Lewis is joined by Declan McConville and Susanna Sealy to recap the action at the Edinburgh Derby, Celtic's lead and Rangers' search for a manager, and Scotland's final stretch to qualifying for Euro 2024.
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00:00 Hello and welcome to National World's Football Talk, your nan's favourite football podcast
00:10 Ken. It's a show where we break down the latest news and results from the Scottish Premiership
00:14 and around the SPFL. I'm your host this week Lewis Anderson, joined today by Susanna Seely
00:19 of the Edinburgh Evening News and Glasgow World reporter Declan McConville to look back
00:24 over the weekend's top flight action including the Edinburgh derby and important wins for
00:29 Rangers, Celtic and Livingston. We'll also have a quick chat about Rangers' managerial
00:35 hunt, the latest surrounding that and Scotland's upcoming Euro 2024 qualifier against Spain.
00:43 So firstly we'll start with you Susanna, Saturday's Edinburgh derby at Tyne Castle was another
00:48 crazy and drama filled two-all draw played in pretty horrible conditions. Heads of course
00:55 coming in from behind to score twice in the space of what was it 83 seconds? Something
01:00 like that yeah. What did you make of the game? Oh it was really exciting, it was my first
01:07 Edinburgh derby as well so sort of getting all that atmosphere was just, it was unbelievable
01:13 I honestly thought Tyne Castle was about to take off at one point and yeah there's so
01:18 much action going on, the rain was hammering down, I ruined every piece of paper that I
01:25 had everywhere. But no it was so, I think for the first half we, you know it was quite
01:31 clear that Hearts had the upper hand and I think we've been speaking before that they
01:35 looked as if they were going to be in a more solid position to take on the Hibs. Obviously
01:40 Hibs having sort of change in management, not really sure what was going to be happening
01:45 and then sort of out of nowhere just when you think Hearts are about to run away with
01:50 it and following the sort of second goal you honestly thought they might go on to get sort
01:55 of three, four more, oh sorry four nil. El Lloron just takes over and the Hibs fans have
02:04 been really quiet and sort of very demure and then suddenly they absolutely lit up and
02:11 it was amazing. I think sort of speaking to the managers afterwards Nick Montgomery had
02:16 said he'd sort of given Yuan about ten minutes to make an impact and if he didn't then he
02:21 was coming off. So Yuan had a lot to prove and boy did he do it, it was really exciting
02:26 and I think it's a really necessary point for both teams. Hearts would be really sorry
02:31 to have lost the lead that they had because they were in quite a commanding position.
02:36 But no I think it was a well deserved point for both sides, it's just depending on your
02:41 persuasion I'm fortunate that Hearts lost it or for Hibs I think it's amazing that they
02:46 were able to come back.
02:47 I think Montgomery touched on that post-match about the game being total madness, his first
02:53 Edinburgh derby. As he touched on it I'm guessing it will feel from a Hibs point of view almost
02:59 like three points given the way that they kind of came, were well out of the game in
03:03 that first half and then obviously both goals kind of stem from defensive lapses from Hearts.
03:10 Yeah definitely I think that was the consensus from the players and the manager afterwards
03:13 was like they had been in such a sort of, they'd been so behind and you know we speak
03:21 a lot as well about the sort of the impact that Tyne Castle fans have, it's one of the
03:24 most electric stadiums in Scotland outside of Glasgow. So I think for them to be able
03:30 to do that, sorry for Hibs to be able to do that in the away stadium is really important
03:37 and it shows a sort of huge strength in character that they can come back from sort of being
03:41 two nil down sort of 60 minutes into play. There was also an interesting point is the
03:47 first 15 minutes we had three yellow cards which like I think when that sort of first
03:54 happened I think Laurence Shankton got his yellow card within about three minutes of
03:57 play and I think I was like oh god here we go we're in for a sort of real shakedown between
04:03 the two sides. Nothing really materialised after that, sort of those initial three cards
04:09 but I think you know it took both sides a sort of while to settle into the game but
04:14 yeah what an amazing day and I think as well to be able to do that with all the you know
04:19 it was a very very Scottish day with the weather hammering down as well so that was a great
04:26 atmosphere.
04:27 Declan just let's touch on Nick Montgomery obviously brand new to Scottish football came
04:34 from Central Coast Mariners in Australia and perhaps performances so far still haven't
04:40 been you know of a great level let's say but he seems to be picking up results what have
04:46 you made of his start to life at Easter Road?
04:48 I think it's very difficult Lewis when you come into a club and obviously you know the
04:52 squad of players that are at Hibs just now you wouldn't see a Nick Montgomery's players
04:56 I think were about hitting the month mark since he arrived at Easter Road so again that
05:00 could be very difficult for somebody to come into a team. I think everybody can see he's
05:04 actually unbeaten since he came in there I think they've played five games he's won twice
05:08 he's drawn three the most important of those games was booting that place into the semi-final
05:13 at Hamden which he's did obviously they'll face Aberdeen in that which won't be an easy
05:16 game but listen see if he gets Hibs to a cup final that's a big box tick you know for Hibs
05:22 this season to get back to a cup final that was something they were doing consistently
05:26 under Jack Ross and getting to cup finals so I think that'll be a big box tick if they
05:31 can get through that game against Aberdeen we'll see how that goes. The Hibs fans would
05:35 of course probably prefer that they're winning more games than they are drawing but at this
05:40 point in time you know that there should be a decent mood around the camp at Easter Road
05:44 it's great to come back in a derby like that as you say it'll feel like three points for
05:47 Hibs rather than Hearts you know turning that around in 83 seconds but I think he's doing
05:55 an okay job but again we're so early on in his tenure he'll be wanting to probably you
06:01 know come back, reset after the international break, have that wee bit of time with the
06:05 players while others are on international duty and then go again because we know how
06:10 tough this period becomes coming off the back of October we'll have one international break
06:15 kind of halfway through November and then Christmas is going to be relentless so I think
06:19 that's going to be the real test for him Lewis but Bootney's placing it at the semi-final
06:22 I think a big box tick for Hibs and we'll see how they get on against Aberdeen. I think
06:27 as well sorry before Nick Montgomery coming in a lot had been made about sort of a mental
06:32 shift at Hibs so like aside from whatever they're doing on the pitch like one of the
06:37 biggest things that's coming out is how much he wanted to change the mentality around it
06:41 and I think if he's sort of doing that and he's taking the sort of the mental game he's
06:46 trying to make it slightly different it could be slightly longer before we see the fruits
06:49 of that on the pitch so it'll be interesting to see but yeah I think it's going to be a
06:54 more mental rather than physical battle at the start.
06:59 One player I want to touch on with you Susannah is Alex Lowry arguably Hearts star performer
07:03 during the game on Saturday there seemed to be a bit of kind of upheaval from the Hearts
07:08 fans when he was replaced just after the hour mark and as most followers of this show will
07:13 be aware he's obviously on loan from Rangers and he certainly seems to have made a very
07:18 you know favourable impression so far at Tyne Castle what's been your assessment of his
07:23 spell in terms of his development so far?
07:26 Yeah well it was really interesting actually because I wasn't expecting him to start at
07:29 the press conference the day before I asked Stephen Naismith you know is it ready for
07:34 this guy to get his be on the starting lineup for such a big game and Naismith actually
07:39 said no he'd said you know he's a great player but he's still really young he's quite inconsistent
07:46 with a lot of his performances he tries he takes essentially too many risks and it wasn't
07:52 sure that they'd always pay off and Naismith also used the in the Kilmarnock game how Lowry
07:58 tried to nutmeg someone didn't quite work so yeah I was actually really surprised to
08:04 see him on the starting lineup for an Edinburgh derby but I mean the kid was amazing you know
08:10 as you say the reaction when he came off was it was noticeable but I think for someone
08:16 he has a lot of tenacity he's still so young that he's sort of I think that risk taking
08:20 is actually really important he doesn't he doesn't seem phased by the sort of the big
08:25 occasions in that regard he'll just go for it doesn't really matter what happens for
08:30 better or for worse but that fire was really important in the first 45 minutes and for
08:35 him to sort of it's sort of unfortunate that his name isn't attached to the second goal
08:40 obviously it's sort of deflected off Christian Deutch in the end so it's now sort of own
08:45 goal sadly but no he was really key in sort of getting hearts up the mark sort of before
08:51 he came off the pitch and I think you know it's the start of something really great I
08:55 think Hearts fans will be really looking forward to seeing more and more of him on the pitch
08:58 brilliant and Declan moving on you were at Celtic Park on Saturday another fairly convincing
09:06 3-1 win for Celtic over Kilmarnock what was your overall assessment of the game obviously
09:13 the result in the Champions League the defeat to Lazio an important reaction that Brendan
09:19 Rodgers got from his players and they certainly seemed to deliver for him I think Kilmarnock
09:24 was a kind of important game anyway Lewis after what had happened in the cup in August
09:29 for Celtic so I think the players will have already wanted to kind of get that out of
09:34 their system so playing Kilmarnock so quickly after a Champions League game was probably
09:38 the kind of the perfect recipe for Brendan Rodgers probably big takeaways you see what
09:43 he says about Rio Hatate Brendan Rodgers after the game you know very poor I thought on Wednesday
09:49 night at Celtic Park in the Lazio game in terms of the standards that we've seen from
09:54 him even in the Champions League last season so Rio Hatate looks to be kind of back to
09:58 his best almost I say that hesitantly obviously it's only one game you need to see that as
10:04 a consistent period of time but his goal is really well taken the commandant defender
10:10 and midfielder sort of having nightmares I think about that for a couple of weeks to
10:14 come he completely takes him out the game so really good goal obviously he's part of
10:20 the second the third goal I think as well Rio Hatate making those moves and those runs
10:25 into the box which has become quite symbolic of him in Scottish football so he looks to
10:31 be back obviously Brendan Rodgers revealing that he'd spoken to him after the game and
10:35 talking about that consistency and getting to that level so for Celtic fans promising
10:39 to see him and Louis Palma he's been somebody who came in so late on in the transfer window
10:45 he's taken the number 7 shirt at Celtic which any Celtic fan any Scottish football fan knows
10:50 holds a dear place in Celtic fans hearts with the history around that so right away there's
10:56 pressure on your back pardon the pun taking the number 7 shirt at Celtic Park but a great
11:02 goal from him I know there's been debate about Rio Hatate's influence with Stuart Findlay
11:08 around that offside but it's a well taken strike if you just take that in isolation
11:12 and I think now you'll probably see him feature a lot more in that front three for Celtic
11:16 I think Rodgers already had Maeda and Kiyoko down as his two starters up there and it was
11:21 to find that missing piece we obviously Jota leaving in the summer and Leila Bada being
11:26 injured so I think out the three so far this season and Yang James Forrest has appeared
11:31 a good few times for Celtic but I think now Louis Palma will really kick on so in terms
11:35 of that it looks as if those two players are going to make a great addition Cameron Carter
11:39 Vickers back into the fold he'll play a big part now probably in the Champions League
11:43 for Celtic obviously coming off the bench it's his mistake on Wednesday of course but
11:47 solid as anything at the weekend and it looked probably I would say the first kind of proper
11:52 Rodgers performance since his return to Celtic Park it was 3-1 you know probably gone in
11:57 6 or 7-1 great you know chance creation going into the box and players really looking as
12:04 I forget the bit between their teeth and again I think some of those players are really thrived
12:08 to be back in that training pitch at Leila's down and what could Rodgers before this next
12:13 batch of Champions League game comes up.
12:15 I just wanted to touch on that again with the interesting point you made there it just
12:20 feels like over the last couple of domestic games in particular that they're really this
12:23 team now really starting to click under Rodgers it's taken that kind of initial you know bedding
12:28 in process with the new manager coming back but it just seems like now that Celtic are
12:33 beginning to kind of hit that next level if you like.
12:36 I think it's just very difficult obviously Ange Postakoglu we see how good a job he's
12:40 doing with Spurs you know another great result at the weekend for Tottenham and you know
12:48 people would say you know he expects first to go away to Luton and win but they were
12:50 down to 10 men for a long period of the game and they went and got the result again and
12:54 they're still unbeaten under him so for the players it's very different you know we've
12:58 seen those inverted full backs we've seen the roller players Rodgers plays a very different
13:02 brand of football with that we see how important you know the both centre-halves are obviously
13:07 he touched on Liam Scales being one of the biggest surprises in his managerial career
13:12 so far in terms of not knowing a lot about the player but we see him getting his just
13:16 awards and his call up to the Republic of Ireland squad Liam Scales so it's very different
13:21 and again I think Livingston probably away was the first time Celtic fans thought okay
13:27 here we go that was down to 10 men I would say now you're starting to see this Celtic
13:31 team really click and probably you know Wednesday night up until the end of that game I think
13:36 a lot of Celtic fans would say you know in terms of European performance that was maybe
13:41 a wee bit more encouraging than stuff they had seen in previous years too so I think
13:45 it is now beginning to click whether the international break comes at the right time I don't know
13:51 but again as I say I think a lot of players will probably be looking forward to spending
13:55 a wee bit more time in training with Brendan Rodgers and just getting up to that level
13:58 that he's obviously looking for.
14:03 So with Celtic winning on Saturday they moved seven points clear at the top of the table
14:07 the pressure was of course back on Rangers shoulders when they went to St Mirren on Sunday
14:13 Susannah obviously you know a lot of speculation around who the new manager is going to be
14:19 at Rangers at this moment in time but important for them as well given they also suffered
14:25 European disappointment on Thursday night that they were able to bounce back with a
14:29 fairly convincing win in the end.
14:32 Yeah definitely and against St Mirren who had as far as I'm aware up to this point been
14:37 unbeaten so I think it was really important especially sort of in a post Michael Beale
14:43 world that Rangers made like a sort of a huge statement if they're going to be able to do
14:47 much this season I think we've all seen that like St Mirren have posed like a really almost
14:54 shocking threat I don't think sort of many people expected the start they had so yeah
14:59 it's really important that Rangers with all the speculation that's going on and there
15:04 has been so much speculation that they've like finally been able to make that I think
15:10 you know you could call it a sort of statement win sort of 3-0 it's really important to get
15:14 that away from home.
15:17 Yeah obviously St Mirren had the player sent off Ryan Strain in the first half for a deliberate
15:22 handball James Tavenier scoring a worldie I must say for the third goal to seal all
15:30 three points for Steven Davis who will round off his kind of stint as interim manager.
15:37 The latest in terms of Rangers manager search it sounds like they'll be interviewing four
15:42 final candidates this week from plenty of reports there's a lot of speculation around
15:49 who those names might be Declan there's been talk around Kevin Musket, Philippe Clamont
15:55 is another interesting one Pascal Janssen and Scott Parker at this moment in time are
16:02 kind of the leading contenders it seems I know those discussions will be taking place
16:06 over the next couple of days in London.
16:11 Where do you think Rangers will go from here who do you feel that they could be the man
16:16 it obviously we know that Graeme Souness now as well is having a kind of advisory role
16:22 in terms of offering his expertise in the situation.
16:27 Just quickly just touching on Sunday as well Lewis I thought it was really interesting
16:31 who obviously Steve Davis brought into the team McCausland lovely so obviously we were
16:34 talking about Alex Lowry earlier I think if he was you know still at Rangers and not on
16:39 Lonely Hearts we'd have seen him probably feature in this run it probably shows you
16:44 obviously it's great that young players are getting the opportunity there but it probably
16:46 shows you the mess in terms of injuries and what came in the door at Rangers especially
16:50 wingers and how little in numbers they actually are who Steve Davis has to turn towards but
16:56 in terms of probably where we're at here Scott Parker to me is a very interesting one in
17:00 terms of Rangers having looked at Frank Lampard we know that the bulk of players in that side
17:06 are British based you know that was the route that Michael Beale and Ross Wilson had went
17:11 down previously they might look at that and think okay this is maybe something we want
17:16 to keep within the squad in terms of a manager understanding the game up here obviously I
17:21 know Scott Parker doesn't have any experience in Scottish football but might look at that
17:25 if he's in that similar mode to Lampard again though it's whether these names fill Rangers
17:31 fans with excitement or not we know Clement for instance won titles in Belgium I think
17:38 for a lot of Rangers fans so they're still wanting somebody to walk in that door who
17:42 is a proven winner Scott Parker took Bournemouth back to the Premier League Pascal Jansen has
17:47 been in management with Elkmar for three years he's not won anything and obviously Kevin
17:51 Muscat's won titles in Australia and Japan bringing somebody of his calibre to the club
17:56 one opens up a completely different market for Rangers in terms of what you've seen
18:01 Ange Poste Coghlan do at Celtic and where he's shopped you know you bring in somebody
18:05 who has this kind of expertise in not just Japanese football but obviously Australian
18:09 football and he's won stuff he knows the club having only been there I know a short period
18:14 of time but he does know what the expectation is of Rangers there's four interesting names
18:20 but again it's whether they're going to be convincing and at this point in time for Rangers
18:24 fans there's still that worry you know these four guys are they better than Brendan Rodgers
18:29 I don't think any of them actually are and it's whether or not whoever comes in seven
18:35 points is a real difficult mountain to climb so yeah it's going to be interesting to see
18:40 who they go with I think Scott Parker's a really interesting one of my Graham Soonis
18:43 in conversations it possibly could be him yeah I wanted to get your take on that Susanna
18:49 how important do you feel it could be for the likes of James Bisgrove and John Bennett
18:54 to have Soonis' kind of expertise and knowledge when it comes to you know getting this appointment
19:01 right given that you know obviously Rangers have well let's face it three out of the last
19:05 four managers have been deemed a failure barring Stephen Gerrard so how important do you feel
19:10 it is to get this this appointment correct? Yeah I mean I think the sort of the likes
19:16 of Celtic and Rangers they want to have long-standing managers they don't want to be changing every
19:21 few months so they need to make sure especially because Celtic are just running away with
19:26 all the trophies at the moment that they need to ensure that this person can stick around
19:30 and see effective change over a sort of long period of time I think getting Graham Soonis
19:34 especially as we've mentioned the names on there there's only you know there aren't many
19:39 that have got the real Scottish sort of experience and it is a very different kettle of fish
19:44 when you're managing a team such as Rangers in the Scottish Premiership it's very very
19:49 different so I think getting as much help as you can from those who have got that experience
19:54 within the league is going to be really crucial and yeah I think Scott Parker's a very it's
20:00 it's an odd choice I would say I can't I can't really foresee it working brilliantly if they
20:06 did go down that route I think he has the chance of being eaten alive if he comes up here but
20:12 you know I guess we'll have to see if that happens but no I think they need as much help
20:17 as they can to ensure that whatever they have lasts and I think yeah the sort of mention of
20:22 Kevin Muscat with the experience that he's got it's really we've seen how brilliant sort of some
20:28 of the Australian players and Japanese players when they've come over they've been phenomenal
20:33 for the likes of Celtic for Hearts for Hibs so it'd be really good to sort of build up that
20:38 connection and see what Rangers could do with it if they went down that route as well.
20:44 Just touching on the final results of the weekend Livingston beat 10-man Motherwell 2-0 at the Tony
20:48 Macaroni Arena and Aberdeen who we've discussed plenty on this show over the last couple of weeks
20:53 held to a goalless draw against bottom of the table St Johnson at Potaudry.
20:58 And moving on I just finally want to round off today's podcast touching on the upcoming
21:03 international window Scotland of course back in action looking to hopefully fingers crossed
21:10 seal their place at Euro 2024 and we obviously face Spain and Seville first up before a friendly
21:18 against France. Declan what's your thoughts heading into this window? Not too bothered about the France
21:26 game obviously friendly don't need to worry about that Spain's going to be really tricky I think
21:30 they will be looking for a wee bit of revenge especially Rodri if he's in and around that squad
21:37 we're looking for something back in his athlete we did to Spain at Hampden. My only kind of wee
21:42 worry Lewis is obviously there's been a real good factor in this camp under Steve Clarke you don't
21:47 want to let too many defeats creep in and you end up putting yourself in the back foot obviously
21:52 we know England was only a friendly we did the business pre England if you will but we know it
22:00 was only a friendly you just don't want to end up in a situation where you've lost three games in
22:04 a bounce one of those is done you're not probably too hopeful going to Sevilla, Seville on Thursday
22:11 and then you get France so that's my only kind of wee worry I think I'm a wee bit more
22:15 bothered about that Georgia and Norway game when we will seal our deal to go to Euro 2024 because
22:20 we know it's already done it's just when that's sealed. Just looking at all the permutations here
22:27 you know we're talking about if so we win our draw against Spain on Thursday we qualify failing that
22:33 Scotland qualify if Norway fail to win against Cyprus on the same night or if none of that
22:39 happens Scotland will qualify if Spain win or draw against Norway on Sunday so it's there's
22:45 plenty of different scenarios there and how excited are we going into this this break?
22:51 Yep yep you know I think those permutations are quite exciting it's just I think we'd all
22:57 probably like Lewis you know it's two folk that go to Scotland games yourself and I you'd like
23:02 to be at Hampden when it happens obviously that would probably mean having to prolong it until
23:07 that Norway game but again you'd probably like to go into that game it already been being done
23:13 and then folk you know are wanting to get their flights and whatever book they can get on I know
23:16 that the ticket portal or that stuff's already there but it's going to be really exciting you
23:21 know the next month as I say it's already done for me anyway it's just if and when we can seal
23:27 the deal and that's it I've placed booked Euro 2024. Epic well stay tuned Glasgow World will be
23:34 doing plenty of coverage around Scotland over the coming days and that's all we've got time for this
23:39 week many thanks to my guests Susanna and Declan for joining me and stay tuned for the next episode
23:44 of Football Talk.
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