The Scotsman's Jane Bradley speaks to David Bol about the latest on the winter fuel payment
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00:00Hello and welcome to the Scotsman's Daily Bulletin for Monday. I'm joined today by David
00:06Boll, our Deputy Political Editor. Good morning, David.
00:08Morning, Jane.
00:09I think we're going to mainly be chatting about the winter fuel payment issue today,
00:15but first we'll have a quick look at the front page.
00:19We'll be leading with a story about winter fuel payments, which is about Keir Starmer
00:24defending the fuel payment cut and the SNP rebels speaking out against it.
00:32We've also got a story about councils growing too big and centralised, and we're looking
00:37at the fact that Scotland's councils are too wide, too general. There's a report that claims
00:43they need to be more localised and better.
00:46And another story is colleges racking up a £37 million redundancy bill. So Scotland's
00:51colleges have obviously made a lot of redundancies in recent months and years, and this is the
00:57cost.
00:58Our front page picture is late pain for Scotland as the match against Portugal did not go the
01:04way we'd hoped, with another last minute defeat.
01:09But if we could go back to the issue of winter fuel payments, David, can you just sort of
01:12talk us through what has been happening and what point we're at now?
01:16Yeah, so this is the latest headache for Keir Starmer. We've known about this, this
01:21idea for some time, that he's basically got no money left over from the previous government,
01:28as Rachel Reeves has set out. And one of the methods he's brought forward is to means test
01:33the winter fuel payments, which will affect about 10 million pensioners across the UK.
01:39So it's a big deal for a lot of people. And quite cynically, it's a part of the population
01:44that vote. So you always see politicians kind of wanting to very much do things that please
01:50pensioners. We see a lot of talk about pensions and these sort of issues. And what's happened
01:55is some Labour backbenchers in Westminster have basically tabled a motion for that to
02:01be delayed or cancelled. And they're going to put it to a sort of a vote in the Commons
02:06tomorrow. And as you mentioned, the SNP are trying to get the Scottish Labour MPs to vote
02:12against the government, basically trying to make it into a bit of a political fight. The
02:16Labour government will win this. They've got a huge majority, as we know, but it's quite
02:20embarrassing for Keir Starmer. Either way, we had a rebellion, a very small one a few
02:26weeks ago about the two child cap and other sort of benefits row between the SNP and Labour.
02:35So it'll be interesting to see if we get another sizeable rebellion. We're expecting a slightly
02:40bigger one. And if any Scottish MPs will be included in that.
02:44Yeah, I mean, that's what I was going to ask you. I mean, how likely is it that we're going
02:48to see much of a rebellion? And, you know, what front is that likely to come from?
02:52Yeah, it's unfair. Apparently, Labour MPs have been kind of inundated with sort of concerns
02:58from their constituents. So I think given the size of the majority, a lot of MPs will
03:04be a bit empowered to speak out against it because they want to keep their constituents
03:08or at least show their constituents that they are, they're on their side. The Scottish Labour
03:13MPs seem pretty loyal. A lot of them, as we know, are all brand new. So it'll be interesting
03:19to see whether any of them have had enough concern to kind of step out of bounds and
03:24do that. And we'll find out tomorrow. As far as I'm aware, there's none that have come
03:28forward so far north the border. But we'll have to just kind of wait and see for that
03:33vote tomorrow in the Commons. So, I mean, it's an uncertain time for Keir
03:37Starmer. I mean, you've obviously touched briefly on the two child benefit cap rebellion.
03:42You know, I mean, how much pushback is he likely to see sort of, you know, going forward
03:46over these kind of issues? Yeah, I mean, this was a quite
03:50controversial one when he announced it. There was always going to be a bit of anger over this one.
03:54I think he's been quite tough and just like, well, we will be unpopular was his line yesterday.
04:00So he expects there to be criticism, quite a no nonsense approach to the two child benefit
04:06one. Those MPs lost the whip straight away. So I guess he has to be quite tough on it,
04:13or it will just get a bit out of hand. So we would expect there to be a bigger rebellion
04:18than that one. There's only a handful of MPs that vote against the benefit cap. This one,
04:23there's a lot of anger about. And with that financial climate that he's operating in,
04:28and those strict spending rules that Labour have sort of imposed themselves,
04:34then we are going to see more decisions like this that will be unpopular,
04:37not seen as particularly Labour. So I do think we will see a few of this. And it's quite
04:42understandable that Keir Starmer will kind of crack down on these rebellions as hard as he can.
04:48And for the actual policy itself, means testing of the winter fuel payment, I mean,
04:51how significant is that going to be for Scottish pensioners?
04:55Yeah, I mean, the Scottish government, I should say, have kind of mirrored that because it was
05:00to be devolved this year. So Shona Robertson, as well as we know, has terrible financial outlook.
05:07And so the Scottish government basically saying without funding from Westminster,
05:11we can't afford to do this. So we're, our hands being kind of pushed by Westminster to
05:17do that. And yeah, there are concerns across the UK, it's 10 million people affected. So there's
05:22a lot in Scotland that will be affected by this. And even though it's means tested, as we know,
05:29fuel bills are skyrocketing, they're not particularly going down as Labour,
05:33maybe over eggs during the election campaign, people were maybe expecting to see a bit of an
05:38instant relief, but the cap has kind of, we've got the same problems with it. So
05:43it will annoy a lot of people, to be perfectly honest, a lot of people who maybe voted Labour
05:47for the first time. People aren't particularly pleased with what they're seeing. It's a difficult
05:54economy they're dealing with. But there's very little hope coming from the Labour government,
05:59they've been very upfront and honest about it. But still, people were hoping to see a bit of
06:03change maybe, and it will affect a lot of people, as you mentioned.
06:07Yeah, well, I mean, I'm sure you'll be looking at this issue for the rest of the day, and
06:12obviously into tomorrow as well. So you can read more of David's stories about this at scottsman.com.
06:18Please keep an eye on the website and read all of our other stories there too. And follow us on our
06:22social media channels on X and Facebook. And if you're out and about today, please do pick up a
06:27paper. And thank you, David. Really good to speak to you. Thanks.