One of the prominent figures behind hatching the 2008 Mumbai terror attack conspiracy, Tahawwur Rana, was arrested on Thursday by the National Investigation Agency (NIA) following his extradition from the US.
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00:00Pakistani Canadian terrorist and a 2611 Mumbai terror attacks key plotter
00:12Tahour Hussain Rana is currently undergoing a medical test at the Palam technical area
00:18and is to leave the Palam airport anytime now.
00:22That's the information that we are getting and we have a live feed right outside the main entry gate
00:29of the Palam technical area.
00:30So in about 5 to 10 minutes from now we are told that medical examination will be completed
00:38and then he will be taken out of this gate and perhaps he will be taken to the special NIA court in Delhi.
00:45Tahour Hussain Rana, one of the key masterminds and plotter of the 2611-2008 Mumbai terror attacks
00:53in which 166 people were massacred when 10 Pakistani terrorists attacked India.
01:00And the evil that these two men, these two terrorists, one Tahour Hussain Rana, the other
01:07David Coleman-Hidley, Pakistani born, one with a Canadian passport, the other with an American passport.
01:14They waltzed in and out of India.
01:16They had multiple entry business visas.
01:19They carried out reconnaissance in multiple cities from sensitive military installations
01:25like the National Defence College in Delhi to the Naval Shipyard and the Southern Command in Kochi
01:31to places of Hindu worship like the Kumbh Mela in Haridwar, like the Pushkar Mela in Rajasthan near Ajmer.
01:39They carried out several reconnaissance missions.
01:41Their aim was to bleed India through a thousand cuts, instructions from Hafiz Mohammed Saeed and Pakistan's ISI.
01:50Some of this information gathered painstakingly by the National Investigation Agency and the others
01:55by America's Federal Bureau of Investigation for a trial that happened in the Chicago Federal Court.
02:01I'll get you all those details.
02:03I'm Gaurav Sawan.
02:04As always, let's get started with the headlines at 8.
02:1126-11 Mumbai terror attacks, key plotter dragged back to India.
02:18Tahavar Hussain Rana lands at Palam Airport in Delhi.
02:22Rana will be placed under official arrest by the National Investigation Agency
02:27and then produced before the special NIA court in Patiala House.
02:33NIA to confront Tahavar Hussain Rana with 26-11 evidence.
02:42He will be questioned on the role of Pakistan's state actors including ISI officers and quasi-state actors like Hafiz Mohammed Saeed.
02:52Exclusive details on India today.
02:59Politics escalates over terror and Tahavar Hussain Rana.
03:04Sharad Pawar's NCP seeks a fair trial for the 26-11 conspirator.
03:08Congress ally says probe must be within the Indian law.
03:11Union Minister Piyush Goyal makes it very clear.
03:14Narendra Modi government does not feed biryani to terrorists.
03:2526-11 Mumbai terror attack survivors seek death penalty for Tahavar Hussain Rana demand he face a swift trial.
03:34US versus China trade war intensifies.
03:41Beijing says Trump's fight will end in failure from iPhones to steel.
03:46The world braces for impact.
03:49Key details about the enemy within and the enemy across the border likely to come out from the interrogation of one of the key plotters of the 26-11 Mumbai terror attacks, Tahavar Hussain Rana.
04:15After a 17-year long wait, he's finally in India.
04:21He was in India last in 2008.
04:25Just five days, just five days, less than one week before the Mumbai terror attacks, he wrecked all the areas.
04:32From the 11th of November 2008 to the 20th of November 2008, he travelled across Mumbai.
04:39He travelled to some other cities and over the course of the next one hour, we'll get to all those details.
04:43NIA has gathered all those details, so he travelled across Mumbai.
04:47He arranged logistics for the 10 Pakistani terrorists.
04:51He had arranged funds through some local elements and who are these local elements, we will probe that story very closely.
04:58Because it wasn't just in Mumbai, it was also in Ahmedabad, it was also in Kochi, it was also in Pushkar Rajasthan and Haridwar, Uttar Pradesh.
05:06It was also in Aapur and Agra in Uttar Pradesh that this Pakistani-born Canadian terrorist had travelled some places with his wife,
05:14carrying out wrecky missions, recruiting local sleeper cells, arranging funds for future Pakistan terror attacks on the instructions of Hafiz Mohammed Said.
05:24The band, Lashkar-e-Taiba Chief.
05:28Remember, it's a UN designated terrorist organisation and Hafiz Said himself is a UN and US designated terrorist.
05:35Nalini Sharma, our legal editor, joins us from the NIA court.
05:39Amit Bharadwaj joins us live from the Palam Technical Area.
05:42Shivani Sharma joins us from the NIA headquarters.
05:45We have the finest team of reporters on ground to get you a 360-degree perspective on this big, big story.
05:52But before I get you our team of reporters on ground, I want to get you what the NIA has just said in a statement.
05:59The NIA has issued a statement saying, and I quote,
06:04NIA secures successful extradition of 26-11 Mumbai terror attacks mastermind.
06:12An aircraft carrying 26-11 Mumbai terror attack plotter, Tahavur Hussain Rana, landed in Palam at the airbase at the technical area at 6.20pm.
06:22The anti-terror agency NIA confirmed it had secured the successful extradition of Tahavur Hussain Rana.
06:28He will be lodged in Tihar jail under high security.
06:32He is likely to be produced in the NIA special court in Delhi in a short while from now.
06:37A team from NIA has already reached Patiala house.
06:41So the legal team is already there. Officials are already there.
06:45After years of sustained and concerted efforts to bring this key conspirator responsible for the 26-11 Mumbai terror attacks and mayhem to justice,
06:55Tahavur Hussain Rana has finally been brought to India after his last ditch attempt to evade extradition failed as the US Supreme Court rejected his application.
07:08Tahavur Hussain Rana's interrogation is expected to shed light on terror sleeper cells in India.
07:15And this is one aspect we will focus on very extensively over the next several days and weeks.
07:20Interrogators are expected to learn more about this bogey of Hindu terror that was systematically plotted and spread through the 10 Pakistani terrorists who attacked Mumbai on 26-11 in 2008.
07:34Probe revealed how David Coleman Headley, that Pakistan-born American terrorist brought, he bought Kalawa.
07:41Kalawa is that sacred thread from the Siddhi Vinayak temple in Mumbai.
07:45Probe also revealed, and this is not source-based information, that's coming out either from the NIA chart sheet or from Federal Bureau of Investigation.
07:53FBI probe report submitted in that Chicago federal court.
07:56So that probe revealed how Pakistan tried to pass 26-11 attack as Hindu terror.
08:02David Headley revealed Hindu terror camouflage during his interrogation.
08:07The probe also revealed how Ajmal Kassab and others were given fake Hindu names.
08:12Former NIA IG Loknath Behra revealed Rana's terror plan in detail when I spoke to him earlier today.
08:19The probe officer in 26-11 also revealed how Rana wrecked the Pushkar Mela in Rajasthan, planned an attack there.
08:27At the Kumbh Mela in Haridwar, at the Kochi naval dockyard and base.
08:33Behra also said that Rana actually recruited people in Kochi.
08:37He wanted to carry out reconnaissance at the Southern Naval Command.
08:41So this is how these Pakistani terrorists were spreading the tentacles far and wide in India.
08:47How crucial is Tahavur Hussain Rana being brought to India for interrogation in your appreciation, sir?
08:57What are we likely to find out?
08:59See, actually, he is a very, very key player.
09:03Because, if you remember, in 2011, we actually, in the National Investigation Special Court, we charged him in Delhi.
09:13For the larger conspiracy behind Mumbai attack.
09:17Yes.
09:18See, he is coming, we'll be actually filling some of the missing links and the blanks in this particular place.
09:27I personally feel that maybe some other names may crop up.
09:31Very interesting.
09:32During...
09:33Names like, names of people like, names in India or names in Pakistan?
09:37Both.
09:38I mean, because, if you see, Rana used to travel quite a bit.
09:43He even came to Kochin.
09:45Yes.
09:46So, you don't know, actually, by that time, we had never gotten access to Rana to interrogate, unlike Headly.
09:54So, many of the things will be brought out by our very competent agencies like NIA and others, and even Mumbai Police.
10:03So, I will not be surprised that some new names also come up.
10:07His local contacts in India, the fact that he visited Kochin, as you very rightly pointed out.
10:12Headly visited even National Defence College in Delhi.
10:15They wanted to target multiple locations.
10:18Is it true, in your interrogations did it come out, that these people, they told Pakistan's ISI and Hafiz Saeed that instead of killing one brigade commander at the LOC,
10:28we will kill many brigadiers at NDC when we bomb their bus.
10:33Is that true, sir?
10:34No, no, no.
10:35See, this actually, what you used may not be correct, but the NDC was one of their targets.
10:42If you read actually Headly's interrogation report, which is in public domain, it's all there.
10:47It says about that, actually, they, I mean, wrecked this particular place.
10:52You know, the best thing is that, I will put it just like Tom and Jerry kind of situation.
10:59And this is Taha Urrana and Headly, they will be actually sometimes friends, sometimes as if they are unknown to each other.
11:09These are all actually dramas, but they actually planned and the plan was really, really, very interesting.
11:18If you actually reveal these things, some of the plans we unraveled, but some of the plans, I think that this man is key to actually reveal those things,
11:28which will be a great boost for the Indian agency.
11:31You had investigated this case very extensively, including Tahawar Hussain Rana's visit to Cochin.
11:37What was his interest in Cochin?
11:39What did he want to bomb there?
11:42See, Cochin is a very strategic place.
11:45We were little worried about, actually, see it as Southern Naval Command, the Seepyard, all strategic installations are here.
11:51So, we were worried and he actually did interview in a hotel, which is very near to the waterfront.
11:57So, that time, so, we were, but we never knew, because we never knew, actually, we did not get chance to speak to him.
12:07Now, there is a chance that, probably this part, Headly also did not say us.
12:12So, whether he had wrecked any place in Cochin.
12:16So, that can be actually extracted from him.
12:18Sir, I was reporting in Chicago and we knew of places like NDC National Defense College in Delhi.
12:26We knew about Siddhi Vinayak Temple in Mumbai.
12:29The Cochin, you know, naval base, some information had filtered out.
12:34What else, what were the other locations that they were wrecking for further attacks?
12:39Because I believe Hafiz Sai that told them that you have to repeatedly keep, you have to repeatedly attack India.
12:45And even after 26-11, their wrecking continued, sir, till the time he was arrested in America.
12:51At the Ohay report, if I remember correctly.
12:53See, if I correctly remember, they were actually, they were talking about Kumbh Mela.
12:58Kumbh Mela, something like that.
13:00Yeah, sir, that time, I remember that particular thing.
13:03He was taking that these people who are actually coming to Haradwar and all.
13:08And also, they went to Puskar.
13:11Puskar is one of the targets.
13:13Other things, I am not able to remember.
13:18I'll get you more on the story.
13:19And this is just skimming through the surface.
13:22We've been through some of the detailed documents file.
13:24Nalini Sharma, my colleague joins me.
13:26Amit Bharadwaj is with me.
13:28Shivani Sharma is with me.
13:29And these are the finest reporters on ground who will get you inside details.
13:34And Nalini, I just believe you've spoken to your sources in the Department of Justice.
13:38What are cases that they deemed it fit to pursue till the end and ensure that that extradition took place, Nalini?
13:47Well, Gaurav, we can confirm to our viewers that India today is getting them the first reaction from the U.S. Department of Justice regarding the extradition of terrorist Tahavur Rana from the United States back to India.
14:03And we have a reaction from the spokesperson of the Department of Justice of the United States, Nicole Oxman.
14:09And what he tells India today is that I can confirm the United States yesterday extradited convicted terrorist Tahavur Rana, a Canadian citizen and native of Pakistan to stand trial in India on 10 criminal charges stemming from his alleged role in the 2008 terrorist attacks in Mumbai.
14:24And this part is important, Gaurav, because what they go on to say is Rana's extradition is a critical step towards seeking justice for the six Americans and scores of other victims who were killed in the heinous attacks on 26-11.
14:38So the U.S. Department of Justice hailing Tahavur Rana's extradition back to India.
14:43They are hoping for justice not only for the six Americans who were killed in these heinous attacks but also for the several Indians who were killed due to the activities of Tahavur Rana, David Headley, the Lashkar-e-Taiba and how many other terrorists who were involved in this entire plot.
14:58So that's the first and exclusive reaction from the U.S. Department of Justice that we are getting you.
15:03Just a few minutes before we can expect Tahavur Rana to be taken out of the Palam airport and be brought eventually to the Patiala House court, the special NIA court here.
15:12Well, his custody hearing will go on.
15:14It remains to be seen at what time he's produced before the court and also what kind of a defense is put up at the stage of the custody, whether any at all.
15:22All of that will come to light only once Tahavur Rana reaches the court.
15:26The prosecution team and the defense team of lawyers both are inside the court where on one hand the prosecution team is being led by senior advocate Dayan Krishnan who is also a crucial, who played a key role in bringing Tahavur Rana back to India and has been working on the case for several months and knows the ins and outs of the entire case.
15:44On the other hand, for the defense team, we have advocate Piyush Sachdeva who will be representing Tahavur Rana, taking care of his best interests before the court of law, although only for the hearing, the custody hearing that's scheduled for it.
15:5510 charges, 10 charges and I'll just come back to you for those 10 charges.
15:59I also have the finest analysts in India joining me on the broadcast.
16:02Sushant Sareen, Vikram Singh and Tara Kartha join us in our continuing coverage and they will stay with me as we analyze this thread bear.
16:12Remember, it's very, very crucial. Those missing links need to be found. But before I come to you, just give me a moment as I want to bring in Amit Bharadwaj.
16:19Amit, is there some activity at the airport? How long before they start moving out of the airport? Any information?
16:26Well, Gaurav, it will be a work of several agencies and authorities in order to ensure that he is not only safely and seamlessly transported to the NIA facility, but also everything is put onto record.
16:46Before I jump into that, just to understand for our viewers understanding, you know, this successful extradition of Tahavur Hussain Rana to India has been possible with the work of joint work of Department of Justice of U.S.
17:01And with that, NIA, as well as the NSG commandos and in India, the Ministry of External Affairs, as well as the MHA.
17:09So just imagine the kind of work that has been put together to ensure that he is successfully extradited to India.
17:15And now we get you the visuals from the Palam facility.
17:19You know, right there, what we are given to understand through our sources is that the documentation process was over.
17:26After that, the medical test of Tahavur Hussain Rana was being conducted at the Palam facility.
17:32And the NIA team in most likelihood has already put him under arrest.
17:36Now, what does that mean?
17:37It also means that the paperwork that's being done by the Indian agencies at this point in time is solid.
17:44Because the moment he is landing on the Indian soil, we are also recording his health status.
17:50You know, what are the parameters of his health?
17:53Because there is a possibility that someone like him who has conducted this monstrous act of killing, carrying out massacre in India, plotting that massacre in India.
18:05You know, he could actually also take refuge on medical grounds.
18:09And that is why we are preparing, our agencies are preparing those solid documentation the moment he has landed in India.
18:16And from there, you will see the phase two of the entire mission beginning.
18:20The moment these doors will open again, or maybe from some other door, you will see him being transported to the NIA facility in an armored vehicle,
18:28along with the SWAT commandos, CAPF personnel, guarding him for a seamless and secure transportation.
18:33Stay with me, Ahmed.
18:34Shivani, before I bring in Sushant, Sareen, Vikram Singh and Tara Karthar.
18:37Shivani, quickly give us an update as far as the NIA is concerned.
18:41The NIA chief is handling this personally, also because he has a personal connect.
18:46As a personal connect, Sadan and Date had braved terrorist bullets during the Mumbai 2611 terror attacks.
18:52He knows the ins and outs, but he would still want to know the gaps in the investigation and especially the sleeper cells in India, perhaps.
19:00Gaurav, it's very significant that the DG was an officer that time when the 2611 happened in Mumbai.
19:11And here at the NIA headquarters, there is all preparation up.
19:15The sanitization process is going on because there are possibilities that after the Patiala house court,
19:20he might be brought here at the NIA headquarters if the custody is granted to the NIA or he can also go to the Tihar jail.
19:27So, all the possibilities are on. So, accordingly, all these agencies are working and they are ready for any action that takes place after Tahburana reaches the court.
19:36And the route chart has also been chalked out from the airport till the Patiala house court.
19:42All the lights will be turned green when he moves there for a 16-kilometer distance between the court and the airport.
19:48And here at the NIA, the sanitization process has been done.
19:53The deployments are at place. The barricades are at place. So, the NIA headquarters are all set.
20:00And the NIA chief is monitoring each and every development around this extradition and the investigation after the procedures that's going to start.
20:08I'll come back to you. As soon as there's breaking news on this big story, when I had interviewed and met Sadanand Date,
20:14he was additional commissioner of Mumbai police crime branch. And all these officers late in the evening, they just dived into that crisis headlong.
20:22Initially, nobody knew that these were Pakistani terrorists. They thought there was gang war that was happening on the streets of Mumbai when the first information about shooting happened.
20:29So, in their riot gear in some instances, and in Sadanand Date's case, you know, just with his service revolver, he and his team, they went to Kama hospital.
20:38That's when the terrorists were hiding when they fled Chhatrapati Shivaji Terminus.
20:42And they had taken some, the apprehension was that they'll take some patients hostage. So, these young, these officers, additional CP that time, crime branch, they went inside the hospital to save nurses and doctors and patients and their relatives and then engage with the terrorists.
21:00And they brought down very effective fire on the terrorists. Unfortunately, some of the brave Mumbai police personnel even lost their lives in that encounter.
21:07But I want to now, as I bring in our guests on this special show, I want to quote what David Coleman Headley said, what he told his interrogators,
21:17and what Rakesh Maria, who interrogated Kassab and then investigated this entire case as crime branch chief and later Mumbai police commissioner,
21:26what he wrote about this because I want to focus on the aspect of the bogie of Hindu terror that these Pakistani terrorists were trying to spread through their masters.
21:36What did Headley say? He said, and I quote, I purchased the red and yellow wrist band, which means Kalawa, that sacred thread.
21:43I forget its name. I thought that the 10 youth could wear it as a cover and that people would think they are Indians. Unquote.
21:50Ajmal Amir Kassab was given a Hindu identity card so that he would appear as a Hindu.
21:55Now, Rakesh Maria, former Mumbai police commissioner said, Pakistani terrorist Muhammad Ajmal Amir Kassab, had he not been caught alive, 2611 Mumbai terror attacks would have been dubbed the handiwork of Hindu terrorists.
22:10Kassab was among the group of 10 that carried out the terror attack on Mumbai in November 2008 and the lone Lashkar-e-Taiba terrorists captured alive.
22:19They were given Hindu names and red-coloured strings to tie on their wrist.
22:23In his memoir, in that book that he wrote, let me say it now, Rakesh Maria, who was then the Mumbai police crime branch chief, he investigated 2611 and I had the privilege of interviewing him and meeting him several times after 2611 including on its anniversaries for several years and late Himanshu Roy.
22:40Now, Rakesh Maria in that book writes, Lashkar-e-Taiba wanted him to be killed, that is Kassab, to be killed as a Bengaluru resident, Samir Dinesh Chaudhary.
22:51With that red thread around his wrist to portray that as Hindu terror.
22:56But their plan apparently did not succeed because the fact was, Kassab hailed from Fareed court in Pakistan.
23:03Now, I want to quote him.
23:05If all had gone well, Kassab would have been dead with that red string tied around his wrist like a Hindu.
23:11We would have found an identity card on his person with the fictitious name, Samir Dinesh Chaudhary, student of Arunodai degree and PG College.
23:20Dilsuk Nagar, Hyderabad 50060, resident of 254 Teachers Colony, Bengaluru.
23:27Maria writes, there would have been screaming headlines in newspapers claiming how Hindu terrorists have attacked Mumbai.
23:34Over the top TV journalists would have made a beeline for Bengaluru to interview his family and neighbours, he wrote in his book.
23:41And I want to quickly bring in Dr. Vikram Singh into this conversation.
23:44Dr. Vikram Singh, it is thanks to that supreme sacrifice of Assistant Sub-Inspector Tukaram Ombale that Kassab was caught alive.
23:52He took a hail of AK-47 bullets to his chest but caught him alive.
23:57Or we would have been saddled with 2611 being labelled as Hindu terror and Pakistani getting away with murder and terror.
24:07Gaurav Ji, I must compliment you for taking up this very sensitive and unpalatable issue as nobody else has.
24:13So my salutations to you. Nobody else has raised this topic.
24:17Now to the fact that yes, I salute the brave heart who took the entire burst of the magazine on his chest, literally and metaphorically biting the bullet.
24:28But for him, things would have been very, very different than what we are seeing them today.
24:32Yes, there was an insidious attempt to buy the wristbands from Sidney Vanak Temple and to guise the identity and to give it a different colour altogether.
24:41But for this fortuitous intervention, things would have been very different.
24:45And I also compliment Rakesh Maria for coming out with his book.
24:48And indeed, it is a very interesting read.
24:50But the fact of the matter is, why?
24:53We have the likes who say, Osama Ji, Afiz Ji, they go head over heels to praise the world's most wanted and the most hated terrorist.
25:03And then thereafter, you may recall that after the incident was over, they commissioned a book to be released by no other than a very important leader of a national party.
25:12And then it was released, giving the impression that the entire thing was saffron terror.
25:18Now, coming back to the whole thing, David Coleman Headley and also the man who was handling him and facilitating his visit, did we not see the presence of a very major film director and actor and his son taking him around like his local guide, making him a member of a local gym, taking him from all around the sensitive area, the Chadab House, the Trident, the Taj Hotel, and also the Ivorai Hotel.
25:45What business did he have? And then the manner in the audacious manner in which Tahavur Rana opened his first world immigration center in Tadadev that also somebody was greasing the farms and somebody was facilitating these anti-national elements to open shop here.
26:04And the manner in the manner in which they got out. And the manner in which they got out about it and made a recce and were in contact with the Huji, Harkatul Ansar and Lashkar-e-Tayyabha.
26:13And the shameless manner in which their cohorts were praised after the incident and tried to change the entire...
26:20Okay, give me a moment as we put out that first picture, that first picture on India today of that Pakistani terrorist Tahavur Hussain Rana in the custody of the National Investigation Agency in that picture you see.
26:35Of course, just give us a moment as we rotate it. This picture has just come in. It has just come in to India today and we wanted you to see it first.
26:42We want our viewers to be first to see news as it happens.
26:47This Pakistani terrorist Tahavur Hussain Rana with a Canadian passport. He used that. He used that Canadian passport to breeze in and out of India.
27:00To open a company in India, a branch of a company. He opened the office in Chicago and I visited that office in Chicago. I have reported from that office.
27:09This is that first picture that you see of Tahavur Hussain Rana. And in just a moment, we'll see his face. Perhaps these are NIA officers who are holding him physically now as they take him for a medical examination and then subsequently to take him to court.
27:27And Sushant Sarin, there are many, many gaps that will be filled. The point that Dr. Vikram Singh was raising about that bogey of Hindu terror, Rana and Hedley knew India well.
27:41And they knew how India could be gamed. Use Pakistani terrorists and blame it on India and blame it as Hindu terror. Sushant Sarin.
27:50You know, Gaurav, I think we need to start asking the question, were they gamed or were they told that this is how this will play out?
27:58That there will be a certain lobby in India that will use these particular symbols and try and change the narrative.
28:07And subsequently also, as Dr. Singh very correctly puts it, even much later, there were people who were trying to spread this kanad
28:15and trying to construct all kinds of conspiracy theories. And, you know, it was so mindless, but they continued to insist on it.
28:25Their hatred and their dislike for a particular ideology or for a particular party was far more than whatever love they had for their country, if at all they had any love.
28:36So it is very clear where these guys were coming from.
28:39And, Gaurav, what is even worse is that 26-11 wasn't the first time this happened.
28:44This has happened in the past as well, from the 1993 bomb blasts in Mumbai, in which hundreds of people were killed.
28:52You go out…
28:52257, sir.
28:55Again, you know, you try and deflect the Samjhauta Express.
28:58You try and deflect a particular investigation.
29:01You try and sow doubts.
29:02You change the complete direction of an investigation and try and absolve the guys who actually did what they did.
29:09Even though the UN had actually identified the mastermind of the Samjhauta Express incident, there were people in India, including in the government.
29:22Now, when a government of the day for settling political scores starts derailing investigations and taking them to another side,
29:30simply because of political reasons, then I think serious questions need to be asked who they were batting for, what they were trying to play at.
29:39And I think this is something, it's deeply unfortunate that this kind of a thing would happen because terrorism is terrorism, right?
29:45Everybody keeps saying, if it is terrorism, then how come you try and create that in 1993,
29:52there was an additional bomb blast which took place in a Muslim area to try and show that this was a secular act of terrorism.
29:59We have journalists who insist that Dawud Ibrahim is a very secular guy.
30:04Tiger Memon was a very secular guy until he turned a fanatic, right?
30:09We have people making those cases.
30:11So, you know, if you have a country like this, you have a fifth column in a country like this,
30:17it becomes so much easier for terrorists to carry out their dastardly plans.
30:22And then, of course, you make a show and dance about that.
30:25Yes, we will take action.
30:27But what action did you take that when you were advised that this is Pakistan?
30:31The initial reaction from the government of India at that point of time was we suspect non-state actors.
30:37Why did you suspect non-state actors?
30:39Could a non-state actor carry out as monumental an attack as this without the complicity and the connivance of the state in Pakistan?
30:47It is inconceivable for something like that to happen.
30:50That was one.
30:51So, you did.
30:52You tried to, you know, absolve the Pakistani state.
30:55You did that.
30:56Then, what did you do?
30:57You were told that let's go and attack Pakistan and teach them a lesson.
31:01What did you do?
31:02You asked a visiting delegation of Americans for permission.
31:06Can I do this?
31:06Do you ask another country for permission to take your revenge?
31:11Do you do this?
31:12Does any government do something like this?
31:14So, you know, we've had this kind of a namby-bamby culture in this country, which is why everybody thinks that this is a country.
31:21You can just kick it and, you know, get away with it.
31:24Look at the bloody Pakistanis today.
31:26They're so shameless, these wretches.
31:28Oh, but we have nothing to do with this guy.
31:30He's a Canadian citizen.
31:32Array, Baba, your guys were involved in the plot.
31:35Your guys were in communication with this guy.
31:37Your guys were telling him what to do and what not to do.
31:40He was hatching and arranging the logistics because of your guys telling him this.
31:47And you were very simply and very blithely, you say, we have nothing to do with this.
31:51They're so shameless, these wretches.
31:52And you will have people in India say, but, you know, we cannot be always on the tenterhooks with the Pakistanis.
31:59We have to make up with them.
32:01So, let us start with playing cricket with them.
32:03Let their actors come out here.
32:05We will go down.
32:07So, you know, if the moment you do something like this, the other guy thinks you're a pushover.
32:12You know what the Pakistanis say about it here?
32:14And they thought we're pushovers.
32:15They thought we're pushovers.
32:16That we'll only talk about our paaar ki ladai till the time a bala court happened and a surgical strike happened.
32:21Then they knew that their baap is here and this is not going to happen.
32:26You know, and I want to talk about that in greater detail, but I want to tear out these two images on your television screen.
32:31So, that is Tahawwar Hussain Rana earlier.
32:36And this is the latest image of that Pakistani Canadian terrorist Tahawwar Hussain Rana.
32:42He studied at the Hassan Abdal Military Academy in Pakistan.
32:47He's 64 years old now.
32:49Now, 17 years earlier, that man was not only wrecking multiple locations in our country, but he was also celebrating.
33:00Now, according to the Federal Bureau of Investigation, the information they were able to gather,
33:05when he saw 2611 Mumbai terror attacks images on his television screen,
33:09as he watched the terror plan unfold, he celebrated.
33:14And he wanted every Pakistani terrorist who was killed in India and Kassab to be awarded Pakistan's highest national military award.
33:25So, for him, it was victory.
33:27For him, it was Ghazwai Hind against Kafirs.
33:31And now, that so-called warrior of that Ghazwai Hind is in shackles as he's brought to India.
33:37And hopefully, that entire military jihad complex will be brought to its knees, Tara Kartha.
33:43That is the need of the hour to punish Pakistan state-sponsored radical Islamist terror
33:48through evidence put out in public domain for the world to see, madam.
33:54Absolutely, yes.
33:55I would, I mean, I think a lot, like I said earlier, a lot of these details,
33:59which a lot of them we already know, but this is all going to come out now.
34:03It's going to come out in headlines.
34:05It's going to be shared with partners in the US.
34:08It's going to be shared with Israel.
34:09Don't forget, Israelis also died in this attack.
34:12So, this is now an international investigation.
34:15And the Pakistanis have a choice of either cooperating, which of course is wildly quite impossible,
34:22but or taking, understanding that, you know, they're going to get cornered on this, that this is not on.
34:27But there's one thing I'd like to say in response to what you were talking about.
34:31You remember, there was the Ajmer Sharif blast and the Hazrat Nizamuddin blast.
34:36There were a trail of blasts before this to show that there is this Hindu terror taking place, right?
34:42That was very worrying.
34:45But on the other hand, I also want to emphasize that within the government at the time,
34:50when I was also there at the time, there was a very, very clear understanding that this was Pakistan.
34:55The Joint Intelligence Committee in which I was there, we put that report out that,
35:00look, there's going to be an attack on a hotel, five-star hotel in Bombay.
35:04This warning was given.
35:06And this was based on, like I said, limited intelligence.
35:10And the problem throughout, always, is that intelligence is not shared when it should be shared.
35:17There's a lot of questions that has to be asked there also,
35:20both outside and within the country in the light of what you just said.
35:24You know, what were those blasts which took place?
35:27How did they happen?
35:28Where did this Hindu terror thing come from?
35:31So those are very...
35:32There's so much more I can...
35:33I would like to share on this broadcast right now and learn from you on this broadcast on Hindu terror
35:39because you have three of the finest voices.
35:42Sushant Sareen, Dr. Vikram Singh and Dr. Tara Kartha joining us on this broadcast.
35:47You know how Ishra Jahan suddenly became Bihar Ki Beti.
35:51The politics with terror in our country.
35:53How that charge sheet was changed.
35:56How the Samjhauta Express charge sheet was changed.
35:59How the Malegaon blast.
36:01And I had Mr. P.K. Jain with me on the broadcast.
36:03Dr. Vikram Singh.
36:04Mr. P.K. Jain, as additional DGP of Mumbai.
36:09He was just a short while back telling me on the broadcast.
36:11And we'll play out his reaction.
36:13He was telling us how they had investigated.
36:16They had arrested Pakistani terrorists.
36:17They had arrested Pakistani elements in response.
36:20In response, Arif Kasmani incidentally in Samjhauta had already been named.
36:24In the UN, he had been named.
36:26And that was changed to Hindu terror.
36:28Malegaon, the real terrorists were permitted to go scot-free.
36:32Wrong chaps were taken into custody, according to Mr. Jain.
36:35This just goes on to show that we were playing with fire that burnt us, leading to 166 deaths in Mumbai.
36:42You're very right.
36:45Now is the time.
36:46The time has come now for the NIA to investigate these flip-flops and these somersaults.
36:52Because these somersaults are not innocent somersaults.
36:55These somersaults are insidious and anti-national.
36:57I repeat, insidious, venomous and anti-national.
37:01And every dramatist persona who has participated in this insidious design needs to be shamed and extolled and charge-sheeted.
37:08What were the compulsions of saying Ishrat Jaha is at Bihar Ki Beti?
37:12For what?
37:13And for what reason?
37:14For vote bank politics?
37:16For appeasement?
37:17Well, that's a different story.
37:19But the fact of the matter, what Mr. P.K. Jain said, I feel that for every Mr. P.K. Jain,
37:24there are 10 more indignant police officers and investigators who feel that a national wrong has been committed.
37:30And the time has come.
37:31Now the NIA need to expose every such move of every person.
37:35And what are the compulsions of saying Afiz Ji, Osama Ji, and whitewashing the black deeds of terrorists and anti-national elements?
37:45The time has come now.
37:46But I wish there were more Gaurav Sawansji's who would raise this topic at least and say that a national shame and a wrong has been committed.
37:54Well, indeed, I do hope that this is taken forward.
37:57The MHA and the IB are listening to your program.
38:00And they take a step forward.
38:01And this is made a part of the investigation plan also.
38:04Sir, I know of an under-secretary in the Ministry of Home Affairs who was burnt with cigarette butts.
38:11I have spoken to him.
38:12I had spoken to him.
38:13And Sushant Saree knows that he was burnt with cigarette butts to change his charge sheet or his inputs on Ishrat Jahan.
38:24But that's a debate for a separate day.
38:25We know of how Samjhotha and, you know, like today, like we are anchoring a long bulletin today.
38:32We were anchoring when Samjhotha was suddenly from Arif Kasmani, Sushant Sareen, from Arif Kasmani being responsible for Lashkar-e-Taiba being responsible.
38:42Suddenly, it was mentioned that it was so-called Hindu terror.
38:46It just blew up in India's face.
38:49Whatever was the plan.
38:51And perhaps there was an attempt to term 26-11 as the same Hindu terror.
38:56It just goes on to show that a lot more needs to be investigated, Sushant Sareen.
39:00Yeah, absolutely.
39:03And I know you're talking about Mr. Mani.
39:05But, you know, along with him, there was another very distinguished IB officer, Mr. Rajinder Kumar, if I'm getting his name correct.
39:12Special IB Commissioner.
39:14He was harassed so much.
39:15He was one of the most intrepid IB officers in this country.
39:20And these guys went after him with a vengeance.
39:23Why?
39:23Because they wanted to give a clean check to the Pakistanis.
39:26Can you believe this?
39:27And this is the way you carry out investigation.
39:30This is the kind of loyalty you show to your country.
39:33I think these people should be ashamed.
39:35They are as shameless as the people in Pakistan are, you know, for having done what they did.
39:41But, you know, you get hold of the…
39:44You do an investigation.
39:45You get to the bottom of it.
39:47And then finally, you see some person coming in and, you know, sabotaging the case.
39:52You're talking about Ishra Jahan.
39:54Let's talk about that criminal Sorabuddin, right?
39:56These guys pretended as though Sorabuddin was some kind of Mother Teresa.
40:01He was a third-rate criminal indulging in gun running.
40:05Gun runner.
40:05You know, one of the problem is that once you start…
40:08One of the finest police officers was put in jail.
40:11You destroy your entire fight against terrorism.
40:13Yes, yes, yes.
40:17And we'll talk about these cases in the next several days.
40:20And I hope we have an opportunity to talk about these cases in a couple of days.
40:24But Dr. Tara Kartha, what information will we get from this villain?
40:28The first image that you see exclusively on India today of Tawar Hussain Rana then and now, what do we hope?
40:36What are those gaps, Dr. Tara Kartha, that we can fill in the enemy within and the enemy across, madam?
40:45You can't think how…
40:46What happiness it gives me to see this character caught.
40:49Because this is something very personal to us.
40:51Okay, what can he be done is, you know, during the time that Hedley was in India, all communications with Hedley was never from Pakistan.
41:01It was from Pakistan to Rana, Rana to Hedley.
41:05That link I want to know.
41:07I'm not sure where those tapes are.
41:09I'm pretty sure the US has a bunch of them, whether they've shared them or not, I don't know.
41:14I'm hoping we have something on that.
41:16But that is going to be a focus on what this man spoke.
41:20There was other targets also, which I perhaps am not at liberty to state, but there were other targets also being wrecked.
41:29And let me tell you something.
41:30The Lashkar has a habit.
41:32They are very thorough.
41:33They are, after all, a Pakistani army-trained outfit.
41:36They do a minimum of three to four records, thorough reconnaissance before an attack.
41:41So that is their tradition.
41:43Second thing, like you said, is you've got a bunch of people whom we already know from his, David Hedley's testimony that he was assisted by A.
41:53Somebody met him at the airport.
41:54Somebody helped him with XYZ.
41:56But there are other people who were involved in this.
42:00So we need to get that clear.
42:02You know, so the, and especially I want to, I mean, what I would personally would really like to know is, how is it that such a bunch of ex-army people, ex-Pakistan army people, ex?
42:14Yes.
42:14Forget the regular army types.
42:16They were thoroughly involved.
42:17That is, we know.
42:18There were a bunch of ex-army people involved, yeah.
42:21This guy, Hedley, Abdul Rahman, who studied in Pakistan Military Academy.
42:26I mean, what is, you know, it's amazing.
42:29It is, if I had an agency doing something, I mean, agencies do these things, right?
42:34I would recruit someone else.
42:35These are all ex-army guys.
42:38It's amazing.
42:38That would just, what would that indicate, Dr. Vikram Singh?
42:41You know, Dr. Tara Kartha is absolutely right.
42:44And they're Abdalis, they're all Abdalians, you know, from Hassan Abdal Military Academy, especially David Coleman Hedley and Tahavar Hussain Rana.
42:53And perhaps it was this band of rogues in touch with other Abdalians.
42:58They were in a group with other Abdalians who were serving in Pakistan army.
43:02And that too would shed more details.
43:04And the FBI has a lot more details.
43:06Perhaps that India-America cooperation, Dr. Vikram Singh, will shed more light on the role of Pakistani state elements here.
43:14We have several dimensions to the issues raised by Dr. Tara Jee in the sense that there is a close user group in Pakistan known as Abdalians.
43:23And both David Coleman Hedley and also Tahavar were a part of this insidious group.
43:28They exchanged the beardings.
43:29They exchanged the various jihadi literature.
43:33And also why they failed in the Denmark attack on the newspaper.
43:38Also, it was a close user group duly supported, aided and emitted by the Pakistani deep state as also the ISI.
43:45Now, coming to the fact that what was the roadmap for attacking India because that is their only oxygen and the lifeline.
43:52And therefore, a thousand cuts was in fact that they were planning to end Ganswai in.
43:57Now, the Pakistan involvement and also the tapes.
44:00I'm sure America has them.
44:01I'm sure we have them.
44:02But this is too sensitive a matter even to be discussed and disclosed.
44:06You had Mr. Bahira on your show.
44:09You have an opportunity of speaking to Mr. Sabanath.
44:13But I'm sure they are on very, very comfortable wicket.
44:16And I'm sure a befitting investigation with an appropriate and scientific roadmap and an investigation plan will see to it that the ends of justice are ensured.
44:26And indeed, he goes the same way as Kassab did.
44:31Sincerely hope so.
44:32You know, former Home Secretary G.K. Pillai, he said India has enough evidence to ensure he is convicted.
44:38According to him, enough evidence even to ensure that this man responsible for 166 deaths of Indians, Americans, Jewish people, Europeans, he is actually sent to the gallows.
44:50I hope, you know, India has that kind of evidence and it comes out in public domain.
44:54But is it also a fit case in your appreciation, Sushant Sareen, for Pakistan once that evidence comes out in public domain of involvement of Pakistani state elements to put Pakistan once again back in the Financial Action Task Force gray list and ensure no more world-backed funding for the terror state?
45:11Yeah, Gaurav, you know, as far as the Financial Action Task Force is concerned, the Pakistanis have already pulled a fast one on them.
45:20So, forget, even if you remove the 2611 attacks and how they have been dealing with, you know, the people involved in these attacks inside Pakistan, even if you keep that aside, the very fact that the Pakistanis have simply not lived up to their commitments, which they made to the FATF on getting holds of people like Masood Azhar, they claim, they have told the FATF, we have no idea where this guy is.
45:45On Sajid Mir, who incidentally used to come on a cricket visa, apparently, there are some reports that he would come on a cricket visa and there are idiots in India who want to play cricket matches with Pakistan and including people who have served in the police services, who say, these guys don't do anything.
46:01So, Sajid Mir incidentally came as that.
46:04Sajid Mir, who they had declared dead, they dug him out from the grave, they've sentenced him, but nobody knows in which jail he is, nobody has any idea where he is.
46:12So, they have actually taken eyewash of action.
46:17And I think the Indian agencies need to work double time to ensure that we apprise the FATF on what the Pakistanis, how the Pakistanis are hoodwinking the FATF, how they have not changed their entire association with these terror organizations, how they are continuing to fund this entire terror finance network, allowing it to continue unhindered.
46:39But, you know, I think we need to start raising hell over that.
46:43It might take some time before we drag them back to the grey list.
46:46But I think we should not give any quarter to these terrorist nations on our border.
46:51We should not give them any quarter.
46:53We should not cut any slack for them.
46:55And despite there will be these friends of, you know, the Pakistanis in India, who will rather get India, you know, sucked into a vortex of terrorism than have India take any action against Pakistan.
47:09I think rather than bother about them, the government in India should have a very clear policy of how to go after Pakistan in every sphere, every domain, at every level.
47:19Oh, absolutely. Dr. Tara Kartha, Dr. Vikram Singh and Sushant Sareen for joining me here on this India Today special broadcast.
47:27Many thanks. We'll be tracking the story very, very closely.
47:30Anytime now, this terrorist, Tahovar Hussain Rana, will be out of Palam technical area.
47:37And we have our cameras there.
47:38You can see those images.
47:40The images on your television screen give out that big story about Pakistan's involvement in terror.
47:47But as I take a break, I want to quickly talk about a brief, for a brief moment, talk about what then Chief Minister of Gujarat, Narendra Modi, had said in 2011,
47:59when Tahovar Hussain Rana and David Coleman-Hedley, while they were convicted in the Copenhagen case, they were let off in the 2611 Mumbai terror attacks case.
48:07That time, Chief Minister Narendra Modi was very disappointed that why hadn't the conviction happened then?
48:14When he became Prime Minister, he pursued this case along with this team and relentlessly pursued this case.
48:21Perhaps today, Prime Minister Narendra Modi will be a satisfied man that at least Tahovar Hussain Rana has been brought to India to face justice.
48:30And hopefully, hopefully, now that entire prosecution till conviction will be a very transparent process that we'll be tracking here very closely on India today.
48:41And then, this man, hopefully, when convicted, will be justice and his maker.
48:50We'll be tracking developments on the story very closely as he steps out of the Palam technical area.
48:55And then, we take him to the Patiala house court.