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00:00Hi, everyone. I'm Maggie McGrath with Forbes Breaking News. There is about 100 days until
00:09the 2024 presidential election. And earlier this week, we saw a major shakeup in the race
00:15with President Joe Biden announcing that he is dropping out and endorsing his vice president,
00:19Kamala Harris, to be the candidate for the Democratic Party. Here to explain what this
00:25moment in political history means and the messaging around it is a top political strategist
00:31and a CEO of a communications firm, Doug Thornell. He leads SKDK, and he has done work with the DNC,
00:39the DCCC, Governor Westmore, and Senator Mark Kelly. Doug, thank you so much for being here.
00:45Maggie, it's great to be with you.
00:46So I want to start with kind of a broad question, but there's so much news and there are so many
00:52talking heads talking about what Kamala Harris, the presumptive nominee for the Democratic Party
00:57now, should be doing about her messaging. So what are you hearing in your world about the
01:04Harris campaign and the messaging she has and the messaging that she needs to put out there?
01:11It's a great question. Today, she just launched her first campaign video soundtrack by Beyonce
01:20with freedom being kind of the overarching theme. And I think you're going to hear a lot about
01:25freedom as a theme. I think you're going to hear a lot about unity versus division.
01:29And I think you're going to hear a lot about the future and moving the party forward and not going
01:34backwards and talking straight to working class Americans about what it would mean to live under
01:43a President Trump presidency where, you know, Social Security and Medicare would be on the
01:48chopping block. Department of Education would be eliminated. Prescription drug prices would be
01:55increased. Child care would be cut versus the agenda that the vice president is going to push,
02:02which is one where opportunity is going to be available to all Americans, regardless of where
02:08you live. And I think those are going to be the themes you hear over the next couple of weeks and
02:12probably heading into the convention. Now, obviously, Vice President Harris effectively
02:18stepped into the campaign apparatus that had been built by President Joe Biden as a communications
02:24expert, as a political strategist. Doug, what do you think of her decision to basically inherit
02:29that operation and keep it as it is versus building one of her own? Very smart to build a
02:36presidential campaign. It takes months, months, you know. And so this was her campaign. She was
02:45not at the top of the ticket, but it was the Biden-Harris campaign. I think the fact that now
02:51she can inherit a lot of the infrastructure, I expect her to bring on more people in terms of
02:58sort of being additive there. But I think it gives her a lot of advantages in terms of
03:04being able to go. Right. So she's not really having to build the car as she's driving it.
03:09The car's been built. I expect her to add things here and there. But it gives her a real it gives
03:17her a real opportunity to just fight this out. And both from an infrastructure staff
03:28and a money standpoint. So all of the money that was raised by the Biden-Harris campaign now goes to
03:34Kamala Harris. And so that's super helpful. The volunteer network, all of these things that have
03:39been worked on by the Biden-Harris operation for the last year and a half are now sort of
03:46in motion. So the continuity piece is really important. You talk about the money and there is,
03:53of course, the eighty one million dollars that was raised by the campaign by small donors in
03:58the first twenty four hours after Biden dropped out of the race. It's really feeling like momentum
04:04has shifted. But I am wondering, Doug, what is your perspective on Vice President Harris's
04:10strengths and weaknesses from the messaging standpoint? You kind of talked about the
04:14differences between the two candidates and what they'll be talking about. But where is
04:18she especially strong and where is she struggling? I think she's tough and I think that will come
04:27through her prosecutor background, being able to talk about, you know, the prosecutor versus felon
04:32contrast, which I think is something you're going to hear more and more about. That's going to be,
04:38I think, a real core theme of what she's going to be talking about. You know, and I think also
04:45the fact that, you know, she's she has foreign policy experience having been vice president.
04:52I think she can connect with a lot of different groups, demographics, types of voters out there.
04:59So those are all strengths. I don't really look. It's hard to say weaknesses. I think I would say,
05:04look, when you're the vice president, you've spent three and a half years talking about
05:08and promoting the president. Right. So I think transitioning to talking about herself and
05:14and talking about her record is going to be something that obviously has to happen. And I
05:19think, you know, you'll see her get more and more comfortable with it. But I imagine that's going to
05:23be a bit of a change. Right. I mean, for the whole campaign, she's been talking about Joe Biden,
05:28what he's done as president, what he will do as president. And now that changed in a matter of
05:33days. And so now it's all about her talking about her vision and what she's going to do.
05:38And so, you know, that's going to take a little bit of an adjustment. But I from everything I've
05:42seen in the last three, four days, she's up to it and she's got a compelling message. And I think
05:49she's got a compelling vision. So I don't have any I don't have any expectations. She's not going
05:54to be able to nail that. But I imagine that will be something that will take a bit of an adjustment.
06:00It's interesting you talk about how she's been out there talking about President Joe Biden and
06:05not about herself. We're effectively in a position where the campaign has to introduce her or maybe
06:10reintroduce her. And they really only have 100 or so days to let the American people know who
06:17she is to get to know each other, if you will, to use really colloquial terms. From your perspective
06:22as a communications expert, is it possible to reintroduce a candidate with this short amount
06:28of time? I think so. It'll be it's going to be look, this is not going to be an easy campaign.
06:36No one should ever no one should think that this is going to be a runaway on either side. It's
06:41going to be very close. This race has been very close for months and months. Polling this week
06:47shows it's a nail biter, both nationally and in battleground states. But she has time. Look,
06:53she's raising you mentioned 80 million or whatever she raised in 24 hours. She's raised, I think,
06:58probably closer to 150 million now since that point, which is only four days later, which is a
07:04which is a spectacular amount of money on top of the cash on hand they already had. So I fully
07:10expect that she's going to have the resources to tell her story. And she's got allies out there who
07:14are going to help tell her story as well. So, yeah, it's not a lot of time. But look, this is
07:20when people are starting to pay attention. So in many respects, that's good for her. And she's got
07:26a big moment coming up with the convention where a lot of eyeballs are going to be watching that.
07:31And she's going to be able to take advantage of that moment. And I would also say the last three
07:36or four days, the type of earned media that she's gotten, it's hard to put a price tag on that. So
07:41that's been super helpful. And I expect, look, you know, the honeymoon is not these honeymoon
07:46periods. They they don't always last. So she's going to start taking incoming from Republicans.
07:54We know that's coming. But she has a real important moment with the DNC. And there is
08:00no RNC convention right to push back on whatever she however she portrays herself, which is
08:07not good for Republicans. So that big moment that exists right now is for her. And then,
08:13you know, you got you've got three and a half months to tell your story, both on the ground
08:17and then in the airwaves and on social media. And so she can do it. I think she is. I think
08:22she has time and she's got a great team around her. You talk about Republican pushback to her
08:28candidacy, to her record in office as VP and even as senator and attorney general before.
08:33And just today, we saw a resolution from House Republicans looking to condemn
08:38Vice President Harris's role as so-called borders are under President Biden. And then we have the
08:46response from the left saying, well, she was never borders are. What do you make of this?
08:51Is denying that she was ever borders are the right political communication strategy?
08:58Well, I think the resolution is a desperate move by Republicans. Remember, they were trying
09:03to impeach Joe Biden. I'm not sure whatever happened with that. So a totally desperation
09:08move. Look, there was an opportunity to do something about the border a couple of months
09:13ago. There was a bipartisan plan that the White House, that the president, the vice president
09:18worked on with with some of the most conservative Republicans in the Senate. It was ready to go.
09:24And the person who stopped it was Donald Trump because he'd rather
09:28have a political issue than solve it. So that's how I think they should prosecute that matter.
09:36Donald Trump was in office for four years. He barely did anything on the border
09:40except make, I think, things worse. So, yeah, I mean, I think that resolution was an act of
09:47desperation. And I expect that, you know, the vice president and her team will,
09:53you know, they should go on the offense on sort of talking about what her position is and not let
09:57herself get defined by Republicans on that. Because, again, look, there was an opportunity
10:03to do something on the border very recently with a bipartisan bill and Trump blocked it.
10:09So I know you say it's politicking for the House to release this resolution,
10:15but immigration and the border is a major issue for many voters. If we are still talking about
10:22this border czar issue in a week, if we're still engaging in this political tit for tat where
10:28Republicans are saying that was her job and Democrats are saying, no, it was never her job,
10:34is that a good thing if this is still in the news cycle 10, 12, 14, 16 days from now?
10:40Well, Republicans are going to make immigration and the border an issue. They did it in 22.
10:48They did it in 20. In both of those elections, they lost. I worked on Senator Mark Kelly's
10:55reelect campaign in 22. And one of the things that we did early on was to make sure people
11:02understood the senator's position on the border. This issue came up in a special election in New
11:09York, Tom Suozzi, which he won against a Republican, and they went after him on the border.
11:16And what the congressman now congressman did was got out early and defined his position and talked
11:22about it. So I think Democrats can't be scared of this issue. I think they need to make sure
11:27their position is clearly defined with voters so they understand it. It's going to come,
11:33right? You're not going to be able to stop Republicans from launching attack ads on it.
11:38But if you have a clearly defined position and more importantly, you have a solution,
11:43then voters will look past it and look at other issues. And we've seen that happen in multiple
11:51elections now. So I hope the Harris campaign comes out very strong and clear on what she stands for.
12:00I don't think these attacks will ultimately have an impact if they take that route,
12:06which is clearly define her position on the border. And then again, take the offense on it
12:12and make sure that people understand that Republicans had an opportunity to do something
12:16on it and Trump got in the way of it. Now, when we talk about her messaging,
12:21one of the things I'm really curious about is the emphasis on her historic achievements as
12:27a politician. She has been the first and the only a number of times in her career already to this
12:32point. Obviously, the first female vice president in the United States poised to potentially become
12:38the first female president of the United States. And then, of course, with that comes first woman
12:43of color, vice president, potential first woman of color, president, et cetera, et cetera.
12:49But to a certain degree, does that harm her politically? Because not everyone is a first
12:54or an only. So does it alienate her from voters if her supporters keep drumming this beat of she's
13:01the first, she's the first, she's historic? And should she lean into another aspect of her
13:06identity as she continues to introduce herself or reintroduce herself to voters?
13:14That's a good question. I don't actually hear a lot from the vice president talking about those
13:22important milestones. What I hear is other people talking about it. And, you know, if you go back
13:30to President Obama and his historic run in 2008, he didn't really talk about the historical nature
13:37of his campaign. I just worked for Governor Westmore in Maryland, the only black governor
13:42in the country, the first black governor in Maryland. And we talked about the issues.
13:48And, you know, it's obviously clear, you know, he's black. And and other people talked about
13:54the historical nature of of his candidacy. And other people will talk about the historical
13:59nature of her candidacy. I think it's important that she not run away from that by any means.
14:06But look, she's you know, she's talking about the issues, you know, and she's talking about
14:13the ways we can bring this country together and solve some big problems that have existed for
14:19decades. And I think that's what all voters, regardless of what you look like, want to hear
14:25is solutions and a vision for the future. And that's what I've heard from her for the last
14:30three days. That's what I expect to hear from her for the duration of the campaign.
14:35Now, obviously, you've worked with Senator Mark Kelly, you just referenced him. And we've been
14:39hearing more of his name in the past few days, because he's on a few lists, suggesting he might
14:45be one of the people being vetted to be her second in command to be her running mate. So,
14:51Doug, I'm curious, if you were to put on your sorting hat and looking at the potential
14:56candidates in the landscape, which include potentially Senator Mark Kelly,
15:00who should Vice President Harris pick to be her running mate in this election?
15:08Well, we have a well, I should say she has a wealth of options, some really talented folks,
15:14governors, senators, that are cabinet members, that to pick from, which is great, right? Like
15:21the Democratic bench is stronger than it's ever been. I would say, look, ultimately, it's going
15:27to come down to who she's most comfortable with. But I think that at some point, if she wins,
15:32which I think she will, she's going to have to govern. So I think you kind of have to look at
15:36who's ready to govern with her and be someone who can be a counselor to her and help her
15:44through tough situations, right? As her most senior advisor, right? And who's ready to step
15:52into the Oval Office if something were to happen. And then I think you look at
15:58electorally who is someone who can bring something to the table and to the campaign.
16:04So I would look at those factors in terms of deciding on who the running mate should be.
16:12Luckily, she's got a bunch of people out there that would be very, very solid.
16:19Look, I'm biased. I think Senator Mark Kelly would be fantastic. He's a combat veteran, flew
16:26over 30 missions, an astronaut, a senator, two term, won twice in a red state. And obviously,
16:36you know, along with his wife, Gabby Giffords has been one of the most vocal advocates for
16:42combating gun violence after the obviously the terrible assassination attempt on the
16:48congresswoman. So he's got a very compelling story, son of two cops. But look, there are
16:55a lot of other people out there as well. I'm sure that the vice president is going to make the right
17:00choice. But she's got a lot of options, and that's good for her. And it speaks to the future
17:06of the Democratic Party. So obviously, we started this conversation talking about the unprecedented
17:11nature of the news we've seen this week. We've never quite seen anything like this in American
17:16history. And Doug, you sit as the CEO of a communications firm. So I'm wondering, what are
17:21other communications experts saying about all of this, everything we've seen? What's your what's
17:27your take? Well, look, it's been a whirlwind, to say the least. You know, on Sunday, I think
17:36no one was expecting that announcement by the president. And when it happened, I think people
17:43were at least Democrats and, you know, were there was a mix of both sadness and shock.
17:51You know, now there's a lot of excitement within the party excitement that I don't think we've
17:55seen in a long time. I would say that people are wondering what it would mean to have a
18:02president, Kamala Harris, right? What are asking about what her positions are? And, you know,
18:10wondering sort of who's in her inner circle? What is her message going to be during the rest of the
18:16campaign? People are wondering what the convention is going to look like. You know, they're gonna
18:20have to, you know, the conventions in three and a half, three weeks, right? They had a convention
18:24built for Joe Biden. They're gonna have to change that. Right. And so it questions about her
18:30running mate. And so it's a lot of, you know, a lot of people are, you know, with Joe Biden,
18:36you knew pretty much everything about Joe Biden. Right. You knew about his family. He had his
18:41running mate. The convention was moving forward the way, you know, the with with him as the
18:48centerpiece. When that all got shook up, I think a lot of people are now wondering what's it
18:54mean to have a Kamala Harris at the top of the ticket? You know, what does she believe?
19:00What is she going to fight for? What are the issues? Who's around her? What's the convention
19:04going to look like? So it's been interesting. You know, it's it's these are these are
19:11crazy times that we live in the last three, three weeks. Just if you think about last,
19:16really the last month since the debate. And it is shook, I think, the entire political world
19:23in many different ways. And so I think people are just looking for, you know, especially clients
19:29of ours and and both whether it's brands or nonprofits or candidates are looking for just
19:36kind of counsel on, you know, in this uncertain world, you know, how to you know, how to navigate
19:41that. And that's really a lot of what I'm hearing and from from clients and from others is just
19:47how we navigate this, you know, shifting landscape.
19:53I was going to ask also about the down ballot races. And if your phone is is ringing off the
19:59hook from some of these congressional or Senate candidates who might need extra communication
20:04support, because obviously, your job campaigning is a little different if the top of the ticket
20:10is Joe Biden versus if the top of the ticket is Kamala Harris. So I imagine all of these races,
20:16not just the presidential race, all of these campaign managers are perhaps massaging their
20:21messaging. Does that mean more work for someone like you? Yeah, in some places it does in some
20:28places, maybe not so much. But look, you've got to you know, it's one thing to have Joe Biden at
20:35the top of the ticket. It's obviously another thing to have the vice president. So, yes,
20:39you have to look at, you know, right now I'll tell you and it's been literally like what,
20:43four days. So right now, what I would say is that, you know, campaigns are starting to reassess
20:49the their contests. There's going to be polling that is done that looks at the vice president in
20:57these districts and Senate states, probably testing messages. And so many of the campaigns
21:04I work on, though, you know, there's an emphasis on, you know, what that candidate is going to
21:12say and do for the voters in that district or in that state. So, you know, the presidential
21:18race is important from like sort of from an atmospheric standpoint. But so many of these
21:25races come down to the individual candidates. And so, I mean, we saw on 22, even with a,
21:33you know, with President Biden having, you know, not the great greatest of approval ratings,
21:38a lot of Democrats in the House and the Senate and governors were able to navigate what was
21:43supposed to be a red wave because they were able to define themselves to voters, have a clear
21:48message. And voters sort of, I think, segment out the, you know, what was going on nationally to
21:55make a decision on their own local concerns. This is different. We've got a presidential race. And
22:01so we have to figure out what's the impact. And quite frankly, anyone who says that they know
22:05right now is lying to you. It takes a little while to figure it out. It's going to take a
22:09little while to sort out. Right. She doesn't have a running mate. That's going to make a
22:13difference. You know, we still need a convention. She hasn't aired one ad yet. Right. So all of
22:18these things have not happened yet. And so that's one reason why I'm optimistic about her ability to
22:24grow. I think her ceiling is higher than Donald Trump's. And once all of those tools that are in
22:33her toolbox are being used, I expect her to start. You know, I expect this race to be very
22:40close and that I expect her to win. Yes. Well, there's already been one poll and it is quite
22:45tight, but there are still so many so many to go. And we hope to bring you back to talk about those
22:50polls, to talk about what we see out of the DNC. But in the meantime, Doug Thornall, CEO of SKDK
22:57in Washington, D.C., thank you so much for being here. Thank you for having me, Maggie.