French Interwar Tanks That Need Adding to War Thunder

Toreno

Today we continue our look at Interwar tanks that need adding to War Thunder, this time taking a look at France.  So join me as we take a look at France's situation after World War 1 and its attempts to produce and upgrade new and exisiting tank designs to faceoff against German remilitarisation.  Social Media ⬇️ Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/toreno.bsky.social Facebook Page: https://www.facebook.com/Toreno4 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/toreno170 Mastodon: Toreno17@mastodon.social Threads: https://www.threads.net/@toreno170 Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/Toreno17 Twitch: https://www.twitch.tv/toreno5/videos  Sources⬇️ Foss, C. F. Jane's World Fighting Vehicles. Ness, L. (2002) Jane's World War II Tanks and Fighting Vehicles - The Complete Guide. Harper Collins Publishers Tank Archives Tank Encyclopedia Zaloga, S. J. (2010). French Tanks of World War I. Osprey Publishing. Zaloga, Steven J.: French Tanks of World War II (1) Zaloga, Steven J.: French Tanks of World War II (2)  France's situation after World War 1: 00:00 "Char de Bataille" prototypes: 01:39 Char B1 and prototypes: 04:23 Renault M26/27 (Renault Kégresse): 09:04 NC1 and NC2: 10:48 Char D1: 12:59 Batignolles-Châtillon DP2: 17:07 AMR 35: 18:32 Garnier Renault SPG: 19:22   Game: War Thunder  ⬅️  #warthunder #france #french #char #tank #charb1 #chard2 #renault #worldwar1 #tanks

Transcript

00:00Hello everybody, and welcome to this second episode of my series looking at interwar tanks

00:04I think should be added to War Thunder, and in this episode we will be taking a look at

00:09the French interwar tanks. So, a quick recap of France's situation at the end of World War 1.

00:15France and its entente allies had won the war, in large part due to France's revolutionary light

00:22tank, the Renault FT-17, which was both very successful during the war and built in very large

00:28numbers, so large in fact that in December 1921, after combat losses from the war and the exporting

00:34of various FT-17s, France still had 3,588 FT-17s available, though it was recognised that in its

00:43current form it would be unlikely to perform as well in future wars. France had also now finally

00:49finished building the 10 Char 2C Super Heavy tanks, and still had access to its earlier designs like

00:55the Schneider CA-1 and the Saint-Chamond, as well as some British Mark V heavy tanks,

01:01though the last three tanks would mostly be scrapped or sold not long after the war.

01:06However, despite being on the winning side, France was a devastated country,

01:11primarily due to suffering huge casualties and the fact that much of the war was fought

01:16on French soil, materially and economically devastating the country. Suffice to say,

01:22with France beginning to rebuild, there wasn't that much enthusiasm for massive military spending,

01:27and so there was a lot of cutbacks when it came to tanks. That said, some development work was

01:33carried out, both on designing new tanks and upgrading the existing FT-17 fleet.

01:39So, we'll start off by looking at one of the new French heavy tank designs, which would eventually

01:44become the Char B1, but there would also be a lot of prototypes leading up to the Char B1.

01:51So, work on what would eventually become the Char B1 came about from a requirement to develop a

01:57Char de Bataille, a combat tank intended to weigh around 20 tonnes, so heavier than the 6.5-tonne

02:03FT-17, but far lighter than the 69-tonne Char 2C. So, in 1921, the requirements were set out,

02:10and four prototypes were produced. One by FAMH, one by FCM, and then two were built in

02:17collaboration by Schneider and Renault, these being called the Schneider-Renault A and B,

02:24or SRA and SRB, with these designs all coming in at around 15-19 tonnes.

02:31The prototypes shared many design features. For example, they all used a three-man crew,

02:37had top speeds of around 9-12mph or 15-20kmh, a machine gun armed turret, 25-30mm of armour,

02:47and in the case of three of the prototypes, the main weapon was mounted in the hull,

02:51and was a 75mm howitzer. But for the SRB design, they instead used a 47mm naval gun in the hull,

03:00and the SRB design also had access to the advanced nadir steering system,

03:06allowing for precise turning of the hull in order to aim the gun.

03:10All four designs went through testing, and in 1925, it was decided to use the SRB prototype

03:16as a basis for the new tank. But it was also decided to take the best design features

03:21from all of the various prototypes and use them for the final design. For example,

03:26the SRB's 47mm tank gun in the hull was replaced by a 75mm howitzer, the pneumatic suspension was

03:34taken from the FAMH design, and the track's clutch and gearbox were taken from the FCM design.

03:42Unfortunately, due to budget constraints, the production contracts were delayed,

03:47and in the interim the design was further refined, so the ultimate design would be

03:51much further improved over these prototypes. As for the prototypes themselves, if they were

03:57added to the game, I think they would make good 1.0 tanks, as they have decent armour and a pretty

04:02effective 75mm gun, or 47mm gun in the SRB's case, though due to the hull placement of the weapon,

04:10they would act more like tank destroyers in-game. And I could also see Gaijin adding them as premium

04:16or event vehicles, but to be fair, as they're prototype tanks, I don't think that's such a huge

04:20issue if they were to do so. So, as the years ticked on, design changes were made, with the

04:26armour being increased to 40mm, which also increased the weight of the tank, and a further

04:32three prototypes were made by Renault and FCM, with Schneider providing the turrets, which were

04:39initially armed with machine guns, but these turrets were later upgraded to the ST-1 and ST-2

04:45turrets, like on the Char B1, and these were armed with 47mm guns, but these were in turn replaced by

04:52the superior APX-1 turret. Interestingly, the third prototype made by FCM would also use an

05:00alternative Traverse system, and a Swiss 180hp diesel engine instead of the Renault 250hp petrol

05:08engine, but these changes were reverted after testing. It was in this guise that the tank would

05:14finally be ordered into production in 1934 as the Char B, which was the forerunner to the far

05:21better known Char B1 bis, though it would take until December 1935 for the first tank to be

05:28delivered, well over a decade since the first prototypes were tested. Despite its large size

05:34and weight of now 27.7 tonnes, the B1 had a top speed of 17.4mph, or 28kmh, which is a decent

05:43speed for such a large and imposing tank, while its advanced nadir steering system should allow

05:50for quick turning of the tank in order to aim the 75mm howitzer. The armament is extremely similar

05:57to the Char B1 bis, having the same 75mm hull mounted howitzer, which is capable of penetrating

06:0450mm of armour at 500m with APHE shells, and a 47mm gun in the turret. But the 47mm gun is the SA-34,

06:14not the SA-35 of the bis, so it only has 20mm penetration at 500m, versus 47mm for the SA-35,

06:24forcing players to rely much more on the hull mounted howitzer when going up against enemy

06:29tanks, making this more of a tank destroyer in game in some ways. In addition to the main armament,

06:35there was also two 7.5mm machine guns, one in a coaxial position and one in a fixed mount to

06:41the right of the howitzer, so provides some defence against soft targets. The Char B1 is

06:47pretty heavily armoured compared to most interwar tanks, with its armour maxing out at 40mm,

06:54so still a pretty hard tank to deal with for some of the lighter armoured tanks,

06:58necessitating them to carry out flanking attacks where possible, or focusing on the tracks to

07:03immobilise this behemoth of a tank, but tanks with larger calibre guns will have a much easier time

07:09of dealing with this than the B1 bis, so you still have to be a little wary when going into battle.

07:16Lastly, like with the bis, the crew complement is four, with the driver and loader for the 75mm

07:22howitzer at the hull front, with the driver also acting as the gunner, the commander in the turret

07:27loading and operating the gun, and a radio operator positioned just behind the turret area,

07:32who could also pass up shells to the commander in the turret. In real life, only 35 Char B1s would

07:38be built, with the improved Char B1 bis being produced thereafter. As war approached, at least

07:45some of the Char B1s would be refitted with the new 47mm gun, improving the anti-tank capabilities.

07:52In War Thunder, I think the Char B1 would play fairly similarly to the B1 bis,

07:57but due to the reduced armour, it will now be more vulnerable to enemy shells,

08:01which combined with the less powerful 47mm gun will likely force players to be much more cautious

08:07when engaging enemies, and rely a bit more on the 75mm howitzer, which will still be able to deal

08:13with most enemies pretty handily. While its mobility is still decent enough to get around

08:18the map as needed, and the 47mm gun can still work well in a pinch.

08:23And so that was the French work on developing a new Char de Bataille, but like I mentioned at the

08:29beginning of the episode, France also worked on upgrading its existing FT-17 fleet, which produced

08:36some pretty interesting variants, and resulted in a few totally new designs. So before we look at the

08:42FT-17 upgrades, just a quick recap on what the FT-17 was. It was a light tank with a fairly slow

08:49speed of only 5mph or 8kmh, and was armed with a 37mm gun only capable of penetrating 15mm of armour

08:58at 100m, and it only had a 2-man crew and maximum armour of 22mm. So for the first upgrade we're

09:06going to be looking at, we are looking at the Renault Cagresse, or Renault M26-27, which came

09:13about in 1924, and was mainly geared to fixing the weaknesses with regards to the slow speed,

09:19which was done by adding a new suspension based on a design by French engineer Adolphe Cagresse,

09:25which was already used in French half-tracks. So the new suspension used metal and rubber tracks,

09:32new sprockets and eight road wheels, while sometimes large rollers were also installed

09:38at the front of the tank to assist with obstacles, which could be a modification in-game.

09:44Initially, this design was a great success, increasing its top speed to at least 7.5mph

09:49or 12kmh, though some sources give a slightly higher speed, but either way this is a much-needed

09:55improvement for what was a very slow tank. However, as I mentioned, the rest of its stats

10:00remain the same as the regular FT-17, which does represent a bit of a weakness with this design,

10:06but like I mentioned, it is a straight upgrade in regards to speed, so you're not losing anything

10:11from this upgrade. Ultimately, 42 FT-17s would be given this new suspension, and many were sent to

10:17take part in the Rift War against Berber forces, where unfortunately the new tracks proved

10:22susceptible to snapping at high speeds, and after being returned to France they were upgraded,

10:29but despite upgrading the tracks again, the new design was largely abandoned, and thus the rest of

10:35the FT-17 fleet was not upgraded, though some of the existing tanks would be sold to Poland and

10:41Yugoslavia, though by the time they saw combat in World War 2, they were long obsolete and were

10:46quickly destroyed. In War Thunder, I would place this vehicle at 0.3, as France now has access to

10:53a decently fast light tank that can get around the battlefield at a decent speed, providing

10:58cover for the slower regular FT-17s, while also flanking enemies and quickly responding to threats,

11:05though still suffering from the other drawbacks that the FT-17 has, like its two-man crew and

11:11weak armament. Around the same time as the Renault Cogress upgrade, Renault was also working on a

11:18modernised design of the FT-17, with two prototypes being produced, the Renault NC1 and NC2. The NC2,

11:27using a Cogress suspension system, and the NC1 using a new but more traditional suspension system

11:34with vertical coil springs, 14 road wheels, new drive sprockets and idlers, giving it a top speed

11:41of 12.4 mph or 20 kmh, again a much better speed than the FT-17 and even the Renault Cogress.

11:49The rest of the tank largely resembles the FT-17, with the same turret and 37mm gun,

11:56or alternatively a 7.5mm machine gun, and again retaining a two-man crew, but the frontal armour

12:03is now 25mm thick, which along with the added speed is a much welcome improvement.

12:09After testing was completed, the NC1 was considered superior to both the FT-17 and the NC2,

12:15but despite this the design was not adopted by France, so Renault instead sold the tank abroad

12:21as the NC27, with Poland and Sweden each buying an example, and Japan buying a whopping 23 of

12:28these tanks, so at least something was recovered from the design. In War Thunder I would add the

12:34NC2 as an event or premium vehicle, and the NC1 as a regular tank in the tech tree, probably at

12:42around battle rating 0.3-0.7, as again we have a much faster design than the FT-17 and Renault

12:49Cogress, while also benefiting from slightly improved armour, though yet again suffering from

12:54the two-man crew and lacklustre anti-tank weapon. So the NC1 and NC2 were not accepted into French

13:02service, but this was much more to do with the French army setting out new requirements for a

13:06tank with a better gun and much thicker armour, which in 1928 would lead Renault to design a new

13:13tank, which was finally accepted in 1929 as the Char D1. So the Char D1 again resembles an enlarged

13:21FT-17, and indeed due to a shortage of turrets many of the early examples were fitted with FT-17

13:28turrets, with the 37mm gun, but on the final design it was fitted with a cast Schneider ST-2

13:36turret, and was fitted with a 47mm SA-34 gun, as well as two 7.5mm machine guns,

13:43one in a fixed position in the bow and one in a coaxial position.

13:47Now the 47mm gun is quite a big step up compared to the previous 37mm gun of the FT-17,

13:55which could only penetrate 15mm of armour at 100m with its WW1 era ammunition,

14:02while the 47mm gun can penetrate up to 20mm of armour in-game at 500m,

14:08and that's with an APHE shell, so much better post-penetration damage.

14:13However, there is a bit of a trade-off when it comes to the WW2 era tanks,

14:17because they also have the same 37mm gun as the FT-17, but they have access to an APCR round,

14:24so they can penetrate up to 33mm of armour at 100m, or 24mm at 500m.

14:32So much more powerful than the SA-34, but again with an APCR round, so much worse

14:37post-penetration damage. So there will be a little bit of a trade-off when selecting what tank to

14:42use. Do you go for the tank with the much better penetrating ammunition but worse

14:47post-penetration effects, or do you go for the 47mm gun with worse penetration but a much better

14:54destroying chance? That would be quite an interesting dynamic I think in-game.

15:00The armour is also much improved over the earlier tanks, now maxing out at 30mm,

15:06though it still features a lot of flat armour plates in some areas,

15:10with only the lower upper hull plate at the front having much in the way of sloping.

15:16Meanwhile, the top speed is 11.5mph or 18.5kph, and is powered by a 74hp

15:2325CV engine, so a little slower than the NC-1, but still decently mobile.

15:29And the crew has finally been increased to 3, so it now consists of a driver and radio operator in

15:36the hull, while the commander in the turret is unfortunately left to command the tank,

15:40as well as fire and load the main gun. This of course could be a bit more problematic in-game,

15:45because while the tank is now less likely to be destroyed via crew losses,

15:49any injuries to the commander will slow down the loading and aiming of the gun,

15:54which is not really a problem you want to have in battle.

15:57The Char D1 was accepted into service in 1929, but not put into production until 1931,

16:04and the final tanks were not finished until 1935, and there was only 160 of them,

16:10compared with 3,499 FT-17s, that were still around in 1934.

16:17So, while these were the most modern tanks available to France at the time,

16:20they were still around in too few numbers to make a massive difference on the battlefield,

16:24and once more improved designs came out, they were mostly relegated to the colonies,

16:30though some were returned to France in 1940 and did see some combat during the Battle of France.

16:36In War Thunder, I think the Char D1 tanks with both the old FT-17 turrets and modern turrets

16:41could be added, probably at around 0.7 for the old FT-17 turret variants,

16:47and 1.0 for the modern turret variants, and these tanks would help bridge the gap between

16:53the older WW1 era tanks and the newer WW2 era tanks, being mobile, decently armoured and armed,

17:00and being far less susceptible to one-shot kills due to the extra crew member.

17:06Around this time, there was also a decent attempt at producing an amphibious light tank,

17:12the Batignolles Châtillon DP2, with a prototype being produced in 1935 and tested in 1936.

17:22Unfortunately, while it worked well on water, achieving a top speed of 6.5 kmh,

17:28while exiting the river, water got into the engine, and due to the now increased weight,

17:33the tank sank back into the river Seine. The tank was refloated and modified to prevent

17:39a repeat of the incident, which seems to have worked as its next tests went much better,

17:45but after further changes were recommended and the tank was returned to the workshops,

17:49it just seems to have disappeared, probably being scrapped before or during the war.

17:55However, it was armed with a 25mm SA-35 gun, as well as a 7.5mm machine gun.

18:02While being capable of a top speed of 25mph or 40.5kmh on land, and 4mph or 6.5kmh on water.

18:13So this would make a pretty speedy amphibious recon tank, especially in the lower tiers,

18:18though it might be let down by its slowed-down light armour and its two-man crew.

18:24But I think it could fit into War Thunder at 0.7 to 1.0, maybe even as a premium or event tank.

18:31Of course, like many other nations, France had some tanks that were maybe not the best

18:35on the battlefield, but were also pretty good reconnaissance vehicles. In this case,

18:40the AMR-35 armed with the 13.2mm Hotchkiss machine gun, which is capable of penetrating 25mm of

18:48armour at 100m, which is a pretty decent performance in-game for a machine gun-armed

18:53tank, and it had a two-man crew, and was capable of high speeds of up to 34mph or 55kmh.

19:01Which would make this a pretty good recon tank for the early tiers. However, it is only lightly

19:06armoured, maxing out at 13mm, so frontal combat would need to be avoided, and flanking attacks

19:13at longer distances might not work out too well. But I could see this being a good recon tank

19:18around 0.7 to 1.0. Lastly, we come to a French SPG,

19:25the Garnier Renault or ACL-75, which was built on the chassis of the Renault VA,

19:32which is more commonly known as the Ch'ti 3, which was intended as a lighter, colonial tank,

19:38but when this failed to attract any attention, it was decided to repurpose the chassis as a

19:43tank destroyer-like vehicle. The ACL-75 was armed with the 75mm Length 30 APX gun,

19:52which has a very high gun elevation, and in-game I believe is basically the same gun as the Samura

19:57Sal 40, so its APHE shell is capable of penetrating 66mm of armour at 500m. So,

20:06a very good performance, and unlike most other French tanks of the era, it has a four-man crew,

20:12so one-shot kills are far less likely than on the two-man tanks. While the armour protection ranges

20:17from 35mm to 45mm thick, which is again pretty decent, especially if engaging from longer ranges.

20:24Though it is a little bit flat-sided in most places, which does let it down a little bit.

20:29Unfortunately, it is vastly let down by its slow speed, as the Ch'ti 3 chassis was just

20:35far too slow, with a theoretical top speed of 25kmh, but in reality its top speed is probably

20:43nearer to 12.4mph or 20kmh, with its off-road speed being worse still. Overall, the Ch'ti 3

20:51chassis killed the project, and work moved onto a new project which would eventually produce the

20:56ARL V39, which I have looked at in another video. In War Thunder however, it could see some success,

21:04possibly as a 1.3-1.7 tank destroyer, either as a premium or event vehicle, or just before the

21:10Samurai Sao-40 on the regular tech tree, as it still possesses an excellent gun and decent armour,

21:18but like I mentioned is let down by its slow speed, possibly leaving it to perform as a

21:23long-range sniper where this will matter far less. So anyway, that's all of the French interwar tanks

21:30for this episode. I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on these vehicles, as well as any other

21:35vehicles you'd like me to cover in the future. I look forward to reading your comments below.

21:40So for the next episode, I'll probably be covering the British interwar tanks,

21:44so hopefully we'll have quite a few there for us to cover, and hopefully you'll join me for that.

21:49Anyway, I've been Tereno, and I'll see you next time.

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