What was the biggest problem of Pakistan in 2023? Experts’ Analysis

ARY NEWS

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Transcript

00:00 Now let's move to our guests and ask them what was the most defining moment of this year politically?

00:06 Arfa, let's start with you.

00:08 The most defining moment of 2023 which changed politics, you pick.

00:16 About Pakistan?

00:17 About Pakistan, after that international, in the next break.

00:19 I think that I would, rather than the moment, I would pick social media as the thing.

00:26 I am seeing this both internationally and domestically.

00:30 I think that in Pakistan's politics, like we keep saying, it is a very old script.

00:36 There is only one script in the country and it is being used again and again.

00:40 But there has been a reaction on it.

00:43 If that reaction has reached people, then I think it has reached through social media.

00:49 If we talk about this month, the people who are sitting here, the protesters protesting in Islamabad,

00:56 the voice that reached us in the beginning, the way they reached here, the night they reached here,

01:04 if it wasn't for social media, then that voice wouldn't have reached us.

01:08 After that, if they are still sitting here and a message is reaching them,

01:14 similarly, if we talk about the rest of the politicians or the way politics is going on,

01:21 old script, maybe our political players are doing the same thing.

01:25 Sometimes Pakistan Telecom is standing, sometimes PMLN is standing.

01:28 But if people's reaction is different on it, then why do we know that?

01:32 So basically, if I rephrase it like this,

01:35 the narrative that social media has changed in comparison to normal media,

01:39 in your opinion, this is a big event of this year.

01:42 I think it is a big event and as you said, we will talk about it internationally later.

01:46 I see the same way in Palestine.

01:50 This is the change that has come.

01:53 The rest is happening in Palestine, it was happening before.

01:57 The reaction from the world, we have seen that before.

02:00 What was the difference this time?

02:02 Very interesting take.

02:04 This is the same question.

02:05 If you have to pick one event or one phenomenon in this year,

02:09 I will talk about it locally, and then we will take it to the international debate.

02:13 Look, the phenomenon, I think it is a sequence.

02:16 There is no such event at the moment, which is a defining moment,

02:20 which will change a lot.

02:22 The side we are moving towards,

02:25 various events have contributed to it.

02:28 So in 2024, that moment will come to you, it has not come yet.

02:31 In 2024, I think there may be a defining moment.

02:35 Or it may be that 2024 also contributes to it.

02:39 And you postpone that moment for a year, 25, 26,

02:43 but it happens everywhere, political change keeps happening.

02:46 So the sequence, the way we saw that the democratic parties,

02:50 what they did with the constitution, what they did with democracy,

02:54 and what they did with the people in the name of democracy,

02:57 then you see that in this year, in 2023,

03:00 the governments that are coming for three months,

03:03 they are still in place, the governing governments.

03:06 So I said that there is no such event that is a defining moment alone.

03:10 There are so many events that it seems like they are adding to it.

03:15 Now, because of those events, will anyone come to a standstill here?

03:19 Or will there be a different standstill as a result of that defining moment?

03:23 Time will tell, but I think it is a sequence of events.

03:26 Which, seeing them, it seems that a lot happened that should not have happened.

03:31 Zaraar, same question.

03:33 In 2023, what can you say is the turning point,

03:38 what can you say is the defining moment, or any such event,

03:41 or any phenomenon that you think should be mentioned?

03:45 I think this year we have seen that everything is happening very openly.

03:50 Whether it is nationally or internationally.

03:53 The masks are off.

03:56 Earlier there was a little ambiguity,

03:59 otherwise you could have thought that it is not what I am seeing.

04:03 But I think that now there is no such temptation left

04:08 that you should remain in denial about anything.

04:11 Vladimir Lenin said that some decades pass and nothing happens,

04:15 and there are some weeks in which decades pass.

04:18 So the past 365 days that have passed, I feel like it has been 3,750 days.

04:23 So much has happened in them.

04:26 And this ties to what Arfa was saying,

04:29 that things are happening very openly because of social media.

04:32 But whatever they are doing, whether you are talking about Pakistan,

04:37 or whether you are talking about Ghaza internationally,

04:40 they did not care.

04:43 Whatever the screams and cries are,

04:46 they are going according to their script or their program.

04:50 Which means that somewhere, sometime,

04:53 I will not say that it will happen in 2024, it may happen in 2025,

04:57 in 2026, in 2027, it may not happen.

05:00 But you are going towards a crisis point.

05:03 Whether it is nationally or internationally.

05:07 As far as Pakistan is concerned, I think it has been proven once again,

05:10 that this country is almost like Las Vegas.

05:13 And for those who do not know about Las Vegas,

05:16 it is a big gambling center in America.

05:19 It is a big city, which you can think of as a big gambling den.

05:22 And in that, you can win one day,

05:25 whether it is roulette on the table, or poker, or blackjack.

05:28 But after going around, the casino always wins.

05:31 The house always wins.

05:33 In Pakistan, we are seeing this, and the house is saying,

05:36 "Yes, we are there, do whatever you want to do."

05:39 So, this is the situation in America and Israel.

05:42 This is the viewpoint, and I am seeing the same here.

05:46 Very interesting.

05:48 Yes, very interesting.

05:50 Mr. Bhatti, the same question sir, from you.

05:53 Look, the year 2023 was a year of collapse.

05:58 Collapse in every department, collapse on every level.

06:01 The constitution was created, the democracy was created,

06:04 the parliament was created, the supreme court was created,

06:08 the respect for the vote was created,

06:10 the civilians were created,

06:12 the government was created, the politics was created,

06:15 the judiciary was created,

06:17 the literature was created, the politics was created,

06:20 the economy was created,

06:22 the foreign policy was created, the immigration policy was created,

06:25 meaning 365 days, daily,

06:28 meaning continuous,

06:31 meaning the country was created, meaning the nation was created.

06:35 But when all these 365 days,

06:39 or like Mr. Zarar is saying,

06:41 I also feel that 365 days have not passed,

06:43 I feel that 365 years have passed in this one year.

06:49 So much collapse has happened and so much has happened.

06:52 But if I pick this, then 9th May,

06:54 9th May has changed our politics, everything.

06:59 There can be a lot of debate on this,

07:01 there can be a lot of talk, a lot of ifs and buts can be put.

07:05 But I can see the effects of this for at least the next two elections.

07:09 And its effects will be felt for a long time.

07:14 And when I see this year in its last moments,

07:20 then I feel that this should not have happened.

07:25 And 9th May has completely changed Pakistan.

07:29 So I feel that this is Pakistan's 9/11.

07:32 Mr. Bhatti, I feel that we can debate 9/11,

07:36 but as a result of 9th May,

07:38 the biggest loss of the democracy was that the civilians lost a lot of space.

07:44 So I agree with you on this.

07:46 In my opinion, 9th May is a time when the politics of democracy has gone back to 2008.

07:54 So the gains that we have made in the last 10-14 years,

07:59 this is a big loss.

08:00 So if I pick 9th May, would you like to add anything?

08:03 I would like to add that the unfortunate incident of 9th May,

08:06 that too is a continuation of those incidents.

08:09 When you did not follow the constitution,

08:12 did not get elections on time,

08:13 and the way it started on 9th May,

08:15 that you broke into the court and arrested the former Prime Minister by pushing him,

08:20 so all these unfortunate incidents were a continuation of that.

08:24 But the incidents like this,

08:25 Mr. Bhatti is certainly correct that there should not have been such unfortunate incidents.

08:28 There is no room for killing.

08:30 or special.

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