At a House Judiciary Committee hearing prior to the Congressional recess, Rep. Andy Biggs (R-AZ) spoke to witnesses about alleged threats to U.S. citizens' privacy.
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00:00I want to see PCLOP back up and running, but I'll ask you, Mr. Hamidachi, is this the first time that we've been without a quorum on PCLOP?
00:09It is not.
00:10Yeah, it's not.
00:13We need to get it up and running as quickly as possible, but this isn't necessarily unique.
00:19It needs to get fixed, though.
00:21I wanted to ask you a question because you responded, and I'm going to tell you how I interpreted your answer.
00:27Why the firing took place, and you said it was reported that Laura Loomer recommended that.
00:38I interpret that as meaning that you're like me.
00:40I don't know why he was fired.
00:42Yeah, I only know the reports that I read, and I will say that there's a difference, I think, also between a job like the NSA where the president has the authority to fire someone,
00:51where with PCLOP, that's an independent oversight board, and the president should not be able to fire those board members.
00:56But he currently has the authority now, but maybe some reform there is what you're suggesting.
01:02So we would argue that he did not have the authority to fire the PCLOP members.
01:06Okay, all right. Fair enough.
01:07So I'm going to go on here.
01:09Mr. Scherr, you indicated that there was some reported abuse even perhaps post-RISA.
01:18Can you give us an idea?
01:19Yes, and that's from an ODNI report from after RISA was passed that described a number of additional abuses,
01:32including congressional staffers and a number of federal employees and even the spouse of somebody who had requested a security clearance.
01:43It's remarkable because RISA was supposed to take care of probably that very kind of thing and failed to do so,
01:52which is indicative that we need to do more.
01:54Mr. Kiko, so I would venture to say, and the chair is gone, but the ranker is still here,
02:04RISA allowed for the chair and the ranker to attend FISC hearings.
02:07My guess is that they haven't been able to – actually, we've got a busy schedule, so probably did not get to do that.
02:16We actually were trying to get that expanded, those of you who are participating with us,
02:21so there would be more members of Congress who could actually get there.
02:24Do you know if the chairman or the ranker have been able to actually attend a FISC hearing?
02:30No, I do not.
02:31And you've indicated there should be some more oversight.
02:35How do we get more vigorous oversight in a shortened answer?
02:41How would you say we do that?
02:43I would just –
02:44You need to do a microphone, please.
02:45Yeah, I see that.
02:46I would just have meetings all the time.
02:52I would have somebody, whoever is your oversight person, call these people up and say, where are you on this?
03:00Give a report because there's 15 or 20 requirements that are new requirements in RISA,
03:07and you should hold their feet to the fire and get in coordination with the inspector generals
03:13and have a whole bunch of stuff done that way.
03:16But I did mention in my testimony, though, there was a requirement that for one of the intelligence agencies to use,
03:26I think it was the FBI, AI, to make sure that there's compliance.
03:31And I don't know why this body, your committee, shouldn't be able to real-time make sure that there is compliance
03:40and what does that compliance look like.
03:42And just make sure that they are complying with everything because you're going to be reauthorizing the bill, you know, in a year.
03:50I agree with you.
03:51We need to be more vigorous in our oversight, definitely and for sure.
03:55Mr. Chernowski, the warrant requirement, and Mr. Knott alluded to this,
04:06a lot of people think that's just too onerous to get.
04:10But with a recent court ruling, but beyond that, if there are exigencies in there,
04:17do we miss any exigencies, any exceptions when we put together the amendment to the proposed bill last year?
04:26Thank you for the question, Mr. Chair.
04:28And I believe that the exceptions to the warrant amendments that you put together during the last Congress
04:34were quite robust in terms of providing the needed flexibility for the agencies to conduct their surveillance
04:41without necessarily needing to worry about that.
04:44So I think that you did a very good job with that, sir.
04:47I would say that I'm where Chairman Jordan is.
04:50I thought we actually opened the door up too wide,
04:53broader than you would have in a normal Fourth Amendment exigency circumstance.
04:58But needless to say, we're going to work on this.
05:02I appreciate all of you being here today.
05:04I appreciate your testimony.
05:06And I think more reforms ahead, to be frank with you.
05:10And so with that, thank you all, and we're adjourned.