During a House Armed Services committee hearing prior to the congressional recess, Rep. Jason Crow (D-CO) questioned Katherine Thompson, who is performing the duties of Assistant Secretary of Defense for International Security Affairs at the Office of the Secretary of Defense, about China’s involvement in the Russia-Ukraine War.
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00:02Gentleman is back, Chair, and I recognize the gentleman from Colorado, Mr. Crow.
00:06Thank you, Chairman, and thank you both of you for being in here today.
00:09I wanted to join my colleagues in expressing deep sympathies for the families of those
00:13service members who we lost in Lithuania, and General Cavoli, thank you for responding
00:19very rapidly and working with our allies to make sure that we had recovery operations
00:24going.
00:25I also want to join my colleagues in thanking you for your incredible service during your
00:29tenure.
00:30You met challenges throughout Europe that we haven't seen since World War II.
00:34You did so with extreme competence, diligence, and discipline, and that was seen by many
00:42folks on the Hill as well as our allies, and we are very grateful for your leadership.
00:46Turning to Ukraine, in the initial stages of the war, the Ukrainians were able to destroy
00:54a very large percentage of the conventional land forces of Russia.
00:58Is that accurate?
00:59Yes, sir.
01:00Over half, by most estimations.
01:03Right.
01:04Would have to think of it as a rolling figure because they were growing at the same time
01:09as they were losing.
01:10But yeah, those are about the kind of numbers.
01:13We're looking at about almost 4,000 tanks, Russian tanks destroyed by Ukraine.
01:18Okay.
01:19Since that time, Russia has, with surprising speed, been able to recapitalize and rebuild
01:24both its industrial base but also its conventional forces and replace a lot of that equipment and
01:29personnel.
01:30Is that accurate?
01:31Absolutely.
01:32How do you characterize China's involvement in that recapitalization, both the industrial
01:35component as well as the military component?
01:41We could talk a lot more about this in closed session, sir.
01:44And perhaps we'll have the opportunity to.
01:46But there has been contributions.
01:49Some of them have been indirect.
01:52By absorbing much of Russian-sanctioned oil exports and gas exports, they have been able
01:59to continue to provide funds that have enabled Russia to continue to build their military.
02:05Some have been more direct.
02:06Some have been through commercial ventures that may or may not be supported by the Chinese
02:11Communist Party.
02:13And beyond that, I think I'd be safest to talk to you about it in closed session.
02:17So, and we'll convene in closed session, but both directly and indirectly, economically
02:21and to some degree militarily, China has chosen sides here.
02:26Oh, certainly.
02:28You know, I think there's an important side note, Congressman.
02:32Sometimes I've been asked, well, they're only giving them moral support.
02:37And I typically respond, but that's the most pernicious type of support.
02:41But it's more than moral support, would you say?
02:43And it is.
02:44Yes.
02:45So they have determined that it's in their interest to support Russia in this conflict?
02:52It would appear so.
02:55Okay.
02:56Ms. Thompson, this administration has taken a hard line on China in a number of big ways,
03:04trying to reestablish and balance that relationship.
03:08Would you agree that China has chosen sides in the Russia-Ukraine conflict?
03:12Thank you for the question, Congressman.
03:15And yes, with the caveat, right, that you highlighted, which I think is actually really, really important in that it aligns with their interests.
03:22In so far as perpetuating this conflict or other conflicts aligns with their interests, I think that's where we will see the adversary alignment.
03:30And that's why it's so important from the context of this administration, right, to get the work streams correct so that the U.S. can focus on deterrence in the Indo-Pacific, avoiding conflict there, while our European allies really step up.
03:39So the Chinese have determined it's in their interest to support Russia, both directly and indirectly?
03:47I would echo General Cavoli's comments.
03:49It appears so.
03:50Okay.
03:51So given that, would you agree that it's in our interest to support Ukraine, if China has determined it's in their interest to support Russia?
03:59I would perhaps take it a step further, Congressman, depending on how you look at it, which is I think that's the impetus for trying to get to peace in Ukraine so that we don't continue to burgeon that relationship or continue to allow the interests to overlap, particularly given the situation.
04:16And I know I don't speak for Indo-Pacific, but particularly given what we're facing.
04:18You're not willing to say, though, it's in our interest to ensure Ukraine is successful in this conflict?
04:23From our vantage point within the administration, I think that's why the prioritization imperative is placed on peace.
04:29But the lack of ability to say that it's America's interest for Ukraine to prevail in this continues to be staggering to me because our adversaries, our competitors, have been very clear about the sides that they have chosen here and who they think is in their best interest to prevail militarily.
04:46And yet we are unwilling to do that. And there's a lot of talk about peace through strength.
04:51But if you're not willing to actually say the thing, if you're not willing to actually call it out and take sides, I don't see how we can be strong in that regard.
04:58So I will continue to urge, along with my colleagues on both sides of the aisle, that the administration is very clear in its rhetoric about who we will support here.
05:07I yield back.