La ciudad de Buenos Aires enfrenta una crisis carcelaria con más de 2,500 reclusos en comisarías y alcaidías, superando su capacidad. La situación ha generado un enfrentamiento político entre Patricia Bullrich y Mauricio Macri, quienes se acusan mutuamente de no haber construido nuevas cárceles durante sus gestiones. La falta de infraestructura penitenciaria obliga a la policía a custodiar presos en lugar de patrullar las calles, afectando la seguridad ciudadana. Este conflicto resalta las tensiones políticas y la necesidad urgente de soluciones estructurales.
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00:00The fight between Libertad Avanza and El Pro is more or less known.
00:05Now, between... Is Patricia Woolrich from El Pro?
00:09It seems like she's not anymore.
00:10She's not anymore, right?
00:11She made several decisions, even from a strategic point of view for the elections,
00:17that have nothing to do with El Pro's strategy.
00:19I mean, yesterday a tweet was published where Mauricio Macri says,
00:24Hey, the police of the city of Buenos Aires, 27,000 policemen,
00:26have to be on the streets, guarding the citizens, not the prisoners.
00:32Patricia Woolrich answers very strongly, she speaks directly to Mauricio.
00:35Here's Mauricio Macri, as I was saying, retweeting his cousin Jorge.
00:40Look at the tone after Patricia Woolrich.
00:43Macri, Mauricio, the country requires that you stop thinking about your private interests.
00:47Very strong, and it ends in an impactful way.
00:51Managing security is not designing uniforms.
00:55That's what Patricia Woolrich says.
00:57Very strong.
00:58Very strong.
01:00From what I understood, it was also Jorge Macri himself who responds and says,
01:04it seems that Woolrich forgot about his political party.
01:07I mean, apart from that, let's look for the political origin.
01:09Patricia Woolrich is a presidential candidate,
01:11then she's going to win the internal election,
01:13because Mauricio Macri is the auspicious one.
01:15Implicitly, it wasn't said.
01:18What are we talking about?
01:19Prisoners in police stations.
01:21What are we talking about, Gustavo?
01:23Yes, what we are talking about is the number of prisoners
01:25that are in the police stations of the city of Buenos Aires,
01:27that should not be there.
01:28Clearly, they should not be there.
01:30Because the prisoners who have to be in the Portean police stations,
01:34could even accept you, look at what I'm telling you,
01:37those who committed crimes in the field of Portean justice.
01:42Not like that, in the field of the nation.
01:43In any case, in the Portean justice,
01:45to commit a crime, you have to have prepared a prison where to host them.
01:51You look at what are the facilities of the Portean police stations,
01:55where the prisoners are and where they obviously escape.
01:59And so that they don't escape, you have to allocate 3,000 policemen.
02:033,000 policemen who should be on the street,
02:05taking care of you.
02:06Or 3,000 policemen who should be yesterday,
02:08ordering the chaos that was in the city with all the traffic.
02:12They are in the police stations taking care that you don't escape,
02:152,450 inmates.
02:20But look at how this grew.
02:23In 2020, you had 448 prisoners in the police stations
02:28and Alcaidías of the city of Buenos Aires.
02:30A manageable number.
02:32After that, we can discuss if it's good or bad.
02:33I think it's bad anyway.
02:34But 450 is 450, a small number.
02:38Manageable.
02:39It starts to grow.
02:412021, 637.
02:432022, 962.
02:462023 goes to 1,794.
02:492024 to 2,128.
02:51And in 2025, it reaches the record of almost 2,500 inmates
02:55in the Alcaidías-Porteñas police stations.
02:57And you say, this has to do with a fierce increase
03:01in crime in the city of Buenos Aires.
03:03Let's see, did the crime increase eight times in the city of Buenos Aires?
03:08Between 2020 and 2025?
03:10No.
03:11What happens is that when the federal prisons are collapsed,
03:16because they no longer have a place to put people,
03:19they tell the city government,
03:21well, keep them in the police station.
03:24Which is wrong.
03:25Look at what Patricia Bullrich says.
03:27Patricia Bullrich tells her,
03:28you had to build Marcos Paz's prison.
03:31And she tells Macri,
03:33you didn't put the money in your presidency.
03:38Do I remember that I was a security minister in that presidency?
03:43It was Patricia Bullrich herself.
03:45Who now complains about what was not done
03:46while she was a security minister.
03:48It's an incredible situation.
03:50Of the 2,434 prisoners that the city of Buenos Aires has,
03:55which doubles, more than doubles, I would tell you,
03:58150% more than the capacity there is,
04:01housed in Alcaidías there are 1,474.
04:03Do you know that in the Alcaidías they are only a place of transit?
04:07You, Juancito commits a crime, God forbid,
04:09but let's suppose that Juancito commits a crime
04:11here in the city of Buenos Aires.
04:13Well, before going to testify in court,
04:16they send him to the Alcaidía as a place of transit,
04:19and from the Alcaidía the prosecutor and judge will make the decision
04:24to interrogate him and then it will be seen.
04:26If they dedicate him to preventive prison,
04:27he can no longer be in an Alcaidía.
04:28He has to go to a prison.
04:30The Alcaidía is a place of transit.
04:31Well, it is not a transit place in the city of Buenos Aires.
04:34Now, in neighboring police stations there are 525
04:38and an incredible fact occurs.
04:40In two neighboring police stations you have two people
04:44who are sentenced to life in prison for homicide.
04:47Next to your house there may be a person ...
04:50Halfway through you have a homicide.
04:52You have a homicide that is guarded by one,
04:54by two police officers at most,
04:57because the police are there to be on the street,
04:59not to guard this.
05:00How many Argentines are the ones who are arrested?
05:03In 1981, foreigners, you have 453.
05:08And the procedural situation, this is the most important thing.
05:10Of course.
05:11Because you have 418, they are sentenced.
05:13If they are sentenced, they can no longer be in that place.
05:15If they are sentenced, they have to go to the criminal.
05:17Why do they transfer them to police stations?
05:19Because there is no place.
05:21Because sometimes one forgets the meaning of the word.
05:23Because there is no place and because this only runs on my account.
05:26As there is no place, it is a good business
05:29so that someone can get an Alcaidía for a few pesos.
05:33Yes, obviously.
05:35Obviously, if you are housed in an Alcaidía or in a police station,
05:39you spend it a hundred times better than if you are in a penal,
05:43either federal or some of the jurisdictions that exist.
05:46Guz, there is also a topic that is not analyzed
05:49or because they do not want to analyze it and it is ...
05:51One thing is to be a police officer
05:53and another thing is to be an agent of the Federal Penitentiary Service.
05:56The preparation is totally different.
05:59It is a totally different activity.
06:00Totally different.
06:02I remember the figure that Gustavo gave.
06:03More than 10% of the metropolitan police
06:07destined to be penitentiaries.
06:08Yes, it is incredible.
06:10It is incredible because they would have to be guarding the street.
06:12They would have to be avoiding more motorcycle theft,
06:15more car theft and more.
06:18I even give you a smaller piece of information, if you want.
06:19They would have to be guarding that there is no trapito
06:21that asks for 20,000 pesos every time there is an event
06:24like the one that is going to be with Shakira now on the weekend.
06:28And 20,000, I don't know if I'm not getting short.
06:30But you look at the situation.
06:32418 are sentenced, 188 have the sentence with a firm sentence.
06:37In the province of Buenos Aires, for example, does the same thing happen?
06:40Because to me this of the political flag and the rest,
06:42the truth is that I am fed up with this thing.
06:44I give you an example that I know a lot.
06:45Rosario happens.
06:46Rosario happens anyway.
06:48In the province of Buenos Aires you know that no,
06:49but you know that what happens in the province of Buenos Aires
06:51is that a penalty like that of Florencio Varela
06:53has an overpopulation of 200%.
06:57But they don't go to the police station of, I don't know,
06:59La Sexta and San Isidro.
07:01In the police station they are there for a short time,
07:02but they go to penalties where in a cell there have to be four
07:07and there are eight.
07:08So, if you want to reform the criminal who entered the penalty,
07:13it is absolutely impossible.
07:15The Federal Penitentiary Service is overflown,
07:17much more overflown than the Federal Penitentiary Service.
07:19And why don't they build prisons?
07:21Well, that's the discussion between Patricia Bullrich
07:24and Jorge Macri, who tells him,
07:26you committed to building a prison in Marcos Paz
07:31and that prison has not yet been built.
07:33Of course, you have to put 700 million dollars, right?
07:36You have to put money.
07:37Well, it's a vicious circle.
07:39That's why when you say,
07:40I'm going to solve the criminal situation by increasing the penalties,
07:44you say, put some penalties that deserve greater sanctions.
07:49This is one of the aspects that must be solved.
07:51This is one of the aspects that must be solved.
07:53Or the other aspect, the judicial structure.
07:55But this aspect that Gustavo is showing,
07:57in an irreversible way,
07:59of what is happening in the city of Buenos Aires,
08:01well, here it is, right?
08:02And what is the argument that Jorge Macri clearly has in his favor?
08:08He says, stop, let's see where the prisoners are from.
08:11He says, I, from the city, people who committed the crime of justice
08:15for having, I only have 147.
08:16How interesting.
08:17I would only have to have 147,
08:19housed in Alcaidías and police stations.
08:22Because 2,237 are from the nation.
08:25Let's see, this does not mean that they are criminals
08:27who have committed crimes in El Chaco,
08:29in Misiones, in the province of Buenos Aires.
08:31They are crimes that are committed in the area of the city of Buenos Aires,
08:36but done under the justice of the nation.
08:39People, things or places of federal jurisdiction.
08:42Drug, places, in some area.
08:44Yes, there are also many common crimes
08:46that have not yet been transferred to the justice of the city of Buenos Aires.
08:49The most serious, such as homicides, for example.
08:52Well, here you have the type of crime of those who are arrested.
08:56Robbery and theft, which is the strongest crime in the city of Buenos Aires.
09:001,347.
09:03Attempted robbery and theft, 287.
09:07Sexual abuse, this is a fact that scares me a lot.
09:11Very, very.
09:11Well, you see, Mumi, because sexual abuse,
09:15and if you are going to see the intrafamilial sexual abuse
09:18in the city of Buenos Aires,
09:20in the area, in certain areas, it is very, very high.
09:24You look, you have 273.
09:26There are 36.
09:26A question that we liked, and if you don't know, we'll find out.
09:29Do they have them grouped in a particular police station, the sexual crimes?
09:35They are supposed to have them in different authorities.
09:40Of course.
09:41But the truth is that with the overpopulation that there is,
09:44that becomes absolutely impossible.
09:47There are 36 for homicides, you only have 7 minors,
09:51and there are others for 485.
09:53When we talk about others, the one who has the most is narcomenudeo.
09:58And look at the figure of the spending of detainees
10:00of the government of the city of Buenos Aires.
10:02I mean, when I say the government of the city of Buenos Aires,
10:05I'm telling you, if you lived in the city of Buenos Aires, your spending.
10:09Because this comes out of our taxes.
10:10It's not that someone grabs a machine and says,
10:13hey, well, let's get money out of here.
10:14No, it comes out of the tax that you are paying,
10:16and that should be intended for other things.
10:19This is the global figure of 2024.
10:23We are seeing a number that is absolutely tremendous.
10:27If I'm not mistaken, it's 70,161 million pesos.
10:31What does it give you, if you divide it by the number of detainees
10:35that the city of Buenos Aires had in 2024,
10:37in which there are days and police stations,
10:4083,576 pesos per day.
10:4483,576 pesos per day
10:49the city of Buenos Aires spends on a detainee.
10:52Do you want to know, do you want to do the math?
10:53How much does a retiree earn per day?
10:55No, no.
10:56Do you want to do the math?
10:58How much does a retiree earn per day?
11:00Fuck.
11:00Let's get it out.
11:01Let's get it out.
11:02It's in 304.
11:04Yes, let's do 390 to divide it.
11:07Divided by 30, it's 13,000 pesos per day.
11:1013,000 against 83,000.
11:12Sorry, there are no more words to say.
11:14No, of course, definitely.
11:15And it strikes me a lot that, because of the discussion,
11:19because this comes out, not because of a conviction
11:21that it has to be improved, but because of a political fight
11:22that is being disputed in the federal capital electorally.
11:26So, the Libertad van Zakir, Patricia Burris,
11:28goes like a hurricane against the pro.
11:30It's shocking.
11:31Just a few minutes ago,
11:34Jorge Macri continued to answer Patricia Burris,
11:38saying that it is useless to tell half-truths.
11:42And there is something that Jorge Macri is answering,
11:45that somehow he is right,
11:47because here there is a problem that has no solution, Luis,
11:50and it is the set of relations that the whole AMBA has.
11:55Because what is it saying to the city?
11:57You take care that we receive 3 million people
12:01from outside the city every day,
12:03and this also involves crimes.
12:05Because it is clear, we always say it involves
12:07the use of transport, the use of, in many cases,
12:10the use of hospitals and schools,
12:13but also the control of crime involves
12:16that 3 million people who do not live in the city
12:18enter the city every day.
12:20I mean, more than a graph, what Gustavo Gravia raises
12:23regarding how much you invest in each thing.
12:27A prisoner in the city of Buenos Aires
12:30earns 84,000 pesos.
12:32Daily.
12:32Daily, daily.
12:34A retiree earns 13,000 pesos daily.
12:38A teacher.
12:39Yes, yes.
12:40I don't know how much the teacher is in the Federal Capital,
12:42it is a little higher.
12:42It is higher.
12:43The Federal Capital is higher than in the rest of the country.
12:45But I don't know if it reaches 83,000, because I say...
12:48No, 83,000 does not reach.
12:49Let's do the following, 84,000.
12:52No, how is it going to reach 83,000?
12:53We are talking about 2.5 million pesos per month.
12:56How good you are, 2.5 million.
12:58Of course.
12:58It does not win.
12:59With all the fury, a teacher in the city...
13:02The initial must be between 1.1 million and 1.2 million, yes.
13:05If a teacher who is watching us helps us,
13:08I say, there is something that is not working.
13:1131,700.
13:14And there is also another issue that I insist,
13:16there are 3,000 policemen destined to take care of something
13:19that they should not take care of and that they should be taking care of us all the time.
13:22And that they are not prepared, as the teacher said.
13:23Because I say, the penitentiary service is a special discipline
13:27that you have to learn and not.
13:29What thing, Mumi?
13:30Why don't they make prisons?
13:32Why can't a prison be built?
13:34I understand the 704, but apparently they don't do it in Mexico.
13:37A, the prisoners don't vote.
13:38B, when you want to install a prison,
13:41the level of opposition that there is in the urban area where it is done,
13:45nobody wants it.
13:46I mean, everyone says to make a prison.
13:47Ah, but it's the truck, no.
13:48Yes, but I...
13:50Let's see, I don't want to be a hypocrite.
13:52We all say, now, a prison near you,
13:55which has nothing to do with the level of security,
13:57because it is not that the prisoners of a prison are going to escape you
14:00and they are going to start stealing in the area.
14:02But the area is affected,
14:05because you have all the relatives who are going to see it.
14:07I say, there are a lot of...
14:08No, the real estate value, huh?
14:09It falls.
14:10The real estate value falls.
14:11It falls.
14:12We are one of the 10 largest countries in the world on a territorial level.
14:15It's just that you can't have...
14:16We can't not have a place to have a prison.
14:19Yes, because you can't put it far from the urban areas,
14:21because the infrastructure, which means bringing drinking water, electricity,
14:25you can't put it in the middle of, I don't know, Patagonia.
14:28What am I saying?
14:29In a inhospitable place,
14:30but yes, at least far from certain urban centers.
14:33The agreement of the city of Buenos Aires is to do it in Marcos Paz,
14:37not in the city of Buenos Aires,
14:39where there is a devotee who has generated,
14:41I don't know if anyone has a relative who lives near the devotee's prison,
14:46they are not very happy with that situation.
14:48They are not happy.
14:49I say, forgive the localism, which I mean Rosario,
14:52which is the...
14:53What else did I know?
14:54The last prison, I think I'm not wrong,
14:56which was done in the province of Santa Fe in Piñero,
14:58of which we have spoken a lot of times about escapes, confrontations and so on.
15:01It took a year and a half because the other towns were opposed to giving in.
15:05You have to be close to an urban center for this,
15:07I'm telling you, for the infrastructure.
15:09So it's very difficult.
15:10First, the prisoners don't vote.
15:12Second, the guide is used for anything else.
15:14It's easier to filter.
15:15So there is no business.
15:16There is no business.
15:17And third, there is a lot of opposition.
15:18The last two great prisons that were built
15:21are the Penitentiary Complex of Ezeiza,
15:23which is really very important.
15:25And the one of Vidal, which enlarged in Campana.
15:27And the one of Campana.
15:28And the one of Campana, where in Campana,
15:30a special module was made,
15:32which is very good,
15:34to generally reintegrate the youngest into society.
15:38Because it has classrooms, it has a lot of things.
15:42Still, not from this, from training,
15:44because I like to get into politics,
15:47it doesn't let me impact the level of confrontation between,
15:51until now it was Jorge Macri and Patricia Woolrich.
15:54Now Mauricio Macri is coming up.
15:56And how does Patricia answer him?
15:58Macri, coma, Mauricio,
16:01dedicate yourself to what you have to do,
16:03and don't be a Putin.
16:04Don't think that the capital is yours.
16:06The truth is that Patricia uses almost a terminology of Cristina.
16:08I think there are some who make an approximation error
16:11if they believe that the central battle of that fight
16:14is the province of Buenos Aires.
16:15There is only one battle in that fight right now.
16:17The one of the province of Buenos Aires is also there.
16:19It is the city.
16:20The city is the battle of definition of what officialism is going to be.
16:23Of course.
16:24Not that it is going to be in activity.
16:26How is officialism going to be formed from the month of October?
16:30Let's see if I'm lucky with you,
16:32because the one that threw me out,
16:34not like the penalty, what is it called?
16:36The one that kicked to the sky.
16:37Cancini.
16:38There it is.
16:39Who is going to be the candidate in the city of Buenos Aires,
16:41of Libertad Avanza?
16:43The senator?
16:45Ah, in Libertad Avanza?
16:47I thought you were talking about the pro.
16:48No.
16:50Is it true that there is a colleague of ours who would have accepted?
16:54I was listening to you.
16:56They told me that Iván de Pineda did not accept.
16:58Iván de Pineda is a smart guy, brilliant, great guy,
17:03and he is not interested in politics.
17:04But they told me that there is another colleague who said,
17:06I'm going.
17:07I know several colleagues who have been tempted for different positions.
17:11No.
17:12Not for that one.
17:13Take a joke.
17:14Names.
17:15No, no, no.
17:16No, because there are people who said no.
17:18Ah, there are people who said no.
17:19There are people who said no.
17:20I know one or two who came to the Casa Rosada office
17:27under the title of, well, look, this is what I have to offer you in the city of Buenos Aires.
17:31They are lawyers.
17:32There are people who have measured.
17:33That is, look how well they measure.
17:35Iván was measured.
17:36Yes.
17:37A lady was measured who works in the media and said no.
17:41And they told me, there is someone who knows.
17:43I don't want to anticipate.
17:45Stop.
17:46No.
17:47No.
17:48No.
17:49Iván.