Yourcinemafilms.com | 2-time BAFTA winning casting director Aisha Bywaters breaks down how she runs her auditions and how she became a casting director!
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Are you ready for the truth?
’Welcome to Your Cinema'
Follow us on socials:
Tiktok: @yourcinemafilms
Instagram: @yourcinemafilms
Twitter: @yourcinemafilms
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00:00Now everyone's making it in film and TV, but we don't really know how.
00:06Here, we uncover the truth.
00:08Welcome to the Your Cinema Podcast.
00:12Welcome to the Your Cinema Podcast.
00:15It's the place where we explore the truth about the film and TV industry and theatre
00:20and hear it directly from those who are smashing it in their areas.
00:24Today, we've got Industry Royalty.
00:27She's a pioneer at a very, very high level.
00:31She's worked on so many amazing projects, including The Kitchen, Riches, County Lines.
00:37There's so many.
00:39We could be here for ages to list off her credits.
00:43But she's also won two BAFTAs, which is huge.
00:48I introduce to you Ayesha Bywaters.
00:51What's going on?
00:53Hello, how are you?
00:55Very good, very good, very good.
00:59Ayesha, first and foremost, thank you for joining us today.
01:04I know time is precious, so definitely not taking for granted you being here.
01:11I'm just going to dive straight in.
01:13I want to know, because your career is so vast,
01:17I really want to get to grips with how you started.
01:22How did you actually get into casting?
01:26I basically went to uni, did a politics degree,
01:31decided that politics wasn't really for me.
01:35Then I left, and I'd always really liked drama.
01:38I was in the National Youth Theatre, and I worked for a theatre company.
01:45I worked for a theatre company in London called Tamasha Theatre Company as an intern.
01:50I did an internship there for a few months, and while I was there,
01:55I helped the director cast a play.
01:58I was like, I didn't know this was a job.
02:00She was like, yeah, there's a job called a casting director.
02:03It suddenly all clicked for me.
02:06It suddenly all was like, oh, my goodness.
02:08I love being around actors.
02:10I don't want to be an actor myself.
02:12This is a place where I can watch, support, be a part of the process,
02:18but I don't have to be on stage.
02:20Wow, amazing.
02:22So you know what, right, because I didn't know that you had that background
02:27in terms of going to the National Youth Theatre and stuff.
02:31Was that you playing around with maybe potentially wanting to be an actor,
02:35or were you doing something completely different there?
02:39I mean, I'm from London, and then actually it was in London.
02:42I always liked acting.
02:44I always liked singing.
02:46I always did those things at school.
02:48But I didn't really want to be an actor.
02:51It was just a great experience.
02:54I got to spend a summer in a play at the Lyric Palace there,
02:58and we performed every night, you know, and we're a little company.
03:04So those experiences are just really nice, but I like to be around people.
03:09I like to be in companies.
03:11I like to do stuff.
03:13I was in the chorus, but, you know, it's a great place to be,
03:18and so many people now are still around in different parts of the industry.
03:24So, yeah, it's really nice.
03:26Oh, that's amazing. That's amazing.
03:28So, right, in terms of, like, when you began interning
03:32and finding your way within casting,
03:35what was the industry like at that time for actors?
03:40I mean, it was a very different industry to what it is today.
03:45You know, when I first started, you would record an actor on a tape
03:50and then have to, like, with your session,
03:55you would then plug that into a computer,
03:57plug a camcorder into a computer,
03:59and in real time have to wait the two hours,
04:03three hours that session had gone on,
04:06and then it would be on your computer, and then you could edit it.
04:09So everything was a lot slower.
04:12You know, everything was quite London-centric.
04:15Can you get here to come for your audition?
04:17Yeah.
04:18People were spending quite a bit of money.
04:20You know, that was just something that if you lived somewhere else,
04:23you would know at some point that you'd have to come down.
04:25You know, people were asking, like, can we wait till after this time
04:29and after peak trains to come down a bit later?
04:32People were sending headshots in the post.
04:36People were sending letters.
04:38I'm making it sound crazy.
04:40It was, like, 17 years ago.
04:43But it was a slower thing.
04:47And so I would say that then it's more difficult
04:53to see a vast amount of people.
04:56Wow.
04:57Which I don't know if, you know,
04:58it's something we'll get into a bit later about, like,
05:01taping and all those things.
05:03And I agree that there are many disadvantages,
05:07but being able to tape and being able to live all around the country,
05:12maybe you're filming abroad, you know, maybe you're on holiday.
05:16People are scared to take a holiday
05:18because they might miss an opportunity.
05:21And also that you can see more people.
05:24Yeah.
05:25It's not. It has to be in this room.
05:26We've got it from these times.
05:28And also then we have to go and edit those tapes.
05:30And we have to do that in real time.
05:33So, you know, it's not like here's the file
05:36and we move and we go.
05:37Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
05:39So, yeah, it was different.
05:41It was different.
05:42Wow. Very manual.
05:43Very manual.
05:44Yeah.
05:45So in that, right, and it's very,
05:49I think what's very interesting is you mentioned the whole,
05:53like the cost of traveling,
05:55the not really being able to live as you want to,
06:02because you just want to be available
06:04for as many opportunities, right?
06:06It, when I think about 17 years ago,
06:10it makes me wonder, like,
06:12and I think this is fairly obvious,
06:14but I'd love to hear it from your perspective.
06:16Like, what was like the diversity like, yeah,
06:20in terms of actors and people that were considered for stuff?
06:25Well, definitely in that time, you know,
06:28things were really different.
06:32So I'm going to be real.
06:34I don't know how much has changed.
06:36Right.
06:37Wow.
06:38I don't know.
06:39Definitely some of the things that are made now
06:44and explored now might not have been explored.
06:49But like in the 90s, we had Desmonds on every week.
06:53Like we don't get shows like that anymore all the time.
06:57With more than one series.
06:59So we get opportunities.
07:00But a lot of shows I work on, they don't get recommissioned.
07:04What is different now is that you can have conversations about things.
07:07What is different now is that you get a script and you're like,
07:10who are these characters?
07:12Can we open it up?
07:13And people are really, really responsive to that.
07:16They want you to open it up.
07:18And not just in terms of race, in terms of gender,
07:23in terms of sexuality, in terms of disability, like in every way.
07:29Like what is a community?
07:30We can have those conversations on a broader scale.
07:33What does it look like?
07:34And what do you want it to look like?
07:37Wow.
07:38So, you know, see, this is,
07:41this is really interesting because it almost seems like,
07:46and correct me if I'm wrong,
07:47it almost seems like before,
07:49and you're talking from a casting director's perspective, right?
07:52You're able to like give input in terms of like, okay, cool.
07:56So can we go this way?
07:58Can we go that way?
07:59Is that what you're referring to?
08:01Exactly.
08:02Exactly.
08:03Yeah.
08:04Okay.
08:05So before then, what was it like?
08:06Was it like, okay, this is who we're looking for.
08:08Can you just go and find it?
08:09And that's it.
08:10Like,
08:11what was the dynamics between you and the rest of the production team?
08:15No, I don't think it's to do with that at all.
08:17I think a casting director's job has always been to ask those questions.
08:22You know,
08:23certainly the casting directors that I've had the pleasure to know or work
08:26with, or, you know, consider colleagues and peers.
08:28Yeah.
08:29Always about trying to open things up.
08:31That's a part of their job.
08:32Yeah.
08:33Commissioners have changed, you know,
08:37the structure of the companies have changed.
08:39So with different people getting into positions of where they have power,
08:48where, you know,
08:49they might want to see different things than the people who had all the sort
08:55of, you know, higher stakes jobs.
08:57Yeah.
08:58That long ago.
08:59So I think that's it.
09:00Yeah.
09:01Fair.
09:02Fair.
09:03Fair.
09:04Fair.
09:05Fair.
09:06Fair.
09:07Fair.
09:08Fair.
09:09Fair.
09:10Fair.
09:11Fair.
09:12Fair.
09:13Fair.
09:14Fair.
09:15Fair.
09:16So,
09:17what sort of advice or advice have you had in terms of like,
09:20maybe a difference that you wanted to make?
09:22Or was it like, do you know what?
09:23I just always need to do the best job.
09:25That's my focus.
09:26And if anything else happens as a side of it,
09:28then great.
09:33Or was there like a difference that you wanted to make in the industry
09:35for me.
09:36It was quite simply that I just wanted to see myself and my life.
09:44So I'm from London, my parents are both from Jamaica, and sometimes I felt like I wasn't
09:53seeing a London that I knew.
09:58I've got you.
09:59Now imagine that, and I'm from London, right? Imagine all the people from all the other
10:04places around the country who were like, we barely ever, ever see anything that is about us,
10:10our stories told from our perspectives. So that's what I'm interested in. I'm interested in, like,
10:15you know, I did a politics degree and decided that, like, that wasn't the place for me. But
10:20I do believe that in the creative arts, we have the power through stories to talk about so much
10:27of what's happening in this country and in the world. And I just wanted to be in a position
10:32where I could be someone who could say, do we really think this reflects what we're discussing?
10:42Shall we try and find it?
10:44Yeah.
10:46Wow. So then with that being at your heart, right, does that affect the kind of projects
10:53that you're, that you take on? Because you are obviously, and like, you're going to be in such
11:01huge demand, you know, the more BAFTAs, the more notoriety, da-da-da-da-da-da.
11:06But does that affect, like, what kind of projects that you take on?
11:12I mean, for me, in terms of the projects that I want to take on,
11:18it's about, if they scare me, it's about reading a script and being like,
11:24have I done this before? Can I do this? I don't know if I can. And then it's like,
11:29that's interesting. I want to work on that. I want to find this. I don't know if it exists.
11:35And then again, it could be the creative team that you're working with,
11:39you know, and ultimately it is the script, it is the story.
11:44So I don't think you can go into everything being like, this is my, you know, greater passion,
11:52that these stories are used to help people basically feel like, you know, they are seen.
12:02So really it is, like I said, it is ultimately the story. But as an aside, running through things,
12:09that's what I'm thinking about. Whether that's through a comedy or a drama or it's like,
12:16hmm, how do we find the truth in this?
12:19Yes. I love that. Finding the truth, finding the truth. I love it. That comes up time and time
12:25again. So I wanted to know, right, because I don't think I've ever really unpacked this or
12:32uncovered this before, right? Like what actually happens when, like as a casting director,
12:40you're confirmed on a project or how does it actually work as a casting director? Do you
12:45have to pitch for work? Do people come to you? Like, yeah, how does it actually,
12:50how does it actually work? I mean, it's different every time.
12:54But ultimately, a lot of the times, yeah, you interview for jobs and they interview
13:02quite a few casting directors and then they decide who they think they want to work with.
13:08And there's obviously people that you've worked with before that want to work with you again,
13:12so they might offer you a job. Other than people that have seen something that you've
13:17done and approach you, which is really nice. But, you know, like actors and many other people
13:26in this industry, you have to, you have to interview for jobs.
13:30Wow. So then, right, see, yeah, I just never really thought about that. But like, so now
13:38you've been interviewed, you've got the job, what happens next? And I'm saying that from
13:45this perspective, right? I watched an interview with Spike Lee once and he was saying that,
13:49like, with casting directors, like, it's not as simple as, okay, just, we're going to have
13:58Denzel in this because he's like, well, I can go and get Denzel myself. Like, you have to bring
14:02something to the table. And like, I guess when you're confirmed on a project, then what happens
14:11next? Is it like you're reading the script, you're trying to understand the nuances of each character
14:17and then you're searching for talent that fits that or like, yeah, what happens next?
14:22Well, I mean, first of all, that's what a lot of your interview should be, right? It should be less
14:27about ideas and more about what you believe the project to be. And the sort of, you know,
14:34the sort of way that you would approach that project, that's how you want to work on it.
14:40And hopefully that director, that producer will understand sort of the direction that you want
14:45to take and be like, that's cool. So that's sort of already been decided. Then you'll have like,
14:51a conversation to be like, where should we start? What role should we start with?
14:54Did you have any ideas? This is what I was thinking, you know, should we do some ideas
15:03together or should we, you know, should we offer a certain person or should we just get out there
15:08and start auditioning people? Like, what's the route that you want to take? And that's sort of
15:14how we go about it. I love that. I love that. OK, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. So in terms of
15:21like a good casting director, because there are loads, there are actually, there's a lot more than
15:29I realise, like in terms of like casting directors out there, right? What makes a good casting
15:34director, in your opinion? What makes a good casting director? First of all, I think that
15:41loads of them, the ones that I know anyway, they are really good. So it's a difficult time
15:46because there's only so much work for actors, for casting directors. Do you know what I mean? So
15:55for me, what makes a good casting director or what I like to achieve in my own casting is for it
16:03to not take you out of the situation. So even if you're casting like super famous people,
16:10if even for one moment you're like, oh, look, there's Ryan Gosling. Yeah. Not there's character
16:19whoever. There's, you know, then I'm like, the casting hasn't entirely worked because it's taken
16:27me out of the situation. It hasn't helped do its job at this point, which is be part of telling
16:34this story. Wow. Okay. I love that. Being focused on the story. Amazing. Amazing. You mentioned
16:42taping earlier, right? And how that's changed in terms of, you know, putting stuff in the post,
16:48et cetera, et cetera. I wanted to know, like, what do you prefer? And I guess I say that from
16:58the perspective of, you know, that, that lockdown shift of, you know, people sending in tapes a lot
17:05more than having auditions. And then even when lockdown ended, it's kind of shifted towards that.
17:11What's, what's your thoughts on that? And would you prefer? I suppose the best way to explain
17:18this for me is that I cast a show called We Are Ladybug. And the first series of that,
17:23before we got to the first series, we had to do sort of a pilot, which was called a black.
17:28And to cast that, I cast it by tape. And this was when he 70. Wow.
17:39So obviously, there's, you know, I had to look for new talent. Yeah. We wanted to explore high
17:44and low. I don't know, a Muslim girl punk band that I could have tapped up in that situation.
17:50So and you could have done it in sort of open call, you know, sense of going and being like,
17:59we're going to be here at this day. Yeah. But a lot of it was actually like finding people
18:04on Instagram and Twitter and contacting them and looking at comedians and looking at musicians. And
18:08so it didn't feel like one of these ones where I could go like, sit in a town hall and wait for
18:12people to come to me. And you were looking at people who were slightly older as well, which
18:17sometimes, you know, can be tricky with that. So it felt like taping was the right thing to do. So I
18:22personally believe that it has its place. Yep.
18:29I do agree that there can be times when it can be tricky. I do agree that it shouldn't be relied
18:36upon. You know, for us, we take first instance, and then we get people in a room. Yeah. Okay.
18:43And for us, we say to the director, if there's anything you see, if there's anything you like
18:48about that actor, let's get them in a room. Let's explore them. Let's allow them to be directed by
18:55you. Got you. Yeah. That's how I think it should be used. Yeah. Yeah. Not as you know, not so that
19:04you are never meeting the team. Yeah. Yeah. And you end up on set. And then you feel like you've
19:12never sort of, because it's good to meet everyone. And also, I might not end up casting you. But I
19:20might end up casting you with something else. So to have those moments where we're together
19:25are really important. So that's what I think the compromise is, because we're not going back,
19:30I don't think. Yeah. I mean, but we're not, we're not going back to every session in a room.
19:36Yeah. So we have to be honest about that. We have to look forward. We have to look at the
19:40benefit, which is that we can see more people, which means that we can see newer talent, rather
19:47than relying on people that we know will come in. And, you know, because you've only got a limited
19:51amount of time. And people can be based wherever they want. People can fit into their lives.
19:56Yep. Yep. And the only other thing I'd say is that, you know, there's a lot of like,
20:02things being said about self tapes, like if you get it in first, you're more likely to be seen.
20:08If people don't watch them, do you actually watch your tapes?
20:13Like, why would I ask you for a tape and not watch it?
20:19I love that. I love that. Wow. Okay. Yeah. This is interesting, because you, you sound like,
20:30the phrase that's come to my mind is you sound like one of the real ones. And the reason I'll
20:35say that, right, is because a lot of, a lot of actors that I know, like personally, they speak
20:40very highly of you. And the way in which, the way in which it comes across for me is that you
20:49actually have like genuine relationships with them. And some of them, you might have, I don't
20:58know, asked for a tape or they've had auditions with you, but they haven't actually been casted
21:04for like some of your projects. So I wanted to know, right, how do you interact with and
21:11treat actors in order to actually build that rapport?
21:18I don't know. Might be the honest answer. But the only thing I can say is like,
21:24that is a very kind thing to say. All I can do is be honest, right? This is not transactional.
21:31This is not just, you know, I need you. And then once that's over, bye-bye.
21:39Actors want to build careers. I want to see them like shine. I want to see them, you know,
21:46I don't want them to come into a room with us. I don't want them to get a self-tape request
21:50and feel like they have not been treated well, that we didn't watch it, that we don't care.
22:01We really do. I often watch TV, go to the cinema and I'm just like, you know, go to the theatre
22:08and I'm just like, oh man, I've seen that actor so many times. Like they've always nearly got
22:13the role, but it just never was the right role. And now look at them here, like doing it, killing
22:19it. Like that's amazing. But they finally found it. You can see an actor come in your room and
22:24sometimes they're like downbeat, underconfident. It's like, no, I always try and get the actor,
22:33you know what I mean? Walk them in, say hello. Try and make it as comfortable as possible. It's
22:38a weird situation though. So it's never going to be completely comfortable, but as comfortable as
22:42possible. At least they're like, you're coming to see our office. You're going to, you know,
22:47it should be an all right time. It's the best I can offer you. Because it is still, you know,
22:53it's like going for a driving test. There's nerves, there's, you know, as much as I'm like,
22:57just be chill. You want to make it as fun as it can be. For some people it is. It's just like,
23:03because you're just meeting, you're getting a chance to meet, catch up. So it should be fun.
23:08It should be nice. If you get the job, you get the job. If you don't, then we're just developing
23:14that relationship. So it doesn't mean like come in and don't care, but it means don't make it
23:20your everything because the journey is everything. Do you know what I mean? And so for me, there are
23:28actors now that I've met when I was an assistant to now having my own office. And it's great to
23:33be like, what's going on? What's happening in your life? And these little snippets where we
23:36see each other a few times a year. So if I'm getting you in, even if you're not getting the
23:41job, I want to cast you. Do you know what I mean? Like, you want to cast everyone you're getting in
23:47and the people I'm not getting in, probably I want to cast you too. You know what I mean? Like,
23:53I can't get everyone in. Yeah, it's true. It's very true. You know, you said, you said something
24:00about treating actors like it was making, making sure that they're having a good interaction with
24:12you. Right. And I wanted to know, like, because I wanted to, is it possible to get back to everyone
24:21that you request the tape for? Like, is that, is that a thing that's done? Like, even if they don't
24:26get the role, do they always get feedback? Like how, how do those interactions go?
24:32So we really try and get back to everyone for every role. Yeah. And that's something that was
24:38taught to me. So I worked for a casting director for a long time called Shane Bay and that was
24:43taught to me there. But, you know, but I'm not going to get back to you in time and that's going
24:51to be the problem. Right. Okay. Okay. You have to sort of wait till the role is cast sometimes
24:58to let everyone go. Yeah. And then by that time, your mate might have told, their mate might have
25:03told 12 other people. And so it feels like, and that's the thing, how do we do everything?
25:10Yeah. So everyone finds out about everything at the right time. And sometimes we've seen loads
25:15of people over a whole project for lots of different roles. So it can take time. Yes. Like
25:21it's me and two assistants with three people trying to make it work. So, you know, we're doing our best.
25:34No, I hear you. I hear you. I hear you. Well, you're doing a good job too. I wanted to know
25:42as well, in a world where like streamers and broadcasters, you know, budgets are going up,
25:51money is less, projects are, you know, it's quite a difficult time for a lot of different
25:59organisations and creatives. Right. But I know there's this emphasis on like making like the
26:05biggest and most acclaimed projects, which oftentimes is, is like, I guess, reaching for,
26:13you know, as big a star as possible because, you know, they want ratings. But in the midst of that,
26:20how important are fresh faces to you? Like new talent? Well, I think if you were to ask any
26:26casting director, it's incredibly, you know, that's, that's your job, right? I'm there going
26:30to the theatre. I'm watching everything on film and TV. I mean, I can't watch everything. It's
26:38between me and my team to do our best to cover everything between us. But we are always there
26:44looking for new people, looking for, so that's the thing that is the most interesting. Also,
26:51the other thing that's really confusing is all the people that have this profile, that get these
26:57projects greenlit, that excite people. Yeah. They had to start from somewhere. They had to
27:02have these projects. They had to have these moments. So we have to remember that always
27:09moving forward. If we're casting the same people all the time, where is the next person coming from?
27:16Where's your next Idris Elba? So, you know. It's true. It's very true. Very true. Very true.
27:25In terms of the, like when you see someone, like you, like you said, you're going everywhere.
27:32You're, you're in the cinema. You're watching stuff on TV. You're going to the theatre.
27:37When you see someone who, they might have like a small part, but they're shining and they're
27:44showing you the truth that you're looking for. Or you see someone on Instagram, like basically,
27:49when you come across new talent, what, what do you do? Do you, do you bank them? Do you tell the
27:56team, keep an eye on them? Do you reach out to them? Like, yeah. How, how does that work?
28:01It's exactly that. It's exactly that. It's just like, you know, on Instagram,
28:07obviously it's like following people. You'll be like, I'll follow them. I'll follow them.
28:11Yeah.
28:13And, and then there might be a time, like, I really like the Cavs family.
28:17And then we got Tayshia Cavs to be in the kitchen, but you never know when something's gonna come
28:23along. So it is, it's just about remembering people. And then there's some times where you
28:29just don't know. So I really like a rapper called, like Christelle as a rapper. And
28:41then we got these projects and they were really right for us. It was like, we reached out and
28:45were like, have you ever thought about acting? She did a role in the kitchen and then she got
28:49a role in Queenie and with Queenie, it was like, you know, she's from Brixton. It's set in Brixton.
28:54Like, I was like, this makes sense to get her involved. And we've also got a singer,
28:59Bella, in Queenie. And with Bella, it was just a case of not so much. It was,
29:04I was watching the news one day and she was on the news speaking to a journalist and I was just like,
29:13okay, how she's speaking, how she is. She really feels like the role. I wonder if she can act.
29:22And then she came in and just got better and better and better. And everyone was like,
29:27oh, that's really cool. That's really interesting. But at the same time we were seeing actors,
29:30so it wasn't one is better than the other or it's just like, who are all the people that we can
29:36explore? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And then when you find it, you find it as simple as that.
29:43Yeah. And I hope that they enjoy it and they want to do more of it.
29:47Again, that whole thing about it being transactional, it's not just like, oh,
29:50I found it for this one tick. It's like, I hope this is another way that they can explore
29:54themselves creatively. Wow. Do you know what? It's something that's just dawned on me is you
30:03really take a holistic approach to the people that you're working with, i.e. you don't see them
30:11just as talent. You see them as people. Why is that? I mean, it's amazing and it's good. I think
30:17everyone should do that. But I'm just I'm really curious as to why or how, where that's come from.
30:23Well, I don't think that that is like new or novel. I think, you know, so many people who
30:31do my job, it's quite a, I think it always has been a job that is about caring for people. You
30:39meet so many people, you see them at a certain stage of their career. You're there to support
30:44them or can talk about, you know, how they've changed since they did this or that when you saw
30:50them at a showcase. So I think it's quite, certainly all the people that I've worked for
30:56or interned with or they all have this approach. So it's definitely something that's learned. And
31:05then also it just feels like the best way to get people to give you good performances. And again,
31:15that's not for me, that's for them. If you come in a room and you feel intimidated and that you're
31:21being judged and that you shouldn't be here, you're not going to do your best work. So my job
31:28is to help and support you to do that and champion you. That really is what my job is, to be like,
31:34listen, we've seen this actor in this, this, that, you know, we think this is what they could bring
31:39to the role. Let's get them in and see what they can do. And then be like, oh man, not today.
31:45That's not on them though. That's the role. That's the script. It's just, you know, only one person
31:52can get the job. Sometimes it hurts. Sometimes it absolutely and utterly hurts when someone doesn't
31:57get a job because they're amazing. But just someone else was the role. That is my job. How
32:04do the audience understand the story? That's all it is. It's like, so not personal, but you're
32:10dealing with people. So it's incredibly personal. Wow. Yeah, that is, yeah, that's, that's very true.
32:18Wow. Yeah, you, yeah, you, you know your job inside out. For, for someone who like wants to
32:26get into casting right, where would you advise they start? Or how would you advise this? It's just so,
32:33there's just so much, isn't there? I suppose the one thing that we have now are just so many, you
32:38know, I use it all the time. So many other casting directors use it all the time. There are, people
32:42are posting all the time now online with their casting calls. So you have that, you have many
32:49workshops, you have things online that, that you can watch. You have groups that you can attend.
32:54There's many different ways. Yeah. So it's a bit like my job as well. If you ask people how they
33:02got into it, they're going to say a thousand different ways. True. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
33:06yeah, yeah. So I can't, all I can say is, if you want to do this, it's going to be really hard.
33:16Wow. There's a lot of people, there's a lot of actors. So why do you want to do this?
33:23Yep. And then remember that, because that's going to keep you going.
33:28Wow. Thank you. That's great advice. Great advice. And one of my final questions, Aisha, is
33:36what do you think the industry needs more of?
33:42I mean, I think it needs more of what it always needs more of. It needs more people that come from
33:50different parts of our society to be, you know, be the gatekeepers. That's what it needs.
33:59I still think we lack
34:04diverse storytelling in many different ways. I still think that things are quite,
34:10you know, it feels like a risk every time. And that doesn't seem to change rather than the norm.
34:17Yep. And there's still a worry. And I don't know if
34:23TV or films or theatre that is for different communities is given a chance sometimes,
34:30it's given the same chance as some other shows are. Yeah. To just find their feet.
34:39Yeah. Yeah. And to explore.
34:43That's a good point. Wow. Wow. Thank you. Thank you, Aisha. Before we go,
34:51before we go, is there anything else that you'd like to share? Is there anything that you're
34:56working on? Yeah. Before we go. I mean, I wish I could share what I'm working on. But I can't.
35:10You know, we're trying our best and hopefully fun things are coming.
35:14I love that. I love that. I love that. I love that. Oh, Aisha,
35:19you really are a light in this industry. Very kind.
35:24Yeah. Do you know what? I see it. But then when I speak with other people,
35:31your name comes up a lot in a way that I didn't realise. Essentially what you said, this thing
35:41actually is personal and they regard you in a personal way. And I'm like, oh, that's so good.
35:48Really? But then it's more than one person. So I'm like, oh, how do you, almost like a spider,
35:54how do you maintain good relationships with people? And you have to see so many
36:00people on a regular basis. But it's what you said. It's caring about them in your interactions with
36:07them. That leaves that mark. So, yes, please continue. I'm glad. I'm glad that people,
36:14yeah, that it's working and that, you know. Thank you.
36:20It is good. It's good. Well, we will catch up. We will catch up, Aisha. Thank you so much.