How To Approach Social Media Marketing in 2024
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00:00 a whole 'nother conversation because for some people
00:01 it should be written word, some people should be doing
00:03 audio, some people should be doing video.
00:05 I think the thumbnail on video is incredibly important.
00:08 I think the first three seconds, do we need the hook
00:10 from the thumbnail to be delivered on in the first
00:14 two or three or four seconds?
00:15 We really believe we do.
00:16 If my hook says, 30 to 40 year olds, you should be
00:19 thinking about LinkedIn, and if my opening line is like,
00:22 before we get into that, in two seconds you may lose
00:24 that audience.
00:25 One thing that continues to work for me is taking headlines
00:28 that are happening in pop culture business and doing
00:31 a green screen and talking over it.
00:33 That model continues to work better than if I just looked
00:36 in camera right now and talked about it.
00:38 Attention is the number one asset.
00:41 - So the first thing I wanna ask you is,
00:43 what would you do today?
00:44 You know, in today's world, you know, inflation
00:47 and everything that's going on in the world's
00:48 really crazy right now.
00:50 If you were to build a business today,
00:52 what would you do differently?
00:54 - I don't know if I would do anything differently
00:56 and more importantly, back to bringing as much value
00:59 to the audience as possible.
01:01 I think the thing I think most about is,
01:03 am I putting myself in a position to succeed
01:06 and will this work?
01:08 And I think if you ask those questions,
01:11 one of the biggest things that everyone who's listening
01:14 needs to think about is, do I like this?
01:17 Am I good at it?
01:18 Like, why am I doing this?
01:20 Am I doing, you know, real estate because my other friends
01:24 say you can make money in real estate?
01:26 Am I doing cannabis or crypto or something else
01:30 'cause it seems like it's hot?
01:32 Am I doing social media influencer because that seems easy?
01:37 To me, the reason I don't think about things differently,
01:42 there's a million things I can do differently
01:44 on everything I do, V Friends, VaynerX, Wine Library,
01:47 Gary Vee brand, the books, but I don't think about it
01:52 from the small little things.
01:54 I think about it from the big things
01:56 and I think most people get the big thing wrong.
01:58 They don't put themselves in a position to succeed.
02:01 They either are delusional and think they're better
02:04 at something than they are, which I understand.
02:06 Like, we all wanna hope and dream
02:08 and it's okay to go for it, but I do think that
02:12 too many people struggle with self-awareness
02:15 and I do think that building something meaningful,
02:18 meaning living life on your own two feet
02:21 and not working for someone,
02:23 which means it's a constant pressure, it's all on you,
02:26 I do think it requires you enjoying it
02:30 if you're gonna do it long-term
02:32 because in the hard days, the fact that you wake up
02:36 and still want to do it 'cause you like it helps a lot
02:40 and when you're just doing it for the money,
02:42 you're gonna give up more often than not
02:45 and so that's how I think about it.
02:47 - Yeah, totally agree with you.
02:48 How did you figure out, for example, your why
02:51 that, you know, besides the whole story of the Jets,
02:54 - Yeah, yeah. - The family,
02:55 but how did you figure out what your why was
02:58 so that it wasn't just for money?
03:00 - It was so early for me.
03:02 That's why it's so hard for, you know,
03:04 and you know this, I know we've been on this journey
03:07 and you know a lot of my stuff.
03:08 It's hard for me to talk about,
03:10 I don't talk about finding why a lot.
03:12 - No, no, you don't. - Right?
03:13 I really don't.
03:14 Yeah, I really don't.
03:16 It's because I don't think I have a great point of view
03:20 on it because for me it was so natural.
03:23 You know, it was so early.
03:24 I mean, I genuinely don't remember a time
03:28 where I didn't wanna be a businessman, you know?
03:31 And so for me, it came very early
03:33 but I do talk about tasting different things.
03:37 I do talk a lot about taking advantage
03:39 of your 20s and 30s, you know?
03:42 I do talk about even in your 40s, 50s, 60s, 70s,
03:47 understanding it's not quote unquote over
03:50 that there is opportunities but I think one thing that,
03:55 I think you have, this is a strength of yours
03:57 if I could watch it from afar.
03:59 I think people say no too much and don't say maybe enough.
04:03 And I think, I've been becoming more and more passionate
04:07 about the concept of maybe.
04:09 You know, I'm in maybe all the time.
04:12 Most things become no but many things do become yes
04:17 and I do think that that's something
04:19 that people need to think about.
04:21 You know, like AI, no, that's gonna be bad.
04:24 It's gonna take jobs.
04:25 Without ever spending 10 hours of research.
04:28 The blockchain, no, especially now.
04:31 Oh, NFTs, no, no.
04:33 Do you actually understand or TikTok?
04:36 Well, I missed it, it's too late.
04:38 Well, actually it's not.
04:39 The way TikTok's built is it's based on the individual post
04:43 and starting tomorrow is just as viable
04:45 as starting two years ago.
04:47 And so I think that people say no.
04:50 And so I think for the people listening,
04:52 trying to find their why, if it didn't come natural to you,
04:55 there's people that wake up and at six years old,
04:57 they wanna be a stay-at-home mother or father.
04:59 At six years old, they wanna be a teacher.
05:01 At six years old, they wanna be a firefighter.
05:03 At six years old, they wanna be a doctor.
05:05 At six years old, they wanna be an entrepreneur.
05:08 But for a lot of people, it's not that easy.
05:11 It doesn't come that natural.
05:13 And I do think that people need to keep pushing themselves.
05:17 Take a pottery class.
05:18 Go to a concert of a different style of music.
05:25 People don't make themselves uncomfortable
05:27 or they're not curious enough
05:30 or they're not willing to try out of fear.
05:34 And I think about that a lot.
05:36 - Yeah, yeah, totally.
05:38 Now when it comes to social media,
05:39 you just mentioned TikTok.
05:41 For you today, what would be the top three platforms
05:44 to be on because there are so many
05:46 and what would you do on each of them?
05:47 If you were starting now, what would you do on TikTok,
05:50 YouTube, Instagram, or Facebook?
05:52 - Yeah, so I think again,
05:53 back to the earlier point of self-awareness,
05:56 if you're selling B2B,
05:58 all of a sudden, LinkedIn is number one.
06:00 If you started a SaaS business,
06:05 if you're listening right now
06:05 and you wanna sell or you sell to lawyers,
06:09 you have a service that sells to lawyers,
06:11 then LinkedIn's gonna be number one globally for sure
06:14 with YouTube Shorts probably being number two
06:16 because YouTube is a search engine
06:19 and a lot of people search there
06:20 so that would also be good if you were into SaaS.
06:23 And then probably in that scenario,
06:25 I would then say if you're selling a B2B service,
06:29 after those two, probably Facebook grounded
06:33 in a Facebook group with then Twitter X being probably fourth
06:38 if you're selling SaaS,
06:39 Instagram's probably a distant fifth,
06:41 Snapchat, Pinterest, they're super far away in that scenario.
06:46 If you're selling T-shirts to 15 to 25 year olds,
06:51 all of a sudden TikTok becomes number one,
06:54 Instagram probably becomes number two in that scenario
06:57 and YouTube Shorts is number three.
06:59 So I think for a lot of people, that's that reality.
07:03 For broader markets,
07:05 I think that if you're really trying to sell something,
07:08 like to the broad consumer,
07:09 call it for everybody who's 25 to 55,
07:13 well now you start getting into Facebook
07:15 still being an incredibly powerful platform for selling.
07:19 I do think that organic TikTok for branding is exciting.
07:25 Instagram again becomes a stronger selling platform
07:29 but both of those scenarios require ads
07:32 more than organic reach.
07:34 Whereas TikTok, you can win on organic reach
07:37 and kind of capture lightning in a bottle.
07:39 So I hope everybody appreciates the answer.
07:43 It is contextual but I think as far as the answer
07:48 to what you would do inside of it,
07:51 obviously there's a lot of science and math
07:52 of what time do you post, how long is the copy?
07:55 I think a couple things to look out for.
07:56 Number one, the best YouTubers in the world
07:59 starting with MrBeastDown spend more time
08:03 and more money on their thumbnail than you can ever imagine.
08:06 So number one, for everybody who's gonna do video,
08:08 and again that's a whole 'nother conversation
08:10 because for some people it should be written word,
08:12 some people should be doing audio,
08:14 some people should be doing video.
08:16 But I think the thumbnail on video is incredibly important.
08:21 I think the first three seconds,
08:22 the thing that Dustin and I were talking about
08:24 on our trip this week is do we need the hook
08:28 from the thumbnail to be delivered on
08:32 in the first two or three or four seconds?
08:35 And we really believe we do.
08:37 We believe that if my hook says,
08:40 30 to 40 year olds you should be thinking about LinkedIn
08:44 and if my opening line is like,
08:45 before we get into that, you might in two seconds
08:48 you may lose that audience.
08:49 And so I think a lot of science around the art.
08:52 I think a couple of other things.
08:54 There's a lot of ways to do it.
08:55 Let me encourage some people.
08:57 One thing that I've been noticing is on Instagram
09:01 you could just take a photo of something, right?
09:03 You were here with your friend this weekend in New York.
09:06 You could take a photo of a nice picture
09:08 that caught your eye in New York.
09:10 Take a photo.
09:11 But if you then wrote three paragraphs,
09:14 really great ones because you're a great writer,
09:17 about the concept of enjoying the weekends to reset,
09:22 of the concept of busyness and chaos
09:25 and controlled chaos is an effective way
09:28 to be an entrepreneur.
09:30 You could write, you know, curiosity.
09:33 I've been to New York seven times
09:34 but I've never gone down this street.
09:37 Like you could take a photo of anything,
09:39 a banana, a car, a tree, a bird, your backyard.
09:44 You really could take a photo of almost anything
09:49 and then write three or four paragraphs
09:51 that are very thoughtful about a point you're trying to make.
09:54 Now all of a sudden you don't need a video and editing team.
09:58 You could do it all by yourself
10:00 and for a lot of people listening,
10:01 they're not great on camera,
10:03 they're not great with their words,
10:05 but they're incredible writers.
10:07 And so it's around self-awareness of the style, the content,
10:12 and then there's strategy around the distribution
10:14 depending on your business.
10:16 And so that's one main theme.
10:19 To keep getting very nerdy and deep on your question,
10:22 the other thing to always look for
10:23 is underpriced attention.
10:25 The thing that I know you know about me
10:28 over these last seven, eight years
10:30 is that I have a very strong skillset
10:33 in understanding where there's more organic reach
10:36 against consumption and when to do it hard than most people
10:41 and that's been a big part of my success.
10:44 You were there when I was yelling about Musical.ly
10:46 and TikTok, when that seemed crazy to almost everyone.
10:51 You weren't there but people that have been following me
10:54 all the way back to 2005, six and seven,
10:57 there was an incredible amount of content and passion
11:01 I had around YouTube and Twitter and Facebook.
11:04 I mean I wrote Crush It in 2008,
11:07 came out in '09 but I wrote it in 2008.
11:09 That's 15 years ago.
11:11 - Long time.
11:12 - So I think that I constantly look for
11:15 the underpriced attention.
11:18 It's always most exciting when it comes up
11:21 in a new platform but new platforms only come around
11:24 every three, four, seven, nine years.
11:27 Then when it's not a platform,
11:28 it goes into the things we just talked about.
11:32 The strategy within the platforms.
11:35 I talked about recently,
11:37 and it's already lost momentum in a month,
11:39 but a month ago I was incredibly excited
11:41 about posting a meme and then a video on Instagram,
11:45 a two post carousel.
11:46 - I saw that.
11:47 - Mm-hmm.
11:48 And I see incredible opportunity in that.
11:53 Again, almost talking to Dustin,
11:55 I'm almost having my own meeting right now,
11:56 one thing that continues to work for me
11:59 is taking headlines that are happening
12:01 in pop culture business and doing a green screen
12:04 and talking over it.
12:05 That model continues to work better
12:08 than if I just looked in camera right now and talked about it.
12:10 - And even when the green screen video is not great quality,
12:15 like it doesn't look good but it works.
12:18 - Correct, to your point, my last one,
12:20 which did really well, I was in the car
12:22 and the light was hitting a different way
12:23 and it wasn't like my, yeah, I was like distorted.
12:25 That's right.
12:26 But I think that that's,
12:29 I think a great strength of mine
12:33 that I would encourage people to consider
12:35 is constantly trying new formats.
12:37 I'll use you as an example.
12:41 We talked in the past, whether on DM or Twitter
12:44 or in a VFriends Discord or like this,
12:48 about like, mm, I'd like to get more traction,
12:50 I want more views on my videos.
12:52 And something that I don't think I've given good advice on
12:54 in the past to you or the hundreds of thousands of people
12:57 that have asked me is, look,
12:59 if you have the same exact format,
13:02 format, not you're talking about different things,
13:05 but it's camera to face and you post it as an Instagram reel
13:09 and you're doing that 50, 100 times
13:11 and you're not getting really the results you want
13:14 after 100 times, you've gotta change it.
13:17 You've gotta change your format.
13:18 Maybe you bring on a guest, maybe you go to green screen,
13:22 maybe you go to written word and picture.
13:24 I think, I always think about that concept of like,
13:27 the definition of insanity is like
13:29 doing the same thing over and over
13:30 and thinking you'll have a different outcome.
13:33 So I do think, I wanna give permission
13:35 to a lot of people out there, like,
13:36 if you've done 100, I think that's the right thing,
13:38 if you've done 100 of the same format per se
13:43 and you're really, really getting nowhere
13:46 and you're now six months in,
13:47 you should challenge yourself to try different formats.
13:53 Not talk about something different.
13:55 - Just talk about the same thing in a different--
13:58 - In a different, you know, like, look,
13:59 I believe in 40 to 50 core things
14:01 and then I layer what's happening in the world at the time
14:04 and new and different formats and platforms
14:07 and I think there's something there there.
14:10 - No, that's good advice.
14:12 I'm gonna try that 'cause I love doing reels,
14:13 like I love doing the video and some work, some don't
14:17 and then something that works on Instagram,
14:19 then I put it on TikTok, it doesn't work over there.
14:22 - Yeah, TikTok's a whole different animal.
14:23 - It's so hard.
14:24 - Yeah, it's hard, it is hard,
14:26 but I think, you know, I remind people like yourself,
14:28 myself, I say this to myself all the time,
14:30 if you're looking for something special to happen,
14:33 it's supposed to be hard.
14:34 - Yeah.
14:35 - You know? - Yeah.
14:36 - Like, I hear, you know, right?
14:38 Like even, right?
14:39 - Yeah, it's supposed to be hard.
14:40 - Yeah, like I was in this, where was I?
14:42 Oh, I was, Friday night, I was in an airport lounge
14:46 in Dallas and this gentleman, like a 60 year old guy,
14:50 you know, he was a real yappy guy,
14:51 I was trying to get a little work done
14:52 before my flight to LA, but he wanted to talk
14:54 and I'm about that, he had no clue who I was
14:57 or anything like that, we were just talking.
14:58 And he got into something and he was like,
15:02 it really seemed to me that this was a gentleman
15:04 and I confirmed some of this through the conversation,
15:07 you know, really, really came from rural America,
15:10 really like came from nothing, nothing
15:13 and made a life of himself and, you know,
15:15 it was really nice and his son was getting married
15:16 in Tennessee in a couple weeks,
15:18 really enjoyed the conversation.
15:20 But he kind of talked about, you know,
15:22 how hard he worked and then he was talking about
15:26 what was hard for him now.
15:28 And I kind of had this fun moment where I was like,
15:30 hey brother, like you of all people know,
15:32 like you didn't get to this point by accident,
15:35 you don't have to do the next thing,
15:37 but it's not gonna happen without hard work.
15:40 And so I think, you know, yeah, I think people ask
15:43 to be known, to get compensated for being themselves,
15:49 to sell books, to speak, to sell things.
15:52 It should be hard because 99% of the world
15:55 works for someone else.
15:56 - Yep, you've said it.
15:59 - Yep.
16:00 - So you answered the next question I had,
16:02 so I'm gonna move on to the next one,
16:03 which is, I wanted to ask about being friends, of course.
16:06 I see you're doing so much, like it's hard for me
16:08 to keep up, like I miss the plushies,
16:11 like I miss the He-Man thing,
16:12 well, the masters of the universe.
16:13 - Yes, I call it He-Man too, by the way.
16:15 - Yeah, I mean, I grew up with He-Man.
16:18 But yeah, everyone called it He-Man.
16:20 Masters of the universe, very good.
16:22 - So I asked, you know, I asked in the VFriends Discord,
16:26 oops, to my fellow specs, and they asked me,
16:28 hey, can you ask Gary, what does he have in store
16:31 for the future, like after VCon 24?
16:34 What's gonna happen, or what do you have planned
16:36 for the NFTs?
16:37 - Yes.
16:38 - Especially series one holders.
16:39 - Yeah, so, you know, for me, the entire VFriends game,
16:45 launched game, meaning operations and building out
16:50 of VFriends is predicated on people falling in love
16:52 with the characters.
16:54 There is nothing else.
16:55 You know, like, back to He-Man, right?
16:59 That Skeletor thing that we did wouldn't have been
17:01 a big to-do if the world didn't love Skeletor.
17:03 So, you know, I think I'm empathetic when spec holders
17:08 or series one holders or any holders ask what's going on
17:12 with the NFT.
17:13 I think what I'm doing is creating the NFT.
17:16 The fact that I can speak to multiple people
17:19 who in the last two weeks watched Fanatics Live,
17:23 where we open up trading cards for hours at a time
17:26 of entertainment and education.
17:28 They discover who Genuine Giraffe is.
17:32 And the fact that there are multiple people who have gone
17:37 from not even knowing what VFriends or I was,
17:42 discovering us in the Fanatics app in discovery,
17:46 watching me, Rips, and Con Man, Connor, you know, hang out,
17:50 get interested and excited by the community, get educated,
17:53 buy a pack for the next show, get the pack,
17:57 start to get on Twitter and meet all of you,
18:00 go and buy a series two VFriend,
18:03 and then go and buy a series one VFriend NFT,
18:07 all in two weeks, and there's two or three examples already.
18:10 - Yeah, I was gonna ask, have you tracked some of it?
18:12 - Oh yeah, we track all of that.
18:14 And so the Skeletor thing, getting into the masters.
18:17 So look, I think what's really fun about NFTs
18:20 as a collectible is you can do things forever.
18:24 You see what wallets have it, things of that nature.
18:26 To your point, October's been a very big month.
18:29 We're really trying to lean into the character development
18:33 of the Halloween characters.
18:35 We think Halloween is a very big platform for VFriends.
18:39 But I think between the Skeletor, the plushies,
18:42 the mini and vending machines,
18:44 the coffee collaboration with Gregory's,
18:46 the Fanatics Live trading cards,
18:49 obviously the announcement of VCon 2024 in Los Angeles,
18:52 I think beyond 2024 is what 2023 has been about,
18:58 between Burn Island, background scenes.
19:00 We're working during this recorrection,
19:03 down market of the NFT thing.
19:05 - Yeah, that's beyond your control, of course.
19:07 - And we anticipated it, as you know,
19:10 I made 30, 40 different videos and interviews
19:14 during August 2020, the height,
19:17 saying 95, 97, 99 of this is going to zero.
19:21 Because that's how these kind of things go.
19:26 NFTs are like trading cards, they're like art,
19:29 they're like sneakers, they're like watches.
19:32 They're going to be collectible.
19:34 99% of watches are not collectible.
19:37 99% of sneakers are not collectible.
19:39 99% of trading cards are not Michael Jordan's rookie card.
19:43 99% of intellectual properties are not He-Man,
19:46 Masters of the Universe, or Disney, or Pokemon.
19:49 So, you know, for your friends in those communities,
19:53 and for everybody broader, and for people who are listening
19:57 that are not into BeFriends,
19:58 but are following other projects,
20:00 you know, I think the requirement of those projects,
20:03 so I'll give you some alpha in a little more detail
20:06 that people in the Discord have heard in the past.
20:08 We are announcing the kids book pretty soon here,
20:12 and it will be in kids' hands in 2024.
20:16 You know, God forbid, my first kids book,
20:20 just so everybody knows, when I wrote Crush It!,
20:22 nobody knew who I was.
20:24 You know what I mean?
20:26 And that book went.
20:28 And so if we're lucky enough to have this book go,
20:32 and so we're working very heavily on that,
20:34 we're working very heavily on getting
20:37 the animation infrastructure,
20:38 and then as far as how I think about specs.
20:40 Collectibles.
20:43 The way collectibles actually work is,
20:46 if you are fortunate enough to get people
20:48 to care about the characters overall,
20:50 Spider-Man number one's first appearance,
20:53 or Spider-Man's amazing story,
20:55 if Spider-Man's first appearance,
20:56 or Wolverine's first appearance,
20:58 is more valuable than his second,
21:00 or in trading cards, there are Kobe Bryant
21:03 and LeBron James rookie cards that are more rare
21:06 than the standard one, and they are more sought after.
21:10 You know, if I'm right, and if we're capable,
21:13 as a digital collectible,
21:15 the specs have a disproportionate world,
21:18 and you can see that happening
21:19 with what's happening with trading cards.
21:21 If you go look at trading cards right now,
21:23 on eBay, the to 25 epic of any character,
21:28 if we were to go right now,
21:29 is dramatically more valuable than the core.
21:33 What has not happened yet is digital collectibles
21:36 are so early that people are still trying to figure out.
21:41 And so it takes time, but to answer your question,
21:46 very detailed and a little bit more long-winded,
21:50 for example, right here, we're looking now,
21:52 everybody who's listening,
21:53 the whimsical wolf is $31 as a rare to 500.
21:58 If we were to find a yellow one,
21:59 which is the base in here, right?
22:02 And I don't know if we'll find one,
22:03 actually, here we go, real quick,
22:04 'cause I just want you to see.
22:06 The regular wolf is $19.99, right?
22:11 There's a gap.
22:14 - Yes.
22:15 - Trading card people understand that.
22:18 In Vee Friends, NFT land, series one,
22:21 not all the way just yet.
22:23 But then there's also the part of, you know,
22:27 what utilities and what things happen.
22:29 And so I think--
22:30 - Yeah, like what's, like one side is a collectible,
22:33 and then from your end, will you continue to like--
22:35 - Of course, of course, but as you know,
22:39 and everybody knows, there's also clarity
22:40 that we're looking for from legislation
22:42 that we have to wait for.
22:44 And so, you know, listen, this is no question
22:47 a tricky time for operators and collectors.
22:51 Don't forget, I'm a major collector
22:53 on the other side of the world.
22:55 - Look at that wall.
22:56 - Yeah, and just of NFTs, creature world,
22:58 world of women, Yuga stuff.
23:01 So, you know, we're all kind of navigating it,
23:03 but look, I think the best thing I can say
23:05 is I hope that the last six weeks,
23:08 and I've definitely gotten a lot of people
23:10 reaching out based on this, has shown people,
23:13 it's not like we're looking to make pretend
23:15 this chapter never existed.
23:17 You know, I think, you know what I mean?
23:18 Like I'm very committed to this.
23:19 We're gonna do this, and we're gonna do it
23:21 for the rest of our lives, and I'm enjoying it.
23:24 You know, it's not fun to have like tension
23:27 and like concern, and I see everything.
23:29 - I know, I know you see--
23:30 - You know this, I see everything.
23:32 I'm working.
23:33 You know, He-Man took 19 months.
23:36 It really mattered.
23:37 There's a lot of people in Masters of the Universe
23:40 Reddit communities and discords that are like,
23:43 wait a minute, VFriends, this is cool.
23:45 Skilled Skeleton is selling more as an NFT
23:48 because, so like, we're working on it.
23:51 I know you got a lot more, and we're gonna run out of time,
23:52 so go ahead.
23:53 - Yes, of course.
23:54 So I wanted to ask you now about your next book.
23:56 - Yes.
23:57 - In our last interview a year ago,
23:59 you told me the title of the book.
24:00 - And now it changed.
24:01 - Yeah, exactly.
24:02 What can you share?
24:03 - Yeah, so what I told you at the time
24:05 was it was gonna be Jab, Jab, Jab, Left Hook
24:08 because I knew that I was gonna write
24:09 a very similar book to that 10 years ago,
24:12 which is what I am writing with day trading attention.
24:15 The difference is when I started writing the book
24:18 versus when I had it figured out a year ago when we spoke,
24:22 I realized this is a much more complex book
24:24 than Jab, Jab, Jab, Right Hook.
24:26 Jab, Jab, Jab, Right Hook was very simple to understand.
24:28 Give, give, give, then ask in your content.
24:31 Here's some examples of content.
24:33 Day trading attention is very detailed
24:36 to what you and I talked about 20 minutes ago.
24:39 It is probably my most academic book.
24:42 You know, there's even a part of me
24:43 that worries that it could be a hair-burning.
24:45 I'm not kidding, I'm being dead serious.
24:48 It's so detailed in the magic of what I do
24:52 and what VaynerMedia does, but I'm proud of that.
24:55 I think we will, Jab, Jab, Jab, Right Hook,
24:58 besides Crush It, is the book I get most talked to
25:01 about how it changed someone's life.
25:03 Especially now in marketing, so many of the people
25:06 that are in companies that we work with,
25:08 when the meeting's over on Zoom, they're like,
25:09 "Hey Gary, can I just say something?"
25:11 I'm only in marketing 'cause I read Jab, Jab, Jab, Right Hook
25:14 in high school or college, and it's very flattering.
25:17 Day trading attention has a chance to be a manifesto
25:22 of the next five years of what to do on social media
25:25 as a reference point, people go back to it.
25:27 Of course, things will change,
25:29 and I speak to that in the book a lot,
25:31 but it's a very beefy book, and I'm really proud of it.
25:35 - When is it coming out?
25:36 - I'd like to have it come out next summer.
25:38 - Next summer, okay.
25:39 - We're just wrapping up, and it's ironic,
25:43 we just touched on both.
25:44 The kids book and day trading attention
25:51 have the potential to come out close to each other,
25:53 and obviously I wanna give them a little bit
25:55 of breathing room from a promotional standpoint,
25:57 so we're just working on that.
25:58 - Awesome, excited about both.
26:00 - Thank you.
26:02 - Now AI, I know you've been talking about it as well,
26:05 I wanna know how you're using it,
26:07 which tools you're using it,
26:08 how you recommend for entrepreneurs.
26:11 - We're using AI in some re-speecher and some audio,
26:14 translating my voice into other languages.
26:16 I'll speak-- - Spanish?
26:18 - Spanish, and Farsi, and German, and French,
26:23 I think every one of your favorite creators
26:26 will be speaking every language, perfectly synced lips,
26:30 no subtitles, in native tongue,
26:33 within the next 24 to 36 months at scale.
26:36 So that's gonna be enormous.
26:37 Mid-journey for creative thinking,
26:40 just typing in different visuals as I visualize things,
26:43 especially for internal presentations and decks.
26:46 Chat GPT for thinking or answering questions,
26:51 I like using it for trends.
26:53 For example, I'll ask, hey, Chat GPT,
26:57 why are people wearing corduroy hats right now in culture?
27:01 Those kind of things.
27:02 Those three really stand out.
27:06 Unfortunately, I have been so busy
27:11 with VFriends this summer, prepping this fall and winter,
27:15 and now I'm even busier VFriends for 2024,
27:19 that I'll be transparent.
27:21 I feel a little anxiety, not really,
27:23 but I am disappointed that I haven't been able
27:27 to go deeper in more tools,
27:30 'cause there's just so many hours in the day.
27:32 But it's very clear what this AI journey's gonna be.
27:37 It's an incredible infrastructure to our society,
27:42 and it will change a lot of things.
27:44 - Yes.
27:45 Are you worried about, 'cause you've said it too,
27:47 and I'm worried myself,
27:49 the deepfake aspect of it.
27:52 What are your thoughts on that?
27:53 - It's why I'm, don't worry, Dustin.
27:56 I know, we're New York City, everybody.
27:57 There's always sounds like this in the background.
27:59 We have no idea where it is.
28:00 I am worried about it,
28:04 and I think it's because people are headline readers.
28:07 So I'm worried because people believe everything.
28:11 I'm gonna say something pretty wild.
28:13 There's a part of me that is curious
28:18 about what it looks like when people believe nothing.
28:21 So right now, we believe everything,
28:23 and we're headline readers,
28:25 and I think it's causing damage.
28:27 What happens in 10 years when we don't believe in anything?
28:31 We don't believe what you said,
28:32 or what I said on video,
28:33 'cause we're not sure if somebody else made it.
28:36 And here's the full circle.
28:38 We have to go to the blockchain
28:40 to see if you and I post it.
28:43 I believe every piece of content I post in the future,
28:46 at some point, will be posted first on the blockchain
28:49 to prove provenance, and then we'll go on the internet.
28:52 And so if you see me say something that really upsets you,
28:55 you're like, "This is not the Gary I know."
28:57 You're gonna be able to go and look and be like,
28:59 "Oh, thank God, he didn't say that.
29:01 "Somebody made him say that in deepfake video."
29:04 I think that, because remember,
29:06 blockchains are not owned by Iran,
29:10 or America, or Russia, or China.
29:12 This is the power of the blockchain.
29:14 And so the blockchain has an incredible seat at the table
29:19 for society in the next 100 years.
29:22 And as we become more digital,
29:24 and it is the only true source of truth
29:27 that can't be manipulated,
29:29 you start thinking about a very interesting thing.
29:32 One of the great things, back to collectibles,
29:36 Empathy Elephant, series one spec diamond,
29:40 will never have a counterfeit.
29:42 There's unlimited counterfeit art, sneakers,
29:45 watches, and training clothes.
29:46 - Oh, in New York alone, oh my God, on the streets.
29:48 - You know what I mean?
29:49 But real counterfeit, forget about the streets
29:51 where it's just obvious.
29:52 There have been people who've really spent
29:54 500,000, $300,000 for a fake Pokemon
29:57 and Michael Jordan rookie card.
29:59 So I think we're so early on this,
30:02 but I'm very excited about what the blockchain does.
30:04 But yeah, deepfake is gonna be challenging.
30:07 It's gonna be tough in a year or two
30:10 when people with audiences like myself
30:14 will have to be on a daily or weekly basis
30:16 going on their social media saying,
30:18 that is not a video I made, that is not true,
30:20 I did not say that word,
30:21 or I did not discriminate against those people,
30:25 or I did not make that claim about business.
30:27 And it happened already.
30:28 During NFT summer, people were using my images
30:32 all over social media, claiming that I was bought this,
30:37 you know, you were close to it.
30:38 They would airdrop me the token.
30:40 - I've seen that, yeah.
30:41 - And then they would be like, Gary V buys 10 of them.
30:43 So I mean, you know,
30:44 people are always doing stuff, unfortunately.
30:47 Remember this, everyone, if you're worried.
30:49 It's always cops and robbers.
30:51 It's always cat and mouse.
30:53 Something gets invented, the bad guys try to do something,
30:56 the good guys try to capture them.
30:58 The good guys try to do something,
30:59 the bad guys try to get around it.
31:00 It's just one big circle.
31:02 So deepfake will be used for bad,
31:04 but we've created as humans the blockchain
31:08 that can be used for good.
31:09 - Absolutely.
31:10 - I'm excited about it.
31:12 So I'm worried, but optimistic.
31:14 - That's one of your main qualities.
31:17 - I think so.
31:18 I think I'm a practical optimist.
31:19 I'm not delusional.
31:20 I'm not an outer space.
31:22 I'm an operator.
31:23 I'm a thinker.
31:25 But I do believe in us more than most people.
31:29 I really do.
31:30 - And I wanted to ask about your time management
31:34 because I think it's incredible.
31:35 How does Gary decide,
31:37 we talked about this earlier,
31:39 saying no and maybe and all of this.
31:41 What gets a yes from Gary?
31:43 Also, because I'm here, right?
31:45 Did I get this yes?
31:46 What is your criteria for that?
31:48 - A lot of it's intuition.
31:50 And a lot of it's the complete opposite, like requirement.
31:55 I think I run on requirement and intuition.
31:58 I have a lot of responsibilities.
32:00 So we're now, because I was a little bit late this morning,
32:02 we're a couple minutes over.
32:03 There's a call going on right now with BeFriends
32:06 and a collaborator that's very important.
32:08 I'm three minutes late,
32:09 but I felt that because I was a little bit late this morning
32:13 and you came all the way out here
32:14 that I didn't want to cut our time short.
32:16 These are decisions that are happening every second,
32:19 especially for someone as busy as I am.
32:20 I have three full-time admins.
32:22 I have two chief of staffs.
32:24 I think what I do well is I don't let meetings run long.
32:28 I talk about that a lot.
32:30 One hour meetings could be 30,
32:31 30 minute meetings could be 15.
32:33 I think I put my money where my mouth is.
32:36 Most people don't hire three admins.
32:38 And so they get the results of two admins or one admin.
32:41 The biggest mistake I think a lot of people make,
32:43 and don't forget, I did my own admin work for 10 years.
32:45 - Of course.
32:46 - Excuse me, 2000, 1998.
32:48 I did my own admin for 13 years.
32:51 So I understand when people hear me,
32:53 they're like, "I can't afford it."
32:54 I'm like, "I know, I did that for 13 years."
32:56 But there was a point where I realized,
32:58 "Wait a minute, it's not good for me to be doing this.
33:01 "There's a lot of time I'm putting into this.
33:02 "I'm getting busier."
33:04 And so I think a lot of entrepreneurs or founders
33:07 don't get admins fast enough.
33:09 And then they don't trust admins.
33:11 - That's a big one.
33:12 - You know, and so I think they'd rather buy nice clothes
33:15 or take a trip or buy a nicer car or a better laptop.
33:19 And they're not investing in themselves
33:21 and their time is very important.
33:22 It's their biggest value.
33:24 I can make more money, but I can't make more time.
33:27 And I think about that a lot.
33:31 - Well, Gary, thank you so much.
33:33 It's been, I had like a million more questions.
33:34 - Oh, by the way, to answer your question,
33:36 why you?
33:37 Because I like you.
33:38 Because we have a real relationship.
33:40 You know, we've seen each other a lot.
33:41 We've interacted a lot.
33:42 That's the beauty of the internet.
33:44 We've seen each other a lot in the scheme of things,
33:47 but none of the, probably the second time on,
33:50 we wouldn't have seen each other
33:51 if we didn't continue the conversation on Twitter.
33:53 - Yes. - Right?
33:55 So I think social media creates the gateway
33:57 to real relationships.
33:59 And I like that, and I like people, and I like you.
34:02 And that's why we're here.
34:04 - Thank you, I love you.
34:05 - I love you back.
34:06 (upbeat music)
34:09 (upbeat music)
34:11 you