In questa puntata parliamo di un nuovo metodo di pagamento allo studio della Banca Centrale Europea: l'euro digitale. Abbiamo bisogno di un'altra alternativa per i pagamenti online e questo progetto potrebbe avere un impatto negativo sul sistema bancario?
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00:00Digital and online payments are the new normal for shoppers in Europe, but another method
00:20of payment is being considered, the digital euro.
00:25Do we really need it?
00:26How much will it cost?
00:28And what's the point?
00:29It is already raising these questions among lawmakers and bankers.
00:34That is under the lens on Udicoded this week.
00:38Between 2019 and 2022, cash fell from 72% to 59% as a total share of payments.
00:46By contrast, total electronic money transactions leapt from 4.6 billion to 8.4 billion.
00:54The European Central Bank's planned digital euro would be available on a rechargeable
00:58card, a digital wallet or a mobile app.
01:01A digital euro account could be set up at a bank, a post office or an online platform.
01:08But would people really use it?
01:11I use digital payments because it's easier, I don't have to walk around with cash.
01:17It's on my phone, it's more practical, easier, faster.
01:21I feel like the government has to know where I'm spending my money and if it's cash,
01:24I can spend it wherever I want.
01:26I've heard of digital currencies.
01:28A specific digital euro for the European continent, for the European Union?
01:33No.
01:34The digital part, at the moment, as I say, I've already gone through situations of fraud
01:39and suspended cards and attempts to hack my own account, which I confess
01:45makes me a little embarrassed, a little not very safe in relation to that.
01:51But it's possible.
01:57Are you worried about your security when you do digital payments?
02:08Sometimes, but I usually trust the banks.
02:12So if the banks are involved, yes.
02:15Paola, how is the digital euro different from a cryptocurrency such as Bitcoin and others?
02:22So, unlike cryptocurrencies such as Bitcoin or Ethereum, this version would be risk-free.
02:28What does this mean?
02:30Well, basically, when we have a digital euro or a central bank digital currency,
02:35it is subject to a banking regulation.
02:38So if you have a problem, you can go to the central bank or you can go to your traditional bank
02:44and get some help or support.
02:48Does it mean that the digital euro is not a currency for investments?
02:52People will not make money on it, like interest in the banks.
02:55It's just something for their daily lives?
02:57Yes.
02:58The initial idea of this project, of the digital euro, is basically that it serves as an alternative means of payment.
03:05So it wants to be as close to cash as possible, meaning that it is free for users,
03:13it is accessible and that it ensures that citizens are protected and that we have financial stability.
03:22So the private banking system is largely against this proposal. Why?
03:28Well, it's basically that European banks are a bit concerned or sceptical about the added value of this proposal.
03:38This is mainly because we don't know yet the overall cost of this project,
03:44we don't know exactly which infrastructure we're going to use for this project,
03:49and it is also because they fear that they could lose some bank deposits.
03:54The ECB already said that they are trying to ensure that this is just an alternative means of payment
04:04and it is not meant to be a savings vehicle for large amounts of money.
04:10So they would cap with a limit, for instance, so that the banks would not feel too much of the impact?
04:15Exactly. They don't know the figures yet, but they are planning to have these holding limits
04:19that they are currently discussing in the ECB, as they are in the preparatory phase.
04:24The proposal is currently a bit stalled at the European Parliament because it was supposed to be voted in April,
04:31but that never happened and they just had a briefing or, well, a hearing with the ECB representatives in September.
04:40Let's look at the pros and cons.
04:42Inclusion is seen as a pro, as people with no private bank account or access to Internet could use it.
04:48Privacy is a thorny issue, but the ECB claims it would not be able to identify payment habits.
04:55Fraud and money laundering could be harder to detect if untraceable.
04:59If too successful, banks might lose deposits and no longer be able to lend.
05:05With us at the European Parliament is Damian Buselager, the Vice Chair of the Committee for Economic and Monetary Affairs.
05:13Many people are sceptical about the idea of a digital euro. Do you think it's worth doing?
05:18I find it super exciting. It is a great innovation to think about more and more people are using digital means of payment for any sort of things
05:27and we're currently very reliant on, for example, Apple Pay and so on, which uses credit card payment providers to be able to pay.
05:35Does the EU need to reduce its dependency on Visa, Mastercard, for example?
05:41You can always use your credit card. It's completely fine. Nobody's going to take that away from you.
05:45But I think it should be possible to have something similar to handing over a cash note to also do that on the digital level
05:51and the digital wallet together with the digital euro would allow for that without any form of transaction going outside to a private sector entity
05:59but just basically via public sector entities. And I think both is fine. You should just be able to choose.
06:05And what privacy controls is the European Parliament trying to secure for the digital euro?
06:12It's obviously extremely important that if you have agglomerated a lot of data about a lot of transactions and about a lot of individuals
06:19you need to make sure that there is anonymization, that there is a way to make sure that this cannot be breached with cybersecurity issues.
06:25Maybe when the transactions are of a lower value can be anonymous and then only if it's larger transactions should be somehow maybe followable
06:35also to ensure anti-money laundering mechanisms still work. But I think there's a lot of layers that we can put in.
06:41The United Kingdom and China are moving in this area. Are you worried the European Union would be left behind?
06:47And here's one moment where we are actually leading, where we can be leading if we come forward with a good proposal
06:52but we shouldn't dissect it now with lobby interests from all dimensions. We should really think about what makes sense
06:57and what is the added benefit as you said for the retail industry and for the individual customers.
07:02Just to add because some people say digital euro would be more about the sovereignty, the financial sovereignty of the EU.
07:08Is this also a value that you think it's important to safeguard?
07:11I think it could have a big advantage for us as well. Also because we wouldn't be relying on third country payment providers
07:18or even European payment providers but we could also rely on public institutions, in this case the central bank, to be able to do our payments.
07:26That gives you some sovereignty also, some independence. I think it's important not just from third countries but in general from failing banks
07:33and I hope that this will work.
07:35The digital euro may boost Europe's financial sovereignty but at what cost?
07:41Anyway, it won't be coming anytime soon, if it happens at all.
07:45Any legislation to be agreed in Brussels and with the Member States will take two to three years.
07:51Thank you for watching. I'll be coming with more EU decoding next week.