This Is The Impact Of Idaho Abortion Law Being Argued In Supreme Court: Idaho Planned Parenthood CEO

5 months ago

On "Forbes Newsroom," Karl Eastlund, CEO of Planned Parenthood of Greater Washington and Northern Idaho, reacted to the Supreme Court hearing about Idaho's abortion law and what he's seeing happen to women and reproductive rights in Idaho.

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Transcript

00:00 Hi, everyone. I'm Maggie McGrath, the editor of Forbes Women. And today we are joined by

00:07 Carl Eastland. He's the CEO of Planned Parenthood, Greater Washington and Northern Idaho. And

00:14 we're going to be talking about a Supreme Court case that happened just today that affects

00:18 his region. Carl, thank you so much for joining us on what is a very busy news day.

00:23 Yeah, you're welcome.

00:25 So to summarize, the Supreme Court heard oral arguments today around a case that basically

00:32 put Idaho state law and a near total abortion ban against a federal law involving emergency

00:39 medical access. And these two laws are kind of coming into conflict. As the CEO of the

00:46 Planned Parenthood affiliate in this region, can you tell me what is happening on the ground

00:51 in Idaho right now? If a person comes to the emergency room pregnant and in need of medical

00:57 attention, are they getting turned away? What are you hearing from patients?

01:01 Yeah, they absolutely are being turned away. It's an incredibly sad situation if you're

01:07 pregnant in Idaho. I think we've heard from so many doctors who are scared. They're worried

01:12 about losing their licensure. They're worried about being prosecuted. And so I think it's

01:16 really important to understand that for someone who is pregnant in Idaho right now, with the

01:21 prospect of having any kind of an emergency and having to go to the emergency room, they're

01:25 going to be turned away. And so what we've seen instead is a significant amount of individuals

01:31 coming across state lines, coming to Washington preemptively, not even trying to go to their

01:36 emergency room in Idaho first.

01:38 I was going to ask, have you found yourselves referring patients to Washington?

01:43 Oh, certainly. We have several staff who work as patient navigators. And so we're on the

01:48 phone constantly every day talking to patients who they're either seeking an abortion or

01:53 they're pregnant and are having emergencies or having difficulties with their pregnancy

01:58 and just want to know what resources they have, where they can go, what are safe, friendly

02:02 places to go. And right now, for those living in Idaho, the best thing to do is to come

02:06 to Washington. That's really their only option.

02:09 So now the Supreme Court heard the arguments today. We expect a decision in the coming

02:14 months, likely June. What happens if the court rules in favor of the state of Idaho and the

02:23 folks arguing on behalf of the state?

02:26 I think it means Idaho health care, just their safety net, their public health systems continue

02:31 to weaken as it has today. We've already seen doctors leaving Idaho. We know it's hard for

02:38 Idaho to hire and recruit doctors. For example, up in Sandpoint, which is a rural community

02:43 in very northern Idaho, they've had to shut down their maternity care. And so patients

02:49 are already having to drive 45 miles to Newport, Washington. Their maternity services have

02:55 expanded significantly. And so it'll just be a continuation of what we've been seeing

03:01 is where Washington is having to take care of Idaho patients. And it's incredibly sad

03:06 for patients. Those who can travel, it's great that they have the resources to do it,

03:10 but not everyone has that ability. And so I think it really is hard on patients who

03:14 struggle, whether they're low income or just have transportation issues.

03:19 Or work schedules that don't allow them to travel or take time off from work. We see

03:23 that from a lot of shift workers. As you talk about doctors, I'm wondering, because we hear

03:27 this from doctors out of Texas, that they can't even talk about other options for patients

03:33 who come in. That it's basically a gag order because of the state laws around abortion.

03:39 Are doctors in Idaho able currently to counsel a patient who comes in and who is pregnant

03:45 and looking for alternatives? What are they allowed to say? Or is there an effective gag

03:50 order on them in Idaho as well?

03:53 You know, they are very cautious. And the Attorney General in Idaho has not been clear.

03:57 And so out of an abundance of caution, doctors are telling us that they're just being really

04:01 overly cautious. And they're referring patients to call into Washington to try to get the

04:07 answers that they can need. And so that's why we have patient navigators who live in

04:11 Washington, work in Washington, and they can answer those phone calls and direct people

04:15 to the best care they can possibly have. So yeah, so in Washington, it's essentially muzzled

04:19 doctors as well from counseling their patients on how to get the best care possible.

04:23 Have you had to effectively reallocate your staff in this environment? Are more people

04:27 working as patient navigators than were working as navigators two years ago?

04:34 Significantly so. So I think, you know, when we knew this Dobbs decision happened, there

04:38 would be a big influx of patients from Idaho. And so, yeah, we had to shift staff resources

04:43 around. We have several clinics that are really close to the Idaho border. And so we just

04:47 had to make sure that we had the staff and the equipment ready, ready and able to see

04:51 an influx of patients. And it has been significant between our organization and a different

04:57 Planned Parenthood that works down in Oregon. The amount of patients that have had to leave

05:01 Idaho for basic care has been significant for us.

05:05 You mentioned basic care. I do know that Planned Parenthood doesn't just provide abortions.

05:10 A lot of people go for a physical, they go for contraception. Are you finding that patients

05:14 are avoiding Planned Parenthood entirely in this environment because it's becoming synonymous

05:19 with abortion care?

05:20 No, quite the opposite. I think we're known in our communities as trusted health care,

05:26 you know, for patients that are seeking the things we do. We're really the experts when

05:31 it comes to family planning services. And, you know, we've had patients say recently,

05:34 if you want an IUD or an implant, or if you need an STI check, there's no better place

05:40 to go than Planned Parenthood. We're the experts. We deal with it every single day. And so,

05:43 no, we've continued to see the value in our communities in Washington, especially that

05:49 patients know where to go if they want really expert care.

05:52 I saw a report from January as we talk about the environment that you are operating in.

05:57 You know, it's not just the law, it's the environment that's facing you guys. And I

06:00 saw a report, the headline talked about threats coming to your staff. How hard has it been?

06:06 Let's start on the recruiting side. How hard has it been to get the staff support you need

06:10 to conduct operations?

06:13 You know, I think it's hard for everyone in health care right now. And so across the board,

06:18 there are nursing shortages, doctor shortages, you know, there's practitioner shortages.

06:22 I think it's especially hard in our world, just given the intensity of the work right

06:26 now. And I think it's also hard with this upcoming election. There's a lot of people

06:30 really looking to 2024, what this election will mean and, you know, the uncertainty ahead

06:35 of us as we head into November and, you know, what that might mean.

06:38 So we're really no different than other organizations in dealing with the health care shortage.

06:43 But because of that, we have several providers who we call them fly-in. They fly in from

06:48 other communities. They care about the work and they want to make an impact in our community.

06:53 So they're flying to Spokane or they're flying to Yakima or Pasco, Washington, just to help

06:58 out as much as they can in our community. So that's been a big help as well.

07:02 And what about on the fundraising side? Do cases like today's Supreme Court hearings

07:07 like today's help you raise money?

07:11 You know, I mean, we've been fundraising for our entire existence, Planned Parenthood.

07:16 So they do help a little bit, but I think overall, our supporters have been with us.

07:22 Most of our supporters have been with us for decades. They know how important this work

07:26 is. I think recently what we've seen support for is we just call it patient assistance

07:31 funds for those patients who really have to travel and have a hardship.

07:35 And we have patients, imagine driving six hours from Boise to Kennewick, Washington.

07:42 That's a big hardship. Some of them have to leave their jobs, take several days off from

07:45 work, often find daycare for their children. And so it just can become a big hardship.

07:50 So we've had a lot of donors who have stepped up just to help provide patients with funds

07:55 that they might need to take this break from their normal lives to get the health care

07:59 that they deserve.

08:00 Now, I asked you kind of what happens if the court rules in favor of Idaho and this continued

08:06 ban. On the flip side, how does the on the ground situation change if the court rules

08:11 in favor of the United States here?

08:13 Yeah, I think it helps. It'll be interesting, though, that the rhetoric in Idaho is so hostile

08:19 already and I think just the absence of doctors not being able to have the freedom to do the

08:25 best care that they want.

08:26 I think, you know, Idaho is gone way too far with the total abortion ban. So I think it'll

08:32 help a little bit for for those patients who are really in an emergency and cannot get

08:37 to Washington. But overall, I think it still puts Idaho in a place that doesn't bring maternity

08:42 care services back to some of these hospitals that have had to close those down.

08:46 And it doesn't bring some of these doctors who have already left. They left mostly because

08:51 of jobs and the restrictions to their care. So I still think it puts Idaho severely behind

08:56 when it comes to public health and making sure that they can keep their residents safe.

09:01 In some other states, we've seen special ballot measures for voters to vote on abortion. We've

09:06 seen referendums. We've seen some legislative solutions in other states. Is there a legislative

09:12 solution on the table in Idaho? Is there the potential that this can be solved or fixed

09:18 on a legislative level?

09:20 You know, I think we just to be realistic, we have years of education still ahead of

09:24 us. I think the Idaho electorate is very conservative, I think often uninformed and doesn't we need

09:30 to do more work just to continue to educate voters and make sure they know what's at stake

09:35 so that they can elect officials that will basically change these laws. So, yeah, there

09:39 is there's work to be done. There is no legislative solution right now that that's you know, we

09:43 think is has a viable chance in Idaho, but we're not going to give up. And we know that

09:48 there's some important work ahead to make that happen.

09:51 What are you looking to next? I mean, today was a big day in the court, but what is on

09:55 your radar for the next month, three months, six months, etc?

10:00 I think that that November election that is on our radar, we have to do well and win.

10:05 I think, you know, we've seen what has happened with these attacks across the country in various

10:09 states. We're really lucky to be in a state like Washington where we have such strong

10:13 support. But federally, we need to have a really good election outcome. So we want to

10:18 make sure we continue to take care of patients day in, day out. Our staff do a great job

10:22 of that, but also do everything we can to make sure we educate voters and they can make

10:26 the right decision in November.

10:29 Is there anything you would say to the Forbes national audience? Right. We don't just have

10:33 viewers in Idaho or Washington about why this case and why the situation that you're

10:39 overseeing matters to them.

10:43 You know, I would say 80, 88 percent of women say that they support access to abortion in

10:50 these kind of situations. This is this is so sad that we're even having to debate this.

10:56 This is really what we consider basic care. When you talk to the medical community, this

11:02 is so obvious that we should be able to let doctors practice within their full scope and

11:07 do the best that they can for patients.

11:09 So I think, you know, the message we want to make clear is that this is really sad that

11:13 Idaho politicians are playing games with with people's lives and their ability to have children

11:19 in the future. And it's it's sad that that's putting the burden on health care providers

11:23 in Washington to be there in circumstances when we really shouldn't have to do that.

11:28 We should be able to focus on other things like expanding primary care and expanding

11:32 mental health and other types of programs.

11:34 And instead, here we are left fixing some of Idaho's really sad problems.

11:41 Did I miss anything? Is there anything that we're not talking about here that we should

11:44 hit on in our final minutes of this conversation?

11:47 No, I think I think you covered it well. Thank you.

11:51 Well, thank you so much for joining us. We really appreciate hearing your perspective

11:55 and your insight.

12:23 (upbeat music)

This Is The Impact Of Idaho Abortion Law Being Argued In Supreme Court: Idaho Planned Parenthood CEO

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