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00:00Welcome to a new episode of Game Changers.
00:23to double the number of Fallout players.
00:26Welcome to a new episode of Game Changers
00:29with me, Hanan Al-Khavath, and Paul Dualipi.
00:32How are you, Paul? Exciting news for today's episode.
00:35Absolutely. I've been binging Fallout, so I can't wait to talk about it.
00:38And I got three words for you.
00:4060 million dollars. This is big news.
00:43From Saudi Arabia, but now let's check the first story.
00:46Activision Blizzard's statement that the Call of Duty League
00:49will provide better financial conditions for e-sports teams
00:52to create a more sustainable league.
00:55So, Activision Blizzard says that the Call of Duty League
00:58will offer better financial terms to e-sports teams
01:01to create a more sustainable league.
01:04So, we saw different conflicts, and this happened in the e-sports teams
01:07regarding financial issues.
01:10My question for you, Paul, after this announcement,
01:14do you think it's going to motivate them,
01:17and we will see other companies do the same, for example?
01:20Yeah, I mean, here's the challenge with Call of Duty League,
01:23and I'll put Overwatch League in the same bucket.
01:26These leagues, as e-sports leagues, for the most part failed.
01:29They did not succeed to the level that Activision Blizzard
01:32hoped that they would succeed.
01:35And a big part of the problem was the way they were structured.
01:38There were many structural issues, and a big part of those structural issues
01:41was the financial arrangement with the e-sports teams.
01:44Because what Activision Blizzard demanded at the beginning
01:47was e-sports teams put up millions and millions of dollars,
01:50pay millions, tens of millions of dollars to Activision Blizzard
01:53for the privilege of fielding a team in the Call of Duty League.
01:56And they did this because that worked for League of Legends,
01:59and it works for traditional sports.
02:02But the problem is Call of Duty League and Overwatch League
02:05doesn't have the same media rights, doesn't have the same audience.
02:08The context is different.
02:11So this is a correction. It's a major correction.
02:14But I think it may be too little, too late.
02:17Look, it's great news for the e-sports teams who are still in Call of Duty League
02:20and who are still in Overwatch League.
02:23But the audience has sort of gone away.
02:26The interest in these leagues has sort of gone away.
02:29So while the financial situation may be much improved for those teams,
02:32and now they can be sustainable for the long term, hopefully,
02:36I think in the short term there's still going to be a lot of pain.
02:39The good news is now Microsoft's backing all of it.
02:42So maybe they're willing to take a loss on this where Activision Blizzard wasn't.
02:45Time will tell us what will happen in the future, but now let's see another story.
03:00So there is a story.
03:02A few days ago, Sony Games announced two portable Web3 video game consoles.
03:05And they said these devices are the first of their kind.
03:08So how is this gaming console different from the ones in the market?
03:11I'm really curious about it.
03:14No, it's a good question.
03:17And I think we've talked about on this show recently
03:20this rise in mobile gaming devices.
03:23This is definitely a trend, and so this plays on that trend.
03:26People want to take the games that they love and play them on the road,
03:29play them when they're traveling, play them in the airport.
03:32They want mobility, and the PC gaming world right now is delivering great mobility
03:35with the Steam Deck, with the ROG Ally, with the Legion Go.
03:38We're seeing a lot of these devices.
03:41Now, the other big trend happening right now is we're seeing a resurgence
03:44in Web3 gaming investment.
03:47A lot of the Web3 gaming companies are coming back
03:50because crypto is coming back in a certain way.
03:53And so you put these two trends together, this is what you end up with,
03:56a Web3 gaming portable device.
03:59Now, unfortunately, I don't think the audience is there for these mobile devices.
04:02So I think that's the first problem.
04:05There's just not enough people playing the Web3 games to justify a mobile device.
04:08I think the second problem is hardware is really difficult.
04:11It's a really difficult business to produce hardware,
04:14and it's why we see usually only the very big companies succeed at it.
04:17Unfortunately, I think these will sort of die out at the press release stage.
04:20We may see one or two of these devices,
04:23but I have a funny feeling it's not something
04:26we're going to be talking about much longer.
04:29And now, Paul, to the story you've been waiting for, Fallout.
04:44So, Fallout games have seen around 200% increase in players' numbers,
04:47and this is due to the continued success of the Amazon TV series
04:50having the same name.
04:53So we've seen so many video games succeeded more
04:56after they did a series or a movie about them.
04:59And this, for example, happened with Sonic when we've seen it in the cinema,
05:02and so many extra players joined Sonic and revenues, let's say.
05:05So what do you think about it?
05:08Yeah, it's absolutely a trend we're seeing,
05:11this melding of different mediums around gaming,
05:14and gaming seeping into TV, seeping into movies,
05:17this Fallout series, like you said, creates this virtuous circle
05:20where you get people who play the game want to watch the series,
05:23and then people who watch the series want to go back and play the game.
05:26And so everything gets elevated as a consequence.
05:29The IP gets elevated as a consequence.
05:32And the series happens to be pretty good,
05:35and the reception has been pretty good, so that helps, obviously.
05:38You know, if the series is no good, it doesn't help.
05:41But from an IP value perspective, this is very powerful.
05:44And this approach of taking IP like Fallout,
05:47and making games, making TV, making movies,
05:50making all kinds of other content around the same IP,
05:53this is the kind of approach and strategy that will win long-term.
05:56And I guarantee we're going to see a lot, lot more of it.
05:59But as a gamer, would you love to see your favorite game on the screens?
06:02Of course, of course.
06:05But then they did the Warcraft movie, and maybe I wanted to see less of it.
06:08But, you know, there's a lot more to it.
06:11And as gamers, we want to see more of the IP that we love,
06:14on screen and in other places.
06:17Fallout just so happens to be a very rich universe,
06:20and so I think that's why it lends itself well.
06:23And Amazon did a good job with it.
06:26And now, a poll to the $60 million news.
06:29A world cup representative for e-sports
06:32and its finalist in the Saudi capital, Riyadh,
06:35revealed next summer that a group of players
06:38will reach more than $60 million,
06:41breaking previous records.
06:44So, news talk about the e-sports world cup
06:47that will be held in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia.
06:50The total prizes will reach more than $60 million,
06:53breaking previous records.
06:56So, Saudi Arabia is really investing in the video game industry.
06:59We've been talking about it in the previous episodes of Game Changers.
07:02Yeah, they're breaking their own record here, right?
07:05It was $40 million last year, now it's $60 million.
07:08They already had the record,
07:11but it's the biggest e-sports prize pool of all time,
07:14of any e-sport, of any event ever.
07:17So, they hold all the titles now.
07:20They have all the trophies.
07:23The question I have is, why keep increasing the prize pool?
07:26What benefit does it serve?
07:29Do we think more people will watch because the prize pool is bigger?
07:32You know, I have a theory that at some point,
07:35when the prize pool is big enough,
07:38you get all the attention and you get all the teams wanting to participate.
07:41Now, is big enough $10 million, $20 million, $30 million?
07:44We could probably debate it.
07:47I think at some point though,
07:50making the prize pool bigger and bigger doesn't work.
07:53It doesn't benefit you anymore and it's definitely not worth the money.
07:56And you know who realized this? It was Valve with Dota.
07:59Because the Dota prize pools continue to get bigger and bigger
08:02and at some point they realized,
08:05why are we giving all this money away?
08:08People will watch if the prize pool is $10 million or $30 million.
08:11Won't make a difference. People are still excited about it.
08:14And now, Paul, let's continue our chat with our guest for today.
08:30To talk more about the world of video games,
08:33we have Sebastian Bourget, a co-founder of The Sandbox.
09:00We are definitely seeing that at The Sandbox,
09:03where now more than 35% of our brands and partners,
09:06our audience of creators, of players,
09:09and of users who own virtual assets and LANs
09:12are actually participating in building
09:15and engaging launching experiences
09:18and all sorts of experiences and content on Sandbox.
09:21Speaking of these users,
09:24I want to talk about community,
09:27especially when it comes to Metaverse.
09:30What do you think it takes, or how important is the community
09:33to having a successful UGC-driven Metaverse platform?
09:38I think it's essential.
09:41And that's why we're so focused on being creator-driven at The Sandbox.
09:44We're focused on providing them the right tools to empower
09:47anyone to become a creator and let their imagination come to life,
09:50launching major updates on a regular basis,
09:53allowing them to create fun and engaging gameplay,
09:56allowing them to define their own rules
09:59and all sorts of mechanics
10:02that really push the vision of the Metaverse
10:05bigger than just gaming, but really allow them
10:08to incorporate culture from music, from fashion, from sport,
10:11and also culture from regions of the world,
10:14such as here in Dubai, in UAE, and also
10:17in broader Saudi Arabia, and so on.
10:20Let's talk about the brands that you work with and the brand activations in general
10:23and Metaverses. What do you think it takes for a brand
10:26activation to be successful in any Metaverse
10:29or in The Sandbox specifically, and what recommendations
10:32are you giving to brands these days?
10:35Have those recommendations changed at all over the last few years?
10:38I think every time we partner with a brand at Sandbox,
10:41we try to provide the same blueprint.
10:44It always starts by being part of the virtual map
10:47that composes Sandbox, having a virtual land
10:50where they're going to publish their experience, announcing it,
10:53and creating a neighborhood, allowing other brands and creators
10:56to become their virtual neighbor into this new virtual space.
10:59Take the time to be creative,
11:02to provide value in the form of information,
11:05of education, or even opening yourself to co-creation
11:08with your audience so they can do things that they actually
11:11can't do in the real world. That's something
11:14we shouldn't forget. It has to be fun. It has to make us want
11:17to come back and play together or compete together and earn rewards.
11:20Thank you. Thank you so much for being with us in Game Changers.
11:23Thank you for having me, and see you soon in the Metaverse.
11:26Thank you.
11:27With that, we have Sebastian Bourget,
11:30founder of The Sandbox.
11:42We're back with the Q&A segment.
11:45We have a question for X.
11:51So there's a poll on Twitter, or X,
11:54that says, is the trend of remastering classic games here to stay?
11:57And 50%, around 50%,
12:00said yes. What do you think about it?
12:03I'm surprised at these results, because I don't know why
12:06about 45% think it's not here to stay, because we've seen so much of it.
12:09And the reality is, gamers who grew up with games
12:12that they love and have nostalgia around games they love are getting
12:15older and want to relive those games. They want to relive that nostalgia.
12:18And we've seen it recently. Final Fantasy 7 had a remake.
12:21It was very successful. You had a lot of people streaming it,
12:24a lot of people playing it. The problem
12:27for the people who say no here is, remastering
12:30classic games is cheap, is highly effective,
12:33and caters to the fans, the hardcore
12:36fans of those games and those IP. So I think
12:39it's definitely here to stay. We're going to see a lot more of it.
12:42And it's much cheaper than making a new game. So, no question, the yeses
12:45here are right. I'm surprised half the people think no.
12:48I really enjoyed this episode. We've seen so many
12:51investments. We talked about the $60 million.
12:54We talked about how gaming succeeded because of series
12:57and movies. Do you have any last comment you would like to say?
13:00Yeah, it's interesting, because all the stories today at their core,
13:03it's a reminder that finance and dollars and cents
13:06are still at the core of the gaming industry. It's still driven by
13:09money and still driven by a desire to make money,
13:12and this is a good reminder of that. That's why we talk money
13:15in gaming. Absolutely.
13:36Yeah.