PGA president Stephanie Allain, producer Datari Turner ('Luther: Never Too Much'), actor Fred Hechinger and producer Zoë Worth ('Thelma'), producer and Imagine Documentaries president Sara Bernstein ('Frida'), producer Shivani Rawat ('Love Me,' 'Winner'), and producer Stacey Reiss ('The Perfection/) joined The Hollywood Reporter's Chris Gardner for a nearly one-hour long panel about the ins and outs of the Sundance Film Festival and all things producing.
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PeopleTranscript
00:00 Hello, everybody. It's wonderful to gather on a kind of a great, wonderful Friday afternoon.
00:05 It's brought you ahead into a weekend. Fabulous time together out here at Sundance again, 2024.
00:10 I'm John Partilla. I'm the CEO of ScreenVision Media. And we're very, very delighted to play
00:15 a small part in the partnership between Hyundai and The Hollywood Reporter, as we embark in a
00:21 very, very interesting discussion with the Producers Guild of America. And I don't know
00:27 tons about the intricacies of this business, but what I do know is that the people that work in
00:32 this business really are the ones that make it happen, that bring together the art and the craft
00:37 and the sweat and the blood to produce such great works of art that we all get to enjoy, that
00:41 really, I think, celebrate and inspire what is so important and interesting in our culture today.
00:48 So without further ado, I'd like to introduce the moderator and head of our panel, which is
00:52 Chris Gardner, the senior staff writer of The Hollywood Reporter, who will do an amazing job,
00:56 I know, today and drive a very, very interesting conversation for us all. Thank you.
01:01 Thank you for the introduction, John, and thank you so much for being here. And thanks to Hyundai
01:10 and ScreenVision Media for helping us do this. I also like you said, we're going to drive a good
01:16 panel for the nice tie-in with Hyundai. And I feel like everyone is here. We got the talent in the
01:22 building, and now our job is just to produce a good panel. So we got the right people for that.
01:27 I'm going to introduce our today's panelists. I'm so happy that they're all here,
01:30 starting with the one and only Stephanie Allain, who is the president of the Producers Guild.
01:36 And she's also here this year with a movie called Exhibiting Forgiveness, which we can't wait to
01:40 dig into. Fred Hechinger, who's an actor that stars in a Sundance title called Thelma, and his
01:48 producer, Zoe Worth, also from Thelma, and they had their big premiere last night and another
01:53 screening this morning. We want to talk to them about how it went. Sarah Bernstein has a movie
01:57 here as well, Frida. She's also the president of Imagine Documentaries, correct? I like to tell
02:04 people what they do for a living while I look at them. This is what you do. I think in Sundance,
02:10 everybody needs to be told what they're doing and when. So Stacey Reese, who also had a movie here
02:15 a couple years ago, Not the Perfection. That was your last project. But before that, you had a
02:21 movie here. I had Spaceship Earth here in 2020. And then in 2016. In 2016, I had The Eagle Huntress
02:28 and Suited both here. Right. Thanks for being here. I can't wait to hear about those and especially
02:33 the one in 2020, which was acquired by Neon. So we'll talk about that. Dottari Turner, welcome.
02:39 How are you? So happy you're here. He has a movie called Luther, Never Too Much, which is premiering
02:45 here at the festival. The very first ever full-length documentary about Luther Vandross.
02:50 And Shivani Rawat, who is amazing. It's amazing that you're here, that we're seeing her in one
02:56 place. She has three movies here this year. So thank you so much for taking time out of your
03:00 busy schedule to be here. She has a movie called Love Me, which premiered earlier this afternoon
03:04 with Kristen Stewart and Steven Yeun. So I want to hear about how that went. And I also want to
03:10 say thanks again to everyone who's here. I know that there's a lot of very smart people in this
03:14 room, not to make you, not to intimidate anyone. So I'm going to start with Stephanie. Just in
03:18 case there's people in this room who may not actually know what a producer does. I hate to
03:23 start with such a silly question, but let's pretend that you were at the Pendry Bar and you
03:27 met the president of a marketing division. They're like, I've always wanted to know exactly what does
03:31 a producer do? How would you answer that? I would answer everything. What don't we do?
03:38 I think the producer is the uber champion of the film. And what that means is when I have
03:48 a project, no one gets in that circle unless they love the movie, they understand the movie,
03:56 they can contribute 150% to the movie. And just to make sure that the circle that we create
04:03 for our director to go do his or her thing or their thing is a safe space and gives them the
04:12 opportunity to do their best work. So what do we do? We do, we work on the script, we work on
04:19 casting, we go by the costume department, we work on the budget, we work on the locations,
04:27 everything that happens on a movie, a producer touches. That's not an answer, but that's what
04:34 it is, right? That's the best answer. That's the best answer. And then as PGA president,
04:39 what are your duties? Susan, what are my duties? Where is she? Susan is the CEO. She's the boss.
04:49 I work for her. Donald and I are co-presidents together, but we each have the president title.
04:55 And basically we just advocate for producers. Our biggest cause right now,
05:00 a lot of you guys are producers, so I'm sure you know this, but producers are the only line item
05:07 on a budget that has no minimum and no health insurance. How can that be? We have no collective
05:15 bargaining organization. So what the PGA does is educates and advocates for producers. And right
05:20 now we are working hard to figure out how we can make sure that when a producer is on set,
05:28 that person is covered just like the PA is covered. That's a big job. By the way, speaking of
05:35 educating and advocating, I think Stephanie has been educating me on her career, her work,
05:40 her films, the industry. I think I've interviewed you my entire career. We are the same age.
05:45 But I was just thinking, listening to you talk and thinking just the fact that we're sitting here in
05:51 Sundance and all the venues that I have interviewed you and bugged you about your work. Congratulations
05:56 for coming back another year. How many Sundances have you been to? No, I was, my husband, we were
06:01 trying to count them and literally we couldn't. I'm going to have to look, but I don't know,
06:07 eight, 10, something like that. All first time directors and as is Titus Kaphar, who directed
06:15 Exhibiting Forgiveness, who is a first time director, but a master painter, a master American
06:22 painter. And the movie is by far, I think the best thing I've ever produced in my career.
06:29 And I can't wait for people to see it tomorrow. Tomorrow, three o'clock.
06:34 That's a bold statement coming from you, looking at your enviable resume. And I actually thought
06:38 of you last night. I covered Opening Night, the gala where Christopher Nolan and Kristen Stewart
06:43 and a bunch of people, Celine Song got awards. And Christopher Nolan said something interesting
06:47 about how he doesn't classify himself as an independent filmmaker. And he doesn't think
06:50 that's a thing because filmmakers are so dependent on other people. And he said,
06:54 poets can be independent, painters can be independent. And I was like, Stephanie Lane
06:58 has an independent movie with a painter. So this is like speaking directly to you.
07:02 As a producer, how does your job change when you're producing a film with a first time
07:06 filmmaker who doesn't actually, who may not know? I mean, he directed shorts, but this is-
07:11 He directed one short. My job is always the same. And it changes a little based on who the person
07:19 is and what the task is, but it's basically the same. Just nurture, support, challenge,
07:27 and get shit done. That's what I do. And I love it.
07:32 That's the headline, you guys, get shit done. Let's move on to the team from Thelma, Zoe,
07:40 and Fred. And Fred, I got the name right, Fred Hechinger. You guys see that? Hear that?
07:45 First of all, congratulations. You seem so relaxed and calm considering the last 24 hours that you
07:52 have experienced. So let's go back- Really?
07:55 Yeah. Yeah, you do. Is something happening inside?
07:58 I think it might be exhaustion.
08:00 That happens here. So tell me about last night was the big premiere. How did it go?
08:05 I think it was great. I mean, it was really fun. This was by far the biggest audience we've seen
08:11 Thelma with. We've had only a few friends and family screenings so far. And it was a blast.
08:17 Wouldn't you say?
08:18 Yeah, I really love this festival. And I think you dream that you can... It's kind of everything
08:27 you're saying about nurturing. Every movie is a little bit like an orphan child. And the only
08:34 way that it's going to come to life and have a good life is if a big group of people come together
08:39 and just care about it nonstop for a long period of time. And it's very strange always, I find,
08:50 to then be able to, if you're lucky, release it and show it on a big screen with people
08:56 and no longer have to be the only people caring about it. And last night, it kind of felt like
09:02 other people did too. And that was an amazing feeling.
09:06 That's good. And I heard this morning's screening was a lot of tears and a different kind of energy,
09:12 right?
09:12 Yeah. I mean, we showed up to the prospector for the Q&A. And we walked in, Josh, the writer,
09:20 director, escorted in June Squibb, who's the lead titular character, Thelma, walked her in down the
09:27 aisle and it was to a standing ovation, full tears. It was just a really magical moment and
09:32 an electric Q&A with a lot of great questions. And it was a different energy. Last night felt
09:38 kind of rah-rah. And this felt, I don't know, maybe more intimate because of the smaller theater. It
09:42 was just cool. It was a really different vibe and super, super special.
09:47 I love a matinee in general. It's an amazing... I mean, it's like you wake up early,
09:54 you see a movie and then the rest of the day you're like, "I already saw a movie. My day's good."
09:58 That's true. That's true. And forgive me, I'm not doing my job very well because I didn't describe
10:04 the fact, like the big coup of this film is that you got the legendary June Squibb at the ripe old
10:09 age of... Is it 91?
10:11 94.
10:12 94. 94.
10:14 94, yes.
10:14 Thank you for fact-checking me. To star in this movie playing Thelma,
10:18 so tell me just first, how difficult was it to get her in this movie? I know... I also just love
10:24 the story if you want to give it a long wind up because I love how this movie came together
10:28 with these weekly writing sessions with you and the director over many months, right? During the
10:34 pandemic?
10:35 Yes. So, yes, Josh Margolin is a close friend of mine and a lot of the people sitting here,
10:40 including my producing partner, Chris Kay. We have a writing workshop that meets weekly,
10:45 but this kind of idea of meeting weekly and workshopping things together,
10:51 a supportive group of friends, is something that I've done actually since graduating college. So,
10:57 I went to NYU where I ran a theater company called The Collectin for a few years and I did a similar
11:03 thing and then moved back to LA, started a Sunday night group that became a Thursday night group,
11:09 and now we have kind of a small intimate version of a similar thing. And the idea behind it is to
11:15 kind of keep each other accountable for writing deadlines that are kind of for yourself,
11:21 outside of the business, outside of what your agent wants or a job, and keep encouraging each
11:27 other to write and finish that draft and just do it for ourselves. And Josh brought in what was
11:32 already a magnificent draft of Thelma out the gate and Chris and I were looking to make something
11:38 together. We really wanted to produce a small independent movie together and when we read it,
11:44 we were like, "It should be this." And of course, it was in the middle of the pandemic,
11:49 the lead actress is in her 90s, it presented some challenges, but the challenge of securing
11:57 June in the role and then working with June was not one of those challenges. That kind of
12:02 electrified and made the process happen. She was the first one in, followed by Fred,
12:08 after we started developing the script. And from there, the movie was just, yeah, off to the races.
12:14 Fred, this is not a producer question. I just am so desperate to know this from you because
12:19 I watched this movie and it's so great, you guys. Congratulations.
12:22 Thanks.
12:23 I saw it before the festival at home. I had a grandmother, much like Thelma, who has since
12:29 passed. And seeing you, I was reminded that it doesn't ever feel like you're acting. It just
12:35 feels like you live in these scenes and you live in that family and your talent is just,
12:38 it emanates from the screen. And I was reminded how it was so similar to your work in The White
12:44 Lotus. And I'm just curious because that show changed your life, I assume. And now you're off
12:50 to Gladiator 2 and Craven the Hunter and doing all these big movies. And you're at Sundance,
12:55 starring in Thelma, which is a big accomplishment. So tell me, how has your life
12:59 changed since The White Lotus?
13:02 Thank you. That's really kind of you. Yeah, immensely. I think it's similar to... It's hard
13:13 to exactly put a grasp on, but I really think the exciting challenge always is how do you make
13:20 films that are truly unique? And not to crash this conversation with acting, but I think that
13:27 there is a connection, but at least maybe between producing and acting in that sense, which is
13:32 that you're always looking for projects that only exist. The story only exists through that
13:41 filmmaker and through that world. And I think being able to do something like White Lotus only
13:45 led to being able to continue to be more specific and hopefully more unique with each experience.
13:53 And I know in getting to help produce along with this and be able to work together on this,
13:58 it was definitely the kind of experience on Thelma where I believe that the process becomes
14:04 the product. And so the feeling that you create on set... We filmed the first week of this movie in
14:11 Josh, our director's, his actual grandmother's condo, which is where he made these documentary
14:18 shorts beforehand, which inspired the movie. So the first week of filming was this kind of
14:23 spiritual connection to the actual location of his family and his history and his life.
14:29 And I'm of the belief that that is felt in the film. And I think that's always a mark of producing,
14:36 because you have to decide what environment can we create, as you said, to nurture something?
14:42 And how do you make inspired, intentional, and creative choices from a logistical standpoint?
14:48 - Spoken like a true producer, you guys, right? A round of applause for Fred,
14:53 launching his producing career in the Hollywood Reporter Hyundai Lounge. By the way, I know that
14:59 you produced a movie that went to Toronto as well with your friends. So sitting amongst this
15:04 esteemed and accomplished group of producers, do you see yourself continuing to do this
15:08 throughout your career? - I love that part of it. I really do.
15:15 I have found that sometimes if it's the right job, they really connect. And your knowledge of it,
15:23 by acting in it, mixed with your knowledge of all the prep period and getting to bring everybody
15:29 together and make sure that they get what they need to do their job in the best way,
15:33 and for the entire crew, I find that they really speak hand in hand a lot of time. And I would
15:37 absolutely love to eventually also be able to do it more and sometimes foster films that I'm not
15:45 acting in because there's so many filmmakers that... I mean, that's why I love this festival.
15:49 At the end of the day, I think we're all probably just like movie nerds. The feeling of being in a
15:57 dark room and seeing something that's alive and shocking and makes you feel in that way,
16:02 it's like that's what you're chasing. And I think if you remember that, that's hopefully,
16:06 I think what producing is somewhat connected to. So yeah, I love doing it and I would love
16:12 to continue to. - I think that was a nod of approval
16:14 from Stephanie Lane, the boss over here. Thank you and congratulations, you guys.
16:20 And then somebody who knows a lot about what it feels like to be at Sundance with the lights go
16:24 low is Stacey Reese. Congratulations on everything, your whole Sundance history,
16:29 but let's go back to 2020 with the movie that sold to Neon. I mean, first of all,
16:35 what did you learn from that experience? I mean, that was also before everything changed.
16:40 January, 2020, it feels like a lifetime ago. - I wanna say that some of the actors I've worked
16:45 with are the best producers. So I think it's such an interesting relationship. So yeah,
16:51 I'm always interested. One of the actors I worked with went on to direct and had a film that was
16:55 here, a short here last year. So I feel like none of us should be in any... We're a producer,
17:01 we're an actor, we're a director, we're all creators. And I think it's a very fluid process.
17:07 So congratulations, I just wanted to say that 'cause I was thinking when you were speaking.
17:11 But back to 2020. - Yes, spaceship to Earth.
17:14 - And the before times. - Before times, yeah.
17:16 - The before times of 2020. I mean, it's always exciting to come to the festival with a film
17:22 that's made independently and this is a marketplace. And sometimes I think we forget
17:28 that 'cause there are lots of films that come here with distribution. But when you come here
17:32 as a producer and you don't have distribution and you are sitting in the theater at your premiere
17:37 and you're like, "I hope people in this room are moved by this film, wanna buy this film,
17:43 people are gonna see this film." I mean, many films come to this festival and unfortunately,
17:48 they don't get seen beyond the festival. So I never sort of take for granted that I'm in that
17:52 room the night of the premiere and that the film's gonna sell. And with Spaceship Earth,
17:57 which Radical Media, I produced it with Radical Media where now I'm an executive producer,
18:02 but that was before I joined Radical Media and we were partners on the movie. We were all in there
18:07 on the edge of our seat and thinking, "I hope this resonates." And Neon was a very early,
18:12 and they were sort of calling us leading up to the festival like, "We're interested in this film."
18:16 We're like, "You can see it at the premiere at Sundance. We're not showing it to you beforehand."
18:20 Because we all know seeing a movie with an audience makes all the difference.
18:23 - Wait, let's stay on that for a second 'cause there might be a lot of people here who don't
18:28 know why people take that strategy. Why would a producer wanna hold onto a movie and say,
18:35 "I know you're interested, but I'm gonna just get into the screen and I'll give you a ticket."
18:39 Instead of doing a big screening in LA beforehand or sending out links, what's the strategy?
18:44 - I think if you really believe in the film that you've made and like any producer really,
18:50 you spend so much time and energy and late nights and sleepless nights making this film. I think we
18:57 all believe in our film and your film's coming to Sundance, which once you have the Sundance
19:02 seal of approval, this is the most incredible place to premiere a film. I think you sort of
19:07 feel like, "I'm gonna take my chances and I'm gonna take it to a festival and I'm gonna show
19:11 it in the room with people." And there are certain films that I think particularly resonate in a room
19:18 with an audience and not have buyers just watching it on links while they're also checking their
19:23 phone or they're making dinner. It kind of drives me crazy when I think about that. So I would
19:29 always personally rather someone watch it with an audience in a room, but obviously it was a
19:34 strategy with our sales team too. - Yeah, and Sundance is sort of famous
19:37 for that lobby negotiating session, which I don't know happens quite as much anymore in the era of
19:43 smartphones and eavesdroppers. It used to, right? It was like a... - It's really fun.
19:49 - Am I here? Hustle and Flow was one of those lobby negotiations and one of those amazing
19:57 echo screenings where everybody in the room had passed and everybody in the room wanted it. And
20:03 then we spent that night... We didn't do... After the screening, we just went to the party and
20:07 partied, just to celebrate that we'd made the movie and we got here. Because I think sometimes
20:13 we're always thinking in the future, always thinking about what's next. Sometimes it's good
20:17 to just sit in the moment. We're here. We're at Sundance, right? - Well, I would like... If I can
20:24 jump in for a second. As a former buyer, because I was at HBO for almost 20 years, I do think that
20:30 that strategy is really important because I think what Stacey was saying just about eventizing,
20:36 I mean, I think as a producer, the more you can do to make your film feel like the event at
20:44 Sundance and the more that you can do to make buyers feel like, "I have to go to that screening
20:50 or I have to schlep to the Cinetic House to watch something because they're not going to send me a
20:56 link," I think the more the anticipation really grows for those buyers. And it's all about the
21:02 buzz and it's all about feeling like, "Well, someone else is going to get to it first. So I
21:06 have to make sure as a buyer I'm in the room." - Can I... You open the door. I'm going to walk in.
21:12 During your tenure at HBO, do you remember or what was the most memorable acquisition,
21:21 deal-making moment you had? -
21:24 There were so many, unfortunately, I'm trying to think. Well, it's funny because I've been...
21:31 This is probably my 22nd, 23rd Sundance and it's always... It remains the premier launching pad for
21:40 documentaries, I think, in the country and probably in the world. So that excitement and to have Frida
21:45 here this year, it's such a thrill. But I think, God, I think one of the first films that I was
21:53 part of at HBO was a film called Born Rich, which I don't know if anyone remembers this.
21:59 Ivanka Trump was in it. That's all I'm going to say. But Jamie Johnson, who was a Johnson & Johnson
22:05 heir, made this film about himself and his peers. And it was probably the first time anyone was
22:12 allowed inside, certainly young people who grew up in some of the wealthiest families of the world.
22:20 And there were lines around the block to get into the screening at Sundance. And back then,
22:27 I mean, HBO was probably one of the only places that could probably buy that film. But nonetheless,
22:33 it was still an exciting acquisition because you could feel that that project or that film
22:42 was going to blow up and be something big. And it was for us at that point at HBO. Yeah.
22:47 How does it feel to be here this year with another film and also as your role as the
22:52 president of Imagine Documentaries? It's so sweet to be here as a producer with a film and also
22:59 in my current role at Imagine. I mean, you all know here, as producers, we're moving mountains.
23:08 It takes a village to make these films. And I think being really on the ground level up
23:15 from inception to production, to post-production, to actually premiering
23:19 is probably the greatest experience you could have in this business.
23:24 And you have a knack for, I know throughout your career, you've been involved in projects that
23:30 focus a lens on a story, a person, somebody like Frida Kahlo, who has been investigated in all
23:40 forms throughout the decades, but finding new ways to tell that story. So much of your work,
23:46 whether it's been new stories or... Anyway, this is one of those examples. But tell me why you
23:55 decide to do that and what new are you presenting about Frida through this piece? I know there's
24:00 some ephemera and some never before seen material. Yeah. No, I think that's always the challenge,
24:06 right? Especially with documentaries. It's like, what are we going to bring to the table
24:09 that's different? And I think to tackle an icon like Frida Kahlo, one of the greatest artists in
24:14 the world, certainly one of the most iconic artists in the world, you really do have to think about
24:20 what is going to be different about this project. And really to the credit of our fantastic director,
24:26 Carla Guiterrez, she always wanted to tell Frida's story in Frida's own words. And she
24:34 really thought about what could we do that someone else hasn't done before. And I think
24:39 this film really is a first person exploration of Frida. I think we're inside her mind, we're
24:46 privy to her diaries, her letters, and you really experience her life through her own narrative.
24:56 So I think that's really special. And also, I think the way that Carla and our team were able
25:02 to really illustrate her life through her art, there's this exceptional animation,
25:07 I think it's exceptional animation in the film that I think really brings her artistry to life,
25:16 but really, I think her probably most intimate thoughts. I can't wait to see it. And congratulations
25:22 and making it through your 20, you said 22nd? Yeah. That's a big deal. But when you were talking,
25:27 you also provided a perfect segue to go to Dottari because thinking about he's here with
25:33 Luther, the Luther Vandross Never Too Much documentary, and so much of what she said is
25:38 sort of what you guys do in your film, presenting the life of somebody who hasn't... Kind of the
25:43 opposite on the spectrum, who hasn't been investigated in that way, but is investigated
25:47 through a lot of their own life and material and song. So first of all, congratulations.
25:52 I also know you're kind of getting up there. This is 11 Sundances for you or?
25:56 Yeah, I've had...
25:58 11 movies.
25:58 This will be my 11th film in the festival.
26:00 It's a big deal.
26:01 I think I've been to maybe 13 or 14, because I'm one of the board members for the Black House
26:09 Foundation, so we're here pretty much every year. But yeah, 11th film.
26:14 I don't wanna ask you the why of putting this movie together, because that's kind of obvious,
26:19 right? Everybody would wanna see the Luther Vandross story told, because it hasn't been
26:23 done in that way. But the question I wanna ask you is how. Did you work with his estate?
26:28 How did you get this off the ground?
26:30 Yeah, well, the story... So my partner, Jamie Foxx, we have a deal, a first look deal with
26:39 Sony Pictures. And the quick version is, I was in a meeting with Tom Rothman, who's the
26:47 chairman in Sanford, the president of the studio. And they were like, "We wanna do music.
26:52 We wanna do music biopics." And Luther, growing up, was my parents' favorite singer,
26:59 Luther and Marvin Gaye. And so I mentioned, "What about doing a Luther biopic?" And they
27:09 both said, "Well, we should connect you with Tom McKay on the music side, because he and
27:17 Colin Firth's company are working on trying to put together a Luther doc." And Jed Daugherty,
27:24 who's in the audience right here, who is Colin Firth's producing partner, who also used to
27:29 be chairman of Sony Pictures International, and his partner, Trish, as well. Tom connected
27:37 us together. I think that's... It's been years ago. So connected us, we hit it off,
27:44 had some mutual friends, and both shared the passion of trying to get this doc to the finish
27:51 line. And then we went through trying to budget it, and how much could we make it for,
27:56 and then went through the process of interviewing filmmakers, and then landed upon Don Porter,
28:03 who's incredible. What was the biggest challenge in putting all that together? Because with music
28:08 documentaries, there is established data on how well they do, where they go, which homes take them
28:15 distributor-wise. So what was the biggest challenge for you in getting a green light eventually?
28:20 Well, I can speak for me and Jamie. I've produced almost 40 narrative films, but
28:28 this was my first documentary. Well, actually, we have a number in production now, but when we
28:36 started the process, this was my first documentary film. And it's different than narrative. You
28:43 sort of don't know what you have. Jed, obviously, was very close to the Lutheran state, and obviously,
28:52 Sony controlled all of the music. But again, you got to go through the archive, and as you get in
28:58 the interviews, it's just... It's completely different than putting a narrative movie
29:02 together, where you read the script, and you have a clear vision of the film, and how to cast it,
29:13 and put it together. I've known Stephanie for a very long time. She's obviously a legend in the
29:20 business. And even when I started my career, I think you did one of my very first... You interviewed me
29:25 when you were running the LA Film Festival at the beginning, at the beginning of my career.
29:31 But yeah, this was just a different process, because you can look at a cut of the movie,
29:38 and you're like, "Okay, well, this isn't it. We got to go back in." And Jed, like I said,
29:44 there's a lot of talented, creative people involved, but we made a special film. I'm really,
29:50 really proud of it. And I think people will watch the film, and see things, and discover things
29:54 about Luther that they did not know. And is there lots of music?
29:59 I mean, we were fortunate, because we made it with the estate, and having access to all of his
30:07 music. And so, the music, as you guys know, is incredible, and all time. He's legendary. And
30:15 then we were able to get a lot of tier one interviews for the film. Obviously, Jamie Foxx,
30:19 who was a massive Luther fan, and obviously, in addition to being an Academy Award winning actor,
30:28 had an incredible music career, and won multiple Grammys. And his first actual number one hit,
30:35 he had Luther in the hook. It was the song he did with Kanye West, "Slow Jams," where he says,
30:41 "Marvin Gaye, salute the Vandross." So yeah, I mean, Luther was very definitely a big inspiration
30:51 for him, and his music career. And yeah, we made this movie with love. Everybody really was
30:57 passionate about it. So... Shivani, hi.
31:00 Hi.
31:01 I feel like after your schedule, saving you until the end, it gives you some time to just relax.
31:06 Thank you.
31:07 And I just am even more grateful that you are sitting here, considering your schedule,
31:11 and today as well. So to remind everybody, she has three films here. "Hitman," the Richard
31:16 Linklater starring Glenn Powell, "Love Me," with Kristen Stewart and Steven Yeun,
31:20 which debuted earlier today. And "Winner," which is...
31:25 Susanna Fogel starring Emilia Clarke.
31:27 Susanna Fogel, who was here last year with "Cat Person," is back a year later with a really
31:32 remarkable story, the narrative version of a rip from the headlines, high-profile news story.
31:38 Hi.
31:40 Hi.
31:41 I wanted to ask you, first of all, in my many years of going to film festivals and pouring over
31:48 directories and entries and submissions and reading the hot lists and doing all the reporting,
31:55 I don't think I've ever read a movie description quite like "Love Me." So I'm just gonna read it
32:02 and then ask you how you went around pitching this movie and putting this together.
32:10 So I don't know if everyone's read this, but the "Love Me" stars Kristen Stewart and Steven Yeun.
32:16 "Long after humanity's extinction, a buoy and a satellite meet online and fall in love."
32:21 What does that mean?
32:24 I think it's just a very compelling love story. I'll just put it as simple as that.
32:30 And what drew me to the project was we were deep in pandemic in 2020, and I got a call from a friend
32:37 who's involved in the project, and she said, "I wanna send you this script. Please read it and
32:41 let me know what you think about it. It's first-time directors." And when I started my
32:46 company, Chavans Pictures, I promised myself I would work with first-time directors. And
32:51 we were like, "Okay, let's read the script and see what it's all about."
32:54 When I read it and I gave it to my co-producer, we both called each other crying, and we're like,
33:00 "This is a beautiful love story. We're actually... I don't wanna give out a lot, but we're actually
33:05 rooting for a buoy and satellite to get together." And we knew Kristen was attached at that time.
33:11 She had shown a keen interest in the film. And then we met Andy and Sam, Zuccarose, the director,
33:17 and just meeting them on Zoom on that little screen and just seeing the passion they had for
33:22 this project, I couldn't say no because we were all... The world was turning upside down. We
33:29 didn't know what our next step would be. And having these Zoom calls, which was so new to all of us,
33:33 just talking to our directors, they were so passionate and they had a vision. And it just
33:39 makes my life as a producer easier because I'm believing in the project, but if my directors
33:43 are equally intrigued and they intrigue me and they're compelling, it makes my job easier.
33:49 And yeah, we went to Steve Young and he said he wanted to work with Kristen. So it was like
33:57 a win-win case for us. And yeah, we're here at Sundance now after four years.
34:00 - That's amazing. Congratulations. And how was today?
34:03 - Amazing. I'm still shaking. So the reviews are still coming in, but
34:09 you have to see the film. It's got a lot of moving pieces, beautiful performances. And I
34:14 think both Kristen and Steven, for that matter, have had such a... The past few weeks, it's been
34:20 great for him. And just seeing them, it's beautiful. And Sam and Andy, they're just such
34:27 great directors and they're just visionary. And just being there, sort of just being in this
34:33 project all together, we just became so close because we started production in 2021 in Vancouver.
34:40 And this is again, during pandemic, where we were in this stage, just all closed, just going home
34:46 from set, back and forth, not really talking to anyone else. And now we're here after three years.
34:52 It's just so special. We were just all emotional, definitely.
34:55 - Congratulations. You also did something very... Did you want to say something? Yeah.
35:00 - I was just saying congratulations. That's impressive to have three movies at the festival
35:04 one year.
35:05 - Congratulations to everyone. All of you, everyone. You also were being very careful.
35:11 And I want to make this a producer's question because you said something that I think a lot
35:16 of people have said about this movie is like, you just have to see it. And the messaging around it
35:21 has been... Has not revealed very much. And I know because my colleagues saw it. So I know that
35:27 there's some... It's mixed media in some parts. So talk to me as a producer, how closely you stay
35:34 to the messaging of the movie and not giving away too much and how you're protective over
35:39 what gets out there in the marketing in order to protect what you have created with the artists.
35:45 - No, absolutely. I think it was a collective decision. When we were throughout the filmmaking
35:50 process, Kristen Stewart gets recognized everywhere she goes. So we had to be very
35:56 careful with that. Luckily this was during pandemic. So there weren't a lot of people,
35:59 but even when we decided that we want to come to a festival, we didn't do any pre-screenings before.
36:04 Today was the first day the press watched it. And of course we were getting a lot of calls,
36:08 but again, like everyone here said that it's important when you make a film, you've done all
36:13 the sweating and the late nights, you believe in it and your directors, you just collaboratively
36:17 decide we're not... We're going to keep it a hush hush movie and we're going to go out to a
36:22 beautiful festival like Sundance and just show it to the crowd and have the critics and
36:25 everyone see it. I think it's great. It's for the best for the film. So we stuck to that decision.
36:31 - And then talking about the decision with producing "Winner," which I mentioned is a
36:35 story that has been out there. There was another movie that has gotten a lot of
36:39 critical attention too called "Reality Winner" starring Sydney Sweeney. I had an old man moment
36:47 just then and I was like, "Oh yeah, euphoria." So tell me about that. Why choose to investigate a
36:55 story that has... Or produce a film that has already existed and is out there in ether and
37:00 what... How you feel about the competition? - So our film is different. I mean, it's based
37:04 on "Reality Winner," but I was brought to this project again as a financial producer. And when
37:11 I met Susannah Fogle, who's the director, I was more intrigued by, of course, reality story,
37:16 but at the same time Susannah's humor attached to the film. And this is not a dry political drama.
37:24 It's not. It's a dramedy. And I feel like we need to show this film. It's so apt with what's going
37:30 on and especially with what happens with reality and everyone's going to see it tomorrow. But I
37:34 feel like Susannah's humor and the way we've shown reality as a high school student, how she grows
37:41 and what happens in her life later in life. So it's literally her growing. And I think both Amelia
37:47 and Susannah's direction is just impeccable. And you have to see this film. It's not a dry
37:52 political drama. It's humor. It's got the funny moments and you'll get to see reality's vague and
37:56 funny choices in the film as well. Yeah. - Congratulations again. You guys,
38:02 we've gotten to hear from everyone and I could do this all day, because I only got through half my
38:08 questions from each person. So, but let's just spice it up a little bit, shall we? And we'll do
38:14 like a little lightning round, some general producer questions, not directed at anyone in
38:19 particular, unless you make some sort of motion or head nod, then I'm going to call you out. But
38:23 if you hear the question, you're like, "I got this one. Let's just jump in."
38:29 Troubleshooting is your forte as producers, actors too. Can you explain one issue, scene,
38:37 deal point, especially disaster from the set that came up that you had to solve and how did you do
38:44 it? - Stephanie, I would just say this, because like Stephanie said, I think producers are,
38:55 I think it's four things you gotta be. You gotta be entrepreneur, because you gotta go out and
39:00 raise money, especially if you're making independent movies. If you can't raise money,
39:06 even if you got great taste and you're not going to be able to be a successful producer,
39:13 I don't believe. You gotta be a janitor, because you spend your whole, it's a blue collar job,
39:21 like you're cleaning up, excuse my French shit, all day long. You gotta be a janitor.
39:27 You gotta be a therapist, because especially working with first time filmmakers, which has
39:35 been my forte and pretty much all of the filmmakers here and all the producers here,
39:42 you gotta be a therapist. If a filmmaker's making their first movie, they haven't done this before.
39:48 Someone like Stephanie, who has seen everything, is gonna be, you gotta be a coach as well.
39:57 You gotta be those four things. I think those are the main four ingredients, I think. Entrepreneur,
40:02 janitor, coach, and therapist. I think if you have those things in your mind, you can tackle
40:09 every problem. - So here's specific, he wanted a specific instance on "Hustle and Flow." If you
40:18 guys remember this moment when DJ throws one of his girls out of house and the baby too,
40:26 and John Singleton, my dear, dear friend, flew in a cat woman stunt lady, so that not only could
40:37 he put her out the house, but he would kick her down the stairs and she'd go, "Rollie." And I was
40:42 like, "No, this is our lead character, even though he is a certain guy, he's not gonna do that." And
40:52 John was saying yes, and I was saying no, and Craig was in the middle, and finally it was the
40:58 only day Craig's mother was on set. So I said, "Let's let Craig's mom decide." And everybody said,
41:06 "Okay." So we went over and we talked to her and she was like, "Oh yeah, no. We're going with Steph."
41:12 And we sent the stunt lady home and what's in the movie is in the movie. But we had to shut
41:19 production down because we could not, I was just not gonna let him roll camera on that. And it was
41:26 one of those moments where you're just like, "Ooh, this is the real grappling with artists and with
41:32 actors." And you're out there and the whole crew is there standing around watching you. And
41:38 as a producer, you just have to have in your heart the movie. Not relationships, not, you have to
41:48 have the movie in your heart. And if you know the movie is gonna be in trouble, you have to do what
41:55 you have to do. So that's just a little incidence of my life. - We love an incident from your life.
42:01 And I love a producer's handbook. Does anybody else have a specific anecdote or something that
42:07 they would add to the producer's handbook of what qualities make a great producer?
42:12 - I feel like I'm just learning so much from this talk. I'm just taking notes.
42:17 - Yeah. - I mean, one thing we talked about on our movie,
42:20 it's actually a saying from my mom, which was, "Keep the main thing the main thing."
42:24 And that's what's, that's kind of, yeah, just translating it back into my language,
42:30 what Stephanie's saying, trying to keep the main thing the main thing, 'cause there's so much noise.
42:34 And you do have to deal with the noise. You have to deal with something that's happening.
42:39 But then at the end of the day, this is the job and the movie needs to happen and the movie needs
42:45 to be the vision. And that's number one. - And I would just say you have to protect
42:52 the creative. And I think, working closely with a lot of directors, I also like to work with
42:58 first-time directors, but you have to kind of like shield them. You're a little bit of like
43:05 a superhero shield for, and you want to keep that creative bubble creative. And you don't want
43:11 things about like, this person didn't show up to work today, or this person has COVID, or we don't
43:16 have money in our bank account to pay our crew, or whatever that is. You don't want to tell the
43:20 director. They need to like keep their vision, their vision. And I think sometimes it's hard
43:25 when you're handling all of that, to not to the person you're often closest to on the set,
43:31 be like, "You're not going to believe what I'm dealing with right now." Or, "You're not going
43:34 to believe this person didn't show up to work today." But you just, you kind of want to protect
43:39 it as long as you can. You guys, this has been so wonderful. Because it's a group discussion,
43:44 we're going to end with one more question. And we're going to hear from everyone.
43:47 Because, and maybe it's a little cheesy, but I always like these kind of questions,
43:52 because they feel like the nuts and bolts of what you do hasn't changed, but what a producer's job
43:56 has changed in the current landscape, whether it's streaming, or whether it's COVID, all the
44:01 things that you have to do change from time to time. So, it's going to be personal. If you could
44:07 go back and give yourself some advice when you're starting out at the beginning of your career,
44:11 what would you say to that younger person? We're going to start with Shivani and go this way.
44:18 Sorry to put you on the spot. I think, believe in your projects,
44:22 but don't get too emotional. That's one thing I'll tell myself. When you get too emotionally
44:29 attached to your project, sometimes you can make decisions which you would later in life regret,
44:35 but believe in them, but don't get too emotional. Always have a middle line, a balance.
44:41 Thank you. Kid, relax. It's all going to work out.
44:48 You don't have to hit home runs to go to the Hall of Fame. You can go to the Hall of Fame
44:55 getting base hits. That's great. And just call Jamie Foxx with the plane. Stacy?
45:04 I always like this expression, leap and a net will appear. I feel like it took me a while
45:09 to take risks and I would have taken risks earlier. I think, I'm not sure my answer,
45:19 but I think my answer has something to do with trusting your gut for both good and bad. If you
45:26 think something's not necessarily going to be great, but there's some weird oblique reason
45:32 that you think it's strategic to do, those aren't really the best choices. That actually,
45:39 the belief in the project itself, keeping the main thing the main thing and seeing something through
45:44 is what I would tell myself maybe 10 years ago to, yeah, keep that the North Star and try not
45:53 to get gamified. Try not to be so externally minded. Fred? That there is no answer in a
46:04 textbook somewhere. That the human answer is the one that is most helpful and most specific. And so
46:13 to be very, very present to the needs and desires and life of each specific project.
46:22 That's great. I love this guy.
46:25 I would have told myself to trust that I was creative. I was a young mother and I spent a
46:38 lot of time nurturing and that sort of rolled over into my directors and I never really sort of sat
46:46 and thought, well, I was a closet writer for years. I was a closet writer. I finally, I don't know,
46:53 maybe I don't even know how long ago it was, maybe when I was 50. So 15 years ago, I told my agent,
47:01 I'm a writer. And I gave him my script and it was actually Charles King, I think. And he said it
47:09 was great. And then I started having these meetings and I was like, oh, I am a writer.
47:13 And I got into the Writers Guild because I was writing. It was so amazing. And I still write.
47:18 I have a book coming out this year called Who's in Charge? I am. And so I would just say,
47:28 do everything you want to do. Don't be scared. That's what I would say.
47:35 And I would just say probably don't sweat the small stuff because I think we probably,
47:42 I, maybe all of us probably have some of the greatest jobs in the world. And how lucky are
47:48 we that we get to be living, existing in this creative world and premiering films and Sundance.
47:55 So just to remind myself that. That's beautiful. And how lucky am I? I'm going to steal that. How
48:02 lucky am I that you guys all came in today to join us on this panel? Thank you so much.
48:07 Thank you, Chris. Thank you. You're so great.
48:10 [BLANK_AUDIO]