During remarks on the Senate floor Wednesday, Sen. Ron Wyden (D-OR) and Sen. James Lankford (R-OK) debated a bill that would extend the statute of limitations for insurance fraud.
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NewsTranscript
00:00Senator from Oklahoma.
00:01Mr. President, I would ask unanimous consent that Senator Wyden and I both be able to complete
00:04our remarks before the vote.
00:06Without objection.
00:07Mr. President, I do appreciate so much my colleagues coming to the floor just to be
00:12able to talk about the scourge of fentanyl and what it's really doing in our communities
00:16on this.
00:17Senator Ricketts, Senator Moody, Senator Budd, Senator Hoeven have spent a lot of time laying
00:21out the challenges that we really face.
00:23I think most Americans know it and have seen it, they just don't realize how fast it's
00:27really moving.
00:28Ten years ago we had 700 deaths in the country due to fentanyl.
00:33Last year we had 87,000.
00:36That's the acceleration we've seen in the decade.
00:38The vast majority of fentanyl used to come across the border from, quite frankly, China.
00:43It was being mailed in and then it was active work was done to be able to shut that down.
00:48It started coming through Mexico.
00:51That is aggressively, we're taking that on and the cartels and the criminal organizations
00:57are shifting more and more to Canada to be able to find ways to be able to move it in.
01:00The Canadians have seen that and have noted that as well by the aggressive actions that
01:05they have taken.
01:06But just to give you a quick glance at this, dealing with just the fentanyl issue, in 2020
01:14the Canadians interdicted 1,000 pounds of fentanyl precursors.
01:18In 2021 it was 11,000 pounds.
01:22So that's the acceleration that's also happening for these criminal organizations that are
01:26trying to be able to move fentanyl into our country and quite frankly into Canada as well.
01:31So we're grateful for their partnership, but we definitely see this as an emergency.
01:35A decade ago, the United States did not move fast enough to be able to stop the movement
01:40of fentanyl into our country and we've lost tens of thousands of Americans.
01:44President Trump has determined, and quite frankly this Congress has determined, we're
01:48not going to be asleep on that again.
01:50That we will take it very, very seriously.
01:52It is a very big emergency to be able to move.
01:55So I thank my colleagues for coming here to be able to talk about it today.
01:59Mr. President, I also wanted to be able to spend some time talking about an issue that
02:03we have that we also have to address.
02:06And it's a totally different subject, but it's dealing with unemployment insurance that
02:12was actually done during the pandemic.
02:16This may not see a big issue to some to say that was a long time ago when we were dealing
02:20with a pandemic.
02:21Thankfully, it's more and more in our rearview mirror.
02:24But during the pandemic, we had billions of dollars of unemployment fraud that occurred
02:30during that time period.
02:32Billions.
02:33Where criminal organizations saw that America was moving fast to be able to stop the unemployment
02:40problem that was in our country.
02:41Obviously, during the pandemic itself, the United States quickly ramped up to be able
02:46to provide benefits and criminal organizations ramped up just as fast to be able to go after
02:51it.
02:52During that time period, as far as the Inspector General has seen at this point, the Inspector
02:57General has identified $191 billion with a B, $191 billion of unemployment insurance
03:06that was inappropriately distributed, $191 billion.
03:13You may say, what's the issue with that and why are we bringing it up now?
03:16Unemployment fraud is a criminal action.
03:21It is a five-year statute of limitations on that.
03:24The first of the unemployment benefits were actually put out five years ago this week.
03:29That means criminal organizations that move quickly to actually try to go after unemployment
03:36insurance that did not qualify for it, five years ago this week, if we have not actually
03:42started that prosecution of them, they're going to get away with it.
03:46And you know what?
03:47Next week, there's another group.
03:48Next week, there's another group.
03:50Next week, there's another group.
03:51And until this body determines that we need to stop unemployment fraud and we should not
03:58allow criminal organizations to get away with $191 billion of tax dollars, they're going
04:05to continue to get away with more of it every single week.
04:10So Mr. President, what I bring is actually a solution to this.
04:13It's a simple extension of the statute of limitations for the unemployment insurance.
04:20This is simple.
04:21This is straightforward.
04:22This is already overwhelmingly passed the House of Representatives.
04:26It passed with a vote of 295 to 127.
04:30That is 83 House Democrats voting for this bill.
04:35This is a very bipartisan bill and this is just a straight extension of this so that
04:41we stop the fraud that we know 100 percent and our inspector generals have already identified
04:47and says has occurred to the tune of $191 billion that we know of.
04:54So as if in legislative session, I ask unanimous consent that the Senate proceed to the immediate
05:01consideration of calendar number 29, H.R. 1156.
05:06I further ask the bill be considered read a third time and passed and that the motion
05:10to reconsider be considered made and laid upon the table.
05:14Objection.
05:15I determine the right to object.
05:18The Senator from Oregon.
05:19Thank you Mr. President.
05:20First of all, I want it understood that we take a backseat to nobody, nobody when it
05:35comes to fighting this fraud.
05:38And that's why I negotiated a bipartisan package in the last Congress dealing with a host of
05:45issues relating to addressing fraud and making improvements to unemployment insurance.
05:52I negotiated that bill within our ranking member, with our ranking member, now the chairman
05:58of the Finance Committee.
06:00And I'm a little struck by what's going on here because my colleague, my friend from
06:06Oklahoma was a co-sponsor of that proposal.
06:11In other words, we did what the American people say they want, which is to have people find
06:20common ground on common sense matters like fighting fraud.
06:27Our bipartisan proposal went after pandemic era fraud by extending the statute of limits
06:32on prosecutions.
06:33It would help to prevent fraud in the future.
06:35It would help states improve their unemployment insurance programs to get benefits out on
06:41time in the event of a big economic crash like we saw in 2020.
06:47It would make better use of data to prevent abuse.
06:51It would protect people who got overpayments entirely due to somebody else's mistake and
06:58who may not even know it to this day.
07:01So, I will tell you, I think it is odd at best, but certainly disappointing, that our
07:09Republican colleagues have decided to walk away from a really good bipartisan agreement.
07:18The proposal they brought to the floor is much smaller.
07:22It's much narrower.
07:23In fact, instead of looking forward, it's looking backward.
07:28No improvements to unemployment insurance.
07:30No fraud prevention looking at the future.
07:34In fact, the bill before the Senate actually cuts $5 million of crucial fraud prevention
07:41funding that Democrats secured after the pandemic.
07:45So you ask yourself, why are Republicans attempting to make this cut?
07:51Because the nonpartisan experts at the Congressional Budget Office looked at this narrow proposal
07:55my colleagues have brought forward.
07:58They've said if Congress were to pass this bill, Republicans would spend more money,
08:04more money trying to track down fraud than they'd actually recover from the fraudsters.
08:10So government efficiency is something we're all interested in.
08:13You got me at hello on the concept of working on those kinds of issues in a bipartisan way,
08:19but here's a Republican anti-fraud proposal that loses taxpayer dollars overall.
08:26And to pay for it, they'd cut future fraud prevention.
08:29That just strikes me as defying common sense.
08:33Another issue with this approach I want to highlight.
08:36The bill now before the Senate fails to provide any protections for workers who got overpaid
08:41through no fault of their own.
08:44Colleagues may remember that when the pandemic UI program was created, it was in the midst
08:48of the COVID crisis, highest unemployment since the Great Depression, tens of millions
08:53of Americans out of work, entire sectors of our economy essentially mothballed.
09:00Congress scrambled to create an unemployment insurance program for Americans who weren't
09:05eligible for traditional unemployment insurance.
09:08Without it, a whole lot of people would have gone hungry and lost their homes.
09:12In the rush to get urgently needed relief to those out of work, some states made mistakes,
09:19provided a number of workers more in unemployment than they were entitled to.
09:24These workers didn't defraud anybody.
09:26A lot of those people who received overpayments had no idea that they got more money than
09:32they should have.
09:34The issue is some states are running their unemployment insurance programs with decrepit
09:39old systems they can barely keep up and they made mistakes.
09:44Now five years down the line, my colleagues on the other side of the aisle want to claw
09:49back these payments, even from people who did nothing wrong.
09:55In fact, some of these people to this day aren't even aware that they were overpaid.
10:01They certainly aren't fraudsters.
10:03States made mistakes in the heat of an economic crisis.
10:07Congress shouldn't be punishing individual workers who had no idea in the first place
10:12what was going on.
10:13A final issue with the proposal.
10:17The Trump administration has made a mockery of fraud prevention by illegally firing the
10:23Department of Labor Inspector General.
10:26The Inspector General's office successfully oversaw unemployment fraud investigations
10:30throughout the pandemic.
10:32In my view, firing the Inspector General is a big setback in the fight against fraud in
10:37the unemployment insurance program.
10:40The Trump administration has also given DOJ unfettered access to unemployment insurance
10:46claims data.
10:48The bill before the Senate would allow DOJ to falsely accuse innocent workers of fraud
10:54years after unemployment insurance helped them keep food on the table during the pandemic.
10:59That is not being tough on fraud.
11:02That is making innocent people victims.
11:05Democrats are all in on bringing criminals who defrauded the UI system to justice and
11:12building a more reliable, durable unemployment insurance system for the future.
11:17That is why, colleagues, we negotiated a really strong bipartisan anti-fraud package.
11:26For the life of me, I don't understand walking away from that package now, especially in
11:31favor of a narrower proposal that would lose taxpayer dollars and sacrifice the effort
11:36to fight fraud.
11:38Therefore, I would ask the Senator to modify the request of the Wyden Substitute Amendment,
11:45which is at the desk and is the text of the Wyden-CREPO Unemployment Insurance Integrity
11:51and Accountability Act, be considered and agreed to.
11:53The bill, as amended, be considered read a third time and passed, and the motion to reconsider
11:58be considered, made, and laid upon the table with no intervening action or debate.
12:05Is there an objection to the modification?
12:07Reserving the right to object, the Senator from Oklahoma.
12:11My friend from Oregon, and we are friends, and we have the opportunity to be able to
12:14serve together and work on a lot of issues, is correct.
12:16I'm glad to be able to see a larger proposal to deal with unemployment insurance.
12:21It's been an issue for a long time.
12:23This is one of the most classic examples of saying the perfect is the enemy of the good.
12:30Today, we have people getting away with fraud, today, and we can do nothing about it because
12:38the statute of limitations has run out.
12:41The House has passed a bipartisan bill by a wide majority to deal with this one problem,
12:48and they have come to an agreement on a wide bipartisan majority to say, let's at least
12:53solve this part and then we'll work on bigger solutions later.
12:58What my friend is recommending is to say, no, let's force everyone to work on the bigger
13:02solution and every single day let more people get away with fraud until we come up with
13:08the bigger solution and can agree on it.
13:12We should stop as much fraud as we can today and keep working on the bigger solution to
13:18be able to get the bigger issues done.
13:20If I can also say to my friend, he knows this bill well as well, this is not about incidental
13:26actions that have happened to someone who accidentally filled out something or a state
13:31did something inappropriately.
13:33This bill is very clear.
13:34That's why it had such a strong bipartisan support out of the House.
13:37This is about criminal actors.
13:40These are people that criminally engaged in large-scale fraud deliberately.
13:47That's $191 billion out there that the inspector general under the Biden administration even
13:53identified.
13:55So I want to do as much as we can on the unemployment insurance side, but let's do things as quickly
14:03as we can to be able to stop criminal activity and to be able to prosecute those individuals.
14:09So knowing that, I will not modify my request.
14:15And the modification is heard.
14:17Is there an objection to the original request?
14:19Reserving the right to object.
14:20The senator from Oregon.
14:22So let me make sure we're clear with my friend because we do a lot of work together and I'm
14:27looking forward to continuing it.
14:30I don't see much to object to this afternoon.
14:35We both want to be all in on the fight against fraud.
14:38Those were the first words out of my mouth.
14:42Let's go all in in fighting this horrendous fraud.
14:46And that's why we worked so long in a bipartisan way because you're not the only Republican
14:53from the committee who worked with me.
14:55It's a large bill.
14:57It deals with a big problem.
15:00And for the life of me, I can't figure out why we aren't dealing with a big problem and
15:04not creating innocent victims, more of them.
15:08So at this point, I guess there's gridlock today, but I want to extend the olive branch
15:15again, which I've been doing from day one.
15:19I want a big bill that goes after big time fraud in a very aggressive way.
15:25And I'm still baffled by why we're not out here with a whole lot of Republicans who are
15:31co-sponsors of my bill, with a senator from Idaho as the chair, and saying this is the
15:38way we ought to be governing.
15:40But I object, and Mr. President, I hope we're back.
15:45The objection is heard.
15:47The senator from Oklahoma.
15:48I'm working on a larger proposal in the days ahead.
15:53That larger proposal is not going to move in the House in the next month or two months.
15:59And in the meantime, we're going to have criminal organizations getting away with it
16:02over and over and over again.
16:04So let's move as much as we can as fast as we can, but at least at this point, let's
16:09solve what we can today.
16:10Mr. President, just very, very briefly, my colleague says nothing's going to happen in
16:15the House to fight fraud.
16:17I got to tell you, I don't see any fraud caucus out there in either the Senate or the House.
16:22There are no rallies for people who are committing outrageous fraud.
16:26I think we ought to move.
16:28We ought to move here.
16:30We've done the hard work.
16:31We've done the heavy lifting, and my colleague from Oklahoma knows what it's like when he's
16:35trying to put together a bipartisan bill.
16:38We've done that work.
16:39I think we ought to move here and then talk to our colleagues in the House.
16:43Why don't you now pick up on the hard work we've done, and we'll get serious about fraud.
16:48So we're going to continue this conversation, and I've always wanted to work with my colleague
16:53from Oklahoma on these kinds of issues, and we're going to stay at it until we deal with
16:57big-time fraud in a big-time way in the United States Senate in a bipartisan way.
17:02Mr. President, I yield back.