Jonny Drury and Lewis Cox sat down to answer questions on West Brom from our E&S Plus subscribers.
We asked for Albion fans who are also subscribers to get in touch with questions they wanted answering.
And in this video they range from Carlos Corberan and potential interest, the summer transfer window, FFP and the fall out from the Black Country derby.
We asked for Albion fans who are also subscribers to get in touch with questions they wanted answering.
And in this video they range from Carlos Corberan and potential interest, the summer transfer window, FFP and the fall out from the Black Country derby.
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SportsTranscript
00:00 Hello, Baggies fans and welcome back to the Express and Start.com. I should say welcome
00:12 Baggies fans who are also our ENS Plus subscribers. We've been out getting in touch with you over
00:18 the last few days. We've asked you to get in touch with some burning questions that
00:22 you want answered. And we're going to be talking directly to you, our Plus subscribers, for
00:27 the next sort of 10 minutes or so. We've got a few questions on various different things
00:30 to do with Albion. So I'm here alongside Mr. Lewis Cox, the West Brom correspondent. So
00:36 we're going to get straight in to the questions. I've got one here from Baggie fan, Eric Dore.
00:43 Eric, thank you very much for your question. Who's asked about finances, FFP, all the boring
00:49 stuff in the game, really. But very important, Eric, nonetheless. Regarding FFP and our
00:56 losses last year and this year, is this going to have a significant impact on our spending
01:03 possibilities in the close season? I think, Coxy, the short answer for Eric's question
01:11 is yes.
01:12 Yes, Johnny. Hi, Eric. Thank you very much for getting in touch. And the question, I
01:17 think, Johnny, we did a podcast, didn't we, not so long ago, the last one we recorded
01:22 and we spoke a bit about this. Hopefully it's something Eric will be able to listen to.
01:25 But yeah, I mean, the long and short of it is yes. Now, I think it's worth clarifying
01:32 here, look, Albion are in a much, much far better position now under Shillam Patel than
01:38 clearly they were with Gauchan Lai. And the forecast for the mid to long term future is
01:43 good and bright, but it doesn't mean there aren't challenges immediately ahead as Albion
01:48 look to recover from the situation that Patel invested.
01:54 So with that, we have the accounts not so long ago, didn't we? I think it was April.
02:00 They were published to Companies House and we did a report. Now, of course, these are
02:03 accounts to June 23. So one year behind, which means, yeah, and they were tough reading,
02:10 you know, 11 million pound losses for the club group losses were 7 million odd. Now,
02:16 we know when we reported at the time that the next set of accounts, which will come
02:20 early next year, which will be to June 24. So which will be to as we sit in now and next
02:26 month, as we reported, they're going to be damning. They're going to be significantly
02:31 worse than those losses I just mentioned, those 11 million, 7 million pound losses,
02:36 because that's where Albion have been this season, as we talk now at this 23/24 season.
02:42 So it's been a season without parachute payment money from Premier League relegation. And
02:47 it's been a season, certainly until February and the takeover of no investment from any
02:54 ownership. Obviously, the absent owner was either unable or unwilling to invest life
03:00 and running on loss and no way to foot it. So, as I say, the losses will worsen. Now,
03:07 you mentioned, Eric, profit and sustainability rules of financial fair play, and those currently
03:13 stand at that. They have a cap, they have rules. So championship clubs cannot lose more
03:19 than 39 million pounds across three seasons. Obviously, that works out at 13 million pounds
03:23 a season. Now, Albion's loss was 11. The group loss was at 7. And the EFL take group figures
03:30 so that they take 7. But we expect this to worsen significantly. So by the second load
03:36 of that 39 million, you can't lose over three years. Albion are going to be sailing close
03:41 to choppy waters, really. So a lot's got to be done to obviously address that, to make
03:48 up for that, to ensure Albion don't come a cropper with regulations, as we've seen clubs
03:53 in the top flight do, haven't we? Of course, within that, it's going to be, try and avoid
04:01 heavier losses than possible. And it's going to mean the outlays of millions of pounds
04:06 on transfer fees just for this summer, possibly, probably next summer, depending on what happens
04:10 next season, just aren't feasible in terms of millions of pounds on players. Unfortunately,
04:16 that's how it is for the near future, for the here and now, for this summer, for January.
04:23 So yeah, it's tricky, isn't it? It'll take some smart working around, wheeling and dealing.
04:27 Obviously we know this summer, 10 players, 10 senior players out of contract. As we speak
04:32 right now, Johnny, we've already seen Matt Phillips depart, long serving player, big
04:37 earner. We expect others to depart, most of those others to depart. We expect those that
04:42 agree and those that are offered that do stay. In my opinion, how I see it is that they'll
04:49 have to take dramatic wage deductions, really. It's a line in the sand summer, Eric, really,
04:57 is how we can explain it. And it does mean, as I say, for the here and now, for the immediate,
05:04 it's not going to be a drastic change. And all of a sudden we can spend millions again
05:07 now, Shillam Patel's in. That's not how it is. And if that does happen, it'll take far
05:12 extra investment because Albin will have to, ultimately, the bottom line is so close to
05:18 those sticking line with those profit and sustainability rules that just don't allow
05:22 it anymore at this level. And certainly not with the losses Albin have made so far in
05:28 the accounts we just had, as I said, to 2023. And those that come to June 2024, when we
05:35 report and write about them early next year, they'll be damning, they'll be damaging. But
05:40 on the back of this summer, Patel, his advisors will have been able to start moving Albin
05:45 into a better place, ultimately. But yes, of course, the bottom line is to your question,
05:50 it will impact on this summer spending, which will have to be smart and managed.
05:55 He's also asked, I guess we will be looking to lower the average wage, average age, as
06:00 well as our wage bill. So do you think we'll be looking at younger up and coming and hopefully
06:03 more dynamic players? Albin of tradition in the last few years had quite a high average
06:07 age of squad. There are, there have been youngsters that have come through in press. We expect
06:11 more academy players to come through this summer. But is that sort of a tactic you use
06:18 or a strategy, should we say, you expect Carlos Pogba and Ian Pearce to take in terms of bringing
06:23 in younger players rather than sort of older players?
06:26 Yeah, thanks, Eric. I mean, yeah, a few weeks ago, maybe about a month ago, I did put this
06:34 to Carlos, something he hadn't actually really spoke on at all, really, certainly at any
06:40 length. It's about the oldest average age in the Championship. And, you know, it doesn't
06:45 take a genius to work that out, does it? What I would say is a lot of the players out of
06:48 contract and those leaving are, as you say, Johnny, early, some of them mid-30s. So some
06:54 of those older players will exit this summer and naturally that will bring the age down.
07:01 Not saying that I don't think there's a possibility where someone like a Kyle Bartley, 33 now,
07:05 had a birthday this week, doesn't have a new deal at Albion. Look, that could happen. He's
07:11 still a very good performer at this level, isn't he? And Pogba might eye a new deal,
07:15 as I say, on reduced terms for him. When I put it to Corbijn, he spoke, and maybe it
07:21 was a bit of deflective and not wanting to draw an issue on it in public or whatnot,
07:27 but he spoke that he wasn't fussed by it and that he doesn't judge recruitment by the age.
07:34 He won't turn someone down because of their age or being too old or too young, I suppose.
07:39 But I suspect in his heart of hearts, he doesn't want Albion with the highest average age in
07:43 the division. And it did not work for Albion this season. Look, they were fifth, they were
07:49 best of the rest in the Championship outside of the big spend in top four, weren't they?
07:52 So it didn't fail miserably. But is it good for the club generally and for the club's
07:58 planning? No, obviously there's no resale value there. You don't necessarily have the
08:05 on-the-way-up determination of players who are pushing for the next stage of their career
08:09 to progress. That's not saying that more older, more experienced players cannot have that.
08:14 Matt Phillips left this week, didn't he? 33-year-old, been there, seen it, done it. He was as determined
08:19 as ever. However, typically you want a bit of... Ideally, you want the right balance,
08:24 don't you? Let's be honest. You can afford to have a couple of more senior players, the
08:29 other side of 30, sorry, and those more in their peak prime years. And yes, you mentioned
08:33 the younger players, Johnny. Caleb Taylor's coming through the academy. Obviously, we
08:37 know about Tom Fellows, Harry Whitwell, those ones who are real teens. But then the recruits,
08:42 you've Brandon Thomas-Sasanté as an example. Yes, I think Brandon's... He might be 25 now,
08:47 but when he came to the Hawthorne's, only 22, 23, those players on the way up, who have
08:53 the potential, the ceiling to improve. I do think they'd like to lower it. I don't think
09:00 it's, you know, oh, you'll have a lower average age next season. It guarantees a better season
09:06 and more success. But I just think it makes sense for the planning of the club. We're
09:09 here with the experienced heads, with the oldest average squad, I think because of the
09:14 way the club has been for the last few years under different sort of structures, different
09:18 football executives, different managers. And we reached a bit of a crescendo with a mishmash
09:22 of contracts, didn't we? And it feels a little bit of a line in the sand with that. And yes,
09:27 I do expect as a result of that for the age to come down.
09:30 Question we got in from Dan. Dan, thanks very much for getting in touch. How confident are
09:35 you that Albion can do some decent summer business? I know you've got a lot of ownership
09:40 that's been patched together and the work has been done late on. Cox, are you confident
09:45 that Albion can do some good summer business?
09:47 Cheers, Dan. I am. Do you know, I am. I am confident in Carlos Corbijn generally, and
09:54 that includes his recruitment. I think some of the recruitment work done by Ian Pearce,
09:59 obviously head of football ops now, in recent years has been good. Both working with their
10:04 hands tied behind their backs. It has to be said, let's be honest. I don't know how possible
10:09 it is for any of us, either of us, to say in the here and now that we're confident.
10:16 In terms of with Carlos, there's little to go by, is there? There's little to go by.
10:20 We've seen him bring in Maga as his sole permanent sign in last summer. And massive asterisks
10:29 next to Josh Madger with the season he had. And even by the end of the campaign, couldn't
10:34 get back in time to feature, could he, in the playoffs, which said a lot. It was pretty
10:38 damning. But he needs to come back, obviously fit and firing for pre-season, as I'm sure
10:43 he will. I mean, others we've seen. Nathaniel Chalaba, a free agent who was brought in to
10:51 do a job. I don't think he quite did as well as people would have hoped. Jan Mvea, a recent
10:58 one, stopped Gap, wasn't it? Let's be honest. He's getting on in his career. I don't know.
11:05 It's hard to judge that one, isn't it? Wasn't fit, obviously, and didn't quite play much.
11:10 The loans have been hit and miss, let's be honest. Mikey Johnson was Carlos' top January
11:14 target. Massive hit, clearly. Jeremy Sarmiento in the first half of the season. A little
11:21 bit less, certainly far less of a hit, wasn't he, in terms of... He was OK. He had a couple
11:28 of fleeting appearances, but not many tears were shed when Brighton recalled him. And
11:34 I think we saw, I don't know, we saw not quite the right fit there, I think we saw. So there
11:41 was that. Pippa came in on loan last summer, ended up being a backup that hardly featured,
11:46 really. Before that, if you go further back, there was Michael Brighton under Carlos. And
11:50 where Mikey Johnson was a January one that really worked, Michael Brighton was a January
11:55 one that didn't work, wasn't it? And that feeds back into the age thing, Jonny, we were
11:58 mentioning earlier. So, hit and miss under Carlos. But look, Carlos, in his time at Albion,
12:04 has been working in a very, very, very reduced field. Let's have that right, in a field of
12:11 not much budget to go at per signing, loan or permanent. And not saying that that budget
12:17 will be increased tenfold this summer. I just think that there's more scope, isn't there,
12:21 by having to fill out the squad, players that have left more scope for him to go at. And
12:26 we spoke about, again, Jonny, in our latest pod, I know we touched on it briefly, and
12:31 it's worth mentioning here as well, the manner and the structure of the recruitment has to
12:36 be right. The profile in terms of, you mentioned it, sort of harking back to the glory days
12:41 of Dan Ashworth and going up to and being in the Premier League and finding gems for
12:46 cheap, be it from Scotland, be it from the continent, or be it from further afield, South
12:51 America, whatever. Albion's recruitment team have to show, now under Shillen Patel and
12:57 under Carlos Corbijn, that they're on top of everything, because they don't have money
13:01 to throw at chances, risks there. What they do have to spend, which will be minimal, will
13:07 have to be spent as wisely as it can, coming in from wherever. So, I hope we see that.
13:12 I hope when we get the chance to ask those involved about that, they say that that's
13:17 what they're looking at and that's what they're on top of. I do have confidence in Corbijn
13:23 and his recruitment this summer. I have confidence in him as a manager and head coach generally,
13:28 but it's a hard sample size so far to kind of back that up with.
13:33 Lara A has asked, again about FFP, but in a different way, 'With the FFP restrictions
13:37 that Albion face, how can we become a sustainably successful football club?' Me and you were
13:45 talking about this before we recorded, we were discussing these questions, and it is
13:48 a very good question, Lara, although I think you will struggle, if you went up and down
13:54 the Football League and the Premier League, without the backing of an owner in the modern
14:01 era, despite FFP, it is still very difficult to be sustainable. Now, Albion did, we're
14:10 sustainable. What Mercedes said, they were running the right way under Jeremy Peace,
14:15 you know, they were delivering profits. But I think it's very difficult. I think Chilam
14:21 Patel will want to get back somewhere close to that, you know, and have Albion running
14:26 sustainably or close to sustainably, should I say. But I think it's very difficult in
14:30 modern football, Lara, with the finances and ambitions and just how football is to be run
14:37 sustainably without the backing of an owner.
14:40 Yeah, no, well, I echo that. Yeah, you won't find too many across the EFL, I dare say,
14:47 Johnny, you know, across the Championship League One and League Two, really. We've both
14:51 covered football further down the pyramid as well, haven't we? And we've seen the state
14:55 of some clubs. There are some, you know, there are precious few who are still run sort of
15:00 prudently and well. But really, you know, it's all relative, isn't it, as well? You
15:06 know, the Championship level finances, League One level finances, League Two level finances.
15:12 In terms of what can Albion do to be more sustainable? What we spoke on earlier in this
15:16 video, really, in terms of wage bills, you know, the wage bill to turnover is big for
15:23 Albion and it's, as it was before these coming to an end, it is not controllable or manageable,
15:29 really. It's out of control. The club making losses per month that the new owners have
15:34 to foot. So, there's really bringing that under control as best they can. How possible
15:39 that is, you know, I suppose we'll have to wait and see. We'll have to find out whether
15:44 that can, you know, that they're not paying out in terms of squad and salaries more than,
15:50 you know, it's being made and you're on a loss, onto a loss like that. But look, Shillen
15:55 Patel's a solid foundation that obviously comes with capital to foot. We're going to
16:02 get on and talk about what Shillen's done so far. So, he's paid off that five million
16:06 plus interest loan. He's obviously had to foot losses as it is running costs for the
16:10 season per month. So, obviously, with anyone, there's no bottomless, endless pit that Shillen
16:19 Patel will want to keep footing forever and a day with nothing back, with no success.
16:24 So, there's got to be manageable and it's got to be brought back to be smart for now.
16:28 That's in terms of sustainability. What else can they do? I don't know if there's a conversation
16:34 to be had about player sales. Don't know quite where that is at the moment. And as soon as
16:40 we do, we'll bring it to you. I've been in a better place than they were in windows sort
16:46 of gone by more recently where I think player sales were genuine. So, they had to raise
16:51 funds as best they could to cover, obviously, we know about the MSD loan, don't we, to cover
16:56 running costs. It's not, as far as I sort of believe, it's not there where it was. But
17:05 that's not to say that players won't be sold this summer. Now, as ever, there are players
17:09 Carlos Cobain won't want to lose. And to me, as a squad, there's players where they're
17:13 more open to be moved on, I think. And if clubs want to come in with an offer, then
17:17 I'll be in. I think we'll contemplate because all of that will help with running costs.
17:23 Will also help with hopefully putting money back into the club, be it in terms of salary,
17:29 wages for a new free player or a loan player that couldn't quite get to before a sale or
17:35 reinvested in terms of partly reinvested in terms of a small fee. We'll have to see. But
17:40 I wouldn't rule out sales at all, but hopefully they're the right ones Robin that can help
17:44 them move more towards being sustainable. But I think we've mentioned about a long-term
17:49 vision and long-term aim of the new ownership, haven't we? And I said earlier in one fell
17:53 swoop, this is going to be a tough ride yet and a lot to sort. So that will be part of
17:59 the mid to long-term vision, I'm sure, is how they can get all of that in line. We've
18:04 a golden dream one day of sustainability, but you're right Jonny, ultimately at the
18:10 top, it's a very tough thing to make happen while bringing success.
18:15 Graham has asked, from what you can gather about Carlos Corbijn's personality and his
18:20 commitment to Albion, do you think he could leave this summer if a good offer comes around?
18:27 Now Carlos Corbijn has previously been linked with other jobs. He was linked with Leeds,
18:31 he was linked with West Ham very briefly, and they were going for a rough patch. For
18:39 me, Coxy, I think rumours will circulate, but I fully expect Carlos Corbijn to be West
18:43 Bromwich Albion manager come the start of the season. What's your take on Graham's question?
18:50 Yeah, I think my understanding of his commitment and motivation to succeed at Albion is he
18:57 couldn't be any higher. That's what I've seen in 18 plus months. I don't expect that
19:06 to wane. In fact, I expect him to be more driven than ever off the back of a heartbreak,
19:13 let's be honest, play-off. Not going Albion's way in terms of a play-off failure. I think
19:19 now, I mentioned Lionel Nassand in the New Dawn, New Era over the last few weeks, obviously
19:24 with Patel as well. I think there's that added motivation of a more stable structure, foundation
19:30 at a club to work from. That's a boost in Albion's favour. Look, but we're all ambitious.
19:38 Everyone in football is ambitious and want to go to the top. Carlos Corbijn will want
19:42 to do it with Albion, no question. But if things happen further up the pyramid and vacancies
19:47 become available, I'm sure clubs above Albion will take note of what Corbijn's done.
19:54 He worked a miracle to get him away from trouble last time out, didn't he? And then obviously
19:59 took them to the semi-finals this time around, previously taking Huddersfield all the way
20:03 to Wembley. So, it'll be on the radar, no question. And it'll be interesting to see
20:08 if anything emerges of clubs coming, sniffing or showing some sort of interest. We know
20:13 Albion are fairly well protected financially in terms of the New Deal. Corbijn signed
20:16 a little over a year ago. So, obviously, there'll be a fee compensation that any club will have
20:22 to pay to show serious interest. But I believe his commitment to be unwavering, really, as
20:30 strong as it could be. But that doesn't for a second mean if something attractive comes
20:33 up to Carlos, then he won't have to have a look at it, I'm sure.
20:38 Nick Moss has asked, "Following the FA Cup game at Wolves, we've heard nothing from
20:42 the FA or West Midlands police. Have we got away with it?" Nick is referring to, obviously,
20:46 the crowd trouble that happened during that game, that derby match. It was the 13th of
20:53 March when West Brom were charged with misconduct by the Football Association over the crowd
20:58 disorder. In a statement, the FA said it alleged the club failed to ensure its supporters and
21:03 - sorry, spectators and/or supporters conduct themselves in an orderly fashion and don't
21:08 behave in an improper, offensive, violent, threatening, abusive, indecent, insulting
21:12 or provocative way. It was also alleged that the club failed to ensure supporters and/or
21:16 spectators refrained from throwing missiles or potentially harmful or dangerous objects
21:20 towards the pitch.
21:21 Coxsey, we haven't heard anything. And usually in these circumstances, if you haven't heard
21:26 anything, nothing has been sanctioned. But do we know anything more than that?
21:31 Yes, Johnny, you're right. We are, as we speak - thank you for that question, by the way.
21:37 It's a good question. We are, as we speak, on the back of asking. As Johnny touched on
21:42 there, having not heard anything from the authorities tends to mean that nothing has
21:47 been decided and hence, obviously, ruled and publicated. But it has been some time, as
21:53 you say. So we're chasing it up on the back of this with the relevant authorities who
21:58 will, all being well, be able to provide us with an update or an answer. The update we'll
22:03 look to bring as soon as possible might be that there is no update at the minute. There's
22:07 a - let's be honest, we don't like to remember it - but there was a lot of trouble that day,
22:10 a lot of separate issues going on. So we'll look to get an answer on that as soon as possible.
22:15 Certainly now the madness of the football and the play-off stuff has drawn to a conclusion.