A three-member Supreme Court committee visited Yashwant Varma's residence to investigate the alleged cash recovery case.
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00:00So, let's try and make sense of these latest developments that are taking place and they're
00:05taking place at multiple levels.
00:07We'll get to ground reports from Allahabad where lawyers are protesting, we'll get to
00:12the latest from Parliament, what's happening in Parliament, we'll also tell you what's
00:17the thinking in the judiciary, we'll also take you to ground zero to Justice Yashwant
00:21Verma's house.
00:22Joining me now for more on this big story are my colleagues Nalini covers the Supreme
00:27Court, our legal editor Nalini Sharma joins us from the newsroom, Rahul Gautam joins us
00:32from Justice Verma's residence.
00:34Rahul, let me quickly come to you first and Rahul, I want to understand from you.
00:38So, this special committee formed by the Supreme Court, it arrived at Justice Verma's house,
00:44what transpired after that because I believe this is that official fact-finding team.
00:50Initially, the Delhi High Court Chief Justice's investigation was only perhaps ascertaining
00:55facts.
00:56How is this three-member team different and what is their task?
01:00What all did they do today?
01:02Well, Gaurav, this in-house committee, inquiry committee that has been formed by Supreme
01:11Court arrived here at Justice Verma's residence, that's 30 Tugla Khusand Road around 2 p.m.
01:17and the committee stayed here for around 45 minutes.
01:21Now, during this course, we've been informed from our sources that they recorded a detailed
01:27statement of Justice Verma.
01:28They also went on to the very spot, the outhouse where this fire incident happened and in fact,
01:37they stayed here for 45 minutes.
01:40The committee comprises three Chief Justices, Chief Justice of Karnataka, Chief Justice
01:46of Haryana and Punjab and also Himachal Pradesh.
01:51Now, after they spent 45 minutes here, they left.
01:55Later on, around half an hour later, four staff members of Delhi High Court, they arrived
02:02here in a car.
02:03They went straight away to the security guard room.
02:07They took some details of the entry register, all those who were coming in, all those who
02:15had visited this place.
02:17They also took some videographic evidence of the CCTV footage.
02:20So clearly, as far as this probe is concerned, we all know that how opposition is seeking
02:25answers on this issue.
02:27As we speak, a meeting is underway of all the floor leaders of Rajya Sabha, which is
02:32chaired by Rajya Sabha Chairperson, Mr. Dhankar.
02:35It is attended by Leader of the House, J.P.
02:37Nadda, Leader of Opposition, Mr. Mallika Arjun Kharge and therefore, it seems that the Supreme
02:42Court had decided to not just kick off the investigation but also to expedite, given
02:46the fact that although there is no timeline to complete the investigation, but obviously
02:50they would want this to be completed at the earliest.
02:54Stay with me for a moment, there are multiple questions and before I bring in Nalini for
02:58more on this, I also want to bring in Shreya, who joins us on this broadcast, Shreya.
03:03There are many questions in the minds of people, including the various figures that are being
03:09given, how much cash was recovered, how much cash was there, where is that cash now, where
03:15has that evidence disappeared, is there still a strong case without that evidence in terms
03:20of, you know, who ordered the removal of the burnt cash, do we know now where all of that
03:26is, Shreya?
03:27Well, you know, that is exactly what this committee is looking at, Gaurav, which is
03:31the understanding of the fact that why was the burnt debris of the cash removed on the
03:39morning of the 15th that has been defined in the exchanges that has been put on record
03:44by the Supreme Court, all these things are right now being analysed, there are details
03:48of the staff who were present that day when the incident transpired, the details of those
03:53involving in the Delhi Police Security Department, all these people will be questioned, the CCTV
03:59footage of the residence of Mr. Verma will also be analysed and that's exactly where
04:05they will be coming to a point when the incident transpired, because the justice concerned,
04:11he still claims that he suspects a conspiracy, he suggests that he's been targeted for quite
04:16some time now in that entire exchange, remember he's mentioned the date of December 2024,
04:21about some posts also coming against him on social media, so all these things in total
04:26will be analysed, but so far as today's presence of the committee at his residence, it's particularly
04:30about gathering electronic evidence and talking with the staff members who were present that day
04:35when the incident transpired.
04:41Gathering electronic evidence is also very crucial and Nalini, this three member panel,
04:49they are very eminent judges of courts and they are the final word as far as the common
04:56man is concerned, there's so much faith in the judiciary and the main effort is to ensure that
05:00that faith of judiciary, in judiciary is not shaken by that cash haul, Honourable Justice
05:06Verma says not my money, I don't know how that money got here, but where did that money disappear,
05:11where is that evidence, is all of that crucial to fact-finding or investigations as they get underway?
05:19Well, it's extremely crucial Gaurav, essentially because only after the chain of events of the
05:26night of March 14th are put into place by somebody reliable, by somebody whose word can
05:31be taken on face value, only then it can be decided what needs to be the future course of action,
05:37so this is step one of the entire probe that is going to go on regarding this case and in case
05:44Justice Verma is found innocent, there is no prime apposite case against him after the inquiry of
05:50this three member, three High Court judges is done, in that case of course, there won't be
05:54any further steps, but at the same time, they will have to clear his name for that, the details
05:59of this report that will be sent out by the three member committee will have to be put into the
06:04public domain because it's going to be in his best interest to ensure that if there is no prime
06:09apposite case against him, details are put out as soon as possible, on the other hand, if there is
06:14a prime apposite case that is found against him, then that will mean that this is going to go on
06:19for much longer because then an official probe, probably a multi-agency probe will have to be
06:25ordered to ensure that whether or not this money was attained through legitimate means or not,
06:31considering the amount of cash that we've seen in the video doesn't seem legitimate,
06:35but at the same time, they will have to determine whether or not there was any quid pro quo,
06:39was this in return for some favours that were given by a sitting judge of the High Court,
06:43all of these are going to be crucial questions that the investigating agencies will have to
06:47answer. Right now, it's still step one, where three High Court judges, two Chief Justices and
06:52one judge are conducting this inquiry from the national capital, they've all flown in from
06:58Chandigarh, we have the Chief Justice of the Punjab and Haryana High Court, from Himachal,
07:02we have the Chief Justice of the Himachal High Court and from Bangalore, we have one of the
07:06judges of the Karnataka High Court, who've all flown into Delhi to conduct this inquiry,
07:11they visited the residence of Justice Verma, we're given to understand that there's a possibility
07:16that they might have even met him inside and might have recorded a short statement,
07:19although we're still waiting for a confirmation on that, but it now all hinges on this inquiry,
07:24because when a report is submitted to the Chief Justice of India, is when he's going to decide
07:29what the future course of action should be and whether a proper inquiry should be ordered in,
07:34and also in the meantime, will Justice Verma be asked to step down or whether an impeachment
07:39motion will be brought against him, is all something that we will get to know only after
07:43the report has been submitted by the inquiry committee. Oh absolutely, because the majesty
07:49of the judiciary, the faith in the judiciary, the final arbiter, when people have an argument,
07:55they say I'll see you in court and they go to courts, so they have to be of unimpeachable
08:00integrity in terms of a cash hole at that place, but I want to once again bring in Rahul Gautam,
08:06because Jagdeep Dhankar saying that yes, the courts have put everything out in public domain,
08:12but we need to deliberate on it. Rahul, what does that mean? CJI put everything in public domain,
08:18is what chairman of Rajya Sabha, issue needs to be deliberated. Now when lawmakers deliberate,
08:25what are they deliberating on? Are we perhaps looking at lawmakers once again, looking at
08:32accountability and you know NJAC once again coming back or is that jumping the gun at this stage?
08:43Gaurav, as far as opposition benches are concerned, they are giving adjournment notices every day
08:49to suspend the business as far as you know both the houses are concerned and discuss
08:54the alleged recovery of cash notes from Justice Verma's residence. Now, you know the leader of
08:59the house, Mr. JP Nadda and leader of opposition Mallika Arjun Karge, they both met earlier Rajya
09:06Sabha chairperson Mr. Jagdeep Dhankar and in fact requested him that this matter should be
09:12taken up for discussion and you know the sanctity of judiciary should be maintained. We should not
09:19discuss this matter you know in a way that a collateral damage would be the integrity of
09:25judiciary system. So therefore, it was decided that Mr. Dhankar would be meeting all the floor
09:30leaders of different various political outfits and then you know a future course of action
09:37would be decided as to how they are going to decide, how they are going to discuss this issue
09:41given the fact that it should not look upon you know that the legislative is trying to infringe
09:47upon the very independence of judiciary. At the same time, this issue many believe as far as
09:53opposition camp is concerned demand due attention and due discussion on the floor of the house
09:58as what really happened, what really transpired and therefore people have a right to know that
10:04what really happened uh you know uh on the night of 14th uh you know at the at the residence of
10:09Justice Verma whether there was any recovery. What happened on the night of 14th but Nalini
10:15it only came out in public domain a week later, action apparently started even off and actually
10:22happened started happening after that. So is there merit in some saying that were they trying to find
10:29out facts initially uh was it being buried under the carpet uh was there a fact finding uh that
10:34was already on and will it remain transparent from this point on are those questions valid?
10:41Well Gaurav, all questions are valid at this point essentially because the case
10:45at as it stands at the current moment is a little bit murky. Remember all of this had happened
10:50on the 14th of March when the holy vacations of the courts were still going on. So the court
10:55technically wasn't functioning along with the fact that when this incident had happened after
11:00that there were some very contradictory statements that had come in from the officials itself not
11:05from the media not from the common citizens but from the officials who were on the spot.
11:10So due to that contradictions or contradictory statements that came there was a little bit of
11:15lack of clarity even for the judges regarding what exactly has happened along of course with
11:20the fact that Justice Varma was vehemently defending himself stating that he had not
11:25heard of any of this cash in fact even his family members or his staff had not informed him. So
11:31there were a lot of initial hurdles that the uh CGI as well as the Chief Justice of the Delhi
11:36High Court Justice D.K. Upadhyay had to cross before they decided what information should be
11:41put in the public domain and what shouldn't. Like you correctly pointed out it's something that
11:45pertains to the independence of the judiciary and the trust of the people in the judiciary
11:51itself. So to cast aspersions or to put out something in the public domain which actually
11:57goes against the reputation or goes against the integrity of a sitting judge of a premier high
12:02court like the Delhi High Court needs to be done after careful consideration and after all facts
12:07have been ascertained. So at least in the beginning it must have taken some time for the CGI as well
12:13as the Chief Justice of the High Court to put the entire pieces together and after that a decision
12:19had been reached to put out all details that were available with them including the evidence in the
12:24form of pictures and videos. And that video being put out in public domain that video being put out
12:28in public domain um wards of burnt currency, semi-burnt currency, partially burnt currency
12:34in in sacks and all of that burning uh being pulled out of that storeroom there's a discrepancy
12:40and perhaps this panel would be able to uh you know the Supreme Court and the High Court panel
12:44will be able to shed light on it. Honorable Justice Varma says that storeroom used to be open.
12:49The police in its investigation have told uh the CRPF, Foxtrot company, 70th battalion of the CRPF
12:56they've told the Delhi High Court Chief Justice that that storeroom was always under lock and key.
13:01So there is a discrepancy and there are many other discrepancies that we'd be tracking very closely.
13:05Many thanks for joining me.