A day after violence erupted in Nagpur over Aurangzeb issue, Maharashtra Chief Minister Devendra Patnavis called it a pre-planned conspiracy.
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00:00Good evening, hello and welcome. You're with the news today. This is your primetime destination,
00:05news, news makers, talking points. Our big talking point is coming tonight from the state
00:11of Maharashtra. Is the state becoming another communal tinderbox? This is the day after
00:18violence in Nagpur over the Aurangzeb issue. Is it our netas who are keeping the communal
00:24pot boiling? What really led to the Nagpur violence? We'll bring you the chronology and
00:31much more. This is the show that brings you the news without the noise. Let's tell you
00:38the nine headlines at nine tonight. A day after violence erupts in Nagpur over Aurangzeb
00:45issue, Chief Minister of Maharashtra, Devendra Fadnavis hints at a pre-flag conspiracy. Over
00:5150 rioters are arrested as opposition claims government has failed to maintain law and order.
00:58Russian President Putin and American President Trump get on the phone line, discuss a ceasefire
01:07plan. US President says talks with Putin have a very good chance of success. Prime Minister
01:17Modi lords the Mahakumbh in Parliament. Opposition hits out, says Samajwadi Party asked why no
01:24mention of the stampede deaths. Rahul Gandhi questioned why he was not allowed to speak
01:29on the issue in the house. ED Heat now on George Soros linked organisations in India,
01:38Open Society Foundation affiliates raided Forex violation probe by ED on Soros firms.
01:47Gold smuggling accused Rania Rao took 52 trips to Dubai, 26 with actor friend Tarun Raju.
01:54Agencies probe a Hawala link to the smuggling ring. US Intel Chief Tulsi Gawad praises Prime
02:03Minister Modi, says like Trump, Modi committed to nation first, ends her speech with Jai
02:08Shree Krishnachand. Sunitha Williams is finally earthbound, SpaceX Falcon undocks from the
02:16International Space Station. Splashdown on Earth expected at 3.27am this morning.
02:23Over 400 killed in Israel's biggest strike on Gaza since the ceasefire. Supplies of essentials
02:30are cut off to Gaza. Nifty above 22,800. Sensex rises 1,131 points. All sectors in the green,
02:40markets reinforce the recovery momentum. But our top story today comes from Nagpur in
03:04Maharashtra where over 60 people have now been arrested in a police crackdown on rioters who
03:10went on the rampage in Nagpur on Monday evening. Over 30 police personnel including two DGP level
03:16officers were injured in the clashes with the mobs that lasted till midnight. The violence
03:21followed protests by Bajrang Dal workers which saw an effigy of Aurangzeb being burned. In
03:27retaliation, mobs mainly of Muslim youth gathered in Nagpur and attacked public property. All of
03:35which is leaving the question, is Maharashtra becoming the latest communal tinderbox? What
03:40really is the story that has led to this flashpoint in Nagpur? Tonight, we look at all that. First,
03:47our ground report. The streets of Nagpur taken over by mobs that ran riot, pelting stones,
04:00vandalizing cars, setting vehicles on fire. Many police personnel including three senior
04:09officers were injured. While tension has been brewing with political statements and protests
04:16over Aurangzeb, the immediate trigger for the violence on Monday night was a protest by Bajrang
04:22and BHP in which an effigy of the 17th century Mughal ruler was burnt around 5 p.m. The video
04:30of the incident was widely shared with claims that a chadar with holy verses was targeted,
04:35sparking tension. Around 7 p.m., Muslims who had gathered in Mahal area started
04:44sloganeering. A little later, they were pelting stones at the police.
05:44We are in Nagpur. This area is Hamsapuri. The violence took place in Mahal area of Nagpur.
05:55After that, two hours later, there was a huge crowd of about 350 to 400 people covering their
06:02faces, raising slogans, having weapons in their hands. The sharp knife you can see.
06:15Peace returned in a few hours, but the damage caused by the rioters was there for all to see.
06:28Every vehicle that was parked outside on this particular street met the same fate,
06:35including this particular swift desire here as well. Several teams of police,
06:42the contingency you can see, to avoid further escalation and law and order
06:46remains intact is certainly the priority of the state government right now.
06:51Curfew was imposed in more than 10 police station areas. While the police were able
06:57to control the situation without any loss of lives, the city remains on tenterhooks.
07:02With Mustafa Sheikh and Sumi Rajappan, Bureau Report, India Today.
07:12The violence in Nagpur has predictably divided Maharashtra's political establishment.
07:18Remember, the state assembly is going on in Mumbai at the moment. Chief Minister
07:23Devendra Fadnavis is the Home Minister of the state as well. Listening to what he and his
07:28critics had to say today.
07:30The workers of the Bajrang Dala protested in the name of removing the cover of Aurangzeb.
07:38During this protest, they removed the cover of Gautam Pandya.
07:45This is a very old incident on a DCP. So, there is definitely a pattern of some people
07:54who are in favour of removing the cover of Gautam Pandya. Such people will definitely
08:01be prosecuted. Under no circumstances will the law and order be given to anyone.
08:08And let me make one thing clear. Those who have harassed the police will not be spared.
08:15We want to know why there was no reaction from the Chief Minister's office when the
08:21riots started. Whenever such incidents happen in a city, and this is the Chief Minister's
08:28city, he is the Chief Minister and he is also the Home Minister. And it is assumed,
08:33I have seen the CMO very closely, whenever such incidents happen, the first report
08:38comes to the CMO on the CM's mobile phone. It comes to the Home Department as well.
08:42Both the departments are with him. Did they not know that this was going to happen?
08:46My idea is that Bhajap has to fulfill Maharashtra's Manipur.
08:49What you did was that the verses of the Quran, which are written on a piece of cloth,
08:56you burned it. And when this was happening, the local Muslims and Hindus
09:03went and complained to the DCP. After that, in the evening, all these things happened.
09:10I condemn all this violence. But look at it in its entirety.
09:15Okay, we've heard from the politicians. Let's first go to the top cop of Nagpur.
09:19Joining me now, Ravindra Singhal joins me. I appreciate, sir, you're joining me.
09:23What triggered the violence on Monday that has left many of your police personnel injured?
09:28First of all, my sympathies with you and the police force. But there was arson and
09:32stone pelting in the city. What, according to you, led to this sudden spurt in violence?
09:39Yeah, because this was a sudden incident which we see. And when the two communities
09:47they came in front of each other, because that area is a busy area and a crowded area.
09:53It's a mixed locality. So, and because the festival is going on of both the communities,
10:00because yesterday there was a Chhatrapati Shivaji Maharaj Jayanti also.
10:05So people were there and they came in front of each other. But our police was there.
10:10They were able to separate them. But stone pelting started after some time.
10:16And because police was there, they were ahead, I mean, in between both the communities
10:22and they were separated. And we faced the brunt in which our 34 people,
10:30or the personnel, police personnel, they got injured.
10:33Mr. Singhal, it is being reported that there were some videos that were being shared on WhatsApp
10:38which showed a chadar with, allegedly with Quranic verses being targeted.
10:43How true are these claims or what are the rumors that led to this violence?
10:48See, it is not, I can't confirm it because it was there and what was exactly written on it,
10:57whether it was written or not, this we have to see because our officer who was there,
11:03the police inspector, he was, he intervened and he was able to stop them.
11:11And this is, this you can see on social media also. And if there were some verses written on it,
11:18that also it cannot be confirmed. Till now, the officer says that he didn't see that.
11:24And if, but yes, the color they saw was a particular color which people are objecting.
11:33But the point is that this was shown in the social media and that spread the rumors.
11:38And that later on created a mess and they had the scuffle.
11:44You know, Mr. Singhal, it was known that the Bajrang Dal and the BHP are going to hold statewide protests
11:50seeking the removal of Aurangzeb's tomb. Did the police fail to judge the potential for tension on the ground
11:58being caused, especially given that this agitation over Aurangzeb has been going on for a few weeks now in Maharashtra?
12:05You see, I can't say that we failed in our assessment because our force was there.
12:14Yes, this has happened. The stone pelting occurred and there was some arson also, but that was, I mean, emergent.
12:26And there, because our staff was there, we were able to contain this only to a particular area.
12:33And our staff was there and the whole thing was brought under control.
12:38And since the incident has happened, there is no issue till now.
12:44And we have also imposed the curfew in those two particular areas.
12:49And the rest of the city is doing very well and there is no issue at the moment.
12:54But Mr. Singhal, three senior police officers among those injured, DCP Niketan Kadam has suffered serious injuries, I am told.
13:03Have those behind those attacks on the policemen, as the Home Minister or the Chief Minister, who is also Home Minister said,
13:09have any of them been arrested? Was there a targeted attack related to the violence on these police officers?
13:16Yes, of course, because all of us were there and Niketan Kadam was also there on the field with me.
13:25So as the officers were moving inside the bylanes to apprehend the public who was involved in this riot,
13:36so his team and he, they went inside to catch those miscreants.
13:42And in one of the incidents when they were coming back, he was attacked by an axe.
13:48So he stopped it and he has got a cut on his palm.
13:53The Chief Minister today in the Assembly expressed the fear that this could have been a pre-planned conspiracy.
13:59Does anything in your probe so far indicate a conspiracy or was this simply an action and reaction process on the ground?
14:07You see, these things are being checked because they have to be verified and this is what we are doing.
14:15Because social media shows that the rumours were being floated and this is what we are able to see till now.
14:24And accordingly, we are also trying to verify all these facts and those who are involved into this,
14:32those who were spreading the rumours and if they had any plans to create this mess,
14:37all this is being studied well so that I can answer to your question properly.
14:43One more question, Mr. Police Commissioner. We have seen footage of stones being collected from the site of violence.
14:49Does the presence of stones indicate, as is being suggested, that all of this was planned in some way?
14:55Some witnesses are claiming that there were rioters with sticks and swords, so clearly well prepared and well armed.
15:01If you see in the videos, there is not even a single video which will show that people had brought these stones
15:11because as I mentioned, our police was there and the crowd was separated. I was myself present there.
15:19So they were separated because the stones were there as the construction activities are going there.
15:25They used those stones and secondly, the vehicle which you can see in the videos, written NMC,
15:33because all these stones which were lying there, they were cleared after the incident so that there is no further escalation in the situation.
15:44So all those stones were the ones which you see were removed from the site.
15:49One final question, would you say the situation though is completely under control,
15:54has there been any dialogue with local community leaders to ensure peace and normalcy?
16:00So at the moment, our aim is to bring peace. That's what we are doing.
16:05That is why we have imposed the curfew in these two particular areas and the areas which can be affected.
16:13And that is why I feel that the community dialogue will start once we are able to bring the situation to full normalcy.
16:26And maybe by today evening or maybe by tomorrow. This is what we are looking for.
16:32Mr. Singhal, for sparing the time when I know you've got a lot on your mind,
16:37I appreciate you joining us and giving us what you believe has happened there on the ground.
16:42Mr. Singhal, Ravindra Kumar Singhal is the Police Commissioner of Nagpur.
16:46Now, I want to step back for a moment to give you the chronology.
16:50It's important to understand that what happened on Monday has been boiling in a way in Maharashtra for months now.
16:57There have been what you call chutput ghatna, small incidents that are linked to communism
17:02that have been boiling in Maharashtra from love jihad agitations to flare ups over WhatsApp messages.
17:08Let's give you a sense about the aurangzeb chronology for a moment.
17:13November 15, 2024, ahead of the Maharashtra elections last year,
17:17Devendra Fadnavis urged voters to counter the vote jihad, which he said had been launched with a dharma yudh, a holy war of votes.
17:26So there was an attempt that was being made to pit a dharma yudh versus a vote jihad.
17:32On January 15, 2025, the BJP leader, Nitesh Rane, known to make communal statements,
17:39said EVM stands for every vote against Mullah.
17:43This is what he said on camera.
17:45February 14, 2025, the film Chhaba was released based on Chhatrapati Shambhaji Maharaj.
17:51The release led to a divide with some people looking at the pictures of how Shambhaji Maharaj was tortured by Aurangzeb.
18:00And that provoked a lot of angry responses in different parts of Maharashtra.
18:05On March 3, 2025, Samajwadi Party MLA Abu Azmi jumped into the fray, said Aurangzeb was not cruel.
18:12In fact, had built many temples, had been misrepresented.
18:15Deputy Chief Minister Eknath Shinde hit back, said Azmi should be charged with treason.
18:21On March 5, 2025, Abu Azmi was suspended from the assembly for his comments on Aurangzeb.
18:28On March 17, 2025, that's yesterday, the Bajrang Dal and BHP on Shiv Jayanti decided to hold protests demanding removal of Aurangzeb's tomb.
18:39Then there were rumors that were spread of a green Chhatar with holy verses being targeted and set on fire along with an effigy of Aurangzeb during the protests.
18:50Chief Minister Devendra Fadnavis had earlier in the day warned that any glorification of Aurangzeb won't be allowed.
18:57All of this built up into the violence and arson that started in Nagpur in which many police personnel were injured.
19:05I want to turn to our managing editor and based in Mumbai, our Mumbai Bureau Chief, Sahil Joshi, to get a sense of this chronology.
19:15Sahil, has Maharashtra been boiling for a point particularly since the elections of 2024?
19:21Are we seeing this as a reflection of the political polarization taking place?
19:26Well, it clearly sounds like that and it looks like that and it didn't start after the Lok Sabha election.
19:35In fact, I could see that this started even before that and, you know, both the political parties,
19:41specifically the BJP and Eknath Shethid Shiv Sen are in kind of a race between each other that who is actually going to top it.
19:51What we can clearly see that the chronology we just tried to put forward, it can be clearly seen that
19:58continuously after every month, some or the other issue comes up which can be linked with the strong Hindutva stand of the BJP
20:09or that of Shiv Sen and, of course, Minister Nitesh Rane is at the forefront of it.
20:14Be it a law for the Love Jihad, be it the Balhar Certificate against the Halal Certificate in Maharashtra and, of course,
20:22the current scenario with respect to the Aurangzeb's tomb in Khultabad in the Sambhaji Nagar district.
20:30It's been building up since its long time but what is surprising is that a place like Nagpur which is, you know,
20:38I was looking at the NCRB data and there are no traces of religious violence or religious riots in Nagpur in many years
20:48despite Nagpur being part of a central province even before the independence. That had never happened in Nagpur.
20:57And suddenly such kind of situation arises in Nagpur. It's something which really the state has to think about.
21:03Today in the assembly when Maharashtra Chief Minister Devendra Fadnavis gave his official statement as a Chief Minister,
21:10he made a last point saying that Maharashtra is an industrialized state and we are looking for a foreign direct investment,
21:17lot of investment flowing in Maharashtra and such a kind of a situation definitely creates issues for that
21:22and it doesn't leave a good test for the investors in the state.
21:27And looking at that people should follow the restraint but in the political scenario it doesn't seem to be like that.
21:35There is some kind of a race among them. Today suddenly Eknath Shinde, the Deputy Chief Minister
21:40who is actually sulking because the Chief Minister's position slipped away from his hands after the assembly election,
21:48is taking more hardened stand than that of the BJP on the many of the issues.
21:52The current Aurangzeb controversy clearly shows that. So it has been building up in Maharashtra.
21:59We will have to see whether after Nagpur, kind of a shock which has come to the state,
22:04things will maybe mild down a bit because everybody has taken a hit with the current controversy.
22:11Because nobody thought that Nagpur will be hit with the religious violence the way it happened yesterday.
22:17Very interesting what you are saying, Sahil. You are saying that there is competition almost on the ground
22:21between different parties, not to forget the likes of Abu Azmi also who have been stirring it up,
22:26each one playing to their vote banks, each one taking hardened communal positions
22:31and that in a way has almost led to Maharashtra also becoming this communal tinderbox too.
22:37Explain that chronology. I appreciate you joining me, Sahil Joshi, there from Mumbai.
22:44Let's raise the big questions. Is Maharashtra, as I said earlier, becoming this communal tinderbox?
22:50Are there Netas of Maharashtra who are keeping this communal pot boiling?
22:55Why is politics being played over a 17th century ruler Aurangzeb in the 21st century?
23:02I want to go to my face-off. Remember, we normally don't have a political spokesperson now,
23:08but today we believe this issue needs responses from both. My only request to both,
23:13my friend Sanju Verma of the Bharatiya Janata Party, its national spokesperson,
23:17and Clyde Crasto, the spokesperson of the NCP, is let's not talk over each other,
23:22so that you are allowed enough time to have your say without any crosstalk.
23:27That's my only request on the face-off therefore, Clyde Crasto and Sanju Verma.
23:31Sanju Verma, you want to respond first. You heard what Sahil said about the chronology,
23:36about how even before the Lok Sabha elections, Maharashtra has been kept boiling,
23:40how leaders like Nitesh Rane on one side, Abu Azmi on the other, keep making provocative statements,
23:46and this has led to what we've eventually seen in Nagpur. How do you explain it,
23:50that a 17th century ruler like Aurangzeb is going to divide Maharashtra,
23:55India's most industrialized state, in the 21st century?
24:00You know, Rajdeep, there is a famous adage,
24:03those who forget their history are doomed to repeat it.
24:07And I think there is nothing wrong in reclaiming our rich cultural legacy,
24:12and for the longest time, my generation, and I dare say, even future generations,
24:17they've been taught history by the likes of Romila Thapar, Irfan Habib,
24:21we've not been taught history by the likes of K.R. Malkani, R.C. Majumdar, Radha Kumud, Mukherjee,
24:27so on and so forth. Can you imagine, in this day and age, there are people who say,
24:32you know, Aurangzeb was a great administrator, you know, Alauddin Khilji was a great warrior,
24:36you know, Nadir Shah, Chengiz Khan, Taimur Leh, Mahmood Ghazni, Mohammad Ghori,
24:40you know, they were very competent warriors. People forget,
24:45be it Alauddin Khilji, Nadir Shah, Chengiz Khan, Taimur Leh, Alauddin Khilji, Aurangzeb,
24:52all of them, at the core, they were Hindu-phobic, bloodthirsty marauders.
24:58I want to simply ask this question. Is this debate about Ayodhya versus Faizabad?
25:03Is this debate about Allahabad versus Prayagraj? Because, you know, it's been made out to be,
25:08you know, into a debate in terms of the fact that this is...
25:11No, no, one minute. One minute. You see, the fact is that I have statements that have been made on Aurangzeb's tomb, for example.
25:19Devendra Fadnavis on one day will say the tomb must be protected at all costs, it's a government responsibility.
25:26On another day he says it is unfortunate that we have to protect this tomb because of ASI.
25:31You see, you are getting mixed signals. Look at the kind of remarks that Nitesh Rane has made.
25:36My point to you is simply this. Is the BJP or its allies trying to stir the communal pot
25:42because you want to consolidate your Hindutva vote bank?
25:47You know, Rajdeep, I'm coming on your show after a long time. It's great that you're having a political debate.
25:52I would also request as a seasoned anchor, you should not speak over me because then my chain of thought gets irreparably revoked.
26:00And I don't wish to have that happen to me. Yeah, thank you so much.
26:04We are all for FOE. I'm sure Rajdeep Sardesai will respect Sanju Verma's, you know, FOE.
26:10The simple point is this. It is not BJP which is stirring the so-called communal cauldron or the communal pot.
26:18It is not the VHP, the BJP, the RSS or the Bajrang Dal which have been consistently tarnished,
26:25which have been consistently painted with a black brush.
26:28You know, Rajdeep, like I said, where is the problem?
26:31The problem is that today, even in Russia, you don't have people who will glorify Joseph Stalin.
26:37You know, in Cambodia, you don't have people who glorify Pol Pot.
26:40In Germany, you never have people who glorify Hitler. In Uganda, you never have people who glorify Idi Amin.
26:47In, you know, Italy, you don't have people who glorify Benito Mussolini.
26:52Dekhiye hamara naseeb, ya kaho hamari badnaseebi, in India, people who glorify Aurangzeb,
26:59Alauddin Khilji, Mahmood Ghazni, Mohammad Ghori, inside, they are glorified.
27:04No, no, no, can I, no ma'am, you see, I know you, I have to ask you, who is glorifying Aurangzeb according to you?
27:10The tomb has existed for centuries. How is it suddenly, and it has been existed and it's an ASI protected monument.
27:18Now, suddenly, you all seem to see the tomb as glorifying Aurangzeb.
27:22I mean, it seems to me that there is an attempt being made to somehow or the other stir the communal pot.
27:28Are you justifying the comments of a Nitesh Rane, for example?
27:32You know, Rajdeep, let me make one thing very clear. Nitesh Rane, Nitesh Rane, Nitesh Rane,
27:38the tallest leader in Maharashtra today from the BJP is Devendra Fadnavis.
27:43The other tall leader is Nitin Gadkari. They have both said, let us maintain peace and harmony.
27:48But you won't pay attention to Devendra Fadnavis' statement. You won't pay attention to Nitin Gadkari's statement.
27:53Suddenly for you, you know, the chief dramatist personae in this entire case becomes Nitesh Rane.
27:59I just want to tell you one thing. Why is it, and this I speak to you as both the national spokesperson of BJP
28:05and as a bona fide Indian citizen with no offense to you.
28:09Why is it that the very lot which loses no single opportunity to blame the BJP,
28:14Aaj Niketan Kadam, the DCP of Nagpur, a senior IPS officer was attacked with an axe by radicalized Islamist vandals.
28:24Media ke muhne dahi jam gaya.
28:26Four months back, Anup Chaudhary, the Circle Officer of Sambal, barely escaped a bullet.
28:32Media ke muhne dahi jam gaya.
28:36Why can't you call out the bluff of radical Islamist terror?
28:41Radhika Desai, kya aapka dikhat hai?
28:43No, no, I call out the bluff of anyone who resorts to violence and extremism.
28:49You don't call out the bluff of radical Islamist terror.
28:52Ma'am, you've come after a long time and I'm happy to see you on the show.
28:55Let me turn to Clyde Trasto. Clyde Trasto, spokesperson, NCPSP.
28:59I want to ask you, the point that Sanju Verma makes is,
29:02she claims that there is an attempt being made to glorify Aurangzeb
29:06and there are those who resorted yesterday to violence, armed violence.
29:10Whatever else happened, nothing can justify attacks on policemen of the kind that took place yesterday.
29:17Your party stands on the issue, given the charges being made here by the BJP.
29:22See, Rajdeep, you have to remember one thing.
29:26Whoever is glorifying Aurangzeb is wrong.
29:30They are not in sane mind and they have lost their sensibility.
29:34Nobody who is sensible will glorify Aurangzeb.
29:37So whoever it may be, whether it's Abu Azmi or anybody,
29:40they are absolutely wrong in speaking what they speak.
29:43Action should be taken on them and there has been action that has been taken.
29:46But the point here is that if you say that you are not paying attention to what Mr. Gitin Gadkari and Mr. Fadnavis have said,
29:53you are hiding what Nitesh Rane has said.
29:56Why do you hide what Nitesh Rane has said? Take that point also.
29:59And the point here is very, very clear that if you are going to use Aurangzeb's name,
30:05you are actually giving him more credence.
30:07People who have attacked the police should not be spared, whoever they may be.
30:11And where was the intelligence when all this was gathered?
30:14That is what my point is.
30:15And now today, Mr. Devendra Fadnavis comes out and says that it is an ASI protected monument or whatever that may be.
30:23Point is, in the center, there is a Bharatiya Janata Party government.
30:27In the state, there is a Bharatiya Janata Party government.
30:29Why don't they come out with a resolution?
30:31Why didn't they come out with a GR and change the whole ASI thing and do what they want to do?
30:36Do they have the guts to do what they want to do?
30:38No, no, one minute. Mr. Clyde Crasto, one minute.
30:42Sir, I want to ask you. You see, this is the problem.
30:44Are you telling me that you support the demand for raising of Aurangzeb's tomb?
30:49Is that what you are telling me on the show?
30:51That you are daring the BJP to go ahead and raise the tomb?
30:54No, no. BJP is talking about ASI protected monument.
31:02Otherwise, we would have done this. What do you mean by otherwise?
31:05What do you mean by otherwise?
31:07The point is very simple. What is right has to be done.
31:10What is your party's stand?
31:12No, my party's stand is whatever right has to be done, has to be done by the law.
31:18Let the law take its course. That is what I am trying to say.
31:20Also, let me tell you one more thing.
31:22Whatever the law decides, I am not here to make laws.
31:25The lawmakers will make the law. There is a law in this country.
31:28Let the law take its course. I am not a lawmaker.
31:30I cannot tell you what to do.
31:32You cannot tell what has to be done. The law will take its course.
31:35We have a constitution. We have a law. We have a judiciary.
31:38Everything is there. Let's follow it.
31:40I follow it. You follow it.
31:42Mr. Clyde Castro, are you telling me that if the centre decides tomorrow...
31:45One minute. Let me attend.
31:47No, no. If the centre through parliament or through the cabinet says,
31:49okay, this is no longer an ASI protected monument.
31:52We believe it should be raised. You are going to support it?
31:59Can anything be done what the Bharatiya Janata Party is doing?
32:01One day they are saying that I cannot do anything.
32:04The other day they are saying, I wish I could do it.
32:06That's what the last 10 years they are there in government.
32:09They could have done a lot of things. Have they done? Let me tell you.
32:11Again, I will talk what Sanju Verma is talking.
32:13Very rarely will I support Sanju Verma's thing.
32:15You are stopping the chain of thoughts of people when they come on your show.
32:18Let me finish what you are saying.
32:20The Bharatiya Janata Party is crying hoarse that we are supporting Aurangzeb.
32:25Actually, the Bharatiya Janata Party is taking the support of Aurangzeb...
32:29and playing politics here.
32:31There was no need for Nitesh Rana to talk about it.
32:33I want to tell you one more thing.
32:35They took 24 hours to...
32:37Let me finish.
32:38They took 24 hours to suspend Abbas Imazmi.
32:41They took 3 months for Dhananjay Munde to ask him to step down.
32:44When there was so much talk about him, Valmik Karad, his man...
32:48who was involved in the brutal murder of Santosh Deshmukh in Beed.
32:523 months it took them till everybody brought out...
32:54your channel brought out how he was...
32:56Your time is up.
32:58I have heard you.
33:01I have heard you loud and clear.
33:02I want to ask both of you though this at the end.
33:04Because this is really the critical question.
33:06Sanju Verma, Maharashtra, the most industrialized state.
33:09The Chief Minister says, look at the amount of money...
33:12we are attracting in foreign direct investment.
33:14There is the other side of Maharashtra.
33:163 months ago, the incident that was just mentioned or 2 months ago...
33:19by Clyde Crasto, a Sarpanch brutally tortured and killed...
33:23by an aide of the Minister who eventually resigned.
33:26Now what do we see?
33:27Bajrang Dal, VHP, along with Islamic radical groups...
33:31taking the law into their own hands, getting into these clashes.
33:34Is this the image of Maharashtra that a 17th century Aurangzeb...
33:38is going to become a 21st century issue?
33:41Shouldn't the focus be on issues like farm suicides?
33:43How to ensure that Maharashtra progresses further?
33:46Shouldn't that be the real issues?
33:48Are these weapons of mass distraction?
33:51Sanju Verma and mass division.
33:54You know, Rajdeep, you have asked a very broad question.
33:57First and foremost, and I don't want to be interrupted.
34:00Please do not place the VHP, the Bajrang Dal and Islamic radicals...
34:06on the same platform.
34:07VHP and Bajrang Dal, do not say...
34:11Ghustaq-e-Rasool ki ek hi saza Sartan se juda and Sartan se juda.
34:15What Islamic radicals did to a Kanhaiya Lal, to an Umesh Kohli...
34:20to Prashant Pujari, to Praveen Pujari, to Rupesh Pandya...
34:23to Rahul Sharma, to Rahul Rajput, to Krishan Bharwar...
34:27to Veer Annali Migam, to Dilbar Negi, to Khushi Parihar, to Shraddha Valkar.
34:32So the first point is that.
34:34Second point is this.
34:35You know, I think the biggest problem that we have...
34:38is not only that we were taught wrong history...
34:40to glorify the likes of Aurangzeb and Allahuddin Khilji...
34:43but the fact that we have an entire class of so-called educated intelligentsia...
34:48which refuses to call out the bluff of Islamist terror.
34:52And the third and most important point is...
34:54this is the same intellectual intelligentsia...
34:57which gives intellectual cover fire to the likes of Shaheen Bagh writers...
35:01who killed a 23-year-old Ankit Saxena.
35:04To the likes of, you know, those sambandh Islamic radicals...
35:07who shot at Anup Chaudhary.
35:09To the likes of Islamist radicals...
35:11who shot Bishwet and Karan with an arrow.
35:13What is this? No way.
35:15My last point is this.
35:16Yaha dekhta Rajdeep with no offence to you...
35:19Clyde Castro is where you died.
35:21Clyde Castro is giving bhashan to the Bharatiya Janata Party.
35:25Let me remind him...
35:26when he was part of an alliance...
35:29which was in power in Maharashtra...
35:31with the Lendak Uddhav Thackeray as the Chief Minister...
35:34April 2020.
35:35In front of 200 policemen...
35:38two sadhus were brutally beaten up to death.
35:43The Palghar sadhus.
35:45On the lynching of the Palghar sadhus...
35:47Sharad Pawar and Clyde Castro took the credit.
35:52Here you are giving a bhashan to the BJP.
35:54Do you have any shame?
36:15Your view.
36:46Can it change infrastructure?
36:48Can it change every day to day life?
36:50Please put the voice down.
36:53Listen, I did not intend...
36:55Please go ahead. Don't worry.
36:57Don't leave me to anchor. Go ahead.
37:02300 years ago what Aurangzeb did...
37:04is not going to change the life of the people right now.
37:07You know infrastructure...
37:08people wanting to go from home to their workplace...
37:10are going through dug up roads in Mumbai and Maharashtra.
37:13Aurangzeb is not going to come and solve.
37:14You can't go and stand next to a dug up road...
37:16or a pothole and say Aurangzeb is cruel...
37:18and the pothole will be filled up.
37:19It doesn't happen like that.
37:20So let's talk about the problems of the people...
37:22the common people that are suffering.
37:24Let's talk about that.
37:25They want to divert the attention...
37:27of all the issues that are going wrong.
37:29And they're talking about Aurangzeb.
37:30That's what they're doing.
37:31Fair enough.
37:32Weapon of mass distraction.
37:33Weapon of mass division according to one side.
37:36The other side says that they want to...
37:38they condemn the glorification of Aurangzeb...
37:41that is taking place.
37:42Either way, this is the last thing any state...
37:45certainly a state like Maharashtra...
37:47that prides itself on its social reform needs.
37:50We are in the 21st century, my friends...
37:52not in 17th century India.
37:55I appreciate Clyde Crasto and Sanju Verma joining me there.
37:59Let's talk about the problems of the 21st century.
38:02That's why I use the word WMD all the time.
38:05Weapon of mass distraction and division.
38:08The real issues, for example, of Maharashtra...
38:10are the state of the farmers...
38:12who continue to still battle not just financial troubles...
38:16but even water scarcity now in many parts.
38:19Only last week, an award-winning farmer took his life...
38:23after failing to get water for villages in Buldhana district.
38:27Just one of the many farmers of Maharashtra...
38:30who over the last several decades has died by suicide.
38:33Here is a report...
38:35the kind that needs to wake up Maharashtra's politicians.
38:38Take a look. Get really...
38:50If there was a wake-up call for the Maharashtra government...
38:53this would be it.
38:56The death of Kailash Arjun Nagre...
38:58a farmer from Shivni Armal village in Buldhana district...
39:02last week was a shocker.
39:06Just five years ago...
39:08the 43-year-old had been honoured with the Yuva Kisan Award...
39:12by the state government.
39:14Nagre, whose body was found in his field...
39:17had left a four-page suicide note...
39:20highlighting water scarcity faced by farmers in the region.
39:26Incidentally, Nagre, along with farmers of 14 villages...
39:30had gone on a hunger strike last month...
39:33seeking water from the Khadagpurna lake.
40:03Farmers accused the government of ignoring their plight...
40:06and have called for a protest in Mumbai...
40:09on March 19th.
40:12This is not a suicide.
40:15This is a murder committed by the government.
40:18The government is asking for compensation.
40:20Farmers have not received crop insurance yet.
40:22On March 19th, we went to Bombay...
40:24to ask for compensation for farmers...
40:26for crop insurance and soya beans.
40:28On March 19th, we went to Bombay...
40:30to ask for compensation for farmers...
40:32for crop insurance and soya beans.
40:34Thousands of farmers will go to Bombay...
40:36to ask for compensation for farmers...
40:38for crop insurance and soya beans.
40:40We will go to the Arabian Sea...
40:42to ask for compensation for farmers.
40:45The State Relief and Rehabilitation Department...
40:48recently revealed that 2,635 farmers...
40:52had died by suicide in Maharashtra in 2024.
40:58Minister Makaran Jadhav Patil...
41:00in a statement in the Assembly said...
41:02that there have been 1,069 suicides...
41:04in the Amravati Division...
41:06and 952 suicides in the Marathwara Division.
41:11Many of the farmers took the extreme step...
41:14after being unable to pay off loans they had taken.
41:18With Zakir Khan, Bureau Report, India Today.
41:25As I keep saying, these are the real issues...
41:27that should matter to the people of the country.
41:30Farmer suicides, not necessarily what happened...
41:34during Aurangzeb's rule.
41:36Let's turn to some news that's breaking at this moment.
41:39Donald Trump has dialled the Russian President Vladimir Putin...
41:43about an hour or two ago.
41:45White House saying that Trump and Putin are speaking...
41:48as US seeks Russian sign-off on a plan...
41:51to end the war against Ukraine.
41:53The phone call has been underway for nearly two hours now.
41:56The White House says the phone call...
41:58between the two leaders is going well.
42:02I'm joined at this moment by...
42:04Senia Kondratieva.
42:06She's a Russian journalist with Russia Today.
42:08And Gil Pardonner.
42:10He's a non-Russian fellow.
42:12Defence priorities at CSS in Washington.
42:15Appreciate both of you joining us.
42:17Gil, give us a sense.
42:19What does it mean when Washington says...
42:21that the call is going well?
42:23Do we expect any real breakthrough...
42:25in their first conversation itself?
42:27I wouldn't expect an immediate breakthrough.
42:30I think it's going to be a much thornier process...
42:33to get to a deal, even a ceasefire.
42:35I doubt, given how the war is going...
42:37and given Russian progress...
42:39in retaking the Kursk salient...
42:41that the Russians are eager to take...
42:43even a short ceasefire right now.
42:45So you're saying that...
42:47you believe that you don't expect...
42:49an immediate breakthrough, am I correct?
42:51I'd be surprised.
42:53You'd be surprised.
42:55Srinia Kondratieva, what can we expect...
42:57from the Russian side?
42:59Is Vladimir Putin in any mood...
43:01to accept any offer...
43:03for at least a temporary ceasefire?
43:05Well, I think definitely...
43:07the talk in Moscow is that...
43:09there is a window of opportunity...
43:11after three years of no talks.
43:13The dialogue is on.
43:15While we don't know...
43:17the particulars...
43:19they're not in public...
43:21and Moscow definitely...
43:23wants to keep them private.
43:25But there is a window of opportunity...
43:27and all the officials...
43:29What do you mean by a window...
43:31Srinia, what do you mean by a window...
43:33Srinia, sorry, what do you mean...
43:35by a window of opportunity?
43:37Do you believe that Russia...
43:39is willing to accept...
43:41this 30-day ceasefire?
43:43Or does Russia want to take...
43:45advantage of what they believe...
43:47is a superior military position...
43:49on the ground?
43:51What is it that the Russians really want...
43:53from the US President at the moment?
43:55Right, that's why I'm talking...
43:57about the particulars.
43:59It's not clear whether Russia will accept...
44:01and on what terms we've heard...
44:03Vladimir Putin saying that...
44:05Russia in principle would like to accept...
44:07but there are some buts, right?
44:09So I believe this two-hour conversation...
44:11that is probably ongoing still...
44:13as we speak...
44:15is discussing those particulars...
44:17the conditions that Moscow...
44:19have put out before Washington.
44:21We do not know exactly...
44:23what those conditions are...
44:25and I wouldn't go on speculating...
44:27what it is.
44:29When I say window of opportunities...
44:31I refer to the dialogue...
44:33that has started...
44:35with Trump coming...
44:37because as you remember...
44:39since April 2022...
44:41since the talks in Istanbul...
44:43between Russian and Ukrainian side...
44:45fell...
44:47there have been no talks...
44:49no even indication of peace talks.
44:51So that's what I understand...
44:53by window of opportunity...
44:55and as my colleague...
44:57speaker here said...
44:59it will be a very thorny path...
45:01I don't think we should expect...
45:03rapid decisions...
45:05or resolution...
45:07or we don't even know...
45:09if there is a proper peace plan...
45:11at the moment.
45:13So you are saying...
45:15there isn't even clarity...
45:17on what plan is there...
45:19at the moment.
45:21So Jill...
45:23what is this conversation then...
45:25really about?
45:27Is it more about at least...
45:29taking one step forward...
45:31in starting some kind of a dialogue?
45:33Is that all that there is?
45:35Is there a sense that Donald Trump...
45:37has a plan in mind at all?
45:39I think it's important...
45:41in a sense that it breaks that...
45:43line of direct talks...
45:45between the two leaders...
45:47of these world powers.
45:49Obviously the Ukrainians are being left out of this talk today...
45:51and that's potentially ominous.
45:53Certainly from their perspective...
45:55I think they fear nothing more than being left out of a deal...
45:57and being divided up...
45:59between the two great powers at play here...
46:01never mind the Europeans and their role in this.
46:03So I think this...
46:05gets the ball moving certainly...
46:07between Russia and the United States.
46:09I think it's meaningful...
46:11but I would be very surprised if a ceasefire...
46:13let alone a meaningful peace deal...
46:15that's a whole other level of negotiation...
46:17even if the Ukrainians...
46:19end up being left out of this...
46:21and being forced to accept something...
46:23on a plate from the United States and Russia...
46:25with no say in it.
46:27Even if it gets to that point...
46:29I think we're a long way ahead...
46:31even if it is just direct bilateral talks...
46:33between the Russians and the United States.
46:35What if for example Vladimir Putin...
46:37as some widely suspect...
46:39says look...
46:41he wants a commitment that...
46:43Ukraine will not be given NATO membership...
46:45he wants a commitment that...
46:47existing areas which Russia believes are theirs...
46:49within Ukraine...
46:51are allowed to be kept by them...
46:53where they have military personnel already on the ground...
46:55do you believe those are acceptable...
46:57to the Americans at this moment...
46:59particularly as you rightly said...
47:01Ukraine is being kept out?
47:03I think the two things you mentioned...
47:05I mean we've already signaled...
47:07let's say we the United States...
47:09have already signaled that that's going to be acceptable...
47:11those terms you've discussed...
47:13but of course it's much thornier than that...
47:15I think the Russians still claim...
47:17all four Ukrainian oblasts...
47:19that they say they've annexed...
47:21and most of those...
47:23a big chunk of that territory is under Ukrainian control...
47:25Kherson and Zaporizhia...
47:27the Ukrainians still control huge parts of those territories...
47:29in Luhansk and Donetsk...
47:31the Russians have most of those...
47:33and it's a little bit easier...
47:35so is the US willing to concede...
47:37on behalf of Ukraine...
47:39who may not agree...
47:41that the Russians are going to have...
47:43all four of those provinces in totality...
47:45I think that's highly unlikely...
47:47to pass muster with the Ukrainians...
47:49and I think it's important to realize...
47:51Ukrainians have agency...
47:53and have much more agency...
47:55than they did two or three years ago...
47:57when this war started...
47:59they now have an economy...
48:01to some extent and certainly...
48:03industry that's geared towards war...
48:05they're producing 2 million drones a year...
48:07in the upcoming year...
48:09so it doesn't mean they can sustain it entirely themselves...
48:11and they need a lot of outside assistance...
48:13from the US, from the Europeans...
48:15they're in a different position than they were...
48:17OK, let me leave it there...
48:19I've heard two viewpoints...
48:21clearly this is a preliminary meeting by all accounts...
48:23we don't know whether there will be a major breakthrough...
48:25but at least the two sides have begun to talk...
48:27as have Russian and American journalists...
48:29on my show...
48:31so I appreciate both of you joining us...
48:33and let's hope that that window of opportunity...
48:35that Senia spoke about...
48:37is actually built up in the days ahead...
48:39because the not so good news today...
48:41is coming from Gaza...
48:43where reports suggest that...
48:45over 400 people have been killed...
48:47in Israel's biggest strike on Gaza...
48:49since the ceasefire...
48:51supplies of essentials...
48:53have been cut off to Gaza...
48:55and this is another attack...
48:57the Israelis have launched in Gaza...
48:59so much for the ceasefire...
49:01and that's of course...
49:03worrying in Gaza...
49:05so signs of optimism on the Ukraine front...
49:07but not unfortunately...
49:09in the Gaza Strip...
49:17OK, let's then turn to the story...
49:19that hopefully offers some optimism...
49:21at the end of the day...
49:23and that story...
49:25is the countdown to Sunita Williams...
49:27the astronauts return home...
49:29NASA astronauts Sunita Williams...
49:31and Bach Wilmore...
49:33have successfully undocked...
49:35from the International Space Station...
49:37this marks the end of their extended...
49:39nine month journey in outer space...
49:41Sunita Williams expected to touch down...
49:43on Wednesday at 3.27 AM IST...
49:45she's returning aboard...
49:47the SpaceX Dragon spacecraft...
49:49with Wilmore...
49:51and two other crew nine members...
49:53the four astronauts will splash down...
49:55off the coast of Florida...
49:57after a 17 hour journey...
49:59re-entering Earth's atmosphere...
50:01the astronauts have adapted...
50:03to their extended stay...
50:05by engaging in over 150 scientific experiments...
50:07that hopefully will contribute significantly...
50:09to ongoing research in space...
50:11all our thoughts, prayers...
50:13with a successful touchdown...
50:15for Sunita Williams...
50:17I want to tell you this...
50:19about Sunita Williams...
50:21along with school children...
50:23about 16 or 17 years ago...
50:25I found her absolutely wonderful...
50:27very charming...
50:29always reaching out to people...
50:31and she is an example...
50:33in a way...
50:35of what can be achieved...
50:37if you aim for the stars...
50:39so we wish Sunita a happy homecoming...
50:41and I also wish each and every one of you...
50:43have a good night...
50:45sleep well...
50:47and watch God.
50:49NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory, California Institute of Technology