Daramad Coal ka Scandal bhi Wheat Scandal ki taraha Daba Diya Gaya" Muzamil Aslam Huge Statement
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Daramad Coal ka Scandal bhi Wheat Scandal ki taraha Daba Diya Gaya" Muzamil Aslam Huge Statement
Daramad Coal ka Scandal bhi Wheat Scandal ki taraha Daba Diya Gaya" Muzamil Aslam Huge Statement
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00:00Dr. Khaqan Najeeb, let's start with you.
00:02Whether it's morning or night, we are trying to understand where the issue is going.
00:10My question is, when the economy is in such a state that you have to impose such heavy taxes on people,
00:18people are bearing the direct and indirect taxes, electricity prices have become unbearable,
00:24so what is the reason for this free distribution?
00:31Bismillahir Rahmanir Rahim. Ashfaq, the energy crisis in Pakistan is existential.
00:36It carries a heavy burden on manufacturing, agriculture and household.
00:41At the heart of this crisis is a governance crisis. Energy problem in Pakistan is not a technical issue.
00:48It's a governance issue, it's an organizational issue, it's an HR issue.
00:53Now, what do I mean by this?
00:55We have been trying to appoint CEOs and boards for many decades, but we have never been able to do it.
01:02That's one thing.
01:03They are operating in such a way that they are state monopolies.
01:08Transfers, postings, manuals are being used in the same way.
01:12So, they are not operationally independent profit-making entities, which they should have been.
01:19Number two, they should have been privatized.
01:21They have been trying for 20-25 years and they are standing there.
01:25So, that's issue number one.
01:26Because the root of all the inefficiencies is obviously coming from the discourse.
01:31The number two governance issue is that you made a regulator,
01:34which should never have been separate from NEPRA and UGRA.
01:38This was not good advice to Pakistan.
01:40Pakistan should have been an energy regulator.
01:42If Pakistan was an energy regulator, it would have made energy a single thought.
01:47I have been hearing for the last 10 years that there is a CTBCM,
01:50which means that a market for energy has to be created.
01:53I have been saying since then that you don't have the HR to make it.
01:57You are still standing there.
01:58The third thing is policymaking.
02:00In policymaking, you have never tried to make all three of your ministries an energy ministry.
02:06What does energy ministry mean?
02:08Think of a single source of energy.
02:10For example, let me give you an example.
02:12What happens with this?
02:13In Pakistan, there is a shortage of 10,000 megawatts of electricity in winters.
02:17And in summers, it goes up to 25,000-30,000 megawatts.
02:20Today, if you cut off the gas supply to 26% of the people in this country,
02:27who are taking gas from this country,
02:29then you can take the same gas to make cheap electricity.
02:32So start thinking that this is an HR crisis.
02:36Without inducting good HR, you can't solve it.
02:39If you want to re-profile the debt with the Chinese,
02:42then all the agreements that were made with Capco and Hubco,
02:45they are about to end.
02:47Now where is the problem?
02:49The agreements of 2015, which are with our Chinese IPPs,
02:54they are putting the biggest burden.
02:56And they have a very heavy burden for the next 3-4 years.
02:59And the problem is that you can't even get back from them.
03:02Because if you do, then they will go to some court
03:06and then we will have to suffer a lot.
03:09So Ashfaq, again, the problem is get a good HR team together,
03:14who understand finance, econ, and energy.
03:19You have to negotiate with them.
03:21I don't want to stop any of their money.
03:23Today, 500 billion has been stopped.
03:25So I want to tell them, I want to give you this money.
03:28But I will give a markup for the next 4 years of payment.
03:31I will give the next payment in the next 10 years.
03:34Your electricity will be more than 2.5-3 rupees.
03:37I think its price will break there.
03:39I just told you how to handle a demand side and a supply side.
03:43The entire Pakistan is going to have a tariff reform.
03:46This means that they want to increase electricity consumption.
03:49At the moment, the tariff is such that it is reducing electricity consumption.
03:52Even today, 3,000 megawatts of electricity is being produced,
03:58which we call captive.
04:00For example, bring them on the right tariff.
04:03Take back gas from them.
04:05Bring them back on the grid.
04:08You will say that I am giving you very hard calls.
04:12But everything is related to governance.
04:14Okay.
04:15Mr. Muzammil Aslam, we have been talking to you a lot about this.
04:20But at the moment, one thing is that,
04:22as Mr. Hakan Najeeb said,
04:24there should be one ministry so that there is one thought.
04:26That there should be an energy ministry,
04:29in which everything should come and work according to a thought.
04:32The decision to separate NEPRA and OGRA is also said to be wrong.
04:35There is a need to work with unity.
04:37And I say that the numbers I have,
04:40the 1,20,000 employees,
04:42the numbers can be more or less,
04:44billions of rupees of electricity.
04:46Either you have it in a sufficient amount.
04:48Here, if electricity is produced more,
04:51then your transmission system is not such that electricity can be dispatched.
04:55Then line losses are a separate matter.
04:58Then this free distribution is a separate matter.
05:00In your opinion,
05:01as far as your assessment has been,
05:03what is the solution to this matter?
05:06Bismillahir Rahmanir Rahim.
05:08Ashfaq, thank you very much.
05:11If you would have been talking to me on this topic 5 months ago,
05:16then the way Hakan is talking now,
05:19I would have been talking in the same way.
05:21Okay.
05:22My view has changed a lot.
05:24Because I am working in the province nowadays.
05:27And I have seen this thing in a little detail.
05:30So my view has changed a lot.
05:33And I understand that where we are standing today,
05:38it is our fault.
05:40And we just divert our attention
05:42that reduce this loan, increase it.
05:45Let's take it from here, let's take it from there.
05:47Let's do this to the regulator, let's do this to Fala.
05:49See, the electricity that is being produced in Pakistan today,
05:54in the next 3 months of the KPK government,
05:5790 MW electricity is coming,
05:59and a total of 213 MW will come in a year.
06:02In today's time, we make electricity from a dam,
06:05and our cost is Rs 7 per unit.
06:07Like this.
06:09Okay.
06:10Then after that,
06:11all the electricity that is expensive and cheap in the whole of Pakistan,
06:15its total cost is about Rs 9.50 per unit.
06:19That's it?
06:20Yes.
06:23Okay.
06:48Like this.
06:51Yes.
06:54Should we produce electricity or not?
07:21Okay.
07:23Okay.
07:48Okay.
07:52Okay.
08:23Okay.
08:31Okay.
08:52Okay.
09:20Okay.
09:22Okay.
09:52Okay.
10:23Okay.
10:38Hmm.
10:52Okay.
10:56Okay.
11:23Hmm.
11:33Hmm.
11:52Hmm.
12:23Hmm.
12:38Is that so?
12:52Hmm.
13:22Hmm.
13:42Hmm.
13:52Hmm.
13:56Hmm.
14:22Hmm.