Sheila Johnson, the CEO of Salamander Hotel And Resorts, sits with Forbes senior editor Maggie McGrath at the Forbes 30/50 Summit to discuss her career, and the lessons and principles she's learned along the way.
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LifestyleTranscript
00:00 - Sheila Johnson, thank you for coming to the 30/50 Summit.
00:03 - This is just such an honor, you have no idea.
00:06 - The honor is ours.
00:07 You have so many titles to your name.
00:10 You are a founder, you are a musician, a philanthropist,
00:14 the owner of sports teams, to a degree
00:16 that no other black woman in the US has reached.
00:19 You also wrote a book in which you write about your life
00:23 and you write about your philosophy of running businesses.
00:26 And one of the things that really stood out to me
00:27 was your entrepreneurial instincts were there
00:31 even in your 20s, well before you reached where you are now.
00:36 How do you think you honed those business instincts?
00:39 - I think it's really believing in people.
00:42 So many people, it's really funny
00:46 'cause I was visiting with Kara Swisher
00:49 who has her book that just came out.
00:51 And she was talking about how entrepreneurs start out
00:55 and then suddenly they become successful, very successful,
01:00 and they go from the Levi set to the Cashmere set.
01:04 And they just kind of lose touch with people.
01:07 And I think one of the things I know because I believe in,
01:11 I really do believe in people
01:13 and really trying to bring people along.
01:16 And it's all about leadership.
01:18 You can lead any company,
01:19 but what kind of leader are you really gonna be?
01:22 Are you gonna be an empathetic leader
01:24 or a mentoring type leader, domineering leader?
01:28 I like to be a leader that really inspires my employees.
01:33 And I've mentioned this before, I call it HAARP.
01:37 It's about being honest, authentic,
01:40 respectful, and passionate.
01:43 And to be able to clearly be able to communicate
01:46 to my employees my vision of how I wanna grow my company.
01:50 And I have to teach them and work with them
01:52 on how to buy into that.
01:55 And you have to be very careful with whom you hire
01:59 because if they come in with their own agenda,
02:02 you don't wanna keep them.
02:03 They need to buy into the vision and into the teamwork
02:07 and be able to work as a team to help you build your company
02:11 - And you've had experience with people
02:12 who had their own agenda.
02:14 - Oh yes.
02:15 - Early days of one company,
02:17 you even caught someone stealing.
02:18 - Yes.
02:20 - So the philosophy there is you hire slowly
02:23 and you fire fast.
02:26 - Hire slowly, fire fast.
02:28 - Yeah.
02:29 - That's good advice.
02:30 You've also shown the ability to have
02:32 a remarkable commitment to the long-term vision
02:35 while other people might be tempted for the short-term,
02:39 optimizing for the short-term.
02:41 You write about the BET IPO and what some people
02:44 and like your co-founder wanted to do with the company.
02:46 - Right.
02:47 - And you had a different vision.
02:48 How did you manage to stick to that vision
02:50 and convince others that what you wanted to do
02:53 was the right path?
02:55 - Well, I'm not sure if I was able during that time
02:57 to convince them.
02:58 I just knew what I needed to do and the value system
03:01 that needed to be built within the company.
03:03 Some people didn't believe in it.
03:06 My co-founder didn't believe in it.
03:08 And it was a case where even when you're doing an IPO,
03:11 because our IPO didn't last very long,
03:14 there was not enough patience to really understand
03:19 how to grow the company and have the patience
03:23 to make it work.
03:24 There are too many people that are always interested
03:29 in the bottom line and how they're gonna make money fast.
03:33 And when you do that, that money doesn't last very long.
03:36 So you've gotta be very strategic
03:39 on how you wanna grow the company.
03:42 And there were just so many mistakes that I could see
03:45 that were happening, like not really identifying
03:49 the ages that we really wanted to strategically hit
03:54 with our programming.
03:58 So our programming never could grow.
04:01 And because of that, we got into the video market
04:05 way too fast 'cause MTV did not wanna promote
04:10 black videos at all.
04:12 That was a door that opened.
04:14 That was great.
04:16 But let's stick to the value system.
04:18 I didn't like what I was seeing on the screen.
04:21 And that's when I then decided to do a show
04:23 called Teen Summit to really teach young people
04:27 about smart TV watching.
04:29 And that's what was really important to me.
04:32 - You were overlooked and discounted and ignored
04:36 as a co-founder of BET for so long.
04:38 But then in your third act, you've come into your own
04:41 as an entrepreneur.
04:43 You have such a successful hotel line property.
04:48 How have you been able to overcome those days
04:53 of being overlooked?
04:55 - I think it was a case with the help of therapy
04:59 and my mother, where they reminded me
05:02 that I did have what it would take to build another company.
05:07 I think when you're in an abusive relationship,
05:11 you have no idea how you lose sense of yourself.
05:15 And I was losing sense of myself.
05:17 And I didn't have the security within myself
05:22 to even think about what I needed to do.
05:25 I lost belief in myself.
05:28 I didn't know who I was.
05:29 And then slowly, once I got out of a toxic relationship,
05:34 I was then able to rebuild my life.
05:37 And it took time and lots of help from a good doctor
05:42 and was able to then really strategically
05:48 put together a path in which I needed to start going on.
05:53 And when I decided, I've had no intentions
05:56 of going in the hotel business,
05:57 and I knew nothing about it.
05:59 But what I did know what I had to do,
06:02 if that was what I was gonna do,
06:03 I needed to hire the smartest people out there.
06:08 And they had to be smarter than me.
06:10 And I was gonna learn from them.
06:12 And the fine line that you,
06:16 and I still everyday work on this.
06:20 The fine line is you hire smarter people,
06:23 but you don't want them to overtake you
06:28 and take you for granted.
06:30 You know what I'm saying?
06:31 - I was going to ask you that.
06:32 It's a tricky balance.
06:33 - It's a very tricky balance.
06:35 And I think part of it is I had the power of finance,
06:40 which they did not have.
06:43 And also I was able to communicate my vision
06:46 and they really bought into my vision.
06:49 And because of that, we're probably one of the most
06:52 successful luxury hotel companies out there.
06:55 We're recognized by Forbes.
06:58 We won this award last week.
07:00 Our hotel in Middleburg is one of 13 in the world
07:04 to receive 15 stars.
07:07 And all of our other hotels are Forbes four stars.
07:11 So as I told the company, I said,
07:14 "Okay, don't sit back on your laurels.
07:16 "We have got to keep those 15 stars
07:18 "and we've got to work on the rest of the resorts
07:21 "to get the five stars."
07:23 So we are very wedded to Forbes, to the training.
07:27 I have actually sat in on the training myself
07:30 to understand what it takes to get the Forbes awards.
07:35 And that's important.
07:37 I was learning the whole time,
07:39 but still able to communicate what I wanted.
07:44 And I knew my design.
07:46 I knew exactly what I want the hotels to look like.
07:48 I picked the furniture out.
07:50 I've designed linens.
07:52 I do all of that, but that's all from my arts background.
07:55 So all of that has built in to where my vision takes me.
08:00 - There are so many details in the book
08:03 that illustrate the ways in which you've invested
08:05 in yourself.
08:06 And this is a small detail relative
08:08 to the other important lessons,
08:11 but you used your own art collection
08:14 to decorate your property.
08:16 - Oh yes.
08:17 - And I just thought that was so fitting.
08:20 It felt so full circle
08:21 because these were pieces you had invested in
08:24 with a property that you had to fight
08:26 the local municipality,
08:27 you had to negotiate,
08:29 you had to be strategic.
08:30 And then when it came time to decorate it,
08:32 you're looking at your own art collection.
08:33 - Yes.
08:34 And there were times when I wanted to cut the budget
08:37 a little bit.
08:38 So I did all my own photography,
08:39 the photography's in all of the rooms.
08:42 And as you get off the elevators,
08:44 there's my work there.
08:46 So I've done even my own personal work
08:48 and I designed the linens and I made the mistake.
08:52 They were all coming out of Italy
08:54 and I said, I can't keep this up.
08:56 I gotta go on a cheaper route.
08:57 (laughing)
08:58 But the same design is still in the linen.
09:01 It's just that I use another manufacturer.
09:04 - Do guests realize that it's your photography?
09:06 - Oh, they know.
09:07 - Oh, they know, they know.
09:08 - 'Cause I sign it.
09:09 - Okay, okay.
09:10 You are proud of your name.
09:11 - Yes.
09:12 - As you should.
09:13 - Absolutely.
09:14 - I love sports.
09:15 And I know I've mentioned this to you multiple times,
09:16 but I think the fact that you own stakes
09:19 in three professional sports leagues in the US
09:21 is remarkable.
09:22 But quite literally, there is no other black woman
09:24 who can say the same.
09:25 Can you talk about how it was that you came to do that
09:28 and why it was important for you
09:30 to get involved in this arena?
09:31 'Cause you could have stuck to the arts.
09:32 - I know.
09:33 I think this is kind of serendipitous in the sense
09:36 that I became friends with the original owner
09:40 of the Capitals and the Wizards and the Mystics.
09:43 I was always friends and respected this man.
09:49 And it's all in the book.
09:52 - Yeah, you got an interesting call from your ex saying,
09:55 "Don't do this to me."
09:57 - Don't do this to me.
09:58 Because he wanted to own the teams.
10:02 So what had happened, he really disrespected A. Pollin.
10:07 A. Pollin was very gracious.
10:10 He never reacted, and he never forgot.
10:14 So one day he called me and he says,
10:16 "I want you to be the face of the Washington Mystics."
10:19 And I said, "What do you mean by being the face of?"
10:21 He says, "I'd like you to own it."
10:23 I said, "But the Mystics doesn't make money."
10:26 And he said, "But look, I'm giving you an opportunity."
10:31 And I said, "I'm not turning it down.
10:33 "Give me the financials."
10:35 He says, "Please make up your mind soon."
10:37 I then called my lawyer and I said,
10:39 "I've just been offered a sports team."
10:41 And he says, "You should not buy a sports team."
10:45 I said, "If you were in that position
10:47 "and if you were offered a sports team, what would you do?"
10:51 And he got very quiet.
10:53 I said, "You just answered my question."
10:55 I said, "Now I want you to get Ted Leonsis on the phone,
10:58 "and I have the money I want to buy into the Wizards,
11:03 "the basketball NBA team, and the hockey team.
11:07 "And I wanna be a really substantial partner."
11:12 And so I was able to do that.
11:17 And eventually Ted named me vice chairman
11:19 of Monumental Sports.
11:21 He's chairman, I'm vice chairman.
11:23 And I've been a very active partner
11:27 in reaching out into the community
11:29 and really helping that franchise be successful.
11:34 You know, I mean, we won a Stanley Cup
11:36 and my women won the national title.
11:40 So.
11:41 - You're doing pretty, you have a pretty good track record.
11:43 - Pretty good, yeah.
11:44 Now we're in a rebuilding process.
11:46 Whenever you win titles, it's a refresher course again.
11:50 - As a Philadelphia Eagles fan,
11:52 I know this entirely too well.
11:54 - Oh yeah.
11:54 - But what I wanted to come back to
11:57 is a theme that I've noticed in the way
11:58 that you talk about your business decisions
12:00 and your personal real estate decisions.
12:02 You seem unafraid to say, "That's not the right value.
12:06 "I want this."
12:08 Or, "That can't make money, but this can, and I want that."
12:12 I will speak for myself.
12:13 That's something I have trouble doing.
12:16 I think a lot of women can struggle
12:18 with being very open about financial decisions
12:21 and financial moves.
12:22 And I know you've also been involved through your philanthropy
12:25 with girls' economic empowerment.
12:27 So we could probably have a five-hour conversation
12:29 about how to empower women economically.
12:31 But what do you tell to women and girls around the world
12:35 about better optimizing their own financial power?
12:39 - First of all, you really have to get out in the world
12:42 and understand the way the world's working.
12:44 If you're not worldly in the sense
12:47 and you're watching other deals going down
12:49 and what's worked, what's not worked,
12:52 there's more startup companies,
12:54 even in the tech industry, that fail immediately.
12:57 You need to hone your instincts.
13:00 And not only that, just don't keep it to yourself,
13:04 but you bring advisors in, and they will school you
13:08 whether it's smart or it's not smart.
13:11 And sometimes I will do things and I will say,
13:14 "I know this is gonna work."
13:16 And there've been a couple of investments
13:18 I'm like, "I should have done it."
13:20 Like there's this company, Framebridge,
13:23 that this woman started.
13:25 She asked me to invest in it,
13:26 and people told me not to do it.
13:29 And I'm really, to this day, I regret it.
13:32 And I use her all the time.
13:34 I just think it's one of the most brilliant companies
13:37 that she's been able to start.
13:39 You have to really keep your eyes and your ears open.
13:42 And I'll tell you a story.
13:43 I was in the owner's box, and I hear my partners,
13:48 and they're talking to each other about investments.
13:52 And there was this one investment
13:53 that one of the partners wanted to start.
13:57 And he says, "I've gotten X number of thousands of dollars
14:00 "from Michael Jordan," and they're naming these names.
14:03 And I'm more like, "Well, if they're gonna invest in that,
14:07 "why couldn't I?"
14:08 And I said, "Wait a minute,
14:09 "what are you all talking about?"
14:11 And they said, "What are you talking?"
14:12 I said, "I'm listening to you,
14:13 "and I wanna be in this conversation,
14:16 "and I would like to invest."
14:18 Well, it may be closing.
14:21 I said, "No, open it back up.
14:24 "I wanna invest in it."
14:25 And to this day, I'm an investor in this company.
14:28 But you have to have, what is it, the perseverance?
14:33 - The gumption.
14:35 - The gumption.
14:37 You need to get in there and express your feelings.
14:40 - You need to say, "I wanna be in this conversation."
14:42 - And it's the way you communicate that
14:45 with strength and confidence.
14:48 You know, say, "I wanna be in there with you."
14:50 No, "I wanna be in there with you."
14:54 - I hope we hear more women say that.
14:56 It's hard, though.
14:57 It's hard when the boys do the boy thing
14:59 and go off in a group,
15:01 and we don't have enough women in these spaces.
15:04 - Yeah, you know, it's really interesting.
15:07 The students that I put through school,
15:08 especially through the Kennedy School,
15:11 when they graduated, I gave them all a set of golf clubs.
15:15 And they're like, "Why?"
15:16 I said, "Because there's more decisions made
15:18 "on the golf course than any other place."
15:21 And so they've all learning to play golf,
15:24 and they're going out there to play with it.
15:26 - It's a good life skill.
15:27 - Yeah.
15:29 - And you also own a golf course.
15:31 - Oh, boy, do I.
15:33 I'm part of the PGA Tour.
15:34 - And the only black woman to do so.
15:37 - Yeah.
15:38 - You're breaking barriers left and right.
15:40 (silence)
15:42 (silence)
15:45 (silence)
15:47 [BLANK_AUDIO]