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Video Information: Shabdyog session, 31.05.2019, Advait Bodhsthal, Greater Noida, India

Context:
~ Is it unnatural to be vegan?
~ Why do children have to become vegans?
~ How can children learn to be vegans?
~ Is veganism a diet lacking in nutrients?
~ Do we have to follow our instincts?

Music Credits: Milind Date
~~~~~~~~~~~~~ .

Category

📚
Learning
Transcript
00:00Ilmari from Finland. Pranam Acharyaji. There has been a lot of talk on veganism in the
00:21MAG group lately. I have also watched many of your videos relating to this topic. I would
00:27like to know your take on teaching veganism to children. I know that veganism has to be
00:34a thing of the heart and that just forcing dry ideology isn't good for anyone. As a vegan
00:41parent, I am not concerned about my ability to show compassion, but rather about the choices
00:47I sometimes have to make for the sake of my daughter's physical well-being. She is very
00:53choosy towards vegan protein sources and that's why we sometimes have to buy dairy products for
00:58her. Every time I have to do that, I feel bad. So there is this conflict between my responsibility
01:06to provide her with nutritionally balanced diet and with my heartfelt refusal to take part in the
01:11exploitation of other living beings. I wonder if there is any right or wrong in this. Thank
01:17you for your guidance, Ilmari. Ilmari, we are neither prakritic beings nor do we live
01:41truthfully. If you look at birds and animals in the jungle, they live totally by prakriti.
01:55If you look at saints, they live totally by the heart. In the industrialized world,
02:09man lives neither as a prakritic being and nor as a being of truth. We live by the mind. We
02:25live by the intellect. The intellect has created all these problems that we are facing. Veganism
02:45is a response to the problems created by intellect. We don't have to teach veganism to
02:57animals, neither do we have to teach veganism to saints. Animals don't need veganism. Saints too
03:05don't need veganism. Man in this modern, post-modern world needs veganism. The man who
03:21is a creation of his intellect needs this veganism. If you look at man today, he is neither a creation
03:35of the jungle nor is he a creation of God. He is a creation of his own mind. Majorly. If you look
03:48at him very closely, then you will realize he is similar to the ones who live in the jungle.
03:52And you will have to look at a million human beings to come across a few who will make you
04:01that man probably came from God. If you look at the bulk of human beings from a distance,
04:16you will neither feel that they come from jungle nor would you feel that they come from God. Man
04:26neither comes from jungle nor from God. Today's man comes from the factory. We are products of
04:33our intellect. We are products of the human factory. And our problems I said too are problems
04:43arising from the human intellect. But that has become our center. We will operate from our center,
04:49won't we? Intellect is the center of today's man. If that be so, why not use the same intellect in
05:07a godly way? If intellect is what we are identified with, why not surrender this same intellect to
05:14the service of God? Why not, for example, use the intellect to create sources of vitamin B12
05:40and proteins and many other vitamins and minerals that are not exploitative towards animals?
05:56If you say that you must provide your daughter with a protein-rich diet, why does the protein
06:13have to come from dairy? When everything in your life is anyway factory produced,
06:21why not use factory produced protein as well? People say, but that would be unnatural. Hello,
06:33if you want to be fully natural, then live on the trees. Is it natural to live in houses? Is it
06:41natural to wear clothes? Is it natural to go to schools? By nature you mean prakriti, right? Do
06:48all these things happen in the jungle? But when you live in the house, then you do not say, oh,
06:53it is unnatural. When you live in the house, do you say it is unnatural, I will not do it. Now,
07:06man has come out of the jungle. He is anyway no more prakritic. His center is not prakriti,
07:16neither is his center atma. His center is buddhi. It's a very strange situation that man is in.
07:25What is the center of an animal? What is the center of the saint? What is the center of
07:34today's man? So, use this same buddhi in the service of truth. You live in an industrialized,
07:46heavily industrialized western country, Ilmari. How is it not possible to have artificial sources
07:58of vitamin C, D, A, B, B12? How is it not possible to manufacture proteins just as
08:08you manufacture everything else? Why is it necessary that the protein molecule must come
08:13from an animal's body? Why is it necessary? On one hand, we pride ourselves in factory producing
08:24everything. Can't the factory produce protein? Must you kill to have protein? Some people even
08:42say veganism is unnatural and their biggest argument is vitamin B12. They say this vitamin
08:50can come only from an animal source and human body requires this. So, this is the proof that
08:58veganism is unnatural. They mean a prakritic. I agree veganism is not prakritic, but then why
09:08must it be prakritic? Is man prakritic anymore? If you want to be prakritic, then I say go back
09:15and live in the jungle. You have come out of the jungle. Is marriage prakritic? Are there marriages
09:23in the jungle? So, marriage is the first thing that is unnatural. Is language prakritic? Are
09:30there languages in the jungle? Are there clothes in the jungle? Are there countries in the jungle?
09:36Are there constitutions in the jungle? Are there vehicles in the jungle? But then to all these
09:42things you do not say, oh these are unnatural. To all these things you are happily amenable. But
09:50the moment it is discovered that vitamin B12 cannot be found except in an animal source,
10:01you rejoice and say, you see, now veganism is ticked off because it is proven that veganism
10:11is unnatural. Yes, of course, veganism is unnatural. And just as you choose so many
10:19things that are unnatural, choose veganism as well. Do not choose it because it is natural.
10:30Do not choose it because it is coming from compassion. Do not choose it because of prakriti.
10:45Choose it because of karuna. And these are two very different arguments. There are the naturalists
10:53who say that you should choose what is there in prakriti. I strongly deny that. I am not a
11:00naturalist. I do not say that you should live as prakriti lives. In prakriti, all creatures or
11:07rather most creatures except the nocturnal ones sleep at night. I conduct my sessions after
11:15midnight. Am I prakritic? Am I? So, I am not at all a supporter of prakriti. In fact, all spirituality
11:27is about transcending prakriti. So, I am not a naturalist. I stand for transcendence of physical
11:34nature which you call as prakriti. But in transcending prakriti, I do not want to stop
11:43at buddhi or intellect. In transcending prakriti, I want to reach the atma or truth where compassion
11:51resides. Get the difference please. Usually people think that spirituality and naturalism go
11:59together. They think if you are a spiritual man, then you would love fruits and all kinds of animal
12:10products and these two often are seen together. The moment a person picks up some spiritual text,
12:21he also starts eating more raw food. It is often a combination. It is seen that spiritual people
12:37go to the jungles. So, somehow a correlation has been established in the mind that spirituality and
12:47prakriti go together. No, wrong. Spirituality is transcendence of prakriti and when you transcend
12:56prakriti, then you can really love prakriti. It is a thing that you have to appreciate. Those who
13:03do not transcend prakriti remain attached with prakriti and if you remain attached with prakriti,
13:09you will consume prakriti. For example, if you remain attached to your own body, then you will
13:15kill somebody's body to feed your own body. If you are attached to prakriti, you will rape prakriti.
13:22But the saint goes beyond prakriti, from there he can just lovingly witness and watch prakriti.
13:30Then he doesn't interfere with prakriti or consume it or rape it. Are you getting it?
13:38In fact, a lot of damage to prakriti is being brought about by prakriti lovers as well. So,
13:49they would say, we require a particular type of fruit. Now for that type of fruit to be grown,
13:59all other species of trees are being cut off. If you are standing at the intellect ilmari,
14:13as you are, use the intellect. Find out where in the world, from where in the world, can you get
14:25all nutrients that are not animal sourced. Let industries come up. If it is required that
14:50artificial meat be made in order to satisfy people who necessarily want to have meat,
14:58I am all in favor of more technological research to produce more artificial meat
15:08that closely resembles animal meat. This is compassion because this is going to save
15:15billions of animals every day. Let technological prowess be used to produce artificial meat,
15:24because the fellow is now addicted to meat. He will eat meat and if you will not give him
15:30artificial meat, he will slaughter the animal. So, use intellect, use research, use technology.
15:42What is all your scientific knowledge for? You can't even produce a protein molecule in
15:48the factory and then we sing so much about man's scientific advancements.
15:55Are you getting it? Man cannot go back to the jungle. So, even if you want to protect the
16:10jungle now, intellect is the answer. Man can neither go back to the jungle nor can man give
16:23up the intellect, but the jungle has to be protected. So, the intellect is the answer.
16:30Use the mind. Use the mind in service to the truth. If intellect is what you have,
16:41devote the intellect to the service of the truth, to the service of compassion.
16:59Satsang with Mooji

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