Media Isle of Man had the honour of being part of Energy Sustainability Centre's recent 'Roundtable' session, organised by MMC and hosted by Capital International Group.
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LearningTranscript
00:00Question from the table, we've heard maybe some areas where, you know, the government
00:07direction could be improved on, but in the absence of that, do you think it is for companies
00:12in the private sector to be leading the way?
00:15I think there's a huge opportunity for them. Environmental issues and sustainability in
00:21our biosphere, if that's championed solely by environmental organisations or conservationists,
00:26then it's always going to be seen as an environmental conservation niche thing, and my sense on
00:32it, as someone working in a wildlife trust, is that for the businesses around the table
00:37and far wider, this is no longer a nice to do, it's a must do. And I think our government
00:44needs to see this strongly, so that it really elevates what biosphere means, and what sustainable
00:51and what energy, and all these other things mean to the island, because it's absolutely
00:56driven by economic development and sustainability.
01:00In Shipture, in 2019, become the first global insurance company to sign the 1.5 degree plan,
01:08and that's because we saw it as a responsibility of business to start to drive this activity,
01:15and not, as you say, not just environmentalists, and leaving it to everyone else to do so.
01:21Through that activity, and through work that we do with partners as well, Energy Rick Resilient
01:27Services will go out and work with partners to try and help them be more energy efficient
01:33and more mindful of their emissions and such, as time goes on as well. So, through our own
01:43activities and working with customers and partners, hopefully business will drive that
01:50change as well, and then hopefully see governments following suit, because companies will need,
01:57there's going to come a point where companies need to demonstrate to other companies that
02:03they're green and efficient, and some of that might come from energy production, so companies
02:09won't deal with another company unless they've got green energy or a certain level of emissions.
02:16So, I think, in the end, government are going to have to help, because everyone's going
02:21to want to only do business with those people that have the greenest of credentials.
02:26So, I think it's really, it's again another interesting topic and set of challenges.
02:34I think private business is leading the way in many respects, but I think when you boil
02:43it all down, private businesses compete against each other for client, so we're very good
02:52at ploughing our own trough and driving in our own direction. We're not very good at
02:58coming together as a collective to get something done for the greater good. It's not what we're
03:04set up to do, and it's not part of our DNA, and I think we can do more in that respect,
03:12and I think that these conversations and more open engagement with all stakeholders, government
03:20included, we can get more engagement, but we've been on our own journey for the last
03:26five years and longer. We don't actually cross paths very often, and that's because
03:31businesses tend to do their own thing, because they have a mandate to deliver certain ambitions,
03:38and they don't come in and collaborate as well as we could. And actually, in the sustainability
03:44piece, there's nothing to compete against. It's all about trying to create an environment
03:49that is good for everyone. It's quite unusual for that, for those circumstances to align
03:56in business. We might be nice to one another, but at the end of the day, you don't want
04:02my, well you do want my clients, and I want your clients, and that's just the way it is,
04:09and you want my people and I want your people, and we're very, you know, businesses tend
04:14to operate on their own and touch lightly, and this is an opportunity for business to
04:22come together and be much more collaborative, and that hasn't happened yet, and we can do
04:27more to make that happen.
04:29I might just say that two things that I always say to government around what makes the right
04:38atmosphere for doing this right, the sustainability journey and the net zero journey, there are
04:42two things, and they've actually been touched on today. One is targets and years, and maybe
04:48if I pick up your point actually about let's make it 2045, you know, why not make it 2045?
04:53Because the worst that happens is it's 2050 anyway.
04:55Exactly.
04:56You know, and we have the same discussion around the target which has been set by government
05:00for 100% renewable electricity by 2030 is really ambitious, so again, ahead of other
05:07countries, and is achievable, but hey, if we're not there by 2030 and it happens to
05:11be 31 or 32, don't stop. None of these targets are cliff edge things. You're actually taking
05:17decisions that are so long term that it's right to have a target to go for, and you
05:22can maybe make it more ambitious, and the worst that happens is that you don't achieve
05:25it.
05:26But the other thing I say to them is also around don't underestimate, where we have
05:30a great private sector in the island who can do a lot of this stuff, don't underestimate
05:34actually how small a message you can send with simple things, and I can say that by
05:39having the Climate Change Act introduced, having the Climate Change Action Plan, and
05:44having that first island plan, which led to an energy strategy now, that's enough for
05:48us to take the call it did, which is to revisit the Moor Valley and go for it, and give the
05:53commitments we have, and we obviously, as Offshore Wind does, it means spending significant
05:58amounts of development at risk, because we don't know whether we'll get the planning
06:01that we need, but if you set that tone, look at the UK in Offshore Wind, it's a world
06:06leader, and that comes from a place where you really have the Energy Act introducing
06:11that back in 2008. We've got some projects that were awarded in 2010 that won't be up
06:17and running until 2029. That is, it's long term, and for businesses there, I mean I won't
06:23go into how many general elections there have been in the UK between 2010 and 2019, but
06:30quite amazingly, and we discussed this of course at the moment with the announcement
06:34yesterday, we discussed what the implications are for us as a business that has 40 odd percent
06:39of Offshore Wind in the UK. We're extremely lucky because of the consensus for so many
06:45years and into decades about this issue, and about the future energy strategy, and that
06:50is I think what's changed just in the last five years on the Isle of Man, and my main
06:54message is stick with it, because the reward at the end is going to be worth it.
06:59It comes back to framework doesn't it? It comes back to putting out the long term vision
07:05and creating a framework around it.
07:07If I could just come to that. The problem about the 2030 100% renewable electricity
07:16is ambitious, I agree, but that was driven by an idea that they could achieve that, as
07:24MUA. The problem with it is they're importing, the strategy is to import electricity from
07:31the UK, so by not creating emissions on the Isle of Man. Well that's all very well until
07:38the regulations change, when CO2 being produced elsewhere has to be counted here. That's
07:48the nonsense, so that's where a date that's been ill thought through, or a solution that's
07:55been ill thought through to match a date doesn't work, and that would set us back years, so
08:01that's why, going back to your principles of abundant natural resources to help renewable
08:07energy here on the Isle of Man, because of that security they're having to spend money
08:12to a third party off the Isle of Man to get electricity. So that's the problem, and that's
08:17where it becomes quite complicated and that's where there's a lot of detail behind the scenes
08:21to try and understand the importance of that solution.
08:23I suppose from my point of view that this point about targets, it's a different perspective.
08:27We set bold, ambitious targets, not worrying about whether we hit them or not. I suspect
08:33government sets targets desperately concerned that it doesn't miss them.
08:38What happens is, someone comes up with a solution, that means we can get renewable
08:44electricity here by 2030. Right, let's set a target for 2030, already knowing how you're
08:50going to deliver it, but unfortunately that's then blinkered, so you're not looking at the
08:54best solution, you're trying to back up something you've already come up with.
08:57I can give you the simple example of what we're planning, because if you take that, what you
09:02said to the degree, you could aim for 2030 to be achievable and that's through basically
09:08relying on interconnection and buying it from somewhere else. That's a decision you take
09:13then to be exposed to the market that you're buying it from for the next 35, 45 years.
09:20Our project will come along in 32 or 33 in Man's waters, six miles from the coast, run
09:27a cable, and that could be, I mean we're building the lowest cost form of electricity
09:32generation right now, never mind what we'll be doing then on the cost curve, right on
09:36the doorstep, and only by waiting for half a decade, the next 30, 40 years could be a
09:43fantastic outcome for the consumers and the other industry. And that's the really tricky
09:48part, that's the really tricky part.
09:49That's the cable I would buy, cable to you, not to the UK.
09:53I can't, for instance, sign up to anything coming from the UK, because we can't say where
10:02the source is coming from. If I'm going to sign up to a green energy tariff, it has to
10:09be from a green energy tariff, not it could have been generated from green energy. So
10:16every way you talk about green energy tariffs, whether it's now or in 2030 when there's no
10:22CO2, I can't sign up to that, I have to know the source, you have to know the source in
10:30order to be able to say I feel comfortable when I do need to consume green electricity.
10:36Hopefully I won't by 2030, but if I do, at least I know it's truly green and not just
10:43coming down the pike from the UK.
10:45The thought of a dystopian future, where by the mid 2030s, so not far actually, we could
10:53have a successful large offshore wind farm selling power to the UK consumers, generating
10:59revenue, coming back to Treasury, so creating opportunity there for public spending. But
11:04on the other hand, because of decisions taken, we may have a very volatile price market for
11:10our own consumed electricity because of decisions to do something else by a different avenue.
11:14The targets are what they are, and I'm not going to debate what government targets should
11:18be. There are many political observations on that already, but it's a bit of the same
11:24as you say, I'm sort of joined up thinking, and I think what I'm saying is it doesn't
11:28take a lot more. Don't go down the path of thinking you have to regulate everything and
11:32tell everyone line by line what the rules should be, but also don't make the wrong decisions
11:39at the wrong time where private business just gets put off.
11:42So authentic isn't it, you want to be authentic, you want to have a clear view, be authentic,
11:47and it's complex.
11:49Which makes it very difficult to communicate.
11:52And it's politics, so there will always be election cycles.