China Now 02-09: China's intelligence networks, environmental policies and housing
The China Now special program informs about this country's news, culture and technological advances. In this episode, we take a closer look at the Asian giant's intelligence networks, its attendance to the latest BRICS' forum in South Africa, as well as Chinese environmental policies, housing in the US and China and other topics of interest. teleSUR
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00:00 Hello, Televisión English presents a new episode of China Now, a web media production
00:13 that showcases the culture, technology and politics of the Asian giant.
00:17 This episode goes over China's intelligence networks, China's attendance to the latest
00:23 BRICS forum in South Africa, as well as its environmental security policies facing Japan's
00:29 discharge of water from the Fukushima nuclear power plant and other topics of interest.
00:34 Let's see.
00:35 China Current is a weekly news talk show from China to the world.
00:39 We cover viral news about China every week and also give you the newest updates on China's
00:44 cutting-edge technologies.
00:45 Let's get started.
00:46 Hi, welcome to China Current.
00:58 I'm Chris.
00:59 Two weeks ago, we reported that China had arrested a CIA spy.
01:03 The suspect, whose last name is Zeng, was an employee at a state-owned military corporation.
01:09 He was lured by the CIA during his stay in Italy and continued to provide critical information
01:14 to the CIA after he went back to China.
01:18 We talked about how rare it was for Chinese authorities to pinpoint the name of a foreign
01:22 agency and how China's new anti-espionage law had affected the foreign agency's operation
01:28 within China.
01:30 Well, the show is not over yet.
01:32 On August 21, the Chinese Ministry of State Security announced that they had captured
01:37 another CIA spy.
01:39 The suspect, whose last name is Hao, was arrested for spying for the CIA.
01:44 Hao was a government official at a critical department who had access to classified information.
01:50 While he was studying in Japan, Hao was approached and recruited by the personnel from the CIA.
01:55 At that time, Hao was only an employee at a non-confidential department, so the CIA
02:00 persuaded him, using money, of course, to apply for positions within core government
02:05 departments.
02:06 And Hao signed an espionage agreement with the CIA and went through multiple assessment
02:11 and training sessions with the Americans.
02:14 After returning to China, he continued to have secret meetings with the CIA operatives,
02:19 providing them with intelligence and receiving espionage-related funds in return.
02:24 China's newly revised anti-espionage law, which came into effect on July 1, urged to
02:29 fight a "people's war" against foreign spying agencies.
02:33 In order to safeguard national security, any citizen or organization that discovers espionage
02:38 activities should promptly report them to the national security agency.
02:43 It would be quite interesting if we compared the two spies.
02:46 In terms of similarities, both of them were recruited while studying abroad.
02:51 This is actually a pretty good sign to national security, isn't it?
02:55 Meaning it is hard for foreign agencies to recruit within the Chinese border.
02:59 Could work, boys.
03:01 As for differences, the spy arrested this time, Mr. Hao, was actually trained by the
03:06 CIA after agreeing to become a spy.
03:10 On the contrary, the first guy had never gone through the entire CIA curriculum for spying.
03:15 This is a problem because our new guy was working at a much more critical government
03:20 body when the first guy was only an employee at a state-owned military company.
03:24 But seriously, since all of you will eventually get into that cell, what difference does it
03:30 make?
03:31 Well, these spying cases also help netizens to understand the protocol for civil servants.
03:36 Traditionally, once someone gets a job as a civil servant, he or she needs to hand in
03:41 their passport.
03:42 Civil servants, especially the ones who work at crucial departments and those who make
03:46 it to cadres, will go through a strict procedure before going abroad.
03:51 People used to consider the protocol as redundant and unnecessary, but as the Ministry of State
03:57 Security began to review all their spy cases, netizens have expressed their understanding
04:02 towards the policy.
04:04 Next up, on August 19th, the Eastern Theater Command of the People's Liberation Army announced
04:09 that it had organized joint sea and air combat readiness patrols around the Taiwan island,
04:15 conducting joint exercises involving naval and aerial forces.
04:20 According to the report from Taiwan, a total of 45 PLA military aircraft and 9 warships
04:26 were observed operating near the Taiwan Strait.
04:29 Among the 45 aircrafts, 27 crossed the so-called "middle line."
04:34 Notably, the Eastern Theater Command also released a video of the exercise.
04:39 Undoubtedly, the aim is to demonstrate the joint combat capabilities of the theater's
04:43 forces, sending a strong warning to both separatists and foreign countries that are engaged in
04:49 provocations and collusion.
04:52 The military exercise is a reaction to Lai Ching-tung's earlier visit to the United
04:56 States.
04:57 Lai, a politician affiliated with Taiwan's Democratic Progressive Party, arrived in New
05:02 York for so-called "transit" on August 12th.
05:06 Lai used his brief transit in New York to garner support for his separatist agenda from
05:11 the United States.
05:13 Meanwhile, China's Taiwan Affairs Office also started its investigation into trade
05:17 barriers set by Taiwan Island, which probably will lead to an end of the ECFA, the trade
05:24 agreement between the mainland and the island.
05:27 On August 21st, China's General Administration of Customs suspended importing Taiwan's
05:33 mangoes.
05:34 According to the official announcement, citrus miller bugs have been found on mangoes from
05:39 the Taiwan island in recent inspections.
05:41 The suspension was made to prevent further damage to the mainland's agricultural production.
05:46 On Chinese internet, many consider the suspension as a warning to the Taiwan separatists.
05:52 Next up, let's take a look at the BRICS.
05:55 On August 21st, Chinese President Xi Jinping left Beijing for the 15th BRICS Summit in
06:00 Johannesburg, South Africa.
06:02 A total of 69 countries, including all of the African countries, have been invited to
06:07 the summit.
06:09 The Chinese president previously visited South Africa in 2018 as he sought to enhance China's
06:14 diplomatic and economic ties with Africa.
06:18 BRICS is an acronym for the developing countries of Brazil, Russia, India, China, and South
06:23 Africa.
06:24 The BRICS countries represent 43% of the world's population, 16% of the world's trade, and
06:31 a larger share of the world's GDP than that of the G7.
06:35 Most of the netizens in Chinese social media expressed their expectations for the 2023
06:40 summit and hope that more strong economic measures will be proposed to boost the economy.
06:46 On August 24th, the BRICS agreed to admit Iran, Saudi Arabia, the UAE, Argentina, Egypt,
06:52 and Ethiopia to the organization, marking the second expansion in the organization's
06:57 history.
06:58 The group was originally formed in 2009 by Brazil, Russia, India, and China.
07:03 South Africa was added in 2010.
07:06 Chinese President Xi Jinping called the expansion "historic" and said it will bring "vigor"
07:11 to the group.
07:12 Chinese netizens expect BRICS to play a role in resolving national and regional disputes,
07:18 and the admission of new members could guarantee China's stability in accessing oil resources.
07:24 Next up, let's focus on the nuclear disaster in Japan.
07:28 On August 22nd, Japan declared its intention to commence the release of nuclear-contaminated
07:34 water from the devastated Fukushima nuclear power plant into the Pacific Ocean.
07:39 In response to this announcement, China expressed vehement opposition, labeling the act as "extremely
07:46 selfish and irresponsible."
07:48 Vice Foreign Minister Sung Wai-dong summoned Hideo Tarumi, the Japanese ambassador to China,
07:54 to formally express China's concerns and objections regarding this decision.
07:59 Sung emphasized that Japan's decision blatantly disregards the firm opposition of the global
08:04 community.
08:05 He further warned that if Japan persists with the discharges, China will take all necessary
08:11 measures to safeguard the ocean, ensure food safety, and protect the health and well-being
08:16 of its citizens.
08:18 During a regular news briefing in Beijing, Foreign Ministry Spokesman Wang Wenbing reiterated
08:22 China's concerns, urging Japan to rectify its decisions, engage in sincere communication
08:28 with neighboring countries, responsibly handle the contaminated water, and accept stringent
08:33 international oversight.
08:34 In a related development, John Lee Kachou, the chief executive of China's Hong Kong
08:39 special administrative region, announced an immediate ban on importing Japanese seafood
08:44 products.
08:45 The Macau special administrative region also declared a ban on importing live and fresh
08:49 food products from the 10 Japanese prefectures and regions affected from Thursday.
08:56 Following the two SIRs, on August 24, two hours after Japan began dumping nuclear wastewater
09:02 into the Pacific Ocean, China's General Administration of Customs announced the suspension of all
09:08 seafood imports from Japan.
09:10 The agency said the measures aim to prevent radioactive, contaminated Japanese seafood
09:15 from entering China and protect the life and health of the Chinese people.
09:20 Chinese customs will strengthen supervision of food imports from Japan.
09:24 Previously, China had banned seafood imports from 10 prefectures in Japan, including Fukushima
09:30 and Tokyo, but allowed imports from other prefectures if they passed radioactive testing.
09:36 The latest import ban now encompasses all of Japan.
09:39 Next up, on August 22, the Chinese ambassador to Myanmar, Chen Hai, met with the Thai and
09:44 Lao ambassadors to the country to discuss and coordinate efforts to tackle local gambling,
09:50 telecom fraud and trafficking in the border region.
09:54 The urgency of these collaborations stems from the increasing prevalence of telecom
09:58 frauds, particularly those originating from northern Myanmar.
10:03 Furthermore, the region near Myanmar's border has become a hotspot for human traffickers
10:08 who deceive unemployed youths with promises of lucrative overseas jobs and poses a serious
10:13 threat to the lives and property of the peoples in neighboring countries.
10:18 The embassies of the three countries in Myanmar have expressed great concern and are continuously
10:23 working on addressing this issue.
10:26 The embassies are fully coordinating with Myanmar authorities to conduct search and
10:31 rescue operations and assist in intensifying efforts to combat gambling and fraud syndicates.
10:37 The challenge now is to ensure that this region does not continue to serve as a safe haven
10:42 for criminals.
10:44 Next up, on the morning of August 22, North Korea's Air Koryo landed its first international
10:50 commercial flight in Beijing, marking the country's reopen after three years since
10:55 the COVID pandemic.
10:56 The flight was set to take off a day before but was cancelled at the last minute, and
11:01 the fluctuation was regarded as a sign of indecisiveness.
11:05 Discussion on Chinese internet focused on what has made up Kim Jong-un's mind.
11:09 Some connect this to the recent typhoon Kano, which passed through the entire Korean peninsula.
11:15 Storms and floods ravaging the land might have proven detrimental to North Korea's
11:19 food production, forcing the country to call for a helping hand, especially from China.
11:25 Others associate this with the military alliance between China and DPRK, which just consolidated
11:31 as DPRK commemorated the 70th anniversary of the Korean War armistice in high profile.
11:37 By reopening its border, North Korea seeks to increase its defense tie with China against
11:42 more aggressive US forces in the Korean peninsula.
11:45 Well that's all for today.
11:47 Thank you for watching this episode of China Currents.
11:49 If you have any thoughts and comments about our show, please reach us at the email address
11:52 below.
11:53 I'm Chris, looking forward to hearing from you and see you next time.
11:56 We will go for a short break now, but we'll be right back.
12:04 Stay with us.
12:05 Welcome back to China Now.
12:22 This second segment explores new scientific development to turn carbon dioxide into sugar,
12:28 as well as how it advances in new techniques for water forecasting.
12:33 All in a new segment, experts put side by side both China's and US housing system.
12:39 Hello.
12:40 Hi, I'm Lisa, and this is Threshold in China.
12:46 Today we are going to share some exciting tech innovations and announcements that happened
12:50 in China last week.
12:57 On August 24th, Japan started dumping radioactive water from Fukushima into the Pacific.
13:04 Experts estimate around 1.5 million tons of contaminated water has accumulated so far.
13:11 Discharges may continue for 30 to 50 years, affecting the entire Pacific region and beyond.
13:19 This has raised global concerns about health and environmental impact.
13:23 The stimulation results revealed just how close the Fukushima contaminated water is
13:28 to us.
13:30 Radioactive material would appear off China's coast about 240 days after being discharged.
13:37 They would then spread down China's southeast shores, reaching the US and Canadian west
13:41 coast in around three years, with some appearing along the north coast of Australia, covering
13:48 almost the whole North Pacific.
13:51 The radioactive materials will then rapidly spread southward along the Americas, carried
13:56 by the equatorial current, while also transferring into the Indian Ocean via northern Australian
14:04 waters.
14:05 With levels building up over time, eventually concentrations would be higher along North
14:11 America's shores compared to the most of coastal East Asia.
14:16 To present a clearer comparison, researchers selected three coastal cities, Misayaki in
14:23 Japan, Shanghai in China, and San Diego in the United States, and grabbed the tritium
14:28 concentration changes in nearby waters.
14:32 Notably, although contaminants arrived latest in San Diego, the stable concentration levels
14:38 there eventually exceed those in Misayaki.
14:42 Around 4,000 days after discharge begins, contaminant concentrations near San Diego
14:48 are already higher than most of East Asia's coastal regions, roughly three times Misayaki's
14:54 level and 40 times Shanghai's level.
14:57 The reason for this phenomenon is that strong ocean currents near Japan carry most contaminants
15:03 eastward across the Pacific, rather than southward along the Asian coastline.
15:09 Though Japan has claimed to the public that the issue is only regarding tritium, many
15:14 scientists worldwide share the consensus that the contaminated water contains up to 64 types
15:20 of radioactive elements, over 70% above safety limits, which are difficult to fully process
15:28 with current technologies.
15:31 Back in May, the plant operator Tokyo Electric Power Company found that black rockfish have
15:37 18,000 becquerels per kilogram of cesium-137, with 180 times over the legal limit.
15:47 They also confirmed that a total of 44 fish with cesium levels above 100 becquerels per
15:52 kilogram had been found in the Fukuyama's plant port between May 2022 and May 2023.
16:00 The effect could be long-term, as we have mentioned previously, discharge may continue
16:04 for 30 to 50 years.
16:06 The accumulation of radioactive materials over such a long time is uncertain.
16:12 China and Russia have suggested an alternative plan for Japan to consider, which is evaporative
16:18 emission.
16:19 That refers to the method of evaporating contaminated water with radioactive tritium and releasing
16:26 it into the air.
16:28 They argue aerial emission would have less regional impact and monitoring methods are
16:33 technically mature.
16:35 However, Japan rejected this proposal mainly based on the higher cost of evaporative emissions.
16:42 The first batch of 7,800 tons of radioactive contaminated water is currently being discharged
16:50 into the ocean, a process that will continue for 17 days.
16:54 We will keep following this developing story and in our next episode, we will provide an
16:59 in-depth analysis on the consequences of Japan's way of disposing the Fukuyama's contaminated
17:05 water and to what extent it will affect each of us.
17:08 Chinese scientists have successfully converted carbon dioxide into sugar.
17:20 Sugar production has always relied on plants, but crop yields face increasing risk from
17:25 climate change impact like land degradation, ecosystem decline and extreme weather.
17:30 Securing sustainable sugar feedstock is becoming a challenge.
17:34 In September 2021, researchers at the Tianjin Institute of Institutional Biotechnology synthesized
17:42 starch from carbon dioxide in the lab.
17:45 In less than two years, on August 16th, 2023, they successfully converted carbon dioxide
17:51 into sugars.
17:53 The team established a modular chemical enzymatic cascade to transform carbon dioxide into hexose,
18:00 which is a simple sugar with six carbon atoms.
18:04 Carbon hexose are glucose and fructose.
18:07 The team has successfully produced four types of sugars.
18:10 The full reaction took about 17 hours, reducing sugar production from years to hours compared
18:16 to traditional crop extraction.
18:19 The yield was 0.67 grams per liter per hour, over 10 times higher than previous bio-based
18:26 efforts.
18:27 Leading author Yang Jianguang said controlling different enzymes enables theoretical synthesis
18:33 for almost any sugar type.
18:36 This precision will be key for high-value food, pharmaceutical and biomaterial production.
18:42 In future, the team want to further synthesize other types of sugar for applications in food,
18:47 medicine and biomanufacturing.
18:49 Maybe one day scientists could even turn air into a meal.
18:59 This past July may go down as one of the hottest months ever recorded, potentially in 120,000
19:06 years.
19:07 As climate change accelerates, extreme weather like hurricanes, typhoons, floods and droughts
19:12 are becoming more frequent.
19:14 Improving weather forecasting accuracy can better safeguard lives and property, especially
19:19 when typhoons make landing.
19:22 Study shows reducing the 24-hour typhoon pass prediction error by just 1 km decreases direct
19:29 economic losses by around 97 million yuan.
19:33 However, reducing typhoon forecast uncertainty has been a slow process, with global medium
19:39 range scale improving only one day per decade.
19:43 Before Chad's GPT exploded, powerful computing, massive datasets and deep learning were already
19:49 combined to build sophisticated weather models.
19:52 For example, NVIDIA's ForecastNet DeepMind and Google's GraphCast Microsoft Climax,
19:59 but recently attention has focused on China's Huawei and its Pangu weather model.
20:04 The Pangu weather model is a 3D high-resolution global forecasting AI system exceeding traditional
20:11 numerical prediction accuracy.
20:13 Two months before appearing in Nature, it accurately forecasted Typhoon Huawei's change
20:18 in its pass five days out.
20:20 By training deep neural networks on 43 years of global data, Pangu surpassed legacy method
20:27 in both precision and speed.
20:29 Previously, stimulating a typhoon's 10-day pass took five hours across 3,000 servers.
20:37 Now with the pre-trained Pangu and AI inference, more accurate forecasts take just 10 seconds
20:43 in one server and GPU.
20:45 With immense computing power, Pangu can predict the hourly or the week's global weather in
20:50 seconds, and it is 10,000 times faster than before.
20:55 The key innovation is its 3D Earth-specific transformer tailored to graphic coordinates
21:02 for processing complex 3D weather data.
21:05 Unlike 2D models confined to pressure level, Pangu's 3D architecture better captures ocean,
21:11 atmosphere and land interactions.
21:14 Pangu has proven itself forecasting extremes like February storm Eunice and UK's first
21:21 40 degrees Celsius temperatures.
21:24 It has the lowest error compared to the European and American agencies for predicting typhoons.
21:30 Pangu is now on the European Centre for Medium-Range Weather Forecasting website, offering free
21:36 10-day global forecasts.
21:38 Recent tests showed Pangu outperformed the centre's model on accuracy metrics and extreme
21:44 weather prediction.
21:46 As the next typhoon approaches, it is hoped that more people can say we are prepared.
21:51 [Music]
21:55 This tree is the tallest tree newly found in Asia, the Tibetan Cypress One, at 101.2
22:04 metres tall.
22:06 This photo is taken by drones and it vertically combines hundreds of shots together, and it's
22:12 the second tallest tree in the world, after the 115.9 metre High Baryon Coast Redwood
22:20 discovered in California in 2006.
22:24 Tibetan Cypress Two, found alongside it, reached 99.5 metres.
22:29 The Chinese team discovered this grove in Tibet, with the world's highest altitude.
22:35 Over 260 trees exceeded 80 metres, with 25 surpassing 90 metres in this biodiversity
22:42 hotspot.
22:43 Judging by diameter and rings, researchers estimate Tibetan Cypress One is about 1,450
22:51 years old, Tibetan Cypress Two is around 1,400 years old.
22:56 So how did they get so big and can they keep growing taller?
23:00 Botanists define giant trees as over 90 metres.
23:05 Researchers said the tallest trees live exclusively in wet, humid, temperature climates.
23:11 The grove where these giant trees were found is a cloud forest, with annual rainfall of
23:16 1,500 to 2,000 millimetres.
23:19 And this is important because for trees above 60 metres high, it becomes increasingly difficult
23:25 for them to obtain water that is transported upwards from the root.
23:29 So it relies on the moisture that branches and leaves directly obtain from fog and rain.
23:36 While not skyscraper heights, these giants are biological marvels and living fossils
23:41 that are many ecosystems.
23:43 Tibetan Cypress One and Two host 46 epiphyte species, which are plants that grow on other
23:49 plants.
23:50 Birds and numerous insects also spotted by the team.
23:54 And that is all for today's Threshold.
23:56 As always, please let us know if you like this news section on science and technology
24:00 in China, and we will do more in the future.
24:03 [MUSIC]
24:16 Welcome to Overlap, brought to you by Breakthrough News and Wave Media.
24:20 My name is Rachel Hu.
24:21 I'm happy to be joined today by Xiaofeng Ma, a content producer on Bilibili, as well as
24:26 Will Merrifield, the director of the Centre for Social Housing and Public Investment.
24:31 Welcome to the show.
24:32 Thanks for having me.
24:33 Hello, nice to meet you.
24:34 Nice to meet you.
24:37 Great to have you both on.
24:38 So I want to get started in this conversation with opening up about the question of homelessness,
24:44 which I think is really interesting.
24:46 Today we're going to talk all about the ways that housing exists in China and the way that
24:50 housing exists in the US.
24:52 And I think as the US is in the midst of a housing crisis, there is a lot for us to dive
24:57 into.
24:58 So I'd love to hear from your perspective, what is the systemic issue of homelessness
25:03 in the US?
25:04 What causes homelessness?
25:06 And generally, what are people in the United States feeling about the impending housing
25:11 crisis that continues to loom?
25:13 Yeah, I mean, it's a big question.
25:16 You know, in the United States, there's about 582,000 people that are experiencing homelessness
25:22 right now.
25:23 That number is probably low of that 586,000 people, about 60% of them reside in temporary
25:31 homeless shelters and the rest sleep in the streets.
25:34 The reason why I say that number is low is because the way in which homeless people are,
25:41 you know, calculated, the way in which we try to account for them is municipalities.
25:46 So cities across the country have these things called a point in time count, where they literally
25:50 have volunteers go out and count people on the streets.
25:54 So they never count, you know, all the people that are on the streets.
25:58 And furthermore, aside from people who are actually experiencing homelessness in the
26:02 United States, especially in our coastal cities, there is a lot of housing instability.
26:09 So you have people who may not be technically homeless, may not be in shelters or on the
26:15 streets, but they're couch surfing, they're going from place to place just trying to,
26:21 you know, stay off the streets.
26:23 So the problem in the United States is really staggering.
26:26 I mean, in the last few years alone in the United States, the situation has been deteriorating.
26:31 I mean, I can just tell you on a personal level, you know, I work in Midtown, I work
26:36 in Manhattan, and the homelessness issue has certainly gotten significantly worse.
26:41 People are struggling.
26:43 People are just on the streets with nowhere to go.
26:46 And the city has done very little to do anything about it other than put more money into police.
26:51 And really, that has not done anything other than given the police more money to harass
26:55 people.
26:56 It hasn't helped people.
26:57 It hasn't translated into people getting housing or homes or anything like that.
27:01 Really, what can you do in a short period of time is really go to a shelter.
27:05 That's all you have.
27:06 And what happens if you don't get into the shelters?
27:08 I know in Alaska, actually, the shelters recently were moved outside.
27:13 They got rid of the last shelter in Anchorage, which is horrific to think about, because
27:18 they moved everybody to a campground and they were actually being attacked by bears.
27:22 There is, as you said, an affordable housing crisis.
27:25 As to the causes of that crisis, I would say, you know, post 2008, which was the financial
27:34 crisis caused by the collapse of the mortgage industry, housing has increasingly become
27:40 financialized in the United States, which is ironic, because what caused that 2008 financial
27:46 meltdown was the financialization of the mortgage market.
27:51 So instead of learning from that catastrophe, which resulted in one of the greatest transfers
27:57 of wealth from the 1 percent to the 99 percent, instead of learning from that, we in the United
28:04 States have doubled down on a hyper commodified, profit driven housing system.
28:11 And just to give you, and you know, this isn't just the United States, this is globally,
28:15 especially all across Western Europe.
28:18 To give you a little context, the global value of real estate was $326.5 trillion.
28:24 I believe that was in 2021, which is four times global domestic product.
28:31 So you have all this capital flooding into global real estate markets in the United States,
28:38 flooding into these coastal real estate markets.
28:41 And it's driving rents through the roof.
28:44 Recently rents in the United States, the average rent surpassed $2,000 a month for a two bedroom
28:50 apartment.
28:51 So you just have, I think, a hyper commodified housing market, which drives rents crazy because
28:58 the people who are investing in this housing are institutional Wall Street investors.
29:03 And what the reason why they're investing in real estate is to maximize profit.
29:07 So what gets built in the United States is things that are extremely expensive and is
29:14 not rationally related to what is needed from workers on the ground.
29:19 So you have luxury apartments being built in a place like Washington, D.C., which is
29:24 going through a huge affordable housing crisis.
29:27 We're publicly subsidizing the building of these luxury apartments and we're not building
29:32 housing that people really need.
29:34 We're actually tearing down the affordable housing and privatizing our public housing
29:39 stock to cater to these global investors who want to invest in very expensive housing.
29:45 Certainly will.
29:46 And I want to add to this about the U.S., which I think is an important point, too,
29:49 which is that a lot of these landlords who own luxury housing, they warehouse it.
29:54 I mean, not just luxury housing, public housing, affordable housing, rent stabilized complexes
29:59 here in New York are warehoused by landlords, meaning that 88,000 different units here in
30:05 New York literally that are rent stabilized and affordable are taken off the market on
30:11 purpose so that way landlords can make more profit.
30:13 And that's, I think, a microcosm a little bit of the system that we have.
30:17 Even if there is something affordable, it's really not in people's hands whatsoever.
30:22 So a lot of people definitely fear deeply homelessness as the crisis deepens, which
30:27 is certainly an issue here.
30:29 But Xiaofeng, I wanted to ask you about homelessness in China.
30:32 I'm really curious to know, is homelessness an everyday experience for people in China?
30:38 Do you see a lot of homeless people in China?
30:41 And what is the government doing to alleviate homelessness or help with the issue?
30:48 To be honest, I was shocked the first time I saw so many homeless people in the U.S.
30:53 online.
30:54 I mean, in today's China, it's not usual to see homeless individuals, but it doesn't
31:00 mean that they don't exist.
31:02 Based on my personal observation, the number of homeless individuals in Chinese cities
31:08 is relatively low.
31:10 In current China, homeless people refer to those who don't have a fixed abode, who
31:16 cannot rely on their relatives or friends in the big cities, and difficult to ensure
31:22 their basic food supply and accommodation.
31:26 It's not like the peasants who lost their lands in ancient agricultural societies.
31:31 They have different problems.
31:34 The homeless issue in China was largely attributed to the urbanization since the 21st century,
31:42 and these people could be divided into different categories.
31:47 Some have mental illness or physical disabilities, usually caused by tragic accidents and it
31:54 changed the life of the whole family.
31:56 Apart from this, the homeless population is mainly made by another group, which is migrant
32:03 workers who left their homes to earn money in the cities.
32:08 When I say migrant workers, I mean domestic immigrants.
32:13 It means people from less developed regions moving to more advanced places.
32:19 Yeah, it's very interesting.
32:21 I mean, one of the things that I'm curious about in China, to go a little deeper into
32:26 Xiaofeng, is this idea of migrants coming from the countryside into the city.
32:31 Because that's a thing that happens in the US, I know it doesn't happen to the extent
32:35 that it happens in China.
32:37 So I'd love for you to share more about this, because I know people in China back home in
32:43 the small countryside often own land or have family land.
32:47 So I'd love for you to elaborate on this.
32:49 Yes, yes.
32:50 China has been an agricultural society for thousands of years.
32:54 After the reform and opening up since the late 1970s, there are still much more farmers
33:00 in the population.
33:01 The income from agricultural activities is often very limited.
33:06 While in their hometown, the secondary and tertiary industries do not have many job positions.
33:14 So they choose to make money in the city.
33:17 When it comes to the homeless issue, we have to talk about domestic immigration.
33:22 Because the main part of the homeless population in China is urban workers or domestic immigrants.
33:30 This is a historical problem originated from the reform and opening up policy.
33:38 At that time, with the rapid industrialization and urbanization, a lot of rural labor migrated
33:47 to big cities for more job opportunities, better education for their children.
33:52 They don't expect to meet unemployment issues in big cities.
33:57 So when they fail to find a job or suddenly lose their jobs, they could go back to their
34:03 hometowns anytime.
34:05 So housing and renting became a huge burden at that time.
34:11 But in the following two to three decades, we went through a housing reform.
34:17 It has increased the supply of commercial housing.
34:21 Before this reform, housing was allocated by the government.
34:25 However, housing supply is still limited because of the limited resources.
34:31 So with the increase of the number of houses, a significant number of people with stable
34:37 incomes bought homes in the cities, and it is much less likely to be homeless.
34:44 On the other hand, those who couldn't afford to buy a home, as long as they have a job,
34:50 they can afford to rent at least.
34:53 I'm not saying that we don't have unemployment here in China, but it's not that difficult
35:00 to find a job that can cover your daily costs, including the rent.
35:05 For those migrant workers who are experiencing unemployment, we have this urban shelter system
35:12 to provide temporary shelter and support.
35:17 Or they can choose to go back to their hometowns.
35:21 The train tickets are covered by the shelter.
35:24 According to the recent data, the number of people assisted was over 3.48 million in 2013,
35:35 but by 2021, it had reduced significantly to 830,000, which is a huge progress.
35:46 Most of them have their own self-built house back in their hometowns, so they have a place
35:53 to go if they fail to earn a living in big cities.
35:57 There is a historical reason behind as well.
36:01 During the land reform and the establishment of the hukou system, we basically ensured
36:09 that rural families could get a small piece of land on which they could build their own
36:16 house.
36:17 The rapid economic development also contributed a lot to solving this problem.
36:23 It released a large number of jobs opportunities.
36:27 Almost everyone benefited from this process.
36:31 So I was wondering what are the main factors leading to homelessness in the US?
36:36 What is the role of your government played in this?
36:40 Will, feel free to jump in and answer that.
36:42 Yeah, I mean, it's a great question.
36:45 So there's this perception in the United States itself, and also I think globally, I want
36:51 to really pound home the idea that the cause of homelessness in the United States is not
36:59 primarily due to mental health issues or drug addiction.
37:03 It really is a cost issue.
37:05 So just really quickly, in Washington, DC, the average rent for a two-bedroom apartment
37:10 is about $3,200 per month, which works out to about $39,000 per year.
37:17 The minimum wage in Washington, DC is about $33,000 per year.
37:23 So right away, there's a $5,000 gap between what a person working a minimum wage job in
37:29 Washington, DC earns and what they have to pay in rent.
37:33 That is before they pay for transportation costs, before they bought food, before they
37:37 bought their kids clothes, cared for their children.
37:42 And in the context of this affordable housing crisis in Washington, DC, we are tearing down
37:48 the public housing and we're giving away massive amounts of public land and public money to
37:54 politically connected developers to build luxury apartments that people can't afford.
38:00 So just really quick, between 2002 and 2013 in Washington, DC, we gave away $1.7 billion
38:10 worth of public subsidies to private developers.
38:14 And in that timeframe, and we gave these public subsidies to private developers because what
38:20 did they do?
38:21 They promised that they were going to build housing that people could afford and that
38:25 they were going to create jobs.
38:27 So what we saw during that timeframe was that half of the affordable units in Washington,
38:35 DC were lost.
38:37 And while half of the affordable housing units in Washington, DC during 2002 and 2013 were
38:43 lost, high end units tripled.
38:46 So what these developers were doing was they were taking public subsidies, they were tearing
38:50 down affordable housing, and they were replacing that affordable housing with more expensive
38:56 housing so that they could maximize their profits.
39:00 And that is what is really driving the affordable housing crisis, not only in Washington, DC,
39:07 but in municipalities and cities all across the country.
39:10 Will, I really appreciate that.
39:11 I think that's an important point.
39:13 But I'd love for you to talk a little bit more, Will, about the situation for home ownership.
39:19 Because I think one of the things that's really important about the market right now in the
39:23 US is that especially young people really look at the future and say, I don't think
39:27 I could ever own a home, which was always sold as a big part of the American dream.
39:32 You can own your own home, you can have your own backyard, white picket fence.
39:36 And that's really not the situation now, especially for young people and millennials who are now
39:41 pushing 40 who will not be able to own their own homes.
39:45 So I'd love for you to speak on this experience and this situation and the outlook for what
39:51 a lot of people feel for the future.
39:53 Yeah, sure.
39:54 I mean, home ownership is, like you said, Rachel, it's out of reach for a lot of young
39:59 people in the United States.
40:01 In the United States, you know, debt, our economy is built a lot on debt.
40:06 So a lot of students are graduating college in obscene amounts of debt.
40:12 If you go want to get a degree beyond a four-year university degree, then you get into more
40:18 debt.
40:19 And that's a trap because we're told that you have to continue your schooling in order
40:23 to get a job, that you can earn enough money to buy a house.
40:27 However, the longer you stay in school, the more debt you accumulate.
40:31 On top of that, as we've been talking about, the commodification of the housing market
40:36 has driven not only rental costs, but housing costs, home purchase costs through the roof.
40:43 In Washington, D.C., the nation's capital, the median home value just surpassed $1 million.
40:53 So think about, and I will say that the median income in the United States, I believe, is
40:59 about $44,000.
41:01 So just think about that.
41:04 There is very little space for people to be able to afford homes in this market.
41:13 And what does that do?
41:15 It drives more people into the rental market.
41:18 And what does that do?
41:19 It drives up housing costs.
41:22 So you can see that the system in the United States is, it feeds into itself.
41:29 And the people that are benefiting from all these different things that we're talking
41:33 about is Wall Street, is the big banks, because they own these assets and they are, you know,
41:40 they're getting rent from us and we're not able to purchase, we're not able to own.
41:45 That's the situation in the United States.
41:47 And I think that it's important to complicate that question of homelessness.
41:51 So Xiaofeng, I'd love to hear your thoughts on some of this and learning more about the
41:54 housing crisis in the U.S.
41:57 I have an impression that the big companies, big capitalists are highly controlled by the
42:04 U.S. government.
42:05 For example, you have a very strict anti-monopoly laws.
42:11 But what you just said made me feel that Wall Street could basically do whatever they want.
42:18 It seems that they could push up the house price unlimitedly.
42:23 In China, when talking about the housing problem, usually it refers to purchasing an apartment
42:31 rather than renting one.
42:34 Because here in China, as long as you have a job, no matter how much you earn, at least
42:40 you could find a shelter.
42:42 That's the main difference between the U.S. and China.
42:46 For Chinese people, the pressure is mainly from actually buying a house for ourselves.
42:52 Although we don't have that much homeless population, we are still on the way to solve
42:58 the housing problem.
43:00 Although the housing reform has largely increased the supply of commodity housing, it also caused
43:07 some housing problems.
43:09 For example, the pricing of housing was pushed up and up and up.
43:14 Under the Chinese culture, newly married couples must own an apartment.
43:20 So you could imagine how much pressure is on young people nowadays.
43:25 In order to purchase a home for the new couple, at least 6 pockets would be empty in Chinese
43:32 family, including the pocket of the bride, the groom and both of their big families.
43:39 When it comes to housing price control, it's a bit complicated here in China.
43:46 The central government always pursues to control the housing price under an adequate level.
43:53 But for local governments, as land transaction is their major income source, they have great
44:02 interest in the housing industry.
44:04 However, if they keep doing this kind of transaction, they will make the housing price up and up
44:12 and up.
44:13 So basically, there is a contradiction between the central and local governments.
44:20 As a result, in order to mitigate this issue, the central government is taking various different
44:28 measures to control the housing price, including providing low rent apartments and so on.
44:37 You know, one of the things I'm thinking as we're having this conversation is just about
44:40 where we see this crisis going.
44:42 Yeah, it is a dire situation right now.
44:46 It seems as though the only solution that elected officials have in the United States
44:52 is to throw more public money and more public land into the private market to private developers.
44:59 And the idea is that they'll build, build, build.
45:02 And at some point there will be a trickle down effect and rents will come down.
45:06 But what we've seen in reality is the opposite of that.
45:09 The more public resources that we shovel into the private market, the more rents go up.
45:16 There are a lot of sophisticated reasons for that.
45:20 But I think that, you know, you had talked about earlier, landlords or developers are
45:26 building apartments and strategically keeping units offline to keep rents high.
45:32 There was a really interesting ProPublica study that just came out about a month ago
45:37 that talked about a specific algorithm that especially Wall Street owned housing projects
45:44 are using that tells them when to keep housing off the market.
45:50 So we're giving our public money to the private sector and we're saying, build housing so
45:54 rents come down.
45:55 And they're building housing to increase their profits and they're actually raising rents.
46:01 There's been a huge housing boom in Washington, D.C. and over the last 10 years, rents have
46:08 risen by 55 percent.
46:11 So what we can plainly see is that what we're doing is not working.
46:16 However, there are movements across the country.
46:21 People are fighting back.
46:22 Tenants are organizing.
46:23 And one of the most hopeful things that I think is happening in the U.S. is this growing
46:30 idea of this concept of social housing in the United States.
46:34 And social housing is the way I think about it.
46:38 There's actually a bill in Washington, D.C. right now that calls for the building of municipally
46:46 owned mixed income housing that is self-sustaining and pays for itself.
46:51 And the way it works is that government looks at housing as infrastructure, it builds housing
46:57 unlike traditional public housing where it was only very impoverished people that were
47:02 able to live in it.
47:03 This sort of public type of public housing has a mix of incomes.
47:08 And because there's a mix of incomes in the housing, the rents paid are able to cover
47:14 the operating costs of the apartment complex.
47:19 And the surplus rent at the end of the month, the rent that's left over after all the tenants
47:22 have paid their rent and the place is upkept, that surplus rent is actually used to pay
47:28 down the construction costs of the housing.
47:31 So this model is a de-commodified, outside the private market, a public form of housing
47:38 that allows housing to be accessed by a broad spectrum of people and I think would provide,
47:45 in essence, a public option for people.
47:47 So if they don't want to be exploited by the private market, they could rent, they could
47:51 choose a public option and pay much less rent.
47:56 That model is based on the model in Vienna, Austria, where that's a municipality of about
48:01 1.9 million people.
48:03 They have 420,000 units of social housing.
48:08 Half of their housing stock is made up of social housing and about 80% of their population
48:14 qualify to live in that social housing.
48:18 So they've removed the stigma of public housing.
48:21 They've made this public housing extraordinarily popular among their residents so the government
48:27 can't cut funding for it and they've created a public option to drive down costs.
48:32 And I think that in order to solve the affordable housing crisis, we're going to have to look
48:37 to de-commodified forms of housing.
48:40 Like I said, there's a public housing bill that is proposed in Washington, D.C.
48:43 There's one that's been proposed in California.
48:46 There's a social housing bill that's been proposed in Maryland.
48:50 I know there's a growing social housing movement in New York.
48:52 So I think that there are hopeful things into the future, but I think what's important about
49:00 the United States is to understand that these things are going to have to happen at a municipal
49:06 level in cities across the country because what we see from our federal government is
49:11 that they're not ready for the moment.
49:13 They're not prepared to take on Wall Street and banks.
49:17 And in order to grow these alternative housing models, I think we're going to have to do
49:21 so through local organizing in cities and municipalities across the United States.
49:26 But it's happening.
49:27 Certainly, Will.
49:29 I really appreciate your insights.
49:31 And I think just what I want to end this conversation on is just drawing off of what Xiaopeng was
49:36 sharing about the Chinese model.
49:39 I think it's just important for people in the United States especially to look around
49:43 and see that there are other options.
49:45 I mean, it's really exciting to think about drawing on these different models that incorporate,
49:50 especially for where we are now in the U.S., options for public housing, social housing,
49:55 and really building into the idea, into the consciousness that we have the right to a
49:59 home.
50:00 Can I just make one last point?
50:01 Yes.
50:02 I think especially for the audience in the United States, I want to drive home the idea
50:09 that Wall Street and hedge funds are not going to save us.
50:13 They are not going to solve our affordable housing crisis because their model is to extract
50:20 wealth from the working class and give that wealth to the 1%.
50:26 What we need is public investment, public investment from our government, our government
50:32 using our tax dollars, using our public land to invest in public institutions that build
50:40 strong communities because the increased financialization, it is fully dependent on Wall Street and hedge
50:49 funds and we will only dig ourselves into a deeper hole if we continue to rely on that
50:54 model.
50:55 Awesome.
50:56 Thank you so much.
50:57 And this was another episode of China Now, a show that opens a window to the present
51:01 and the future of the action giant.
51:03 Hope you enjoyed it.
51:04 See you next time.
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