Las Vegas Raiders Insider Podcast on the Emerging Raiders, the Vulnerable Kansas City Chiefs, and More
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00:00 Hello everybody, this is Hondo Carpenter from Sports Illustrated's Fan Nation Las Vegas
00:07 Raiders Insider Podcast.
00:09 It's great to have you here today as always joined by my dear friend, the great Johnny
00:12 Schott.
00:13 Now for Christmas today, he's wearing his hat, but our first show of the new year, John,
00:21 you got to introduce the show with a riff, okay?
00:24 Yes, will do.
00:26 Absolutely.
00:27 The fans are demanding it.
00:29 So can you do the introduction?
00:30 Can you do a enter the Sandman, the intro?
00:34 I don't know that one, but I've done it before.
00:36 The thing is if I do it here, it's going to trip off all kinds of crazy stuff.
00:40 So I've got something cool that sounds familiar that will work.
00:47 If it works so well, it'll take right off and become the open to the show.
00:51 But I got something in mind, but yeah, if you start playing something note for note,
00:56 you'll get some tricky digital trouble as people know out there.
01:00 Oh, I didn't know that.
01:02 All right.
01:03 Johnny, let's dig right into it.
01:04 We got a lot we're going to talk about today.
01:08 We got a lot of Raiders.
01:10 My article yesterday, my one-on-one with the general manager went viral.
01:14 We're going to talk about that.
01:15 And then I got some NFL things I want to get to.
01:18 But I made the decision with my article that published yesterday at nine Eastern in the
01:24 morning, nine Pacific, 12 noon Eastern.
01:29 My one-on-one with Champ Kelly, I didn't want it to be about the Raiders.
01:34 I wanted fans to get to know him, his philosophies, what built him, what made him, went back to
01:41 his time with the Broncos, with the Bears, all of it.
01:46 It's not a matter of if he's going to get a general manager job, it's when.
01:49 And it may not be with the Raiders.
01:51 It may be with the Raiders.
01:52 I'm rooting for them.
01:53 I hope it is with the Raiders.
01:54 But he's going to get a chance.
01:56 And because we didn't know that it was going to be the Raiders, I thought that was the
02:00 best way to go.
02:02 What are your thoughts on that?
02:04 Well, I think it is actually important to have some idea of who Champ Kelly is.
02:11 It's not like he's a guy that everyone knows in and out.
02:14 You know, a lot of the guys at that level of the NFL, the general manager, the front
02:18 office level, we don't know that much about.
02:20 It takes us time to know some of their names.
02:24 And over time, maybe we get to know some of the names.
02:27 Most of the names we don't know.
02:28 If you ask people who the Patriots general managers were during their great run, you're
02:34 going to hear some different answers and some big holes.
02:38 At the same time, there is real importance at the NFL level to understand what a general
02:47 manager is after.
02:49 We've seen some really weak sauce general managers just kind of stay and blow in the
02:53 wind while somebody else is pulling the strings.
02:56 And I don't know that that's what you want.
02:58 What you want to understand if you are a franchise that's going to get behind Champ Kelly is
03:04 what is Champ Kelly going with?
03:07 Is he a guy that is like, "Hey, every team is different.
03:10 We're going to try to put each team in the best position to win," kind of like a coach
03:12 would, kind of like Belichick and Saban did on their great special, explaining every single
03:17 team is different.
03:18 And to coach them all a little bit differently, the key is to find what can we do to put the
03:22 team in the best spot to win, not try to jam a square peg into a round hole.
03:27 So at this time for Champ Kelly, I think that was a good thing because you can look pretty
03:33 hard out there and there's not a ton out there about what's behind Champ Kelly and who he
03:39 is and kind of where he comes from.
03:41 So I imagine around the sport, that's going to get some eyeballs because it's not a readily
03:47 known set of facts.
03:50 People are not like, "Oh yeah, Champ Kelly, he's the guy from this school and then he
03:53 went here and then he did that."
03:56 Not picking on Mike Shanahan, but a lot of people know Mike Shanahan's history and he
04:00 wasn't really a GM, obviously, mostly a coach, but that is plain as day.
04:06 Everyone knows that.
04:07 Everyone knows John Gruden's history.
04:09 This is a different cat, a very important one and a very important time for his career
04:13 because the next step could be a big one.
04:16 Now we turn to the Raiders who come off a zero points with Minnesota, 63 with the Chargers,
04:27 the biggest ever in NFL history to go from zero to 63 point franchise record for the
04:34 Raiders at 63 points.
04:36 Historic, absolutely historic.
04:39 The way that Antonio Pierce is leading this team, you cannot deny it.
04:45 Again, you can argue whether or not you want him.
04:49 I'm rooting for him to get the job, but I think you cannot deny his thumbprint on what
04:54 he's done on this team.
04:56 I think he has now emerged as a guy, whether it's the Raiders or not, he's going to get
05:02 a chance as a head coach.
05:04 He's proven that.
05:07 I think he's done an exceptional job.
05:09 Your thoughts on the job Antonio Pierce has done?
05:13 I think to be fair, he's done a good bit better than it would have expected.
05:18 Anyone would have expected to take anybody and put them in the position he was in.
05:23 The team, the timing, I don't think you'd expect quite these results.
05:27 To see a jump or a boost the first week or two would be expected.
05:33 Nobody wants to hang a zero on a board ever.
05:36 Obviously, nobody wants to hang a zero on a board, but to go from a zero to a 63 actually
05:42 brings a lot more attention and eyeballs to Antonio Pierce.
05:45 What's going on in Las Vegas?
05:47 What?
05:48 It's obviously unprecedented.
05:51 It's not necessarily something anyone wants to see again because you've got to hang a
05:54 zero in there.
05:56 That's a whole large bet that you're ever going to see any kind of spread from zero
06:00 to 63.
06:01 But I do think Pierce has taken great advantage of his interim head coaching.
06:08 I think from the very start, the very first move he made with the offensive coordinator
06:11 was interesting.
06:13 We see personnel moves that he may or may be not a part of.
06:16 Obviously, Kelly is a part of.
06:19 Happening just in the last couple days, suggesting that they're continuing to coach this.
06:25 This is not going into cruise control now.
06:27 Obviously, it shouldn't go into cruise control when you've got the Chiefs on the docket.
06:32 But some franchises are in cruise control or some look like they're heading into a pasture
06:38 in Charlotte, for example.
06:40 Antonio Pierce is standing out.
06:43 I don't know where he would have sat in the list of potential head coaching candidates
06:47 before the year.
06:49 But right now, you've got to have him really pretty high up there because there's actual
06:54 game experience in what he's done.
06:56 And as I talked about last time, it is going to be a different Antonio Pierce the first
07:01 full season that he's got.
07:03 It's not going to be dramatically different.
07:04 But if anything, I would expect it to find a different gear.
07:09 He won't be an interim coach again, but he has to this point done a better job than I
07:14 think anyone could have reasonably expected he would do taking that thing over.
07:19 He attacks the game.
07:22 He is leads from the front.
07:26 These guys love him.
07:28 Now I'm going to tell you how big of a job I think he's done.
07:31 I think the Chiefs are not as good as they were even the last time they played them.
07:37 I think the Raiders are better than the last time they played them.
07:40 I still think to go up the arrowhead into any road win is stealing one in the NFL.
07:48 I've written that before from Don Shula.
07:51 But to go up there and I mean, have a very competitive type game to go up there and fight
08:01 is all that you can ask.
08:03 To me, that's what I'm looking for.
08:05 I still have not made my prediction.
08:07 Originally, I predicted that they would lose this game.
08:11 I'm still leaning towards that.
08:14 But to me, this is a much closer game than I ever thought it would be.
08:18 And that's a testament to Antonio Pierce.
08:21 It is.
08:23 And as fundamental as it sounds, part of the testament is he has done enough and consistently
08:30 to put the feature players, put the ball in their hands as much as they can on offense.
08:36 We've seen that.
08:37 We've seen the ball go to Adams Moore.
08:39 We've seen the ball go to Jacobs Moore.
08:40 We've seen a development of a tight end in progress that the guy over there on that side
08:45 of the screen said was coming.
08:46 On the other side of the ball, we've seen mastery performance by Max Crosby.
08:52 We've seen other guys.
08:55 It's not so easy to just plain feature them like you can when you put the ball in their
08:58 hand.
08:59 That has stood out from Antonio Pierce.
09:01 And yes, the Chiefs are not in disarray, but we have not seen them this upset before.
09:08 They have an issue with the ball, catching the ball, holding the ball for completion.
09:15 We've seen that this year.
09:17 I don't, doesn't look like it's just going to go away.
09:20 It really is something.
09:21 We've seen upset Pat Mahomes like we haven't seen before.
09:24 And even Andy Reid.
09:26 They have some real issues that I think they've got some likes to stand on.
09:30 They've been a victim of some bad calls.
09:32 I think they handle the offsides thing dead wrong.
09:35 The wide receiver just should have raised his hand and said, I was offside.
09:38 I don't know how he couldn't have looked and seen that.
09:42 Now they may have a point that the official is supposed to say something, but as everyone
09:46 has pointed out rightfully, it doesn't remove the fact that you're offside.
09:50 But to blow it up that much, not sure how effective that was.
09:54 This is a curious time for the Chiefs.
09:57 I don't think we're going to see the Chiefs just blow the Raiders out at all on Christmas
10:01 day.
10:02 I don't see that coming.
10:03 We'll get to predictions when we need to get to them, but I'm kind of with you.
10:07 I think this is going to be, I don't know that it's going to be a totally gettable game,
10:11 but it's going to be a game that the Raiders should have a chance to hang with the Chiefs.
10:16 And if they can hang with them and compete for all 60 minutes, it's possible they could
10:21 steal one.
10:22 But the Chiefs are not the same Chiefs that we've seen in past years.
10:26 Not right now.
10:27 No.
10:28 You've done this with me for years and you know I have 10 criteria that I judge every
10:32 game on.
10:34 And coming into the season of the 10, I had the Chiefs 7-3.
10:42 Where I thought 7 of the 10 really pointed to the Chiefs, 3 pointed to the Raiders.
10:50 It's not that far away on this one anymore.
10:53 I think Antonio Pierce, I mean his staying with Aiden O'Connell, moving Bo Hardegre up
10:58 to the box, John, all these little adjustments that he's making, bringing, you know, going
11:03 and saying, "Listen, Jack Jones can fit in our locker room."
11:06 Look at what he, look at that.
11:07 I mean, to me, that was the most beautiful pick six I've ever seen in my life.
11:11 Last week it was unbelievable.
11:13 Just looking at how he has this team ready.
11:16 And now they got confidence.
11:19 And you know as well as anyone, you've been doing this a long time as I have.
11:23 Confidence means everything.
11:25 Peyton Manning's first year, there were people saying he was a bust.
11:31 And he just started getting confidence, he started getting better.
11:33 I'm not saying Aiden O'Connell is Peyton, I'm not saying he isn't.
11:37 But you know, the last time he played the Chiefs, I think he had the best rating in
11:42 the NFL among quarterbacks.
11:44 It was 120.
11:46 He continues to play better.
11:48 I still have not made up my mind here, John.
11:50 I'm telling you, I go back and forth on this one.
11:53 It's very, very fascinating to me.
11:55 I want to talk to you about another critical thing that I think is really important with
12:01 these Raiders.
12:02 And it's the fact that you don't see them repeating mistakes.
12:09 It is almost, I'm a 52-year-old man.
12:12 If you would have told me at any time in my career, including after the Detroit Lion game
12:23 before Josh, even afterwards, that the Raiders would be the least penalized team in the NFL
12:29 at any point in my lifetime, I'd have told you, no, that's just not their psyche.
12:34 It's not who they are.
12:36 But man, Antonio has hammered the point.
12:40 We can't afford to beat ourselves.
12:42 We're not good enough to beat ourselves and the other people.
12:46 You mentioned a minute ago, the Chiefs have had a few bad calls against them.
12:50 And that's true.
12:51 But after years of getting all the calls, it is just a drop in the bucket.
12:58 What he's done there, the way avoiding sacks, the way Aiden O'Connell has done it, his QB
13:04 rating going up, his quarterback and offense looks terrible against Minnesota, no point.
13:10 He makes no personnel changes, but gets his OC up in the box, puts a respectful boot to
13:18 the can of the quarterback.
13:20 Listen, I believe in you.
13:22 Go attack.
13:23 Don't look over your shoulder.
13:24 Go do it.
13:25 I mean, when you look at every single thing he's done, Malcolm Coons changing how they
13:31 coached him, now he looks like an emerging superstar defensive end across from Max Crosby.
13:38 Tyree Wilson getting moved to the inside, rushing for, which was Patrick Graham, but
13:43 in association with Antonio Pierce, listening to his coaches.
13:48 When you look at the impact of him, it's pretty phenomenal, isn't it?
13:53 It is.
13:54 And we probably underrate confidence because as Jack Nicklaus once said, he said something
14:01 like, you know, you can take three years to build it up and it can go away really quickly.
14:09 Go away in a couple swings from golf analogy.
14:12 What the Raiders look like is a team that's not trying to do too much in the past.
14:18 And we can look around the league right now and see teams that maybe have players that
14:22 are trying to do so much that it's, it's really hurting the other 10 on the field and it's
14:27 making a difference.
14:28 We saw that in the Eagles game on Monday night, uh, pointed out pretty clearly, uh, by a defensive
14:35 back trying to do too much on a play late in the game.
14:38 We haven't seen the Raiders do too much of that.
14:41 And when you talk about not beating yourselves, that's a place that you can point at.
14:45 The penalty thing is beyond belief, really.
14:48 It's actually so far beyond belief.
14:50 I know a lot of Raider fans are just probably frozen solid.
14:53 Like let's get through the end of the year because this is, this is too good to be true.
14:57 This is too good to be true that we don't have a massive deficit in the flags.
15:02 Let's get through the year.
15:03 And then actually when it's all in ink, add it up and be like, Holy cow, those are some
15:07 of the intangible things that I don't think you can predict when a coaching change is
15:11 made that's going to happen.
15:12 Cause it doesn't always are usually happen.
15:15 Usually what happens when there's an interim coach, especially at the college level is
15:19 you see, uh, basically more selfish play than less, less disciplined play than more.
15:27 And you maybe see some out of character, dumb things that people do on the field.
15:31 We haven't seen that.
15:32 And it to everyone's very clear perception.
15:38 It's not because Antonio Pierce has been tightening the leash too much.
15:42 Everyone knows that that might've been what happened in the past.
15:45 Too tight a leash, not enough celebrating the wins, et cetera.
15:49 At the same time, this isn't just Lucy goosey, go do what you want fun and gun.
15:54 So maybe this is a product of Pierce playing when he did of Pierce coaching at the level
15:59 that he did learning from the great head coaches, uh, really who fed successful careers like
16:03 Herm Edwards that he was under.
16:07 He's got the finger on the pulse of this group and he may have, this is just one of those
16:14 things that I don't think you can predict, but when you want to look for examples and
16:19 evidence, are they playing smart?
16:21 Are they playing physical?
16:22 Are they playing 60 minutes?
16:23 Are they beating themselves consistently?
16:25 It's one thing to get beaten by the chiefs because they're a more talented team.
16:29 Imagine if the Raiders were doing some of the things the chiefs have been doing lately.
16:33 If they got and drop a bunch of balls, if they got and take a bunch of dumb penalties,
16:36 if they got and they don't line up correctly, if they line up off sides, we'd be saying
16:40 a whole different story.
16:41 Yes, the credit goes to Pierce and the staff and the players for doing that this far.
16:46 And yeah, to be honest, it is a surprise.
16:49 This is not something people around the NFL were expecting was going to show up when Antonio
16:53 Pierce took over.
16:54 I think they were expecting the car to start shaking and rumbling and leaking oil and maybe
17:01 losing a door and kind of coming to a barely stop here at the end of the season.
17:06 Yeah, I, interim, Rich Versace was the first interim situation that I really watched with
17:13 my own eyes that it didn't come off the rails.
17:18 If you look at percentages and I've seen a lot of the interim, as you know, they just
17:24 normally are utter failures.
17:26 This has been nothing.
17:27 This has been an utter success.
17:30 And I really think he's positioned himself.
17:33 I'm going to tell you, John, I've not yet made my prediction, but I am.
17:39 I am really leaning towards.
17:41 I think the Raiders are going to get this one.
17:43 I really do just based on some things I can't talk about and based on some things I can,
17:50 they're more disciplined.
17:52 If they go up there and play the way they've been playing, now listen, they're not scoring
18:00 63.
18:01 I'm not even remotely implying that they don't have to score 63 to beat the chiefs, but man,
18:09 I'm leaning towards it.
18:10 It's going to be an interesting pick for me.
18:12 You know how serious I, you know, before the year I had said, if Jimmy Garoppolo stayed
18:16 healthy for 17 games, I thought they would have won nine.
18:21 And that was my prediction for the season.
18:23 Obviously Jimmy didn't, obviously the coach was fired, but I'm going to tell you now the
18:28 way AP's coaching right now, if he had coached all 17 and had training camp and OTAs and
18:35 mini camp, I think this is probably a 10 or 11 win team, probably an 11 win team.
18:42 And that tells you a lot about Antonio Pierce.
18:45 It's going to be, I said, when he got the job, it's his job to make this very difficult
18:50 on Mark Davis.
18:52 And let me just go to the next one.
18:55 If he beats the chiefs, do you see a scenario in which Mark Davis doesn't name him the head
18:59 coach?
19:02 Barring something unbelievable in the final two.
19:06 No, I don't.
19:09 I would think that that would practically clinch the thing because everyone on earth
19:15 who's familiar with the NFL knows that in order to win your division, you're going to
19:20 have to beat the chiefs.
19:22 So if you actually have a coach that did it and had a chance, certainly to compete in
19:28 an argument, not a chance really to win the first one, but competitive for a chunk of
19:34 it.
19:35 Yeah.
19:36 I think that probably would.
19:38 Now in a perfect world, of course you run the table and win the last two.
19:41 The last one's got a name brand on it too, that fans are important to pay attention to.
19:46 But yeah, I mean, if you're anybody in this position, in an interim position in this division
19:52 and you beat the chiefs, your candidacy has to go way, way, it has to go way up.
19:58 So I didn't really think of it as a cherry on the top type of situation coming up this
20:02 week.
20:03 We obviously don't know what's going to happen in the game, but if they find a way to beat
20:07 the Chiefs at Arrowhead, I would think that that is a cherry on the top of the candidacy
20:12 for Antonio Pierce to be named the permanent head coach for the Raiders, most likely after
20:18 the year.
20:19 I don't know what upside there would be to do it before, but yeah, that would be something.
20:24 John, before the Chargers game, I went out into the tailgate lots.
20:34 Those people were amazing.
20:37 I just, I don't even really have enough words to describe it.
20:42 And I'm going to tell you, I heard, I kept hearing something that really resonated with
20:50 me.
20:51 AP's one of us.
20:52 AP grew up, Cali grew up a Raider fan.
20:58 He gets it.
21:00 This is not like any other NFL team.
21:04 There's none like it.
21:05 They have their own culture.
21:09 I'm not saying other teams don't have a culture.
21:13 Belichick wasn't a Patriot.
21:16 He became a Patriot.
21:19 Holmgren became a Packer.
21:25 Jimmy Johnson became a Cowboy.
21:28 Rich Versace became a Raider.
21:31 Totally.
21:32 I give him that credit.
21:34 John Madden was a Raider.
21:37 AP is a Raider.
21:42 He resonates.
21:45 The fans really liked John Gruden.
21:50 Some of them didn't, but the most part, just really liked him.
21:53 They really, really liked Rich.
21:57 They love AP.
21:58 AP is one of them.
22:01 It reminds me of a John Madden, where even when John was in the booth and making video
22:09 games, every Raider, "That's our John Madden.
22:12 That's our guy."
22:14 It's a unique relationship.
22:16 I find it fascinating.
22:19 The connection that he has with where he grew up, that is unique.
22:26 It just fits very well.
22:28 There's a visual appeal.
22:30 You don't have to be a Raider fan to see Antonio Pierce on the sideline.
22:33 "Oh, that's a guy that makes a lot of sense there."
22:37 He played, which Raiders head coaches have ... Obviously, there have been some that have
22:42 played.
22:43 AP is of an era connected deeply with one of the stops the Raiders had in Los Angeles.
22:50 It does seem to be a pretty natural fit.
22:53 For example, you can think of other guys that wouldn't be as clearly natural a fit.
23:01 I like Jason Garrett.
23:02 I think he's a really smart head coach, a smart offensive coordinator.
23:07 If he was the Raiders head coach, it wouldn't be as natural a fit.
23:13 Mike Tomlin was not a stealer.
23:17 He's in ink as a stealer.
23:19 He will always be a stealer.
23:23 If he was in the Raiders, it wouldn't fit as well.
23:25 It'd be like, "Hey, here's a guy from a total other organization."
23:28 Pierce does seem to be a natural fit.
23:32 To his credit so far, he doesn't look like a guy that's going to screw it up.
23:37 I think there's a lot of Raider fans that want some stability, that want some commitment,
23:42 that want some common sense thinking for somebody in a position of playing, coaching, whatever,
23:47 that's not going to screw it up because there have been screw-ups in recent time.
23:51 I think sometimes we underestimate that a little bit.
23:54 Some people just want relative quiet, professional, and some success without screwing the thing
24:01 up big time.
24:02 There's a little value ...
24:03 I'm going to tell you ... I'm sorry, Joe.
24:05 Go ahead.
24:06 There's a little more value to that maybe than there should be because of what's happened
24:11 in the past five years.
24:13 I think Pierce gets that.
24:14 He's not blind.
24:15 He knows what's happened.
24:17 He can't miss it.
24:19 I got to tell you, the thing that in the four years I've covered the Raiders that I see
24:25 that I'm lacking in this franchise is stability.
24:32 They thought they had it with Groot.
24:34 They didn't.
24:36 Had a chance with the Bersaccia.
24:37 Went a different direction.
24:41 Bring in Josh.
24:43 Gone.
24:44 AP has come in and said, "This is who we are.
24:48 This is what we're going to do.
24:50 He works great with Champ."
24:53 They have brought some normalcy.
24:56 Now, talking about the Raiders, and all of a sudden the normalcy is discipline, no penalties,
25:06 attacking.
25:07 I loved what he said at halftime.
25:10 He told the team, "I don't care about the score.
25:12 Foot on the gas."
25:14 Everything that you think is Raider is Raider now other than the penalties.
25:22 I will tell you this.
25:25 I hear a lot from fans, "Mark Davis doesn't care."
25:28 That's horse crap.
25:30 Absolute horse crap.
25:32 I've not always agreed with every decision he's made, but I have never questioned his
25:38 heart nor his commitment.
25:43 His desire to get it right is admirable, but I hope he doesn't overthink this.
25:53 Whether he goes with them or not, that's not what I'm talking about.
25:57 Don't overthink it.
25:59 It's still a game.
26:01 I hope that he doesn't so badly want to get the next shiny object or listen to people
26:10 who aren't Raiders.
26:13 He listened to his team when he made the change.
26:18 He needs to listen to his fans and his team when he makes a decision.
26:22 It's just my personal opinion.
26:23 All right, John, I got some NFL ... What do you want to add?
26:27 Go ahead.
26:28 I like the idea, "Don't overthink a no-brainer."
26:31 I also like the idea of, "Take the lesson and apply it forward."
26:34 We've seen the team do that with Antonio Pierce.
26:37 I think we're going to see that with Mark Davis, who maybe overthought it when deciding,
26:42 "Oh, I can have this with Josh McDaniels."
26:45 It just didn't work out.
26:47 I hear what you're saying, and I think we're going to see that in practice in the coming
26:51 months.
26:52 I hope so.
26:54 For the Raiders, I hope so.
26:55 All right, John, I got some NFL topics I want to talk to you, but then we're going to keep
26:58 it and come back and finish with the Raiders.
27:00 First of all, we're seeing a new trend in the NFL about internal suspensions.
27:07 Talk to the fans and the listeners about that.
27:09 This did make some news earlier this week when the Colts suspended a wide receiver and
27:15 a cornerback for three games.
27:18 Whenever this happens at this time, red flags are going to go up and say, "Is this a gambling
27:22 issue?"
27:23 It's just going to happen by default.
27:25 We don't know if it is yet, but this is a strange move from a sometimes strange operating
27:30 franchise in Indianapolis, taking two players, suspending them internally.
27:35 We probably will never know what happened there unless there's some NFLPA issue that
27:42 comes public or there's some leaking, but this is a strange thing.
27:45 I wonder if this will become a trend.
27:48 I don't know if it does the franchise any good when you have such a tight roster, but
27:53 this is something that caught our eye because we don't see this every day.
27:57 Let's see if this becomes a trend or if this is just a hearse moment, if you will.
28:03 We have no idea what it was about.
28:05 Jalen Hurst made some comments about complacency.
28:11 I think that's what they were about.
28:12 He said commitment.
28:13 Right.
28:14 I'm sorry.
28:15 Commitment, yes.
28:16 I'm sorry.
28:17 My fault.
28:18 Commitment.
28:19 To me, it resonated as he was talking about complacency.
28:23 I know you felt the same thing.
28:26 Before I have you answer this, I want to say something.
28:30 Familiar with Jalen from his time in Alabama, this is a very ethereal guy.
28:38 He's super smart.
28:40 Jalen Hurst is one of the smartest people you've ever been around.
28:43 His football IQ is through the roof.
28:46 When he starts talking about commitment, I'm thinking complacency set in.
28:51 You were thinking it.
28:52 Let's discuss that for a minute.
28:54 It's natural.
28:55 He comes from spending time with Nick Saban, who would tell you it's natural to trend towards
29:01 average.
29:02 It's natural to be complacent.
29:03 I think what Hurst is saying is some of the issues we're having in Philadelphia are because
29:08 of the natural implant in the players' brains that this is not the Super Bowl or the playoffs.
29:14 We've seen this over and over and over again.
29:17 Teams make it very far.
29:18 Sometimes they barely make the playoffs the next year, or they struggle to get it.
29:22 It's just natural to know in the back of your head that this is not the playoff knockout
29:27 game.
29:28 This is not the Super Bowl.
29:30 It's to the detriment.
29:31 It's your own human nature that you have to fight against.
29:35 I don't think he's suggesting that these guys aren't committed to practicing, learning the
29:40 playbook, staying in shape, eating right, etc., that you have to do during the season.
29:48 I think what he may be saying is we may just be a little naturally complacent.
29:52 It's a dangerous thing to play with.
29:56 We saw the Falcons make a great run, lose a Super Bowl for a combination of reasons
30:02 and a bad overtime rule, lost.
30:05 They're actually back, and they're running on that complacency train, and they get to
30:09 Philadelphia in a playoff game, and Julio Jones drops the ball, and that's pretty much
30:14 the end of their run.
30:16 That's a recent example, not to pick on Julio, but that's a recent example of a team that
30:20 ran maybe a little complacent.
30:23 We see this over and over.
30:25 We're going to see it again.
30:27 I don't know that we saw it too much with the Bengals, which is to their credit, but
30:33 that's a franchise right now that's getting hot, as healthy as they can be, but that's
30:39 one that looks like they've figured out, "Hey, we've got to fight against this."
30:43 The Eagles, I guess you would call them struggles because it feels like they should be a couple
30:47 games ahead.
30:49 I don't know that Pertz meant so much they were commitment-based as natural complacency.
30:57 That's what it looks like to me, and maybe to you, that they may be just a little bit
31:03 short of being sharp because in the back of their Eagle heads, they know this is not the
31:08 playoffs.
31:09 This is not when we need to be at our best and flip that switch.
31:12 It's a dangerous game to play.
31:14 I'm going to say I want to turn attention to some hot teams, but I want to talk about
31:20 the Dallas Cowboys for a minute.
31:23 They are a team that essentially, since Troy Aikman's been gone, you just can't buy into
31:33 them.
31:35 They always have that – I guess I can't say that because I don't want to get a ton
31:42 of blowback – but they always have that team that looks great on paper, all kinds
31:51 of talent, but not the best team.
31:55 They just seem to implode at the wrong – there's an old saying Drew Stanton said to me.
32:03 We were talking about a particular player in the league.
32:07 Who the player was doesn't matter, but he goes, "They're just good enough to get you
32:12 in the hunt, but not good enough to win it."
32:16 He was talking about – I want to be careful so nobody knows who I'm talking about – he
32:22 was talking about certain mentalities.
32:26 The Cowboys are that team.
32:27 Just when anyone starts to believe in them is when you realize you shouldn't be believing
32:32 in them.
32:33 What an utter disappointment.
32:35 To me, it was that way with McCarthy.
32:38 It's been that way with everybody they have.
32:40 The only common denominator – with Parcells, they were a little bit different.
32:48 Other than Jimmy Johnson, Jerry Jones has run that franchise.
32:51 To me, it's about Jerry.
32:52 What's the shiny new thing?
32:55 Let's look good.
32:57 To me – how does anyone find room to believe in the Cowboys?
33:04 I think the biggest room to believe in the Cowboys is that they are perpetually a little
33:10 more overrated and over-marketed.
33:13 Jones drives that.
33:15 I think that's probably why we get where we get.
33:18 I think the Steelers were essentially America's team 15 years ago when the Ravens and Steelers
33:23 was the best rivalry in pro sports, not even close.
33:27 The Steelers were really about as popular as the Cowboys.
33:31 I think that bothered Jerry Jones.
33:33 I think you saw the wheels start to turn to get us back where we need to be as "America's
33:39 team."
33:40 So, with that in the picture, you've always got an extra push for the Cowboys to be marketed.
33:48 They're probably a little overrated and over-hyped.
33:52 You probably need a coach that's going to push back against that really hard.
33:58 We got an insight a little bit into what Jason Garrett did in the season with, which was
34:02 basically a season-long hard knocks.
34:04 You saw some struggles there.
34:06 You saw some conflict in his own staff.
34:08 He couldn't figure out how to get rid of that, to get everybody going one direction.
34:14 Arguably, he wasn't a strong enough head coach.
34:17 Did he get as much out of that talent as he should have?
34:21 We look back and say, "Probably so."
34:24 You always have to consider with the Cowboys that they're probably a little overrated.
34:29 Sometimes they get guys after their prime.
34:31 Sometimes they get guys that just cash in the checks and kind of cruise.
34:36 To their credit, they find some guys.
34:38 Obviously, they've got a phenomenal talent on defense in Mike Parsons.
34:44 When they go lay an egg like that, and we talked about it on this show, because I saw
34:48 it coming.
34:49 I saw Buffalo's last stand.
34:50 They're going to throw.
34:52 The Cowboys, they didn't look like they got on the trip.
34:55 You want to talk about an example of complacency, that might have been it.
35:00 There's 53 guys on the roster.
35:03 You can't expect the quarterback or the leader to pull every single person along with them.
35:09 Some people didn't get on the plane there.
35:12 If this is something, to steal a line from Mike McDaniel, watching the hard knocks after
35:19 they blew it against Tennessee.
35:23 If the Cowboys can figure out how to use this to their advantage, if they can take the lessons
35:29 from the monstrous egg they laid in Buffalo and apply it, then you may be able to see
35:34 them turn course and get better from here.
35:38 I am interested in what the Cowboys do from the Buffalo loss.
35:41 Do they play better?
35:43 Do they get better from it?
35:45 Or is this a sign that this car, like we talked about earlier, is this car going to lose a
35:49 door?
35:50 It's going to throw a rod.
35:52 It's going to clunk to the end and get whacked out of the playoffs early as they have been.
35:58 To defend the Cowboys, and Tony Romo specifically, he got too much criticism for, "I didn't win
36:03 this playoff game," or whatever.
36:04 If you're going to count playoff games, you better give credit when somebody has earned
36:09 a bye.
36:10 In my book, that counts as a win.
36:12 If you're going to criticize playoff losses, if you've earned a bye, you better count that
36:16 as a win for any quarterback, to be fair.
36:21 The Cowboys are probably not going to get a bye.
36:24 Not what we just saw.
36:26 If they get knocked out in the first round, it's going to be interesting.
36:31 Because as you laid out, the backstop of everything is general manager, coach, owner, string puller,
36:36 Jerry Jones, there's not as much accountability or flexibility in that organization.
36:44 They pretty much go as Jerry Jones sets them up to go, for better, for worse.
36:53 - Let's talk about some hot teams in the NFL.
36:56 To me, the two hottest, San Francisco and Baltimore, on fire.
37:03 - I still can't believe San Francisco lost two in a row.
37:07 I cannot believe it.
37:09 That was a long time ago.
37:11 They're not losing two in a row again.
37:14 Right now- - People that I know in that organization,
37:18 said it wasn't an excuse, and nobody came out and made it, but they were battling sickness.
37:25 On the team, it was really, really bad.
37:28 Nobody came out and made an excuse of it.
37:30 They just took their losses and kept going.
37:33 I remember you and I talking about it at the time.
37:35 I'm like, "The rumors of their demise are highly overrated."
37:40 I think they're- But you know who I'm excited for?
37:44 Lamar Jackson.
37:45 So many people said, "Oh, he's not a real quarterback.
37:49 He can't throw the football."
37:50 But wow, get him some weapons, and he's shown everybody.
37:56 I've been so happy for him.
37:58 He's such a good guy.
38:00 Just a great guy.
38:01 Everybody that knows him loves him.
38:03 I'm happy for him.
38:05 But to me, those are the two hottest teams.
38:07 I know you kind of throw Buffalo in there, and the Natty.
38:11 Let's talk.
38:12 Yeah, well, the great thing about Lamar Jackson is it looks like he's a situational player.
38:18 He was asked to run the offense a certain way, ran it very successfully, and now they're
38:22 running another way, and he can do it.
38:25 It's a wild thing to think about.
38:28 Not many guys can do it.
38:29 Let's see where his career goes from here, because he could be absolutely cruising into
38:33 the Hall of Fame if he can keep this thing going.
38:36 They are hot.
38:37 They are Ravens.
38:38 They have a culture.
38:40 Vincennati caught something in that Jacksonville game.
38:44 They actually snatched it from Jacksonville.
38:46 There's no doubt.
38:47 They are making a real push to the playoffs.
38:50 It's interesting because it's such a veteran team.
38:52 It's not a team that was complacent.
38:54 It's a team that had bad luck before the season even started with that injury that Burrow
38:57 had, and he gets another one.
39:00 Now Jamar Chase looks like he may be banged up.
39:03 Maybe the Bengals are just too beat up to keep this thing going.
39:06 And Buffalo, I saw this coming.
39:10 I thought Buffalo was going to be a wild card team that makes it to the Super Bowl.
39:14 They're on their last legs.
39:15 I think they're too injured.
39:16 They've got other distractions, but they seem to know it's December, and they also look
39:22 like a team that can take the momentum that they just destroyed the Cowboys with and take
39:28 it into another gear.
39:29 So we're watching that, but I'm agreeing with you.
39:31 The two at the top are very clear.
39:33 There's no sign that either San Francisco or Baltimore is going to trip up anytime soon.
39:38 Think about this, if the Raiders go up and get a win at the Chiefs, it's very conceivable
39:46 they win those last two, and let's say that they were able to sneak into the playoffs.
39:52 Who really wants to face that team with that momentum getting better?
39:56 I'm not saying they're a Super Bowl team, because I don't think they are, but still,
40:00 you know, how many times have you and I heard Izzo talk about matchups, playoffs, Final
40:06 Fours, tournaments, are about matchups.
40:09 That Raider team, if they're able to go up there and beat the Chiefs at the Chiefs, they're
40:16 a dangerous out right there.
40:17 That'll be a fascinating one for me.
40:19 All right, John, let's get to our featured foursome picks this week, then we're going
40:23 to get back to Raiders.
40:25 Four best players of the week are very simple this week, and in one way, we have a knockout
40:29 game.
40:30 It's Cincinnati at Pittsburgh.
40:32 Somebody's getting knocked out.
40:33 The bottom line is somebody is getting knocked out.
40:36 The curveball in the situation, I think, is Chase.
40:39 You've got injury issues on the other side.
40:41 The Steelers are too big a mess.
40:42 The Bengals are going to go in there and do a little roar on them.
40:45 Bengals, I agree with you 100%.
40:48 Jacksonville at Tampa should not have been important.
40:51 It is.
40:52 We are seeing the maturation process of the Jaguars stumble a little bit.
40:56 It started with Cincinnati.
40:59 It just plain did.
41:00 They haven't looked great on the big national stages.
41:03 All of a sudden, this becomes a little more important with the standings for Jacksonville
41:07 than it is for Tampa.
41:09 It's time for the Jaguars to go in there and take it.
41:13 The battle of...
41:14 Yeah, I'm going to take Jaguars myself in a Florida-style battle.
41:21 Of course, Baltimore or San Francisco.
41:23 We just talked about them.
41:25 This of course is going to be couched as a potential Super Bowl preview.
41:30 I don't know that that will be the case, but I would like the odds of at least one of these
41:33 teams being in the Super Bowl.
41:37 Long way west for Baltimore into San Francisco.
41:41 I like what's going on with Chase Young and Nick Bosa.
41:44 I like it a lot.
41:45 San Francisco is going to eat.
41:48 I think San Francisco eats here pretty good.
41:52 If it was at Baltimore, I would take Baltimore.
41:55 I'm taking San Francisco.
41:56 It's going to be one to watch.
41:58 Then yes, we've got to see Dallas at Miami.
42:01 How does Dallas respond?
42:03 Well, they need to take a page from Miami.
42:06 Miami responds brilliantly.
42:09 From a come for the head trip and fall loss to Tennessee on Monday night to a plane waxing
42:16 shutout six days later, Dallas in trouble.
42:22 Miami is coming.
42:23 I like the Dolphins, not 30 to nothing, but I like them big and watch out for panic in
42:29 Big D.
42:30 Yeah, Dolphins.
42:31 It's there.
42:32 That's a unique place to play.
42:36 I'm riding with the Dolphins all day long.
42:39 All right, John, now back to the Raiders.
42:42 Time for your prediction.
42:43 Score.
42:44 Who wins?
42:45 What's the score?
42:46 I think I hear what you're saying, that the Raiders don't need to score a million, but
42:52 I think it needs to be in the 20s.
42:54 I think the ideal situation is 25 points or more.
42:58 I think that's there for them, but I don't think they get there.
43:01 I like the Chiefs 28 to 20 in not quite a woulda, coulda, shoulda, but a game that's
43:08 even a step closer than it was last time they played earlier this year.
43:12 I like the Chiefs 28-20 and a little bit of a frustrator for the Raiders.
43:17 And I'll make my prediction later in the week.
43:19 John, as always, it's great to have you here.
43:21 Remember, you are listening to our podcast.
43:25 Thank you for joining us.
43:26 I'm Hondo Carpenter from Sports Illustrated's Fan Nation, Las Vegas Raiders Insider Podcast,
43:30 part of the Fans First Sports Network.
43:33 Johnny's got a podcast on the Fans First as well called the Spartan Pride.
43:37 Appreciate all of you.
43:38 Remember, if you just want to listen to the audio, you can go listen to us on Spotify
43:42 or Apple or wherever you get your pods, as well as I do an additional podcast every day,
43:48 five to ten minutes, riding with Hondo and Dexter, just giving you some inside scoop
43:52 on the team.
43:53 Follow me on Twitter @HondoCarpenter, or on Instagram.
44:00 It is @HondoSR.
44:03 We'll see you all there.
44:04 Thanks for joining us today.
44:05 Bye-bye, everybody.
44:05 Bye bye, everybody.