In this edition, we look at how Ursula von der Leyen gained approval for a second term in office by the narrowest of majorities, and dissect Hungary's child protection act.
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00:00Hello there and welcome to Brussels My Love, Euronews' weekly chat show on European politics.
00:18I'm Maeve McMahon and this week we're broadcasting from Strasbourg where MEPs met for their monthly
00:24voting session. Coming up, after weeks of gruelling hearings, the brand new European
00:30Commission took centre stage in Strasbourg this week. Now that they're approved, the
00:3426 commissioners will work a bit like ministers in a national government, reporting to their
00:39boss, Commission President Ursula von der Leyen. As incoming US President, Donald Trump
00:44gets ready to deregulate, cut taxes and fire officials. We're asking how Brussels will
00:50keep up. And it's been described as the largest human rights case in EU history. The Hungarian
00:57government is in Luxembourg this month at Europe's top court, defending a law that it
01:01says protects children, but which in reality seems to collide with core European values
01:07by heavily restricting or even forbidding the portrayal of gay and transgender people.
01:1216 EU countries have joined the commission in opposing Budapest. MEPs looked at the situation
01:19for the LGBTQ plus community in Hungary this week and beyond. A warm welcome to our guests,
01:24Thomas Thobbe, Swedish MEP from the European People's Party. Thank you, it's a pleasure to
01:28be here. Wonderful to have you. Ciara Peterhansen, Danish MEP from the Green Party. Welcome. Thank
01:34you. And Raquel GarcÃa Hermida Vandervalle, Dutch-Spanish MEP from the Renew Europe. So
01:39lovely to have you with us. But before, as always, we hear your thoughts. Let's just
01:43get some more context on the main announcement from Strasbourg this week.
01:49Half a year after the European election and two months before Donald Trump takes over,
01:58the new European Commission is ready to roll, finally.
02:07After a lot of drama and intense negotiations to unblock all pending nominations,
02:12the European Parliament confirmed Ursula von der Leyen's team this week.
02:20This was made possible by a sort of coalition agreement between the centrist parties EPP,
02:27S&D and Renew, who had patched up the differences and swallowed the remaining bitter pills.
02:37Notably excluded from this deal were the Greens, which is testament to the recent
02:41shift in Europe's political landscape from central left to central right.
02:50The big question now is, will the new commission's policies cater to the new reality
02:55and become more conservative?
03:02So there you have them, the brand new faces of Brussels, if you like.
03:06Raquel, what has been your reaction to this new commission?
03:09I'm happy that we have a commission. I'm happy that we have a coalition
03:13agreement that was one of the main points for Renew. And I'm mostly happy that we can get to
03:18work because we saw that Donald Trump was already packing his presumably golden plated
03:24moving boxes to get into the White House. And we were still fighting here.
03:28That's a crucial point. It's time to get to work. And we heard from Ursula von der Leyen today
03:32saying the transition period is over and the first 100 days will be crucial.
03:36Thomas Stewart, though, it's worth pointing out that just 370 MEPs voted in favour of this
03:42commission. So very low compared to the support she got back in the summer with over 400 votes.
03:47I mean, it basically reflects, of course, that we see a gaining support for populists,
03:53both to the right and to the left. And of course, they will in a way never be in favour of the
03:59commission. And of course, that is a challenge that we have in the European Parliament. But I
04:03think the most important thing is that we actually were able to deliver. And I must say, I think for
04:10anyone looking at European policy, we had election five months ago. I think citizens expect
04:17get to work. Well, that's funny, because today the European Parliament's earlier this week,
04:20the European Parliament President Metzola was saying how we're on time, you know,
04:24compared to 2019, we'll be able to start on the 1st of December with this new commission.
04:28But for our viewers, they're thinking it's been taking so long. But it's been interesting for you
04:33as a member of the Green Party. You were quite divided on whether to support this new commission
04:39or not. Which way did you go in the end? I voted in favour. And I think it's also important to note
04:43that none of the groups voted unanimously except for the hard right and the hard left.
04:49But yes, for us, it was important to show that there is a stable majority,
04:53especially to our colleagues in EPP, that we can make it work with a centrist
04:59Green to EPP majority. We see it's not stable without us because clearly the deal has been
05:04broken. There weren't enough support among the three groups. So for us, it's about influencing
05:09the policies. We experienced we can do that with van der Leyen. And I think looking at the political
05:13guidelines, it goes towards the Green, less towards the extreme right. So that's why...
05:17Is there a lot of infighting now in your party?
05:20No, I wouldn't say so. I think we're united at the fact that we don't want to see the Italian
05:25extremists in this commission as an executive VP. And then we disagree on how do we best ensure
05:32political influence, but also keeping out the far right and pulling EPP closer to the centre again.
05:37Well, President van der Leyen stressed in her speech that the transition period was over and
05:41the first hundred days of office would be crucial because after weeks of political limbo and concerns
05:47from many MEPs over the inclusion of far right commissioners, she tried to put their worries to
05:51bed. Take a listen. Overcoming divisions and forging compromises is the hallmark of a vivid
05:58democracy. And my message today is we want to work with you in that spirit. And as I said before
06:06the vote in July, we will work with all democratic pro-European forces in this house. And as I've
06:15done in my first mandate, I will always work from the centre because we all want the best for
06:23Europeans and we all want the best for Europe and it is time to come together. So President van der
06:30Leyen, they're stressing how she would work with the centre, but does the parliament still have a
06:34centre, Raquel? Yes, we still have a centre and we have shown that we can come together and
06:40work from content, from ideas, from our programmes, listening to one another, to what is important
06:45for us. And for us, it was really important to have agreements on paper. We got that. We're very
06:51happy with the content. We're happy that we are respecting the Green Deal. We're happy that we're
06:56going to be working towards European defence. We're happy that we're going to be working towards
07:01respecting rule of law. There are very important things in there and I fully agree with the
07:05colleague from the Greens. It's very important that we have a majority which can be a bit flexible
07:11with progressive forces, but I also think that we have to hold each other accountable and I trust
07:16the colleagues from the EPP that they will respect the agreements. Kira, we heard Raquel
07:21mention the Green Deal there. We didn't really hear it as a top priority. The three top priorities
07:26from Ursula von der Leyen were security, democracy, prosperity. Green Deal really gone down
07:33on the priority list. Yeah, and I think that's a shame because we still have a climate crisis and we
07:38see floods and heating over in Europe. I think it's a reflection of the reality we're facing in
07:45different member states. In my own, climate was still the number one for the European elections
07:49but clearly it wasn't in other countries and I think we as politicians responsible also for how
07:54we're handling the climate crisis have a responsibility to show that this is still
07:58something we need to do. I feel however though she is still thinking about the climate. Now we don't
08:04call it a Green Deal but a Clean Deal. For me it's less important what we call it as long as we see
08:09the actions. Has green become a bit of a dirty word and just on that note as well on the green
08:13we saw she has appointed Philippe Lambert, the very outspoken former head of the Greens,
08:19co-chair of the Greens. She has appointed him as her special advisor. So yes there is still
08:24inklings there that she wants to keep this Green Deal or Clean Deal alive. But looking at you as
08:29an EPP member with competitiveness right up there with the priorities alongside security and
08:36democracy, how do you strike that balance? No but I think it's very important to understand that
08:42for us we feel a big responsibility. We were the big winners of this election. I'm trying to be
08:48humble but that's the fact and of course it is a responsibility for us now to build constructive
08:53majorities. But to be serious if you're going to build constructive majorities in this parliament
08:59you also need ECR. We just had all the commissioners designate. If they were supposed
09:04to be approved they also needed ECR support and that is what I think is kind of lacking in when
09:10you comment on this because we cannot think that you know they don't exist here. They are here in
09:17the European Parliament. People have voted for them. Some of them are of course impossible to work with
09:23but they are also constructive MEPs. So for EPP it is important to keep the pro-European forces
09:31together but of course also we need to tackle the challenges that we have. Security but with climate
09:37of course we also need to think about how is this affecting people, how can we have more economic
09:42growth. I mean all those issues are important. And the issues on voters minds if you look this week
09:47you know we've had elections in Romania last week, there's elections in Ireland this week,
09:51cost of living crisis, housing crisis, migration. These are the issues on people's minds. But take
09:56the energy transition. It's directly linked to cost of living but not in the way that it's
10:02sometimes presented by the right, particularly the extreme right. We see that as an opportunity
10:08to reduce our energy bills and we have seen many examples of when you transition to green and clean
10:15energy then the energy costs go down and it improves our geopolitical situation in the world.
10:22We're not dependent of Putin. We're not dependent of other autocrats or wannabe autocrats. So it's
10:27really important that we also speak to voters as the intelligent people they are and we make it very
10:32clear you can present everything in terms of costs but you can also present it in terms of
10:38opportunities and also the future of the planet as we want it to be and not as something which just
10:44happens to us. But it is also important what kind of decision politicians actually make. I mean
10:50Germany is not here and they cannot defend themselves. But seriously of course
10:54the German decision to be so dependent on Russia we can agree on that but I would also argue to
10:59take away nuclear was of course a bad decision because they were thinking let's go for renewables
11:04which we have to of course invest in but it became renewable and coal. I mean we have to also take
11:12responsibility for what our policies have meant and some of the policies have not been working
11:17in Europe and that is what we see. That is the rise of the populist to the left and to the right.
11:22And do we have that sense of urgency Kira then around here instead of just oohing and
11:25awing and all the things happening the reality on the ground in many member states where a lot
11:29of people are voting for non-traditional for example if you look at Romania in the presidential
11:34elections Georgiou who's very anti the European Union very pro-Russia he came out on top.
11:41Yeah and I think that's also due to the the polarism and the populism we see in general. I
11:46think also the media plays a big role here because of course if you are in your own little echo
11:51corner on social media and you see one reality be it it's only Trump or it's only Harris we have a
11:57different like we don't have a collective conversation about whether we want this country
12:01or the EU to go as I think that's also hampering the democracy that we see in some of these member
12:06states. And I think what we are then lacking here also I agree with much of what you're saying that
12:12when we're discussing for example Russian energy dependence we all know we're not doing it well
12:17enough like our sanctions aren't working functionally our energy dependency is still high
12:22we still send a lot of money for energy to Russia so we still have a lot of urgency there if we
12:28actually want Ukraine to win and also secure the dependency from Russia. And also let's maybe look
12:33at what we can do with what we know we have as we knew we have asked to look very carefully into
12:40possible influence from Russia in the Romanian elections because what happened was really
12:45strange and it was very much fueled by TikTok so we really want to go to the bottom of this
12:53and try to see if there are foreign powers at this moment already interfering with our election
12:59results. And then I think if I can may add of course we as politicians and I would also call
13:05myself a center politician have a responsibility because if you feel that the green transition
13:11are going too fast or you're losing your jobs and there is not a social security network to support
13:16you we don't invest in the skills. Of course people turn to someone who can promise them
13:20something else be it to the extreme left or the extreme right so there we also have a common
13:25responsibility among the democratic parties to also ensure that the policies we're making here
13:30also have a positive impact. And that's what people need at the end of the day and we saw as
13:34well this week Ursula von der Leyen stressing that to have action we need unity but of course we
13:39don't have a whole lot of unity but just as you can imagine there's been lots of reactions
13:43coming out all week to this new commission and one that stood out was the tweet by
13:47Stefano Malia from the European Economic and Social Committee which said political declarations
13:53alone are not enough over the past few years we've been misled by political slogans and declarations
13:58often accompanied by flashy headlines for supposedly new initiatives but what we're
14:03missing is concrete actionable roadmap to guide our efforts. So just to translate some into the
14:09substance that we might see now coming out of this commission while of course as you mentioned
14:13earlier Donald Trump is preparing to appoint Elon Musk in charge of his efficiency department.
14:20I think in any case it's very concerning that there is obviously a conflict of interest
14:26between someone with extremely big interest in the private sector in deregulation that that
14:31person is put at the head of a department any department anywhere in the world in this case
14:36in the United States so even more impactful for the rest of the world but I also
14:44think that we have to look at that roadmap and that plan for the future and what I just said
14:50be very clear about that I was really happy to hear von der Leyen speaking this morning about
14:56the capital markets union and that seems very technical but it's very simple it's something
15:01that will allow our businesses startups also small businesses to thrive and grow within the European
15:09Union and not be pushed away by American businesses or Chinese businesses. And that's precisely what
15:15Mr Melillo was referring to Stefano also he was saying you know we want a more business
15:20friendly environment in Europe we want to see a red tape cut but just Thomas when it comes to
15:25dealing with Donald Trump should Ursula von der Leyen jump on a plane and head over to Palm Beach
15:30just like the head of NATO did last week Margarita? I think it is extremely important that we try to
15:36keep a good relation with the US and with this new administration for sure there are going to
15:41mean a lot of challenges for us it's clear because one thing we know about Trump he actually does what
15:47he says so we need to prepare for that but I mean for us we also have to draw some own conclusions
15:54and I think one of the conclusion is of course we have to take responsibility for our own faith
16:00you know we cannot be so dependent on US for example on security issues and when it comes to
16:06the business environment of course we have over-regulated in Europe that has been our model
16:12I mean what we basically need is some kind of revolution you know in the commission
16:16you know we have a machine of 30,000 people that need to think differently. But Kira that's probably
16:21a problem for you because if we deregulate we're rolling back then on the legislation that we had
16:26put in place in order to reach our goals. Well I think what is important is that we assess why do
16:31we have different legislations like why do we have consumer protection we have that because we want
16:37our consumers to be able to buy the products and I'm not saying you want to get rid of consumer
16:41protection but that's a bit the thing when we are saying or Ursula von der Leyen is saying we need
16:45to cut 25 percent of bureaucracy or we need to every time we introduce one legislation take two
16:51legislations out but you don't go into discussing what concrete legislation because we don't want
16:57to get back to the financial crisis where all the banks failed or get rid of consumer protection
17:02or environment. And it's the consumers we will pay the price if we see this favorite word of
17:06Donald Trump tariff being used. It will have enormous consequences for our economy but
17:12something which we can control and it doesn't depend on the United States. Look at the deforestation
17:16law. The most consumers in Europe they don't want to go into supermarkets and have their products
17:22being produced at the cost of jungle and forests all around the world. And I think it's important
17:30that we keep those pieces of legislation which were very good initially and are still very good
17:36that we keep them as whole as possible because it's something that ends will help biodiversity
17:43and will help climate and will help consumers and will help our businesses because there were a lot
17:49of businesses who were very much against modifying the deforestation law in the Netherlands. It was
17:56all over the place. Big businesses including supermarkets including food industries they were
18:01against modifying it because they had already made changes they had already adapted. And then
18:06it was a confusing signal then for the commission to delay it. But I guess one concern as well for
18:10the previous commission has been really they've been in crisis mode when with Brexit, Covid,
18:16the energy crisis and the full-scale invasion of Ukraine by Russia. So all eyes now on this brand
18:23new team. We've seen pictures of them earlier and we wanted to find out from one expert Ricardo
18:28Borges de Castro from the College of Europe if there be any shining stars. Take a listen to his
18:33thoughts. There's no really a big hitter in the College of Commissioners. OK. You have Mrs. Calas
18:39Mrs. Ribera. I think Piotr Serafin could be a surprise. But you really don't have any big
18:44hitters. So in a sense it's going to be sort of if I can use this expression a domesticated
18:49commission. She's going to be in full control of the college having sidelined all the opposition
18:55all of the dissenting voices that she had in a previous in a previous college. So I think
18:59very much Mrs. von der Leyen is going to be the boss. Sometimes we talk about winners and losers
19:04in this type of situations. Mrs. von der Leyen and the EPP are clearly winners in you know of
19:10the past couple of weeks. So I think she she starts her position or she starts her commission
19:16with a strengthened position. So I believe that at the start the commission is actually not weakened.
19:21I think it is actually strengthened. So that is the take from Ricardo Borges de Castro from the
19:26College of Europe basically saying that Ursula von der Leyen will be the boss. She does have
19:30her fingerprints pretty much on everything and she's known for being quite controlling
19:34inside the commission. What is your take as a member of her party. But I mean seriously this
19:39is a result of elections elections in member states elections at the European level. So I'm
19:45talking about her management style her management style. Well I must say you know I think Ursula
19:51von der Leyen has two things that make her a great leader. Firstly she actually has an idea
19:58and sometimes she even says things before others that are not popular. When she said I think Ukraine
20:04actually should join the European Union. Not many even in this house were in favor of that then.
20:10When she acted during the pandemic for example. So she can show leadership. But then of course
20:17she is rather tough. And I mean I want that. I want a leader in Europe to be tough because we
20:23need that. And we need a commission that actually works. And I think she's been very clear what she
20:28expects from the commissioners. Would you agree with that Kira. I would know. No but I think
20:35clearly also compared to Jean-Claude Juncker like she's a much more competent and stronger leader.
20:41I think there's no doubt there. And I think some of the criticism is also gendered a little bit
20:46that she's working too much sleeping in her office too bossy or whatever. And I think however she's
20:52not as strong now as she were in July. She lost quite a lot in this in the election of the
20:57commission. And she's also the commission now with that with the least best result of all the
21:02commissions in past time. So she's she's been weakened a little bit today I would say because
21:06she didn't look to the center but couldn't really figure out or EPP didn't. I think actually she
21:11wanted but part of your group wanted to look other ways. So she will have a hard time. I think
21:16she will have a hard time. And interestingly we didn't even get to mention the outgoing
21:21European commissioners who've been all taking to social media this week showing images of them
21:25packing up their boxes and reminding their voters and Europeans what they've been up to. So we bid
21:30them the best for their future and best of luck. They are the incoming commission. But for now we
21:35can close this conversation for more on the portfolios of all those commissioners. Do take
21:40a look at Euronews.com. Meanwhile stay tuned to Euronews. We will be back very soon to tell you
21:46about a tense battle between the Hungarian government and many EU governments about gay
21:51and trans rights. See you soon.
22:00Welcome back to Brussels my love. Euronews weekly chat show with me Maeve McMahon coming to you from
22:06the European Parliament in Strasbourg where MEPs gathered to discuss among other things this. The
22:13Hungarian government under scrutiny in the European Court of Justice over the Child Protection Act
22:18that was enshrined into law back in 21. According to the commission the law is a massive violation
22:24of EU rules but Budapest says it aspires to stop paedophiles. But EU treaty experts and 16
22:30governments say it stigmatises LGBTQI plus people by putting same-sex couples and paedophiles in the
22:36same bracket. The law bans gay people from featuring in school education materials and on
22:41TV shows for under 18. So this court case seems like a really big deal especially given so many
22:47member states have joined the commission in the ruling. What are your thoughts on it Raquel?
22:50It's the biggest fundamental one of the biggest fundamental rights court cases up to date and it's
22:55very nice to see that the commission and member states are joining forces and that's what we have
22:59also seen in the European Parliament in a recent debate about this that the EPP, Renew, S&D, Greens,
23:06the left joining forces and the most horrible things being said in plenary by the extreme
23:13right including ECR. The Italian ECR members made horrible statements. It was really difficult to
23:21hear and that's why I want to call on the responsibility again of our colleagues from
23:25the EPP to be very clear about fundamental rights in our coalition agreement moving forward.
23:30And it's an interesting point because often it's finger pointing between Budapest and Brussels i.e.
23:34the commission but here this ruling it has the backing of 16 member states as well.
23:38Yeah this is an awful law that we have and and what I think is more worrying is that we actually
23:45see a backlash now. We see this is not only in Hungary now we see this in more countries in
23:51Europe happening and you know what need to understand this for Viktor Orban. He was once
23:58a liberal politician. He knows. He was in your party. Even in my party but I have to say I was
24:06very successful of kicking me out of my party though. You were responsible for that. But seriously
24:10they think like this. They can win election by targeting trans people, targeting gay people.
24:17It is a way for them to win election and it's really disgusting and for us I think as a union
24:22we need to stand up for our values because we are more than just the internal market and free trade.
24:28We are also a union of values. Well as I said it was back in 2021 when this law was passed and
24:35Prime Minister Viktor Orban back then said it was his way of protecting children from harmful content.
24:41He also insisted that he defended the rights of homosexuals but that this law was about parents
24:45deciding what kind of sexual education their children should be given care. That's the response
24:50from Viktor Orban. Yeah and I think it's a it's a very good propaganda camp but clearly the
24:56the actions on the ground speak louder than what Viktor Orban is saying. This is a way to
25:01make stereotypes say that all LGBTI people are pedophiles to take back the rights that we've
25:08gained over generations. As you're saying this is a backlash. We see it not only in Hungary
25:12but in Italy, Romania and the US. We see the backlashes on women and LGBTI people
25:18and I think it's very worrying and where it becomes tricky from the EU side is now we have
25:23a rule of law mechanism but it's not a rule of law mechanism we can use when countries are clearly
25:28breaching our values. It's when they're breaching they're misusing the funds or being corrupt or
25:34whatever. So we need to find a way where we say this is not only as you said Thomas an internal
25:39market this is also a political union with common values. If you don't like that you're happy to
25:44you're welcome to leave but you need to abide by the rules that we all follow. Well it's interesting
25:48because the 16 member states I mentioned they're mostly kind of central or like Nordic countries
25:54very few in the east because of course in the debate this week in Strasbourg Bulgaria was also
25:58mentioned for their new law that they adopted in in August. Yes and that's that's a law to the
26:04example of the Hungarian law and we're seeing the same movements like you said also in in Georgia
26:10in America this is a this is an international well-organized very well-funded movement which
26:16we are now seeing in action here in the European Union and I fully agree the current mechanisms
26:21that we have are either working too slowly or not working at all because you know we will wait we
26:27will have to wait four and a half years before we know what the court rules on the Hungary case
26:32who knows about Bulgaria. So what we propose is C66 as we knew is make sure that you apply
26:39conditionality which Ursula von der Leyen mentioned explicitly this morning in a much faster way that
26:45we are much more able to act swiftly so that these abuses are going to be stopped in their tracks
26:52immediately. And one organization NGO in Brussels who's been following this case very well
26:57is Reclaim. To get their take we caught up with Esther Martinez. Take a listen. We are seeing the
27:03anti-gender movement being very active in the European Union organically because there are
27:10reactionary forces in the European Union that already exist but also because Putin has a
27:16destabilization campaign that escapes goats, LGTBQ people to destabilize the European Union
27:24at its member states. So basically what we are seeing now is that these groups are more active
27:30and more successful than they previously were and we are seeing beetles such as the Hungarian one
27:37being replicated across the European Union. With Trump coming in the new administration we think
27:42that this is only going to get worse. Esther Martinez there expressing her concern for gay
27:47communities and of course transgender people. There's massive debates all across Europe
27:52regarding the rights of transgender care. We saw it as well you mentioned Donald Trump.
27:58For us this is really about having the discussion what is the European Union and for me the European
28:06Union is something to be proud of. You know we protect minorities, we protect people's lives.
28:12Of course we can have some political differences but this is another Europe that they are pushing
28:17for and we have to stop it. And what about your group? Would everyone agree with you?
28:21A clear majority. Not everyone of course but I mean EPP we have been pushing this agenda and of
28:29course I mean as a Swede I mean of course we perhaps are one of the more progressive delegations
28:35within EPP on this matter but I'm not worried about my group at all I would say on this issue.
28:41I'm more worried about how these actors are using social media and to cause an opinion
28:51against people that keep pressuring us and we see election results that are quite worrying.
28:57I think that we have to look at social issues more broadly than we might do or might have done
29:03up until now in the sense that being able and free to be who you are it will increase your
29:10mental health. It will allow you to thrive. It will allow you to work. So social issues are not
29:16isolated. They are intertwined with everything that we do as European Union. I fully agree with
29:22the colleague. We have to look at this from a perspective of values. And on that point we can
29:27conclude this conversation. Thank you so much to our guests for being with us and as you said
29:31Raquel a ruling will be next year so we'll keep you posted on that. Thank you so much
29:35for watching. Stay with us here on Euronews.
29:46Hello there. You're watching Brussels my love. Your weekly update on European news. I'm Maeve McMahan broadcasting from Strasbourg where I'm joined by Thomas Tobi Swedish MEP with the European People's Party.
29:57Kira Peter Hansen Danish MEP from the Greens and Raquel GarcÃa Hermida van der Valle Dutch Spanish MEP from Renew Europe.
30:05Now this week EU buildings were lit up in orange to mark the International Day for the Elimination of Violence Against Women.
30:12MEPs here also joined a 16 days of activism campaign to fight for the elimination of gender
30:17based violence. And on the back of this concerning conversation another debate was held here in
30:22Strasbourg and that was about the gender pay gap in the European Union which in 2024 still looks far
30:29from being fixed. According to data from the European Commission the pay gap in the EU is still
30:34at 13 percent which means women would have to work almost two months more than men to make up
30:39that difference. Women on average earn 87 cents for every one euro earned by a man and the gap
30:45decreased only by 2.8 percent in 10 years. So that's a lot of data to digest. It's not breaking
30:51news because I feel like we have this conversation every year at the same time when this social
30:56media campaign goes viral highlighting how women were now working for free. Why is this still the
31:01case Raquel? I think it has to do with structural issues so how we are have arranged the way that
31:07we work but also with cultural issues and girls and I'm a mother of three three daughters so
31:13so girls are also taught to be less assertive to be to be nice to be kind to be not too outspoken
31:22and I think that works through the rest of your life in the way that you approach a negotiation
31:26for example. So cultural issues but of course companies have the responsibility as well we'll
31:30get to that later. But Kira as a female MEP here have you seen a lot of women face major inequalities
31:36when it comes to accessing progression or rewards or? Well I was actually the rapporteur on the
31:42on the gender pay transparency director in the last term so I spoke with a lot of women who
31:48experienced discrimination on the basis of their gender and I think the causes are both like cultural
31:54stereotypes what do we expect from women it's also an under evaluation politically of how do we see
32:01a nurse's working conditions versus a mechanic's working conditions that create the gender pay gap
32:07across sectors and a gender segregated market and then especially now I'm quite young but
32:13my mom's generation they've then had a pay difference in the beginning of their career
32:18that became bigger and bigger and bigger and then in the end now we see the pensions are much lower
32:23than their male counterparts so I think now we can hopefully fix it for your daughters Raquel but
32:29I thank you, I thank you. Let's not have this same conversation in 10, 20 years.
32:36And let's bring in another take from a gender pay gap expert who is the head of The Nine which is a
32:43women's social club over in Brussels we can take a listen to Georgia Brooks. It is difficult
32:48for countries individually and therefore the EU as a whole to come in with a concrete set of plans
32:56and I say this because we are looking at recommendations, we're looking at action plans
33:02and the advice is solid and there I think we are seeing that there's so much room for
33:09interpretation that at a country-wide level companies because it really is companies have a
33:16lot of free reign so there are some companies that do this because they believe in gender equality
33:21they believe in paying women a fair wage and then others that don't and then if you have no
33:27penalties and there's no enforcement ask yourself what is the incentive. So that's Georgia Brooks
33:33there an advocate for gender equality. Thomas we bring you in now of course and she talks about
33:38the need for penalties enforcement of companies as Kira said we do now have this directive that
33:43came in last year it needs of course to be implemented but will this be a game changer
33:48do you think? I don't know to be honest I think I mean this is a big political failure because also
33:55many women actually work in the public sector something that actually we as politicians have
34:01quite much control over and still you can see that the salaries are lower because it's dominated by
34:08women so I think that perhaps could be the most important step to take you know raise the salaries
34:16also in the public sector for women working in health care many are teachers and so on and of
34:22course we want more men to be teachers as well but I mean I see this there is another evaluation
34:29of the work that the women do and we have to recognize this then of course you know as a
34:34swede we have another way to regulate our labor markets you know I don't like EU regulation on
34:40this but I mean I fully share you know I'm worried about this I have a daughter myself
34:45I want her to have the same possibility as my son has and I fully agree also that I mean I really
34:53try when I became a parent you know I'm gonna treat them in the same way I'm gonna empower
34:58empowerment them as much as I can but I don't know if I succeed you know because they need
35:03something in society and things change you know it's really tricky. Should we start publishing
35:08salaries? I think we should they have it in Norway so now we're the full range of Scandinavians
35:15and in the pay transparency directive we will also have to publish at least the pay gap
35:19but we see collective agreements are the keys to closing the gender pay gap and transparencies and
35:25then adding on to what you said Thomas one of the issues is also that a lot of women are working
35:29part-time because you don't have daycare institutions that are functioning well enough
35:33it's maybe too expensive families can't afford it you have also tax systems where you tax the
35:38household and not the individual person so there are a lot of economical structures as well that
35:44are keeping women outside of the labor market or making sure they only work part-time which
35:49of course affects the salaries. And the situation in the United States is even worse I saw this week
35:54Disney had to pay millions in a in a lawsuit case because they were clearly paying a woman much less
36:00than a man for the exact same job but in Luxembourg it's a good situation I believe it's the only EU
36:05country Raquel where women are earning slightly more than men. Yes and that might have to do with
36:10the sectors in which women are employed but also good policies and like Kira said
36:17and I concur and I said in the beginning it's about making sure that women don't develop
36:22that pay gap at the beginning of their careers and especially when they choose to form a family
36:28to become mothers because we do see that because women tend to work in lower paying sectors when
36:34it comes to a choice between two partners a man and a woman in this case to decide who's going to
36:40maybe work less it's easier economically for the woman to do that because she already
36:47earns less so we have to make sure that we balance that out with good daycare and
36:53with good facilities and ensuring that from the get-go that we don't have those gaps appearing.
37:00Okay well on that conclusion we can bring this conversation to an end thank you so much to our
37:04guests Raquel for being with us Kira and also Thomas Lloyd thank you so much for being with us
37:09and thank you for watching any comment or any reaction to anything you've heard please reach
37:15out our email address is brusselsmyloveaturinews.com you can also send us a direct message
37:21on social media and we will get back to you thanks so much for watching see you soon on Euronews.