 We will talk to them too in the next segment of the program.
01:20 But Tosha Khana has also come to a very interesting place.
01:23 The Chairman of the Justice Department is about to be punished soon.
01:27 When he finds out what is going to happen, then the matters are very interesting.
01:32 Many requests have been made by the Justice Department in the courts.
01:37 Sometimes in the Supreme Court, sometimes in the High Court.
01:40 We will talk about that too.
01:42 But Ittizaad Zahid Singh is present with us.
01:44 Ittizaad Zahid Singh, Assalam-o-Alaikum.
01:46 Wa-alaikum-Salam.
01:47 Ittizaad Zahid, first of all, let's come to the legislation.
01:50 Your party says that it does not even hide or come forward.
01:55 We do not understand what their official position is.
01:57 They also present it.
01:59 Sherry Rahman Sahiba also defends that law.
02:03 Then many people or the translation of the People's Party comes.
02:07 They say that we have nothing to do with it.
02:09 We oppose it.
02:10 What is happening on these legislations?
02:13 This is a democratic value that is everywhere and it is well known.
02:22 When a family has its first months and its finances are running out,
02:33 then Kashif does not legislate in a controversial way.
02:41 He says that the house is ending.
02:46 A new parliament has to come, a new mandate has to come,
02:50 people are giving new verdicts, people are giving new decisions.
02:53 So they have come and we are not doing this yet.
02:57 And many laws, even though they understand that our party is against it,
03:07 they say that the next parliament will come,
03:14 the parliament will continue, the legislation will be done and people will be under the mandate.
03:19 Here it is going the other way around.
03:21 Absolutely reverse.
03:23 In this mischief, someone is pushing it from behind.
03:28 What has he done?
03:32 They have entered someone's house like this.
03:37 Thieves, five thieves, they must be working immediately.
03:44 And they are issuing bills like thieves are issuing bills in their cars.
03:50 Hurry up, hurry up.
03:53 No, more than 50 bills, more than 50 bills, in three days, in two days.
04:01 Neither has this been read in the parliament, nor has anyone read it,
04:05 they have not even made a committee.
04:07 I am surprised that they do not even think of this.
04:12 Sir, this was called unholy haste.
04:14 Do you remember?
04:15 You use a term, unholy haste, but your party is also included.
04:20 Why are you only saying Shabaz Sharif?
04:22 I tell you, I do not believe that this is the office of the government.
04:28 I have not seen anything.
04:31 I do not think he would have, he has been with the government.
04:36 For 11 years, he has been in the Pallani jail, Pindi jail, Lakhpat jail,
04:43 and in the courts, he has been making the priests go around.
04:47 And this is not him.
04:51 Sir, but listen to me, you can give a statement.
04:54 Look, let's say I have listened to you, they must not have read it.
04:56 I have also listened to you, Bilawal Bhutto must not have read it either.
04:59 But when he must have read it, then he can give a statement.
05:03 Get yourself away from this.
05:06 Bilawal is silent, Zardari is silent.
05:10 I am not giving it as a statement.
05:12 It is a statement.
05:14 But this is a shameful provision.
05:17 This section 11, in the official secret act, which is being put in by Shikh,
05:27 Shikh, that is 2A, 2A.
05:32 It is a sub-clause.
05:34 Now, this is so shameful, so shameful.
05:38 This one clause, all these martial laws, I do not know what all,
05:44 but this is the interpretation of cruelty, which is going to be prospective in the future.
05:51 And what does it say?
05:53 That any person in Pakistan and any household,
05:59 and any building, office, shop or factory or house,
06:06 can enter the intelligence, secret agencies, without warrant,
06:17 and if someone is resisting, then he can beat him.
06:21 He will not like it.
06:22 He can use force on him.
06:24 Now, how much force, shoot him.
06:27 And this, this, this, they, sir, but this is all, I am just saying that everyone has read it.
06:34 It has been under discussion for the last two or three days.
06:37 There is a lot of criticism in the media.
06:39 You also said in the Supreme Court today that it is necessary to look at this.
06:44 One assembly, the National Assembly has already passed it.
06:47 The Senate has sent it to the committee, but the Senate was also inclined to pass it.
06:52 Like in the Senate, Sherry Rahman Sahiba was inclined to pass the extremely popular law,
06:59 which also has very dangerous things.
07:01 If you read it, it says that such a person who manipulates people's beliefs using electronic media or social media,
07:13 makes conspiracy theories, which the politicians make,
07:16 make self-induced narratives, which you have made yourself,
07:21 hatred and discrimination are understood, but this is written about politicians on whom restrictions are being imposed.
07:29 Kashif, which is of 9th May, self-induced narrative, he wants to make it himself.
07:37 And he wants to formalize it.
07:40 I have already said that he has got experience of 9th May.
07:45 And he considers it a great success.
07:48 That we did great.
07:50 We clapped people, induced them to violence, and we arrested everyone and did this and that.
07:57 And no one could spoil us.
07:59 We are giving advertisements on television.
08:01 We are making the court commander out to the jinn out,
08:05 and there people are singing songs, sometimes bringing teachers,
08:10 sometimes they are bringing students from Karachi.
08:14 Somebody thinks that this is a very successful vote.
08:20 Vote to success.
08:22 If the clause were to be given, then the argument would have been broken.
08:28 Sir, but I have agreed with you that somebody thinks that something has been found.
08:33 But many people including your party think that these are very red lines that have been crossed.
08:38 This should not be left.
08:40 The discussion of different cases, article 6 should be put on it, it should be banned.
08:45 Your party is supporting this, which is People's Party.
08:49 I will tell you one thing.
08:51 This is against the temperament of People's Party.
08:55 Sir, that party is against the old temperament.
08:59 It can also be against the new party's temperament.
09:02 No, Radha is in the 50th Senate.
09:06 So how strong is its reaction?
09:11 And this reaction, I will tell you,
09:15 the four people, whose government is this?
09:18 It is of Shabab Sharif.
09:20 Who is the interior minister?
09:22 It is of Shabab Sharif.
09:23 Who is the foreign minister?
09:25 Who is the foreign minister?
09:27 Look, there is a cabinet.
09:29 I will tell you, sir, Shadat Awan, Minister of State for Interior,
09:32 Pakistan People's Party, tabled a bill in the assembly.
09:37 Sherry Rahman Sahiba supported it.
09:40 Not only supported it, she said that everyone should be encouraged.
09:44 Pass it.
09:45 If it comes back, we will make amendments.
09:47 But for now, pass it somehow.
09:49 So to say that it is their government, sir,
09:51 your party is defending it.
09:54 No, I do not agree with this party's behavior.
10:00 And I clearly say that this is the position of the party,
10:06 it is not defensible.
10:08 Look, with this clause, you are imposing a perpetual martial law,
10:14 and you are imposing a parliament.
10:16 A democratic institution is acting like a democratic institution.
10:21 And I said that in Zia-Ullah's period,
10:24 it is not like that,
10:25 Zia-Ullah's period was very bad,
10:28 maybe even worse than that.
10:30 They put a hangman, so many people were hanged.
10:33 But after that, I am not so disappointed,
10:37 from my own institution, I will tell you,
10:42 I have been on the floor of the parliament.
10:48 I am from there.
10:50 I was the sovereign of the parliament that I kept on raising slogans.
10:55 And seeing this, you think that the parliament is complete?
11:00 184, 3, 4, you vote for me,
11:02 I will go to the parliament.
11:04 And you are saying that you are going to the house of the person
11:07 who has been praised by the intelligence agency.
11:13 You are saying, you are a terrorist.
11:20 You are a terrorist.
11:24 You are a terrorist.
11:27 Your voice is being cut off, let me call you again.
11:30 What is this mistake?
11:33 We have nothing to do with it.
11:35 It is a technical problem.
11:38 But as he is saying, he is cutting his hand.
11:40 There is a lot of criticism on this legislation.
11:43 Everyone is criticizing,
11:45 the leadership is silent,
11:47 the government is supporting it,
11:49 in fact, it is defending it.
11:51 The parliament and political parties have to introspect it themselves
11:55 because when your own people are disagreeing on something
11:58 and saying that it is not right,
12:01 like yesterday, in the last 2-4 days,
12:03 especially from Sunday to tomorrow,
12:05 we have seen a lot of speeches in the senate,
12:08 in which people have criticized it across party lines
12:13 and said that it will be used against us tomorrow.
12:16 And it is also true that the law is made by someone else,
12:18 it is made for someone else,
12:20 it is used against them.
12:22 We need to see this.
12:25 I think Mr. Ijaz has gone to the motorway,
12:27 but we will talk about the Tosha Khana case.
12:31 Mr. Hassan Malik is with us,
12:33 Mr. Saqib Bashir is with us,
12:35 Mr. Raja Mohsin Ijaz is with us.
12:37 This Tosha Khana,
12:39 and I wanted to ask Mr. Ijaz about this,
12:41 we will contact him again and ask him.
12:43 Is there going to be a punishment?
12:45 Of course, apparently,
12:47 trials are being concluded
12:49 and in the next 2 days...
12:50 It is happening.
12:52 So, there are 2 days,
12:54 the election commission has started its arguments,
12:56 and if there is no stay,
12:58 I think that the decision can be made in 2-3 days,
13:00 if there is no stay,
13:02 because there is a matter in Islamabad High Court and Supreme Court tomorrow,
13:05 so this is a possibility,
13:07 because 8-9 requests have been heard in the High Court today,
13:09 so tomorrow the decision will be made.
13:11 Let's see what happens then.
13:13 Mr. Ijaz, I will come back to this later.
13:15 Mr. Ijaz, what do you think will happen in Tosha Khana?
13:17 If Tosha Khana is given a stay,
13:19 then tomorrow,
13:21 they will call a trial,
13:23 and wind up the case,
13:25 and Islamabad High Court will also pay the case,
13:27 I don't know what will happen.
13:29 I don't know what will happen.
13:31 I don't know what will happen.
13:33 I think Mr. Ijaz is on the motorway,
13:39 and again his voice has gone.
13:41 We will try to contact him again.
13:43 Look, the case,
13:45 in a way,
13:47 is it going to the judge,
13:49 as Mr. Ijaz said,
13:51 we will come back to this case later.
13:53 What do you think,
13:55 why is this case being controversial?
13:57 Or is it not controversial?
13:59 It is not controversial at all.
14:01 It is not like that,
14:03 because it was a matter of Facebook posts,
14:05 but the FIA has cleared the judge,
14:07 but those posts,
14:09 because when this issue came in the beginning,
14:11 I also visited the account,
14:13 because I visited the account,
14:15 it was there,
14:17 but later the account was locked,
14:19 and then further the FIA has cleared it.
14:21 The second controversy you are saying,
14:23 in this case,
14:25 the trial that is taking place,
14:27 in my opinion,
14:29 there are some loopholes,
14:31 which will be very clear when the case comes in the appeal.
14:33 What are the loopholes?
14:35 The loopholes are that Article 10A,
14:37 the fair trial, is given to you.
14:39 Suppose the matter of jurisdiction,
14:41 which was decided on 26th July,
14:43 the matter of jurisdiction has to be decided first.
14:45 Now the trial is concluding,
14:47 and the matter of jurisdiction is pending.
14:49 On 5th May,
14:51 the judge had given a decision,
14:53 against which on 4th July,
14:55 the High Court said that your decision is not correct.
14:57 The trial court said that the matter of jurisdiction,
14:59 you should decide on it again.
15:01 He gave 7 days,
15:03 he gave the decision in 3 days,
15:05 and it became an ex-party.
15:07 The chairman of PTI, his advocate was not heard.
15:09 The judge gave the decision in 3 days.
15:11 This is a very basic question,
15:13 for any case conclusion,
15:15 that the jurisdiction should be decided first.
15:17 The matter of jurisdiction,
15:19 which has questions on it,
15:21 if it is not decided,
15:23 and the trial concludes,
15:25 then there can be many questions.
15:27 Sir is saying that the jurisdiction is the biggest problem.
15:29 His Facebook posts are also a big problem.
15:31 If he had done it from the Facebook company,
15:33 because here,
15:35 the FIA has cleared it.
15:37 I spoke to the FIA in detail,
15:39 they said that they have examined it a lot.
15:41 These posts were not there before,
15:43 nor are they there now.
15:45 You are saying that you have seen it.
15:47 No, I am telling you as a personal matter.
15:49 I am telling you about the FIA.
15:51 You have not seen it as a government matter,
15:53 but as a personal matter.
15:55 I will listen to Mr. Ijaz before Mr. Hassan Akbar comes.
15:57 Sir, can you hear me?
15:59 Yes, I can hear you.
16:01 Sir, I think you are in a low signal zone,
16:03 in the motorway,
16:05 and you are in the middle of the road.
16:07 Sir, people are thinking that
16:09 they are not hearing you,
16:11 so they have to clear it.
16:13 Sir, tell me,
16:15 why do you think it is a low signal zone?
16:17 Tosha Khan.
16:19 I have not seen
16:21 a judge like this.
16:23 I have seen
16:25 a few judges
16:27 who have
16:29 made the people's party,
16:31 the people's party,
16:33 the people's party,
16:35 the people's party,
16:37 the people's party,
16:39 the people's party,
16:41 the people's party,
16:43 the people's party,
16:45 the people's party.
16:47 The people's party
16:49 is a party of the people.
16:51 The people's party
16:53 is a party of the people.
16:55 It is a party of the people.
16:57 It is a party of the people.
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24:43 It is a party of the people.
24:45 It is a party of the people.
24:47 It is a party of the people.
24:49 It is a party of the people.
24:51 It is a party of the people.
24:53 It is a party of the people.
24:55 It is a party of the people.
24:57 It is a party of the people.
24:59 It is a party of the people.
25:01 It is a party of the people.
25:03 It is a party of the people.
25:05 It is a party of the people.
25:07 It is a party of the people.
25:09 It is a party of the people.
25:11 It is a party of the people.
25:13 It is a party of the people.
25:15 It is a party of the people.
25:17 It is a party of the people.
25:19 It is a party of the people.
25:21 It is a party of the people.
25:23 It is a party of the people.
25:25 It is a party of the people.
25:27 It is a party of the people.
25:29 It is a party of the people.
25:31 It is a party of the people.
25:33 It is a party of the people.
25:35 It is a party of the people.
25:37 It is a party of the people.
25:39 It is a party of the people.
25:41 It is a party of the people.
25:43 It is a party of the people.
25:45 It is a party of the people.
25:47 It is a party of the people.
25:49 It is a party of the people.
25:51 It is a party of the people.
25:53 It is a party of the people.
25:55 It is a party of the people.
25:57 It is a party of the people.
25:59 It is a party of the people.
26:01 It is a party of the people.
26:03 It is a party of the people.
26:05 It is a party of the people.
26:07 It is a party of the people.
26:09 It is a party of the people.
26:11 It is a party of the people.
26:13 It is a party of the people.
26:15 It is a party of the people.
26:17 It is a party of the people.
26:19 It is a party of the people.
26:21 It is a party of the people.
26:23 It is a party of the people.
26:25 It is a party of the people.
26:27 It is a party of the people.
26:29 It is a party of the people.
26:31 It is a party of the people.
26:33 It is a party of the people.
26:35 It is a party of the people.
26:37 It is a party of the people.
26:39 It is a party of the people.
26:41 It is a party of the people.
26:43 It is a party of the people.
26:45 It is a party of the people.
26:47 It is a party of the people.
26:49 It is a party of the people.
26:51 It is a party of the people.
26:53 It is a party of the people.
26:55 It is a party of the people.
26:57 It is a party of the people.
26:59 It is a party of the people.
27:01 It is a party of the people.
27:03 It is a party of the people.
27:05 It is a party of the people.
27:07 It is a party of the people.
27:09 It is a party of the people.
27:11 It is a party of the people.
27:13 It is a party of the people.
27:15 It is a party of the people.
27:17 It is a party of the people.
27:19 It is a party of the people.
27:21 It is a party of the people.
27:23 It is a party of the people.
27:25 It is a party of the people.
27:27 It is a party of the people.
27:29 It is a party of the people.
27:31 It is a party of the people.
27:33 It is a party of the people.
27:35 It is a party of the people.
27:37 It is a party of the people.
27:39 It is a party of the people.
27:41 It is a party of the people.
27:43 It is a party of the people.
27:45 It is a party of the people.
27:47 It is a party of the people.
27:49 It is a party of the people.
27:51 It is a party of the people.
27:53 It is a party of the people.
27:55 It is a party of the people.
27:57 It is a party of the people.
27:59 It is a party of the people.
28:01 It is a party of the people.
28:03 It is a party of the people.
28:05 It is a party of the people.
28:07 It is a party of the people.
28:09 It is a party of the people.
28:11 It is a party of the people.
28:13 It is a party of the people.
28:15 It is a party of the people.
28:17 It is a party of the people.
28:19 It is a party of the people.
28:21 It is a party of the people.
28:23 It is a party of the people.
28:25 It is a party of the people.
28:27 It is a party of the people.
28:29 It is a party of the people.
28:31 It is a party of the people.
28:33 It is a party of the people.
28:35 It is a party of the people.
28:37 It is a party of the people.
28:39 It is a party of the people.
28:41 It is a party of the people.
28:43 It is a party of the people.
28:45 It is a party of the people.
28:47 It is a party of the people.
28:49 It is a party of the people.
28:51 It is a party of the people.
28:53 It is a party of the people.
28:55 It is a party of the people.
28:57 It is a party of the people.
28:59 It is a party of the people.
29:01 It is a party of the people.
29:03 It is a party of the people.
29:05 It is a party of the people.
29:07 It is a party of the people.
29:09 It is a party of the people.
29:11 It is a party of the people.
29:13 It is a party of the people.
29:15 It is a party of the people.
29:17 It is a party of the people.
29:19 It is a party of the people.
29:21 It is a party of the people.
29:23 It is a party of the people.
29:25 It is a party of the people.
29:27 It is a party of the people.
29:29 It is a party of the people.
29:31 It is a party of the people.
29:33 It is a party of the people.
29:35 It is a party of the people.
29:37 It is a party of the people.
29:39 It is a party of the people.
29:41 It is a party of the people.
29:43 It is a party of the people.
29:45 It is a party of the people.
29:47 It is a party of the people.
29:49 It is a party of the people.
29:51 It is a party of the people.
29:53 It is a party of the people.
29:55 It is a party of the people.
29:57 It is a party of the people.
29:59 It is a party of the people.
30:01 It is a party of the people.
30:03 It is a party of the people.
30:05 It is a party of the people.
30:07 It is a party of the people.
30:09 It is a party of the people.
30:11 It is a party of the people.
30:13 It is a party of the people.
30:15 It is a party of the people.
30:17 It is a party of the people.
30:19 It is a party of the people.
30:21 It is a party of the people.
30:23 It is a party of the people.
30:25 It is a party of the people.
30:27 It is a party of the people.
30:29 It is a party of the people.
30:31 It is a party of the people.
30:33 It is a party of the people.
30:35 It is a party of the people.
30:37 It is a party of the people.
30:39 It is a party of the people.
30:41 It is a party of the people.
30:43 It is a party of the people.
30:45 It is a party of the people.
30:47 It is a party of the people.
30:49 It is a party of the people.
30:51 It is a party of the people.
30:53 It is a party of the people.
30:55 It is a party of the people.
30:57 It is a party of the people.
30:59 It is a party of the people.
31:01 It is a party of the people.
31:03 It is a party of the people.
31:05 It is a party of the people.
31:07 It is a party of the people.
31:09 It is a party of the people.
31:11 It is a party of the people.
31:13 It is a party of the people.
31:15 It is a party of the people.
31:17 It is a party of the people.
31:19 It is a party of the people.
31:21 It is a party of the people.
31:23 It is a party of the people.
31:25 It is a party of the people.
31:27 It is a party of the people.
31:29 It is a party of the people.
31:31 It is a party of the people.
31:33 It is a party of the people.
31:35 It is a party of the people.
31:37 It is a party of the people.
31:39 It is a party of the people.
31:41 It is a party of the people.
31:43 It is a party of the people.
31:45 It is a party of the people.
31:47 It is a party of the people.
31:49 It is a party of the people.
31:51 It is a party of the people.
31:53 It is a party of the people.
31:55 It is a party of the people.
31:57 It is a party of the people.
31:59 It is a party of the people.
32:01 It is a party of the people.
32:03 It is a party of the people.
32:05 It is a party of the people.
32:07 It is a party of the people.
32:09 It is a party of the people.
32:11 It is a party of the people.
32:13 It is a party of the people.
32:15 It is a party of the people.
32:17 It is a party of the people.
32:19 It is a party of the people.
32:21 It is a party of the people.
32:23 It is a party of the people.
32:25 It is a party of the people.
32:27 It is a party of the people.
32:29 It is a party of the people.
32:31 It is a party of the people.
32:33 It is a party of the people.
32:35 It is a party of the people.
32:37 It is a party of the people.
32:39 It is a party of the people.
32:41 It is a party of the people.
32:43 It is a party of the people.
32:45 It is a party of the people.
32:47 It is a party of the people.
32:49 It is a party of the people.
32:51 It is a party of the people.
32:53 It is a party of the people.
32:55 It is a party of the people.
32:57 It is a party of the people.
32:59 It is a party of the people.
33:01 It is a party of the people.
33:03 It is a party of the people.
33:05 It is a party of the people.
33:07 It is a party of the people.
33:09 It is a party of the people.
33:11 It is a party of the people.
33:13 It is a party of the people.
33:15 It is a party of the people.
33:17 It is a party of the people.
33:19 It is a party of the people.
33:21 It is a party of the people.
33:23 It is a party of the people.
33:25 It is a party of the people.
33:27 It is a party of the people.
33:29 It is a party of the people.
33:31 It is a party of the people.
33:33 It is a party of the people.
33:35 It is a party of the people.
33:37 It is a party of the people.
33:39 It is a party of the people.
33:41 It is a party of the people.
33:43 It is a party of the people.
33:45 It is a party of the people.
33:47 It is a party of the people.
33:49 It is a party of the people.
33:51 It is a party of the people.
33:53 It is a party of the people.
33:55 It is a party of the people.
33:57 It is a party of the people.
33:59 It is a party of the people.
34:01 It is a party of the people.
34:03 It is a party of the people.
34:05 It is a party of the people.
34:07 It is a party of the people.
34:09 It is a party of the people.
34:11 It is a party of the people.
34:13 It is a party of the people.
34:15 It is a party of the people.
34:17 It is a party of the people.
34:19 It is a party of the people.
34:21 It is a party of the people.
34:23 It is a party of the people.
34:25 It is a party of the people.
34:27 It is a party of the people.
34:29 It is a party of the people.
34:31 It is a party of the people.
34:33 It is a party of the people.
34:35 It is a party of the people.
34:37 It is a party of the people.
34:39 It is a party of the people.
34:41 It is a party of the people.
34:43 It is a party of the people.
34:45 It is a party of the people.
34:47 It is a party of the people.
34:49 It is a party of the people.
34:51 It is a party of the people.
34:53 It is a party of the people.
34:55 It is a party of the people.
34:57 It is a party of the people.
34:59 It is a party of the people.
35:01 It is a party of the people.
35:03 It is a party of the people.

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