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00:00Hello, and Telesur English presents a new episode of China Now, a web media's production
00:15that showcases the culture, technology, and politics of the Asian giant.
00:19In this first segment, China Currents divides into the top stories of the week, such as
00:24the falling of USAID and how it benefits China and the world, a gala showcasing the future
00:29of China's manufacturing and more.
00:32Let's take a look.
00:37China Currents is a weekly news talk show from China to the world.
00:40We cover viral news about China every week and also give you the newest updates on China's
00:46cutting-edge technologies.
00:48Let's get started.
00:57Welcome to China Currents, your weekly news report on the latest development in China.
01:02I'm Lisa.
01:03In this episode, how well USAID's fall benefit China and the world, Chinese police defeated
01:09US cops in Dubai, a gala showcasing the future of China's manufacturing.
01:15First, let's dive into Trump's big move.
01:18According to a report on the 6th of February, Trump plans to cut the number of employees
01:24at the U.S. International Development Agency, USAID, from over 10,000 to fewer than 300.
01:33Western media view this as a retaliatory move against the Democratic Party, arguing that
01:39it will lead to many developing countries losing vital food and medical aid.
01:43However, Chinese strategist Professor Wang suggested that this development may not be
01:49detrimental to developing countries, particularly China.
01:53Instead, he sees it as a sign of the U.S. moving away from its long-standing global
01:58dominance, which could actually benefit the global South.
02:03To understand this trend, we can focus on two main points.
02:06First, the reduction of USAID indicates that the U.S. machinery of creating chaos around
02:12the world has fallen into brain death.
02:15U.S. global dominance relies on two pillars, military power and cultural warfare.
02:21The military aspect is clear, but the cultural warfare is where USAID plays a significant role.
02:27While the USAID is often seen as an international aid organization, it actually functions as
02:33a tool for the U.S. to protect its interests and maintain its dominance without using military force.
02:39After the U.S. military establish a presence in the region, it needs a low-cost method
02:44to maintain control.
02:46This involves weakening local resistance and anti-war sentiment.
02:50USAID act as a remote control, often through funding and influencing foreign media.
02:56For example, in 2023, Reporters Without Borders, RSF, reported that USAID funded over 6,200
03:04journalists and 707 media outlets across 30 countries, as well as 279 media-focused NGOs.
03:13In Ukraine, USAID was the primary sponsor of many independent media outlets, with 90%
03:19of them relying on foreign subsidies to operate.
03:22This strategy was clearly seen during the 2014 coup in Ukraine, where the manipulation
03:28of public opinion by various independent media funded by outside forces helped lead to the
03:33removal of the democratically elected President Yanukovych.
03:38If USAID had been shut down a decade earlier, this conflict in Ukraine might not have occurred.
03:45It's even possible that the global COVID-19 pandemic could have been avoided.
03:50On 3 February, Musk revealed that USAID had funded research into biological weapons, including
03:56gain-of-function studies on the virus, which contributed to the deaths of 7 million people
04:02worldwide.
04:03If USAID's record hadn't been exposed, the rumors surrounding the Wuhan virus would
04:09have smeared China much more.
04:11Furthermore, more man-made viruses could have continued to threaten the world.
04:15Now onto the second point, ending USAID will make all sovereign states great again.
04:21Trump simultaneously announced a 90-day suspension of all foreign aid.
04:26The New York Times reported that this decision could make an already fragile ceasefire more
04:31fragile, noting that during the Gaza War, USAID provided over $1 billion in assistance
04:37to Gaza and the West Bank, helping tens of thousands of Palestinian refugees with food
04:42supplies.
04:43However, a closer look reveals the hypocrisy in the New York Times' stance.
04:49According to Brown University, in 2024, the U.S. provided $17.9 billion in military aid
04:55to Israel, over 10 times the amount given for Palestinian refugee aid.
05:01Trump even suggested that the U.S. could claim ownership of Gaza.
05:05What's more alarming is that the food aid itself has been linked to plans for biological
05:10warfare.
05:11In November 2021, USAID announced it would donate 3,000 tons of wheat seeds to Syria,
05:18claiming that the goal was to ensure bread for everyone.
05:21However, when Syrian agriculture officials examined the seeds, they found that 40% were
05:26infected with a parasite called nematode.
05:29They warned farmers to destroy the seed or risk damaging their land's agricultural value
05:35for years.
05:36In December 2024, Bashar al-Assad, the former president of Syria, was forced to resign.
05:42Assad's government had long subsidized a type of flatbread, which cost only 400 Syrian
05:48pounds for 12 pieces, that's about 3 cents in USD.
05:52For Syrians living on just $2 a day, this flatbread was crucial for living.
05:57It was literally the bread for everyone.
06:00However, according to MEM, after Assad's resignation, bread prices in Damascus skyrocketed
06:07by 900%.
06:09On 6 January 2025, the U.S. announced plans to ease sanctions against Syria and allow
06:15human aid to enter the country.
06:17It's important to note that the previous Syrian government still managed to feed the
06:21population, even though much of the agriculture production was controlled by the Kurds.
06:26And also, this was against the backdrop of the U.S. using sanctions to damage Syrian
06:30agriculture.
06:31However, after the U.S. relaxed sanctions and allowed aid, many Syrians began to starve.
06:38Similar situations in Afghanistan and Venezuela show that it's not foreign aid that guaranteed
06:43food security, but rather a stable government that effectively serves its people.
06:48This highlights how USAID has contributed to starvation in developing countries.
06:53If USAID hadn't been so involved in promoting revolutions and biological warfare, the people
06:59in these nations could have survived with dignity.
07:02Ironically, the U.S.'s so-called charitable aid has often turned them into beggars of
07:07the free world.
07:08So, while Trump's decision to shut down USAID may have been driven by political motives
07:13and a desire to scale back, it also weakens the backbone of U.S. global dominance.
07:19When the propaganda machine stops, people in developing countries may finally see that
07:24their true saviors are themselves.
07:26And this realization will help those in the global South to regain confidence and collectively
07:31work towards a multipolar world order.
07:34For the U.S., the saving of these cuts won't be enough to stop its decline, but they do
07:39show that the Trump administration understand the challenges of maintaining global hegemony.
07:45Strategically, moving away from this dominance might indeed be a smarter and more practical
07:49choice for the U.S. today.
07:51Next up, let's see how Chinese police set a new world record.
07:56The UAE SWAT Challenge 2025 began on 1 February in Dubai.
08:01This intensive five-day event brings together top law enforcement and military teams from
08:06around the world to showcase their skills in challenging tactical situations.
08:12This year, the competition set a new Guinness World Record, with a record-breaking of 105
08:17teams with 46 countries participating.
08:20China sent three teams into this year's challenge.
08:23The team from Zhejiang Province won the championship, while the Anhui Province team took home the
08:28bronze medal.
08:30The Chinese team competed in five demanding events, including rapid assault tactics, firepower
08:35strikes, officer rescue mission, tower operation, and extreme obstacle courses.
08:42After making their debut in last year's competition, the Zhejiang SWAT team set a
08:46world record in this year's tower assault event, completing it in an impressive 2 minutes
08:52and 33 seconds.
08:54The event stimulates railroad hostage rescue and counterterrorism operations, challenging
09:00teams to swiftly breach and clear a multi-story building.
09:04The Zhejiang team consists of nine members, with the oldest being 33 and the youngest
09:0925.
09:10One member, Liu Peng, born in 1998, has been a police officer for eight years.
09:15Since learning about the UAE SWAT Challenge last January, he dedicated 90% of his time
09:21to training.
09:22In China, the police are referred to as the People's Police.
09:26This is significant.
09:27According to Chinese official media, in 2023, reports of theft and robbery nationwide decreased
09:33by over 31% compared to 2019.
09:37During the same period, human trafficking cases dropped by 66%.
09:41Additionally, a total of 42,000 drug-related crimes were solved in 2023, marking a 74.5
09:50decrease from previous highs.
09:52Also, despite an increase of 116 million motor vehicles and 112 million licensed drivers
09:58over the past five years, road traffic accidents in China have actually declined.
10:03Most importantly, Chinese are not afraid of the police because they truly serve the people.
10:09Next up, on the 28th of January, the 2025 Chinese Spring Festival Gala showcased a groundbreaking
10:15blend of tradition and technology.
10:1816 unitary H1 humanoids robots dressed in traditional Chinese floral patterned jackets
10:23danced alongside professional performers.
10:27They executed a folk dance with impressive precision, even tossing and catching handkerchiefs
10:32in mid-air, which entertained viewers.
10:34This interesting performance was the result of three months of AI-powered training, precise
10:39coordination of 43 high-torque joints, and a 360-degree sensing system.
10:47Using deep learning, the robots analyzed and mimicked human dance moves, generating real-time
10:52commands that made their movements both powerful and precise.
10:56If these robots can toss a handkerchief, they can certainly handle other tasks, like turning
11:01a screw.
11:02Notably, while Tesla's Optimus robot costs up to $30,000 each, the unitary H1 is priced
11:08at around $14,000, making it a more affordable option for small businesses and developing
11:15countries.
11:16And that is all for today's China Currents.
11:18Thank you for watching this episode.
11:20And if you have any thoughts or comments about our show, please reach us at the email address
11:24below.
11:25We look forward to hearing from you and see you next time.
11:31Let's take a short break, but don't go away because we'll be right back.
12:02Welcome back to China Now.
12:06Today, Overlap welcomes Chris Youngs together with Trevor Nkube, Zimbabwean entrepreneur
12:12and newspaper publisher.
12:14Let's see.
12:24Welcome to Overlap, brought to you by Wave Media.
12:27My name is Chris.
12:28I'm an ex-journalist and a media content creator in China.
12:32Today, I'm really thrilled to be in conversation with Trevor Nkube, a veteran journalist and
12:39entrepreneur from the great nation of Zimbabwe.
12:42Welcome Trevor.
12:44Thank you so much, Chris.
12:45What a pleasure and a privilege to be with you.
12:49I look forward to our conversation, Chris.
12:52Thank you so much for the opportunity.
12:55I've done a little bit of homework about your past.
13:01What I understand is that you are from the western part of Zimbabwe.
13:07You ran newspapers and other forms of media.
13:11You have been in this industry for a very long time.
13:17What is a rather recent development that you have started your podcast in conversation
13:24with Trevor?
13:25A lot of Chinese internet users are not used to such long-form videos.
13:30They like, you know, Douyin, a Chinese TikTok, they like to swipe across the screen.
13:37So people in my profession, they lament, ah, these people, they are just mentally lazy.
13:45They just love to detainment.
13:48They don't really want to go off the truth.
13:51They don't want to hear complete stories with different angles and nuances.
13:57It seems to me that we as content creators have yet to find a way.
14:02And I think I want to hear from you, as you have done very successfully with your channel.
14:09Before I do that, I must ask you, though, why did you decide to go independent and to
14:15do long-form journalism?
14:16Why did you decide to do that?
14:20The primary reason, I would say, is because I watch a lot of such content online.
14:28I see such long-form videos, especially podcasts, are very, very popular in the West.
14:37Maybe not so much so popular in the UK, but certainly in the United States.
14:43My previous organization, Guancha, is a very political...
14:48We talk about international politics all day long, and we watch the rise of Donald Trump
14:55very closely.
14:56And when Donald Trump announced when his campaign got successful, when he was elected, he thanked,
15:04the person he thanked was Joe Rogan.
15:06So Joe Rogan, the biggest podcaster, was a kingmaker in that election.
15:13So I thought, wow, such influence.
15:18He could reach out to so many people, and those people were genuinely having a good
15:23time on his show, watching his content, even though it's controversial from time to time.
15:28So I thought, why can't we just create such videos in China?
15:33We talk...
15:34China, we have a lot of interesting people, so why can't we have such interesting conversations?
15:39So I wanted to try this, but it seems to me that we have yet to find a way to conduct this thing.
15:48Why do you say that, Chris?
15:49I'm sorry, I'm going to push.
15:50Why do you say that you are still yet to find a way of doing it?
15:55What seems to be the problem for you?
15:58The problem is, you know, in China, the stereotypical time span for Chinese online content is from
16:1015 minutes to 20 minutes.
16:12That's a typical Chinese long form video.
16:17And those kind of conversations I do, they easily run into one hour, one and a half hours.
16:24I was having a hard time struggling with how to edit the conversation, because I think,
16:29oh, they are so wonderful, but you have to listen to this part.
16:34There's a way of ramping up to that fascinating part of the story.
16:38You have to listen from the beginning.
16:41But our viewers, they can't wait.
16:43And I received a suggestion from Douyin, the Chinese TikTok.
16:49We work with them very closely.
16:51And they suggested to me, Chris, you need to put the best part in the first two seconds.
16:56The first two seconds.
16:57If you don't get their attention in the first two seconds, you're done.
17:01It's like, how to get people so interested in a person with just in five seconds.
17:08OK, give me five seconds.
17:09I can't do that.
17:11So I'm still struggling with that.
17:14Yeah, I hear your pain, Chris.
17:18But I'll tell you where I come from.
17:21My thing, Chris, is like you.
17:24I love watching podcasts.
17:26I love watching long podcasts.
17:29I love reading books that take me into how somebody thinks.
17:33Different ways of doing things.
17:35I love watching opera.
17:37I love watching a long conversation with Bill Gates and that kind of stuff.
17:42I love watching things to learn so that I grow.
17:47And like you, I want to think that there's a lot more people like you and I who want
17:54to watch things so that they grow, so that they learn.
18:00And here is what I suspect we are at the risk of doing.
18:07Dumbing down our journalism to get a larger audience.
18:13But we need to ask ourselves, which is why I asked you, Chris, why are you doing this?
18:20I think at the center of everything that we do is that why.
18:24Why are you doing this?
18:25And for me, that why, Chris, gets to answer the question, are we successful or are we
18:33not successful?
18:34You ask me now, am I successful?
18:36Absolutely.
18:38Do I want bigger numbers?
18:40Absolutely.
18:41Do I have big numbers?
18:43Not now, but I am very clear that history will prove you and I right.
18:50That the public, Chris, will begin to walk towards quality.
18:55The public will begin to walk towards long form.
19:00That the evidence out there, Chris, says the world is divided because we are consuming
19:08this fragmented content.
19:10Which doesn't tell you the whole picture.
19:13We are consuming this two and a half second content which riles you, make you angry without
19:20knowing what the other two minutes were of the content.
19:24Therefore, the responsibility for you and I, Chris, is not so much to be swayed by the
19:30people that want the two seconds.
19:32Let TikTok and Doin do whatever they're doing.
19:36You and I, let's focus on content that is what I call stickability.
19:44This is content that people keep on coming back to.
19:47Chris, we also have an opportunity.
19:49Let's use Doin to get people to have a view into our content.
19:58Interestingly, Chris, we found that our small clips, the consumption of those clips is
20:05into millions.
20:07That's okay.
20:09I would want millions to watch an episode like this.
20:13But it's not happening.
20:14But guess what?
20:16Each million that watches the TikTok clip, there's one or two people that come back to
20:21watch us.
20:22So I think it's important to ask ourselves, Chris, and to be very clear about what is
20:28the why of what we're doing.
20:31And if the why is accompanied by we want to achieve long-term goals, not just short-term
20:39goals of getting a million people, you get 10 million people.
20:43Why?
20:44Why do you want 10 million people?
20:46I want to affect Zimbabweans and the continent in a positive way.
20:53And I understand that that's a piece of work that is heavy lifting.
20:59It's not going to be easy because you want to engage people.
21:02You want to inform people.
21:03Chris, you and I have a big responsibility.
21:07The world is divided.
21:09There's so much toxicity.
21:11And that toxicity and the division, Chris, comes from the fact that we are the most,
21:18we are a society, you and I, that lives in an era where technology has made, has flooded
21:26us, drowned us with information, but we are the least informed people that have ever walked
21:32this planet.
21:35Yeah, I completely agree.
21:39Sometimes I do self-reflection over my past career.
21:44The way I see it, I think, let me just begin by a Francis Bacon quote, knowledge is power.
21:52Yeah.
21:52If you say knowledge is power, then getting to know stuff is gaining power.
21:59And certainly that will disrupt the pre-existing power hierarchy and power balance in a society.
22:06So those who are in the powerful positions, they will act, the elite class will act as
22:14gatekeepers to control information, basically.
22:19So the formation of knowledge is traditionally that the profession of journalism is in the
22:25business of forming knowledge, informing people, right?
22:30You take raw material, which are the facts on the ground, you do some selection of facts,
22:36and also you process such information.
22:39And more often than not, my view, this is my view, those people who are in the institutional
22:48media are swayed by political forces.
22:52So they will instill political biases in the narratives they create.
22:58So their analysis is not the reader's analysis.
23:02They're taking on things, it's not the reader's taking on things, but they present them as
23:07solid facts to people so that people skip the process, skip the step of thinking.
23:12They jump immediately to conclusion.
23:15So if they tell you, okay, China is bad, let's say China is creating a debt trap in
23:20Africa and China is taking over the world resources, and people will, okay, China is
23:28bad.
23:30Instead of just going to conduct investigation like investigative journalists do.
23:37So because while people, the way we observe our environment, we only live within a few
23:44blocks.
23:45We go to work, we go home, we don't know what's happening to the outside world.
23:50We rely very heavily on the kind of curated information we receive every day.
23:56So if we receive pieces of information from institutions with political agenda, though
24:05we are very subjected to biases and that kind of things.
24:10So I think traditional media is losing out in this regard.
24:16And I don't know whether you have, previously I mentioned the case of Trump, and also before
24:23Trump was elected, Washington Post, they made a decision not to endorse any of the two,
24:29Kamala Harris or Trump, any of those two candidates.
24:33And they say it was the decision of Jeff Bezos, the owner of the newspaper.
24:38And the owner of the newspaper wrote an op-ed next day saying, the hard truth is Americans
24:45don't trust media.
24:46So the traditional institutional media lost, completely lost public trust.
24:54That is true because of agendas associated with these big media companies.
25:01And so, but we must also put the onus on the reader.
25:08You ask in terms of, are the readers discerning in terms of what they're reading?
25:17Are they selective?
25:19What do they choose to read?
25:22And why are they reading or why are they listening to podcasts?
25:27Why are they listening to TikTok?
25:30What kind of world are we going to become if the reader is not discerning?
25:36If you recall that the fundamental principle of media was freedom of expression.
25:45The individual must express themselves.
25:48Stable societies, accountability, we are dependent and co-dependent on each other.
25:55We all need each other.
25:57But society throughout the world, Chris, is fragmenting.
26:02Your truth is no longer my truth.
26:05How can that be?
26:06How can that be?
26:08So I fear, Chris, that the issue that you and I are discussing right now is huge.
26:16And unfortunately, it is spinning out of control because everybody's now a publisher.
26:24Everybody now has a podcast.
26:26For me as a Christian, there's a place in the Bible where there's a tower of battle
26:32where we are all talking but not understanding each other.
26:36I mean, where is this going to end?
26:40Where you're talking to me, I'm not understanding you.
26:43You live in your own little ghetto, Chris.
26:47I live in my own little ghetto.
26:49I come from work, I go home.
26:50I've got my Facebook people.
26:52I've got my Dion people and so forth.
26:54We have these clusters of people across social media who don't talk to each other,
27:01who don't know each other, who don't communicate.
27:04Yeah, I can feel you.
27:06I definitely can feel you.
27:07I think you've raised a question, a very interesting question.
27:10Why do people need to read news?
27:13Why do people listen to podcasts?
27:15To me, I think there is this psychological benefit that you think you are relevant,
27:21that you think you are connected to the world.
27:24Even though you may be very isolated in the basement,
27:27you're just rolling computer screen,
27:30thinking that you understand what's happening remotely in Russia.
27:33And you're an armchair strategist,
27:36telling people how to run big countries like China and America.
27:40In fact, you can never manage your own home.
27:42You don't even buy a grocery.
27:44That kind of thing happens, yes.
27:46I think it's a world, the way I see it,
27:50is that our division of labor is so thorough
27:54that we only need to excel or do in one aspect.
28:00You just do this, and he just does that.
28:02And we combine our efforts, it's going to make the society run.
28:05So that people are super absorbed into their own stuff.
28:10But they need to maintain this idea that somehow they are connected.
28:14They are not out of touch with the reality.
28:17But in fact, they are.
28:18So that they need to take in information
28:21and need to take in the kind of stories about how other people perceive you.
28:26So you can have an understanding of your mutual relation, in a sense.
28:33So I feel this business is experiencing a very significant transformation.
28:39I have another very encouraging new phenomenon I observe in China nowadays.
28:45It could be very interesting to you.
28:49The previous administration was going to ban TikTok.
28:55So they say, you have a deadline, which is January 19th.
29:00After that, we're going to ban TikTok.
29:02And American TikTok users are flooding into Chinese social media platforms.
29:09They call themselves TikTok refugees.
29:11They flooded into China, and they interact with Chinese internet users directly
29:16without going through any intermediaries,
29:18telling you that Chinese people are living miserably,
29:21or telling you American people are living a superfluous life.
29:26They just check with each other the items.
29:32How much do you spend on food?
29:34How much do you spend on clothing?
29:36How much do you spend on traffic fares and travel fares,
29:40and housing, medical bills, education?
29:44So that people understand, have a broad, a vague,
29:48but more complete picture of each other's life.
29:52So you're not an abstract idea of Chinese coming.
29:57And they are not just evil US imperialists.
30:01We are living people, living and breathing,
30:05and trying to have a happy life for ourselves.
30:09So in that way, people's distance is reduced tremendously by technology.
30:16We'll have to adapt to this, I think, to this changing technological landscape.
30:22I think journalists in the past have this role of public knowledge.
30:32In a way, you're educating people to be in pursuit of truth,
30:37in pursuit of truth, basically.
30:40But then suddenly, you find yourself,
30:43okay, I may not know the truth, I'm also investigating the truth.
30:47And there are people out there on the internet
30:50who could be closer and get to the bottom faster than I could.
30:54So I'm not a teacher anymore.
30:57I need to learn.
30:58So in the end, I'm just an average person on the internet.
31:03I think, Chris, you put your finger right onto it.
31:06Our responsibility, Chris, is...
31:08So first of all, clearly, media,
31:12somebody's moved the cheese as far as media is concerned.
31:15And the game has changed big time.
31:17So for you and I to remain relevant, Chris,
31:22I want to posit that what we need to do is
31:26to be better informed than the public, okay?
31:30So more experts, more qualified people,
31:34rather than commoditized news.
31:38I mean, commoditized news like,
31:40you know, someone was run over by a car there.
31:44That will never be in a newspaper anymore
31:46because it's going to be on Twitter,
31:48it's going to be on TikTok.
31:49So I think the challenge, Chris,
31:53where we will remain relevant is,
31:57can we be the source for investigative journalism?
32:02Can we be the source for analysis,
32:05expertise, expert analysis on things like climate change,
32:10if we agree that there's climate change,
32:12law, for instance, technology, for instance?
32:16Because not everybody's going to be an expert
32:19on what's the cheap to buy from NVIDIA
32:22and that kind of stuff.
32:23So there's going to be, for me,
32:27more specialization within our industries.
32:30So generalists will fall away
32:33because everybody is a generalist.
32:36So more specialists in business,
32:39more specialists in how to deal with AI
32:42and the advantages of dealing with AI,
32:44the pros and cons and so forth.
32:45So I'm thinking that there will still be that place
32:51for long form, deep journalism
32:55that provides the expertise,
32:58that answers the questions that the public has.
33:02Let that long form, Chris, be informed.
33:05Let it be expert.
33:07When I'm saying expertise,
33:08not within the pejorative way of expertise,
33:11you're pushing a certain agenda,
33:13but just to be impartial,
33:16present the facts to people to make up their minds.
33:20I think there was still going to be that point.
33:24We are so immersed, Chris,
33:26in this noise, in this hate,
33:29in this toxicity, in this division,
33:32that more and more of us are going to hunger
33:36for real information, which is researched.
33:40We will find people coming back to good journalism.
33:45We will find societies and communities.
33:48We'll find people investing in local community titles
33:54that run a story about my school,
33:58where my child goes,
33:59and their schools and that kind of stuff.
34:01It might be on the internet or whatever.
34:05People will hunger for real news.
34:08People will hunger for fact check news.
34:10People will realize that spending so much time
34:13on WeChat, on WhatsApp and that kind of stuff
34:18just floods you with gossip, which is not real stuff.
34:22Yes, I wanted to go a little bit to,
34:24because you have said that media has played
34:27a tremendous role in shaping our understanding
34:30of our society.
34:32And also, we ultimately will have to embrace
34:36our traditional values when it comes to make a decision
34:40of what we really need to know about the world.
34:44So I want to ask you about general public in Zimbabwe,
34:50and also by extension in South Africa.
34:53How do they get to know about China?
34:55And what do you think?
34:57Do you think they are getting sound information
35:00about China?
35:01Or do you think there needs to be improvement
35:05in the kind of sort of information gap
35:07that we need to bridge?
35:09Oh, yeah.
35:10So the answer to your question is that people
35:13don't know much about China.
35:16That's the general public.
35:17They don't know much about China.
35:19Language is one of the, I think,
35:22hindrances that get in the way of Zimbabweans
35:25and Africans getting to know more about China.
35:28Distance is another thing.
35:30The complex issues involved are another thing.
35:34So to your question, there is need for China
35:39to up its game as far as communication is concerned.
35:44Whether it's a way of communicating in a language
35:47that the majority of the people understand,
35:50or it's a way of making media accessible
35:53in a way that people understand.
35:55But the bottom line is that people
35:57don't know much about China.
36:00That people rely on stereotypes about China.
36:05And those stereotypes increase informed
36:10by what people see, read, watch,
36:15what they experience in their neighborhoods.
36:18I don't know how traveled you are, Chris,
36:20but every, I mean, there are Chinese everywhere.
36:25In Zimbabwe, there's a lot of Chinese
36:27and they are into all sorts of things.
36:29So sometimes people's face-to-face interaction
36:32with Chinese forms their views of the Chinese.
36:36Sadly, there's a stereotype which is negative
36:40about the Chinese.
36:41And those stereotypes are that they are exploitative,
36:47they are cruel, they are corrupt
36:49because they come in and do business
36:51with government ministers who are known
36:55or assumed to be corrupt.
36:58That any business that they deal with,
37:01that they're engaged in is not kosher business,
37:03is not above the board, as it were.
37:07But you know, Chinese diplomats
37:10need to communicate better and communicate differently.
37:14There needs to be more of an exchange of information
37:18between the Chinese that are in particular
37:21individual countries with the locals that are there
37:23to dispel some of these notions.
37:26Just like, I mean, I had lunch,
37:30my wife and I had lunch with the Chinese ambassador
37:33only last week, last week on Monday, actually.
37:36And even I, I was blown away by the things
37:41that the Chinese ambassador was saying.
37:45They are good Chinese and bad Chinese.
37:47But the stereotype out there is that all Chinese are bad.
37:52They come in, they break rules,
37:54they destroy the environment and that kind of stuff.
37:58And maybe also, what kind of people leave China
38:01to go and do business abroad?
38:03I don't know what kind of people these are
38:05who leave China to come and do business abroad.
38:07Are they doing so well?
38:08Or they go out because they see opportunities
38:11to make a quick buck and come back
38:13and they don't care about the environment
38:14where they are doing business.
38:16So the bottom line, Chris, to answer your question is,
38:19no, people don't know much about Chinese.
38:22They need to know more about the Chinese.
38:25Yes, China needs to communicate differently.
38:28The embassies need to do more in getting the locals
38:32to understand what China is all about.
38:34I mean, allow me to turn, Chris, and share with you.
38:39I mean, I'm currently reading this book.
38:41I finished reading it, rather.
38:43Can you see it?
38:44Yes.
38:47She has done a great job for me of telling the Chinese story
38:52in a manner that people understand.
38:54I've just finished reading it.
38:55And I invited her to be a delegate
39:00at our annual Ideas Festival in Zimbabwe.
39:03And she interacted with people virtually.
39:07And people were hungry to learn.
39:09Just right now, my PA has, I bought a copy for somebody else
39:14who reached out to me and says, can you buy me this book?
39:17And this book is now selling in Zimbabwe
39:19because I recommended this book to a lot of people
39:22because it has made me understand
39:25the importance of culture in China,
39:28that Chinese love China,
39:30that it's not every Chinese who's wanting to escape
39:34to the West and that kind of stuff.
39:35So there's a lot of Western propaganda.
39:38And by the way, Chris, I've decided that going on,
39:42I'm going to be reading books on China by Chinese
39:46so that I don't have Western gatekeepers
39:49telling me what China is.
39:52So China needs to get more Africans, not African,
39:56Africans, people in Latin America and so forth
39:59to go to China and experience China,
40:02to experience Chinese media,
40:04to have an engagement with Chinese diplomats and so forth.
40:07I've made it my own personal agenda, by the way, Chris,
40:11to learn more about China, but from Chinese authors
40:14rather than from somebody else.
40:15I don't know if that answers your question.
40:17Oh, yes, yes, yes.
40:19I think it's very important thing that you have mentioned
40:21is that people don't have sources to get to know China.
40:29And it's the same here in China.
40:30When I want to find information on Zimbabwe,
40:34I search on English language channels like I Google,
40:42I use Wikipedia, I use YouTube, I watch your content.
40:47And all those content are predominantly
40:52international global media in English.
40:56And I guess because Zimbabweans, they speak English.
41:00And when you want to know China,
41:03you go to an English language news website
41:06or information website
41:07and you search for Chinese information about China.
41:11You don't go to a Chinese website
41:13telling you information on China.
41:16So and that English language
41:18being the lingua franca of the world,
41:21I think is one of the issues
41:23because Chinese people, they are not multilingual.
41:26No.
41:27Only a fraction of the Chinese population, 1.4 billion people,
41:30a fraction of them can converse with people freely in English.
41:35And that's kind of problematic.
41:38I imagine a lot of encounters you have in Zimbabwe
41:44with Chinese people.
41:45Do you think, oh, these people, they like to stick to themselves.
41:48They don't respect local culture.
41:50They don't know how.
41:53Yeah, they don't know how to appreciate the local culture.
41:57So, yeah.
41:58So in the end, they come across as cold or arrogant,
42:03but Chinese people are not arrogant, generally speaking.
42:07There are some, of course, there are some,
42:09I would say, like people everywhere.
42:12The Chinese people, there are good Chinese people,
42:14bad Chinese people, xenophobic Chinese people,
42:16warm Chinese people, all kinds of people.
42:19But in general, the people who go overseas,
42:24they want to take the risk of setting up their business abroad
42:28in another completely foreign environment
42:31are those more adventurous people
42:34and those people who are more open to the outside world.
42:38And it's generally assumed they are not narrow-minded.
42:44They do not have a pre-made mindset about the stereotypes.
42:50Yeah.
42:51So, but I think a lot of these unfortunate misunderstandings
42:55are due to lack of information, lack of interaction.
42:59And the lack of interaction to some extent
43:02is due to this familiarity with each other's language.
43:07And the fact we are now talking to each other in English
43:12is a reflection to that fact that we cannot converse,
43:16I cannot talk to you, I don't know, are you from Ndebele?
43:21Yes, Ndebele, yes, yes.
43:22Ndebele, the language is a Bantu language?
43:26It's Ndebele, it's Ndebele, the language is Ndebele.
43:29So I speak Ndebele, it's spoken in South Africa,
43:31it's spoken in Zimbabwe.
43:33It's a fundamental point, Chris.
43:37It would be lovely if you were speaking Chinese
43:40and I speaking Ndebele and we can talk,
43:43but that's going to take a long time.
43:46But that's the ideal place.
43:47I agree with you completely, Chris, on that.
43:52Yeah.
43:53Well, I mean, not going to be a long time, I think,
43:56because, well, some technological gadgets,
43:58like you wear our specs and you can translate immediately
44:03what the other party is saying to the local language.
44:07That is, the earth is shrinking very fast,
44:10technology has done that.
44:12But I think the more basic thing is what do people need?
44:17Like you have mentioned earlier,
44:20the things we need in our life,
44:21the good life that we all want to live,
44:25the good life may not necessarily be materialistic,
44:29how much money you make.
44:30It also has to do with your inner mentality,
44:34your inner peace.
44:35How do you reconcile with your social relations?
44:40You have lamented earlier about the fact
44:43that people are glued to their phones,
44:46that they are in total disregard of their social environment.
44:50The more intrinsic need is that people need
44:54to be in touch with other people.
44:56So there's this need, this fundamental need.
45:01Technology has just created a false feeling
45:05that you are connected somehow
45:07with the number of likes you receive.
45:10Ah, you are very popular,
45:11but in fact, you're probably just a miserable person
45:16in your own basement doing videos.
45:19Just we are so engrossed by the fact
45:23that technology has enabled us to better perceive,
45:28may not be better, may not be the right word,
45:30to perceive with greater precision
45:34and greater magnitudes the kind of relation
45:38we want to pursue in our life.
45:40But in fact, you could be wandering further
45:43and further away from the real interactions between people.
45:47And that's really sad.
45:48And I think as super normal people,
45:53super average person,
45:54that we probably will have to convey to our peers
45:59the more holistic approach to our lives,
46:06to connect with people.
46:08Our conversation will have to be more engaging with them.
46:11So we ourselves will need to understand their needs,
46:15basically their psychological needs
46:18when they consume information online and otherwise.
46:22And I think that's a really challenging task for us.
46:26I think I agree with you.
46:29That's going to be the heart of the matter.
46:32How do we get, remember what I say,
46:35that is the public discerning
46:37in what kind of content that they're consuming?
46:41Do they know the difference between fake content
46:45and genuine good content?
46:48Do they know that?
46:49Do they care about that?
46:51I think our responsibility is to do our work
46:58in a humble manner that makes people care about what we do.
47:04For people to realize that without a good media,
47:09without researched information,
47:12society is at risk.
47:14So the onus is on us,
47:16but we are fighting.
47:17The headwinds are huge.
47:20Those headwinds include the corporates.
47:23Those headwinds include the public
47:26who don't seem to have time
47:29to engage with the stuff that we're doing.
47:31But let's not blame the customer.
47:34Let's do what we're supposed to do and do it well.
47:36Chris, it's been good chatting to you.
47:39I need to run.
47:40I really have thoroughly enjoyed this, yeah.
47:42Me too, I enjoyed it very much.
47:44And I hope our conversation will continue in the future
47:47because I think it's a vital channel
47:49between our two countries, China and Zimbabwe.
47:51Yes.
47:53We need such conversation to be going forward.
47:57Chris, I would love to do this more often.
48:00And I would love us to bring in even more people.
48:03Maybe people on my side, people on your side.
48:06I'd love to have us even having physical encounters
48:11where we get people in a room
48:13and we talk about the kind of things that we're talking about.
48:16But primarily, do Chinese understand Zimbabweans?
48:20Do Zimbabweans understand Chinese?
48:22How do we get to know each other?
48:24How do we get to understand each other?
48:26We need each other.
48:28We need each other.
48:29And for us to fully embrace each other,
48:34we need to understand each other.
48:36At the moment, ignorance breeds fear.
48:42Fear then sends us tears apart.
48:46So we need to understand each other
48:48so that we get to know each other.
48:50And that compassion, that love and care
48:55begins to come in again.
48:57Thank you so much, Chris.
48:59Very beautiful.
49:03Take care.
49:09And this was another episode of China Now,
49:11a show that opens a window to the present
49:13and the future of the action giant.
49:15Hope you enjoy it.
49:16See you next time.
49:20Bye.