In the next episode of Monthly Meets, Dan Parker sits down with English journeyman tour pro Robert Rock who is arguably known for having one of the best golf swings on tour as well as overcoming Tiger Woods in his prime to win the 2012 HSBC Abu Dhabi Golf Championship. He talks about qualifying for the US Open at Pinehurst No.2, his golf swing philosophy, how he plans to spend his retirement from playing professionally and, of course, that famous week in the desert.
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00:00I thought I was good, got my first handicap at 27, so I wasn't, because golf is difficult
00:05and changing your swing is even harder.
00:07Actually, I'm hitting it better than this guy.
00:09Then I panicked, because I knew what I'd signed myself up for.
00:12Thomas Bjorn sent me a message saying, don't make a fool of yourself.
00:15And I wanted, hopefully, at the end of it, for him to maybe go, oh, he's all right, player.
00:25Right, Robert, thanks for joining us on Monthly Meats.
00:29Appreciate it.
00:30You've been back in the news this year with your US Open qualification.
00:34You've had a couple of months to reflect on that now, that period.
00:39What are your reflections on it, and that couple of weeks of golf?
00:44It was a brilliant experience.
00:45It was something I obviously hadn't planned on doing at all this year.
00:51I retired in 22, and I would have liked to have retired, but still play the odd event.
00:59But that wasn't possible, so I played a qualifier, and I got in, which I didn't think I'd get
01:07in that at all.
01:08But the point of the qualifier was just getting me to play amongst a great field, which is,
01:12it's always a great field at Walton Heath and at the Open qualifiers.
01:15It was a chance to see where my game was at after a couple of years out.
01:19Played with a good pal, James Morrison, and we just had, we had a good day.
01:23Yeah.
01:24We both played well.
01:25I played better than I thought I was going to.
01:26Well, I actually putted better than I thought I was going to.
01:28I was hitting the ball pretty similar to how I do if I put a little bit of practice in.
01:35And then that took me to Pioneerst, which of all US Open venues now, that's...
01:40Was that right up there for you?
01:41It's the best tournament I've ever been to.
01:44Really?
01:45Yeah, I was really surprised.
01:46I'd not been a massive fan of American golf events up to that point.
01:50Played two US Opens before that, and they were just hard.
01:55But Pioneerst was different.
01:57Pioneerst is, I can see how vast that area is and how many golf courses, how many great
02:03golf courses there are, and how it's just a golfing area, right?
02:07With great weather.
02:08So it's difficult to not like it.
02:10And it was a really, really tough test, which I wish I'd been able to try when I was playing
02:15my best.
02:16I mean, I played, I played really well the first day, but I wasn't tournament practised
02:20for...
02:21Playing 72 holes is hard, right?
02:24And I sort of forgot a little bit of how demanding a full week's major tournament is.
02:30And I was exhausted.
02:32So after the first round, I just had very little left in the tank for the second day.
02:36Second day was even hotter.
02:37Course was a little bit firmer, but the golf I played between the two days was so similar.
02:45One was level par, which felt like six or seven under par, and then the second day ended
02:49up being nine over, which felt like only two or three shots worse, right?
02:54So obviously, a lot worse, but still a great experience to have played another major.
03:00Yeah.
03:01And obviously that wasn't part of the plan initially.
03:02It was sound like the qualification was just a...
03:04I don't recommend trying a major after two years out.
03:08It's not the smartest thing in the world to do.
03:09That's why I'm always so surprised, right?
03:10Because you did the qualification sort of on a whim, I guess, a little bit, had a little
03:14knock.
03:15Yeah, absolutely.
03:16And you happened to fall into it.
03:17Yeah.
03:18Then I panicked.
03:19Then you...
03:20Because I knew what I was...
03:21I knew what I'd signed myself up for, right?
03:22Because if you're two years out playing against the best players on a really hard course,
03:29you can make yourself look a bit daft.
03:32And Thomas Bjorn sent me a message saying, don't make a fool of yourself.
03:36That's what you want to hear, isn't it?
03:37That was Thomas saying, well done, I think, in a way, but...
03:40And then I thought, yeah, he's right.
03:43So I panicked practice for three weeks and managed to get one decent round in, so I was
03:46quite happy with that.
03:47Well, it was brilliant, and it was great to watch.
03:49So it's coming from the back of that retirement you spoke about.
03:53I've seen a lot of great athletes and other people retire from sport recently, Andy Murray
03:57fairly recently.
03:59And I just want to sort of get into your mind about the retirement process, like where did
04:02the decision come from, how quickly, how long did it take you to decide that, and why?
04:07And what's the transition like from professional sport to not doing that?
04:11That's a good question.
04:14It was more timing in life rather than me saying that my golf game wasn't up to it anymore.
04:20It was based around my son.
04:24He's now 16, but he was 14 when I chose to stop completely, but in the previous years,
04:32I was slowing down, trying to play every other week so that I could be at home and take him
04:36to his football, because he's a really keen footballer.
04:39And we've been going to Chesterfield now, which is part of their academy.
04:43We've been going there for four years.
04:46So it was trying to slow down enough that I could do that, but then the football training
04:53gets more and more intense and I needed to be there all the time.
04:58So I decided to put, I thought when he got to the sort of 15 age group, that'd be when
05:03he gets a bit more serious and can't afford to miss anything.
05:07So I thought that's a good time to stop.
05:11And the COVID time gave me a little bit of a break that I needed, because I did nearly
05:1520 years straight.
05:16So that gave everyone a little bit of time at home, didn't we, thinking about stuff.
05:21And it also gave me a rest because I'd actually really hurt my thumb, my left thumb, and I
05:28was battling through that.
05:29And then that period allowed it to heal.
05:32So I started that back up quite fresh.
05:36And then I think we overplayed during COVID.
05:38We played nearly every week, didn't we?
05:40And that sort of made me want to tone it down a bit.
05:44So yeah, I decided 22 was time to stop.
05:47I'm sure during that COVID period, golf wasn't that much fun.
05:50It was the perks weren't there that you were having when you're normally on tour and there's
05:54crowds and there's everything that comes with an event, right?
05:56All the cool bits disappeared.
05:57Yeah.
05:58So it was sort of like, maybe we'll take a rest there then.
06:01And how are you finding it then?
06:02How have you found that transition into not playing professionally?
06:05Difficult.
06:06Difficult.
06:07Every time I see people now that are retiring from sport early, I fully understand what
06:13they're probably going to go through in the next year or two.
06:16My first year, I panicked and sort of threw myself into almost everything to try and fill
06:22the time and feel like I was busy, which I shouldn't have done.
06:28And now I think I've found a little bit better balance in what I'm doing.
06:34It's what gets you out of bed every morning.
06:37And I'm not very good at sitting around doing nothing.
06:42And I really enjoyed hitting balls, I really enjoyed practicing and I'm glad I finished
06:47without actually really disliking golf.
06:52Yeah, you've not fell out of love with the sport at all.
06:54No, so I'm really, really grateful that I actually managed to call time on it a little
07:00bit early, keep some of the interest there.
07:02And now I still hit balls when I can and try and play the odd little one or two day event.
07:11But yeah, I still like playing.
07:12Yeah, well, that's good.
07:13And we'll come on to sort of what you're doing now and the future for you in a little bit.
07:16But I want to take you right back, right, right back.
07:19When did you first pick up a golf club and why?
07:21And at what point in your youth did you realize that golfing some guys was going to be your
07:26career?
07:28I think I just picked up some old clubs that I found in our shed at home.
07:33They were, I didn't even know what they were actually.
07:36I think one was probably a putter.
07:38It didn't look like much of a putter, but it was a putter.
07:40And I think the other one might have been a nine or a six iron.
07:43And I don't, I think I can remember not knowing which way around the number was supposed to
07:46be.
07:47Right.
07:48That's about right.
07:49So start with those.
07:51And then there was a few people in my area played.
07:55It wasn't my family's game.
07:57They didn't play.
07:58But I had some friends that played.
08:00We had a local course at the town, played a bit.
08:04That was just a nine hole par three course.
08:07Actually, no, sorry.
08:08It was a nine hole, but it was a short course.
08:10Had threes and fours.
08:11Yeah.
08:12Played that for a year or more.
08:14Joined a club at 13.
08:17Thought I was good.
08:18Got my first handicap at 27, so I wasn't.
08:21That comes down quickly though, you know.
08:23Yeah.
08:24And then a few years later, I was down to sort of five handicap and got on well with
08:29the assistant pros.
08:31And they told me what the PGA training was all about and what standard you needed to
08:36be to start that.
08:37Yes.
08:38And then that's when it became clear, well, this is something I can actually do.
08:41Might not mean that I make money out of actually playing golf and winning competition money,
08:46but I could be a club pro.
08:47I could be a teaching pro.
08:50So then that route was pretty obvious.
08:52Yeah.
08:53And that was something that appealed to you then, you know, forgetting obviously the tour
08:56stuff that came later that probably wasn't part of the plan initially.
08:59Teaching and coaching the game, something that appealed to you pretty quickly.
09:02I hadn't had a coach up to that point, give or take a few little maybe county lessons
09:09or the assistant pros helping me out.
09:11But physically didn't have a permanent coach because that just wasn't an option.
09:17So I studied a lot of the game.
09:19I read as much as I could at that point.
09:22And I would always try and probably annoyingly so pass that little bits that I thought I'd
09:27figured out onto my mates who were playing with.
09:30That was the start of your teaching.
09:32I was that fella, yeah, that was doing that.
09:35But that made me think, well, I quite like figuring stuff out and trying to see if it
09:41works for other people because that's different.
09:43If something works for me, it doesn't necessarily work for you.
09:45And trying to find the link of all those things was quite interesting.
09:49So I knew I could be a coach or I could try to be a coach, put it that way.
09:54And I knew I could be a club pro.
09:55Yeah.
09:56So, you know, you're one of the few sort of people who went through that route and then
09:59made it onto the tour.
10:00Why do you think so few sort of actually have that breakthrough?
10:04And what would you, what kind of advice would you give to people doing that course right
10:08now or yourself back in the day to help that push through that extra little bit?
10:14I was always desperately, desperately searching ways to make my golf better.
10:20I think I had written off a playing career because I wasn't as good as some of the key
10:24players at my age group.
10:26So, but I was interested enough to just keep studying and practicing.
10:32Yeah.
10:33And when you're working in golf, initially you don't get time.
10:37So you're in the shop or you're teaching and you don't have time to practice.
10:40So my game took a little bit of a backseat for a while, even though I was still always
10:45reading and trying to find out more info.
10:49I didn't have time to play or practice.
10:51And then when I became qualified and I became self-employed, then the whole world's your
10:57own, isn't it?
10:58It's how much you put into it.
11:00And I was able to coach at certain times in the day and then practice the rest of the
11:08day.
11:09And I practiced from that point onwards.
11:10I was probably, what had I been?
11:14I think I was around 19, 20.
11:18I practiced every hour I could find.
11:21Yeah.
11:22It's constant.
11:23I hit millions of balls.
11:24Millions of balls.
11:25Yeah.
11:26And I just got, I just kept getting better and better and kept winning different things
11:29in the assistant pros game or in the Midlands pros, which we're at now.
11:36And then there was some good players in the Midlands that were ex-tour players.
11:40And I just started to gauge my game off those.
11:43And then I got my chance to play in tour events and it went well.
11:47Now, that was the key part is those went well.
11:50Yeah.
11:51It's not your ideal route to the tour, right?
11:53And it's not one I don't think, if you're serious about playing the tour, you should
11:57really chase because it's too difficult.
12:00But I hadn't got real dreams of playing the tour at that point.
12:04I just played well, qualified for these events.
12:07And then I played well in these events because I was really prepared for them.
12:11And things went my way.
12:13But having a serious mind on tournaments, you've got to go through mini tours, tour
12:19school, challenge tour, DP World Tour, play your way through.
12:24Right.
12:25So just touching on that then and your sort of the way you learned the game and were taught
12:29the game.
12:30I saw you saying in another interview that you used to collect golf magazines and read
12:33them religiously.
12:34Golf magazine included.
12:35Yes.
12:36So thank you for reading that back in the day.
12:37You're welcome.
12:38I bought a lot of those.
12:39I'm sure you still do now.
12:40I had a mountain of them.
12:41And so, you know, would you call yourself a real student of the game?
12:45Did you always have that sort of thirst for knowledge on the swing of how the game works,
12:50the intricacies of it all?
12:51Was that always a little bug in your mind?
12:53Yeah.
12:54Yeah, it was.
12:55I think I was fascinated by the swing and golf magazines were really the only access
13:04point at that time.
13:05So you do your little pieces where you were chatting to people about their swings or you
13:09do the swing sequences in the magazines, which the ones that I liked, I sort of saved
13:14in particular magazines.
13:17And I built a whole little, my own sort of volumes of magazines that were the bits that
13:25I liked, whether it had been Faldo, Seve, Woosnam, David Ledbetter.
13:31What else would there have been?
13:35Like Greg Norman.
13:36Just all your features on the players that I liked how they played.
13:42And then you try and find some common ground, which is a lot easier these days.
13:47But doing it from magazine pictures was hard.
13:50But I loved it.
13:52That's it, isn't it?
13:53That's why I always thought you were a bit of a student of it.
13:54You clearly enjoyed that.
13:56Obviously, nowadays, we've got YouTube, the internet, thousands of sources for golf swings.
14:02It's too easy now.
14:03Yeah, right?
14:04Too easy.
14:05Would you have used YouTube?
14:06I've got two questions here.
14:07Would you have used YouTube back in the day?
14:08Absolutely.
14:09It would have saved me years.
14:10It saves you years of sort of archiving stuff.
14:13But do you think it's a good, useful resource, as good as it was back in the day, if not
14:17better?
14:18It's better because everything's on there.
14:20It's on your phone.
14:22You can go through it slowly and you can see the missing gaps that in your original swing
14:30sequences, there'd be big chunks missing.
14:33From the swing sequences in the magazines?
14:34Yeah, because the cameras wouldn't pick them out or you wouldn't be able to publish a,
14:38I don't know, like a 30-frame sequence, would you?
14:41Take up too many pages.
14:42Just a normal swing, yeah.
14:43Exactly.
14:44But the YouTube and the slow-mo video that everyone's got on their phones now makes it
14:49so easy.
14:50And all the bits that I figured out for myself are now pretty much on YouTube or on your
14:58phones for free.
15:00You did the hard work.
15:01I feel like I did.
15:03I probably would have liked to have, no, I'm probably wrong to say I wouldn't have liked
15:07to have done that because that's what really got my interest every day.
15:10It's part of it and I think it's with anything, any hobby or interest you have, it's the searching.
15:13I wouldn't be in this point now if I hadn't have done that.
15:15Yeah.
15:16Put it that way.
15:17So where does your philosophy on the golf swing come from?
15:20Who are the sort of coaches and the sort of people and the swing thoughts that you latched
15:25onto early doors and kept throughout your career?
15:28It was probably a combination of all those people that I mentioned and more.
15:34Some random swings that I think, well, that's interesting.
15:37That looks good.
15:38Why does that look good to me?
15:41And I think simplicity is the best thing.
15:45Trying to remove, I wanted a, what I was searching for I think when I was younger was a standard
15:51golf swing.
15:52Right.
15:53And there wasn't one.
15:54A blueprint.
15:55Yeah.
15:56And everyone had their own little bits that they put in that make their swing look like
16:00them.
16:01And I wanted to compare mine to something and I didn't know what that was.
16:07And I felt like there was something or there ought to be something there.
16:11A bit more basic than, or a bit more human than just a golf robot.
16:17Right.
16:18I thought there must be someone somewhere that is close to what we might eventually
16:24say is the easiest way to swing the club.
16:27So that's all I was looking for and trying to strip out the little bits from each pro
16:33player that I think didn't, maybe didn't add too much, but that was just unique to them.
16:39And they just want to find a lot of common ground really.
16:41That's all I was trying to do.
16:43I mean, you're quite regarded as having one of the best swings in the game.
16:47Do you think that yourself?
16:48Are you always trying to work on bits?
16:50And where have you pieced your swing together from over the years?
16:52It's from that.
16:53Yeah.
16:54And if you'd say that you like my swing and my swing was just my swing and that was just
16:59how I hit balls and how I'd always hit balls, I'd take that as a compliment.
17:04But I wouldn't actually say that that was a particular great swing as such.
17:10But I feel like my swing I've put together purposely.
17:14So it has to be what I want.
17:16Right.
17:17It would make no sense, would it, to build something that I didn't like.
17:20Right.
17:21So I keep mine because I put each bit together and I know how long it's took me and how hard
17:25it's been.
17:27And it's not been easy and I don't find hardly any of it easy because golf is difficult and
17:33changing your swing is even harder.
17:35So it's a mixture of all great players, all bits that I think just make golf shots look
17:42simpler and it isn't perfect.
17:45And if I could keep hitting balls as much as I had done in the past, I think I'd probably
17:51add just a couple more bits to it.
17:53But I can't do my swing as fast as I used to.
17:55I would like to put my swing up now with the speed I might have had in my early 20s.
17:59Oh, interesting.
18:00And then I think that would be something that I'd really, really like and I would be more
18:05content with.
18:06But it's just took a long time and then your body starts to give way a little.
18:09Body says no.
18:10Not anymore, mate.
18:11Sorry.
18:12Body's certainly saying no at the moment.
18:13Yeah.
18:14Do you enjoy the teaching side of it?
18:17You know, is that, you know, the actual act of teaching yourself, taking golf out of it,
18:21passing on knowledge, helping others out?
18:23Is that something that you've always sort of enjoyed and sought to do or is it the golf
18:26that brings you there first?
18:27Yes, it's the golf.
18:28Yeah.
18:29It's the golf.
18:30I'd like to be able to help people that are as keen as I am or was at any stage.
18:40So whether they're just starting but I can tell they're really keen and they want to
18:46learn stuff fast or whether it's a pro that really is frustrated by something that they
18:51can't seem to change.
18:53Those are the bits that I find interesting.
18:56And hopefully some of the bits that I've got that I've learned and the movements that I've
19:02managed to practice and understand can just help somebody quickly, right?
19:07That's what I want.
19:08I don't want to give lessons and say I'll go away and practice for a month and it should
19:11work.
19:12I want to see some pretty instantaneous changes if I can get them right.
19:17Yeah.
19:18That's the test for me.
19:19Yeah.
19:20Can I get it right straight away and change this guy's swing so that he changes what he
19:25doesn't like and starts hitting better shots.
19:28Yeah.
19:29And that doesn't always mean lower scores, does it?
19:30But if I can change how somebody hits the ball straight away, then I feel like that
19:35they've probably gained something from coming to see me.
19:38And who in the modern game right now do you think has one of the best swings either aesthetically
19:43or just sort of mechanically?
19:44Everyone.
19:45Yeah?
19:46Yeah.
19:47Everyone's got a good swing.
19:48Everyone's at that level.
19:49So it doesn't matter to you.
19:50That's the beauty of how things have changed, right?
19:51Everyone's got the access to everything.
19:52And if you haven't got a good swing, you ain't got much hope I don't think these days, right?
19:56Because there's thousands of people that got great swings.
20:00All coaches are getting more towards a standardized ideal looking swing, I think.
20:11It's easy to find the errors or the faults and it's easier now to put them together.
20:20So very rarely see a pro with a bad looking swing these days, especially on the tours.
20:25Yeah.
20:26Yeah.
20:27And even people watching amateur golfers at home, if they're getting around and they're
20:30enjoying the game and they're scoring how they want to score, that's a good swing to
20:33you in a way, you know?
20:34Yeah.
20:35Yeah.
20:36Is that swing your swing kind of vibe?
20:37Yeah.
20:38If you're...
20:39That's something you subscribe to.
20:40Most people nowadays can hit drivers pretty well, right?
20:42Yeah.
20:43Our young juniors can all hit drivers well.
20:45Quite often now the starters that are kind enough to start all the kids off, so watched
20:49all day and didn't see any bad drives.
20:52And you don't, right?
20:53Because the drive is easy, right?
20:55This drive is easy.
20:56Everyone can whack a driver.
20:57Basically, yeah.
20:58Because you've only got to get it airborne, hit it somewhere on the face.
21:01It goes a reasonable way, doesn't it?
21:03So that part isn't really the skill anymore.
21:09But yeah.
21:10So before we start wrapping up and talk about the future and why we're here today, back
21:15to the sort of heyday of your career, I guess, that 2010 to 2012 period.
21:20Tied seven for the 2010 Open, won the Italian Open, beat Tiger at the HGTV Championship
21:25in 2012.
21:27What about your game in that couple of years was firing so well to allow you to be so successful?
21:33Was there something in particular?
21:34My iron play was really, really good.
21:37Yeah.
21:38That was the bit I tried to build.
21:40And from 2005 to 2008 was where I really sort of rejigged my swing a little bit.
21:47And that's where I hit the most balls.
21:50And that's the period in 2008 I started to feel like I'm hitting some really nice shots
21:55here.
21:56And I understand what I'm doing.
21:57And my iron play is getting really good.
21:59And my short game and putting wasn't really as good as it probably is now, actually.
22:03It's probably better now.
22:04But my iron play was good.
22:06I used to hit it close, like almost to inside three feet a couple of times around.
22:12Yeah.
22:13Whether that be with a medium to short iron.
22:16But I used to count on that.
22:17And that was how I put my rounds together.
22:20And from 2008 onwards, my confidence just got better and better with how I was playing.
22:27And I started to like how I was playing, which I didn't before.
22:30And that was important.
22:31I started to feel like I was a pro.
22:34So was that like a mindset thing?
22:36You didn't feel like you're quite a bit of imposter syndrome sort of thing?
22:38Didn't feel like I belonged there?
22:39Or did you feel like I could go and get over the line?
22:42Trying to win tournaments.
22:43Right.
22:44I felt like I was on the tour and I could probably stay on the tour.
22:48But I was in that lower part of it where you're really looking at the order of merit at the end of the year to see if you kept your card.
22:56That was difficult.
22:57Yeah.
22:58I didn't want to stay there.
22:59Because it was taking a lot of work, a lot of traveling, not earning loads of money.
23:04Doing okay, but nothing that was probably I couldn't earn actually just staying put.
23:11But from 2008, I started to feel some signs where actually I'm hitting it better than this guy.
23:16He's winning tournaments.
23:17Right.
23:18My time might come.
23:21And then that progressed into actually having chances to win.
23:26Messing up in the final round or final two rounds, but continuing to play good, really good golf.
23:34So that 2012 event, the HP Championship, you played with Tiger.
23:37I saw an interview you said going into that at the time, you were like, if anything, I'm going to have a front row seat here to a Tiger Woods round of golf and potentially a win.
23:46Right.
23:47We're just sort of touching it there, though.
23:49Was that your mindset of being the underdog slightly in those situations?
23:52And was that something you sort of reveled in?
23:54In other tournaments, even the tournament before that, I played really well and felt like I had a chance to win and was pushing myself.
24:03I'd won a tournament in Italy a few months before.
24:06Yeah.
24:07Albeit that didn't have the same sort of marquee players as the Abu Dhabi one did.
24:13But I was getting closer.
24:15I'd got to 20 under par, which was a milestone for me.
24:18Right.
24:19That's a big number.
24:20That's a big number in it.
24:21Right.
24:22And lots of tournaments get to 20 under.
24:23But you've got to get to 20 under.
24:24You've got to be there.
24:25You've got to get there.
24:26You've got to be the one that gets it.
24:27Yeah.
24:28And that means playing well four days, polling puts for four days, keeping your scoring boots on, not slowing down,
24:35not 18 pars in your last round, don't do it.
24:38Right.
24:39So, but then Abu Dhabi came along and I knew I was playing all right.
24:44I actually played one of my best rounds on Saturday before I played with Tiger.
24:47And I just wanted to play OK on Sunday so that I wasn't in the way or didn't feel in the way.
24:57I wanted to watch him do his thing.
24:59And I wanted, hopefully, at the end of it, for him to maybe go, it was all right, player.
25:04That was your goal going into it?
25:06Pretty much.
25:07Yeah.
25:08Just not make a hash of it.
25:10And could I take everything that I'd learned up to that point, being on my own, hitting balls on my own, building my swing that I liked,
25:20could I actually trust it and get it to work under that sort of pressure, which was something I'd never felt before.
25:27That's mad.
25:28What a sort of, you know, everything's led to this moment kind of feeling, right?
25:31All you'd done, all the balls you'd hit, the swing you'd built.
25:34I wasn't interested in winning.
25:35No.
25:36Not interested.
25:37You were just wanting to do...
25:38And you shouldn't be, right?
25:39And that's probably, if you do, you're not going to perform as well sort of thing.
25:42Well, I guess the people that were much better ranked than me, if you're a top 10 player in the world and you're playing with Tiger Woods,
25:48you're trying to prove a point, aren't you?
25:50You're right, yeah.
25:51And you're trying to see, how am I good enough?
25:55I didn't think for a second that was my approach.
25:59My approach was just see if you can play your golf, right?
26:03Yeah.
26:04See where that puts you.
26:05It might put you, hopefully I can still perform a decent round.
26:09No, I honestly didn't care where I finished.
26:11And that worked though, didn't it?
26:12And so was that quite gratifying to go in with that mindset and just to go, you know,
26:15I just want to do what I've done, go through the process I've done for all these years in this situation.
26:20How gratifying was that to then actually get over the line at the end of it?
26:23I honestly just wanted to play the first few holes well, settle into it, right?
26:26You know what I mean?
26:27And not just ruin the day with all the people watching and think, oh, he's just crumbled straight away, right?
26:33I didn't want to be that fella.
26:34Yeah.
26:35But the first few holes, I played brilliant.
26:38I was three ahead after six.
26:40And then I thought, this is too good now not to finish this off.
26:45So was it at that point you went, okay, let's forget the mindset from the first tee.
26:49We've had a good start.
26:50I've got three shots on him.
26:52Let's see if I can give him a good run to the end.
26:56I still expected to lose, right?
26:58But I thought, right, I'm going to be neck and neck with him on the back nine.
27:02And that is just priceless.
27:04Yeah.
27:05So I kept waiting and waiting for this big moment, you know, that he always did,
27:11where he would chip in or hole a long putt or something.
27:13And it just didn't happen.
27:15Might be one of the only occasions that he played in the lead in the final round in the final group
27:19and didn't actually do something like that.
27:23So I felt very lucky.
27:25I hit some magic shots right at the end.
27:27And there was two iron shots.
27:30So I started off the round trying to think, can I actually just hit a normal drive,
27:35get it on the fairway?
27:38As basic as that.
27:39And then I thought, can I hit a wedge off this tight line, not duff it and look like a, whatever.
27:45And I got through that process thinking, right, I can actually hit balls now.
27:47I'm all right.
27:48I'm comfortable.
27:49I can tick along today and be okay.
27:50And then I'm three ahead after six.
27:52And then we, I think I lost one shot early on in the back nine.
27:59Maybe the 12th or 13th.
28:01But anyway, on the 14th, I just did one of my best fairway bunker shots ever.
28:05Well, the best fairway bunker shot I've ever hit.
28:08To 15 foot with a seven iron.
28:11Which I struck absolutely perfect.
28:13I'll never forget the feeling.
28:14I'm still over it thinking, I haven't had one of those.
28:17I hit this properly.
28:18I struck it.
28:19Not just like clean or not.
28:22I hit it perfect.
28:23That one where you feel like you've hit it kind of flush.
28:26This is the moment where I'll just determine whether I've got a chance of winning this or not.
28:30Because it could, I mean, it was a nice shot, but it could have come down.
28:32It was short in the bunker.
28:34Could have gone over the green.
28:35And it come down 15 foot away.
28:37I thought, right, I've got all that.
28:39And now I've got a really good chance.
28:41And then the 15th, I hit an even better shot with a five iron,
28:44which landed pretty much within a couple of yards of where I was trying to land it.
28:49My standard sort of faded iron shot at the time.
28:52But as soon as I started my downswing, I knew I did a good shot.
28:54And that was the best feeling from hitting all the balls my whole life.
29:02I knew.
29:03I knew this is good.
29:04So it sounds like then you did have, my next question was,
29:06did you have a chance during that back nine to enjoy it?
29:09To take in, to realise I'm going toe-to-toe with Tiger Woods here in a pretty big tournament.
29:13I totally enjoyed that bit.
29:14Oh, brilliant.
29:15That's great.
29:16But even hitting those shots, I still have to hold the putts.
29:20Putting wasn't my area at all.
29:23I felt like I was in control early on with how I was hitting it.
29:28But I didn't know whether I was going to hold putts.
29:30So those two iron shots, they still had 15, 20-foot putts to hold,
29:33which I could have easily missed.
29:35I could have three-putted them, the way I've putted in my life.
29:39But I held both of them, and that put me right in it.
29:43And I was still expecting an eagle on the last or whatever.
29:47It just didn't come.
29:48It just didn't come, no.
29:50But what a crowning achievement for your career then.
29:52Would you have said overall, I think I've got your stats down here,
29:56but I can't see in the sun, 465 events over 25 years.
29:59Would you have said what you've come out with at the other end was an overachieving career,
30:03an underachieving career, or something about right?
30:06If you take that one day out, I'd have been really disappointed.
30:11That day, capped it all off. Wow, that's huge.
30:15It's a nice way to reflect on it though, isn't it?
30:17Yeah, feel lucky that I grafted for that long and got –
30:21the game gives you stuff in random times,
30:24and you don't know what you're going to get, do you?
30:27But I got that out of it.
30:29And so, like I said, 465 starts on the tour, European tour,
30:33sort of journeyman, I guess, absolute warhorse for the tour.
30:36Were you sort of like a proud European tour member,
30:39and what's your reflection on the way it's developed now into the DP World Tour,
30:43and how it now sits in the sort of hierarchy of professional golf?
30:47Yeah, I always call myself a European tour player.
30:52I'm not a massive fan of the name change, but such is life, isn't it?
30:57And not overly proud of what's going on with pro golf at the moment.
31:03So I'm sort of a little bit glad that I've been out of the –
31:09the chats on the range must be tedious every week now,
31:12so I'm not involved in that, and that's quite a good thing.
31:16Where it all sits, I have no idea.
31:19It's way above my head to sort that out.
31:23And, you know, if I were to give you the war chest,
31:27and I could put it all out in front of you, professional golf,
31:31have you had a thought on how you might like to see it work?
31:34Is there something that you want to see happen,
31:37either reversing what's happened recently or back to the way it was?
31:41Is there something you've seen that I'd do that,
31:43or are you just sort of trying to keep away?
31:45I'm not bothered.
31:46Keep away?
31:47Yeah, they're doing a good job messing it all up on their own.
31:51I don't need to get involved in that.
31:53It was cool when I started.
31:55I loved the job when I started.
31:56Yeah.
31:57I loved it all the way through till probably, I don't know, 2015, 16-ish.
32:04And I think when the European Tour got its Rolex series off the ground,
32:10we missed stars coming to play.
32:12Yeah.
32:13And it was sad that we had to keep paying them to turn on.
32:17But I think that's just sport, isn't it?
32:20So lastly then, Robert, we spoke about your retirement and how that's all been.
32:25What's the future for you now?
32:27We're at the Belfry today.
32:28It's the final of the Robert Rock Junior Tour.
32:31How's that come about?
32:32What's it all about?
32:33And how do you see it going forward and your kind of involvement in it?
32:36So it's something I wanted to do always, really,
32:40but trying to put good events on while I was playing the tour was pretty impossible.
32:47Yeah.
32:48So Natalie Haywood, who's a PGA Golf pro from Derby at the time,
32:53she approached me and said,
32:55could she run a few trial junior events?
32:58Which I said, absolutely, let's see what we can do.
33:02So seven years later, we've now got 25 events.
33:07Yeah.
33:08We started doing international ones.
33:09We're doing world-ranking ones.
33:11We're doing mini-tour events,
33:13which is basically putting the tees halfway down the fairway
33:16for driving range kids to come and have a taste.
33:18What's the age range of people that play?
33:20It's everything.
33:21It's every bit of everything.
33:22From five upwards.
33:23Oh, wow.
33:24We will be doing under-21s next year.
33:25Yeah.
33:27And then because of the places that I was going to whilst Natalie was running this,
33:31I managed to tee up places like this and some other great courses that we go to.
33:35And I wanted the juniors to have a taste of playing great courses
33:40with a load of other juniors of all different standards
33:46and feel like they're part of a big group.
33:50Yeah.
33:51And it's gone really, really well.
33:52People have really got on board with it.
33:54The Belfry have been awesome.
33:55We've got Callaway, PING, Adidas, Tight List, PGA, DP World Tour.
34:02They're all involved in supporting.
34:05I hope I haven't forgot somebody there,
34:07and I tend to when I'm doing these things.
34:09You can add it in if you haven't.
34:10Hopefully add it in.
34:11Thank you to those people.
34:12Yeah, thank you to everyone that's doing it because it's hard.
34:15Obviously, you can make a great event if you charge people loads of money
34:18because you just buy everything.
34:20But I wanted it to be the cheapest junior tour going,
34:26round the best courses with good prizes.
34:28Yeah.
34:29So we've asked a lot off all the manufacturers,
34:31and they've all been just incredible.
34:34They give us so much stuff to make sure it's a nice prize table
34:39for the price point that doesn't look like we can afford it.
34:43So I've put quite a bit into it,
34:46and now it sort of ticks over nicely.
34:49So it's packed here today for the finals.
34:51We're packed.
34:52I should have said this is the Junior British Masters.
34:55Got you.
34:56So I wanted that to be sort of a preceding event to the British Masters.
35:01Which is in a couple of weeks.
35:02In a couple of weeks' time, all these kids will be coming to watch.
35:05Nice.
35:06Last year, I dragged a group of them up and down the range,
35:09met a few of the players.
35:10Oh, brilliant.
35:11They were able to watch quite close.
35:14So they're going to get to play the course.
35:16They're going to see the big guys play on in a couple of weeks.
35:19Yeah, tour of course.
35:20I did that.
35:21Tour of course.
35:22Proper T-boards up.
35:23Oh, brilliant.
35:24As you would see at a tour event, but slightly sort of scaled for the T's.
35:29And then they're doing all the staging work already, aren't they?
35:31The grandstands are going up.
35:32So the course is looking great.
35:35Yes, they get to see it in a real tournament format.
35:38So hopefully that – I would have loved that when I was younger.
35:41Right.
35:42I came to play here in a four-ball event with a mate just in the winter.
35:49And that felt like I was playing a great course that had the Ryder Cup, right?
35:54It was not even close to the right time.
35:56But now they're playing it two weeks before.
35:58We go to – yeah, loads and loads of great courses.
36:01So a massive thank you to all the courses that don't charge us very much.
36:05Some let us have it for free.
36:07That's what you want to see though, that kind of community building around it.
36:09And is that what inspired you to do it?
36:11It's like, I'd love this as a kid.
36:12Yeah, yeah.
36:13And here's a great opportunity.
36:14It's better than a – it's like a collection of all the Junior Opens you might play
36:20around the best courses, but you're playing them as part of a series.
36:25It's all contextualised.
36:27It's all linked up.
36:28Yeah, and you can play at any stage.
36:29So you don't have to have a handicap.
36:30Oh, really?
36:31Yeah.
36:32Jeez, brilliant.
36:33Well, and so we got that.
36:34You got the tour.
36:35Still doing your teaching, obviously.
36:36Yeah, I do bits of teaching.
36:37Here and there.
36:38Not too much.
36:39I'm doing one in a minute, actually.
36:40Yeah, I've got you in ten minutes.
36:42It'll be warming up.
36:45And then what else am I doing?
36:47My son's a keen footballer.
36:48He's signed for Chesterfield.
36:50And you've had to learn football, I saw.
36:51I've had to learn football.
36:52Where are you at with that now?
36:53Still pretty poor, I would say, around there.
36:55Have you picked a team?
36:56Are you just a Chesterfield fan?
36:57I'm Chesterfield now.
36:58Chesterfield.
36:59Yeah, just before she died.
37:00Chesterfield, don't die, yeah.
37:01Yeah, I probably, I reckon I'm a 20 handicap.
37:04Oh, 20 handicap football IQ?
37:06Yeah.
37:07Okay.
37:08Maybe worse.
37:09Do you like football?
37:10It's okay, it's a safe space.
37:11I forgot it was a golf YouTube channel.
37:12Yeah, no, I didn't used to get it, but now I'm starting to see the tactics behind it.
37:18And I'm starting to see that some footballers that I've met through golf, they use loads
37:24of golfing terminology when they're describing how they kick a ball, so.
37:28Is that helping you?
37:29I can do that, yeah.
37:30Are you like picking out a footballer kicking a ball and getting your swing mechanic brain
37:33on and going?
37:34Did that the other day with David on his free kicks, yeah.
37:36You really?
37:37Yeah, I did.
37:38I was like, why is that, what's that making that spin like that?
37:40Right, because your foot isn't flat, is it, right?
37:42So I was trying to work that out.
37:44You can't switch off, can you?
37:45No, no.
37:46But yeah, I don't know.
37:48Yeah, it's interesting.
37:49I'm enjoying it.
37:50So with all of that then, lastly, what do you think and what would you want your legacy
37:54in the game to be?
37:55Is it a greater sum of your playing career?
37:57Is it the stuff that you're going to be doing as juniors the next, you know, however long?
38:01What do you think your legacy, Robert Rock, will be in the game of golf?
38:04Not bothered.
38:05Not bothered?
38:06Not bothered.
38:07Just keep going.
38:08People make their own minds up, yeah.
38:09I'll be dead.
38:10Nice cheery way to end.
38:12We've got the same stylist.
38:15Hopefully my swing will be on YouTube for a while, so people can take that and use that
38:19as they please.
38:20When we're all dead, even you watching, we'll still be watching.
38:23My swing will be on YouTube, hopefully, yeah.
38:25We'll all be dressed the same.
38:26Don't delete it, yeah.
38:27We'll wear Adidas stuff.
38:28We'll wear this black Adidas stuff in the beautiful heat.
38:29But, Robert, thank you for joining us on Monthly Meats.
38:31Really appreciate it.
38:32All the best.
38:33Pleasure.