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00:00We have Whitney Cummings, the host of Good For You.
00:03We have Jenna Ushkowitz, the host of And That's What You Really Missed.
00:07We have Jesse Tyler Ferguson, host of Dinners On Me with Jesse Tyler Ferguson.
00:11We have Lamor- oh, I'm so sorry, I mispronounced it.
00:14It's Emmy winner Lamorne Morris from The Mess Around and The Lamorning After.
00:19And then, of course, Eliza Schlesinger, Ask Eliza Anything.
00:23Yeah, you guys, we're comedians. We're going to need way more jobs than this.
00:29And they've got mics.
00:30Emmy, Emmy.
00:31Wait, are you-
00:32It's okay.
00:33It's like a PTA brunch. That's what this feels like.
00:35Are you actually welcoming heckling because I didn't know that was something that-
00:38Yes, Crowdwork Clips is the only business left.
00:43Well, thank you all so much for being here and for keeping me so entertained on car rides.
00:47I would love to start at the beginning because you all launched podcasts in addition to, you know, having very busy day jobs.
00:55What was sort of the impetus to start one and how did the initial idea come about and how has it sort of evolved from that idea to what it is now?
01:02Because, Jenna, I believe you kind of had something different in mind originally, but the fan demand changed it.
01:07Yeah, so we started with One Network, Kevin McHale and I, and it was after Glee had finished and we had wrapped the whole series.
01:16And we decided we just loved working with each other.
01:19So we thought we would do like a friend-work-wife kind of podcast where you bring in people who love to work with each other.
01:26And then the fans were just so rambunctious and relentless about wanting to hear Glee stories and Glee experiences.
01:35And so we ended up actually just dissolving the first idea of the podcast and creating a Glee recap podcast instead.
01:43Wow. It's literally you gave the people what they want.
01:46I mean, you have to. They're the ones who are, you know, listening every week.
01:50So it felt. Yeah, we couldn't avoid it.
01:54Whitney, for you. Oh, sorry. Sorry.
01:57Hi. You know, a couple of things, you know, I mean, I think that, you know, Eliza can speak to this, too.
02:02We're touring comedians, you know, and, you know, connecting with our fans and having an emotional connection to them is a really big part of selling tickets, engaging with them.
02:11Literally, some people think they're engaged to us, you know, but it's a really big part.
02:16Thank God for restraining orders.
02:18So it's like, you know, getting someone to buy a ticket these days. There's so many options for entertainment.
02:22A lot of it is free to get someone out of their house to come spend, you know, whether it's, you know, 50, 80 dollars a ticket and pay for babysitters and parking and, you know, drinks.
02:31And, you know, it could be 300 dollars at the end of the day. So people really, I think, expect a very intimate connection with the person that they're going to see.
02:38I sleep with every audience member after the show. I'm kidding.
02:41I've been to a lot of her shows.
02:47And because there's also so many people touring right now, you know, influencers and podcasters and stuff.
02:52So, you know, to get someone out of their house, they really want to have a personal connection with you.
02:56So I think that's been a big part of it.
02:58Also, you know, the TV and movie business started changing a little bit.
03:01And, you know, comedians, I won't speak for everybody here, comedic actors, you know, it's look, we want to be on TV.
03:07So we want to get cast. We want to be in movies.
03:09But we're always, you know, like a little loud, a little too tall.
03:12I mean, I'm taller than every actor in Hollywood.
03:14Like, you know, there's certain jobs I'm just never going to get when they come up to here.
03:18So I think we're always looking for a kind of backup plan to feel like we have some kind of power, some kind of agency, you know, and creators like, you know, whatever happened in our childhood to make us, you know, want to make drunk people laugh at night.
03:33You know, the same thing is, you know, even if you're on a show and you're working, you know, six months out of the year, that's another six months where you still want to create.
03:40You still want to connect with people.
03:41The need for attention never goes away.
03:43You know, so I think us having that opportunity to do that and connect with our fans as well as a movement towards at least having some of our content be owned by ourselves.
03:53Yeah.
03:54You know, and we can talk about that more a little bit later.
03:56But wanted to experiment with that.
03:58Eliza, is it similar for you being a Tariq?
04:00I have no idea what she's talking about.
04:03I started podcasting, I want to say 2015, and it was to work on my interview skills.
04:08I so badly like a lot of comedians wanted my own show.
04:11And, you know, you get a couple cracks at that.
04:13But there is a real in its infancy podcasting was about those interviews.
04:17And there were so many bad interviewers.
04:19And I would watch these podcasts and I would be like, well, there is an art to that.
04:22Like, it is its own skill.
04:24And so I did that.
04:25You know, you invite your friends on.
04:26Joe Rogan was one of my first graciously one of my first guests.
04:30And then over time, I love doing it because it's another avenue to perform.
04:35It's another way to be funny.
04:36It's not the same as being on the stage.
04:38And for my podcast, I came up against how difficult it is to consistently book quality guests.
04:43Because it is such a saturated market, we make the listener, the guest on my podcast,
04:48so people write in for advice.
04:49And so now it's another way, similar to what Whitney was saying,
04:52in that it's another way for your fans to have access to you and see you in a different light.
04:57Because you are so many things to so many people.
04:59So you can be sincere.
05:00You don't have to have a punchline a minute.
05:02You can get into topics.
05:03You can really, it's an open format, talk about whatever you want.
05:06And for anyone that you might lose, maybe you get them with the stand-up.
05:10So it's about casting a wide net, but doing it with quality versus just quantity.
05:15And so, at least for us, on our podcast, we don't do guests as much
05:19because I wanted it to be this curated experience where people get a distilled version of me in a more intimate way.
05:26And you create those bonds.
05:27And these things matter to people because they listen to you during COVID.
05:30They listen to you when they're going through having a bad day and they come up to you after shows
05:34and they say things like, I went through a terrible depression.
05:37I lost my dad.
05:38I watched your special.
05:39I watched your show.
05:40And it's never lost on me as a performer that people spend time with you,
05:46even when you think that you don't matter.
05:48And so podcasting reaches all those people.
05:50And that's why I do it.
05:51I mean, it's so challenging, I would think, to do one.
05:53Lamorne, you're doing two?
05:55Two.
05:56Two.
05:57Overachiever.
05:58Life of an Emmy winner.
06:00It's crazy.
06:03No lies detected.
06:05Why are you up here with us?
06:07Every once in a while I've got to look back and reach back to the community.
06:12He actually booked this before he won.
06:14And I'm kind of losing respect for you that you didn't cancel.
06:18No, I have two.
06:23One was very similar to Glee.
06:28It's New Girl.
06:29New Girl was a very popular show.
06:31And we would get asked the same questions over and over and over again.
06:35You'd be out in the street.
06:37People want to know different things.
06:38Hey, did this really happen on this episode?
06:41And half the time I don't know what the fuck they're talking about.
06:44Because I'm like, I forgot.
06:46There's so many episodes.
06:47And so myself, Hannah, Simone, and Zoe, they should know,
06:51we decided to put together.
06:52The first edition of our podcast where we honestly just answered questions
06:56and we recapped episodes.
06:57And it was cool to do just because, you know,
07:00you do a show for so long and you're kind of in it while you're filming.
07:04And you don't get a chance to actually engage with fans on a regular basis.
07:09And that's something I thoroughly enjoy doing.
07:11It's so hard to get into this business that now that I'm in it,
07:17I don't want to be out of it.
07:19And so I do enjoy the process of engaging with fans on a high level just because,
07:26like you said, that's who keeps me where I am.
07:30You know what I mean?
07:31That's the audience.
07:32Those are the people that to a certain degree I cater to.
07:35And so the fans were asking for a new girl podcast,
07:38and that's what we gave them.
07:41And I have another podcast called The Morning After with my buddy.
07:46It still cracks you up, huh?
07:47Yeah, it does because it's ridiculous.
07:51But that one, this one was built out of not boredom,
07:56but my buddy and I, a writing partner, we joke around a lot.
08:01We fuck around all the time.
08:03The types of conversations that we have are so stupid.
08:07And so we wanted to make a show that had nothing to do with anything.
08:12So we'll invite a guest on that might have a movie coming out,
08:15but we don't talk about that shit at all.
08:17You know what I mean?
08:18We just want the fans to see a different side of who they are
08:23because we've all done press junkets before,
08:26and you get asked the exact same questions about the same things over and over
08:29and over again.
08:30No offense, you guys.
08:32But, I mean, if I hear it on one platform,
08:35I'm going to hear the same answer from another,
08:37especially during a junket.
08:38It's five minutes and then the next person.
08:41But on the podcast, you know, we have dumb subject matter.
08:45You know what I mean?
08:46That can really open a guest up to talk about,
08:49we had Glenn Powell on talking about penis enlargement.
08:52I forget what we, yeah, it doesn't make sense.
08:56Why are we talking about that?
08:58But we get them to talk about it and it's silly and it doesn't mean anything.
09:02And the fans have a different perspective of who that guest is,
09:05of how they actually are.
09:08And so that's kind of why I did both, you know.
09:12And Jesse, for you, what was sort of the impotence behind,
09:14you know, starting Dinners on Me?
09:16He needed money.
09:17Yeah, clearly.
09:19He's not on my TV every three hours.
09:21So rich.
09:22I just want to check my close-up really quick.
09:24Can you get it on me?
09:26How do I look?
09:27Am I looking okay?
09:29Sometimes I don't look great in close-up.
09:30Okay.
09:33So I actually was, I had pitched a different idea to so many podcasts.
09:37And it didn't happen.
09:39They didn't like that idea.
09:41And then they came back to me and said,
09:43what about us doing something in the food space with you?
09:45And so I, you know, I had written a cookbook over COVID.
09:49I loved being in the kitchen.
09:53So I wanted to do something in the food space.
09:55So this idea of taking my guests out to different restaurants in Los Angeles
09:59and New York that I love and having a conversation over a meal
10:02seemed really exciting to me and sort of a very fly on the wall.
10:05You know, I've had a few podcast hosts actually be guests on my show.
10:09Like Dax Shepard was on recently,
10:11and he just was so stressed out by like the noise element.
10:14Like we were right by the kitchen and he was, you know, it was like,
10:16ah, should we do that again for sound?
10:18I was like, no, that's all part of it.
10:19It's all part of it.
10:20It's very environmental.
10:21So I love that we could sort of not only do a format that I felt comfortable
10:28with, but also something that was a little off center
10:31and sort of took it out of the studio and into the real space of, you know,
10:34restaurants and eating and enjoying each other's company.
10:38So that's sort of how mine came about.
10:40I mean, you mentioned that, that there are a lot of podcasts.
10:43I think everyone here has at least one.
10:45So I'm sort of curious, how do you stand out?
10:49How do you, you know, in addition to bring your own personalities,
10:52how do you stand out from the crowd and make it special?
10:56Or do you just, you know, you can't worry about that sometimes.
10:58You just have to do what you do and hope people love it.
11:02You're looking right at me, so I'm going to take this question.
11:04I know, I didn't tell.
11:06I think a lot of it just has to do with bringing your authentic self
11:10to these conversations.
11:13You know, the podcasts that I listen to,
11:15I'm very connected with the people that are the hosts of these shows,
11:18and they have a very specific way of talking to their guests.
11:23And, I mean, maybe you're lucky enough not to have guests.
11:28Well, also most of the comedians have been canceled.
11:30There's not a lot of guests left.
11:33But it's, you know, it's a tricky balance.
11:36And honestly, I don't know how certain podcasts break through
11:40and other ones don't because there's been some that I've been a huge fan of
11:43that have been canceled because no one's listening to them.
11:46So I feel very fortunate, first of all, that,
11:49and I know that a big part of that reason is because of Modern Family
11:52and people recognize my name,
11:54and I certainly do not take that for granted at all.
11:56But I'm so happy that that brings people to me
11:59so that I can then extend a bit of myself in return.
12:02Yeah.
12:04I think authenticity is something that we're short on in entertainment.
12:09And I think when something breaks through,
12:11then you have a million iterations of that
12:13because everyone hopes, like, oh, I'll be the next blank.
12:15But there is no next whoever.
12:17You are you.
12:18And I think as an entertainer, especially as a stand-up,
12:21and of course as an actor, you roll the dice on that.
12:23We all move here.
12:24We all want to do things.
12:25And the practice is sticking to your guns
12:28and being yourself authentically and wholly
12:30and not giving in to trends.
12:32And it doesn't always pay off, but at least at the end of the day,
12:35you know that you did it authentically and originally,
12:38and your audience will find you.
12:39And the great thing about the Internet that we're in now
12:42is that there is something for everyone.
12:45So you may not find a billion fans,
12:48but you might find 100,000 loyal fans
12:50who will support you your whole career.
12:53And that's personally something that's never lost on me,
12:55having, like, a very dedicated fan base,
12:58is that you constantly serve them honesty and yourself.
13:02And I think that there's a reward for vulnerability
13:05because people can sense inauthenticity.
13:07Yeah, I talk to, like, actors all the time
13:09when they ask for advice on how to audition
13:12or how to break into the business
13:14or how to become a unique individual.
13:16And I say, you're already there.
13:18There's no one like you.
13:20So you have to trust your humanity.
13:23Trust that you don't have to pretend to do a thing and be a thing,
13:27unless you want to be some wild, crazy character actor,
13:30but you're already unique.
13:32And that's the same thing with podcasting.
13:34You know, there's so many options.
13:36People want to hear your perspective.
13:38I can go through a million podcasts
13:39that are talking about the presidency,
13:42but everyone has a completely different point of view.
13:44You know what I mean?
13:45So it's interesting to just hear how a comedian might feel about it,
13:49how a politician might feel about it,
13:51how an athlete might feel about it.
13:53As long as you're staying authentic to yourself,
13:55I think you got something.
13:59How to keep a success?
14:02Oh, no.
14:03Like, how do you stand out from the crowd?
14:05Well, I just had on the Hawk Tour, girl.
14:07Really?
14:09My strategy is to just sell out and do whatever you have to do.
14:14Yeah.
14:15Wow.
14:16Yeah.
14:17Why am I so impressed?
14:18Why are you so cool?
14:19It's the biggest thing I've ever done.
14:21I've peaked.
14:24You know, I definitely, you know,
14:27to Eliza's point about interviewing being an art,
14:30it's one that, you know, is very hard to crack.
14:32It's obviously your skill set.
14:34But also for me,
14:35I find I'm better at it when I'm genuinely fascinated by somebody
14:38and genuinely just want to hear what they have to say.
14:41And, you know, having her on, you know,
14:44I have people that tend to come to me because it's a female
14:47and maybe a little bit vulnerable.
14:48And, you know, if she went on some other podcast,
14:50like dude's podcast, they might, you know,
14:52make the blowjob jokes and this and that, whatever.
14:55I spent most of my career making blowjob jokes.
14:57I'm not doing that anymore.
14:58I'm a mom now.
14:59And so I like to create a safe space for those kind of people that have
15:03gone through some kind of public shaming to come and talk.
15:06I had Amanda Knox on and she admitted all this stuff she had never
15:08admitted before.
15:09You know, I think that a lot of podcasts,
15:11like we're not these people that need like seven minutes.
15:13We need a soundbite and we need, you know,
15:15I don't want to humiliate anyone.
15:16I don't want to embarrass anybody.
15:17I'm not sadistic like that.
15:19You know, some people do really well with that format.
15:21But, you know, for me, it's just sort of like,
15:23people are fascinated by you.
15:25I'm fascinated by you.
15:26Let's just sort of try to see who you are with no agenda.
15:29And she was oddly riveting and to Eliza's point, again,
15:32like I think what is so fascinating about her is she's so,
15:35she doesn't have like some calculated idea of who she wants to be.
15:38She's not trying to build a brand.
15:40She's just exactly who she is and became this breath of fresh air.
15:43Like I asked her what her hobbies were.
15:44I was like, what interests you?
15:46And she just said, seafood.
15:48I think we're all overthinking it.
15:52You know what?
15:53We're all overthinking it a little bit.
15:55And, you know, I think also something people really appreciate because,
15:59you know, when you're watching, you know,
16:00Modern Family, New Girl, Glee, you're watching this brilliant,
16:03you know, these scripts that have been written.
16:05Someone like Ryan Murphy, you know, Liz Meriwether, you know,
16:0820 writers have worked on it.
16:09It's been edited.
16:10You know, sometimes people also want to just hear the wire tap,
16:13you know, and sometimes conversations really,
16:15this is actually kind of boring, but I'm still riveted, you know,
16:18because the way that people consume podcasts, they're at work.
16:21They're in the Amazon warehouse.
16:22They're truck drivers.
16:23They're, you know, they don't need a joke every two seconds.
16:25You know, they kind of just want a background friend.
16:27They want to feel like they're in a conversation.
16:29And, you know,
16:30I think something so amazing about podcasting is that a lot of
16:32conversations we're having, you know,
16:34in rooms is like, there's no attention span anymore.
16:36Nobody has an attention span.
16:37People just have to move, move.
16:38Hashtag Quibi.
16:39Hashtag RIP.
16:40But it's okay.
16:41I set up three shows there, you guys.
16:43No big deal.
16:44Together, they totaled one show.
16:46And, you know,
16:47they say people have short attention spans.
16:49You okay.
16:50Then why are people listening to Eliza's podcast for an hour?
16:52Why are they listening?
16:53You know what I mean?
16:54So I, you know, Rogan is three hours long.
16:56He puts out three a week, you know,
16:58and millions of people are listening.
17:00So I think it's cool to kind of get the antidote to all these sort
17:03of platitudes of like, you know I think they also remind us to play
17:06to the top of our game.
17:07Um, I think they also remind us to play to the top of people's
17:10intelligence.
17:11You know, a lot of the biggest podcasts are science podcasts.
17:13Yeah.
17:14Cuberman and, you know, stuff like that.
17:16So I think it's like, I listened to a language podcast by John
17:19McWhorter, a language.
17:20Yeah.
17:21He's a linguist.
17:22He's a linguist at Columbia.
17:23And like, that is the thing.
17:24That's a podcast I listened to the most.
17:26And you don't trust.
17:29I just, I think it's all people put out stuff from their heart.
17:32And I think these people like it's a science podcast.
17:34It's like, Oh, this interests me.
17:36I didn't get that job doing that thing on TV.
17:38So I'll just go do my thing.
17:39And your audience finds you and, and people want, they want the hang.
17:43They want to be with the friend.
17:44They want to be with the person smarter than them.
17:46They look to podcasts for their information.
17:48And quite frankly, I think the podcasts that do well, and when I
17:51say do well, I just mean are able to subsist versus, I mean, there
17:55are huge ones, um, people that actually want to be doing it.
17:58I think a lot of people like I'll just do a podcast to supplement
18:01whatever it has to actually come from your heart.
18:03Like you have to do nice ad reads, not in the fucking toilet.
18:06You have to, which is where a lot of us do them.
18:08You have to put some heart into it.
18:10You know, I'll hear ads for podcasts that are like, it's just me and
18:12my friend and we just talk about whatever.
18:14It's like, no, we want like a little bit of polish.
18:16And we want to know that you care that people are choosing to
18:19spend time with you.
18:20So it does like have to come from your chest.
18:22You know, I won an award for my ad reads, by the way.
18:25I take those.
18:27I believe that you have a buttery voice.
18:29Thank you for saying so.
18:30That means a lot.
18:31So many awards, Jennifer, you, um, you know,
18:34we talk about how fascinating it is to,
18:36to talk to people and you learn new things.
18:38Is it interesting for you to let go back and revisit some of these things?
18:42Do you find that you're learning new perspectives or?
18:44Oh, yeah.
18:45I mean, like Lamorne said earlier,
18:46there's so many episodes and they start to meld into one when you do so
18:49many.
18:50And for, for us in particular,
18:53it was so unique because we already had a built in fan base.
18:56So we were bringing in, um, you know,
18:59millions were so lucky to have millions of fans to come listen.
19:03And then how do you keep them is really the question.
19:06And for us,
19:07we were so also lucky that Ryan Murphy decided to come and do the first
19:10episode with us.
19:11He did a two-parter.
19:12He doesn't talk about Glee a lot.
19:14And obviously he's,
19:15he's had this incredible empire of a career.
19:18Um, and in Hollywood,
19:21it feels like when you get to the top like that with a phenomenon like
19:24Glee, it was, they rise you up, they,
19:26they bring you up and then they just want to tear you down.
19:28And there was so much tragedy around our show as well,
19:31that Kevin and I felt like we had a responsibility to come on and speak
19:36to our fans and tell them the truth of what was a joyful six years,
19:42uh, you know, amongst a lot of, you know,
19:45sadness and tragedy and darkness,
19:47but that was not the overall feeling or the, um,
19:52the feeling that any of our crew members,
19:56guest stars, uh, co-stars had.
19:59And so we felt like we,
20:01the fans were dying for the truth.
20:03And so Ryan opened up that door for us.
20:05And then we were able to really kind of have these therapy sessions,
20:09if you will,
20:10for these people and guests to come on our show and talk about their
20:14experience.
20:15And then to kind of set the record straight, um,
20:18for what our experience was on the show.
20:21And Jesse knows, I mean,
20:22we ran in the same circle and the Warren for a significant amount of time
20:26during our shows and, you know,
20:28there's so much gossip about it.
20:31And we were a young cast that was kind of on the rise.
20:34And so, um, looking back now, you learn so much. I mean,
20:38we have the worst memories.
20:40So we look to our guests to kind of remind us of all those really great
20:43times, but, um,
20:45we have new perspectives on why we were feeling what we were feeling when
20:49we were kind of lost in our other cast members pulled us out of those
20:53moments.
20:54And it's really special and therapeutic and nostalgic.
20:58And I think the fans are really liking again, the authenticity of it all.
21:02Oh, you just touched my heart.
21:04I know the show gets emotional because also, you know,
21:07I think there is this thing in Eliza, uh, uh, pointed out earlier,
21:10I spent 10 years in ICUs because both my parents had strokes and it's,
21:15it's, we're fine. We're good. Um, uh, but they deserved it.
21:18They deserved it. I'm kidding. Um, no, they're alcoholics. It's fine.
21:21How do you think I became a comic? But they, uh,
21:23when you walk around the ICU and hospitals, all they're doing is watching TV.
21:27Okay. They're just watching TV. They're watching TV, you know,
21:29and in writers rooms, everyone's like, well, we're not carrying cancer.
21:32You know, we're not, we're not laughter is the best medicine, but whatever.
21:35Um, and you know, uh, you know, right now the TV business,
21:40I think is having a little bit of a confidence crisis. Um,
21:42but the fact that people are coming to your podcast, they can't let go.
21:46The show touched them so deeply. I, my boyfriend's here.
21:49He can't wait to take a picture with you because a new girl, I know.
21:52And they watch it over and over and over again.
21:58Not Fargo, not Fargo, not Fargo.
22:02But I think that it's like,
22:03cause a lot of people want to bifurcate podcasts and television.
22:06And I always want to go, no, no, we can help each other.
22:08Like look how great it is that like Glee, the legacy gets to live on. You know,
22:12I also like to look at the ways that things kind of, uh, used to exist,
22:15but they, now they just look different.
22:16Like to me this is kind of the updated version of remember pop-up video on
22:20page one, right?
22:21We're dying to be on it when I was like 21 obsessed with pop-up.
22:24So it's like, you guys are like, remember in this scene,
22:26this actually happened and it's all this like behind the scenes stuff.
22:28So it's the show behind the show, you know?
22:30So it's kind of cool because when a show gets canceled,
22:32really our show got canceled, you know,
22:34it can live on forever and ever in other ways now, which is, you know,
22:37super cool and heartening for the business.
22:39Cause I think everyone's looking for ways that the business is dying or the
22:42way podcasting is killing certain businesses,
22:44but I think we're all helping each other. It's just getting rearranged.
22:47Well, I think also like what Jenna was like tapping into. And I mean,
22:51for all of these TV shows and the fans that find it after,
22:54like people are fucked up. Like people's lives are fucked.
22:58Like I tour this country almost all year round and you get people that come to
23:03your shows that listen to your podcast,
23:04that consume the art that by the grace of God,
23:07you are able to make and they are like, Oh my God, I just lost both my parents.
23:11My house was in a flood. I was in a hurricane.
23:13And I have like goosebumps thinking about it because I'm in the military.
23:17I don't see my family. There's a plague of locusts. Yeah.
23:19But I listen to your podcast. I watch your show. Like I, I dedicate, like it,
23:24you are the relief for them. And so anytime you feel bad, like, Oh,
23:28I wish I had more listeners. I wish I had this.
23:30Like people are doing so much worse and they are spending and they were looking
23:35to you to feel better, whether it is buying that ticket or listening to that.
23:39And like, I don't think we,
23:40in our Hollywood bubble really realize like how rough it is for so many people
23:44out there. So to have something like that,
23:46that can be your companion in your truck, in your ambulance,
23:49in your car before you've got a clock in to do something that maybe you don't
23:52want to do is something that we don't ever really get to touch. Right.
23:56But, but to feel it and to know that that's out there,
23:59I think is a very special thing.
24:00But how do you sort of balance that? Because you know,
24:03social media has come up a couple of times and it has its good and bad
24:06qualities.
24:07You're able to engage with your audience and you get feedback and suggestions,
24:10but there are obvious downsides. You know, how do you,
24:13how do you go about finding that balance where you can engage with your
24:16listeners? But also, you know,
24:18I'm just kind of laughing because I just had this memory.
24:21The first time I ever saw Jesse in person,
24:23like I was at like a tea party or something.
24:26I was just walking along and I went, ah,
24:28and I was that person and I should know better.
24:31And you were so gracious by the way.
24:33Tea party?
24:34That's what you're hung up on?
24:37Is this like a freak off party?
24:39Bafta tea party.
24:40Oh, no, I remember. I remember.
24:42Was that baby oil?
24:43Emmy winner Lamorne Morris knows what I'm talking about.
24:45It's the tea party they have for Bafta for when you're, yeah.
24:48I'm very familiar.
24:49Some of us have a political podcast, so we're a tea party.
24:52So the, so the question is how do you balance?
24:57Yeah, you know, you want to be, you want to engage your audience,
25:00but you also want to keep boundaries.
25:02I don't have many boundaries to be honest with you.
25:05Like, I'm not joking.
25:06I love engaging with people.
25:08I used to sleep in my car.
25:10So there was like a moment of, holy shit, you know,
25:13people are appreciating the thing that I've always known I knew how to do.
25:16So if they come up and ask for a photo,
25:18if they come up and they fan out or whatever the case may be,
25:21I'm right there with them.
25:22You know what I mean?
25:23Like, holy shit, you're right.
25:24It is me.
25:25Yeah.
25:26I love it.
25:29I can't believe it either.
25:30Somebody,
25:31somebody that recognizes you as a celebrity to you.
25:34So, yeah.
25:39So I appreciate when I say I appreciate it.
25:41I mean, I truly, truly appreciate it.
25:44So the boundaries are just strange.
25:46Just don't touch my hair and like, you know,
25:48I'm sorry about that.
25:50You know what I mean?
25:51I think that is all black people's boundaries.
25:55So that's literally it.
25:57You know what I mean?
25:58I had one instance where I was,
26:00I had the flu and I was,
26:02it was like two,
26:03three in the morning.
26:04I had to go to a 24 hour drugstore just to pick something up so I could
26:07breathe.
26:08And I look like shit.
26:09I had my hoodie on and I was not feeling great.
26:11And I,
26:12and I remember being in the aisle and some guy goes,
26:14holy shit,
26:15can I get a picture with you?
26:16And I said,
26:17oh,
26:18hey brother,
26:19not right now.
26:20I don't,
26:21you know,
26:22I'm just,
26:23and he was like this,
26:24man,
26:25fuck you,
26:26man.
26:27It's just a picture.
26:28It's like,
26:29it's like,
26:30you know what I mean?
26:31So there's,
26:32it's been one time in my life where I couldn't take a photo.
26:34Yeah,
26:35of course.
26:36And that's what happens.
26:37So now I must take the photo.
26:39I think with podcasting in particular,
26:43like,
26:44and with social media and the rise of social media,
26:46obviously it's,
26:47can be used for good and bad.
26:49You have to remember that people are human.
26:52And I feel like we can remind people of that.
26:54And so like in the podcast,
26:57you know,
26:58for example,
26:59like the glee fans,
27:00they want this guest or this person.
27:01And sometimes we can't get them and we'll just say,
27:03Hey,
27:04you guys,
27:05we hear you.
27:06We see it,
27:07but we can't right now.
27:08Or,
27:09you know,
27:10and just addressing them directly to feel like they're being heard is,
27:13is something that I feel like you can create a safe boundary for yourself,
27:18but also not let them know that that's,
27:20that's the boundary because they are being heard as well.
27:23They're not being told no.
27:24And I feel like with social media,
27:27like we came up in the rise of like Perez Hilton time and blogs and Tumblr
27:32and all of these things.
27:33And you just have to remember,
27:34you have to take,
27:35it's like any review,
27:36like,
27:37I don't know if you read reviews,
27:38but like it's,
27:39you take the good with the bad and the bad with the good.
27:41And so I take it all with a grain of salt,
27:45but we do,
27:46the fans are not the grain of salt,
27:48you know,
27:49it's,
27:50it's everything around them.
27:51And then reminding them that like,
27:52be kind and lead with kindness because we're all just human.
27:55Yeah.
27:56Jesse,
27:57how do you deal with people coming up and pointing and screaming at you?
28:00Cause you handled it very well when I did it.
28:02Oh yeah,
28:03I handled it well.
28:06I mean,
28:07look,
28:08I grew up a closeted gay kid in Albuquerque,
28:09New Mexico in the eighties and nineties.
28:13And so I wish I had something like Instagram or social media to be able to
28:19reach out to communities that weren't accessible to me in Albuquerque.
28:23So I take it very seriously when people reach out to me and want to connect
28:28with me on social media.
28:29And I have a lot of people who do ask very personal questions in my direct
28:34messages.
28:35And I try and give them the time that I had cause I do think it's,
28:37it's a tool and I'm constantly telling kids,
28:40you know,
28:41when they're asking me about like,
28:42I feel like I'm trapped in my hometown.
28:43It's like,
28:44there is a whole world out there and there are avenues and there are,
28:47there's a freeway and exit ramps in so many different ways now where they
28:51weren't,
28:52they didn't exist when I was a kid.
28:53And so I,
28:54you know,
28:55for me being able to have this podcast,
28:57be able to,
28:58to communicate stories about my life or talk about stories that my guest has
29:02and then be able to amplify that on my social media and give them sort of just
29:06even a flagpole,
29:07like,
29:08Oh,
29:09I have this thing over here.
29:10That is hugely important to me.
29:11And you know,
29:12social media is so awful in so many ways,
29:15but I really do feel like it does more good than bad.
29:17At least that's where I'm sitting with today.
29:20But I,
29:22I do,
29:23I do appreciate all the good that I can do.
29:25And I think maybe we're alluding to like,
29:28you know,
29:29negative comments or something like that.
29:30Do you know what I mean?
29:31And negative comments,
29:32like,
29:33I mean,
29:34you know,
29:35comics,
29:36you know,
29:37we sign up for feedback,
29:38you know,
29:39driven and people giving feedback,
29:40you know,
29:41I kind of appreciate it sometimes,
29:42you know,
29:43if it's just like you look old or whatever,
29:44it's like,
29:45you know,
29:46that's just mental illness.
29:47You know what I'm saying?
29:48Right.
29:49Cause I look amazing.
29:50But like people trolling and doing stuff like that.
29:53Sometimes they're trying to be funny or,
29:55you know,
29:56I think we just like focus on that and take that way too seriously.
29:58I think that in terms of like the negative comments,
30:00it only really hurts when you agree with it,
30:02frankly,
30:03you know,
30:04so something that really pisses you off,
30:05you're like,
30:06wait,
30:07why is that bothering me so much?
30:08And I've actually gotten a lot out of it being like,
30:10why does that bother me?
30:11Why am I letting the stranger affect me?
30:12You know?
30:13So it's actually been weirdly healing and other parts of my life too,
30:15because,
30:16you know,
30:17people like your negative comments,
30:18isn't that hard?
30:19I'm like,
30:20I had to audition for Kevin Riley in a tank.
30:23Remember like testing for TV shows and going to studio and network against Molly Sims.
30:28I mean,
30:29it was a nightmare,
30:30you know,
30:31like models were just going,
30:32you know,
30:33so,
30:34so unrelatable,
30:35Whitney,
30:36like none of us have gone up against.
30:37I mean,
30:38we've done very well.
30:39Um,
30:40uh,
30:41no,
30:42but I just mean like for us to complain about something like that would just be so,
30:43you know,
30:44delusional.
30:45The fact that we have access directly to fans,
30:46the fact that there's,
30:47you know,
30:48an ability to like democratize,
30:49you know,
30:50exposure like this,
30:51you know,
30:52the amount of like people that,
30:53you know,
30:54don't know,
30:55they can't afford to live in New York or LA because they're not like Nepo babies.
30:56No offense to Nepo babies.
30:57I just gave birth to one.
30:58Um,
30:59and I,
31:00I just feel like the amount of incredible talent that maybe can't afford to move to
31:06LA and get an agent and go to acting school,
31:09you know,
31:10there's,
31:11I hired someone for an HBO pilot that I found on YouTube.
31:12It's just like hilarious girl who was working at a bank,
31:15you know?
31:16So I think in terms of access to talent and in terms of people being able to put their
31:19stuff online and not have to wait around for a casting director to call them,
31:23you know,
31:24I think it's just,
31:25it's,
31:26it's really amazing and there are some negatives,
31:27but you know,
31:28I,
31:29and I also think in terms of like,
31:30you know,
31:31television movies like,
31:32you know,
31:33your actors in these movies being able to have podcasts like,
31:34you know,
31:35I've been doing podcasts and I talked about it from the moment I got cast the
31:38process I'm going to Canada,
31:39I'm doing this and everybody was so invested,
31:41you know,
31:42and they watched it like when it came out instead of just to go,
31:44that's just another show,
31:45you know?
31:46So I think that everybody wins when we,
31:47you know,
31:48engage with our audience and you gave them some ownership,
31:50gave them some ownership,
31:51you know?
31:52And I think that also kind of used to be,
31:53let me know if you guys agree with this,
31:54like,
31:55no,
31:56no,
31:57that if you were acting,
31:59you couldn't really host.
32:02You couldn't really do a talk show.
32:04You couldn't do a podcast,
32:06you know,
32:07or it would make,
32:08it would look cheap or you would look,
32:09you know,
32:10like it was pick a lane and we're all like Nick Cannon.
32:12Now we can all kind of do anything.
32:14We're all just like Nick.
32:15It's kind of great.
32:16It's kind of great that like,
32:18you know,
32:19we can podcasting builds us up,
32:20keeps us relevant so that,
32:21you know,
32:22television,
32:23you know,
32:24so I think it's kind of exciting that we can all do everything.
32:25Your question was about like,
32:26at least the balancing of it.
32:27And I tend to take a little bit.
32:29I don't think I'm the most famous person on this by far,
32:31but I do believe as a creator,
32:33as a,
32:34as a comedian,
32:35it is a one way street.
32:36And so I don't actually want the feedback.
32:39I want people to enjoy it.
32:40If you don't like it,
32:41that's okay.
32:42But I'm never looking to the comment section to check myself.
32:45And I think,
32:46you know,
32:47you post a video,
32:48you make a funny video,
32:49right?
32:50You will get 80% of people that don't get that.
32:51It's satire or that are like,
32:52this was wrong.
32:53This was offensive.
32:54And it's like,
32:55well then it's not for you,
32:56but I'm not looking to like Susan from Idaho to tell me that what I said was out of bounds.
33:01I'm like,
33:02we are comedians.
33:03We tell,
33:04like we set the tone here and I made some,
33:06I made some art.
33:07And if you don't like my art,
33:08that's okay.
33:09But the point is you watched and this is not me now going back to you to being like,
33:13well,
33:14was it,
33:15is it okay if I make more art?
33:16Because as a comic,
33:17you have to be so steadfast in what you are putting out.
33:19And it's something that men don't deal with as much.
33:21It's not that men don't get feedback,
33:23but you get male comics for better,
33:24for worse.
33:25Like,
33:26this is what I said.
33:27And I said it and I move on and we love them for it.
33:28And as women,
33:29I like,
33:30I try to take a page from that.
33:31I don't do anything hurtful.
33:32I don't aim to hurt.
33:33But if you say something that rubs someone the wrong way on the wrong day,
33:36and then they want to tell you about it,
33:38it's like,
33:39okay,
33:40fine.
33:41But this is,
33:42I am only outputting.
33:43We are not taking an input at this time because I've done it.
33:45Like I'm a mother of two.
33:46Like I'm good.
33:47I'll get my input from people that are smarter than me.
33:49Not like a faceless egg in the comments.
33:52Like that's insane.
33:53You would never go to a psychiatrist.
33:55That was just like,
33:56I just got off my shift at subway.
33:58You'd be like,
33:59no,
34:00I just got off my shift at subway.
34:01I want to go.
34:02You want to get feedback from people that you trust and you don't know these
34:05people that are out there.
34:06And so you do have fans that you converse with people that you check in on
34:09people that are there for you consistently,
34:11but you are the artist.
34:13I am making the art.
34:14It is there for you to consume.
34:15I will consume your art when you make some,
34:17but it's just a one way street.
34:19And that's it also,
34:20uh,
34:21you know,
34:22with social media.
34:23Now we are trying to feed this volcano.
34:24Like we have to have like a two minute clip.
34:28Every couple of days.
34:29I don't know how often you guys post.
34:30It feels like we have to post almost daily at this point.
34:32And so,
34:33you know,
34:34podcasting part of the reason,
34:35you know,
34:36I'm able to get,
34:37you know,
34:38really big guests as I promised them,
34:39you will get five,
34:40very well edited,
34:41subtitled six K clips for your feet.
34:44Six K.
34:45Like I will give you six K clips.
34:47Hi.
34:48What's that?
34:49What's that?
34:50Smell a vision.
34:51It's I only shoot in holograms.
34:54Um,
34:55it's,
34:56it's just that most high res possible,
34:58you know,
34:59so that it's gonna,
35:00you know,
35:01future proof.
35:02I got to get six K six K order that shit.
35:04Then you can reformat it.
35:05This is not six K.
35:07This is an old iPhone.
35:08This is an iPhone four.
35:10This is blackberry footage.
35:11Yeah.
35:12That is a painting.
35:13We're being painted in the back.
35:15Um,
35:16so that's another thing is like,
35:17is that as artists,
35:18we can like barter with each other and be like,
35:20Oh,
35:21Eliza,
35:22come on my podcast.
35:23You can talk about your tour.
35:24You can talk about this thing coming up and I'll send you these clips.
35:25You know,
35:26it's kind of funny because now when we go on talk shows,
35:27I love these guys,
35:28you know,
35:29we're all friends with Fallon and Kimmel,
35:30but when you go on these talk shows now,
35:31you know,
35:32uh,
35:33they'll take pictures,
35:34you'll do your segment and then they'll be like,
35:35Hey,
35:36can we get the email so that we can send you the clips to post on your
35:37feed?
35:38And you're like,
35:39aren't I on your show?
35:40Are you on my show?
35:41Or am I on your show?
35:42But it's kind of cool to go like,
35:43we're all collaborating with each other.
35:44You know,
35:45we're all sort of helping each other,
35:46you know,
35:47build.
35:48And that's,
35:49you know,
35:50what makes people want to watch us.
35:51I'm so sorry.
35:52We're out of time,
35:53but the good news is you have places where you can listen to these people.
35:56Talk more about this.
35:57Thank you so much for being here.
35:58Thank you all for being a great audience.